#I DON'T SHIP COCKLES I PROMISE

[castielsprostate]

you just know misha read that take out loud and his face scrunched up and his metal hip creaked and jensen stopped sucking his dick and danneel had to gag

[incarnateirony]

you've got such confidence that everybody ever daring to criticize you is in some secret cult based around your destruction or something. you are wrong sometimes, so what, everyone is! writing paragraphs upon paragraphs "owning" your hater's and wanting to quote "rip their face and nuts off, kick them, then throw them in an acid container so nobody can find the body" makes you look like a weirdo, not someone capable of taking criticism and grow from it.

...No secret cult, just common sense when I catch you guys bitching on twitter in the middle of my anon storm. And the fact that you can't communicate like normal human beings for shit, and are so unplugged you think you can use words like "mistress" while pretending to not be from Over There. Bruh. They're the only ones that use that dialogue. I literally scrolled like a week of a muted cockles channel to find this since you guys went absolutely useless and hid when you realized I was HAPPY to think it was her. So I found it myself and was honestly disappointed. Guess what? Not a single cockles person uses that FUCKING term.

You. Can't. Communicate. Like. Normal. Human. Beings. Anymore. Even if you think you are, you're not. And you're too socially dysfunctional to understand why you're like HOW DO YOU DO FELLOW HELLERS whenever you try.

Again. I put in my post, and listed things I've been wrong about, and when I responded to them then. I also admitted I was wrong about a vague yeah i put on some random anon about who someone might be because it's an area I don't care about because I DONT FUCKING SHIP AND IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH TV OR LEAKS? I also very clearly highlighted the difference between leaks and memes, because that's confused you.

Not times I've had a human margin of error in day to day life.

LEAKS, MOTHERFUCKER. TELL ME ONE I GOT WRONG, THAT ISNT A VAGUE CLAIM OR A LIE YOU'RE PARROTING FROM 2pO'S CULT. No, you don't have to be IN the cult to be dumb enough to parrot it either, that's not what I'm saying. NOT SHITPOSTS. NOT. I DUNNO. SEEING THE WRONG CONSTELLATION IN THE SKY SOME DAY.

LEAKS, MOTHERFUCKER. SPEAK CLEARLY. WHAT HAVE I GOTTEN WRONG.

LEAKS DONT COME BY PROXY OF GIDDY FAN REACTIONS. LEAKS COME BY WAY OF TANGIBLE PROOF OR DIRECT DISCUSSION WITH CREATIVES AND MULTIPLE TIERS OF CONFIRMATION BEFORE I EVER PEEP A FUCKIN WORD. (with exception to minor caveats I give specifically, such as the capacity limit of a current source or the ability for something to slip through which. GASP. ADMITS MARGIN OF ERROR EVEN IN LEAKS FROM GOOD SOURCES.)

LEAKS. WHAT. HAVE. I. GOTTEN. WRONG. STOP VAGUEBLOGGING. YOU KEEP SAYING IT. FIND ONE.

(Oh, and don't hope for Margin Of Error to save you on Deancas. I can promise you, it won't here.)

I'd give you a half point if you were smart enough to say "you got the episode filming numbers mixed up" (which, by the way, I admitted and corrected), which also has nothing to do with the leaks, because grabbing bulked out footage and trying to mentally attach them to filming days is, yet again, NOT THE SAME AS FUCKING LEAKS. I already CLARIFIED earlier the divisions on sources and where shit is from. Like yeah, 90% of those vids are from insta, 10% good luck chucklefuck try to find it. That 90% I try to plug in by filming and don't get a clapboard for every. Sometimes you skew a couple of days. OH LOOK THERE! HUMAN ERROR ON SOMETHING I ADMITTED AGAIN. Just. Not actually leaks (spare for that 10% or so). As much as. Trying to find the shape the leaks I have are taking visually, which is an entirely different thing you guys also suck bad at.

