#Wack'd

[dumbingofage]

Hi! I have no idea if it's appropriate to ask here but I've been scouring the archive for hours and I'm going insane. I'm looking for a strip where people are talking about Mike and someone says something along the lines of "or, in an incredible power move, did he die just so we'd feel bad for what he thought of him?" Can anyone please help me find it, I'm starting to believe I made it up.

"or, in an incredible power move" definitely sounds like something from somewhere in Dumbing of Age, but I can't remember offhand a bit where Mike's death was suspected to be to make people sad about their feelings about him being a jerk. Not offhand, anyway.

This is the closest I can get!

or we can give wack'd five minutes to either find the exact quote or, in an incredible power move, make up finding the exact quote

[itswalky]

i can answer this. leslie was born in 1961

thanks wack'd

[f4liveblogarchives]

Fantastic Four Vol 1 #300

Sat Feb 5 2022 [12:22 AM] Wack'd: OKAY HERE WE GO [12:24 AM] Bocaj: Three hundred [12:24 AM] Bocaj: 🥳 [12:24 AM] Wack'd: So we open on Johnny arguing with the Daily Bugle's own Joe Robertson [12:25 AM] maxwellelvis: What's Robbie done?! [12:25 AM] Wack'd: Johnny is not very happy about being a headliner on the society pages [12:25 AM] maxwellelvis: It's not Robbie's fault you're one of the most talked-about people in the country. [12:26 AM] maxwellelvis: What's he supposed to do, pretend you're NOT more talked-about than both of the Coreys put together? [12:26 AM] Wack'd: Robbie is very calmly like "we checked our sources, so it's not libel, and you're a public figure, so it's not an invasion of privacy." [12:26 AM] Wack'd: Johnny is not having it [12:27 AM] Wack'd: Robbie offers to print a statement from Johnny who replies that "you couldn't print it in a family paper" [12:27 AM] Wack'd: It's about time Johnny got to be a jerk. Ben's been sucking up all the jerk energy as of late [12:29 AM] Bocaj: Johnny can be little a jerk [12:29 AM] Bocaj: as a treat [12:29 AM] Wack'd: Ben is pacing up and down Yancy Street. The Yancy Street Gang can't stand to see him miserable so they take Jen's approach from last issue and put a little fight in him to make him feel better [12:29 AM] Bocaj: Aw? [12:29 AM] maxwellelvis: Is this from when they traded in the porkpies for construction helmets? [12:30 AM] Wack'd: No, they still look like if the Little Rascals grew up to be West Side Story extras [12:31 AM] Wack'd: Meanwhile with the bridal party, the paparazzi start trying to hassle Alicia. Jen and Sue make quick work of them [12:31 AM] Wack'd: Jen "doesn't like men who sneak around with cameras", if you forgot that incident [12:32 AM] Wack'd: Over in Latveria Doom is planning…something involving flowers [12:33 AM] maxwellelvis: "They are gene-modded to aggravate Reed Richards' allergies. When the minister asks if there are any objections, Richards will be helpless to stop himself from sneezing, and the wedding shall be ruined! HAHAHAHAHAHA!" [12:33 AM] Wack'd: God, I hope that's it [12:33 AM] Wack'd: Over at Four Freedoms Johnny is beginning to feel a little young for marriage. Reed gives him a little pep talk [12:35 AM] maxwellelvis: Every… third or so, evil scheme from Doom should just involve him tweaking Reed in some way so he can rub his face in the fact that he can't retaliate. [12:35 AM] Wack'd: Over…somewhere…one Philip Masters isn't taking the news well [12:35 AM] Bocaj: Philip "Consistent" Masters [12:35 AM] Wack'd: He's concerned Alicia is throwing her life away [12:35 AM] maxwellelvis: "I sure hope Alicia doesn't use my own radioactive clay to force me to change my mind and bless her wedding. But what are the odds of that happening?" [12:37 AM] Wack'd: Mad Thinker (given name pending) has broken into Philip's apartment to suggest a teamup, but Philip has decided this is something he needs to deal with himself [12:37 AM] Wack'd: Wizard (that's his real name, he had it legally changed) has also broken into Philip's apartment to suggest same [12:41 AM] Wack'd: Philip feels a little put in a corner by this whole ordeal so he agrees to the teamup on two conditions: no harm comes to Alicia, and Johnny is only murdered after the ceremony so Alicia will be a widow and get Johnny's inheritance [12:41 AM] Bocaj: Good looking out [12:42 AM] Wack'd: I do love it when Philip's victims mimic his expressions

[12:42 AM] Bocaj: Angry Franklin [12:42 AM] maxwellelvis: I guess that is one advantage of drawing him looking like a human instead of a marionette. [12:45 AM] Wack'd: At the ceremony, Ben and Alicia have a talk. Ben apologizes to Alicia for dragging out the relationship when he wasn't feeling it and keeping Alicia from finding Johnny sooner [12:46 AM] Wack'd: They cry, they hug, and Philip--overhearing from his hidey hole--is outraged that the daughter he raised "could still feel anything for that ambulatory rock pile" [12:46 AM] Bocaj: You gotta let it go dude [12:46 AM] Bocaj: Or else you'll eventually have your hands crushed by the Hulk [12:48 AM] Wack'd: Thus commences the wedding of Jonathan Lowell Storm and Alicia Reiss Masters. Those sure are some names [12:48 AM] Wack'd: Since it sure seems like things are getting serious I got curious when exactly Alicia turns out to be a Skrull [12:49 AM] Wack'd: Answer: not for another five years [12:50 AM] Wack'd: At this point these two have been an item for a little over three [12:50 AM] Wack'd: Which means when this gets rolled back this will have been the status quo for eight years [12:50 AM] Wack'd: COMICS [12:50 AM] Bocaj: Comics! [12:51 AM] maxwellelvis: ARE! [12:51 AM] maxwellelvis: WEEEEEIIIIIIIIIIIRRRRRRDDDDDDD! [12:51 AM] Bocaj: Sometimes, someone gets really upset about a thing not being like when they were reading and have the power to make it everyone else's problem [12:52 AM] Wack'd: I mean I didn't love this relationship or the accompanying drama either but at a certain point you really do gotta just learn to live with it [12:53 AM] Wack'd: Anyway, Philip pulls a double-cross, using a Dragon Man puppet to attack Thinker and Wizard instead of fucking up the wedding [12:53 AM] maxwellelvis: Isn't Dragon Man a robot? [12:53 AM] Wack'd: Yes [12:53 AM] Wack'd: So what [12:53 AM] Wack'd: You can make puppets of robots [12:53 AM] maxwellelvis: Doesn't mind control require a mind to control? [12:54 AM] Wack'd: shrug It's magic, they don't have to explain it [12:54 AM] Bocaj: Sweet magicy radiation [12:54 AM] Wack'd: Wizard manages to escape but Thinker gets immolated by Dragon Man's fire breath [12:54 AM] Wack'd: It's okay though because he was secretly a Thinkbot this whole time [12:55 AM] Bocaj: Yknow, comic writers, if everything turns out to be a __bot, I might stop caring [12:55 AM] Wack'd: "Why physically enter a potentially dangerous situation when I can just as easily project my consciousness into a simulacrum?" [12:55 AM] Bocaj: Fair counter [12:56 AM] Wack'd:

