#mostly because i went on several partly related tangents or overexplained the background observations that led to my conclusions. lol

[larrythefloridaman]

handing you more characters bc your analysis is so delicious .

crimson. the scrunkly. most likely to be cpuk's tumblr sillyman.

Studying this little freak like a bug <3

(cpuk and ncct spoilers)

The thing about Crimson is that narratively, he is, as a villain, a bad coping mechanism or a self-destructive behavior. Barely even a metaphor- thats literally what he is to peppermint in pretty much no uncertain terms, she's parasocially in love with him because he, and the concept of a multiverse, allows her to indulge in the fantasy of a world where she's happy, and indulging unhealthily in fantasy is what actively drives people away from her, making her even lonelier. And she's not the only example of characters whom crimson's relationship to them is defined by them giving in to a character flaw. Chessmaster is the other clear cut example- succumbing to his inferiority complex and giving in to evil for the sake of proving himself are directly interrelated events, and he broke free when he was given kindness and support, a clearer picture of why he's like this (because he was designed to be,) and a vision of something different, something healthier, to be. He tempts people, consciously or not, to act their worst.

Hamburger Helper was a family man. Season one's storytelling is patchier than later seasons, but one can read between the lines, both then and later, to see something of a Mr. Incredible style gloryhound mid-life crisis to inspire his behavior, and his husband putting his foot down and breaking things off wasn't enough to drag him back to sense- especially since his son was on his side, resenting dadondorf for both his more firm parenting and splitting their family, launching into his ongoing emo phase and "trying to summon satan to kill his dad." (Real line from cpuk1. smthn smthn nccts crimson's first host was a dad and hes good with kids and says despite being kind of a monster he wouldn't hurt one. food for thought) But when The Grunk died, the show went on hiatus, and he was left in the broken fizzled aftermath of all that and forced to slowly realize how immature he'd been behaving and what ultimately really mattered to him and defected from Crimson of his own will.

Valentine was a risk taker, all for the drama of the show. Valentine walked directly into explosions just to see if he could survive them. He's a performer and a gentleman and a hero to the people. However, a risk taken in performance is a risk nonetheless and his overconfidence was his downfall. Valentine made a bet. Didn't tell a soul before he did it, other than a crimson possessed hamburger helper, speaking in their minds- hold your breath for the drama! And then he lost. And the deal was real. And so were the consequences. And the show he so loved came crashing to a halt as he was used to kill a man. (I'd also like to note, captain crimson in the nccts is kind of another example of a recreation of val as an image without his input, if im understanding the dream-fakes correctly- bc theyre composed of the current dreamers recollection of them, and Val isnt in the fourth dream. So once again val is being copied over as a biased outsiders image formed from people's perceptions of him, this one more literal and impermanent and largely defined by a very publically known traumatic experience that he really doesnt like to talk about and the person who controlled him in that time, while Quad was originally made to be a sort of exaggerated parody of what he loves and values. fun.)

Larry's... well, I've talked about Larry's problem. He overextends himself, unwilling to burden others intentionally even if they're willing to bear it, and needs to show himself a little self-compassion. And the circumstances of his possession? He functionally agreed to saving Crimson's life, and Crimson repays this by running off with his body right away and refusing to let Larry see his loved ones (for reasons of self-protection, crimson desiring to lie low right now, but still) and Larry's still trying to fix him from the inside. Bro thats nice and very noble and all bc god knows crimson genuinely needs help but you functionally got kidnapped my dude!!!!!! You missed yet another Valentines day after SEVEN missed Valentines days! you're on course to miss a NINTH since the show's gone off air in your absence!!! Your man just wants you to be safe for once!!!!!! He misses you!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sidenote ive noticed in terms of teaching the lesson of not overextending your compassion sometimes folks trying to teach it fumble the point by making it so the way its taught is by making the target not 'worthy' of the compassion somehow (tricking the giver of care or help into thinking they need it when they really dont or smthn) as if overextending yourself is a matter of choosing who's morally deserving of help and weeding out the untrustworthy lazy manipulators or some shit rather than You Cannot Help Everyone, its a Logistical Impossibility and By Trying You Will Only Hurt Yourself and Eventually Others as Either Your Loved Ones Worry Themselves Sick To Death Over You as Your Wellbeing Inevitably Declines Or You End Up Lashing Out At Others Because Your Needs Have Gone Uncared For As A Result, Therefore You Literally NEED to be Helped Because You Literally Cannot Bear It All Alone and im glad thats more the kind of vibe set up here. Like. Crimson definitely definitely definitely needs help that much is clear. But Larry aint the fucker to do it. because He's Super Not Okay Either and also, he'd been trying to get Crimson to open up for however long it was between cpuk orange and ncct2 hed been trying and didn't know Funbox's name when Crimson was willing to say that on live tv but Dani spends an hour in a vent with him and he's Explaining His Personal Living Nightmare to her. Larry is not a person hes willing to open up to, probably Specifically Because he is trying and wants to help him! Larry's fuckin. Red Cross Syndrome actively makes Crimson want to clam up! They can be good buds, they certainly seem to enjoy eachothers company well enough, but not in the 'i can unload about my trauma to you' way right now because neither of them are people who think they need or deserve that yet!

