#Je'daii

[david-talks-sw]

What are your thoughts on the je'daii? Do they even work, like I find myself irritated by the concept because people often use them to validate/prove the notion that "balance = both sides of the Force"

If you stick to what George Lucas said, in Star Wars a person being "balanced" is someone who accepts their inner darkness and resists its pull nonetheless.

When fans mention the Je'daii, it's usually in the context of:

"The Jedi downgraded from the Je'daii, limited their studies of the Force, refusing to study the Dark Side was a mistake. It was an original sin that caused them to create an imbalance within them."

Which is weird, to me, because the whole point of the comic's narrative is that:

the Je’daii Order’s way was doomed to fail.

Introduced in the Legends comic series Dawn of the Jedi (2012), the Je'daii are the predecessors of the Jedi. They are an order of Force users who studied and practiced both the Light Side and the Dark Side in hopes of finding Balance.

The reasoning is simple: everyone has a bit of good and bad in them, you learn to master the good and the bad sides inside of you, indulging them equally. But while this method seems sound on paper… it didn't work.

Consider that they’re already dabbling with the Dark Side...

... but hey, at least they’re aware of its dangers, they’re trying to be responsible about it.

There's a support system where they all warn each other when they're about to cross a line. But even then, there's many who've fallen and been exiled to a moon, to be rehabilitated.

Suddenly, circumstances compel all of them to use the Forcesaber, a weapon that only activates when you draw on the Dark Side.

And that does something to them. Over the course of a year, they all become increasingly aggressive.

Soon, a faction breaks off because they no longer want to stop using the Forcesaber. They’re addicted to the Dark Side.

A war ensues, at the end of which the Jedi Order is born, a group of Force users who:

acknowledge and accept their inner darkness,

while also striving to overcome it rather than give it power.

So that’s the moral of the whole Je’daii story.

Their idea of "Balance by wielding both" was actually so fragile and difficult to maintain that all it took was a little push for them to become vulnerable to the Dark Side's temptation.

Hell, even after the Jedi Order was established, one of its founders, Master Rajivari - who in Dawn of the Jedi (2012) is framed as a wise ex-general who, albeit strict, spends his days meditating and philosophizing - he goes to the Dark Side too! 

Because that's how the Dark Side works.

The Dark Side isn’t just "negative feelings" or a "bad guy superpower" that you can mix with a "good guy superpower" to unleash the ultimate 'Force blast'. This isn’t an anime.

The Dark Side is a drugs/smoking/drinking addiction.

It's selfish, temporary pleasure. The more you consume it...

... the more you get addicted...

... and the more it consumes you right back...

... until nothing remains.

Jon Ostrander, who wrote Dawn of the Jedi (2012), echoed this sentiment multiple times:

“As I see it, those working on the light side work with the Force, channeling it, open and sensitive to what it tells them. They serve it. Those on the dark side try to impose their will on the Force, to make it do their will, to make it serve them. The Je’daii believe in a balance between the light and the dark side and so attempt to use both. Problem is, a balance is hard to maintain and the dark side is so very seductive.” - John Ostrander, LA Times, 2012

“The Je'daii aren't light side or dark side, although they know and are aware of both. Instead they seek a balance in the Force between light and dark. Balance, however, is a difficult thing to maintain and there is always the danger of falling wholly to the dark side — and some Je'daii have done so.” - John Ostrander, Newsarama, 2012

And this is a recurring theme throughout all of Ostrander’s comics, by the way. Be it with the Je’daii, but also with Quinlan Vos or Cade Skywalker, the point remains the same: 

"Yes, wielding the Dark Side gives you great power, and you get to show off some badass new tricks...

… but it ultimately destroys you and everyone around you."

Remember: if it weren’t for Cade or Quin’s loved ones, neither of them would have come back from the Dark Side. They aren't badasses because they can use Force Lightning, they're badasses because they found the strength to give that up.

So if you genuinely think the Jedi "downgraded" by refusing to give the Dark Side more power than it already has on them... you're missing the point.

“It’s not about ripping things out of the sky using the Force or Force Lightning. A lot of people, they think “oh look how powerful Vader is, look how powerful the Emperor is, I want to play be the bad guy because I get these powers”. It’s an empty feeling, at the end of the day, after the moment. [...] The Dark Side is a spiral downward that you’re trapped in.” - Dave Filoni, “Force of Rebellion”, 2018

It was an upgrade.