[12:58 AM] Wack'd: As the reception begins, a crate arrives from Latveria to the chapel [12:58 AM] Wack'd: And it's…genuinely just flowers, and best wishes from Victor Von Doom [12:59 AM] maxwellelvis: "Best wishes and good luck to the happy couple on their wedding day, most sincerely, Victor Von Doom, Ruler of Latveria. PS: Fuck you, Richards" [12:59 AM] maxwellelvis: And there's a little cartoon of Doom giving the middle finger. [01:00 AM] Bocaj: HA [01:00 AM] Wack'd: The card reads "A truce between us for as long as these flowers bloom" [01:00 AM] maxwellelvis: If only they were perennials. [01:00 AM] Wack'd: Reed is quick to point out Doom did cut the stems [01:00 AM] Bocaj: What if you froze them [01:01 AM] Wack'd: Yeah, Reed, this is your opportunity to get Doom with stupid baby word games [01:02 AM] maxwellelvis: Reed: "No, that isn't what an Honorable Man Of Science would do" [01:02 AM] Wack'd: Honor's overrated [01:03 AM] Wack'd: Anyway, congratulations to Johnny Storm [01:03 AM] Wack'd: Enjoy 58 issues of marital Skrull bliss [01:03 AM] Wack'd: Good grief [01:04 AM] maxwellelvis: yare yare daze [01:04 AM] Bocaj: What's funny is that they keep on being married after its revealed that the relationship was based on a lie [01:05 AM] Bocaj: We'll have to see you see how it plays out but that's pretty easy going [01:05 AM] Wack'd: See I knew they stayed married [01:05 AM] Wack'd: That's why I assumed the reveal happened in proximity to the wedding [01:05 AM] Wack'd: Because the longer the deception goes on the weirder that is [01:06 AM] Bocaj: There was a Tony Stark fan comic spoofing a similar thing. He slept with Black Widow, turned out to be a Skrull, he wasn’t at all perturbed [01:08 AM] Bocaj: But that’s not a mmblemmble years marriage [01:09 AM] Wack'd: It's really not

[mousathe14]

I know the guys who made the Defenders are responsible for the abysmal Daredevil Season 2 and some of the less great parts of the latter half of Season 1, but.... They aren’t doing a bad job right now.

Like, Defenders is pretty good and the characters are served pretty well.

Like, Luke, Jessica, and Matt are written pretty much at their best in their own shows and consistently so. I have only watched the first two episodes of Iron FIst, I’ll get to the rest later today after my Defenders rewatch, but if the first two eps indicate anything they wrote him as the same idiotic self-righteous man-child as his show has so they got that right too.

And I like Matt more here than I did in DD season 2. A friend was able to articulate that without anyone to preach to, the character became substantially less intolerable. 

As my friends and I were chatting, one of them had sort of come to a realization of why Defenders went over so well and why the characters didn’t deteriorate. It seems that it might actually have to do with having decent precedent to work from. Actually it’s probably better for me to just copypaste that bit of convo than explain it. And removed some irrelevant bits. Also kept an amusing bit.

May as well see if the explanation makes sense to anyone else.

Convo credits go to mah bois @wackd with his insight, @thebibliomancer with his amusing asides, @zarekthelordofthefries for asking all the right questions, and @maxwellelvis for knowing too much.

Bocaj: I'm so jealous of Iron Fist. He has all the money and he got to hug a dragon. Life ain't fair, I tellyawhat

Bocaj: Out of spite I tried to brainstorm a setting where people get different powers by hugging different dragons but then I remembered that sans hugging, thats what Drakengard was.

Wack’d: But yeah what I was gonna say the smart thing the show does is, like

Bocaj: It sure could have used some hugging

Wack’d:  Jessica and Luke both get really standard storylines that could easily be season arcs in their own shows

Except it turns out the Hand is behind them, which brings them into Matt and Danny's nonsense

Zarek: So the way it resolves the different styles is basically making the mundane stuff caused by the magic stuff?

Wack’d: Yeah

In this one specific instance, at least--there's no, like, "Kilgrave was secretly part of the Hand this whole time!" or whatever

Bocaj: phew

Wack’d: But yeah I think, like

Maybe the Daredevil showrunners are just shit because the show they were given to run was Daredevil?

They are pretty good at crafting good stuff out of Jessica Jones and Luke Cage material

Zarek: In the sense that Daredevil inherently doesn't work, or it just doesn't work with their style as creators?

Like, "did the best with what they could" or "just aren't good with this playset"

Wack’d: If I had to hazard a guess--Marco Ramirez and Doug Petrie are in the same position with the other three characters that they were when they came on board with Daredevil in season 2

Maxwellelvis: I'm going to say it's probably partially because the specific Daredevil stuff they chose to focus on for a lot of this, namely Stick, and Elektra, and the Hand, no longer work because it's no longer 1983, ninjas are old hat now and this story isn't innovative or groundbreaking anymore.

Wack’d: "Figure out what made this character tick last time and hew as close to that as possible"

The problem is Daredevil season 1 didn't have much of an identity? In the first half we get a kind of dark drama under Drew Goddard's pen, and then it slowly switches to melodrama and camp when Steven S. DeKnight shows up

Wack’d: So Ramirez and Petrie have to synthesize those two approaches while also introducing a ton of new characters and ALSO setting up another series two years from now

Zarek: Steven S. DeKnight is a hell of a superhero name

Wack’d: Which is, like--I don't think I recognized what a tall fucking order that is

Bocaj: Was Daredevil 2 the Iron Man 2 of Netflix too?

Wack’d: Kinda, yeah!

Zarek: Oh shit is Iron Man 2 still on Netflix i still havent seen it

Bocaj: This has been a victory for sentences that i said mostly because I liked the way they sounded

Wack’d: I mean I think, like--the reason I didn't recognize it because I didn't expect it to do as much heavy lifting as it ended up having to

Maxwellelvis: Is the Punisher the Black Widow of Netflix Marvel?

Bocaj: They did have a teamup movie

Wack’d: But yeah in hindsight this makes a lot of sense

Maxwellelvis: They team up a lot, Bocaj.

Bocaj: Avengers Confidential: Punisher & Black Widow:: The Other Avengers Are In It For Five Seconds

Maxwellelvis: I'd assume it's because Nat is like the only other superhero who is perfectly A-ok with murder.

