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hamham1o1 · 3 years

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A look at Dream's punishment through irl rules and taking into account UN's rules regarding prisons. Because it is just interesting and it proves how there is NO justification for it. But mostly because it's interesting to look at and you may learn a thing or two.

I have seen too many times people trying to justify Dream’s punishment. I did research and read through multiple articles and documents (over 73 pages of two different documents) about the more legal sides of his punishment. While Quackity’s physical torture is obvious, I am here to address that even before that it was still very illegal. I know it is fictional! This is just a look into the real life facts and rules regarding prisons because it is interesting to look at Dream’s punishment and Pandora’s Vault under the light of these. So keep that in mind while reading this!

Welcome to my ted talk with actual facts and be prepared for quite the ride!

While yes, he has done bad things…however he has not done something so bad that he deserves a punishment so cruel that it’s considered too inhumane for even mass murderers. Like actually! Stay tooned and you’ll see what I mean.

His sentence is indefinite solidary confinement. Which is defined by the united nations as:

“the confinement of prisoners for 22 hours or more a day without meaningful human contact.”

This means his punishment fits the definition for all his time (including visits) except when Tommy was locked inn and now with Quackity (although I’d consider the last one a turn for the worse). Now that we have that cleared up- lets get into the rule breaking. But first, let me introduce you to The Mandela Rules!

“The Mandela Rules reinforce human rights principles, including

the recognition of the absolute prohibition of torture and other cruel, inhuman

or degrading treatment or punishment and effective guidance

to national prison administrations for persons deprived of their liberty”

Now that we have established that, lets get into this concerning fact train!

Rule 43

1. In no circumstances may restrictions or disciplinary sanctions amount to torture or other cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment.

The following practices, in particular, shall be prohibited:

(a) Indefinite solitary confinement;

(b) Prolonged solitary confinement;

(d) Corporal punishment or the reduction of a prisoner’s diet or drinking water;

(e) Collective punishment.

Yeah…pretty clear breaking of 4/5 there. They can’t even break e! Not to mention the pretty explicit breaking of d that was probably a surprise. You can count it as them breaking 4/4 if you count the fact that they can’t even break e. Rest assured my friend, this is just the beginning.

Rule 44

For the purpose of these rules, solitary confinement shall refer to the confinement of prisoners for 22

hours or more a day without meaningful human contact. Prolonged solitary confinement shall refer to

solitary confinement for a time period in excess of 15 consecutive days.

Already broken this one too huh. Even visiting days counts because I don’t think anyone has been there for hours and I also don’t think Sam’s interactions would be long enough or count as meaningful human contact. The time with Tommy and Quackity is the only time it dosen’t count as solidary. So this is getting…very much concerinng. But this is still only the start.

Rule 45

1. Solitary confinement shall be used only in exceptional cases as a last

resort*, for as* short a time as possible and subject to independent

��review, and only pursuant to the authorization by a competent authority. It

shall not be imposed by virtue of a prisoner’s sentence.

2. The imposition of solitary confinement should be prohibited in the case

of prisoners with mental or physical disabilities when their conditions

would be exacerbated by such measures

Woops…so not only is it illegal as a punishment…but also the “he is a psychopath” argument (which is already a bad stereotype, but I won’t get into psychology here. It’s a common misconception and c!Tommy not knowing is almost to be expected. However please do not say that someone, character or real person, have a mental disorder or illness without proper knowledge about psychology and in the case of characters we shouldn’t put labels unless the writer has said that they have taken mental disorders or illnesses into account when making the character) just got yeeted out the window. Actually that argument just took a loop and now is an argument for the other side. It makes sense because as it says: it exacerbates their preexisting mental illnesses. Which is why it’s prohibited.

“In no case may a detainee’s contact with the outside world be

dependent on his or her cooperativeness, be used as a disciplinary

sanction or form part of the sentence.”

- Special Rapporteur on Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment, Civil and Political Rights, Including the Questions of Torture and Detention, ¶ 43, Comm’n on Human Rights,

“…The medical officer should visit prisoners held in solitary confinement

every day, on the understanding that such visits should be in the interests

of the prisoners ’ health. Furthermore, prisoners held in solitary

confinement for more than 12 hours should have access to fresh air for at

least 1 hour each day” - Subcomm. on Prevention of Torture [SPT]

Wow Sam…it is almost impressive in a dark way just how explicitly these are broken. The Warden’s very punishments for disobedience just straight up counts as torture. And for the obvious record I highly doubt Quackity’s daily visits to the green bloob counts as anything but ‘the interests of the prisoners’ health’. You can disagree here…but I am being very sarcastic.

