fluffybananacake

[fluffybananacake]

are we fighting about fic comments yet again?

It looks like the "comments on fanfic" argument/discussion/whatever is going around for the umpteenth time since fanfic was on the internet. Usually I stay out of this stuff, but this time I made a tumblr just to get my thoughts out about it. Because I have them, and they come from a place of a primarily fic reader who is honestly feeling a little beaten up about this. It's long but so be it. One post of mine in counter to what feels like a landslide of posts of everyone else yelling about comments feels ok to me. (After reading enough posts, even the ones that are super bland and "yeah comments are good I guess" feel like nagging.)

PLEASE NOTE: Comments are good, I am certainly not saying and will never say that no one should ever leave them, or that authors who want comments are acting entitled or spoiled or whatever else I've seen on the other side.

a. Who is the intended audience for these discussions? I honestly can't figure this out. Is it just "other fans" or "fandom"? That's super broad, and would include fic writers as well, who presumably do comment sufficiently on other writers' fic, based on the generally accepted belief that comments are good and writers love getting them, and readers should be leaving more. It would certainly be something if that wasn't the case. So All Of Fandom can't be the intended audience. Is the intended audience the population of fic readers who don't write and never ever leave comments? Well, I'm going to posit that Solely Readers Not Commenters is a population that probably has a high proportion of people who aren't on tumblr, who don't follow fic writers on social media, and whose main--if not only--engagement in fandom is just reading fic, and who therefore neither know nor care that this conversation even exists.

I'm also going to suggest that this is not a massively large group, because at some point, they're likely going to move on to another hobby or comment on a fic or take some other action that would move them out of this group. I don't think Solely Readers Not Commenters is the intended audience, because frankly, they're just not involved in fandom at that level.

Is the intended audience readers who don't write, and who leave comments but not on every fic they read? If so, then I don't understand this either because this Readers Only group IS leaving comments. They comment! They may even comment a lot! So, it can't be to them either, because they are already meeting the presumed goals of the discussion, getting comments on fic.

b. So is the issue then that people aren't leaving ENOUGH comments?

Well, define "enough". I think what people are looking for here is just a nebulous ephemeral "more". Understandable! Who doesn't want more comments on their fic? But "more" is not quantifiable, and it is a lot to put on your Readers Only (who I do think is the group all this is directed to, and who I will refer to as Readers going forward). A generalized yearning for "more" will never be satisfied. Some Readers may increase their comment practices as a result of this discussion, and that is great--and will likely be insignificant for any given writer because there are 14 million fics on AO3, and even a 10% increase in comments is going to miss entire fandoms and/or writers.

Also, the kudos button exists for a reason. That reason is to provide feedback when the reader doesn't have anything to say other than "read it, liked it!". I've seen arguments that some people use the kudos button for other reasons, but as there is literally no way to know why someone clicked the kudos button without asking them, why not assume that they are using it for the intended purpose? Kudos are positive feedback, they are a "thanks for writing", they indicate a baseline level of appreciation and enjoyment of the fic, and they are absolutely just as valid a form of feedback as the most detailed comment. Not as gratifying to receive for sure, but that doesn't make them less worthy or nothing. We've all seen fic that received thousands of kudos--isn't that preferable to thousands of comments that just say a variation of "read it, liked it"? The more in-depth comments, the comments that are valued and that Writers hold deep in their hearts, would get lost in the flood. And if there was no kudos button, my fandom experience leads me to believe that there wouldn't be a comparable uptick in comments. Instead, people who would have clicked a kudos button will now just click the back button, the overall comment levels would remain relatively constant, but now Writer is actually getting less feedback than before. Long live the kudos button.

c. Is it then the quality of the comments? This is definitely part of the conversation. For every post that says "any and all comments are amazing and loved!" there is another post, or four, giving guidelines on how to format your comment, literal outlines and templates to use, and other helpful suggestions on how to leave thoughtful detailed comments.

These are probably really helpful for many people. They're probably especially helpful for those times when a fic hit the reader HARD and they're having a difficult time articulating what they want to say about it, or for people who struggle with commenting in general, or who like guidelines, or have anxiety about commenting but still really want to, or for any number of reasons.

They can also feel a lot like work, and aren't going to appeal to everyone--and they're not required..

