wondyweiss

[wondyweiss]

Welp, apparently Viz bought rhubarb and a number of the fndm darling names are still involved. Guess we'll see whether this means more 'Ice Queendom' style spinoffs or the current story's conclusion.

All we can do is wait! Am interested what direction they'll take regardless of whose attached.

[wondyweiss]

There have been several "download everything you can because it's so getting deleted" posts wrt to RT being shut down next month so I would like to draw your attention to the Archive of Pimps. People have been working very hard to archive the entire Rooster Teeth catalogue (including First content) and while most of it has been backed up the to Internet Archive they could use help with organizing it. Instead of a bunch of people individually downloading different videos sporadically to their own machines, check to see if the videos you want are already on the archive and you can download them from there and if you might like to help organize.

[wondyweiss]

say what you will about rooster teeth and its business practices, but it is genuinely heinous that warner bros can just wipe something of such significance to youtube, the entertainment industry, and the internet as a whole completely off the map because they didnt "make enough of a profit"

[wondyweiss]

They just announced that the RT Store is closing down for good 4/26 (April 26th) so get the RWBY stuff(also anything else they drop before the end) while you can guys!

[wondyweiss]

A mega archive of every piece of rooster teeth content, I myself DID NOT!, create this, so credit to whoever did! Be sure to share this around with everyone!

[wondyweiss]

[wondyweiss]

Hey, shameful update: my dumb ass *totally* misread Neath's tweets. His work with Arr Tee was free*lance*, so presumably they paid him. Very sorry for the false alarm.

Yeah, dw- I saw! You're all good lmao

[wondyweiss]

Clarifying a little: from the way Neath phrased things it seemed like his VOing was *intentionally* pro-bono. I don't think he was aware of how hellish things were for, say, the animation teams. Still.

Ah, okay! That adds a lot, thank you.

[wondyweiss]

So apparently Neath Oum responded on twitter to pestering about how Chicken Dentures' collapse affects him. Good news: not in any 'I was directly depending on this shit company' sense-his actual employment is totally unconnected. Less good but unsurprising news: his Ren-voicing was unpaid.

What the fuck

[wondyweiss]

there is something soooo funny to me about rvvby ending on volume 9. A nothing volume. A volume of filler. A volume where you can count the things that happened that actually mattered, that would have had a lasting impact, on one hand

I mean what a waste but also how funny

[wondyweiss]

you see those comments from barbara on reddit about rt animation's budget?

Someone sent this to me awhile back. Here's Barbara talking about financial stuff regarding production.

[wondyweiss]

A lengthy thought wall about the recent RT shutdown and DillonGoo Studios' interest in acquiring RWBY - I speculate and entertain some hopium about the pros that could come with it and why all in all, impossible it may be, it's probably the best shot we have for RWBY.

Some rwde cause it mentions Shane's letter and nobody likes that.

I've been reading a lot, a lot of the various discussions around RWBY's fate and Dillon Goo Studio's (henceforth shortened to DGS) interest in acquiring it. Here's my overall evaluation everything so far:

This goes without saying but this is obviously an optimistic take on the matter, I wanna talk moreso about the pros rather than the logistics of whether DGS can afford it, whether you think it's just clout-chasing, etc.

Dillon's a former RWBY animator and a fan of Monty's work. No matter what you think of Monty's style of action, in the greater public sphere, RWBY is known and liked precisely for that and largely that alone, period. Only RWBY fans who are already invested in the show will mention story or characters - for the majority of people, i.e. future RWBY fans, the action is the main selling point, and DGS clearly can deliver on this.

Dillon himself is at least amicable with most of CRWBY and likely open to negotiate with them given prior work history. For any other media corporation, consulting the old IP holders of a defunct company is a minor formality at best or even a laughable waste of time. And if you want to bring up a certain almost 10-year-old letter and the person working with Dillon who wrote it, there are plenty in the comments section who would agree with me that it's not as big a dealbreaker as one might think, given the company the letter largely condemned is well dead and buried. I won't go further into that matter.