Maladaptive coping mechanisms and emotional regulation strats being the domain of a god of treachery makes sense- especially in a show about compassion and healing the way CPUK often is. they don't fix the real problem. Often they make it worse. They make you feel better, stronger, until they don't, they take control of your life, and sometimes you have to hit rock bottom before you realize you have a shovel in your hands. But, the thing about them is, they're NOT 'evil,' they're volatile, theyre unhealthy, and they don't come from nowhere. Its the culmination of unaddressed pain. And as with Chartreuse's tragedy, this applies to Crimson as much as it does to those his powers effect- this badboy's chock full of dumb destructive shit he does to feel power and control over and satisfaction with his own life, and that makes itself most apparent in his relationship with Crimsonaut. Now, Crimsonaut lacks much of a firm moral compass- but he's kind, in a snarky long-suffering sort of way. he was created by Dr. Order to venture into the crimson for study. We don't know how that went, but we know the result. Allowing Crimson to hide and recover in his body, lying about being uncontaminated upon his return from meeting him, intentionally hiding and protecting Crimson from discovery until he was strong enough to start taking control of the body from time to time and getting up to his shit again. Crimsonaut is more than capable of verbally standing up to Crimson, he puts his foot down- but he puts his foot down only when Crimson condescends to him, treats him like he's not an equal. Crimson calls him his little buddy- like hes affectionately describing a cat or a small animal or perhaps one of those fucked up lil splatoon fish, and Crimsonaut tells the evil primordial god in his body that he owes him at least the title of friend. Takes some backbone, which he chooses not to use later. He wasn't happy with crimson attempting to destroy the universe, where he lives, but after the fact, their relationship as we see it doesnt seem to have changed at all. Crimsonaut was still willingly playing his snarky human shield. Crimsonaut's friendly with Dani, and no exorcism ever happened. even though he very nearly successfully destroyed a universe, (and got them both put on a fucking Leash by his siblings for weeks after the fact,) he'd rather let him stay. But being separated from Crimson as a result of Crimson's own meddling, getting a nice breather away from him, and Crimson using this break as an opportunity to make a direct attempt to kill him to avoid being put back was the last straw. he was horrible despite when they got along and what he was made for and he couldnt just put up with it anymore, although Prism's next move might have... complicated his feelings about it. Crimson might honestly care about him, but that didn't make him any less of a toxic friend, and for that, Crimsonaut doesnt owe him a continued place in his life, and Crimson lost himself the most earnest, faithful, selflessly motivated friend he seems to have had since he arrived in this universe entirely through his own short-sighted self-destructive inability to deal with the minor restrictions living with Crimsonaut imposes on his life. He cant make himself willingly hand over control to another person enough to adapt to a minor dietary restriction. Absolute control freak. And... well. We know why.

