litnerdwrites

[litnerdwrites]

also also also also cassian: don't worry, you can talk to me about how the sound of fire bothers you and you were groomed by your mother and a thirty year old duke at the age of fourteen.

also also also also also cassian: everybody hates you, and my brother threatened to kill you, but come to this party where you can spend time in front of a fire with the guy who tried to kill you, and the people who have said worse things to you than you ever have to them.

also also also also also also cassian: you want to marry eris because he's a prince and i'm not

cassian: shes a wounded animal

also cassian: idk why your sisters love you but they DO

also also cassian: why won't u talk to me Nesta 🥺

mind you this all happens within 2 pages

[litnerdwrites]

Elain feels like the poster child for what incels think a woman should be like.

Feminine, delicite, infantilised (to some, quite frankly, concerning degrees), spends her days looking after the home, and only uses the money provided by the men in her life (Rhysand). She has little to no agency and happily steps up to put other women (Nesta) down because of the IC and their (misogynistic) views, specifically about women marked as difficult.

Oh, and she even joins in on the conversations about Nesta when she isn't around, like when she tells them about her being groomed and a Duke wanting to marry her, Elain (nor the IC) see nothing wrong with the 30 (ish) year old wanting to marry or 'reserve' a fourteen year old. As far as I can remember, the only person who saw an issue with that was Papa Archeron, since her sisters clearly don't care, and Mama Archeron's only reason was that he wasn't a prince. I don't like Papa Archeron, don't get me wrong. He failed his daughters in every way that mattered and his so-called sacrifice at the end of WAR is not good enough to redeem him. With that said, I can acknowledge that this might very well be the only (as far as I can tell) example of him actually being a half (or maybe quarter) way decent father. The bar is practically in Hell, I'm aware.

Back to Elain.

She literally exists to act in ways that are convenient to the IC, and has done nothing other than be their perfect pawn, displaying no agency of her own. She even went along with keeping the pregnancy from Feyre, and, as far as we can tell, had absolutely no issues with it.

Even when asking her so-called stans about her, the only answers many of them give is her relation to either Azriel & Lucien or her sisters, plus a couple of hobbies. Her own stans can't even find something interesting about her to talk about.

There's always been hints of internalised and externalised misogyny throughout SJM's writing, albeit wrapped up in a veneer of feminism, but Elain feels like one of the more blatant examples of it. Why would literally anyone be interested in a book about her if she's such a non character, the only things there to talk about are her more interesting sisters and her love interests.

I would bet money that people would read her book more for Azriel/Lucien (and maybe even for a hint of Feysand, since they can't stop licking his boots) than Elain. I'd also bet money that people would refuse to to read Elain's book because of Azriel/Lucien. At that point, would it even be Elain's book?

Why I hate Elain? It’s called transference.

Because I am not allowed to hate her on either side of the fandom. One side goes on and on about how she is a dainty girly girl who represents everything good and soft under the sun and must be protected at all costs while the other is coddling her like she’s a sacred lamb who’s been herded left and right ever since she was born.

Because she is an adult too who never changed or showed any signs of wanting to be better. And no one expects her to either, except for being bitchy to the one sister who always protected her or for hurting the man who literally did nothing to her, because Elain is fucking Elain and that is enough of an excuse and explanation.

Because as long as she fits the exaggerated misogynistic version of flower clutching, dress wearing, ever smiling romantic of a woman who is equal parts innocent and sexy, never does anything wrong, and shows smidgen of emotion with tears so as a faith of her good heart, who the fuck cares about anything else?

I hate Elain because I hate everything that character stands for. I don’t need to wait for a fucking book to decide if I like a character whose only personality is some flowers and her love interest. I don’t need to explain why I don’t like a fucking outline that doesn’t even offer plot relief in four whole books but has had direct negative impact on many characters.

I don’t have to like her just because she’s got trauma. It’s the only thing she’s got.

I don’t have to like her just because she is going to be a female lead.

I don’t have to like her just because you like her.

I will hate whoever the fuck I want to hate. And I hate Elain.

[litnerdwrites]

Wouldn't their daughter be a witch? I imagine she'd be on par with the first witch, no?

I mean, the first with is the daughter the goddess of the heavens and the sun, which we know is either the mother or the maiden. In chapter 30 of kotf, Vittoria asks Emilia if Celestia (the Crone) couldn't have helped them kill the first witch, to which Emilia replies '“Her niece,” I reminded my sister. “Celestia would not have killed family.”t.'

We can also be certain that the first witch's father isn't one of the Demon Princes, or probably a fallen angel at all, because Lucia married Pride. (Side note, I wonder if the dad is still alive/has contact with Sursea and Lucia?)

So if Wrath, who we can assume is far more powerful than Sursea's father, were to have a child with Emilia, one of the Crone's favorite daughters (alongside Vittoria), wouldn't her powers, theoretically, match Sursea's.

And as far as power goes, I think it would kind of fall into the vengeance category while still playing into the Wrath aspect, at least more than death, imo. Death isn't on anybody's side, nor is it good or bad. It just is. So, I think their child's power would lean towards Karma and a bit to justice too.

Wrath is the Angel of Justice, and justice can be a form of vengeance (not always, but sometimes). I wonder if we'll see more of the goddesses in Throne of Nightmares?

If Wrath and Emilia have children, I wonder if any of them will have powers over karma.

[litnerdwrites]

Haven't you heard? In this fandom, Nesta's actions are her own. But the IC's actions are either on Amarantha, Tamlin, Hybern or Nesta. Sometimes Eris. Oh, and Feyre's actions (that are just as bad as Nesta's by her own admission) are also on Nesta.

You see, the IC can abuse whoever they want, but anybody so much as glances at them in a sorta weird face, then they 'just don't get it', and if they even mildly criticise the IC, enforce personal boundaries, ask questions or offer ideas that don't align entirely with their ideology, in any capacity, they're abusive monsters who destroy everything they touch, live to spread misery and want to make the world a worse place 🙄

I'm not a subject matter expert, but where is Nesta verbally abusive?

Yes, she called Feyre stinky and a half-wild beast, but that's tame compared to how siblings talk to each other, especially those living in dysfunctional families. My brother and I have said far worse to each other than that, and we get along far better than Nesta and Feyre. If that's verbal abuse, then all siblings are abusers.