[hologramcowboy]

I am interested to know your opinion on shippers obsession with JA. Both J2 and cockles/destiel shippers go to great lengths to prove Jensen is either with JP or Misha. Its like he is a prize and whoever has him is the winner. JA is absolutely adorable I know but why is him being with either of these men romantically important to these people.

Anon, as promised I took my time answering this and gave it my full attention, this is probably going to seem like the most judgmental post in the history of ever and possibly the longest but here goes:

When it comes to shipping, I've stated before that I love seeing people engage their creativity, fall in love with a show and then with creative license create something new that brings them joy. That's so awesome to see. But shipping has a dark side or, rather, a small percentage of people who are set on ruining the fandom experience for all.

Let me start by saying that Your question would be better posed to a shipper that would be open enough to discuss with you. But since you asked me, in particular, it probably was for a reason so here's my perspective. As always, please ignore whatever doesn't resonate and follow your inner guidance.

From a psychological point of view, no one becomes over invested in anything without projecting a personal issue unto that situation/person. I think the hateful shippers (let's remember there are also normal people in this group not just cray ones) see themselves in the people they ship so, for them, their favorite star getting Jensen is like them getting Jensen. It's a projection of an inner frustration. People devalue themselves so they don't see themselves as valuable enough to be in a great relationship, which is why they chose someone to stan who embodies what they want to be and who can have what they think they cannot have.

Psychologically speaking, taking sexual identities that don't belong to Jensen and trying to force them unto him is damaging. It would be damaging to any human let alone someone who is outside of these fandom groups and can't understand everything about them. But people never put themselves in Jensen's shoes. It's one thing to build a story inspired by a series and love it so much you share it with the actor and another to confuse the real-life actor with the character you created. But I do get that these people need to see themselves in Jensen and Misha/ Jensen and Jared/ etc., they need to be recognized, they need to win. That's human and natural but what I will never get is WHY they bully Jensen, make up lies about him and objectify him when they know this hurts him. Even the people who think Jared and Jensen are in a relationship, like that's cool as long as they don't harm anyone with it, it's their prerogative but when they assault others who believe differently or attack the actors then it becomes a toxic, toxic thing.

I should share an important aspect from my perspective, Actors use sexuality a lot in their scenes, they use it to create chemistry. So often, these rumors happen because people are ignorant about an Actor's toolbox and how sexuality is included in mostly everything. Why? Because it is primal. For this reason, there are exercises aimed at creating chemistry and when script analysis is done it's always best to give special attention and look for the main chemistry/climax points of any story, that's the ultimate goal after all. This chemistry might be sexual or otherwise, but it is the fuel of the story and it is what captivates the audience. Aside from this, the whole point of a tv show is to bring to life a plot with chemistry so everything is set up to support and feature the through line of a story. In Supernatural's case, it's the love between the two brothers, that's the core of Supernatural and so the whole show was dependent on the chemistry between the two leads, which meant they had to find to super attractive men who also vibed believably that they could share a strong bond despite being basically in competition as Actors.

All of this not considering the intimacy the camera creates from a cinematic point of view. So, it's funny to me when people think this one or that one are dating just because they have chemistry because any actor that is trained can create chemistry with anyone within minutes. That being said, people get discarded all the time during audition due to said chemistry, mostly not because they suck at creating it but because execs/directors/ etc are looking for a certain zing which you either have naturally or you learn to create masterfully. Sometimes it can even be created from the outside in by manipulating what the audience sees and how they see it through masterful direction, styling, context creation, etc.

