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away-ward · 8 months

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Rambles!

regarding your #asked and answered 216 i think it's really interesting how even when emmy was a nobody at school (whether she believed it the case or it's because she really was one), pretty much any interaction or impression we see of her by other people who were not her classmates or the horsemen has been positive (even the horsemen didn't have any problems with her except for damon but that was personal so he doesn't count). People really did respect emory very much in thunder bay, as they should. I remember even the police officers were pretty cool with her, right? In nightfall AND in fire night, she didn't have any problems with them. She even said she's familiar with the PD station too, so maybe that plays a part, other than her achievements and people saw her doing good things like caring for her grandma in town? Even rika hold a lot of respect for her and her gazebo in corrupt. I think will only said something about how people don't see how beautiful she was, but his "people" are probably immature, privilege and shallow people of his age, so that could also be why they don't think she's fun. Even then, there was hate from them. Will ofc would find her fun, because he didn't want ti grow up, but always want to do more and better, just like emory but emory was more like she wanted to grow up, and doing more and better has always just been part of her. That's why they matched! Others (like damon, alex, drugs, alcohol, friends, women, seimming, achievements, education, career) are just vices from their true wants and addiction/obsession: willemmy each other.

Getting back to the impression of others of emmy, this is so Interesting to me, because emmy never praised herself in her pov, especially her achievements or the good things she did for herself or others, so that's why we got a lot of angst, but people around her really did respect her, especially older and more knowledgeable people, and to a lesser degree, even the horsemen. I guess that's why it hurts even more for will to be rejected, because emory scott was will grayson's standard (vice versa) and he thought she thought he couldn't be better, which is so not true.

And in a town where that one specific weird kind misogyny is so thick, the "she's good, that's why we don't touch her" kind, if we want to consider other reasons why people don't fuck with her other than her 1. Pushing them away (she was described as moody but never evil. Not enough for people to dislike you just because you're moddy in a town full of dangerous insufferable people), 2. Her brother is a shitty cop, 3. The Horsemen's "protection" (from her bullies, or people like Nolan and Miles Anderson. I remember her classmates like rose and jack were exasperated with the horsemen emory thingy for the seating in classes, but never mentions of any hatred, just annoyed about annoying kids being annoying, that's all). There has to be a certain amount of respect for emory (big ones too), because if not, the town would still have treated her badly and see her like dirt, which was not true. Even banks and winter were laughed at because of their blood connections, but not emory. Interesting! Thank you for bringing this conversation in.

Interesting thing too how one of the first best attributes of emory by will was always her character and attitude towards good and better things in life. The fact that she was a hard worker etc., and a family woman. Because will wnats to be one too, and he also always cares so much about the people he loves. I stand by my opinion where the other main reason why willemmy match so well was because their world is beautiful, and they way they view people and world so beautiful, that's why when they were taken advantage, it hurts. Will with damon and emmy, emmy with martin, will, even alex. Both of them had a good impression of damon BECAUSE willemmy's view of the world is beautiful. And i him damon saw this too, because the way he interacts with willemmy is so different than the others. He was so soft for them, lmfao! And i think this was also the reason why emory was like a light and storm for the guys in blackchurch. Finally, there's hope for more, a fiery fighter and lover. Anyway, back to willemmy's beautiful pov, i think this is what We don't get this from michaelrika, kaibanks, winterdamon, or even aydinalex. They don't have to BE like willemmy, but yeah. But still, we got this distinct trait from willemmy. I bet if emmy was similar to rika or winter, their povs would've been more cutting and edgier. Michaelrika was cutting and sharp, kaibanks was like a pillar, so stable and taboo, winterdamon was like soft but so painful. But willemmy was beautiful, but sad but funny too. Willemmy has the biggest heart, they were the reasons people still love, be it will with the horsemen, and emmy with blackchurch gang or alex.

i think it's also interesting how Emory was like the wind and the storm where, even though she didn't notice this, whereever she goes, that's where the trouble is 🤣 if she didn't find trouble, trouble will find her, just like will! And being around a character as fiery as emory, no wonder will, and even alex, aydin, micah and rory were swept in her storm, wind and chaos. Even when all that bullshit ass plot happened, emory still came out of it with her own narrative, maximizing the best out of the worst situation. It all came back to how EMORY reacted. She's the moving force, when she took rein, things change especially for her, and this is not something that i see with any other characters in nightfall, or this series, maybe except for rika. Even damon was passive because he always relied on other or he talked more than what he can do.

(side note) I was not a fan of winter because of this, in any case, i felt like winter was the one who was like a pile of dead leaves. Putting aside her disabilities that limits her interaction with people, even when she was given the chance to love or do something, she was just there, the most useless character. Winter never had to work for anything in any of her relationships (her career was the best part of her, i respect that), but she gets to be happy in her romantic one with damon because HE was the one that had to beg for scraps and do all the work. I don't see any chemistry between winterdamon because of this. I don't think winter deserves damon because i don't see much loving from winter to damon, especially in a series where every FMC/MMC gets obsessed over their partners. I was annoyed by rika, but i was rooting for her when she was going after what she wants, even banks too who was on the verge of choosing kai because shes tired of damon, but winter? Nothing. I love mutual pining, and the pining in kill switch was not mutual, and for the most favourited couple in the series, they didn't serve anything. Imo, i feel like if you like winterdamon, it's only most likely because you enjoy damon's character, or if you want to be with damon (self-inserting yourself into winter's bland ass character) or wants to be loved by someone like damon. While there's nothing wrong with self-inserting yourself in characters, that's not how i enjoy my romance books, i don't want to BE or be WITH the FMC/MMC, i want to root for them, and they have to got their own distinct personality and pining to root for first, and damonwinter lacked this so much. And whatnot with the amount of misogyny and women-hating that came from BOTH winter and damon and pretty much everyone there in kill switch, i came to hate them as characters. I was so fucking surprised that Nightfall lacked the misogyny from the previous books even among all those stupid women-hating and being pitted against each other agenda by aydin and will to emory and alex, so I said what i said, idc if people disagree with me. Emory Scott best character, that's right. I can stand murder, horror in dark romance, but misogyny? I'm out 🤣 oh yeah, btw i was talking about winterdamon's dynamic though, not who did worse, because of course damon did worse, no debate here. To me, winterdamon was not dark romance, they were dark erotica, like michaelrika. Theirs stories were full of sex and erotic mindfucking, but when it comes to love? I don't buy them. But then, i believe in kaibanks but pd ruined them, so what do i know at this point honestly. I know my take on winterdamon was a very unpopular opinion. People can share what they think of it though, i don't mind.