Bocaj: Wolverine and Hawkeye are under Bendis

BENDIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIS

Wack’d: And so this time Ramirez and Petrie have it easy--they know what a good Jessica Jones story looks like, they know what a good Luke Cage story looks like, they had an entire season to figure out what they had to do with Daredevil

[alephnull47]

new banner image thanks to @wackd

[thedoctorwhowiki]

People assume that time is a strict progression of cause to effect, but *actually* from a non-linear, non-subjective viewpoint - it's more like a big ball of wibbly wobbly... time-y wimey... stuff.

[bowsersrighthandwoman]

How do you tell your highly religious mom who used to force you to church, force you to participate, tried to force you to go to church school, and straight up wack'd you if you complained about it because 'God is the reason we are alive' that you are not really a religious person.

[zarekthelordofthefries]

Your Fave is Problematic: They Might Be Giants

1. They sing "a atom bomb" rather than "an atom bomb" in "I've Got A Fang."

2.

[brightcoat]

wackd asked:

☁Much human ingenuity has gone into finding the ultimate Before. The current state of knowledge can be summarized thus: In the beginning, there was nothing, which exploded. Other theories about the ultimate start involve gods creating the universe out of the ribs, entrails and testicles of their father. There are quite a lot of these. They are interesting, not for what they tell you about cosmology, but for what they say about people. Hey kids, which part do you think they made YOUR town out of?

Oooh, I love me some Pratchett!

[itswalky]

You have a big cast, and in DoA especially, revelations have been a thing at various times. Is it ever difficult to keep track of who knows who/who knows what? I am reminded of one webcomic writer needing to consult his fan wiki or having to hastily have a character rationalize forgetting certain things. (Not dunking on them, that's probably an easy mistake to make.)

I'm mostly pretty good on this! Sometimes I'll search character tags to see if characters have met yet. I remember being surprised to learn that, eight years in, Sal hadn't met Joe. Recently I went to see if Lucy had ever met Jacob, but their only strip pairing involved Joyce daydreaming Jacob while Lucy was present. Stuff like that.

If I'm pressed, usually I can just ask Wack'd.

[f4liveblogarchives]

Fantastic Four Vol 1 #299

Fri Feb 4 2022 [11:31 PM] Wack'd: We open on typical Johnny/Ben prank war nonsense [11:31 PM] Bocaj: Ben must be feeling better? [11:31 PM] Wack'd: Except Johnny didn't do a prank [11:32 PM] Wack'd: He said something innocuous that Ben took as a joke at his expense [11:32 PM] Bocaj: Sooooo no [11:32 PM] Umbramatic: oh no [11:32 PM] Wack'd: We do not find out what it was just yet but the issue's called "The Best Man" so I can hazard a guess [11:33 PM] Wack'd: Ben storms out of 4 Freedoms, shoving his way through the media folks there for the grand opening, including Peter Parker, who somehow manages to move fast enough to avoid Ben's wrath [11:33 PM] Wack'd: Dunno how that Parker kid does it [11:33 PM] Umbramatic: holy shit [11:34 PM] Wack'd: Yeah Johnny sheepishly admits he asked Ben to be the best man because he thought Ben was cooling off [11:34 PM] Wack'd: Jen calls him a moron and then goes after Ben [11:35 PM] maxwellelvis: Where's that facepalm GIF? [11:36 PM] Wack'd: HEY BOCAJ THAT THING YOU KEEP MENTIONING GOT RETCONNED [11:36 PM] Bocaj: Alicia's appearance? [11:36 PM] Bocaj: And similarity to Sue? [11:36 PM] Wack'd: Ben flashes back to his first time meeting Alicia and mentions that she only looked like Sue through the magic of makeup [11:36 PM] Bocaj: Thank goodness for the magic of retroactive continuity [11:37 PM] Wack'd: Ben does mention that he felt like he was taking advantage of Alicia because of the age gap Roger Stern nooooo whyyyyyy [11:37 PM] Bocaj: Siiiiigh [11:38 PM] maxwellelvis: Boy, can you tell this comic is written by Boomers, or can you? [11:38 PM] Wack'd: Jen pulls Ben out of the bar he's sulking in and offers to take him to a different, better bar [11:39 PM] Wack'd: This feels remarkably post-9/11 for something published in 1987. What war were we in then I wonder

[11:40 PM] Umbramatic: …huh [11:41 PM] Wack'd: Johnny leaves the stage early to find Ben. And who does he run into but his old pal Spider-Man! Fancy seeing him here [11:43 PM] maxwellelvis: In 1987? That'd be the Iran-Contra Scandal. [11:44 PM] Wack'd: Ooof [11:44 PM] Wack'd: Johnny and Spidey stop on a roof and Johnny explains the series of decisions that led him here. Spidey calls him a moron and is also just plain surprised he's getting married [11:44 PM] maxwellelvis: Plus the continued CIA actions in Nicaragua and Angola [11:44 PM] Bocaj: "You're getting married? But you haven't even proposed to me, you goof" [11:45 PM] Wack'd: Johnny says he wants a small private wedding and not to let the word out but unfortunately they are like three feet away from an open window and a real snoopy resident who immediately calls the Daily Bugle tipline [11:48 PM] Wack'd: Back with Jen and Ben, Ben keeps recapping his and Alicia's relationship, saying that he felt like since he was afraid to marry her they were stuck in a rut [11:48 PM] Wack'd: And also he had intended to break things off with her when he returned to Earth! Which is true and just makes his whole sorted ordeal even more petty [11:48 PM] maxwellelvis: Ben, honey, you've not seen anything yet, talking of ruts. [11:49 PM] Wack'd: Jen: "Let me get this straight…you decided to quit the F.F. because Alicia broke up with you…before you could break up with her?" [11:49 PM] Wack'd: Jen is right! This is stupid! [11:50 PM] maxwellelvis: "I may not be able to practice law in this state, but it doesn't take a lawyer to see that that's pretty fuckin' dumb, Blue-Eyes." [11:51 PM] Wack'd: Anyway, Ben starts getting real deep into the monstrous self-loathing, saying he has it worse even than Bruce Banner [11:51 PM] Wack'd: And that cheeses Jen right off [11:52 PM] Wack'd: Fight fight fight [11:52 PM] Wack'd: The rumble takes them through a demolition zone. The workers there are thrilled their job is being done for them and start taking bets on the outcome [11:52 PM] maxwellelvis: I'm glad Jen's sticking up for her cousin here, at least. [11:53 PM] Wack'd: Anyway the rumble cheers Ben right up, and it turns out Jen orchestrated this whole thing, right down to picking a bar near a demolition zone [11:54 PM] maxwellelvis: "No need to apologize to us, ma'am! You saved us a day's work AND I made a mint on the side!" [11:55 PM] Wack'd: A happy ending all around (until next time which will not be happy I don't think)

[11:57 PM] maxwellelvis: What happened to She-Hulk's gloves, and why are her boots red?

