themosscycle

[themosscycle]

I am very glad that I did!! Honestly this was written mostly because of the type of discussions I’ve seen. Because these people say that it’s the same put a different gender to Ralsei and Kris and for me that kinda feels like not reading the room.

But returning to the Ralsei hc…

In my case I also love the idea of Ralsei being a feminine boy, and he also can be. If the game stays like this and he just becomes more proue to openly wear more feminine clothing and to look more representative of what he wants to reflect that’s okay! It is also part of being queer. I’ve met boys that are like that and they still consider themselves men.

Maybe the only reason I would like Ralsei being transfem is because that action would instantly defy the prophecy at some extent and that would go with the themes of not being what the world has scripted for you.

Kris and Noelle forced heteronormativity in Snowgrave, Ralsei being forced being a Prince that carries the secrets… etc… the story opresses all of them and subverting stuff like that it’s cool for the game messaging.

Ralsei could also just become even more feminine, and I think the game makes super duper clear he wants to.

Being a boy that uses dresses and flowers is also important representation. I think that another idea I like is Ralsei being genderfluid because that would also fit well with his shape-shifter abilities.

Ralsei changing his name to Rals or something else too… like as a symbol of him creating an own identity and choosing things for himself would be cool too.

It surprises me how a lot of people doesn’t understand that it’s not the same having a Ralsei transfem headcanon than headcanon Kris as male/female.

Like… I get that people in fanfic sometimes put a gender to Kris and that’s fine. If you don’t agree with a fic you can just not read it, and making other character explorations in art or fanfic is completely okay.

But it’s not the same misgender Kris, than put a feminine gender to Ralsei. I am very surprised to see comments labeling this as just “bias”, when in this case the “bias” is about respecting the characters and the themes they represent in the story, and also to be considerate about what the characters represent to different people.

There is nothing ground breaking about seeing Kris male or female. It services nothing to their character.

Part of Kris’s conflicted autonomy and identity is that they are not yours to label, and we are in this process of getting to know them as players while “controlling” them. (Talking from the meta video game perspective ofc. From the game’s and character’s perspective they are just like that because they want to).

It’s important to Kris character to be nonbinary and be referred by neutral pronouns (whether you headcanon them assigned as a male or female at birth, or if you choose to deviate this for your own personal fanfics or works).

However… in discussions about the canon of when we are talking talking generally about it you should keep Kris’s headcanons to yourself, because nb people are erased a lot from media and that Kris is nb is important for their character. Phrases like: “you could wear anything you want” and the conflict with their identity as a member of the Dreemurs being a human… the neurodivergent coding of Kris and how often ND people can be also queer.

It doesn’t matter as much to any other character because of that. Some people like to see Susie or Noelle as potentially transfem and there is no issue with it because it just doesn’t matter. For me she is a butch, and I like Ralsei as a feminine boy too! It’s also interesting. But yeah, sometimes headcanons conflict more or less with the actual canon, and it’s something that imo we need to consider when we refer to the characters and the game.

But for Ralsei being a girl, if he really wishes to be, would be interesting for his plot and his narrative. Because Ralsei is a character that has never allowed himself to choose anything and the narrative forces him to be this mysterious prince, when he might be just a Lost girl wanting to give love and be accepted. It would be a very good trans allegory even if at the end it’s not completely explicit, and I struggle to see why some people don’t understand this.

We are seeing some small seeds and crumbs about this in the game. It doesn’t come from nowhere. But of course, for now, is still in fanon territory. However, it counts as a theory, so it can be used in general discussions if you want to and that’s the difference.

(Twitter sometimes gets annoying. This is why I like when this kinda stuff doesn’t come out from tumblr lmao)

[themosscycle]

People are so much more sad, and desparate, and lonely than you think. I have had three incidents in the last four months were a technician I was working with was being either dangerously unfocused (we work with high voltage), or just flat out angry with their coworkers, and every time when I just pulled them aside to say hey, this isn't you, you're nice, and you're competent, so something must be up - what can I do to help - they have responded by bursting into tears. One guy was struggling to get his wife moved into a care home, one guy just got served divorce papers, and the other hadn't slept a wink the night before because his daughter had the pukes.