Getting back to emmy, now on the other hand, Emory, unlike winter, or even alex (apart from their careers), was active in how she seeks for things she wants in her life and her future (even though she never acknowledges it), emory survives the best under pressure, that's why i like her too. When i read her book, i had to reread certain phrases because i gotta think in different povs about emory scott because just like will, she's an unreliable narrator, but she's an unreliable narrator of herself, unlike will who was an unreliable narrator in front of others. In fire night, it was mentioned that only emmy knew him best, so all this time, him in her pov was his truest self), and maybe that's why when she was at her lowest, i too, felt like wow, if she felt like this, maybe there's really no way out. Idk, people can hate on the plot (understandable) but i think it's also interesting despite how shitty it all came to be, emory decided how she's going to deal with it instead of letting the currents bring her. There's always more and better to look forward to for characters like willemmy. Even when things were not in her cards, she's able to come out and make it good for her (?) does this make sense? I think that's why it's also interesting how the opinions of nightfall is so divided, because if readers think like emory, than i guess they might like her story more since how she dealt with her problem after was more important than what was the past or how she came to be where she was at. There's a lot of suspension of disbelief and being a bit delusional. But because of that, She was able to put things in the past and strive forward. She never needed anybody to tell what she had to do, but she needed time, and maybe support because she's tired of doing things on her own or alone. It requires a lot of time to get there, but the payoff of her character was worth it. Funny because i thought this was what aydinalex lacked. They waited for people to do their work for them, and even when they were around, they kept on busy being in someone's business and when things don't go as they imagined, they blame on others. Aydin on will and alex, alex on aydin and emmy. Never themselves, always someone else's wrongs.

i love that even after everything, when i reread nightfall, i noticed how much decisions emmy made were for herself and for what she thought was better for everyone even in the poorest situation. However people always still see her decision as her siding to will, alex, aydin etc. It's like how women irl always claim they're doing things they want for themselves, and people still dismiss them because 1. They don't actually care about what she wants, or 2. Because she's not doing what they thought wa sgood for her. At the end of the day, people are still the ones acting entitled to how a women (aand in this case, the fmc emory) should live her life or react to certain situations. It also does help that emory had said many times that she was tired being dead, so she's moving on to be alive. I think smart characters like emory should be given credit and hold accountable for her goods and wrongs. There's nothing wrong with loving a character who has flaws and do things we don't agree with. I understand though when people get defensive over emmy, admittedly, i do too, but i think, unlike a lot of her fans, i'm a bit in the middle where she can do right, she can also do wrong, but what she wants and needs will be supported first. A lot of readers' judgement are still black and white, as if every moment has to be good, or logical, or worse, she's so bad, nor redeeming quality / she's too good for people, when admittedly if she was good, she wouldn't have wanted to be part of their life. They're all guilty to a certain extend. Emory scott in real life unfortunately, would always chose damon torrance and michael christ above us, guys, idk how to tell this to people. Even if i support her fictionally, irl, i knew when it comes to choosing between me and her family, it's family first for her, there's more likely that she would hatecrime us than support us. I think people forgot that, lmfao! Idk, emory scott felt the most human to me among every other characters, so i guess that's why i still love her, but not too much to the point where i'd defend her with my life because our moral really don't align.

sorry for my rambling, this is my first ramble in a while on your blog, It's been a while, KO! Nice to ramble here again! How you doing now? I dont even remember my past rants, tbh. I took a long break from social media, and had the time to reread nightfall again! I've read some new books that i came to love like the Mindfuck series, and a short novella that me cry my ass of because the regrets in the story reminded me of willemmy so much, and that novella was An Unplanned Occassion by Angie Kim. I just finished another series of novella by trisha wolfe called with visions of red, book 1-3, and overall it was good but the ending was whack. I was also on my talia hibbert binge, and i'd recommend a paranormal novella called The Mating Huntress because of how how but amazing it was! I'm really on my thriller and crime books binge right now, and in my journey, i found Wretched by Emily McIntire and i quite liked the couple, reminded me of willemmy. The plot was so ridiculous, but the tension and relationship was good! I have yet to read Sempre, but maybe one day i will. And talking about one day, do you know that they're coming out with annew movie?!!! I havent got around to read the book, but maybe i'll watch the movie first, what do you think? Anyway, itks been a while since i'm here and i just though of you and wanted to shared my thoughts about nightfall with you again so here is the ramble. Some of my thoughts have changed, but some had remained. I think, i'm looking at these characters with a kinder lense now, What about you? Hope you had a good day, KO!