[mousathe14]

So I saw @wackd, @ahr42p, and @mukkora today.

Pics because it did happen.

The first two pics were from us trying to take a picture inside but discovered that the camera was racist.

The fourth pic had me try to strike a different pose but I was caught mid-movement

[tvtropesdoctorwho]

Day Eighteen (June 16, 2014)

The complete text of this session, unabridged, can be found here.

The Plot The companions decide to go investigate a different range of caves.

You can read the story starting from this session here.

The Map See here.

During the Week Due to Wack'd's dad's birthday and Father's Day both falling on Sunday, the game is moved to Monday at 3:45. As a consequence, SF cannot make it and AHR is a firm maybe.

Hour One (3:46PM – 5:00PM) Bocaj, unnoun, and Wack'd arrive. unnoun elaborates on her evening plans. TParadox arrives, and Mukora joins the group from Spain. TParadox posts a Spider-Man meme prompting a discussion of which characters assorted players are.

nomuru2d arrives. unnoun discusses writing the story sections with Wack'd. It's debated whether to wait on AHR, and a long period of indecisiveness ends when she contacts Wack'd via Facebook to inform her she'll be unavailable.

The game begins and is quickly derailed by an argument over whether Morningites have fur before resuming.

Hour Two (5:00PM – 6:00PM) The game continues slowly. Gurgle's name is discussed. Bocaj leaves for dinner. nomuru2d leaves to cut the grass.

Hour Three (6:00PM – 7:00PM) Wack'd goes to get dinner, and returns, as do Bocaj and nomuru2d. TParadox leaves. unnoun leaves for dinner.

Hour Four (7:00PM – 8:00PM) TParadox returns.

Hour Five (8:00PM – 9:00PM) unnoun continues to be gone, and this is speculated upon. Spider-Man comics are discussed. Big day for Spider-Man. For actual roleplaying, not so much.

Hour Six (9:00PM – 10:26PM) Spider-Man discussion continues, and discussion of the new Godzilla picks up. Mukora goes to get dinner, and unnoun returns. Wack'd begins teasing a system for increasing roleplaying productivity. 

Mukora returns, and The True Meaning of Smekday and it's impending adaptation. Wack'd reveals his system, which is to call people's names at random every so often and require them to post when he does so.

It's decided it's too late to continue. Everybody leaves.

10:26PM

[f4liveblogarchives]

Fantastic Four Vol 1 #298

Fri Feb 4 2022 [11:14 PM] Wack'd: Ben, join a dating service, jeez

[11:16 PM] Wack'd: So it turns out when Reed did the thing that turned the two warlord brother guys who were fucking with our sun into one guy he reversed the suction of things out of our sun to a suction of things into out sun and that's how big muscle warlord fusion dude got here [11:17 PM] Wack'd: Reed figures since this is his fault he should go fix it [11:17 PM] Wack'd: Fight fight fight [11:18 PM] Wack'd: Beefy dude has the power to absorb heat so that's Johnny done and dusted [11:18 PM] Umbramatic: oof [11:18 PM] Bocaj: Type advantages [11:19 PM] Wack'd: Ben manages to fight him to a pulp and then tries to keep kicking him because he's got some anger issues to work out, but Jen pulls him back [11:21 PM] Wack'd: Through big dude's ramblings Reed works out what happened to him and decides to split him back into two smaller, more easily managed guys and then send them back from wence they came [11:22 PM] maxwellelvis: "We don't have a 'wence we came', YOU threw it into your Sun!" [11:22 PM] Wack'd: These guys don't care [11:22 PM] Wack'd: They just wanna stop being in one body so they can pummel each other [11:22 PM] Wack'd: Everything else is whatever [11:22 PM] Bocaj: Single track mind [11:22 PM] Umbramatic: inside you there are two guys [11:23 PM] maxwellelvis: I'm just saying, if it were me, I'd make my highest priority turning Reed into my new bop bag. [11:23 PM] Wack'd: Seriously though

[11:23 PM] Bocaj: Umbra, geez! [11:23 PM] maxwellelvis: Yeah, Umbra! [11:24 PM] Umbramatic: listen i will stop when I damn want to [11:24 PM] maxwellelvis: What are these guys fighting over, anyway? Who looks more like a Double Dragon character? [11:25 PM] Wack'd: They just hate each other [11:26 PM] maxwellelvis: Did Jaagur steal Umbra's lunch when they were boys? Did Umbra never let Jaagur be the racecar when they played Space Monopoly? [11:26 PM] maxwellelvis: "But I have to be the racecar! It's a Jaaaaaag!" [11:26 PM] Umbramatic: i would never [11:26 PM] Wack'd: So these two beating on each other while unmerging is causing a science thing. Johnny tries to stop it but gets caught in the science thing [11:27 PM] maxwellelvis: *facepalm* [11:27 PM] maxwellelvis: Can't leave him alone for two seconds [11:27 PM] Wack'd: Ben momentarily considers letting Johnny die and then realizes that they're brothers, and brothers don't let brothers die [11:27 PM] Wack'd: You see? It was a metaphor!

[11:28 PM] Wack'd: Not a bad story idea in theory but man, Umbra and Jaagar needed intros that didn't immediately cause me to roll my eyes at boring cosmic shit and also maybe be, uh, interesting on their own merits [11:28 PM] maxwellelvis: Maybe if Jaagur kept the Tick cosplay

[f4liveblogarchives]

Fantastic Four Vol 1 #297

Fri Feb 4 2022 [10:41 PM] Wack'd: "I'm gonna live among the stars with the rest of the uggos in a perfect uggo space society and--hey! Which one of you jokers slipped me last month's script?"

[10:42 PM] maxwellelvis: "Yuk it up, Bic-head!" [10:42 PM] Wack'd: We start with space opera bullshit, on a distant outpost around a red dwarf, with lots of characters whose names I will have to learn [10:43 PM] Wack'd: At least one of those names will be easy to remember

[10:43 PM] maxwellelvis: Umbra, what are YOU doing here?! [10:44 PM] Umbramatic: oh hey it's me [10:45 PM] maxwellelvis: Doesn't that guy in the back look like the Tick? [10:45 PM] Wack'd: deep breath [10:46 PM] Wack'd: Okay, so Umbra wants to summon his Jaagur to war. Damos is concerned about the preparedness of their forces. Umbra is okay if loads of people die. A third guy brags about being important and then Damos kills him to make a point [10:46 PM] Wack'd: Umbra is using something to sap power from the sun that will help him somehow [10:46 PM] Wack'd: Everyone got this? [10:47 PM] maxwellelvis: Can you "drain" the power from a fusion reaction? [10:47 PM] Wack'd: Fuck if I care [10:48 PM] Wack'd: Meanwhile. the Four are hanging out at a military base in the South Pacific, and Jen, Wyatt, and Franklin have just arrived by hypersonic rocket. [10:49 PM] Wack'd: Alicia is also here [10:50 PM] Wack'd: Reed tries to explain the plot but Jen is like "fuck that, how's Ben doing" [10:51 PM] Wack'd: Answer: not great