And yes, Nesta called Cassian a low-born bastard two times in the Wings and Embers bonus chapter, but Cassian has called himself a low-born bastard far more often than Nesta has. Cassian calls other people a bastard all the time, but it's not verbal abuse when he does it? Amren has called Cassian far worse things than Nesta has.

Cassian, Amren, and Grandmamma Archeron have said far worse things to Nesta than she's said to anyone else. They are the verbal abusers of the series, not Nesta. How do Cassian and Amren deserve love, kindness, and respect despite being abusers, but Nesta doesn't?

[litnerdwrites]

So, to add, as like a psa, Illyrians were their own race of people. They inhabited the northwest Balkan Peninsula, and were closer, geographically, to Italy than India.

The last and best known Illyrian kingdom had a capital called Shkodër, which is also a city in modern Albania. Powerful chieftains could unite several tribes into kingdoms. Though, after a war with the romans, they became a roman province called Illyricum. After that many of them were conscripted by the emperor to serve in the roman legions.

And they weren't just warriors. The Illyrians were seafarers, and master shipbuilders with a reputation for piracy. That piracy is part of the reason their conflict with Rome started. Imagine, if SJM had done proper research and just not been racist, what kind of story we could've had.

I feel like, if you want inspiration for fanon Illyrian culture (since the books are a disgrace to the culture, imo) then taking that inspo from actual Illyria might be a better bet. Respectfully, of course. Since it also feels pretty disrespectful to essentially steamroll actual Illyrian culture, in favour of another culture, and try to attach them both to the negative connotations SJM assigns them.

I think the real world Illyria is very fascinating, and if SJM did five minutes of research, she could've come up with a very interesting political structure and plot line that didn't come across as incredibly racist.

I think @extremely-judgemental is probably right in saying that the Op she referenced in her post isn't being malicious. This repost is to, in part call out SJM as racist, but also gush at how fascinating Illyrian culture and history in real life actually is. I have now found a new rabbit hole to dive into and I can't wait to do so more research on this. And I encourage others to as well. It's very interesting.

Hey not to be that person but could you not use my (Indian) culture as reference for Illyria, yk the race that is canonically barbaric, has nothing good to offer to the world and so deserves to be 'burnt to the ground'; where women are oppressed forever, abused and raped and treated as human incubators; where everyone except for three men are evil. A race ruled by a white woman from her lalaland while adorning herself with something sacred to them without second thought like it's her birthright. I understand you're having fun with fantasy and creativity but back the fuck off🙂

[litnerdwrites]

Get to know your mutuals tag game! Answer the questions, then tag six people.

Got tagged by both @extremely-judgemental and @a-court-of-moonlight-and-ire so I'll respond to both here. Thanks for the tag!

Favourite colour: Pink! Pale baby pink, specifically. But green isn't far behind (I loved Ninjago as a kid and had a childhood crush on Lloyd, and just never really grew out of it, since he's still the reason for green being one of my favorite colors).

Last song: I've been listening to The Challange from Epic the Musical almost nonstop, but I've also had Tir na nog by Celtic Woman on a loop too, and I honestly can't tell which I listened to last.

Currently reading: Potion of Deception by Ann Sorstone (Arc) and Whispers of the deep by Emma Hamm.

Currently watching: Hm, I've also been obsessively rewatching the Apothecary Diaries, since I love it so much. I'm also rewatching the Infinity saga as the thing I'm watching with my younger brother and sister (they didn't see marvel movies before). As for a new thing, I'm watching Once Upon a Witch's Death.

Currently craving: Red Velvet cake. The one from costco with that really good icing. IYKYK.

Tea or coffee: Coffee. Usually iced coffee.

Tags- @hrizantemy @kataraavatara @aphroditeofcnidus @steh-lar-uh-nuhs @delulu-4-u @afandomangel

[litnerdwrites]

He is having way too much fun with this entire situation, like Lust's having the time of his life here enjoying every second 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[litnerdwrites]

Wrath taking his daughter out to an age appropriate ball for her first time and she's nervous 🥺

Sorry it took so long, but writers block was kicking my ass. You can read this request here.

Note to anyone wanting to request, I take those on my other page, @thestoryarchives , made specifically for fics. Please read the request guidelines that indicate the fandoms I write for, as well as my boundaries, and leave them over there. Any requests made on this account before the other blog when live, will be answered in this manner.

[litnerdwrites]

You can't call Nesta's actions abuse, and in the same breath, argue that Feyre and the IC are just 'giving her a taste of her own medicine'. This is especially true in the cabin, where Nesta is condemned for her words and actions, having them labeled as abuse, but Feyre's words and actions towards Nesta that, by her own admission, are just as bad, are justified. If Nesta's actions were abusive, then so were Feyre's, since they were on the same level. Feyre hunting doesn't give her a free pass to treat Nesta that way. If anything, using her position as her family's sole provider as a blank check to treat them however she wants is form of financial abuse. This is even more clear later on, in ACOFAS and ACOSF. Nesta has no money of her own, and hasn't been given her inheritance. She's in an unfamiliar place that would be difficult to leave, and even if she could, there are few places she could go to be safe. She is entirely dependant on her sister and brother in law for money, so for them to use that money to coerce her into playing house when she doesn't want to. And let's not even touch on the fact that they pushed her towards Cassian, who she made it clear she didn't want to be around, and who was an absolute creep towards her.

[litnerdwrites]

100%.

The thing is, I think Nesta was far more prepared for the idea of leaving her sisters to live her own life than they were. She was raised for marriage, to a prince. She knew that, one day, she'd be married off, and have to leave Feyre and Elain to live with her husband. She'd see them like, what, once every few months, maybe? Elain might've had some idea of this, but I doubt that it was ever as real to her as it was to Nesta. And Feyre was so neglected by her mother, she either had no clue at all, or thought it would never happen.

Then, when they lose their wealth, the idea of selling her sisters off for marriage is part of her fantasy so she can have peace. In her dream of living in that cabin, painting with her father, she never mentions visiting her sisters. She doesn't seem to consider it. To her, marriage is a way get rid of them for good, during a time where she resents them. Meanwhile, Nesta's plan to marry Thomas is so Feyre doesn't have to worry about having another mouth to feed.

Now, however, Feyre no longer has to worry about money, so she can have the perfect family she dreamed of. That includes her sisters. What she's failing to properly understand, however, is that as much as Nesta and Elain are her family, she's their family too. And that means that Feyre can't just decide what family looks like, and have the world conform to it. She can't decide on her own, what Nesta and Elain's family should look like. Just because she found joy, doesn't mean her sisters are bound to find joy the same way, and she doesn't get that.

