scribz-ag24

[scribz-ag24]

genuinely think youre onto sth. for some fans of the game who havent played it in a while, didnt care to do a deep dive on character dynamics a lot or simply are unused to fandom culture, they probably just remember grovyle being Cool Male Hero™ to celebi's 2000s Female Character™, so it is harder to fathom any pairing beyond that, much less one where grovyle isnt automatically granted a dominant status on account of being a man.

plus i suspect that if some people projected onto grovyle as children while they were playing, they could feel emasculated at seeing their chosen character in a gay ship, thus they react against it or claim it makes no sense. That wouldnt explain why duskvyle has been so unpopular for years but it could explain why some people seem almost repulsed at the idea of pairing them together

dusknoir and grovyle man......

when i played rhe game i thought it was obvious how linked together they are bur after seeing a terrible ship tier reddit post and some of its comments i wonder if itd be nice to make a post about how se5 is pretty much duskvyle material for 45 minutes straight, on top of the. maybe. 20 minutes of interactions in the main story???

[scribz-ag24]

dusknoir and grovyle man......

when i played rhe game i thought it was obvious how linked together they are bur after seeing a terrible ship tier reddit post and some of its comments i wonder if itd be nice to make a post about how se5 is pretty much duskvyle material for 45 minutes straight, on top of the. maybe. 20 minutes of interactions in the main story???

[scribz-ag24]

Stare contest (?).

[scribz-ag24]

we need more dusclops/grovyle stuff in the world. anyways, obsessed with dusclops in special episode 0. go king, give us nothing

[scribz-ag24]

the guys :)

[scribz-ag24]

get me away from my computer please

[scribz-ag24]

dusknoir's selfishness appreciation post

One aspect of Dusknoir's character I find deeply captivating is how his selfish motivation to live on remains unique and differentiated from the rest of the cast. In a story where most of the characters are willing to sacrifice themselves for a greater good, it's fascinating to see how Dusknoir at no point ever seeks that greater good, and yet the writers succeed in giving him an emotional and satisfying character arc. All without ever getting rid of what made Dusknoir work as an antagonist in the first place, something that stands out even more when comparing him to his peers in SE5. So lemme ramble about it for a bit

Dusknoir is motivated by his fear of disappearing and, in spite of sparing a thought to how welcoming the world was before the paralysis ("The quality of life here must be cheery and charming. / Why, it’s so welcoming, I might like to settle here myself… Hoo-hoo-ha!"), at no point is he ever shown regretful or hesitant to cruelly eliminate those who attempt to change history. His determination at times seems firmer than Grovyle's, since Grovyle is seen apologizing for his actions or forcing himself to focus on his mission to save the planet above all else (Crystal Lake and encounter with Spiritomb during his escape from the Sableye, respectively). Dusknoir's objective is much smaller in scope and he shows no sign of being able to have his mind swayed.

He is self-centred and terrified, as expected of Pokémon in the dark future. In Explorers's tale, where major plot beats revolve around accepting sacrifice and overcoming your fears, it's no wonder Dusknoir works perfectly as the major opposing force throughout the game. Where Hero and Grovyle (and Celebi although the narrative ignores her for the most part) love the world too much to let it die, Dusknoir can't think of anything except perpetuating his own survival at all costs, disregarding the fact that he has no actual reason to live. The only thing we see him do is serve Primal Dialga, and even that job seems limited to "get rid of those who try to change history". There are no prospects of anything better coming his way.

Morover, Dusknoir's lack of care for the world remains consistent throughout SE5. As Grovyle's main opposing force, it's only natural all the arguments about the "morally right thing to do" are white noise to him. When Grovyle finishes explaining the heroic grand objective of his mission, that saving the planet will grant everyone in the past a new future, Dusknoir blatantly ignores his entire argument. He shows no regard for any life but his own, something that might also be inferred from the careless way he treats the Sableye and Spiritomb.