[10:52 PM] maxwellelvis: Are we getting into Angry Pinecone Ben territory? [10:52 PM] Wack'd: That's later, I think [10:52 PM] Bocaj: Angry bucket Ben [10:53 PM] Wack'd: So uh, whatever those space guys are doing is fucking up Earth's sun, somehow, so now...it's Daylight Savings Time. [10:54 PM] maxwellelvis: I'm pretty sure you can't do that with a fusion reactor, which is what the Sun is. [10:55 PM] Wack'd: So Johnny is worried they might not come back from this one because it's a rush job and the equipment and something something. Weird how when Reed rushes an invention its fine but when the government does it its a death trap [10:56 PM] Bocaj: Reed's success rate is slightly better [10:56 PM] Wack'd: Johnny asks Alicia to marry him when he gets back, blissfully unaware Ben is sulking nearby [10:56 PM] Umbramatic: oh noooooooo [10:56 PM] Wack'd: Oh. Reed did build this rocket. Just on government land. Got it [10:57 PM] Wack'd: (The reason they're at a South Pacific base is that after last issue the government happened to find them in the ocean and then immediately went "hey solve this sun thing for us") [10:58 PM] Bocaj: I'm sure that this will be fiiiiine [10:58 PM] Bocaj: The first time he built a rocket on government land worked out [10:58 PM] maxwellelvis: I think they've got the wrong comic book character for this: You want the Scarecrow for this; he's done it before. [10:58 PM] Wack'd: Hahahahahahaha. Okay!

[10:58 PM] Bocaj: Uh [10:59 PM] Wack'd: This is a very silly solution which makes me happy, but also one of my favorite running gags is Johnny being rendered useless whenever they're in the vacuum of space [10:59 PM] Wack'd: So I'm also sad [10:59 PM] Bocaj: I mean I'm perfectly fine with ye comic science handwaves but this still breaks my brain [10:59 PM] maxwellelvis: I've seen a lot of wonky science in this book before, but it's a new one for me. [10:59 PM] Bocaj: I guess it can produce infinite oxygen [10:59 PM] Wack'd: How is the fire getting out?! [10:59 PM] Bocaj: Unstable molecules? [10:59 PM] maxwellelvis: How long can he operate like this before Johnny starts going "AAAAAAAAAHHHHHH!!!! THE PLASTIC IS MELTING INTO MY SKIN!!!!"? [11:00 PM] Wack'd: It's not plastic, it's ATMO-WEB! New, from Kenner! [11:01 PM] maxwellelvis: All I can think of is Tom Hanks on Celebrity Jeopardy! [11:01 PM] Wack'd: Brief cutaway to war happening and Umbra and Jaagur fighting each other [11:02 PM] maxwellelvis: Wouldn't it be great if by the time the FF get to where this is going on, both these guys are dead and their armies in no condition to fight? [11:02 PM] Wack'd: It would [11:02 PM] Wack'd: So back with our heroes…Ben…uh…. [11:02 PM] Wack'd: He is going to kill himself for real this time [11:02 PM] Wack'd: By drifting into the vacuum of space [11:03 PM] Wack'd: Because Johnny is marrying Alicia [11:03 PM] Wack'd: Johnny goes out to save him but Ben thinks he's only doing it because he feels guilty [11:04 PM] Bocaj: Geez [11:04 PM] Wack'd: Johnny nearly exhausts his supply of oxygen getting Ben back to the rocket [11:05 PM] Wack'd: And then Reed does the thing to the sun. Reigniting the sun makes the two warring factions, uh…

[11:05 PM] Wack'd: Man I dunno [11:06 PM] Wack'd: They died as they lived, with me not giving a single solitary shit [11:06 PM] Bocaj: HA [11:06 PM] maxwellelvis: So, Reed just committed a xenocide. [11:06 PM] Wack'd: What? No! What? Go back to being dead!

[11:07 PM] Bocaj: That sure is a design [11:07 PM] maxwellelvis: And the two leaders are going to kick his ass for fusing them into one being. [11:07 PM] Wack'd: I mean what's weird is they don't know who the Four are [11:07 PM] Wack'd: And the Four don't know they even exist [11:08 PM] Wack'd: So there'd be some weird logical leaps to make that happen [11:08 PM] Wack'd: But I guess it's happening! [11:08 PM] maxwellelvis: They just know that that ship is where the vortex came from, it seems. [11:08 PM] Wack'd: Noooooo the Four just knew something weird was happening to the sun [11:08 PM] maxwellelvis: No, I mean this new fusion guy. [11:09 PM] Wack'd: And had no idea it was because on the other sun of the galaxy some other guys were doing something to another sun [11:09 PM] Wack'd: And vice versa [11:12 PM] maxwellelvis: Like, yeah, these two guys were dicks for stealing our Sun, but Reed didn't have to destroy their whole planet for that. [11:12 PM] Wack'd: Reed didn't know! And also they were violent, petty warlords [11:13 PM] maxwellelvis: Yeah, but I'm pretty sure their armies didn't deserve to be turned into star fuel [11:13 PM] Wack'd: True [11:13 PM] Wack'd: I'll give you that

[f4liveblogarchives]

Fantastic Four Vol 1 #296

Fri Feb 4 2022 [08:41 PM] Umbramatic: that's a lotta pencils [08:41 PM] Wack'd: It's the 25th anniversary issue and they've celebrated by inviting everyone [08:41 PM] maxwellelvis: The fuck was goin' on over there-- ah [08:41 PM] Umbramatic: ooooh [08:41 PM] Wack'd: Before we get to plot stuff, have some commemorative essays [08:44 PM] Wack'd: Stan Lee: "Who amongus has not nurtured a secret desire to see Reed Richards stretch further than he's able? Who has not been tempted to shout 'it's clobberin' time!' when no one's looking? Who wouldn't love to have a fire extinguisher near at haand the next time Johnny Storm shouts 'flame on'? And what red-blooded American youth hasn't wished that he had met the stunning Invisible Girl before ol' Stretcho latched onto her?" [08:44 PM] Wack'd: sigh Never change, Stan [08:45 PM] Wack'd: Stan also requests that if you like the issue, praise him, and if you don't, blame Jim Shooter [08:45 PM] Wack'd: I don't think anyone has ever needed permission to blame Jim Shooter [08:47 PM] Bocaj: It’s easy and productive, as long as you don’t do it in person. Man is an actual giant [08:47 PM] maxwellelvis: "Hey, aren't you the guy who sank Ultra Comics and Malibu Comics?" "FE FI FO FUM!" [08:49 PM] Wack'd: And now, Jim Shooter's considerably shorter essay [08:49 PM] Wack'd: Mostly just about how he loves Marvel and Stan and how this issue made him realize what a great responsibility he has as editor in chief [08:49 PM] Wack'd: And now: comics! [08:50 PM] Wack'd: We open with Ben Grimm sullenly walking through the rain. In the middle of the road [08:51 PM] Wack'd: A car hits him [08:51 PM] Umbramatic: that poor car [08:51 PM] Wack'd: Indeed [08:52 PM] Wack'd: The driver steps out to berate Ben but Ben is in no mood. The driver is frightened. Ben tells him to leave but the guy can't drive away, the fender is crammed into the wheels. So Ben pulls the fencer off [08:53 PM] Wack'd: I do want to emphasize this is all…surprisingly quiet and understated? It's a funny situation but Ben isn't, like, quipping or loudly angry [08:53 PM] Wack'd: He's extremely terse [08:54 PM] Wack'd: Not really what I was expecting from a Stan Lee script at all