Another point to consider is that someone who is highly desirable (think leading man, leading men and women are usually the men and women most want to sleep with) will magnetize others regardless of circumstances and create chemistry on a subconscious level. People automatically assume and start rumors but it's to deflect the fact that they are attracted and magnetized to said individual and perhaps lack the maturity or awareness to handle it in healthy ways. Think of any sex symbol, people all described them differently based on how lude or intelligent the person doing the describing was but they all had one thing in common: Blind Desire. Unfortunately, when blind desire hits people and they do not have the tools to process it some can get pretty evil. Look at Elta, she's shamelessly built her whole identity around sleeping with Jensen and gives zero f**** about the damage to his image she's done time and time again. So, his own wife behaves like an obsessed fan would. It's sad and heartbreaking. But this often happens when people have magnetism, most don't know how to process it, so you get these really weird experiences that make you want to move to a different planet and directly affect your self-esteem because when people are obsessed with you, you're not going to blame them, you're going to blame yourself and feel like there's something wrong within you. Whether people admit to it or not, what they do does have an impact on the Actors not just on their own mental balance.

So, the point is, shipping in and of itself isn't bad, it's only the percentage of people dead set on hatred and malice that choose practices that harm the actors and other fans that sucks big time.

Jensen is innocent in all of this and besides doing his job as an Actor, he has done nothing to encourage this type of behavior and it does not reflect his values, beliefs and choices, the only thing it reflects is the nature of the people who are being vile.

Again, I could be completely off on this, this is just my impression so please find a shipper that can openly and kindly speak to you and explain their valuable perspective because I am sure they have so much more to share and explain.

[msgrumpygills]

Same anon as before, who said that the shippers don't actually care about Jensen (or Danneel) and the one who said that the cockles/destiel ones are just as bad as the tinhats/wincest ones.

To address the fact that I supposedly said that shipping him with Misha ruins Jensen's reputation, and that's somehow homophobic. I'd like to first point out that it was a shipper, not me, who said "don't ship Darius and Misha, it'll ruin Darius' reputation", because I was making the comparison that they never care about that when it comes to Jensen. But second, if we are going to talk about how this affects his reputation, fine, I'll bite. It isn't about whether Misha were a man or a woman. The fact is that Jensen is married with three children. I don't care how much tumblr dot com thinks open marriage and polyamory are a fun, sexy thing. In normal life, they are not looked upon as well as you'd imagine sitting here, and more than that, I promise you, if the rag magazines get a whiff of these lies, they wouldn't be printing bs about happy families and threesomes and two dads and everyone singing kumbaya. They'd be calling him a cheater, whether Misha were a man or a woman. And that's not all. The shippers don't stop at saying that Misha is a part of their marriage. They talk like Jensen can't help himself around any man in his vicinity, in their minds, it's all swinging and sex parties and random hookups. And, let's not forget the "repression" and "internalized homophobia" and "misogyny", which are, as we all know, pretty integral to their theories. I think that's pretty rude and disrespectful, and hurtful to him as a person and to his reputation.

And on top of that, he's spent this whole time being loyal to his family and marriage, and not being into men. If it were me and people were spreading rumours about open marriages and multiple partners, I personally would be extremely offended and feel like my reputation was being ruined. When you've been loyal and faithful and loving to your family and marriage, people saying that you haven't, that they aren't enough for you, that you'd bang anything that moved, that's pretty fucked up to you and your reputation. We've also seen exactly how he feels about this shipping real people thing, so I think we can imagine that he doesn't enjoy having these rumours about him. And then of course, there's the "he invalidated cockles, so he's homophobic and evil" things. I think that's pretty hurtful to his reputation. There's also the fact that in their fetishization of him, any time his new co-workers, friends, or even some random man, is with him, or posts about him, these people start rumours there, just in an effort to "prove" that he's into men so they can bring it back to the cockles fiasco. Do we also need to talk about how exactly they present him in these creepy fantasies? As some sort of sexual deviant?

All this would be equally disgusting and disrespectful and potentially ruinous to his reputation if the rumours were about a woman, but sure, keep proving my point. Anyone who doesn't fall for these conspiracy theories is misogynistic or homophobic, according to them. Maybe it's even racist and elitist to not think that this is okay? Let's see how many buzz words we can assign people who dare to see him as a human and not an object, a tool in their creepy fantasies.

