#sae is a character who often contradicts himself

[prettyboykatsuki]

Ari would you talk a bit more about how Sae can love you like someone born first, like an older brother with examples maybe? Only if you want to of course! You're one of the few people i trust with characterization so it's always a delightful experience to read how you view them!

yes!

its kind of hard for me to verbalize this ajkfdkjsf but i think older brothers tend to put a pressure on themselves to act a certain way even in the instances that their parents aren't putting outside pressure on them to succeed. this is effected by the gender of their younger sibling to an extent but it's just sort of an older sibling instinct.

a lot older brothers in relationships are sort of universally the same in relationships? they're not... nice. like that's not the word i would describe them with usually. kind but not nice. i think where rin can love you in a softer and more vulnerable way - sae is perpetually stone faced and almost a little cold around you to the point you have a hard time understanding his feelings

sae can love you like someone born first as in, he'll always look out for you, always give into you, and always be lenient towards you. he probably won't express any part of himself that openly like it won't show on his face but if you spend any time with him it's a bit obvious.

sae as a character i think values people who have a sense of independence and can accept him where he is - but contrarily i think he needs to be needed and the way he loves you reflects that conflict.

he'll do almost anything for you once he gets to that point in his own feelings but he won't approach you warmly or communicate these things to you at all lol. he has the distant kind of love that makes you feel like there's a wall between you and a debt you can't often repay.

to me that kind of stoicism and kindness feels very familiar to first born kids and big brother in general. this what i can do for you. i can love you practically and give you answer and solutions.

he seems like he needs to loved softly for that reason.

[twilightknight17]

One last one and I'm done because I just wanted discussion, not to fight, but no I've rarely seen Shuake that is not dark or angsty, most of the fic recs are dark sad fics. I don't see good traits discussed, you're not on twitter but even on tumblr most of the time he is called irredeemable, a psychopath and evil. All the memes about being evil have him tagged! Even "fluffy" fanart has him threatening to kill Akira. The take on him in Royal is that he's not redeemed and likes being an ass.

I don’t want to fight with anyone either, but I’m not sure how much of a discussion it can be when the two sides are basically “I only see him portrayed as pure evil” and “I don’t really see that very often at all.”

But okay, let’s roll. You want a serious answer? Here’s a serious answer.

(Po, my dear, there are actual major endgame spoilers in this answer, so don’t click on this one.)

There’s definitely plenty of sad fanfic, but I mean, their situation is pretty sad. That doesn’t mean the fluffy kind isn’t there. Or the slightly silly kind. Seriously, have you read the fic where Goro’s trying to win Mothman out of the gatcha machine? AO3 has all sorts of tags, it’s not that hard to find soft stuff. And I literally reblogged fluffy napping fanart like 2 days ago.

Anyway, “psychopath” is a very strong word, and I don’t think it describes his character at all. Nothing in the game indicates to me that he enjoys killing. He usually seems like his mindset is “I did what I had to, even if I didn’t like it, because all that matters is taking out Shido.”

And no, the way he acts during Maruki’s Palace doesn’t contradict that. Those are lesser shadows, not people, and he’s very aware of the difference. He never suggests killing Maruki, even as a joke, despite how much he hates him and his ideal reality. And if I remember correctly, he never actually says that he wants to kill Shido. Just ruin him when he’s at his highest point. (And yeah, dumb plan overall, but he was an angry, depressed 15-year-old at the time, and I choose to believe that he ended up too far in, and it came down to his life or his targets’. Shido was planning to have him killed after following his every order; disobeying would have just signed that death warrant more quickly.) The only time he targets someone and it wasn’t an order from Shido is the engine room fight, which is basically him hitting rock bottom and having an emotional breakdown even before he uses his powers on himself.

Third-sem Goro is...abrasive, yes. He’s tired. He’s clearly done with All of This Bullshit. He’s got no memories of anything after the engine room. He’s aware that yet another person is trying to control his life, except this time, in the most condescending, for-your-own-good way possible. He’s got to work with the people who saw him at his lowest, which is probably mortifying. He’s got to face his own death a second time, while knowing that he was Akira’s wish. No one has ever really wanted the real him, his entire life, and now that someone does, someone that he cares about too, he has to give that up. I’d be pissed off too.

But despite that, he’s still brave. He’s still determined. He’s still strong. And he still cares, underneath his gruff exterior. The first thing he did when he found himself in Shibuya on Christmas Eve, no idea what had happened, was to find Akira and Sae and take responsibility for his crimes so that Akira wouldn’t go to jail. When Akira’s wish basically glitched the matrix to ensure that Goro got out of jail almost immediately, the first thing Goro did was find Akira to figure out why. Many of his navigator lines indicate that he’s worried about and/or protective of Joker.

And if we take the unimplemented scene they found as canon, when he woke up and found himself at the center that once took care of his mother, he still made plans to return to Tokyo and make sure Akira got out of jail. He could have walked away, but he still went back for his rival. The most important person in his life.

I don’t know if this was what you wanted, Anon. I’ve realized I don’t really know what you think, since you’ve mostly told me what the rest of the fandom supposedly thinks. If you want to keep discussing this, you can PM me, or send me an ask off anon so I can reply privately.