-Z

Z!!

Hi! It’s good to hear from you. Totally wasn’t expecting you to come back after last time, but I’m glad you seem to be doing well. It seems like the break did you good, and you were able to read a lot. I'm surprised I came to mind after everything, but I guess that's a good thing.

I'm trying to be kinder towards the series too. I have my gripes as always, but overall I still want to see the best of it.

I had no clue Netflix was making One Day, and while I don’t think anything will replace Anne’s Em in my heart, the new one looks so good. Just the trailer gave me my willemmy friends-to-lovers AU vibe. Made me so happy that I recorded my reactions and favorite parts because trying to read that again wouldn’t be easy. Thanks for the heads up!

youtube

Regarding Sempre, don’t push yourself. It is mostly nostalgia on my part, but I can talk about that story nonstop. Just give me the green-light-go, and I’m off. However, I can see that the writing is a bit out of date, and clunky here-and-there. It was republished as a YA, so there’s no spice. If you’re someone who needs the spicy parts, this probably wouldn’t be a fun read for you. It’s written in third person, so it can be hard for those used to first person to get into.

But oh my god! The characters and the layers. I feel like these characters really earn their stories and growth, you know? Have you ever read something and you’re like ‘this happened all too quickly and I really don’t believe what’s happening right now, but I guess here we are?’ Like when the mcs go from barely knowing each other to being completely dedicated in a week, and it’s like… but do they really know each other or am I just supposed to believe they do? That doesn’t happen in Sempre. You see the growth, the love, the reasoning. The characters mess up and rebound and mess up again, and each time they earn their forgiveness and get better. There is a bit of a fated-love element, but I again… the love they share is earned and developed properly instead of just placed in front of us.

And the layers and the secrets and how the characters deal with them is so heart-wrenchingly good. Vincent DeMarco, Carmine's father, is so multifaceted. He does absolutely deplorable things that Haven, that as a reader you understand but still. And yet, you also understand why Haven forgives him eventually.

At least I do.

I can understand not wanting to read it because it’s simply not your taste, though. Nothing wrong with that. It’s absolutely not the greatest thing ever written. But Corrado will always be my original Sexy, Stone-faced Mafia Man. And he without a doubt would burn the world down for his wife. Fun fact, his book is an Adult book, so it does have a few spicy scenes. You have to get through the first part, which is his abusive childhood, but the love story between him and Celia is a good read. Love them.

Thank you for listening to my Sempre ramblings (seriously, I could go on…no? okay. let me know though...you know. in case), let’s get to the main topic.

Emory.

I think will only said something about how people don't see how beautiful she was, but his "people" are probably immature, privilege and shallow people of his age, so that could also be why they don't think she's fun.

I agree that the adults had a lot of respect for Emory. But that could also be wrapped up sympathy. She lost her parents, her brother is a public servant, she had to grow up to deal with very adult things at a young age. As for Emory’s peers though, I think it’s important to remember how Emory was presenting herself. She stopped taking care of her outward appearance, such as brushing her (possibly) curly/frizzy hair. Will calls it kinky, and Emory says she learned to “straighten it”, which could mean her hair gets frizzy when it’s not maintained properly. She doesn’t wear make-up, and her clothes are too big and falling apart. We usually picture Emory as a sleek, well put together girl, but she was messy.

I also think Will was watching everything she did. He knew her routine, where she’s usually went, what she liked to do. I think what he picked up on was that the other kids didn’t notice how hot she actually was beneath all of the mess. That she had an amazing body from swimming and hard physical work; her eyes were gorgeous under the thick glass (if you could even get her to look at you, which he worked for); that her lips were thick but her tongue was sharp. And beneath all of that sharp barred-wired persona was this person who was kind. Nobody noticed these things because Emory Scott was a weird mess on a good day.

Adults typically do have more insight and understanding, and might be able to overlook her appearance to see what a great person she is, but I doubt her most of her schoolmates had the mind to do that. As you said, they are immature and shallow.

As for Rika, she definitely respects Emory’s hard work but she was pretty quick to forgive them afterwards. But who knows, maybe if the night had turned out differently, she would have been the first in line to make Will “fix” it.

emory was more like she wanted to grow up, and doing more and better has always just been part of her.

Doing more and being better was a big part of Emory’s character. Farther down, you say Emory never praised herself but she absolutely did. When quiting the swim team, she said she knew she was a good swimmer and that she helped the team. And then in the pool before Will interrupts her swim, she starts thinking about her skills. She likes showing people what she can do. She’s fully aware of her skills and that they shine when she works on them. She knows she smart and talented. And yes, she fools herself into believing that because of that talent, she doesn’t need friends (you’re absolutely right, she is an unreliable narrator because that is a full lie she told herself to feel better), but that doesn’t negate that she’s aware of her skills and praises them.

emmy never praised herself in her pov, especially her achievements or the good things she did for herself or others, so

But this is a good point – it’s her academic achievements that she acknowledges. The good things she does for other people don’t get mentioned in anything other than passing. Emory focuses on her mistakes. She offends Elle, we hear about it. She annoys another student, we hear about. She hurts Will, we hear about. For pages. It’s like for Emory, being a decent and good personal is the most basic thing, and that is so amazing because of everything she’s been through! That kindness still comes so easy to her that it doesn’t even deserve more than single thought she gives it.