I haven't spent my whole life responding to people being rude, or stupid, or dangerous with knee jerk compassion. It's a new habit. The first time I did that as the lead for my lab, it was because the guy genuinely was so good natured that I knew something had to be off. But the other two times were just me going, alright, lets see if it always goes this well, and so far, it has. I'm almost 30, and I just figured out that the #1 reason people are shitty are because they are going through shit.

I don't think you have, like, a moral obligation to respond to people being jerks with knee jerk compassion. But it has made my life so much easier the last four months that I would recommend trying. For your own sake. Please.

(I'll step off my soapbox now. Enjoy your Sunday.)

[themosscycle]

As someone who remembers the deep lore of Toby Fox being an accomplished pianist who then struggled with his playing and composition because of physical disability in his hands preventing him from being able to play effectively and without severe pain (right around the time when he was scripting Deltarune, in fact)...

The whole narrative of Kris being unable to play while shackled to the soul and then immediately spending the 10 minutes they have free of it (after requisite plot scheming) to play a 8 minute medley of Toby Fox songs (which I'm pretty sure is just a straight up recording of Toby himself playing) feels pretty personally moving in a way that I'm surprised I haven't seen more people talking about. Like yeah, those little moments of frustration when the soul tries to play and just plonks in the keys, that hits, I bet.

[themosscycle]

It surprises me how a lot of people doesn’t understand that it’s not the same having a Ralsei transfem headcanon than headcanon Kris as male/female.

Like… I get that people in fanfic sometimes put a gender to Kris and that’s fine. If you don’t agree with a fic you can just not read it, and making other character explorations in art or fanfic is completely okay.

But it’s not the same misgender Kris, than put a feminine gender to Ralsei. I am very surprised to see comments labeling this as just “bias”, when in this case the “bias” is about respecting the characters and the themes they represent in the story, and also to be considerate about what the characters represent to different people.

There is nothing ground breaking about seeing Kris male or female. It services nothing to their character.

Part of Kris’s conflicted autonomy and identity is that they are not yours to label, and we are in this process of getting to know them as players while “controlling” them. (Talking from the meta video game perspective ofc. From the game’s and character’s perspective they are just like that because they want to).

It’s important to Kris character to be nonbinary and be referred by neutral pronouns (whether you headcanon them assigned as a male or female at birth, or if you choose to deviate this for your own personal fanfics or works).

However… in discussions about the canon of when we are talking talking generally about it you should keep Kris’s headcanons to yourself, because nb people are erased a lot from media and that Kris is nb is important for their character. Phrases like: “you could wear anything you want” and the conflict with their identity as a member of the Dreemurs being a human… the neurodivergent coding of Kris and how often ND people can be also queer.

It doesn’t matter as much to any other character because of that. Some people like to see Susie or Noelle as potentially transfem and there is no issue with it because it just doesn’t matter. For me she is a butch, and I like Ralsei as a feminine boy too! It’s also interesting. But yeah, sometimes headcanons conflict more or less with the actual canon, and it’s something that imo we need to consider when we refer to the characters and the game.

But for Ralsei being a girl, if he really wishes to be, would be interesting for his plot and his narrative. Because Ralsei is a character that has never allowed himself to choose anything and the narrative forces him to be this mysterious prince, when he might be just a Lost girl wanting to give love and be accepted. It would be a very good trans allegory even if at the end it’s not completely explicit, and I struggle to see why some people don’t understand this.

We are seeing some small seeds and crumbs about this in the game. It doesn’t come from nowhere. But of course, for now, is still in fanon territory. However, it counts as a theory, so it can be used in general discussions if you want to and that’s the difference.

(Twitter sometimes gets annoying. This is why I like when this kinda stuff doesn’t come out from tumblr lmao)

[themosscycle]

Transfem Ralsei crowd… you have won a new soldier today.

At first I liked it as a headcanon… but there are too many signs.

That thing of Ralsei tasting the cake for the first time and liking it too.

Chapter 3 & 4 Transfem Ralsei Moments

Battle after Susie switches the controllers.

Calling Ralsei cute. It's worth mentioning that in the 'seen it before' branch of the conversation, Ralsei remarks that if there's one thing about himself he likes, it's his face. Being cute is something that he finds joy in despite his negative self-esteem

Susie and Noelle talking about Ralsei. Even if she's seen the picture of Asriel at this point, instead of just agreeing with Noelle and slipping up that way, Susie immediately compares Ralsei to Toriel (probably thinking about when she stole his glasses in Chapter 2)

And finally: Ralsei talking about how he has never allowed himself anything at all and how his whole existence is about making Kris and Susie happy... while Lost Girl plays in the background. If BERDLY can get a unique theme for his moment of emotional vulnerability, why does Ralsei share Lost Girl with Susie and Noelle (and Dess)?