Framing "balance" as "equal Dark and Light Side" is like consuming one (1) salad a day and one (1) whole bottle of vodka and calling that "balanced". No, buddy, that'll kill you. Because:

The vodka is better at being destructive than the salad is at making you healthy.

It's won't stay just one bottle per day. It'll eventually become two, three, etc.

Because as George Lucas stated time and again, resisting the Dark Side is a constant struggle.

So that's my two cents.

You've probably already heard about the recent announcement of a Dawn of the Jedi feature film, a biblical epic that will be directed by James Mangold.

And truth be told... it scares me SO much that we came THIS close to an Episode IX: Duel of the Fates that framed "balance" as - you guessed it - giving equal power to your light and darkness.

Like, how did this ⬆️ get as far as it did? Did nobody think to sit Colin Trevorrow down and explain to him that he fundamentally misunderstands how the Force works?

So all I can do is cross my fingers and hope James Mangold has a better grasp of - if not the lore (I wouldn't be surprised if the words "Je'daii" or "Tython" aren't uttered once in the film) - at least the message.

[dathomirdumpsterfire]

savage has never seen his brother smile like this before. like he's feeling... joy. excitement. not for murderous plots or yet another scheme to unsettle that smarmy, annoying little jedi. no just... just this. whatever he's feeling, it has put this look on his face. savage stares, trying to imprint the moment on his mind. eventually, he dares ask: what did these white-blue lines mean? what about them was so special? they are a map, maul explains with soft reverence, to a lost place of the sith. to a place of history. history? how strange. it was history that spoke to his brother so? he does not understand, but that hardly matters. it only matters that it has given him this singular vision of maul. of the nightbrother he was supposed to be. less... burdened. savage suggests they go see it, forget their current mission, and follow the map to the where history sleeps. his brother agrees, turning for the cockpit and stalking toward the controls. savage follows just behind him, as ever.

[rakatan]

tim lebbon, dawn of the jedi: into the void claudia gray, the high republic: into the dark

[darth-maul-of-dathomir]

Some of the temples here are old, as in 'before the nightsisters existed' and others are old, as in 'before the jedi existed'. This one, I suspect, is older still. Not so ancient as the endless empire, but perhaps from the time of the je'daii, or the Followers of Palawa.

Dathomir, it seems, has played host to many a culture over the eons. It is a fine place to hunt for mysteries. That I feel more present here than elsewhere is a... minor benefit, as well.

[moraiwings]

If the Force is the dream, you are the dreamer, and sometimes you have to wake up. Sometimes you are all you have.

Tim Lebbon, Dawn of the Jedi: Into the Void

[nightlightillustrates]

Little doodle of my OC, Aevo, with another Star Wars OC named Voh for a little contest prize where I asked people to make Star Wars OCs for a chance to be drawn with mine, over on my Discord!!

[thenightmarketofdathomir]

Wishmonger, thank you for the tales you've spun for the brothers. I don't have a question about them today, but I do have one about you: what are you? I know you're not Zabrak or human, you've given us too many clues otherwise, so I can only assume you're... something else.

Dathomir is an ancient world, and many species have called it home: the Kwa, the Rakata, the Paeceans, and humans too -- those that appeared without explanation who would leave to form the early Je'daii order on other worlds, and others more attuned to the energies here, who would later build their temples and schools, whose edifices were lost to Dathomir's jungles and swamps.

Sith and Witches, too -- those who've tried to harness the wild magic found beneath its gravethorn groves and bogs, those too young to remember the time before.

And still, there are others here too, great sentient creatures, beasts meant for war that have grown wild with the ichor, and other forgotten and abandoned creatures fashioned from Dark Side alchemy -- children left to ruin.

What am I?

Though my influence might not stretch beyond the reach of my claws, I see with many eyes, and I feel deeply in every chamber of my hearts: when Dathomir bleeds, so do I.

I have watched your little empires rise and fall for more than thirty thousand years, child.

Ask yourself, not what but whom, because this is the riddle, and perhaps you should not ask questions you truly do not wish the answer to though your heart may be pure and you hope to see with that unflinching stare of yours...

That which dwells in shadow may be beautiful too. Monstrous, yes, but everything in the dark can be lovely, even the terrors... from a certain point of view.

[tarragonblack12358]

THE FORCE

The LIVING FORCE was the energy of all life, which, in turn, fed into THE COSMIC FORCE —which bound everything together and communicated the will of the Force through each midi-chlorian.