I do like the idea of Emory having the Horsemen’s protection (even though that’s probably not the case entirely). I think the Horsemen, the general rule is that you pick on those weaker than you; don’t punch down. Which is what Nolan and Miles did. They'd find people weaker than them. Emory said that Miles didn’t pull “those kind” of stunts when the Horsemen were around, and even Rika acknowledged that he waited for them to leave before he got worse. The Horsemen kept order because they had a standard, especially towards women. I don’t think they went out of their way to enforce it, but it’s like the Horsemen’s disapproval was probably damaging to your social life? And since the Horsemen didn’t have a problem with Emory, people just let her be. Without insight into how Will “pushed her into corners” and what the other students interpreted that to mean (thanks, PD!), it’s hard to tell what people really thought of her.

Because will wnats to be one too, and he also always cares so much about the people he loves. I stand by my opinion where the other main reason why willemmy match so well was because their world is beautiful, and they way they view people and world so beautiful, that's why when they were taken advantage, it hurts.

Yes! This is an excellent point. Despite everything they each went through, they still view the world as beautiful. They don’t compare or complain or focus on the pain. They see the world as a place full of opportunities. They see the world as beautiful. I love them so much!

good impression of damon BECAUSE willemmy's view of the world is beautiful. And i him damon saw this too, because the way he interacts with willemmy is so different than the others. He was so soft for them,

I really do love this idea. I don’t have words to add because… yeah.

And that’s why I said the Damon would hate the Damon-lovers who bash Emory. Don’t you see how much he likes Emory?

i think this is what We don't get this from michaelrika, kaibanks, winterdamon, or even aydinalex. They don't have to BE like willemmy, but yeah. But still, we got this distinct trait from willemmy. I bet if emmy was similar to rika or winter, their povs would've been more cutting and edgier. Michaelrika was cutting and sharp, kaibanks was like a pillar, so stable and taboo, winterdamon was like soft but so painful. But willemmy was beautiful, but sad but funny too. Willemmy has the biggest heart,

The heartfelt way that Will loved Emory (even misguided as he was) is definitely something I was missing in the other books. Even in the past scenes, there was something so cold and dark about the way the guys thought of about their girls. Like they were something to capture and lock up. But Will really was like this girl is everything and I need everyone to see it. But what you said made be think about what Will called them; Michael was the Leader, Kai was the Brain, Damon was the Passion. And everyone but him knew Will was the Heart.

And I think that comes through a little bit in their stories, but what’s a good love story without a little bit of heart?

It all came back to how EMORY reacted. She's the moving force, when she took rein, things change especially for her, and this is not something that i see with any other characters in nightfall, or this series, maybe except for rika.

This is a really good point too. I like how you basically go on to say, and it circles back around to what you’ve said previously, about Emory owning her decisions. She didn’t always make the best decisions. But when she took control and made decisions, she did them with her full weight. She put everything she was into them, and never tried to hide from her mistakes. She laid them bare for the world to see. And this was the lesson Michael was trying to teach Rika, so it’s interesting that Emory is like this without much emphasis on it?

Like even in Conclave, Rika is still running from her decisions. She has decided she can’t marry Michael until she’s honest about their chances of having a family on their own. But instead of telling Damon that, she lies. She tells Kai, but only when she’s stressed and emotionally spent. Rika doesn’t always own who she is (forgive me for picking on her ability to have children. It’s just the first thing that came to mind. But it also shows up when she told Damon how to take down Winter’s father, and then tried to befriend Winter without telling her the part she played putting Winter in Damon’s control.), but Emory doesn’t shy away from it.

She moved her story forward, and made decisions for her benefit, but also made decisions that would hurt her for the benefit of someone else, fully acknowledging what she was doing each time.

Emory, unlike winter, or even alex (apart from their careers), was active in how she seeks for things she wants in her life and her future (even though she never acknowledges it), emory survives the best under pressure, that's why i like her too.

You’re right that Emory survives best under pressure. I think this is kinda where I base my idea that she didn’t do too well socially at Berkley, partially. On one hand, she’s got school, on another she’s trying to take care of her grandma. These are things she’s comfortable with. But outside of that, there’s no real pressure. She’s not fighting for survival or fighting to keep a secret. She’s just existing. It’s why when she gets to Blackchurch, she starts to feel alive again.

But Emory, unlike other characters, always had a direction she was going in. Rika, Banks, and Winter didn’t know what they wanted for their futures before Michael, Kai, and Damon showed up.

Rika was just going to college but no idea what she was going to do with a degree. She knew was expected to get married, but she didn’t know what she wanted. Enter Michael and Damon, and now she’s mayor of her home town.

Banks wanted to be safe, but out side of that, she wanted whatever Damon wanted. And she’s still making decisions based on his grand scheme. She’s a Senator, just like he wanted. And I’m not saying she doesn’t deserve it, but would she be just as happy taking over Gabriel’s business, and being a mom and a wife?

Winter was a dancer, but it was Rika who gave her the boost she needed to pursue it seriously, and Damon who gave her the support.

Emory pursued getting out of Thunder Bay with a career path in mind. She made deliberate choices that created the future she had in mind for herself. She worked hard to get there and didn’t let people shame her for making those choices. And finally, Damon didn’t decide her career. He does get to enjoy the fruitage of her hard work, though. Maybe Damon likes that he can’t control her. I think he does.

Alex… never had plans of being an escort, but she landed on her feet after a huge disappointment. Still, she sort of just does whatever the gang wants her to do. Even as in adult, she’s involved in everyone’s business. And PD tries to sell this as her just being so capable but I don’t buy it. It’s annoying that she never did anything on her own and instead just gets hangs off the family’s coattails.

In fire night, it was mentioned that only emmy knew him best, so all this time, him in her pov was his truest self),

This is such a good point.