[08:55 PM] Wack'd: We go through the origin again. I won't bore you. I recognize enough issue #1 stuff to know that this isn't, like, a huge retcon or anything [08:56 PM] Bocaj: Did they all put their hands in the middle? [08:56 PM] Wack'd: Yeah, and Ben does "I'm what Susan called me--the Thing!" and Reed says "And I'll call myself--Mr. Fantastic!" [08:56 PM] Bocaj: That’s what I’m here for [08:57 PM] maxwellelvis: What we all came here for [08:57 PM] Wack'd: Ben mopes a bit about how he'll always be a monster [08:57 PM] Wack'd: And then, in a cutaway to later, charters a plane to deposit him on Monster Island, which he reckons is where he belongs [08:58 PM] Wack'd: When I say deposit I mean he literally jumps out into the middle of the ocean while the pilot begs him not to because he has so much to live for, so until that coastline comes into view it kiiiiiinda plays like Ben's killing himself???? [08:58 PM] Umbramatic: oh geez [08:59 PM] Wack'd: What the absolute fuck happened to Stan Lee between 1971 and 1986 [08:59 PM] Bocaj: That may have coincided with one of the times he went out to Hollywood and lost a significant chunk of everything [09:00 PM] Wack'd: Meanwhile, in Los Angeles, Reed fires the 4 signal flare! Buy a beeper, Reed, gosh [09:01 PM] maxwellelvis: --- "Big" Bob Pataki [09:01 PM] Wack'd: Sue is about to give a speech at a charity fundraiser when she spots the flare, and declares to the crowd "I'll keep my message short and sweet: give til it hurts!" before turning invisible and rushing off [09:02 PM] Wack'd: Johnny and Alicia are at an auto show. The whole gang's in LA looking for Ben, but Johnny admits he's procrastinating because he feels guilty about Alicia [09:03 PM] Wack'd: Also Alicia tells Johnny that she "loves hearing you describe the autos," which is hilariously clunky [09:04 PM] Wack'd: Johnny and Sue arrive at…I guess Reed has rented a hotel room? But it's pretty spacious and he's cluttered it up with science junk [09:04 PM] Wack'd: See, Reed's tracked down Ben's pilot friend, who tells them about Ben's self-exile [09:05 PM] Wack'd: The pilot angrily tells them that it's all their fault he's exiled himself since they never sympathized with his plight and rubbed their good fortune in his face, and the best thing they can do is stay far away from Ben [09:06 PM] Umbramatic: i [09:06 PM] Bocaj: And then it was a short issue [09:06 PM] Wack'd: You joke but we get another timeskip and the entire gang has returned to New York [09:06 PM] Bocaj: … [09:06 PM] Bocaj: Welp [09:07 PM] Umbramatic: o h [09:09 PM] Wack'd: Hey, its our first real good look at 4 Freedoms

[09:09 PM] Umbramatic: that sure is a 4 [09:11 PM] Bocaj: I want a cutaway [09:11 PM] Wack'd: So do I [09:11 PM] Bocaj: What secrets does that 4 hold [09:10 PM] Wack'd: Inside, Jen and Wyatt are exercising and talking about how the original Four are so tight knit, and as a result won't let them in on what that old pilot said or what they're feeling right now. Wyatt wishes he could help, while Jen says she "loves them and respects them" for that bond [09:12 PM] Wack'd: Wyatt tries to segue from talking about the Four's familial love to his feelings for Jen, but Jen cuts him off [09:12 PM] Wack'd: "Hey! I thought heap big injun chiefs were men of few words." *siiiiiiiigh* [09:12 PM] Bocaj: Goddammit Jen [09:12 PM] Umbramatic: yikes! [09:13 PM] Bocaj: You’re a sex pest, you’re a racist. I don’t like these sides of you [09:13 PM] Bocaj: Speed run to being your best funny meme self pls [09:14 PM] Wack'd: She did get a funny meme moment earlier but it was immediately after the pilot bummed everyone out so it didn't land

[09:14 PM] Bocaj: Ha [09:15 PM] Wack'd: Johnny is off trying to break out of his own sulking by busting up a bank robbery, but it's too easy and he's immediately back to self-recrimination over how he's treated Ben [09:17 PM] Wack'd: Hi Franklin! It's been a hot second, huh? But now that the audience has been reassured you haven't been forgotten, it's time for you to go away again. Bye Franklin!

[09:18 PM] Umbramatic: -yeets the child out of the narrative- [09:18 PM] maxwellelvis: Why does Franklin look like a blond Alfred E. Newman? [09:18 PM] Wack'd: Blame whoever this page's artist is, I guess [09:20 PM] Bocaj: So that’s what the power pack powerpod power cast means when they talk about Sue and Reed neglecting Franklin so much that the power pack book absorbed him [09:18 PM] Wack'd: Sue I don't see how this is different from Reed's usual behavior