RELIGIOUS DENOMINATION

■Jedi

Light Side of the Force -> Ashla

■Je'daii

Balance -> Bendu

■Sith

The Dark Side of the Force -> Bogan

[aspiringnexu]

Something I've never really understood is people comparing Star Trek and Star Wars. Not only because the genres are so different (sci-fi vs sci-fantasy) or the fundamental difference that is the absence of Earth entirely in the Star Wars universe (Star Trek is meant to be about a recognisable, if improbable, future, whereas Star Wars is a Space Opera a Long Time Ago and Far Far Away).

But the biggest difference I see is that the two are set in fundamentally different times.

Yes, yes, I know that's obvious. I literally just pointed out the 'Long Time Ago' bit, but bear with me.

Star Trek is set in a time where exploration is still the order of the day. The Alpha quadrant is still being explored, new species are still being discovered. The Beta and Gamma quadrants are the big new frontiers. The Delta Quadrant has one very hazily mapped squiggly line with a few gaps thanks to Voyager but even that small portion was chock full of New Things. The Galaxy is still divided and unknown with new stations and trade routes popping up all over the place.

Meanwhile Star Wars is old. Real old. By the time of the Clone Wars the Republic has gone through different eras. There was a golden age. It has come and gone already. Sure there are still the Unknown Regions but it is fairly fucking rare to come across a brand spanking new space-faring race or rival government. Coruscant as the heart of the Republic has not been outright attacked for a millennium by the time of the CW. The galaxy is such a hot mess of a melting pot that only the truly reserved and isolationist species are rare to see. Humans have been buggering about and propogating so much that now its impossible to tell where they actually all came from because Alderaan? Naboo? Corellia? All major human hubs, but you could say the same about dozens of other planets, and as far as anyone can tell, at least some of the near-human species are almost definitely genetically related to humans so there has clearly been enough time for some natural evolution after the space travel.

I just find it so interesting that people try to compare them when they are at fundamentally different stages of galactic development. Its like comparing the Wild West to the modern day. The galactic governmental structures and attitudes are so amazingly different and that is to the franchises' strengths.

Star Trek is about, at its most basic point, exploration.

Star Wars is about, again at its most basic, adventure.

Sounds similar? They are similar, but whereas in Star Trek the New Things are new, in Star Wars they're new to those characters, or at least new to the audience.

Kirk and Spock are exploring the unexplored.

Luke and Han and Leia are having adventures in an already clearly established society. They forging new paths in an already defined environment.

They're both also, coincidentally, fighting evil Space Fascists but that's just par for the course. I think something about space just Does That. The Void inspires assholes to go 'I can conquer those stars!' only for said stars to pull an uno reverse in the shape of a blond kid with little to no self-preservation skills but a knack for flying spaceships.

Something something space something something sci-fi.

TL:DR Star Wars and Star Trek are different on so many levels but the most interesting one is the fact they're represent galactic civilisation but at different stages. The 'fun, exploration, everything-is-new!' stage, and the 'established society including rampant corruption, unfortunately' stage.

I love 'em both.

[eorzeashan]

Sort of turning over thoughts in my head (and you've all seen enough of me yelling about swords lately) but even without the Inquisitor story, Eight and Talos already go way back -- before Talos ever meets the Inquisitor, Eight was often pirated from Intelligence to be Talos' bodyguard whenever he stumbled across dangerous knowledge or artifacts that would put a target on a humble archaeologist like him. they're good partners and good friends, and at first, Eight was not happy about being pulled into nonsense work for other branches, but as Talos tends to get wrapped up in situationsTM while gleefully chasing that spark of knowledge, things got rather...exciting and he found himself conscripted more and more on his expeditions (which he himself ended up liking and fostering his own fascination with the world which Talos studied). It's but one of the reasons why he expresses less derision towards Force-users compared to his other agent siblings.

This dynamic doesn't stop even when Eight is assigned to spy on Lord Zash (as my way of justifying him in the Inquisitor story) and even further beyond, where reuniting in the Alliance if the PC recruits both of them at the same time triggers a little cutscene where they happily point each other out, sort of like SCORPIO and Kaliyo.