To continue the trend of Grovyle and Dusknoir being foils of each other, SE5 show us example after example of Grovyle looking for strenght in others, lending a thought to Hero and Partner, reminding himself again and again why he fights so hard. Through it all, he never loses sight of the global consequences of his actions, "for the future!" "make an impact in Partner's future" "the fate of the Pokémon in the future".

In fact, Hero and Partner rarely leave his thoughts. Grovyle is deeply tied to others thanks to his internal thoughts, whereas Dusknoir's thoughts, all throughout the Frozen Island, never stray far from his worst enemy. Even the two ocassions when he brings up Hero or Partner are meant to torment Grovyle, he's very isolated otherwise. It only reinforces how narrow his scope is, compared to Grovyle's ambition of changing the entire world for no benefit to himself.

Up until the middle of SE5 Grovyle seems like a deeply selfless character, and that remains true until the end. However, in a moment of brilliance, the writers introduce to us Grovyle's objective of making his life shine, of leaving a footprint in the world so he will be remembered by others, a selfish motivation. One that is as valid, captivating and powerful as the selfless "give everyone a new life is", and a selfish one nevertheless. And that is exactly what Dusknoir needed to hear. In a parallel to the first conversation of the episode, Dusknoir is once again hurt and vulnerable and listening to Grovyle's justification for his mission. Only this time he pays close attention to what Grovyle says; and this time, to his later dismay, he understands him.

Dusknoir's character arc is partly as strong as it is because the writers are not erasing any of his flaws or established personality, they are precisely using that wish to not disappear and that focus on his own life to drive Dusknoir into a noble objective. Therefore, when Dusknoir switches sides, it is believable. There is enough evidence to see why he was swayed by the idea of his spirit lingering in the world, where millions of lives never made a dent in his determined pursuit of hopeless self-preservation.

As if that wasn't enough, the writers make a point of driving this selfish motivation even further home by contrasting it with literally every other friendly character we can talk to. We only need to take a look at Celebi and the Sableye's lines of dialogue to see that, if the writers had intended for Dusknoir to care for the future itself, they would have had no issue making him say it explicitly. All these characters can spare a line to the greater good of the planet.

And yet, Dusknoir's distinct objective remains clear until the very end, no mentions of the future or any global scale, he wants to make his life shine and live to the fullest in the time he has left. It's an aspect i see overlooked quite a lot in general media, using selfishness to contribute to the big heroic mission. Since Pokémon games tend to have a clearer, more simplified message, where being selfish should be bad and being selfless would be unambiguously good, I am rather fond of this example of a villainous antagonist turning the same qualities that made him an insurmountable threat into the strenght of a crucial member of the team that helped to save the world.

I firmly believe this is a pretty important piece of Dusknoir's characterization. Obviously, he is indirectly "caring" about the world by saving it, yet that is never his main goal by any stretch. Keeping his self-centred personality is an extremely compelling way to develop his character for the better without introducing any external influence, relying on "i'll do the right thing" or the cliché "do it for X person" that would water down his place in the narrative and contradict his established characterization. Once he recognizes the truth in Grovyle's words, he is able to put his fear aside and finally live, for whatever time he has left, as himself and for himself.

[As a funny detail, i find quite charming how celebi is shown to fight for nothing but to save the future; dusknoir, on the contrary, is wholly focused on leaving an impact on the world; and grovyle somehow holds both motivations without neither overshadowing the other. If this isn't proof that they're meant to be a trio, i don't know what it is lol]

[scribz-ag24]

The ol’ jitterbug

[scribz-ag24]

dusknoir's selfishness appreciation post

One aspect of Dusknoir's character I find deeply captivating is how his selfish motivation to live on remains unique and differentiated from the rest of the cast. In a story where most of the characters are willing to sacrifice themselves for a greater good, it's fascinating to see how Dusknoir at no point ever seeks that greater good, and yet the writers succeed in giving him an emotional and satisfying character arc. All without ever getting rid of what made Dusknoir work as an antagonist in the first place, something that stands out even more when comparing him to his peers in SE5. So lemme ramble about it for a bit