I have absolutely nothing to add, I think you explained this perfectly! I agree though that calling people misogynistic and homophobic just because they don’t buy these deranged fantasies, is ludicrous. 

Just a follow up to the message I just sent about cockles and shippers and reputation. The ire was obviously not directed at you, Grumpy, but rather at being called homophobic for thinking that the way this fandom treats Jensen is absolutely not okay. And I want to reiterate, that I didn't say Jensen and his personal relationships would ruin his reputation, I haven't gone far enough to theorize what would happen if these theories were real, because I have common sense and I know they're not. But that doesn't mean that the nasty rumours that the shippers spread about him aren't problematic or disrespectful. And if that makes me any sort of phobic, well, then I'm sure I'm not interested in being the kind of woke or politically correct that would be acceptable for this fandom.

Dummy me saw your added message after posting so I’m adding your follow-up now! 

I understood that nothing was directed at me, but I appreciate the clarification! <3

[clairenatural]

How do you feel about cockles because I have a Thought based on one of your tags but don't want to bother you if you're not comfortable with it

oooh i finally got the cockles ask. i’ve been preparing for this day

alright so the tl;dr is that I wouldn’t say I actively ship cockles but for the sole reason that I (personally) don’t like shipping real people. if I did I would be right there with everyone else, I promise.

I absolutely adore their relationship. they have *so much love* for each other it’s achingly obvious and their connection is a once-in-a-lifetime kind of thing. I appreciate everything they choose to show us and I get just as excited as everyone else when they like each other’s tweets/comment on Instagram posts/etc. If there’s something more I wouldn’t be surprised and if they ever chose to share it with us I would be ecstatic but I, personally, don’t love digging too deep into it.

That being said I have a lot of friends and mutuals who do ship them and celebrate them unashamedly and I support them!!! as long as you’re being respectful (i.e. not harassing the actors with it), which cockles shippers are usually pretty good at doing, have as much fun as you want with it :) like I said the foundation of what they have is just so much love and I love seeing it and celebrating it too💕

[incarnateirony]

why are people talking about jensen and misha getting doxxed? is there more serious and/or personal info being shared now or do they mean mishas text semi confirming for a lot of people what they speculated about, combined with things they already knew?

im personally of the opinion that if they truly wanted to hide and no one outside their personal lives to know anything, they'd manage to keep things totally private and definitely wouldn't be making jokes and innuendos they do, so I don't think by "shipping" or acknowledging there's ~something happening there, that we're intruding (obviously as long as no one brings that outside of fandom and especially not to them). that said, i do think that fandom spreading things that obviously weren't widely known or even assumed is imo straddling the line.

Nah, they're conflating the fact that at one point Misha and Jensen *got* doxxed to verify the info cockles fandom had found out by other, more harmless means, which Misha just kinda put out there on main. So now they're like UR DOXXING THEM/POSTING DOXXING INFO and it's like no sweetie. You haven't seen their utility bills yet, I promise we're not posting the doxxing info.

Watch, now they'll say me even mentioning that after they've been flooding my inbox is posting the doxxing info and like, you can't have it both ways while pretending info the fandom could have posted about YEARS ago from their OWN OBSERVATIONS BY INCIDENT are doxxing after waiting until Misha openly tweeted about it and then go "oof now you mentioned the THING?" like go away. There's a level of concern troll here that's out of pocket. If they didn't want it talked about Misha wouldn't have talked about "the last time" at Jensen's apartment, which unto itself says that there were more times, much less common sense brain function saying that if there's fond nostalgia about it that he misses, it wasn't exactly a rare occurance and A FUCKTON OF US BEEN KNEW.

Not like knew. KNEW. Like capital Knew. The rumor that spread in fandom at large also had a bundle of people directly given the information that more than verified it years ago. What fandom got was a loosely distributed candy pack to make sure more confidential details didn't get out (those ones still haven't) while giving the veil of plausible deniability as a mere rumor.