Even when things were not in her cards, she's able to come out and make it good for her (?) does this make sense?

I think it makes sense. Emory played the cards she was dealt the best she could, and then she didn’t complain that the game was rigged against her. She knew it was. But at her best, she made favorable situations out of unfavorable conditions.

Funny because i thought this was what aydinalex lacked. They waited for people to do their work for them, and even when they were around, they kept on busy being in someone's business and when things don't go as they imagined, they blame on others.

Yes.

Yes!

YES. This.

At the end of the day, people are still the ones acting entitled to how a women (aand in this case, the fmc emory) should live her life or react to certain situations. It also does help that emory had said many times that she was tired being dead, so she's moving on to be alive. I think smart characters like emory should be given credit and hold accountable for her goods and wrongs.

I don’t think it’s so much that Emory has flaws that people dislike, but yeah, the disagreeing with the decisions she made is interesting. Because I can say “I’d never make that decision” and even hate a decision has character made, but I can understand how a character got there. And always thought that was the point of reading? To understand the situations of other people and see their circumstances for what they are.

when people get defensive over emmy, admittedly, i do too, but i think, unlike a lot of her fans, i'm a bit in the middle where she can do right, she can also do wrong, but what she wants and needs will be supported first.

I’d like to think I’m in the middle too. I mean, I know I joke about Emory being perfect but that’s really because she deserves to have people treat her like she’s never done anything wrong. You know. Like how some people treat Damon.

I’m also just very insane about her. But I try not to care too much if people say things I disagree with. Like you said, people can say what they want. They can have different opinions, different characterizations.

But I do like your approach to not erasing her decisions because you don’t agree with them. To erase them would be to erase her character, making her someone different. I prefer to try and understand her character and what got her there. At least, I hope that’s what you’re saying.

i guess that's why i still love her, but not too much to the point where i'd defend her with my life because our moral really don't align.

I completely get this. Honestly, I think if Emory were a real person, she probably wouldn’t like me too much, and I wouldn’t like her. But because she’s a fictional character and I’ve been personally introduced to her story, which I can sympathize with, it’s easy to say she deserves the ending she got. Which was happy. Because it’s a romance.

As I said before, it’s good to hear from you. I enjoyed your ramblings.

Oh, and I did read the Damin/Winter side note. I agree with you. It really does feel like Winter is so easy to ignore. I often times forget to include her in my daydreams. I wish she’d had stronger staying power in my mind, because I think I would love a Damon and Winter if she did. But alas.

Stop by again soon!

#asked and answered #ko's dns tag #devil's night series #emory scott #willemmy #character discussion #asked and answered 220

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misterbitches · 3 years

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i had the misfortune of finally watching/getting through what happened in whatever episode where he gets raped so im gonna talk about it and tag it cos that's what a bitch fuckin feels like, got it? i do what i want aint no limit bad ass bitch aint never been timid. woopsie realized i got the nicknames confused oh well lmao

it's just logistically and plot wise like there's literal plot holes in this and i'm taking the production and set-up into account along with the actual content and development. im an ARTIST OKAY im jk i mean i am and i am pretentious and terrible but look. i didnt get that degree and im not in a house worth of debt for nothing ok. it's called writing on tumblr about my grievances of shows that dont matter and do not respect me as a fat black american woman either so it is my fault yet here i am.

anyway it was worse than i imagined and their talk after (with chengren) was even worse. that's what i mean about making the lines their own (the actors) bc teng teng sounded like a straight up motherfucking moron and im like

bECAUSE IT'S HIM EVEN THO IM LIKE WHAT THE FUCK DID U JUST SAY U STUPID BITCH? but then it's like awwww and they also care about his wellbeing obviously??? but no? but it's like ok still teng teng said it even if it's stupid because he is a character and charles puts that forth. the people that fail the most to do that are xing si's family but that's not the actors fault because it's the literal material. you're like wait what but you just said...?

so i know they have no script editors i guess i think i find this season ACTUALLY fascinating because of just how egregious it is. i also went back and watched history: obsessed which i thought i liked because of their chemistry even though god the production....but i tried rewatching it and i was like wow this is worse than i remembered and the production issues were even worse because some of the music was SO LOUD AND BAD HOLY FUCK and their whole rship isssssss a sight to behold lmao

so man i guess it really is the power of anson/charles. which is good cos we love to see it...sort of but also a lot.

i honestly....because i've been able to pay attn more to the aftermath of the rape going back and putting it into more context and focusing (just barely lmao) is hm even worse. the inconsistencies are insane. it's not even just about the act but the writers have zero idea where they are going because they have no interest in exploring it. but the way in which it happens is like fascinating. yong jie literally thinks he owns xing si and it doesn't matter if he was kissing him or not or asked for a kiss on the lips (which dude what the fuck? i'll get to that) because he was plied with "extremely strong drinks" and his mom knew about it....which girl congrats you're an accomplice to the rape of your son by your other son?