There's probably a lot more stuff that I may have missed but these moments stuck out to me even on my first playthrough. going to finish chapter 4 and see if there's anything to add later

[themosscycle]

me when I remember that a character whose normal state is being very mumbly and untalktative/strange finding more success in life when they are controlled by someone who forces them to be more confident/say things that arent exactly true to their nature/do things they're not comfortable with

and PERHAPS

potentially feels so exhausted by/opposed to/upset with being someone they're not all day, being perceived as someone they're not by those who they are close to, that they feel the need to rip this control (this facade) out of themself when they are alone just so they can do what they really want for a few minutes....

is a really good autism metaphor.

thank you kris dreemurr. no one does it like you.

[themosscycle]

It’s also good to have rants and criticism of the things we like and love patchwork.

I actually feel bad at times when the game puts Ralsei in a position where he needs to humiliate himself to be useful in any way. Like, when he makes the ladder thing in chapter 4. It’s like a desperate attempt to be and it’s so sad. The pushing buddies is another example.

I will only say that maybe the only badass moment Ralsei has is when he single-handled kills the Oldman-like statue. I guess you didn’t counted it because it’s not really super significant, but yeah there is clearly a tendency of the game of put Ralsei appart from what the others do, and that moment it’s the only exception I can really think of.

Because… well Ralsei knowledge hasn’t also been super useful besides prevent the lighteners from doing things that will bring harm to the world or cause a titan or the roaring. He always intervenes when things are about to get very ugly and gives the necessary info to buy the team more time. But it has come to the detriment of what he intends to do… and that it’s something I had never thought about.

This is why I think people don’t pick up on this, because for people Ralsei’s function is his guidance and information. But he must go against the things he intends to do and that is an angle I had never considered.

I think Ralsei wants to let the lightners be the heroes and have their moments, because actually if you think about it with all the knowledge he has he could solve all the puzzles and we would skip all our “fun”. He has already said this so he could be more useful but he usually doesn’t because probably he has an idea of who is doing what and what is gonna happen….

I think this is what differentiates Ralsei from a damsel. He is knowledgeable, he knows a lot and we have confirmation that he could do a lot more but he just doesn’t. He is never directly put in distress for us to rescue him or he is not fully useless, this is why I think people don’t really have an issue with it and I kinda agree.

This is not to contradict your points, is just things I’ve just thought about why this is a recurring thing… and for all of Ralsei stuff I actually have a theory for chapter 5 that I hope it happens (this that I will say can happen in a lot of different ways and for different causes too… but is something I think the narrative is forging the path to).

Here it comes my two cents on how I think the game should do Ralsei’s arc and what I think is gonna happen ————————————>

Chapter 5 is gonna have a similar focus with Ralsei than chapter 4 had with Susie and chapter 3 with Kris. Even you could stretch this and say chapter 2 was for Noelle though she didn’t had a secret boss fight (well. Guess you could count Snowgrave… if you do that).

If you think about it these 3 chapters were done to be released together. We were meant to see the arcs of the three of the fun gang altogether, but chapter 5 was cut so maybe this is also why it feels like this currently.

We had a lot of crumbs and info of chapter 5, and I think that considering Ralsei is like deltarune version of Flowey and Ralsei’s chapter being Asgore flower shop darkworld, we could have a very significant progress in that regard. Also… I feel that considering Ralsei’s appearance of being a goat I think that the trend of the boss of the darkworld ignoring or disregarding Ralsei will change too. I don’t feel that Asgore will behave as other darkners have (for me it’s almost a confirmation that Asgore is gonna be here due to the portrait we had in the prophecy).

My bet of things that could happen? There is an ability that Ralsei hasn’t learned of shown yet, similarly to how Susie learned to heal Ralsei will learn something more defensive (it should be different than Rude buster though).

This ability is going to make Ralsei step out from his subservient attitude. This is going to be hurtful to watch because something that happens in chapter 5 is gonna make Ralsei finally break. He is going to get angry at things. Justifyingly so. He is gonna scream.