DGS is very community-oriented - they're very intimately familiar with 3D animation and produces creator-friendly content like the Goo Engine which helps future animators inspired by RWBY to make similar anime-style 3D content. Every single RWBY fan animator whose work we enjoyed benefits from this acquisition - all of whom can grow into future animators for the series, intimately familiar with its trademark action style.

DGS is probably the only genuine fan of RWBY that has a remote chance of acquiring the IP with the express motivation of using the IP creatively. This can be clearly seen in the steady improvement of their animation content over the years and desire to push the medium. All other candidates are corporations whose motivations with RWBY are, more likely than not, going to be entirely financial (not necessarily a bad or unhealthy thing, but it's a factor).

If RWBY stays under WB or given off to Crunchyroll? They have no stake in RWBY beyond pure business. They have no interest in what's best for RWBY or its growth, only how it will be most profitable or recoup the losses from RT. The only companies I can see being more creatively invested in RWBY are ArcSystem Works who implemented RWBY in Blazblue Cross Tag Battle, or Shaft that animated Ice Queendom, but those are both Japanese companies unlikely to go all-in on a foreign IP - especially given that these studios usually adapt other IPs, not buy them outright.

DGS is invested in RWBY. Their entire studio's style is built on RWBY-esque action animation. Acquiring RWBY more or less guarantees it'll become their main flagship series and their main investment, whereas with WB, Crunchyroll or other big platform, RWBY is nowhere near prolific enough to be much more than another shelf-filler in their library. At worst, Warner archives RWBY for eternity and at best, they only bring RWBY out for tie-ins and crossovers to prop up their larger DC properties. Why give RWBY the spotlight when they own the likes of Justice League and Looney Tunes?

DGS may not be the most plausible choice, but it's clear that unless some big company like ArcSystem Works or something throws their hat in the RWBY ring, DGS is far and away the people's favourite, even gaining approval from JJ Grelle (Tyrian's VA), who quite notably refused to reprise their role for Rooster Teeth.

DGS is still very much an indie studio which IMO RWBY has flourished the most under, the time period where it retained a certain unpolished energy that made you invested in watching it improve and grow. I don't want to watch a RWBY that uses its precious time under a new studio to just go by the numbers and coast by on its existing fanbase. I want to watch a RWBY that grows, innovates and takes risks, that impresses and draws new and old fans in the way it does for every single person that has watched the Red Trailer for the first time.

I think a lot of folks have a preconceived notion that RWBY has to continue on the exact same production value as V9 left off, but that never had to be the case. I think a return to a much more subdued production with smaller teams focusing on strong individual episodes over large overarching narratives will be healthy for RWBY and more easily invite new fans, which it sorely needs if it wants to stay afloat this time around.

Whether this means a continuation to V10 or a reboot I don't know, but I know I'd rather take a RWBY that a new studio respects and will produce in a way that fits their strengths and limits, over trying and overreaching themselves to make something work that even Rooster Teeth failed to, or over no RWBY at all.

That's the crux of it: the worse alternative is no RWBY at all. CRWBY and especially us as a fandom are in no position to be picky when that's the alternative. There's no such thing as a perfect deal, but this is about as sweet as they come. If the only hurdle is WB's refusal to sell, then that's on Warner. If the only hurdle is affording the IP, I, many others and no doubt other associates Dillon Goo Studios knows are likely to help them meet that price.

I do wanna stress, despite my optimism, I'm not asking to stake all our hopes on DGS as the saviour of RWBY, god no - the last thing I want is a weirdo Monty 2.0 cult and I doubt Dillon would want that either. I'm not saying the RWBY they'd make will be perfect or be equitable for everyone either - some compromises must be made and professionally speaking, whoever owns RWBY next has no legal obligation to make V10 or bring back anyone from CRWBY. Any such action is solely on the graces of the new IP holder and at the end of the day, I think whatever creates a healthier, longer-lasting future for RWBY should take priority over our sentiment or attachment.