but first of all...the kissing thing. in what fucking world would he (xing si) want that unless he thought he (yong jie) was someone else. i can't say their attraction is evident because we are being lead by this team to think so; they create this false sense of sensuality already so to me that signifies that they never intended for them to have a bond as brothers. it just feels cheap and fucking lazy (which it is.) even if he did, which doesn't make sense considering the context THEY CONSTRUCTED, it wouldn't matter because he was so fucking drunk which.... at that point nothing is fun, you feel sick, who wants sex like that? does he not have whiskey dick? did they have a condom? was it not painful for him considering? even if this was something to easily get over like was the dick good? it couldn't have been. and then, on top of that, there's the fact that you can change your mind or whatever but also that people do get aroused in these situations bc it is human nature (that's if they can literally get aroused which if the drinks were allegedly sooooo strong that nigga would be out so....again like even practically here it doesnt add up. have these people ever been drunk? if not, write what you know girl. cos sometimes it's like i think some of u r trying to be cool when u dont have 2 b lmao)

so yong jie coming on to him previously may be seen as like push-and-pull but here's the thing. right after it happens (the rape and it's rape so call it that you'll be okay) xing si gets up and goes home and is terrified and upset. he acts like what we have seen or even felt after a violation. he's scared, clutching his bag, it's like...you know...decently coming off as truly distressing (the actor isn't bad at all and i like that he's dark. i just massively hate this for him but hey at least he can show some chops.) like honestly man that fucking sucks and hurts to see. if we've been there we feel it. or part of it is realizing belatedly what happened. a lot of times that drop in your stomach is the worst.

but somehow for some reason, to which i cannot understand, the three of them begin to talk as if xing si pressured him? which maybe i missed something and that is possible—dont feel like going back to look—but that also made no sense. like what kind of false memory is this? why would he think he wasn't willing? and if he thought yong jie wasn't and that he pressured him how does he remember like...anything about the sex?!?!??!? besides waking up and being with him. like i guess he felt yong jie's MASSIVE DONG imprint but ??!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!??!? MAKE IT MAKE SENSE!!!!!

god then the logic of the top/bottom thing is like i said i wasnt going to get into it but it's actually really funny. this whole thing was hilarious. honestly because I DO NOT UNDERSTAND WHAT THAT MEANS. he could have totally raped him in that way but how did you get to this CONCLUSION FROM THAT??????? BY YOUR LOGIC THAT'S NOT HOW IT WORKS? IF HE IS THE BOTTOM AND PENETRATION IS THE ONLY FORM OF TRUE CONSUMMATION AND RAPE BECAUSE APPARENTLY, BASED ON ANATOMY, IF YOU HAVE A DICK IN UR BUTT UR A GIRL THEN HOW. DOES. THIS. MAKE. SENSE. AND THEN

AND THEN

this whole stupid conversation happens so we get to the conclusion that xing si violated him ok cool but that means that something is wrong. that is the CONCLUSION WE CAME TO A SECOND AGO?

also the other rapist is a villain and muren isn't in love with him so, once again, you're breaking the rules of your own world about acceptability which is why most of this is absolutely mind bogggglinG that iit's fuckign comical. like i actually when i can stomach it start laughing or my jaw is slack because it's so insulting as a viewer because there is like 0 logical followthrough.

because whatshisface barges in, kisses him in front of his friends without permission, then says whether you were willing or not which is hm. at that point how u gonna change that around but let's not bother with logic here. i am simply here to point out how this makes no sense according to the rules they set up even outside of the basic rule of life which is hm dont rape people maybe.

so now we know xing si was raped, they believe he was raped, he himself believes he was raped, and whatshisface literally says he doesn't care even if he was willing (he wasn't) so he admits to rape. i don't believe in the police and i hate them (BL industry needs the cops but dont get me down that road) but no one...thought to go?

because according to history 4 logic nothing matters so im sure if he went to the police you could handwave the homophobia since there's no actual context for anything besides their whimsy. but they dont want to do that because they aren't interested in an arc of growth; redemption isn't possible unless he is removed from the family but again no work on thinking this through or thinking about the victim's feelings. because gay sex? who fucking knows. supposedly progressive taiwanese writers of gay shit (like how supposedly progressive the world is. as in it is not and this behavior is the norm and bl perpetuates that) can't think of transformative justice?

and then they gave bad advice so we wont acknowledge that because teng teng doing anything wrong/stupid is frequent but hurts me and also that storyline is not real so i pretend they are not there outside of this post

so all of this is just straihgt up clownery now because it's fucking absurd like logically, practically, human-wise. the kissing thing is inconsequential but it was such a lazy cheap way out lmao cos they really wanted it to seem consensual but that's not how it works. on top of that their attraction makes no sense because whatshisface is just there. he is just there. he's nothing and no one so the sentiments are even more empty and on top of that he doesnt listen to a single request fucking obviously because the basis of their relationship is fucking rape so fucking listening and respecting his partner is not on his list of fucking priorities. he's literally so fucking annoying even without being a rapist it's like someone please beat his ass.

and then after all of that you want us to feel bad? with your horrible writing, poorly misplaced music, stupid costumes (those fucking SHOES THEY ARE HIDEOUS, AND MOST OF THIER CLOTHES DO NOT FIT IT'S LIKE WHY), questionable fucking editing. we're supposed to wnat them together? this sounds literally fucking crazy but bear with me lmao even with the rape they could at least have SOMETHING i mean like i cant believe im fucking saaying this. but like in addicted heroin which is fuckin tragic and awful at least there's a MODICUM of interest but honestly that show s a fucknig drag. idk they lookd good together? here we have 0. nothing. and it doesnt motivate. watching obsessed again i can see why i liked it in the beginning bc they have good chemistry but the acting and production adn like everything about it plus the rape-y vibes it's just too much. you need to pick one thing so if you're going to be a shit writer at least supplement it with something. this thing is nothing.

and even more nonsensical and what boggles my mind frankly out of all this is the mother's involvement and the father's final response. there are NO consequences? theyre all happy?

ok so lets go through this:

1. 2 boys grow up 2gether, one of the boys is fucking psycho, the mother knows but does nothing??????????????