Dusknoir is motivated by his fear of disappearing and, in spite of sparing a thought to how welcoming the world was before the paralysis ("The quality of life here must be cheery and charming. / Why, it’s so welcoming, I might like to settle here myself… Hoo-hoo-ha!"), at no point is he ever shown regretful or hesitant to cruelly eliminate those who attempt to change history. His determination at times seems firmer than Grovyle's, since Grovyle is seen apologizing for his actions or forcing himself to focus on his mission to save the planet above all else (Crystal Lake and encounter with Spiritomb during his escape from the Sableye, respectively). Dusknoir's objective is much smaller in scope and he shows no sign of being able to have his mind swayed.

He is self-centred and terrified, as expected of Pokémon in the dark future. In Explorers's tale, where major plot beats revolve around accepting sacrifice and overcoming your fears, it's no wonder Dusknoir works perfectly as the major opposing force throughout the game. Where Hero and Grovyle (and Celebi although the narrative ignores her for the most part) love the world too much to let it die, Dusknoir can't think of anything except perpetuating his own survival at all costs, disregarding the fact that he has no actual reason to live. The only thing we see him do is serve Primal Dialga, and even that job seems limited to "get rid of those who try to change history". There are no prospects of anything better coming his way.

Morover, Dusknoir's lack of care for the world remains consistent throughout SE5. As Grovyle's main opposing force, it's only natural all the arguments about the "morally right thing to do" are white noise to him. When Grovyle finishes explaining the heroic grand objective of his mission, that saving the planet will grant everyone in the past a new future, Dusknoir blatantly ignores his entire argument. He shows no regard for any life but his own, something that might also be inferred from the careless way he treats the Sableye and Spiritomb.

To continue the trend of Grovyle and Dusknoir being foils of each other, SE5 show us example after example of Grovyle looking for strenght in others, lending a thought to Hero and Partner, reminding himself again and again why he fights so hard. Through it all, he never loses sight of the global consequences of his actions, "for the future!" "make an impact in Partner's future" "the fate of the Pokémon in the future".

In fact, Hero and Partner rarely leave his thoughts. Grovyle is deeply tied to others thanks to his internal thoughts, whereas Dusknoir's thoughts, all throughout the Frozen Island, never stray far from his worst enemy. Even the two ocassions when he brings up Hero or Partner are meant to torment Grovyle, he's very isolated otherwise. It only reinforces how narrow his scope is, compared to Grovyle's ambition of changing the entire world for no benefit to himself.

Up until the middle of SE5 Grovyle seems like a deeply selfless character, and that remains true until the end. However, in a moment of brilliance, the writers introduce to us Grovyle's objective of making his life shine, of leaving a footprint in the world so he will be remembered by others, a selfish motivation. One that is as valid, captivating and powerful as the selfless "give everyone a new life is", and a selfish one nevertheless. And that is exactly what Dusknoir needed to hear. In a parallel to the first conversation of the episode, Dusknoir is once again hurt and vulnerable and listening to Grovyle's justification for his mission. Only this time he pays close attention to what Grovyle says; and this time, to his later dismay, he understands him.

Dusknoir's character arc is partly as strong as it is because the writers are not erasing any of his flaws or established personality, they are precisely using that wish to not disappear and that focus on his own life to drive Dusknoir into a noble objective. Therefore, when Dusknoir switches sides, it is believable. There is enough evidence to see why he was swayed by the idea of his spirit lingering in the world, where millions of lives never made a dent in his determined pursuit of hopeless self-preservation.

As if that wasn't enough, the writers make a point of driving this selfish motivation even further home by contrasting it with literally every other friendly character we can talk to. We only need to take a look at Celebi and the Sableye's lines of dialogue to see that, if the writers had intended for Dusknoir to care for the future itself, they would have had no issue making him say it explicitly. All these characters can spare a line to the greater good of the planet.