I've also decided that whether in his own timeline of KOTFE/ET or a different Commander's, Eight's sword is one that he and Talos discovered on yet another scouting expedition to ancient ruins looking for Jedi remnants. They were too late to save the Jedi who sent the distress call from a remote planet of Je'daii ruins, and so unexpectedly ran into a trap of Zakuul Knights everywhere who had also intercepted the signal and lay in wait to try and capture the Outlander, but as Eight does, he protected both of them well enough-- but the situation was dicey enough that they had to hide in the Je'daii village.

Further discovery and Talos' nosey self revealed the site of many a Je'daii forge and one lone sword hidden under centuries of ash and dust, but Eight would note that it appeared to be unfinished, left on a whetstone all by itself. No sword guard, a misshapen piece strung together by wire above where the collar is supposed to be...it appeared the Jedi they'd come to rescue had spent all their lonely months trying to restore it. By this time, all the heavy fighting has long since snapped Eight's own vibroblade in two, so he takes it with him. It turns out to be the key to making it off-planet, as the original smith of the Je'daii sword made it as a lament to his people's descent into war and their own inability to find another way, and so left it as a gift to the future in the hopes that one day it would be used by someone unfettered by their mistakes, who walked the in-betweens and retained the strength that the smith lacked in their life. Eight's heart resonates with the force imbued into the blade, unbeknownst to him as this is, as he simply marvels at the craftsmanship and remarks that whoever made it put love and care into forging it, and decides that he'll be its custodian out of respect for the life that this one Je'daii lived. Talos urges him on to keep it and recreate the way it was used (mostly for his own anthropological studies), but also as a secret gift to his long-standing bodyguard of an agent who still walks with the soul of a warrior.

There's a lot of ruminating on the Force and the past during this little arc, and Eight is a bit starry-eyed by the thought that the Sith and the Jedi used to be one, like a confirmation to his dream of living side-by-side to both these respective cultures. He and Talos emerge from the gauntlet with a newfound appreciation for being tourists in this strange history, as well as the knowledge that someone from thousands of years prior could feel the same way you do now.

Anyways, long ramble aside, I really liked the idea that Eight's sword is still a Je'daii sword which opens his eyes to a bit of their storied past since he has little to no experience with Jedi but needs to understand them in his own way as well in order to truly live as part of their secret world. Like the red sageo cord on his belt dyed in the blood of Sith, I thought it'd be nice if he carried another's object of grief and unfulfilled wishes on his back like that.

There's something about ancient history and touching it as someone who has no relation to it that really speaks to me, and the idea of non-force users taking up their legacy is sweet, imo. Like we'll take care of you even when you're long gone. It's the kind of love that you don't really see between the Force-sensitive and Force-blind in-game.

And a sword must be used. It has no use without a wielder, even if its very existence is a question that cannot be answered on whether the world is better off without a weapon that can only be used for violence, good intentions aside. That sword was created to answer that very question, of which its blacksmith could not answer themselves and hoped for another to take up the blade in their place.

In that blade, Eight sees himself.

[azemessence]

My hands around your throat Won't leave me alone

Don't mean to break the skin I'm just sensitive

[queen-scribbles]

Me? Having fun with the ability to name outfit slots? Nooooooo

[voidendron]

the op healer (who suddenly found themself vg tanking) kitty in question 💞

they are Not Pleased to have a tank loadout now

and Even Less Pleased to have been Constantly Yeeted bc they're a tank akl;sdjkls

[serenofroses]

can't progress story on Tau and Seleni until I get the specific item unlocked with collection sales....

[jedi-enthusiast]

Vague Obi-Wan lore from Bloodshed, Crimson Clover shitpost:

-----

Obi-Wan, eyes glowing, in an empty room: *talking in some ancient language no one can understand*

Some Random Jedi: ...is that not...concerning?

Qui-Gon: Last night I caught him floating on the ceiling and chanting ritualistically. When I asked what he was doing he told me that Master Katri was teaching him an old Je'daii mantra...so I consider this an improvement.

Some Random Jedi: ...isn't she dead?

Qui-Gon: Yes, which is why I will not be asking again.