A part of me thinks that, perhaps, Feyre's pushing misplaced frustrations with her mother's neglect onto Nesta. She wants Nesta to love her, and live with her, and dote on her the way a mother should, without accepting or understanding that Nesta was hurt by their mother too, and, like her, her sisters both need to find their own path. That's how they'll become closer than ever, to the point where physical distance between them won't matter.

I feel like the extreme poverty at such a young age kind of stunted a lot of Feyre’s emotional growth (understandably so) and now that she’s an adult she’s trying desperately to recreate the childhood she never had and just not realizing that adult sibling relationships aren’t the same as when you’re children, and they shouldn’t be.

Adult siblings could live together for a variety of reasons (money, maybe one needs a place to stay, maybe a country where it’s hard for a woman to support herself) that are totally valid, but it’s very rare that adult siblings who have the financial means to live separately and no extenuating circumstances…don’t. My mom and her siblings are WAY closer than lots of others-they live in the same city and get together semi weekly along with their kids being close with each other. I could not IMAGINE my mother insisting my aunt come and spend the holidays with my dad’s side of the family or expecting them to have the same friends. Yes at the beginning of ACOSF Nesta was isolating herself as a form of self harm and her loved ones (people who ACTUALLY CARE ABOUT HER) should have discussed it, but there’s this pervasive attitude in ACOFAS and ACOSF that Nesta is the weird one for like…not wanting to live with Feyre and be best friends with all of Feyre’s best friends. Like…no, that’s very normal actually.

[litnerdwrites]

Realistically, if Resse's Puff died for good, and Feyre lived but wasn't chosen by the magic, who, outside of the IC, would acknowledge her as ruler of night? Maybe like 70% of Velaris, but we've talked before about how Velaris has no army of its own. The soldiers that fight for it are from the Hewn City and Illyria and show an obvious, and extreme prejudice against women. So why would they follow her, even if Cassian and Azriel ordered it?

If the High Lord chosen is High Fae, the Illyrians and Darkbringers would probably chose to follow them pretty easily, if they don't try to kill them. If they're Illyrian, then I doubt the Illyrians would have many issues at all, but the Hewn City may be harder to convince. Though, it would come down to who they'd rather serve, a woman, or and Illyrian. If the land choses a women to rule, the first true High Lady, then that might spark an actual civil war, where they pick between them, or even refuse to fight for either of them.

There's also the other High Lords. Would they back Feyre as High Lady? They play nice for the sake of politics, even with Beron, despite what their own opinions may be, but with Rhys gone, and the land having chosen someone else, would they back her? If the army doesn't stand behind Feyre, then probably not. Especially given that she learned to read less than a year prior, and doesn't even know how to properly govern. If anything, it would spur other courts, like Autumn, and nations on the continent, to attack, which Feyre is as also wholly unqualified for.

All this to say, if the land didn't chose her (and maybe even if it did), then it's unlikely that Feyre would have many allies willing to back her as High Lady if Rhys died. The only situation that I can think of in which they might, is if Nyx was born, and she'd serve as a regent until he was of age. And even then, there'd be a decent amount of opposition, probably using violence.

[litnerdwrites]

Not sure if this is a hot take or not, but there should've been a larger time skip between ACOTAR and ACOMAF.

It would've given Feyre more time to mature, to learn the Spring Court, and Prythian. During that time, the overt ways in which Spring is framed as not being meant for Feyre (the traditions, rules, lack of support, Ianthe, and relationship issues) could begin to deepen and fester. Become something more understated, that appears to be a functioning relationship on the outside, but through Feyre's POV, we'd see what a fragile foundation it's standing on.

I don't hate Tamlin, and honestly, I think what Feyre did was worse anyway, because she dragged innocent people into it, who didn't do anything to hurt anyone. But I think it would've been interesting to see their relationship become more mutually toxic, and show that they're bad for one another. After all, their relationship seemed very rushed. If you remember, Tamlin needed to make a human fall in love with him to break a curse. It wouldn't matter if he loves her, just that she loved him.

Given how desperate he probably got, it would make sense that Tamlin would do anything to make Feyre fall in love with him. In which case, being stricter about things like tradition and governing would be a reasonable change to see in him. It would also be more compelling to see these parts of him clash with Feyre's free spirit. I think it would be easier to see a clear contrast between the way Feyre lived in Spring, and the way she lives in Velaris.

That's why her fears in ACOMAF, about moving on too fast, and how it would look, then her getting over it the second she realised she and Rhys were mates, would feel less forced than having Feyre need to worry about Spring because she's spent time growing to love it, and becoming responsible for its people.

The plot where he allied with Hybern to save her could still be there, but maybe add in details and context, like hearing rumours about Feyre stealing from Summer, or running through the Middle to give him a sense of urgency, as well as providing more reasons to believe Feyre is being controlled. It would also give Ianthe more information to manipulate to begin convincing Tamlin that every fear and paranoia she planted in his mind were true.

I also think it could play into how naive Feyre is compared to these fae, reminding her of her human instincs when she thinks they're gone. Feyre's destruction of the Spring Court could've been done in a way where she didn't intend to allow civilians to get hurt, but either through naiveté, the machinations of others, and just plain carelessness, people did get hurt, and she helped it happen. Give her some consequences, let her learn just how smart and cunning and otherworldly those ancient fae are, after we spent ACOMTAR and ACOMAF slowly separating ourselves from the human lands, their beliefs while growing accustomed to Prythian and the fae. I want to There could be more subtle reminders of this humanity through Feyre's sisters too, that she may initially turn her nose up at. I want to see juxtapositions between humans and fae throughout the books, leading to a moment of realizatdion and fear, that has her feeling human again, but in the most vulnerable way.

I think that seeing Feyre slowly become the Feyre from ACOTAR, to something more similar to Feyre from about ACOWAR onwards would've been a lot less jarring if she had more time to transition. Feyre feared what she might become if things in Spring didn't change, if she was stuck there for too long, she might turn into something as spiteful and vicious as Amarantha, and I think that should've been played into more. It would've been much more interesting to see. Feyre having to struggle between her morals and what she needed to do, not just regarding her relationship with Tamlin, but adjusting to life in Night.