And yet, Dusknoir's distinct objective remains clear until the very end, no mentions of the future or any global scale, he wants to make his life shine and live to the fullest in the time he has left. It's an aspect i see overlooked quite a lot in general media, using selfishness to contribute to the big heroic mission. Since Pokémon games tend to have a clearer, more simplified message, where being selfish should be bad and being selfless would be unambiguously good, I am rather fond of this example of a villainous antagonist turning the same qualities that made him an insurmountable threat into the strenght of a crucial member of the team that helped to save the world.

I firmly believe this is a pretty important piece of Dusknoir's characterization. Obviously, he is indirectly "caring" about the world by saving it, yet that is never his main goal by any stretch. Keeping his self-centred personality is an extremely compelling way to develop his character for the better without introducing any external influence, relying on "i'll do the right thing" or the cliché "do it for X person" that would water down his place in the narrative and contradict his established characterization. Once he recognizes the truth in Grovyle's words, he is able to put his fear aside and finally live, for whatever time he has left, as himself and for himself.

[As a funny detail, i find quite charming how celebi is shown to fight for nothing but to save the future; dusknoir, on the contrary, is wholly focused on leaving an impact on the world; and grovyle somehow holds both motivations without neither overshadowing the other. If this isn't proof that they're meant to be a trio, i don't know what it is lol]

[scribz-ag24]

THE WAY HE MANHANDLES HIM ??? I HAVENT SEEN THESE IN SO LONG I WATCHED THEM LAST NIGHT AND??

do yout hink it awakens anything in him

[scribz-ag24]

thx for the tag! I control english and spanish and i currently possess a basic level of french

don't know who to tag, so anyone who sees this, feel free to answer ^^

I'm curious, what languages do my mutuals know?

I speak both English and German, and I know some very basic phrases of Finnish, Spanish, and French.

Tag your mutuals!!

@serene-sky-kid @halcyon-xxy @plutonium-sky @ari-skycotl @arsolitaforever @beigetiger @ejsuperstar

If I forgot you, I'm sorry, and don't be afraid to join in regardless <3

[scribz-ag24]

what’s a futuretrio fic or one shot you think should exist that doesn’t yet? if you have more than one you can make a list

hmmm if you said duskvyle wed have some more ground covered, but with future trio we have sooo much unexplored.

there are currently 10 fics with the tag, and some of them are super good, the sun will rise goes fucking crazy in every way im obsessed with it. also like oil poured out is super sweet, and the only thing to do is to keep going also has super nice moments iirc.

Tbh i think they need more in general, i think they deserve all the fics and one shots in the world. And ngl i agree the approach most fics give them is very appropiate, it makes sense to set the fic after se5 since thats when theyre on friendly terms and have a chance to move forward. I cant say i have any ideas for it tho, my brain doesnt work that well.

at best id say that anything with the trio pre-canon could be interesting but its also pretty hard to do since celebi and dusknoir have no reason to interact so itd have to lean a lot on either actaeon or rendshipping prolly.

I think post-canon trio going back to the past with hero/partner could be fun. also them repairing their future maybe. i have no idea, man, this is why i stick to shitposting and them nuzzling together wenwfwfvlrenj

they have so much potential together i cant think of a concrete idea rn sorry xDD

[scribz-ag24]

After the Big Apple post I’m thinking about the gecko enjoying eating sweets without worry a very normal amount-

Also I will make something that isn’t a quick sketch at some point, you will see…..

[scribz-ag24]

we should let rouxls kaard deltarune create polycules in other universes i think

[scribz-ag24]

Most of Dusknoir crimes where committed in the future, and because the dark future was erased from existence, he technically has done nothing wrong.

Grovyle on the other hand, committed all his crimes in the present/past, and those remain. He's the real baddie.

[scribz-ag24]

starting to believe that dusknoir are a fucked-up-looking species of dog. give him a pat and a belly rub and throw him at enemies so he can manipulate them, its healthy for him <3

[scribz-ag24]

If the antenna can get radio waves from the spirit realm, who’s to say it can’t get the local stations?