(I heard a theory that this might be caused by Noelle joining the party… and with the chapter 2 Noelle or Ralsei? Question Susie asks… well I will just leave it here. Noelle has all Ralsei’s abilities but improved if you think about it).

We can’t make Ralsei use fire magic even if that is in his prophecy portrait. We have never seen Ralsei actually producing flames (I think he does some attack at some point but we can’t do it)… because he is focused on being this complaint and pacifist companion. Ralsei will become something of himself when he finally allows himself to shine and to be his full self.

Ralsei can also be powerfull. If he puched that statue I think he can do a lot of things that he usually doesn’t do. I think he is limiting himself because that is his role. He is the tutorial, the mage, the assistant. Like, I feel that for the prophecy he is just someone that must always be there to ensure that the intended path of the story it’s not broken significantly. This is why he is not meant to intervene. He is not meant to be someone important.

His way of subverting the prophecy (like Susie does always) will be becoming more than a guide or tutorial-like character. He is trying to change the prophecy but at the same time, when events differ from the prophecy, he gets super scared. It’s something I find very interesting about Ralsei. Of course maybe he just doesn’t want something even worse to happen and that’s fully understandable.

He needs to see that he can and should break things from time to time.

Also… I really want Asgore doing something besides stalking Toriel and embarrassing Kris lmao. Like, Asgore has redeeming qualities but he hasn’t had a time to show them and helping Ralsei could be one of that time. Maybe by helping Ralsei he distracts himself from Toriel and Sans.

I am still debating myself if “fields of pink and gold” is a reference to Susie and Noelle becoming a team sidelining Ralsei, if it is something Mike related or if is something about Asgore and Toriel/Sans. But well… these game usually surprises me so… who knows.

We could also have a lot of reveals of what’s happening because I think that Asgore also knows things.

Also… if he becomes his full badass version I want to see what Kris does.

Okay. Ralsei Rant incoming.

I feel like I have to preface this by saying I love Deltarune, i ADORE Ralsei, and I acknowledge that the game is far from complete and there are plenty of things that can happen going forward.

But I lowkey hate how Ralsei just... fails utterly at EVERYTHING he sets out to do. And I do mean EVERYTHING. He is Failure personified, and I kinda hate that for him.

Chapter 1: Tries to establish the prophecy to the heroes (while attempting to subvert it at the same time) and get them onside. He fails at this because Susie initially refuses to cooperate, and when she DOES finally come onside, it's because of Lancer and Kris, not anything Ralsei says to her. He then tries to convince King by healing him - and fails, nearly consigning the heroes to death as a result.

Chapter 2: Tries to keep the more horrifying/existential aspects of their destiny under wraps. Here he fails on two fronts, first because Kris digs too deep with Spamton, and then again because Berdly very nearly creates a Titan and kickstarts the Roaring, necessitating Ralsei to scream at them to stop. This does not endear him to anyone.

Chapter 3: Tries to console Tenna. Fails, because his sense of empathy is so incredibly warped due to his own nonexistent self-esteem that he very nearly drives Tenna to suicide. Alternatively, you could see this as Ralsei getting Tenna to accept his imminent demise at the Knight's hand. This too fails, because Susie immediately undoes that with her own rousing speech.

Chapter 4: Tries to prevent Susie from going to his room and discovering it's empty. Fails, because all he did to stop her was put up one bit of yellow tape. Then he tries to ensure that neither Kris nor Susie will see the result of the final prophecy. Fails, because Susie rushes ahead to look for Gerson and stumbles across it on her own.

Everything significant Ralsei tries to do completely and utterly fails. Events happen and victories are won IN SPITE of his involvement, and not because of it. He has all this knowledge about what's going to happen, he's acutely aware about the dark world and its rules, and he still cannot do a thing. And the worst part? He can't even claim that he had no choice, because he's been working to subvert the prophecy from the very start, meaning it DOESN'T have a cast-iron grip on his actions and choices. Ralsei's failures are all his own.

And what, additionally, does he contribute to major fights, aside from a TP-intensive healing spell? Against King he's an active detriment. Against Queen he does very little, while Kris and Susie are much better at removing Berdly's wires than he is. Against the Knight he can't do meaningful damage, his healing takes valuable TP from Susie's Rude Busters, and he disintegrates if the Knight so much as breathes on him. And against the Titan, his best use is to bring Kris back to life and be one half of a decreasing-effectiveness Dual Heal.