Rule 22

1. Every prisoner shall be provided by the prison administration at the

usual hours with food of nutritional value adequate for health and

strength, of wholesome quality and well prepared and served.

Raw potatoes every day for the rest of your life..eehhh no thanks. If Dream ever gets out he will probably join me in the 'eating potatoes trauma’ box. As funny as that sounds, it isn’t a joke. I was force fed potatoes as a child and I hated it to the point where it gave me a mental block that stops me from eating them as my body just does not want to swallow it. It’s a problem. But I can joke about it. Maybe Tommy will join us too, although it wasn’t really the eating potatoes that caused that trauma…rip. Rest in anything but potatoes.

Rule 42

General living conditions addressed in these rules, including those related

to light, ventilation, temperature, sanitation, nutrition, drinking water,

access to open air and physical exercise, personal hygiene, health care

and adequate personal space, shall apply to all prisoners without

exception.

I think it’s pointless to say more on that topic as it’s pretty much already summed up. Let us now move over to what are probably some of the qoutes so specific that it’s scary.

“Furthermore, [the Committee] is concerned about the use of solitary

confinement for indefinite periods of time…. Full isolation of 22 to 23

hours a day in supermaximum security prisons is unacceptable

(art. 16).” - Committee. against Torture [CAT]

Oh wow.. talk about on the nose. I should’ve just started with this one as it pretty much says pretty clearly how it is unacceptable. Like yikes…can you get more specific? It is just downright ridiculous at this point. (-_-;)

“Solitary confinement, when used for the purpose of punishment,

cannot be justified for any reason, precisely because it imposes severe

mental pain and suffering beyond any reasonable retribution for

criminal behaviour and thus constitutes an act defined in article 1 or article

16 of the Convention against Torture, and a breach of article 7 of the

International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights.“

Ahaha…ha….yeah for those who justify it…the convention against torture is very much against it being justified…Imagine if the characters could read these rules, that’d be interesting. Although I am pretty sure they don’t follow realism for the imprisonment. As I have already said; this is just an interesting look at the irl rules and how Dream’s punishment and Pandora’s Vault stand under light of them.

“No prisoner, including those serving life sentence [sic] and prisoners on

death row, shall be held in solitary confinement merely because of the

gravity of the crime.”

- Special Rapporteur on Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment

Like…there are no loopholes here. It is so extremely clear that it truly is darkly impressive how the characters don’t seem to have a second thought about this. How do you accidentally sentence someone to a lifetime of torture without realizing? If they do know…It’d be very dark.

Btw Tommy’s exile and his time in prison doesn’t count as solidary confinement. Just to clear that up.

It amazes me how badly they break these rules…I know they probably didn’t take the realism into consideration. However it is still kind of darkly impressive. Especially considering how scary specific they break them too. Even though this is just a interesting (I was about to write fun, however I wouldn’t count realizing how inhuman the prison is is 'fun’. But it is interesting) look at Dream’s punishment and Pandora’s Vault under the light of real life rules for prisons. (lol my paranoid self have said this so much)

These facts also proves how saying it’s justified…is kind of morally bad. Not attacking anyone! I just want to also say how while it is pure fiction and the characters in the story can have whatever opinion they want as they are characters. However when it comes to fans approving and justifying it without taking time to consider how it really isn’t something that can be justified (real or no). You can have whatever opinion you want, however just maybe take some of what you have learned today and reflect over it? To think twice after having received new information dosen’t hurt. I am not here to tell you what to think, so rest easy. Only to share some facts^^ (*so obviously scared of offending anyone*)

I recommend taking some time to look it up yourself if you want to look further into it. The psychological aspects of it is also interesting to look at!

I hope you have learned something here today and found this post and my research interesting! I spent hours on this so I hope you have enjoyed this! I originally posted this on reddit and I was very surprised at how many stopped by to read it and therefore I choose to post it here as well because you learn something and hopefully also gained a new perspective.

Ninma over and out!

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