Prism and the Ciblings relationship wasnt... explicitly cast as being abusive in those words before the nccts, though one could easily read between the lines. And what the implications spoke loud and clear already was bad enough. But things are called what they are in the nccts, (not by the cods, who. likely think its... not normal. but maybe normal for gods. Theres not really other examples of godly parenting for them to draw from, after all. But Folk correctly labels Prism as abusive.) and Crimson's status as a favorite target of torment is exposed, and recontextualizes... a lot of things, really. He implies quite straightforwardly that everything he says should be taken with a grain of 'im aware of when Prism's watching and what im willing to say when she is is effected somewhat by that.' His words are inherently a bit deceptive, but not necessarily maliciously- but self-protectively. Every respectable parenting resource: "strict helicopter parenting doesnt teach your child obedience, it teaches your child how to lie to you" prism raising a god of treachery: "haha yeah thats the point :)"

Crimson and Prism's relationship is a pretty realistic example of the effect of the beginning of a cycle of abuse, in the broad sense. A parent, effected by existential stresses they cannot escape, be they monetary, interpersonal, psychological, whatever, lashes out against their children in the process of raising them, simultaneously traumatizing them and modeling toxic behavior to them, which they ultimately mimic because thats how dealing with problems and stress was modeled to them in their formative years, lacking access to or knowledge of more positive outlets for their feelings.

Crimson wants to be nothing like her- but he is, unthinkingly, like her. He hurts people to his own ends, he manipulates the truth, he's controlling, a number of other small things- a sickly smile to reflect prism's vacant yet intense one. He is his mother's son. Godhood of treachery and godhood of stories are... rather similar in concept, really- i don't recall who, but ive heard a certain philosophy of storytelling said as, paraphrasing, 'fiction is lies, falsehood, in service to truth.' he adopts an aesthetic of opposition, blood guts and chocolate cake, without really deconstructing his behavior in context, because changing who he is means making himself more vulnerable to being changed while he's figuring himself out, and Prism's entire modus operandi is changing you without you ever noticing, and he wants to believe through his rebellion he can atleast be fully authentically himself, uninfluenced. But change cannot be staved off forever, and despite what he wanted to believe, he's still stuck. Choosing evil is not an escape, it is another cage. The hopelessness and stagnation of lacking meaningful choice setting in seems to be changing him anyway.

I marked the 'horrible person' square the way i did because normally when one claims a tragic villain 'had no choice' but to commit their actions, its not really an accurate reflection- having reasons and motives to do what you do doesnt change that you chose to do them, if only under duress. But Crimson was... very particularly, literally and specifically being disallowed from having a choice in who he turned out to be under the gaze of a panopticonic and brutal authority that could begin watching him at any time, and what they wanted him to be was evil. He was born to be a villain and groomed into it, lead to evil blindly by a strict parent who's strictness was applied specifically to spawn the rebellion it caused and create a self-demonizing villain. He could've chosen to be better in theory- options were technically there- but he wanted to be a villain because he was raised in such a way that it felt like a meaningful rebellion against Prism's goody two shoes persona, but it wasnt, and he wouldnt have been allowed to pick the better options anyway- judging from things like Prism hitting the undo button on TOJ giving her a shiner, anything deviating too far from the plan can just be undone anyway, with none but her (and the audience,) maintaining memory of it, although it's marks are left regardless. little retcons. (Prism saying she felt guilt for what she 'had to do' to Crimson is... a bit supported by this- if she never wanted him to ever have nice things she could very easily take All of it away. She could have made that hug never happen. But she did let him have that. Doesnt make the constant cruelty better but yknow. Abusers are weird and complicated people sometimes and often they believe what they're doing is for the best for the child even if it really really isnt)

While we all came to agreement that Doctor Order's statement, about how if someone is changed by prism by unnoticed inches it will become miles over time, did not apply to her... I think it applies to Crimson, although not fully in the magical sense she meant, but the metaphorical. I think once upon a time there mightve been a better nature and hope in crimson which was slowly, steadily, and thoroughly corroded for a long, long time. Started CPUK Reboot in my rewatch recently, and before it became Team Calibur, Team Crimson's uniting factor wasnt even evil- it was passion. Bizarre, considering how inhuman Crimson was played in the first season. Kindness is what comes naturally to people. All that doesnt have to matter, not in the least, to the people he's hurt- but free will has always been more theoretical for him than the average person with Prism's eyes trained on him, and morality greys and greys as one gets into the weeds of why people are the way they are and when you remove or bar off meaningful and conscious choice from the equation. It is, sometimes, a luxury to have the option to be a good person, even if you aren't aware those options have been closed off to you. People get trapped, often without even knowing, in doing things that contradict what they believe or understand to be right to survive and enjoy any kind of happiness or fulfillment every day. smthn smthn no ethical consumption under capitalism for a familiar example. Crimson just raises So Many Fun Moral Philosophy Questions. God i love 'born to be evil, are so much more than that' type characters theyre always so human and fun to get pretentious about. can you tell my family's ex-catholic /j