2. one of the sons moves out so his father doesn't get a hint that's he's fucking gay. ok fine. he has 2 best friends, a job, an apt. he is fine.

3. aforementioned brother is obsessed with him for SOME REASON besides being crazy?

3.5 no one has done anything during him growing up to help him not be crazy?

4. mom says to husband who is their father also just in case we forget "im afraid he will lose his humanity"

4.5 again, do nothing. 0. just like oh man hes crazy. guess that's just our son ;)

4. who cares. plies him with alcohol purposefully to rape him. not even dubious (even though dubious is fucked and not okay or is just not. fucking real. these shows are contextless when they want to be or even movies or whatever so it's like largely not up to the task to understand complexity in human rships and then oversimplifies it constantly because that's what we do IRL. but people have fucking feelings you know and we realize when things don't feel good or right to us either very quickly after or having to process it. and once you're eyes are opened you may feel as something was fucking ripped away from you. for the modc couple this would be a very logical conclusion for the high schooler the thirty year old dated but again logic or feelings are up to their whimsy. no one cares bc everything can be counted as dubious so honestly it's a fucking stupid fucking topic like again why are we litigating what is and isnt consent when you could just like idk. read cues? consent? wait? not be a freak? like we all know what is proper human shit so even if we are watching this uncritically which u cant bc it's glaring and stupid it's just even more dumb) so it was honestly a rape plot like he literally planned it soooooooooo??!?!

5. aftermath of rape the victim is like literally fucking bereft and confused. and a rape victim. like that's what they are insinuating and what also he is to be clear.

6. boy tells him "idc if i raped u i luv u lmao"

7. mom ENCOURAGED THE BOY to get him drunk because her other son was too nice? she encouraged her adult son to rape her adult step-son (but her real son because she repeatedly says you are my son and the dad does too THEY GREW UP TOGETHER WHEN THE KID WAS IN AN IMPRESSIONABLE STATE) so THIS ALSO MAKES EVEN LESS MOTHERFUCKING SENSE

8. everyone finds out about his rape and he isnt mortified he's just concerned about himself being gay to his dad?????? except it's not really about his gayness bc now it's about his sudden love for his rapist brother? which? hm ok. understandable the dad is like wow i do not think i like this

9. dad knows all of it is fucked up, everyone does, knows the mother fucked up, knows he fucked up. doesnt like it because he is normal. so we know this is terrible? ok great so—

10. father says "i can't accept this...but i'm willing to give you my blessing" ok see here's the thing. when you write you have to think about the things you are putting on the page and what you have written previously. this quite literally made no sense how the fuck are you going to not accept them but give them your blessing? does this crew know what the fuck words are? i'm assuming they went to some sort of school to obtain jobs here bc there cannot be natural talent or experience. maybe most of them are rich. fuck i do not know but this also makes no sense. just the literal logic of it it's like fucking insane the whiplash.

10.5 apparently this father is also shitty. everyone here sucks and they are basically begging me to think xing si is a fucking idiot so i dont even want to look at him if he is an object he doesnt matter so now i want to kick him. thanks a lot you made the victim get absolutely fucking nothing

they KEEP PUSHING the brother thing it is so insane and it's liek GUYS WE GET IT WE UNDERSTAND THEYRE "RELATED" BUT NOT RELATED SO IT'S OK HE WAS "RAPED" BUT NOT RAPED but you're GOING BACK ON YOUR OWN RULES!!!!!!!!!! WE GET THAT THEY ARE BROTHERS!!! WE'RE OVER IT NOW BUT WHAT IS THIS WHEN WE ALREADY ESTABLISHED SOMETHING? I AM CONFUSION? they flip flop between my son, my brother my actual brother, and cannot fucking distinguish between love for your father and love for your romantic partner? so to me what i see is that the father wants to fuck the son. that's the conclusion i am garnering now considering nothing matters and his love for his "brother" is the same as his love for his dad lmao. they couldnt even do that in a way that made sense. like damn anybody can get anything. these ppl who are doing this have to be fucking rich and/or have connections.

also this guy sounds literally like a textbook abuser like he says constantly "im the best choice" is a rapist is awful holds capital (oh hees "saving" smh ur trapping her!!!!! RETIRE!!!!) also wears terrible shoes so i am like ur alllllllllLLLLL FUCKING CRAZY ur all literally crazy and then they are trying to set rules and boundaries in their fucking house like WHY ARE THEY LIVING TOGETHER EVEN? even tho oh my god they know he raped him and for some reason they are both allowing to live in the house but they dont want them to have sex??!?!?!??!??!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?! i get that this is their house but this is like at this point these ppl are writing anything and now whatshisface is acting like a 2 yr old again and we are supposed to find this cute? like it makes 0 sense why do u fucking care u literally encouraged ur son to rape him so they cant have consensual sex under your nose now and have to wait four years? this is coming from the son who couldnt wait until someone was sober enough to realize hes fucking psychotic and should be killed also the fact that they act like being 20 means u have no fucking brain like this kid is in med school supposedly how do we know like hes a liar and an idiot so. also wait do they mean undergrad? how are you in med school at 20? is he a genius? girl i dont care lmao i guess i missed that but it's not like it matters so whatever