"No one is saying they ARE required!" Agreed! No one is saying that at all, and please keep writing those and putting them out there because as I said two paragraphs ago, they are probably really helpful for a lot of people! When they are part of an overall conversation/discussion about how Readers are failing in the comments department however (and yes that is the overall tone), it can come across as "your comment that you liked the fic and thanks wasn't actually sufficient and you need to give that writer more detailed positive feedback". Cool, that's just super cool.

The danger here, which this debate runs up against every single time it bubbles up, is that this is one small step away from telling people How To Do Fandom. And that's a bad thing, right? Isn't fandom supposed to be the place where you can be yourself and engage at the level you want? That seems to be the general sense around the related perennial debate about constructive criticism in comments--people are here to have fun, however they have that fun is fine, only positive comments because this is all for fun. Why can't that grace be given to Readers as well?

d. Comments encourage writers to write, and some people may stop writing without them, and also Readers are getting fic for FREE so this is the least they can do.

These are two sides of the same coin to me, and that coin is called something like Readers Who Don't Comment Are Freeloaders and Driving Writers Out of Fandom. I've seen the "fic is free" argument a million times, and it holds zero water for me. "For FREE!" Like fic is a commodity that would otherwise be sold, but here, by the grace and benevolence of Writer, behold this fic for you, Reader, given for FREE. You know what else is given for FREE? Reader attention, so maybe go post the last chapter of that 4/5 complete WIP that's been gathering dust for years, if the commodification of fanfiction is going to be the argument. But we're not about telling people they have to do anything in the fanfiction world here in this one-post tumblr, so do or don't, Writer, whatever works.

Fandom is predominantly a hobby, no one is forcing anyone to publicly post anything on AO3 or Wattpad or whatever, and it is not the job of Readers to keep other people engaged. Furthermore, Readers are not second-class fandom citizens. This argument ignores the fact that Readers get to choose how they engage with fandom, and it elevates Writer concerns over Reader concerns. In a word, it's gross.

(A related argument is "well, what if everyone just stopped writing fic at all, what THEN?" and the only response to that is "what if the moon fell out of the sky" because both are equally likely to happen. Fanfiction predates the internet and was around in the 1800s. It isn't going anywhere.)

e. OK fine, anonymous one-post tumblr account, what is your freaking point.

I love comment rodeos. I love comment drives. I love leaving comments, and I loved getting them on the handful of fics I did write decades ago. I don't think Writers are obligated to reply to their comments any more than I think Readers are obligated to leave comments, but I think it is lovely when it happens. The kudos button is one of AO3's best features, and is exactly as valid as a comment because it is positive feedback. A fic has 7000 kudos? Congratulations, 7000 discrete people liked that story! CELEBRATION TIME! I also will hold the following opinion until the sun dies: that it is 100% acceptable, valid, and appropriate to read a fic and do literally nothing after. No comment, no kudos, just clicking that back button and going to the next thing--for any reason whatsoever.

I think that what we're really seeing in this big fandom discussion is the very human and understandable need for acknowledgement, validation and positive reinforcement. Writers are getting comments on their fic, but they don't feel like it's enough, or the comments are not the kind they like. Writers often spend a lot of time and effort on their fic, and it is understandable that they may subconsciously want a commensurate level of effort from Readers as a whole.

But comments aren't fanfiction. A comment is never going to match the energy put into the fic itself, no matter how detailed and effusive, because Writer's relationship with with that story began before putting fingers on the keyboard.

My super unpopular opinion (I know, I have yet another one) is that the average fic gets the comment engagement it's meant to get. A fic that rocked that fandom to its core, that shooketh it and brought it to its knees, will obviously get a ton of comments. A fic that is a perfectly fine middle of the road fic, pleasant to read, a good time, and also forgettable once it's over will get fewer. Yes, some fics get lost in the rush, some fics never get the audience that they could have for whatever reason. As in life, so in fandom--the sun does not shine equally bright on everyone.

Do I think people should comment more? No, because fanfiction--reading or writing--is not a job or an obligation. I point again to the millions of unfinished and abandoned WIPs, to refute any pushback that Readers owe anything to Writers. If there is an obligation, it would have to go both ways. Yet WIPs, including those by Writers who are still active in the same fandom, are often abandoned entirely *despite* comments begging for updates. Writers do not owe fic to Readers, and Readers do not owe comments to Writers, full-stop.

We're all in this corner of fandom because we love fic. We love writing it, or we love reading it, or we love doing both. And we, as individuals with agency, get to choose the level of engagement with fanfic that we feel comfortable in, at any given time.