[09:20 PM] Wack'd: So Reed says if he'd only remembered this week was the anniversary of the rocket crash, he might've known to look for Ben at the crash site, and could've talked Ben out of exiling himself [09:21 PM] Bocaj: Ben: “That’s the last time he fergets our anniversary” [09:21 PM] Wack'd: And Sue comes to an absolutely bonkers conclusion [09:22 PM] Wack'd: See, Ben knew when he'd mope about being the Thing, it ate Reed up inside emotionally. Therefore Ben wanted Reed to suffer [09:22 PM] Wack'd: And the only thing to do is stop begging for Ben to come back every time he runs off and cut ties for good [09:22 PM] Umbramatic: wha [09:22 PM] Umbramatic: I DON'T [09:23 PM] Wack'd: It's some hot nonsense, yeah [09:24 PM] Wack'd: Sue's little speech somehow strengthens Reed's resolve to go to Monster Island and talk things out with Ben [09:24 PM] Wack'd: Johnny wants to come to because guilt [09:24 PM] Wack'd: And Sue wants to come because…???? [09:25 PM] Bocaj: It seems like everyone is taking the opposite conclusions and double negativing themselves into maybe good decisions? [09:25 PM] Umbramatic: as one does??? [09:25 PM] Wack'd: The dialogue may be more modern but here is the firm grasp on human behavior we all know Stan Lee for [09:26 PM] Wack'd: And so Reed, Sue, and Johnny take off without Jen, Wyatt, and Alicia [09:26 PM] Wack'd: Jen and Wyatt are cool with it [09:26 PM] Wack'd: Alicia is pissed [09:27 PM] Wack'd: Turns out she maybe has some stake in this??? Whoda thunk [09:28 PM] Wack'd: Reed, Sue, and Johnny arrive on Monster Island and are immediately beset upon by monsters [09:28 PM] Wack'd: Fight fight fight [09:28 PM] Bocaj: They should have used the Repel [09:28 PM] Bocaj: Only way to not be bothered by monsters pocket or otherwise while walking around [09:29 PM] maxwellelvis: Are you going to show us how these monsters have evolved since the Kirby days? [09:29 PM] maxwellelvis: Or are these all new monsters? [09:29 PM] Umbramatic: oh i love pokemon legends arceus [09:29 PM] Wack'd: They're all pretty boring looking honestly. Just buff dudes with slightly weird heads and off-spec colors [09:30 PM] Umbramatic: ah, machokes [09:30 PM] maxwellelvis: Where's Giganto? [09:30 PM] Wack'd: Not present [09:30 PM] Wack'd: Sue gets damseled immediately and needs Reed to explain to her how to use her powers to get out of trouble because of course [09:30 PM] Bocaj: Ffffffff [09:30 PM] Wack'd: NEVER CHANGE, STAN [09:30 PM] maxwellelvis: How can you go to Monster Island without Giganto? [09:30 PM] Wack'd: shrug [09:31 PM] maxwellelvis: He's just as iconic as the rest of these characters, he was on the cover of that first issue, not Mole Man or Dr. Doom [09:31 PM] Wack'd: This fight goes on for a while [09:32 PM] Wack'd: I think the monsters are deliberately vague to keep the dozen-odd pencilers and inkers and colorers from tripping over each other [09:32 PM] Bocaj: Nothing like action scenes to fill out the runtime [09:33 PM] Wack'd: Trumpy, you can do sonic things!

[09:34 PM] Wack'd: Anyway Reed, Sue, and Johnny are overwhelmed through sheer numbers, and taken to see:

[09:35 PM] maxwellelvis: Why did he steal Mole Man's glasses, tho? [09:35 PM] Wack'd: So he can keep track of visions in his eyes [09:35 PM] Umbramatic: oh no [09:36 PM] Bocaj: Somehow this look works for Ben [09:36 PM] Bocaj: I can't credit it [09:37 PM] Wack'd: Ben explains that he's not here because he still blames Reed. Or because he's angry about Johnny or Alicia. He's over all that now [09:37 PM] Wack'd: He's simply decided that he can't make it in the normal world anymore and he needs to be somewhere where no one looks at him funny or thinks he's a freak [09:38 PM] maxwellelvis: So go to (insert city with a reputation for lots of subculture folks in it), Ben [09:38 PM] Bocaj: That's sad [09:38 PM] maxwellelvis: Ah, this must still be before the superhero wrestling thing got started. [09:41 PM] Wack'd: It turns out Ben is Mole Man's heir apparent, as Harvey Elder is dying and needs a successor. Harvey is startled to see the the Richard/Storms here but Ben convinces him it's all cool and puts them up in a room for the night [09:42 PM] Bocaj:

"One day, Ben, all this will be yours" "What, the caverns?" "Yes. Everything the sun doesn't touches will be your kingdom"

[09:44 PM] Wack'd: Please enjoy this butler Moloid

[09:44 PM] Bocaj: I do [09:44 PM] maxwellelvis: What do you suppose it sounds like when Moloids talk? [09:45 PM] Wack'd: And this one-of-a-kind Monster Island monogrammed drinkware set

[09:45 PM] Bocaj: Amazing [09:45 PM] Bocaj: This is a great situation Ben lucked himself into inheriting [09:45 PM] Bocaj: Don't screw this up for him, Reed [09:46 PM] Wack'd: Johnny is worried Ben might be mind controlled and Sue is worried he's throwing his life away, so Ben takes them on a tour of the joint to convince them he's not only a king, but the king of a place worth living in [09:47 PM] Wack'd: Remember forever ago when Mole Man abducted ugly people so he could build an underground utopia? And then less forever ago when it turned out a Disney knockoff destroyed it trying to reheat the center of the Earth? Well Harvey's done some rebuilding

[09:48 PM] Bocaj: I don't know how to feel about this Uglytopia [09:48 PM] Bocaj: Or I guess about the people that are being highlighted specifically as too ugly to make it in 'normal society' [09:48 PM] maxwellelvis: Why's he got the cast of Spitting Image in here? [09:49 PM] Wack'd: There's some weird ethnostate, mass separatism vibes here, yeah [09:49 PM] Umbramatic: yeesh [09:49 PM] Wack'd: Krakoa but for uggos [09:49 PM] Bocaj: oh my god [09:50 PM] maxwellelvis: Guarantee if this comic were written today, "safe space" would be thrown into the dialogue here. [09:51 PM] Bocaj: oh my god [09:51 PM] Wack'd: So the "best part" turns out to be that Harvey has a giant machine working on terraforming a new continent in the middle of the Pacific so this new society can happen above ground [09:52 PM] Wack'd: Reed is skeptical and thinks maybe Harvey is making a weapon instead but Ben shrugs him off [09:52 PM] Umbramatic: but think of the currents! [09:52 PM] Wack'd: *shrug* [09:53 PM] Wack'd: Harvey is worried about telling the Storm/Richards the grand plan but Ben assures him everything is under control [09:53 PM] Wack'd: And then Alicia shows up [09:54 PM] Wack'd: Alicia is in a bad way since she fought her way down into Monster Island herself [09:54 PM] Wack'd: Which…man, wild, huh? It seems like women under Lee get to be cool so long as they're not Sue! I dunno what it is! [09:55 PM] Bocaj:

Stan Lee: "Do you know who I hate. Sue Storm." Someone, anybody: "But you co-created her." Stan Lee: "I dunno. I just. Man. She's the worst."