But as things stand right now, if DGS isn't just farming Twitter likes and is honest-to-god serious about acquiring RWBY, and no better candidate presents themselves, this is about the best option we have right now, and I myself will be ready to help and contribute in whatever little way I can. Because I know the very real alternative is either a complete gamble on yet another faceless media subsidiary, or watching RWBY rot behind a vault for the next decade or more.

[wondyweiss]

So I've had this in my pocket for the past two years. I've been debating on putting this up or not since I think the comment was later deleted or hidden and I don't know if that was the posters doing or a mod on the reddit. This was someone I interviewed back when I was looking into RT's labor practices back in 2019. I feel like putting this up now considering RT will cease to exist and because I'm seeing Shane being brought up again so hey here's a former employee stating how one of the reasons they didn't open up about their experience was because of how Shane was treated by the fanbase and was worried about going through the same thing.

[wondyweiss]

I cannot tell you how happy this makes me to see this. JJGrelle brought life to Tyrian and it would be incredible if they came back to voice him again.

[wondyweiss]

At least they canceled rwby before the writers had to contend with the fact that Jaune is mentally like 70 years old and any future relationships they set up with him would be intensely frightening

[wondyweiss]

Why do you think RWBY v1-3 worked compared to the rest of it?

Hm.

Honestly a lot of the first three volumes doesn't - the pacing can be awful (and grinds to a halt within arcs dealing with Jaune), the writing decisions leave a lot of to be desired(and are beyond offensive at times).

To say what the first three volumes do well is to talk about what the volumes after dont.

The issue with V4 and onward is simple one:

Too many new redundant characters

I have been hammering on this point again and again - in a weird attempt to expand the world, the showrunners ended up filling it with things that overlap win purpose or outright have no purpose.

Generally if you want to have something happen and want to choose between existing character and new character as initiator, nine times out of ten it's better to go with an existing character.

For example, why did we need Salem's evil council of evil? Why did we need a whole team of villains on Salem's side that essentially fulfill same role and purpose as Cinder's group already did? They don't exactly do anything for the lore or the setting and most of their purpose is one-note - Hazel for example exists just to rage about Ozpin in a poorly executed attempt at making his intentions and role more ambiguous - but there are already plenty of characters who can fill that purpose, so why was Hazel, as a character made? Raven exists, Ironwood exists and is clearly having a crisis, even Haven's headmaster exists (let's say he does) - plenty of ways other characters can fulfill the same purpose as Hazel without Hazel existing. Same extends to the rest of Salem's group - Watts exists solely to "explain" the computer virus (why did we need it explained?) and to have a reason to go against Atlas (but Cinder already has a reason thanks to her backstory in-show???) and Tyrian is the same way.

Too many redundant story beats

The writing attempted to make the setting more complex, but in the end a lot of what's added has no real reason to be there - why do we need Relics when Maidens are already there? Even if we were to go with the same idea of Gods causing doomsday(as dumb as it is) the writing could just as easily have the exact same plotline with collecting Maiden powers, for example. So why have vaults and then relics on top of that?

The Gods are the same way too. Why have Gods at all when you can already comfortably just go with the idea of Salem getting Maidens powers to her side being just as catastrophic? Salem's backstory doesn't even need them - in fact if one were to remove the Gods and keep the backstory the same, the end result would be exact same story. But the show doesn't do that - instead, come V9, it adds ANOTHER layer of gods and magic trees and gives the god brothers a backstory that ALSO wasn't needed and doesn't do ANYTHING in terms of furthering the narrative.

Generally if there's a plot thread you'd want to do the first question to ask would be "Does this change ANYTHING for any of the characters?" - plot is an excuse to get characters through the story beats after all. In the case of God Brothers, the plot thread invents a new problem and then solves it - nothing changes.

Lost Focus

The show is titled RWBY for a reason.

Ruby, Weiss, Blake, Yang - that's the core of the show.

The show started with the color trailers focusing on them and their journeys. The Volume 3 ended with them each having their own issues to deal with and plot threads tying to those issues.

What do the Volumes that follow do with that set-up? Nothing.

Volume 4 is absolutely pointless in grand scheme of things.