Perhaps have Feyre push to request the book of breathings in a more diplomatic, and honest way, but only steal it when that fails. Let her snap and snarl at members of the IC, or random citizens, for remaining untouched under Amarantha's reign, and let her have some crueler impulses from time to time, to show how she's changed, rather than justifying the cruelty she committed.

I think much more time should've passed between Feyre returning to Spring from UTM, and Feyre leaving for Night. One that allows for comparisons, contrast, context, and and a far more emotionally complex and layered story that feels like more of a natural progression, than what we got. One that ends with her embracing the roll of villain. One where more comparisons can be made between her and Amarantha. One where the NC aren't just hypocrites and assholes, but intriguing, morally complex characters, that are able to learn some kindness and humanity from Feyre. They can learn to ditch the mask, and be more honest about the good intentions behind their actions, and willingness to repent for it.

[litnerdwrites]

After a quick google search, I found a reddit thread that talks about it though. There are two consensuses that are reached on them.

The first is referencing a deep dive someone did, but I couldn't find the source. The deep dive concluded that 1 gold mark is equal to 20USD, by calculating the price of something Feyre buys and working backwards. So 500 Gold Marks

The second one is someone taking the weight of a single gold mark, historically (250g) and multiplied that by 500, which was 12,500g. Gold marks would've been made of 24K gold, so they used the price of gold per gram (which is 97.23 AUD), so 500 gold marks would be $1,203,825,045.53 AUD. In this calculation, one gold mark would be 24307.5 AUD.

However, four are three factors worth considering here.

The first, as OP of the second calculation mentions, Nesta was gambling too. She would've won some and lost some on that.

The second, is that, realistically, how much is that in comparison to the IC? I mean, seedy, slightly run down taverns are gonna be cheeper than restaurants and high end clubs like Rita's. By comparison, who's spending more? If the IC go to Rita's even just once a week, they're more likely to spend far more than 500 gold marks in a single night.

The third is that Nesta was malnourished when arriving at the HOW. By that point, she wouldn't have been able to eat any of what she bought because her body wouldn't be able to handle it. So, if not her, who was eating it? I find it concerning that no one in the IC realised or asked her about that, but also not surprising. They've never considered the 'why' behind Nesta's actions, just judge based on Feyre's happiness, and their convenience.

And finally, what is the worth of a dollar within ACOTAR? The amounts both seem astronomical, but depending on the Night Court' economy, it might not be considered so insane within the NC.

If we take one gold mark as being 20 USD, that would be 31.30AUD and 15.03 GBP.

If we take one gold mark as being 24307.5 AUD, that would be 15536.62 USD, and 11677.20 GBP.

In both cases, how much can one gold mark buy within ACOTAR, and more specifically, the Night Court, compared to the real world? Would a household of two people be able to live off of one or two gold marks a month? In 2025? Velaris is the most wealthy city within the Night Court, and, from what we know about it, we can assume that the cost of living there is higher than in other places, so how much would a gold mark be worth in Illyria, or the Hewn City? Would you be able to live off of a single gold mark in either of those places?

I don't think it's as simple as converting it to real world currency and basing your judgment on that alone. Factors like the cost of living, standard of life, economic state, etc. should all be compared to one another to come up with a more accurate comparison. Would a gold mark be considered minimum wage, or the equivalent of a century's worth of saving? How would that compare to places like THC, or Illyria?

I want to tag in my lovely mutuals, @hrizantemy and @kataraavatara . to ask for their thoughts. Both of them have such wonderfully nuanced takes on this series, so I'd love to hear their two cents on this.

Do we have a frame of reference for how much 1 gold mark is? That is - is Nesta spending 500 of them in one night the equivalent of spending $500 in one go, or more?

Anyway, I ask because I'm pretty sure that due to material cost and labor alone, each one of Feyre's single-use tissue dresses dripping in diamonds costs way more than that. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[litnerdwrites]

Yes! Exactly. I love everything you said there.

To add, one of the many ways this fandom, and even SJM herself, discredits the Archeron sisters, and their character potential is by dumbing them down, so to speak.

Feyre is the good one, who we're meant to root for, and should rarely, if ever criticise or question, and if she does do something wrong, it's because she's young.

Elain is the soft, gentle, innocent lamb, who sometimes snaps, mostly at Nesta, but that's fine because she's had enough of her.

Nesta is the mean, horrible bitch. She's an abuser and should be punished by everyone for everything she's ever done, even if others benefited from/asked her to do it.

By assigning these simplistic motives and qualities, they take away from the characters. And again, I think SJM is guilty of this as well.

For Feyre, when she's called out for not considering the political ramifications of her actions, such as destroying the Spring Court, or stealing from Tarquin, either Tarquin and Tamlin (more so Tamlin) are put down, arguing that the Rhys&Co. Know better, and that they were better equipped to handle the situation, and just overall demeaning them and their authority as sovereigns of their own court in order to justify the crimes the Night Court commit.

This argument turns Feyre from a cunning, apathetic, borderline heartless, calculating, young woman dealing with a lot of trauma, who's now found herself in the middle of several very complicated political situations (between Tamlin and Rhys, Hybern and Prythian, and humanity and the Fae) with unprecedented magic, who should be considered a threat to and by her enemies, to an infuriating idiot. A liability who shouldn't be trusted because she's too naive to utilise critical thinking skills and is more likely to derail everything you plan because she didn't look before she leaped. A child at the adult table, trying to understand their conversations, but not having the knowledge, experience or context to do so, if you will.

For Nesta, any good deed she does is overlooked, no matter how painful or difficult it is. No matter how hurt she gets, or what she endures, it's always downplayed and taken for granted. Nesta is relegated to being this abusive, cruel, heartless monster, who shouldn't expect or deserve care for her pain, acknowledgment of her attempts to atone, and praise for her good deeds, whether they work out or not (exhibit a, see aftermath of almost being raped and eaten by a kelpie).

This undermines any actual healing or redemption Nesta may actually go through, as well as any relationship she forms with her sisters. None of it matters because it all feels superficial and forced. Any trauma responses, or moments of weakness and pain that make her a relatable character, or add context and nuance to her thoughts and actions, goes away.

For Elain, she's trapped in the box of being the demure, hyper feminine, doe eyed, child. The way she's talked about and overlooked, when she isn't needed to manipulate Nesta insults her intelligence and autonomy as a fully grown woman. As a result, Elain is left as merely a pawn, and any praise she and Feyre receive for their good relationship or her place in their court is null and void, because she isn't an equal to her sister.