Contrast with Susie - demolishes King's HP with Rude/Red Buster, Throws Kris to cut Berdly's wires the most effectively, AND can demolish Queen's acid shield with Rude/Red Buster, she's the sole MVP of the Knight fight, and her idea is pivotal to defeating the Titan at the end of Chapter 4.

And look, I'm not going to say that Ralsei failing to keep his friends from caring about him and wanting him to be his own person is bad - of course it isn't! We want him to be able to choose for himself what he's (or indeed she) is going to be. But for heaven's sake, he's going 0 for 0 right now. And if my theory about him snapping in Chapter 5 and being the one responsible for the "inferno of jealousy" turns out to be correct, he'll have continued the trend of failing at absolutely everything meaningful he tries to do.

And additionally, I'm not saying that his inability to succeed at anything despite his best efforts makes his character bad! Again, far from it! I Love Ralsei because of his struggles with his identity, his desires fighting against his obligations, and his unflinching kindness and gentleness in the face of a cruel and uncaring world. But Toby, I'm begging you - give us SOMETHING to celebrate over here! Give us SOMETHING we Ralsei stans can point to and go "see! He IS contributing to the team! He IS pulling his weight! He ISN'T just a cute and cuddly guy and/or girl!"

At this point, I think Ralsei's issue is more fundamental than "He has negative self-esteem" or "He's the wrong gender". Put simply, the universe FUCKING HATES HIM. It's like he's destined to fail, destined to die, destined to never amount to anything. And yes, Susie loves him and Susie will save him and Susie will regurgitate meals into his mouth like a baby bird, but all that actually means at the moment is that he's forever doomed to wander in her vast shadow, never able to make anything of himself. What would he even be without her? Nothing? Less than nothing?

People are talking about Ralsei's role in combat becoming completely superfluous, and having to be carried by his friends, and are treating this as an Unambiguously Good Thing. And it kind of blows my mind that anyone can accept that a character in a story - a Main Character, no less! - can serve absolutely no function except to be a mascot and stand at the sidelines doing nothing, contributing nothing, achieving nothing. Do you know what those characters are called? They're called DAMSELS. And people DO NOT LIKE DAMSELS, last I checked!

I don't know, maybe I'm missing something here. Maybe Ralsei's unending litany of failure and ineffectiveness is meant to say something profound that I'm just not picking up on. But would it have killed the developers to let him have ONE unambiguous triumph? ONE thing we can point to and say, yeah, that's all Ralsei, that's his Thing and he rocks for that. And maybe that makes it sound like I hate him, and I have to assure you yet again, I don't. I love this guy to pieces - and it's precisely because I love him that I'm so torn up about this.

I don't hate Ralsei. I hate that he can't catch even a single goddamn break.

[themosscycle]

saw a twitter post that was like "carol knight is CH 3/4's kris knight, and rudy knight is CH 3/4's papyrus knight" and i'm kinda speechless because it's correct. that's pretty much it.

[themosscycle]

in that moment

[themosscycle]

My take on this is that Kris isn't necessarily kneeling here out of some kind of deep loyalty but because the Knight is pushing them down with its sword until they fall.

it's both a kind of acknowledgement of strength (a knighting) and a cheeky reminder from the Knight that they could have Kris's arm off, if they really wanted to.

like Kris just watched them do to Tenna.

[themosscycle]

I found this so funny… I was like thinking… do I really need to grind all these dudes?? Then this happened. Lmfao.

for your.... whatever needs

[themosscycle]

Those theories that: “Deltarune’s final message will be that you should go outside and touch some grass” are so annoying…

Like… of course, probably it won’t be a happy ending where all the darkners live with the lightners in a happy dream world. There will be some angst but come on… all Gerson speech about hope and courage can’t be for no payoff.

[themosscycle]

OK! I think, I have a theory...

We all know about theory where Susie replaced Noelle in the prophecy because of her power to defy fate.

I started to think "How the story of the game would've changed without her?" If prophecy went the way it was supposed to.

Then I remembered this....

Ralsei was surprised when Delta Warriors defeated the Titan. The same way he was surprised when we "defeated" the Knight. Doesn't he know the whole prophecy? Probably without Susie these battles would've went differently.

Susie was the one who chopped part of Knight's sword.

And SUSIE'S IDEA was what allowed us to defeat the Titan.