Judging by his resentful tone with things like lovey dovey romance and Prism's 'barney the dinosaur' demeanor, i think its pretty fair to assume Prism's faux-sugary demeanor has made him thoroughly distrustful or disdainful of anything too 'sweet' at the outset. Only pain and grit is 'real', anything too sweet is a facade waiting to stab you in the back. Despite his two-faced smarmy deceitfulness being a defining trait, being Authentically Himself seems to concern Crimson a great deal, and for obvious reason. That being said i think theres also a part of crimson that wishes he could win over her approval, judging from his conversation with captain crimson- where i think he's the only one of the cods to actually briefly label prism as their mom directly, if only in a snarky derisive way, (usually they fall in line with her description of herself as their babysitter, but i mean. When your parent is a primordial cloud of feelings and ideas and not a person that can raise you but their emissary raises you in their place idc thats functionally a Mom) and implies Crimson sticks around here because of Prism in a way that makes it sound like it was a deliberate choice- it'd certainly explain why he actually tried to be good at the job he Knew he had (until attempting to self-sabotage to prove a point,) and making a point out of cobalt fucking up at his, despite his typically impulsive and self-indulgent personality. not really realizing he never could have her approval until his godhood of treachery was revealed to him, a title which means he is inescapably evil to her. I think Crimson wants very badly to be liked and approved of by Somebody, and in failing to get that from Prism has... latched on to the audience a bit, as another extension of his progenitor Spectrum. Crimson sees chat! He can see everything we say about him! He probably has thoughts and feelings on a good lot of it! He started using the nickname Crimbo because of us, and throughout orange's intros iirc he seemed more than a little disappointed by the reception to him as host not just from the competitors but from us in chat booing him (in a heelish kind of way, largely. God knows we do love crimson even if he sucks <3) and for god's sake the nelson warping is activated by us complimenting him. hes So Desperate for us to like him! Not unlike prism was!

i think the treachery reveal ultimately came as the second hit of a three hit combo of crimson's held beliefs being challenged. I think Crimson percieved Cobalt as kinda... Prism's lapdog to some extent? always trying to be the 'responsible' one, managing his and Chartreuse's behavior on Prism's advice while botching his own job. Cobalt showed his care for Crimson as his little brother through making deals to keep him alive, but considering he spends every other moment they're together (understandably, crimson is not a good person and cobalt has a very firm and deliberately constructed punitive moral compass to keep from losing sight of his responsibilities,) being critical of him on moral grounds it makes their relationship feel much more... transactional, even if Cobalt doesnt mean things that way. Like he's only making these deals to protect him because Someone needs to do his job. And then a disguised Crimson, after his apparent death, walks in on Cobalt discussing with Chartreuse that they need to do something about Prism, that this has all gone on too long. He cares, regardless of their stupid jobs, he just wants Crimson to be Less of an Asshole. And then, after the treachery reveal, there's chartreuse giving up her godhood.

Crimson's been confused by and rudely dismissive of his sister's relationship ever since he found out- particularly so after learning what she's been doing to maintain it. She's weakening herself, hurting herself, making herself vulnerable, to maintain a relationship with some mortal who, even if she could keep up what she was doing, not telling him anything and enduring the pain of keeping his fracture in the timeline sustained, would have sixty maybe seventy years at best to be with her and then she'd be back to the usual. They are incomprehensibly old, Folk is a blip in the grand scheme. She'll get over him, she should stop whining about it, its spilt milk. And then she gave up her godhood entirely. This mortal was worth facing not just pain, but the inevitability of death to her, worth facing the absolute vulnerability of mortal life. Crimson still can't understand it... he still doesnt agree with her decision and he doesnt particularly like Folk that much. but he can understand this is Really Fucking Important to her. and he cares about her enough to respect it and want to be a part of it as much as he can.

Ultimately, what i think Crimson really needs is to learn is how to trust someone enough to willingly hand over power and control to someone else without it being the end of the world and that change can be for the better, and him respecting the agency of other people even if he intensely disagrees with their decisions is an important step in the right direction on that front.