BONUS:

Dooku, who literally just wants to eat and go to bed: *walks into his Temple quarters*

Obi-Wan:

Ḩ̸̡̬̝̰̤̺̜͎̩̾͆̏̿̔̐̈́ȩ̸̨̛̫̟̟͕̲̭̻̖̘̘̀͊͂̕͜͝ͅl̴̛̞̘͙̲̪̭̟͓̳̳̟̀ĺ̶̛͎̲̩͔̋̋̎̇͐̿̏̽̍͒̍̎͝ȍ̸̱͚̮̤̩͖̰̣̔͗̾̍̏̆ ̶̡̛̠̞̝̻̖͔̜̫̈́͜M̷̧̗̜͕̘͈͙̠̜̼̔͊̎͋̓́̒ͅa̴̺̜̫̻̠̻̭̯͉̣͖̮̠͒ͅş̷̘͓͔̟͎̈́́̉t̷̩͔͓̳̠͈̩͇̖͈̯̰͛̆̄͂̓̏͝e̸̱̜̾r̴̛͍͙ ̸̛̟̞̠̺͓̙̩͒̍͝Ḋ̵̛̼̯̘̗̖͗͌̃͋̿͝o̸̢͕̜̭͎̫̙͌́̿͊̈͛ͅo̵̹̼͚̻̫͓̻̳̻̭̳̐̅̉͑͆̊͂̔k̶̡̨̳͓͎͖͉͔̟̹̪̼̣̎̈̈́̇̒̈́͌̀̀̌̿̑͘ū̶̬͎̀͒̊͑̽̀͘͝

Dooku, backing out the door: Nope...nope...not tonight...I'll room with Qui-Gon...just...hell no...

The real reason he was so ready to stab Obi-Wan in AotC

[roseaesynstylae]

A Collection of Posts about the Jedi, Part 1

I am pro-Jedi and interested in worldbuilding. Here are some a lot of posts I've found on Tumblr. Some are long, some are short, all are interesting. Hopefully you'll find them helpful, inspiring, and/or useful. There's also my collection of fics, My Favorites of Jedi Appreciation.

They're not really in any order, but they are roughly grouped by subject.

Edit: I'm just going to keep updating and organizing this with any interesting posts I find.

Here is Part Two, as Tumblr made me split it.

Jedi Defense

why the jedi couldn't walk away from the republic

Debunking more myths in the GFFA: the Jedi and the clones.

Mace Windu

before the acolyte releases

agape love

i would not want a romantic relationship if i was a jedi

the jedi did everything they could

jedi are aro

When a Star Wars writer engages with the material but not the narrative.

jedi and attachment

jedi and attachment 2

jedi and dbt

in defense of the jedi

the je'daii order

shmi skywalker adhered to the jedi code more than anakin ever did

Attachment Theory and Master Yoda - the Jedi Way to Security

The Parallels Between Antisemitism and Certain Arguments Against the Jedi

Jedi do not steal children

Some basic points to remember

Color and Jedi

Jedi as peacekeepers

Three flaws in the Jedi order you can concede

in defense of the jedi 2

The Jedi Council were reasonable in the Wrong Jedi Arc actually

The Jedi are not out of touch

An analogy

A defense of Ki-Adi-Mundi

Every instance of touch between a Jedi and another physical being

Jedi are allowed to visit their families

Jedi are allowed to leave the order

Jedi do not steal children 2

Kanan and Hera are not against the rules

Mace and his troops

Jedi do not steal children 3

Why the Council couldnt've prevented Order 66

1000 Jedi isn't a lot

The Jedi aren't corrupt & slavery isn't their fault

Padme, the Jedi and slavery

Prosset Dibs is a moron

"Jedi-Friendly" bashing of the Council is not a thing

Yes, the Jedi have flaws (everything has flaws)

Jedi and compassion (+ Ki-Adi-Mundi)

Mace Windu is a compassionate person

The Jedi aren't eugenicists (that's the Kaminoans)

Padawans are not child soldiers

Debunking the lightsaber vs bullet thing

Legends!Luke is not better than the PT Jedi

Jedi Culture

psychometry

jedi culture

martial arts

jedi-as-family

Guide to Jedi Ranking Terminology

jedi "labels"

jedi melting pot

jedi gifts

jedi healers

jedi culture 2

young jedi

jedi and taxes

jedi sects

jedi weddings

jedi robes

jedi order corps and subdivisions

jedi order bureaucratic structure

Jedi robe significations

Jedi clothing

Jedi Temple Guards

Jedi culture 3

Feelings soaking in

Jedi and teaching

Jedi are empaths

Bag of flour and the 212th

Plo Koon

Jedi debates

Jedi views on blood ties in Lucasfilm canon

Other faiths in the order

Jedi meeting their bio families

Different adoption scenarios

Jedi music

Telekinesis

Jedi healers

Jedi and emotions

Padawan attire and conduct

Jedi younglings