But what would've happened without Susie? They would've just allowed the Titan to roam in the Dark World freely? Even if yes, Ralsei doesn't seem that much relieved by the fact they defeated a Titan.

Because if not Susie, the fight wouldn't have happened...

She was the one who made the Knight open the second fountain. So Titan's defeat was just a return to Prophecy's original track.

The whole Titan fight wouldn't have happened if not Susie..

It all wasn't in the prophecy to begin with.

(All screenshots were taken from this and this videos because I am a lazy ass. Go support creators who don't put spoilers into their thumbnails.)

[themosscycle]

Transfem Ralsei as a concept, whether purely a headcanon or not, is so much more interesting than transfem Noelle.

Like, Noelle being trans is a fun thought, but there’s nothing interesting added or gained from it. She’s the same character, just with a trans button slapped on.

Ralsei on the other hand? Fuck. Like, this poor goat really believes he doesn’t deserve anything, and devotes his existence solely to being what others want from him. And it’s clear he’s unhappy about it. Not only is that already super egg coded and relatable to plenty of transfems, but the idea of him completely defying what he was made for to become her own person is so much compelling and interesting than “Noelle, but she’s trans”

[themosscycle]

ralsusie is so utenanthy-coded if you think about it

[themosscycle]

endlessly fascinated by flowey basically being the first darkner we ever meet? he is an object (a plant) injected with determination and given "the will to live"... that's basically what darkners are; in deltarune, the dark fountains are created through determination and bring the surrounding objects in the immediate area to life.

i replayed undertale recently for deltarune research, and i can't stop thinking about true lab. thanks to ralsei's dark worlds lore drop at the start of ch3, we actually have a very tangible connection between dark worlds and true lab thanks to this little freak:

(relevant bc FRIEND's face is specifically on endogeny's body, an amalgam created in true lab)

and when combing through true lab, alphys presents us with a very relevant question:

flowey answers this question in his own way in undertale, but i am very curious as to what the ultimate answer is going to be in deltarune. it's already been answered, kind of? none of the darkners we meet have ever wanted to cease existing. spamton especially stands out to me in this regard; he is chasing his freedom down at all costs. is this not him directly exercising his will to live, his will to continue existing... his own determination?

...but what happens to him, assuming you pursue his boss fight in ch2? is spamton's fate- being unable to do anything after his strings have been cut- a grim omen of what happens to darkners when they have the will to live?

deltarune has been very choosy with when it allows itself to use the word "determination" (iirc it only happens three times: twice from queen about noelle and once from 'the voice' (gaster) if we die while challenging the roaring knight).

this isn't quite a theory, moreso a presenting of ideas, but i want to believe ralsei could become determined enough to do something cool by the end of the game. after all, ralsei's resolution at the end of chapter 4 is wanting to believe the prophecy can change. or, rather...

ralsei's resolution at the end of chapter 4 is gaining the resolve to change fate, for real this time :)

[themosscycle]

I have stumbled upon this interpretation of the game, and I find it very interesting. I get that this is not shared by most of the fanbase and I really like to see new interpretations of these games in general (kinda dislike that people turn this into a war of who is right or who isn’t right, but I know it’s the internet lmao.).

I find interesting that people never consider that sometimes you really ponder between two choices your brain makes.

Sometimes I want to say something but I am afraid and I prefer to say nothing.

Talking from the meta perspective, we influence what Kris does, but I don’t think that the actions don’t come from Kris.

This thing of feeling apart from Kris is clearly intentional from the game’s perspective. There is clearly a separation being made, but the narration and the choices are all Kris’s.

Regardless of the interpretation we have, I think Snowgrave and feeling powerful is something that makes Kris feel safe. When Rudy says to Kris to go and protect Noelle… they unwillingly are making this tendency in Kris stronger imo, because Kris is in the middle of a fucked up situation and they want to protect her.

They hate to harm people they love, but at the same time power makes them feel safe, and is a tendency that exists inside themself.

I don’t 100% subscribe to this but it’s very interesting to consider as a possibility. I prefer to keep an open mind. even if also I can’t help but have my own cents about it with the info we currently have.

Also… like you are pointing out the game insist into avoiding make a clear separation between the soul and Kris. The reason why their body can function without the soul for a time it’s to be seen. But still Kris and their soul are always the same for the rest, and just a separate thing for US.

“ohhh did kris want to do this or did the SOUL make them” why did you say kris twice