even if we ignore the stupidity of the literal acts, the grossness of the content, the absolute inability to write coherently or even remotely in a way where we would even want to see them together which is like....u set it up at the beginning so he punches "the love his life's best friend" also holy fuck im sorry remember when he punches muren because xing si got too drunk. so i'm guessing whatshisface is that good of a bartender that he makes super strong drinks and gets xing si drunk but his alcohol is magical therefore it doesn't make him sick. his alcohol is the type that gets you drunk but somehow doesnt get to your liver even though that's how we get drunk but dont ask guys he's only in med school and a bartender so i think he knows best (seriously have the main writers had a day of fun in their lives? have they ever been drunk? are they toddlers? drunk babies could probably do better tho.) i get that he was also jealous but if this kid is SOOOOOO genius (he understands social cues lmao he has the cpacity to project onto his victim so im like miss me with the not understanding shit. go to a fucking therapist like seriously did no one care abt this kid? his mother thinks he's like almost a goddamn murderer. how is she not dead? how are they all not dead? how do any of them know how to drive with this type of brain?) then he would understand that they are very clearly friends since he watched them part in a very platonic way and since he apparently knows what love is cos he thinks....he can....make someone fall in love with him bc he loves them? again, i wouldnt know hes 20 and taiwanese and im 29 and black from AMERICA so im WESTERN* so you know. different life experiences i guess XD

even if we do mental gymnastics to get it to a place where they "had sex" and he didnt rape him there's 0 ZERO ZERO ZERO ZERO ties to the literal story they wrote and the rules they set up. i'm going ot assume they dont know wtf theyre doing and i know for a fact we all care more about their dumb show than they do but it's actually startling how piss poor this is it's like idek what to compare it to. the continuity is awful awful awful they needed a script supervisor majorly and they are making bank and are going to make fucking bank fof this shit. and itll just continue like that until IRL material changes and that's facilitated by these very same groups they choose to profit off of and exploit by propelling it into the mainstream and litigating homosexuality through capitalism. and i'm being specific with homosexuality. i dont want a GL market like at all and i know why we wouldnt have it either and that has everything to do with the nature of BL, capitalism, coercion, and the fanbase being young girls and women. i don't think in this day and age we can safely say all the fans are straight; i'm sure a majority but many women or people on the gender spectrum and sexuality spectrum also consume it. frankly, it's possible the women who write it could be or something too. i dont rly believe any1 is str8 lmao but im just saying it's not out of the realm of possibility. but it isnt about that at all. that's why we wont see "good" female characters (like well written) often that's why we won't see trans women or kathoeys or fat people or black asians in it. a lot of it is is a choice we participate in whatever. but holy fuck dude u could at least respect the audience's fucking intelligence. i'm talking about everything i think that is encapsulated in the project but it's even more jarring and worse because it's so insanely inconsistent and poorly done. like how we jump from one conclusion to another is wild to me. even their first "night together" and he wakes up im like girl....u no ur ass felt it. this nigga broke into his house and was like "im gonna have u" like it's getting weird

just make xing si suffer offscreen not us the stupidity is staggering, mind blowing, hilarious.

how wong kar wai, a straight man from HK (or at least married to a woman), or barry jenkins, a striahgt black man, write/do stories well about people they wouldnt knw about their experiences directly is....well thinking like using their brains and like knowing all types of people? the man who co-wrote moonlight is a hOMOSEXUAL, leslie cheung was fucking gay or queer (and he committed suicide and that's important also RIP homie) both are hailed as queer cinema like WKW wanted to do something else and invested time into it, changed the way he played around with structure, moved away from his crime oriented stuff. he THOUGHT about it and this film is about their reality. it's a harsh film, idk how i feel about it (but my fav movies of his are the crime ones or the messy ones where it's clear he didnt write a script lmao fallen angels is one of my fav movies its' abt assassins kinda) but i know it means something. and he didnt like what HK had previously wasnt enough. it is not the only cinema that should be shown since it's such a stark reality and depressing but it is a real depiction so we can have all sorts of stuff. no this isnt WKW level or moonlight level but i know for a fact these people think they are doing something because artists always do i say this as one and someone who is equally as useless. you're making a statement.

i also hate the westerner component of peoples analyses. first of all dont do cultural relativism. we can critique and respect. but second of all how are we going to keep saying "dont put western ideals on this" when that is what is happening anyway because that's part and parcel for soft power and capitalism. how about taiwan's history with the KMT? what about the regimes young people fought about? aided by US imperialism which permeates through society and affects material conditions, views, democracy, identity and that goes into culture and media. hm? what about that? is that reality too fucking western for people? that we are doing the same thing again now? is that okay to talk about or is that only on your time?

then there's the argument that this is just entertainment. yea no shit but the thing is if we r gonna talk about marginalized groups and watch bc of marginalized groups and then be expected to identify then i dont see why i cant put this in context. even if it wasnt fucking serious we'd still judge it. but it's so pompous and again like i wouldnt say EYE think it's art but it is "art" in the literal sense and no self respecting artist would ever go "man this means nothing." of course im not sure if they do respect themselves so hey but u cant just go oh man it's entertainment when it literally rests on the fact that HOMOS are MARGINALIZED. it literally rests on the fact that WOMEN ARE OBJECTS. you either want progress or you dont. i dont understand being so demanding but not beign specific in the demands and not trying to use your brain. if you dont want to use your brain don't. but if you are looking , engaging, and keep making these arguments or telling ppl it doesnt matter whilst complaining about how much others care is hypocritical at best, willfully obtuse at worst. both bad. :)

(also all this + another thing; it is insulting to have this like wedding happen based off of this stupid relationship when people fought so hard and had to push it. now they can use the material conditions to their advantage but it's so ridiculous. also because there is difficulty still in getting married in taiwan i'm honestly like....the boldness of the writers...)

#history 4 #history 4: close to you #*dont call me western ever #a thot

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