She isn't someone who found happiness with the IC, she didn't have a choice but to try and be happy with them, because even if she did want to go somewhere else, she wouldn't be taken seriously or allowed to do so. The moments of her arguing with Nesta, that people use to praise her and put down Nesta, it's not her venting some arguably valid frustrations, but being unable to word it/ struggling to both acknowledge her own failures and communicate her genuine feelings with her sister as her parroting the words others told her too to manipulate Nesta instead. She isn't a family member, she's a pawn, and a prisoner, but is too naive to realise it. She can never have a genuine conversation with Nesta, because she's being forced to help indoctrinate her.

The way some in this fandom chose to regard and utilise their characters feels very detrimental to them, and a bit like a waste of character potential. As OP pointed out, many indications and examples of a complicated relationship, or character traits that don't fit the aforementioned narratives assigned to each sister, are largely overlooked or outright ignored. There was so much potential that feels like it was thrown out of the window.

All three sisters have so much potential, and I especially love the lovely @hrizantemy 's interpretations of them in her fics, A Place of Silver Silence and What Happened to You. I love the way she makes use of these characters, and dives into different aspects of their characters in each one. I'd also recommend Burn the Path, Thalassa_05, A Court of Exiles by Notquiteright, The Unfordged Hearts series, by limeandorange (on AO3) and The Fire Before the Storm by Sarafey on AO3 for some fun takes on the sisters. These are fics I love because of the way they try to dissect and portray the Archeron sisters as well as the IC.

I believe my mutuals @kataraavatara and @litnerdwrites made a post talking about Elain, and I want to add on.

I don’t like Elain. And I say that with an understanding that she reminds me a lot of myself when I was younger—the way she makes herself small, slips into softness, plays the role of the quiet, gentle one. But that’s not why I dislike her. I think she’s survived by making herself a victim, and that survival strategy gets dressed up as innocence far too often in this fandom.

People always say “Nesta is overprotective,” or “Nesta won’t let Elain make her own choices.” But Elain is a grown woman. She has been for a while. And I’d like to call back this scene in A Court of Silver Flames:

“Like calls to like,” Amren countered. “You were Made by the Cauldron. You may track other objects Made by it as well, as Briallyn can. And because you are Made by it, you are immune to the influence and power of the Trove. You might use them, yes, but they cannot be used upon you.”

A glance to Elain. “Either of you.”

Nesta swallowed. “I can’t.” But to let Elain involve herself, jeopardize her safety—

Amren said, “You tracked the Cauldron—”

“It nearly killed me. It trapped me like a bird in a cage.”

Elain said, “Then I will find it. I might require some time to … reacquaint myself with my powers, but I could start today.”

“Absolutely not,” Nesta spat, fingers curling at her sides. “Absolutely not.”

“Why?” Elain demanded. “Shall I tend to my little garden forever?”

When Nesta flinched, Elain said, “You can’t have it both ways. You cannot resent my decision to lead a small, quiet life while also refusing to let me do anything greater.”

“Then go off on adventures,” Nesta said. “Go drink and fuck strangers. But stay away from the Cauldron.”

Feyre said, “It is Elain’s choice, Nesta.”

Nesta whirled on her, ignoring the warning flicker of primal wrath in Rhys’s stare. “Keep out of this,” she hissed at her youngest sister. “I have no doubt you put these thoughts in her head, probably encouraging her to throw herself into harm’s way—”

Elain cut in sharply, “I am not a child to be fought over.”

Nesta’s pulse pounded throughout her body. “Do you not remember the war? What we encountered? Do you not remember the Cauldron kidnapping you, bringing you into the heart of Hybern’s camp?”

“I do,” Elain said coldly. “And I remember Feyre rescuing me.”

Roaring erupted in Nesta’s head. For a heartbeat, it appeared that Elain might say something to soften the words. But Nesta cut her off, seething at the pity about to be thrown her way.

“Look who decided to grow claws after all,” she crooned. “Maybe you’ll become interesting at last, Elain.”

Nesta saw the blow land, like a physical impact, in Elain’s face, her posture. No one spoke, though shadows gathered in the corners of the room, like snakes preparing to strike. Elain’s eyes brightened with pain.

Something imploded in Nesta’s chest at that expression. She opened her mouth, as if it could somehow be undone. But Elain said, “I went into the Cauldron, too, you know. And it captured me. And yet somehow all you think of is what my trauma did to you.”

Do I think Nesta is being overprotective in this scene? Absolutely. But she’s not telling Elain she has to stay pliable, docile, or under her wing. In fact, she’s telling her do whatever you want—have a life, make choices, be wild if you want—but don’t put yourself danger.

That line—“you only think of what my trauma did to you”—hits hard in the moment, but it’s not entirely fair. I don’t think Nesta is sitting around thinking about how Elain’s trauma affected her. No—Nesta is thinking about what she did that might have caused Elain’s trauma in the first place. Like when she agreed to scry for the Cauldron during the war, which directly led to Elain being kidnapped by Hybern. That guilt haunts her. It’s not selfishness—it’s responsibility, it’s shame, it’s regret. And that’s a huge difference from what Elain is accusing her of.

Is it healthy? No, absolutely not. But think about it like this—throughout her entire life, Nesta has consistently been shielding Elain from things. From their cruel, abusive grandmother. From the brutal reality of the cabin and the poverty they endured. From the harshness of the world, from faeries, from war. Nesta’s role has always been protector, even when she didn’t know how to do it in a way that was kind or constructive.

So when she tries to stop Elain from engaging with the Cauldron or the Trove, it’s not about control—it’s about falling back into that same instinct: protect Elain at all costs. It’s not healthy, no. But it’s deeply human, and it’s rooted in a lifetime of seeing herself as the only barrier between Elain and the ugliness of the world.

And Elain isn’t innocent in this dynamic—because she let Nesta take on that role. Time and time again, she allowed Nesta to be the shield, the angry one, the wall between her and the worst of the world. She leaned into that softness because she knew someone else would do the hard, ugly protecting for her.

That doesn’t make Elain evil, but it does mean she benefited.

In A Court of Frost and Starlight, we get this moment:

“Nesta is still a part of this family.”

“Is she?” Elain sawed deep into the next loaf. “She certainly doesn’t act like it.”

