#when a character states they're ugly when in fact they're gorgeous

[violetlunette]

Main Female Protagonist: Oh, my face was horribly scarred! I’m so ugly now! No one will ever love me!

Me: Oh, you poor thing, that’s awful--

The hideous scarring in question:

Me: ...

[alvadee]

Hi, I just wanted to say that even though I’ve never seen a movie or show Victor Buono was in (I’ve been meaning to check some out, but my special interests have demanded full attention), I really enjoy seeing you post about him. He seems to have been such a lovely person, very talented, very handsome, and I get quietly excited for you when you learn some new information because I think it’s a really beautiful thing to want to preserve someone’s memory as fully as possible. And it’s so nice to see someone appreciate the beauty of fat bodies as well, as a fat person myself. Anyways, I just wanted to tell you that I enjoy seeing your enjoyment of him.

haha I get that with the special interests. If you ever want to watch something with him tough just hit me up, I have everything ready on my external hard drive. 😌

Thank you, HE WAS ALL THOSE THINGS!!! He's just so fascinating to me. One reason is the contrast between him and the characters he played and then the contrast of his flamboyant screen presence to the enigma and cryptid he was off screen and the mystery of him having known everyone important and been everywhere important and yet I can find barely any visual traces of his life except documents that state he did all those things.

Like, I get such weird looks irl when if I should mention how much I like him, and it's not for having a crush on a dead actor per se (because I play that down) but that it's him. They usually seem to wonder why, when I can pick from all the unavailable actors there are to have a crush on, I chose an "ugly" one. (No one words it like that but I'm not stupid)

And besides the fact that I think irl most of the time he looked handsome in a socially acceptable way it's like.....I wouldn't have this huge crush of him if it were just for his looks, I'm literally not build that way. I liked his looks, learned about his character and was then enchanted with all of him, including his looks. I can not separate one from the other and character wise I think he was the best man ever.

And tbh people who can't find fat people attractive are losers. Nearly half of the population falls into the (stupid, made up) "obese" category, they're missing out on so many hot, interesting and amazing people. Even as a child I could not understand how obviously beautiful and gorgeous people weren't considered beautiful just because they were fat. As if that eradicated all of their other features and characteristics. Wild that people think like that. But I think the social media attention Adele got this year proves again that's how most people work.

Thank you for your kind words, that's so nice of you!

It always feels weird to me to get complimented for the way I loose my mind over a man who I think was so amazing (like, i never see any other stan accounts get compliments for how brave they are to thirst over thin men) but I do get the spirit these messages are sent in and appreciate it! ❤️

[hylialeia]

Arya being pretty matters. Often rabid Sansa stans of which I hope you are not , try to discredit Arya's beauty and the relevance of that in her arc. The text has repeatedly mentioned how Arya is bullied for her looks by Jeyne & Sansa and people like Lady Smallwood and kindly man tell her that she is pretty . So all of that need to have narratively significance because Arya has low self esteem about her looks.

Listen, I get what you're trying to say here, but I disagree.

In terms of her narrative, Arya's self esteem matters. Her relationship with gender and the patriarchal society she lives in matters. Her experience with the smallfolk matters.

But whether or not she's pretty doesn't.

Does the text say Arya is pretty? Yes! And rather blatantly, too, in contrast to what she believed when she was younger. What matters from these passages is that Arya figures out beauty is relative and that how attractive she is doesn't determine her value. She's an 11 year old girl.

The purpose of my original post wasn't about Arya's perception in-universe, though, but out-of-universe. And yeah, I do find posts that obsess over whether Arya is pretty or not extremely uncomfortable (now's a good time for another reminder that she is 11 years old). Especially when said posts are in service of somehow proving she's lesser or better than her sister.

Posts criticizing Arya because she's not as beautiful as Sansa are sexist and regressive; they've already undermined their point by bringing it up. They're not even worth my time to refute, they're just that mean-spirited and misogynistic.

But what I find strange is others acting like the proper response to these people is to say, "look, Arya is actually pretty!" instead of, "how is this 11 year old girl's physical appearance relative to her worth in any way?" For people to only ever draw her or reblog art that portrays her with traditionally feminine features and erases her long face. For people to linger over how attractive Arya will be to this or that male character (never a female character, imagine that). For people who claim to love Arya to try and make her more like Sansa, despite one of Arya's most well-known scenes being when she clearly states that's not the type of person she's comfortable being.

And finally:

Arya doesn't need to be pretty to "beat" Sansa and Jeyne or prove them wrong. In fact, insisting that she does is harmful to me and every other reader who relates to Arya for not being traditionally pretty (at the age of 11 years old). My features are a lot like Arya's, personally, and I didn't grow up to be drop-dead gorgeous or even notably pretty. And I don't need to be. Will Arya be? Who cares. Really, why does it matter. Tell me.

Do you think Arya needs to be beautiful to prove Jeyne was unfairly mean about her looks? To prove Sansa going along with it (or just not putting a stop to it) was wrong? Arya's ultimate physical appearance doesn't change anything about this situation: Jeyne and Sansa were in the wrong here whether Arya was pretty, is pretty, or will become pretty. Pretending otherwise enforces harmful standards for girls and women, insisting that their value is in some way tied to beauty just because society says so.

So tell me: was Arya less of a well-written character while wearing the ugly girl's face? What if she'd kept it on forever? What if in the future she falls into a pit of boiling acid and her face is scarred? Will she be worth less to people who enjoy her character just because they can't fancast her with super models? No. Because beauty doesn't affect worth.

Women don't need to be pretty to be kind, clever, or complex. And 11 year old girls definitely don't.