[09:56 PM] Wack'd: Pffft [09:56 PM] Wack'd: 1. Someone tell Alicia about polyamory 2. Man shit like this gets weird when you remember at this point in time she's a Skrull

[09:57 PM] Bocaj: Lyja Lazerfist has two hands, as many hands as she needs [09:58 PM] Wack'd: Ben tries to talk to Alicia about what's happened. Ben asks Alicia why she left him for Johnny and doesn't receive the answer "you voluntarily stayed on another planet indefinitely without reaching out to me," somehow [09:58 PM] Bocaj: YEAH [09:58 PM] Bocaj: THAT SEEMS LIKE AN IMPORTANT THING TO MENTION [09:58 PM] Wack'd: Instead Alicia says that Ben was too self-loathing and she felt like she was all give and he was all take [09:59 PM] Wack'd: Which…I dunno, you were pretty self-loathing too for a long while there, Alicia [09:59 PM] Wack'd: I guess their relationship ended because it was no longer PC to have a character regard themself as a monster for being blind [10:00 PM] Wack'd: Which is good! I am glad Alicia stopped doing that! And I can totally see how that might've unbalanced their relationship, had Ben not ditched her for space first [10:01 PM] Umbramatic: yep [10:01 PM] Wack'd: Anyway Alicia continues that Johnny has matured a lot and is thoughtful and sensitive and attentive [10:01 PM] Wack'd: And Ben's like "actually this sucks, why'd I come here" and fucks off [10:01 PM] maxwellelvis: NO! We are talking about Johnny, right? [10:02 PM] maxwellelvis: The guy who nearly endangered the universe by initiating a game of monkey-in-the-middle with the Cosmic Control Rod? [10:02 PM] Wack'd: I mean if anything in relationships up to this point he's maybe been a little too sensitive [10:03 PM] Wack'd: Thinking about Crystal and Frankie here. Coulda done better with boundaries and whatnot in both cases [10:03 PM] Wack'd: Sometimes comically so [10:04 PM] Wack'd: Uh [10:04 PM] Wack'd: Speaking of Johnny [10:04 PM] Wack'd: Eat your heart out, Dan Slott

[10:05 PM] Umbramatic: fleshy [10:06 PM] maxwellelvis: "Oh, that's real nice. Fuck you, Storm." -- Any of those people [10:06 PM] Bocaj: Geez Harvey [10:06 PM] Wack'd: Ben, wanting to avoid any more fighting and frankly just exhausted, gives the order for the Storm/Richards and Alicia to be evicted back out onto the surface [10:07 PM] Bocaj: If Johnny married Alicia and took her name he could be Johnny Storm-Masters [10:07 PM] Wack'd: Nice [10:08 PM] Bocaj: Just saying, he should consider putting a ring on that hyphenated name [10:08 PM] Wack'd: Reed determines that creating a new island the way Harvey intends will omnicide the entire California seaboard, so they need to go back and stop it [10:08 PM] Bocaj: "LUTHORRRRRR!" [10:08 PM] maxwellelvis: Reed, the Pacific is a big ocean. Just convince him to move his building site. [10:09 PM] Wack'd: Alicia asks Johnny to kiss her before he runs off into danger in case he doesn't come back but Johnny refuses, getting some of those old Ben "I'm a freak and I don't deserve you" blues [10:09 PM] Bocaj: Don't you love reruns [10:10 PM] maxwellelvis: Y'know, that's not why the Phantom of the Opera lets Christine go in the end. [10:10 PM] Bocaj: Oh god I just remembered that modern FF is still doing that with Johnny picking up Ben's character beats [10:10 PM] Bocaj: The more things change dot dot dot [10:10 PM] Wack'd: Like I said [10:10 PM] Wack'd: Eat your heart out, Slott [10:11 PM] Wack'd: Ben asks why Harvey did that to Johnny and Harvey claims he was spiting Ben's enemies for him, leaving Ben flummoxed and angry [10:12 PM] Wack'd: It's weird Harvey would see Johnny getting uglified as a punishment but whatever [10:12 PM] Wack'd: So Harvey has occasionally mentioned he needs to go get some sort of treatment in absolute private but Ben, at his wits end, barges in and demands to talk to Harvey [10:13 PM] Wack'd: Turns out these "treatments" are a holodeck where Harvey can pretend to talk to beautiful people at fancy parties [10:13 PM] Bocaj: Huuuh [10:14 PM] Umbramatic: wow [10:15 PM] Wack'd: Ben's faith is shaken now that he knows Harvey doesn't actually have any convictions and still longs for the approval of pretty folks [10:15 PM] Bocaj: I don't know that that follows necessarily but ok [10:16 PM] maxwellelvis: "Expressin' your fantasies in a healthy way that don't hurt nobody? Yer outta yer mind, Harve!" [10:16 PM] Wack'd: Yeah it's [10:16 PM] Wack'd: The politics are [10:16 PM] Wack'd: Whatever [10:17 PM] maxwellelvis: Alternative punchline: Now we know that Mole Man is part of the most oppressed group of all: Gamers [10:17 PM] Wack'd: Ben storms off and finds the rest of his old team busting up the island-making machine. He's shaken but he's also not 100% flipped back the other way yet

[10:18 PM] Wack'd: "What about that time you determined me bein' the Thing was psychosomatic and put me through a buncha phony-baloney tests so I'd think you were still tryin' to cure me?" "Lies by omission don't count!" [10:20 PM] Wack'd: Ben doesn't forgive Reed but figures he's probably not lying about this and switches sides. And then an army of monsters shows up to stop them. Fight fight fight [10:21 PM] Wack'd: In this fight Sue gets to do some cool stuff without being instructed. Shooting force fields like bullets, stopping a tank, rolling a buncha moloids in a big ball [10:22 PM] Bocaj: Stan: "GOD, FINE" [10:23 PM] maxwellelvis: Jim: "You got a problem with that?" Stan: "Maybe I do…. If I can find a ladder." [10:23 PM] Wack'd: The machine is destroyed but Monster Island's caverns begin collapsing! It's a mad dash for the surface! Ben buys Reed and Sue time to make it out, then stays behind with Johnny [10:24 PM] Wack'd: Harvey, knowing his perfect utopia is all over again, voluntarily fixes Johnny's face at Ben's request before heading towards…uh…something else, I guess. He's doin a thing [10:24 PM] Wack'd: Oh, he's gonna spend his final moments in his holodeck. Alright [10:25 PM] Wack'd: The waters are rough because an entire island sinking into the sea but Ben and Johnny make it out in time and swim to safety [10:26 PM] Wack'd: Aw, friends again!

[10:27 PM] Wack'd: "It's a three hour paddle home"

[10:28 PM] maxwellelvis: I don't know, Wack'd, do you think Stan's earned an "Excelsior!" on this? [10:29 PM] Wack'd: Uh. Objectively that was pretty bad [10:30 PM] Wack'd: There's the seeds of a good story in here but they do not grow into a tree at any point [10:30 PM] maxwellelvis: And he shoves She-Hulk and Wyatt Wingfoot off to the side to focus entirely on the family [10:31 PM] Wack'd: I mean, it's the 25th anniversary, I get wanting it to be only folks who were there at the beginning [10:31 PM] Wack'd: In general the commitment to just doing one story about one foe and finding ways to complicate that rather than cramming the whole of Fantastic Four history in somehow is a smart choice