Elain doesn’t say that with concern. She doesn’t ask why Nesta’s withdrawn or what pain she might be in. She doesn’t express fear for her sister. She frames Nesta’s pain as rejection of them, and then immediately distances herself in return. That’s not support. That’s emotional retaliation.

And then in A Court of Silver Flames, we get this:

“She’s not getting any better. She’s not even trying.”

She wrapped her arms around herself and stared toward the distant sea.

Again, Elain doesn’t ask how she can help. She doesn’t express sorrow, or frustration rooted in love. She just makes a judgment. She assumes Nesta isn’t trying, when in reality Nesta is drowning. That’s not care—it’s condemnation, veiled in softness.

In both of these moments, Elain puts her own pain first. It’s “I feel hurt because she’s distant” rather than “she’s hurting, and that distance might be a symptom.” It’s “she’s not trying” instead of “she might not know how to try right now.”

And this is why Elain’s line in ACOSF—“you only think of what my trauma did to you”—rings hollow. Because Elain consistently thinks of what Nesta’s trauma is doing to her, and not what Nesta is actually going through.

So instead of “you only think of what my trauma did to you,” a more accurate statement would be:

“You carry guilt for the ways you think you failed me.”

Because that’s what it is. Nesta isn’t consumed by what Elain’s trauma did to her—she’s consumed by what she did, or didn’t do, that might’ve caused it. It’s guilt, not selfishness. And that distinction changes everything about how you read that scene.

And Feyre’s little line—“It is Elain’s choice, Nesta”—honestly doesn’t mean anything in the grand scheme of that scene. Because at the end of the day, Nesta still ends up doing it. Nesta is the one who gets pushed into tracking the Trove, not Elain. So Feyre’s attempt at standing up for Elain’s autonomy is performative at best.

If Feyre truly believed in respecting choices and protecting the people involved, she could’ve said something like, “You might not like this, Nesta, but Elain is going to do it—because you’re still recovering. You’re in a vulnerable place, and we’re not going to put you in danger.”

But that doesn’t happen. Because despite Feyre’s talk about choice, it’s Nesta who’s still expected to sacrifice, to endure, to suffer—even while in what is essentially rehab and battling untreated PTSD from war, death, and trauma.

And this line right here—“Elain doesn’t go near him,” Feyre said. “And you won’t let me near him?”—only cements my point.

Yes, on the surface it’s about who’s going to dance with Eris, but it reveals something deeper: Feyre will not put Elain in danger. She refuses to let Elain step into even a politically uncomfortable situation, let alone one involving risk.

That moment with Eris shows exactly what Feyre is willing to shield Elain from. It makes her earlier line—“It is Elain’s choice”—feel hollow. Because Feyre is quick to step in and say, not her.

Whether she agreed or not, Nesta was always going to be the one to look for the Trove.

[litnerdwrites]

At the bear minimum, Nesta isn’t a hypocrite about it. Besides, not even FEYRE put her personal feelings aside to look out for you. Or Nesta. She just left you with Reese’s Cup and bailed. And when she got back, her first thought was cuddling up to him, not checking on her incredibly traumatised sisters. Meanwhile Nesta put her own trauma and response to it ON HOLD for you. And even back in ACOWAR, I feel like she was ungrateful and dismissive towards Nesta and what she did for Elain.

And again, second hand trauma is a thing. It’s likely what Elain went through was traumatising to Nesta too.

elain going “you only thought about how my trauma affected YOU >:(” to nesta and feyre takes me the fuck out because A) girl you did not give a flying fuck about nesta’s AT ALL, B) your trauma did in fact affect nesta because she was your 24/7 caretaker and C) circling back to point A you were pretty snippity about how Nesta’s trauma affected YOU when she didn’t want to come over to family dinner and bake bread or whatever. like what are we even talking about here.

[litnerdwrites]

I get what you're saying, but I think that a title could save Nesta, just not as she is right now.

As you said, her issue is mental. She thinks she deserves the treatment she gets, and that she doesn't deserve kindness or a life of her own. On top of that, her life is essentially micromanaged by the IC, who have their expectations for her, and she doesn't think she could or should exist outside of those expectations. Because of that, Nesta isn't really in a position to decide if she wants to go on a hero's journey, reluctantly or otherwise. If she were to embark on that journey, in her current state, it wouldn't truly be of her of volition. It would be because the IC made her do it, and anything she gains, be it artefacts or power, would be managed by the IC and not Nesta.

If she were to gain the HL title, at this point, as you said, the best case scenario, she'd rule the land as Rhys' puppet through Cassian. Another option would be making Cassian the face of Dusk, and announced High Lord instead. That's all if Rhys doesn't just claim the land for the Night Court outright, and rule as he sees fit (especially if his High King fantasy comes true, he'd run it all anyway, for better or worse. Mostly worse.)

However, if Nesta were to develop as a character, work on her mental health and decide she may want to leave, the High Lady title would help her do that. It would give her a reason to leave the IC's supervision, and Cassian (assuming he hasn't undergone any development or introspection of his own) is so obsessed with Rhys, he may not want to go with her, unless he ordered her to. Even if he did go with her, leaving even just Velaris would be great for Nesta. It would give her the chance to reevaluate herself and her life, without interference.

Cassian, Feyre and probably Elain are the only three who want to genuinely help Nesta, but it's the others who take advantage of that desire, in order to manipulate Nesta. Cassian and her sisters think going along with Rhys and Amren's plans for her is the best way to help her, refusing to see those plans for what they are. Whereas Mor know exactly what they are, but she cares more about Nesta changing to make Feyre happy, and using her powers for their own gain (and maybe even punishing Nesta) than Nesta genuinely getting better. So even with Cassian probably being a spy for Rhys, being away from the Night Court, and seeing Nesta grow and heal on her own, truly heal, may be jus as good for him? At the very least, it could lead him to realise what his court's true intentions for Nesta are, and could lead him to developing some more critical thinking skills and growing as a person. It's not guaranteed, by any means. After all, you could hand a person every tool and secret they need to grow, and be better, but there's no guarantee they'd take it, which, in and of itself, would be an interesting character arc, and internal struggle to watch someone go through.