Volume 5 is absolutely pointless in grand scheme of things.

Volume 6 is absolutely pointless in grand scheme of things.

In fact, I wrote about the story structure issues with V4 years ago

The narrative structure, at the basic level, is a game of Connect-the-Dots - you have specific story beats you want to reach that work in accordance with overall story and character outline - it's up for The Plot(tm) to lead the characters from one beat to the other.

The way RWBY works past V3 is by inventing a new problem that didn't and then resolving it, essentially staying in place. I sort of outlined it in the V4 structure chart in my write up in how nothing in that Volume serves any real purpose nor furthers the characters.

What does the mess at Haven Academy contribute to the story story that Beacon already haven't? Does what happen there affect the story going forward? No.

What does team RWBY and the whole absolutely dumb and boring mess with the mech and leviathan do for the story? Are there any lasting consequences from that happening? Nope.

What does the run-in with the Apathy do for the characterization? Are there any lingering psychological effects? Do we learn something new about how Grimm function or how the Eyes work? Are there any lingering implications or any story holes that the encounter slots in into? Absolutely nothing.

That's three big examples in those Volumes where the writing invents a new issue, resolves it and doesn't further characters or narrative by doing so.

In Connect-the-Dots, you don't stop hopping from dot to dot midway-through, you don't hop back and forth between existing dots. Story beats and character beats are beats for a reason - they move things forward, they affect things, they alter things. If you have something that leads the narrative back at the place it was before in then you might as well delete the entire thing.

Now this is not the same as characters being stuck in loops or the idea of repetition as storytelling device - repetition that the narrative is aware of WOULD be a story beat in on itself and this is not that.

In fact even going into Atlas arc - the endgame has almost nothing to do with the build up to it and would happen anyway even if most of the volumes leading to it were removed.

Anticlimactic Payoff

If the narrative is build up to something, the pay off should generally equal to the amount of time and focus spend on the build up (unless it's used as a contrast).

Yet in RWBY a lot of mysteries end up being more of matter-of-fact answers than revelations.

What happened to the moon? Oh something crashed into it.

Why are Ozpin and Salem the way they are? Gods did it.

Why is Raven angry at Ozpin? He...turned her into a bird?

What has been Raven up to? Nothing.

Is Ozpin shady or not? Eh, not really - he's just sort of there.

What's up with the creatures of Grimm? Gods did it.

All of these were teased and built up going forward and the actual revelations never justified the build up or teasing that came before.

None of those revelations did anything to further the narrative or develop characters.

It was as if the writers were going through a checklist of what needs to be revealed.

So, What about the first three Volumes?

Now, flip everything I wrote about V4 and onward upside down.

That's the first three Volumes.

The only characters that exist are the ones that have an use within the narrative.

The plot threads are revealed when they become relevant - Mt.Glenn comes up when it matters, for example. If anything there's not enough reveals.

One can easily trace the plot threads through the story - how Ruby's introduction to Beacon affects her dynamics with Weiss, how Jaune's and Ruby's struggles with unexpected positions of leadership affect the team formation, how the friction within the teams furthers the plot to crash into villains goals. And what's more - each mini-arc ties to the four leads and their characterization. Things don't just happen - each storyline starts with the character and ends with characters growing or their relationships changing.

The Payoff is extremely good - V3 takes every single thing the show did through the three volumes and makes use of it. Everything matters - Mt. Glenn exposition, Roman, WF stuff, Jaune's insecurities, Pyrrha's characterization, Yang's characterization, Blake's conflict, Ruby's growth and position int he story, Weiss growth, etc - everything gets used and everything affects the characters involved.

For all the flaws, for all the absolutely insensitive story decisions and bad jokes - the first three volumes manage to handle those key points well and the end result is far more enjoyable.

The volumes after don't.

While good action sequences helped one of many reasons I hold V1 through V3 dear to my heart is because the show pulled off something that was quite rare back then when those Volumes aired - delivering actual consequences and not being afraid of upsetting the status quo within the story.

[wondyweiss]

Round 2

Brambleclaw submission

Sienna Khan submission