As for Nesta, I get what you mean about needing to scare the IC off with her powers, but would that be enough? If she were to threaten them, or their city with her powers, it wouldn't be something they let slide. At best, they place a bounty on her, and allow her to be hunted until she gives in. At worst, they just lock her in the prison. Even with her powers, if they start making deals with more monsters, label her as a threat, or otherwise put a target on her back, she'd have to stay in hiding, and there's no guarantee she'd be able to hide forever. That's not even considering people who'd want her to work for/remain in their country/court. Nesta would need some degree of political protection from, not just the IC, but the world. Because if Nesta is locked in the prison, or forced to another kingdom to be used as their weapon instead, then how does that put her in a better position than where she is now? She'd just be broken down again, only called upon to be used the way the carver was, or even in the same way the weaver was.

In which case, a title of her own would protect her that. Especially if she's smart enough to bide her time, and build dusk's strength.

In the mortal lands, Nesta calculated the number of ships needed for evacuation of humans before the war. Medieval queens rarely has duties that involve true governance. Aside from birthing heirs, they run the royal household. The manage finances, plan events, etc. While a certain degree of political knowledge was required, it was mostly for conducting themselves with other nobles, not running a country. But these skills are ones Nesta has.

She outsmarted Eris in silver flames.

She calculated the number of ships and costs of evacuating her people.

And of all three Archeron sisters, she has the most potential. Nesta's proactive and practical in a way her sisters aren't. She's the most likely to go out of her way to learn.

So, would a title help her?

Yes.

But should that title be High Queen/ Lady of any Dusk?

Not necessarily.

If she were to take and keep that title, she'd need to build Dusk from the ground up. She'd have to build a thriving country, with it's own military defence. Her powers alone aren't enough to protect her. Not for long anyway. And with the IC constantly interfering, it won't be easy. It would take centuries, and that would be time Nesta would spend with a pointless title that doesn't protect her when she's at her most vulnerable.

This is why I prefer fics and theories where Nesta becomes the lady of another court instead.

the IC are positioned as a band of heroes who love to solve the problem on their own (as seen in MAF) but went out of their way, lowered themselves for the sake of Prythian, and played along with the other courts.

Exactly.

Within an established court, with it's own foreign affairs policies, culture, reputation, military, and alliances, they would have no choice but to step back. They wouldn't be able to imprison, or hunt, or lock up Nesta because she'd have a court backing her, with established connections that they could use to protect her.

With that said, Nesta settling in another Court would bring up questions about the immigration laws of Prythian. If we assume Nesta and Elain were given legal paperwork when they came to Night, they'd probably need it to leave. But they could also request sanctuary, or refugee status, and depending on the laws, or the High Lord they approach, they may be able to do so without documents.

However, if they don't have documents, they could have them made in the court they wish to settle in, requesting permanent citizenship in the process. With her powers, Nesta would be protected in pretty much any court she settled in, assuming she maintained regular citizenship.

Would any of these courts be much different than the NC, in that the ways they might try to use her and her powers? Maybe. Maybe not. I think it would depend on which HL she approached. Which leads me back the title.

Once again, a title would protect her. Regardless of if she becomes the Lady of a Court, or a regular noble/ aid. Nesta has the skills to be the Lady of a Court, and the heart to want to help it become better. A title would give her the chance to cultivate her own political faction, and create her own connections.

Political power is something Nesta needs to protect herself. But that doesn't mean that she needs to be the ruler or leader of Dusk, or any other court. I don't think Nesta is a leader, but I do think she the heart. The one who inspires others, and nurtures those who stand at her side. She brought the Valkyries together. She inspired the priestesses. She moved the High Lords, convincing them to work together. I think Nesta's an interesting play on the trope (heart of the team), because she isn't what you'd typically expect, but she has the same affect on others.

I think a really interesting twist for her story to make is somebody else becoming the ruler of Dusk, if it absolutely must return at all. Perhaps one of the Pristesses, like Clotho, or Merrill (there was tragically little done with these characters) or maybe someone from the Hewn City. They'd have a reason to need the power of Dusk; to free their people. To see the sun. Emerie, or any other Illyrian, could become the ruler of Dusk too, for the same reasons. To create a better life for Illyrians, where they aren't little more than fodder. Or maybe it should be someone with no to Prythain after all. Meanwhile, Nesta and her Valkyries playing various roles in the court, as aids, researchers, generals, strategists, librarians, ministers, etc.

So yes. I do think a title could help Nesta. If she finds the courage to leave, to heal somewhere else, a title may be the only thing standing between her and being dragged back forcefully, with or without her powers. I don't think she fits into the reluctant hero role though. She's the heart. She's the one that inspires the hero to embark on the journey (like she did with her Valkyries) and goes along with them to help. She's the one will stand up for and protect those she loves, making sure that they have the space and ability to achieve their goals.

The reluctant hero trope is truly exhausting. Not in fiction but in the fandoms. Granted this trope has been used as a badge of honour and virtue in characters all the time, readers are forgetting that not every character needs to end with a position of power to take charge of their life. Especially when nothing, I mean NOTHING, in the character suggests they want it at any level or deserve it.

Yes, the point of the trope is for the hero to not want power, but do they even need to get to the top of the food chain? Does getting a title mean anything at least in the narrative? Katniss Everdeen is an icon in this trope. She was the face of a rebellion in her world. She didn’t want it but she needed to be and in the end, it did have an impact in her world. Bilbo Baggins definitely did not want to leave his comfortable life to start on an adventure but his journey changed his world. And ykw, they both end with no titles and are still a hero.

I am sick of seeing the High Lady of Dusk propaganda in this fandom. Nesta has no interest in politics though she is trained from a young age. She has shown no interest in the fae world either. So what, since she doesn’t want to be a queen, she deserves to be one?

Why does she need to be a queen anyway? Give me one good reason how it will affect her growth or the narrative if she gets a title? She will get to flaunt to Feyre and Rhysand? You realise SJM is writing the books and Nesta will never leave the sister she ‘owes’ her life to? A title isn’t going to fix the trainwreck that her life is, instead it will be used to manipulate her more. Now she not only owes Feyre but also everyone else because it is her responsibility, which is exactly what they did during the war.

Also, if Nesta shouldn't be with someone like Eris because it's what her dead mother would have wanted, then she wanted this for Nesta too? Wouldn't this be traumatic and triggering for her?

Besides, Nesta already falls under this trope as is. She doesn’t need a fucking title to become any more of a hero than she already is. Don’t wish to turn a character into something they are not and that will stunt their growth (unless that's what you're going for) just because you can’t think of any other possibilities. This whole propaganda proves that writers like SJM have completely brainwashed the readers into believing that empowerment only comes from a fancy title whether it means a thing or not.

[litnerdwrites]

Girl, your taste in anime is immaculate. I'd like to add a few, if you don't mind.

If you want a good laugh and maybe a bit of chaos:

The Disastrous life of Saiki K - A psychic teen wants to live an easy life, but his powers, mixed with the eccentric people in his life keep inadvertently causing varying degrees of chaos. (Might also fall into the weir brilliance category).

Sleepy princess in the demon castle - The Demon king kidnaps the princess of a magical kingdom and locks her in the dungeon. All she wants is to take a nap, and will do whatever it takes to make that happen, even if it means resorting to committing what might arguably be considered warcrimes to do it.

Kiss Him not Me - Otaku girl who loves BL suddenly becomes the object of her several classmates affections when she loses weight overnight (I normally hate the 'she's pretty now that she's lost weight' trope, but in this case, they do learn later on that they care for her because of more than her appearances), but instead of wanting to date them, she wants to ship them instead. But, although many of them started as rivals for fmc's affections, over time, they all come to value each other as friends.

Himouto umaru chan - Part time smart/popular girl, manages her time spent driving her brother mad, mentioning her high school princess status, and hiding any part of her alter ego of gamer girl/ slacker from the world.

Noragami - Human girl makes a deal with a stray god to fix her body so her soul stops slipping

Suspense/Mystery/ Maybe something scary and bit of spookiness:

The Apothecary diaries - Apothecary was kidnapped and sold into the rear palace, where the emperor's concubines reside. After using her skills to save the baby princess's life, she divides her time serving a high ranking concubine, and solving various mysteries and conspiracies within the court.

In/Spectere - A young girl names Kotoko Inwanaga agrees to become a goddess of wisdom for the spirits and other paranormal creatures of Japan. She now spends time mediating for them, solving disputes and maintaining the balance between the human and spiritual world.

Toiler Bound Hanako-Kun - A young girl named Nene Yashiro asks for help from an apparition, Hanako the ghost, to get the guy she's crushing on to notice her. When things go wrong, she finds herself working as Hanako's assistant.

School Live - Four girls live at school, unable to leave.

Bungo Stray Dogs - In a world where certain humans have supernatural abilities, an orphan boy names Atsushi joins an organisation called the armed detective agency for a sense of belonging and to escape those pursuing him.

Durarara - Mikado moves to the city for high school, after being convinced by a childhood friend. On the very first day, he sees the headless black rider, and the superhuman Shizuo Heiwajima, and takes it as a sign that he'll get all the excitement that he wanted. But he, along with both ordinary citizens and the most eccentric residents, are mixed up in the commotion of supernatural events that begin occurring throughout the city. Once again, probably could fall into weird brilliance category. Warning, it does get kind of dark at times.

The Ancient Magus Bride - Orphan Chise has the ability to see supernatural creatures, making her very special. In lieu of taking her own life, she's sold to a mage who ends up making her his apprentice instead, where she learns about the magical world, and finds friends and family in her new community.

Dr. Stone - In a world where humanity becomes stone, teen scientist, Senku, wakes up about 4000 years in the future, in the new stone age, with the goal to bring humanity and science back to the world.

Romance (some soft, others that bring out the feels):

Bloom into you - High school girls struggle with their developing relationship, while exploring and trying to figure out their own identity and sexuality.

True Beauty - High school girl learns make up to keep from being bullied, which works, until a popular new transfer student ends up accidentally seeing her without it. While trying to keep her secret, she starts to wonder if true beauty is really so skin deep.

The betrayal knows my name - Orphan named Yuki gets dragged into supernatural events, and meets a demon named Luka who's bound to serve and protect him, and learns that he's secretly part of a clan of magical warriors who're bound to protect him, and by proxy, the world.

Love Stage - The world expects Izumi to go into show biz, like the rest of his family, however, he has his heart set on becoming a manga artist. A wedding magazine he was in as a child wants to do an anniversary edition, using the original models from the shoot he was in as a child. This leads Izumi to reuine with Ryouma, who's seems to have been in love with him since the original shoot, not knowing that he was also a boy. Comedy, chaos and gay awakenings ensue.

The Saint's magic power is omnipotent - Two girls, Sei and Aira, are brought to another world by a magic spell, for the purpose of becoming their saint. Its unclear which one is the saint, but the prince, being an absolute tool, preferred Aira to sei (cause she looked nicer, I guess) and ignored Sei completely. Sei takes the situation better than most people would and builds a life for herself, as part of the institution that studies potions and medicinal herbs. A cute, golden haired knight commander seems awfully taken by her too.

These are some of my favourites, nixing the ones you already mentioned yourself.

Any anime recommendations you give me? I need a whole list of new shows too watch Good ones too

Ohhh okay I’ve just been getting back into the anime fandom lately, but yes—absolutely, I’ve got some recs for you!

For Pain, Emotion, and Top-Tier Storytelling:

• Attack on Titan – dark, political, emotional, brutal.

• Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood – near-perfect story, heart-wrenching, philosophical.

• Mob Psycho 100 – incredible character writing, heart, humor, and insane animation.

• Banana Fish – prepare to cry. Seriously. A gut punch, but so worth it.

• Made in Abyss – deceptively beautiful world with deep horror and emotion.

If You Want Beautiful Animation and Aesthetic Feels:

• Violet Evergarden – every episode is a poem; bring tissues.

• Your Name / Weathering With You – both are movies, visually stunning and emotional.

• Demon Slayer – flashy, heartfelt, and the animation is unreal.

For Fun, Humor, also Angst:

• Jujutsu Kaisen – cursed energy, dark themes, hot characters, everything.

• My Hero Academia – the drama, the friendships, the angst—it’s addicting.

• Spy x Family – hilarious, wholesome, lowkey angsty, and Anya is a star.

Romance and Softness (or absolute mess):

• Horimiya – cute high school love with a twist.

• Fruits Basket (2019) – family trauma, soulmates, curses—it delivers.

• Toradora! – chaotic, emotional, and classic.

• Yuri!!! on Ice – love, ice skating, and soft boys with trauma.

Just Straight-Up Weird Brilliance:

• Paranoia Agent – psychological and bizarre, perfect for late-night brain rot.

• Erased – mystery, childhood, time travel—so well done.

• Death Parade – life, death, judgment, and existential crisis in neon lights.