nysus-temple · 2 years ago
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What about Hermes and Dionysus? 👀
DEPENDS if you're asking about sources OR my ideas. Because i can talk for HOURS about both of those. Hermes and Dionysus are just soooo......... They mean so much to me it's stupid at this point.
I'll stick with the sources for now and summarize them the best i can, and then some ideas that i hope i can summarize too; so i talk about both since you didn't specify and i would hate to leave you without an exact answer nskdnfk
Out of all the gods, when Dionysus arrives to Olympus (post-reincarnation), it's Hermes the one who is trusted the most to take care of him. He saved him from Hera's wrath a couple of times. Like Apollonius of Rhodes mentions in the Argonautica, he saved him from FIRE. FROM FLAMES.
Our good Nonnus of Panopolis also talks about this episode ! Saying Hermes traveled around with him for a while, and during that time he also asked several groups of nymphs to educate him. He even played and spend time with him alone, i think we all know this sculpture of Praxiteles, one of the few Greek originals that have survived to this day:
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AND when Dionysus was a young man, not an infant anymore, Hermes left him with Rhea, who educated him in relation with his powers, like for example, being incapable of getting drunk.
Not only that, but there's also the fact that we all know, of Hermes being the psychopomp of Hades. I've always liked to imagine it's him, by Zeus' order, who took Dionysus to Olympus when he was Zagreus, after Persephone gave birth to him. Since in the Orphic Hymns, Persephone takes care of him AFTER he's reincarnated, not when she gives birth to him.
Nonnus of Panopolis also specifies in the end of his Dionysiaca that Dionysus sits next to Hermes at Olympus <3
Remember the Minyades shenanigans Dionysus had? Out of ALL the gods, it was Hermes who took pity on them, it was Hermes who was with him-
I think it's really funny that, like, Hermes was there when Ariadne and Dionysus had children, like, look:
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What is he doing there lmao. "Hey do you two need a second dad-"
AND NOW, BEHOLD, MY STUFF ! Some random concepts and ideas i had of them, go down if you wanna read them or skip if you were here for the sources only.
i've always felt that Hermes has a hard time showing Dionysus how he feels about him. Why? Because he's really good with words, but not gestures; and Dionysus only finds appreciation though gestures, not words. That's due to his way of thinking that everyone is always liying to him, how no one told him about Persephone and Semele, about Gaia's feelings towards him, about how many people were going to treat him... Bad. No one advised him that. They educated him, took care of him and... Lied to him. He died. He was killed. And yet, no one had the courage to tell him. So Hermes thinks it's... Wrong, to tell him that he loves him. That he always cared about him. That he always sacrificed anything he had for him. That didn't matter how many times he reincarnated, for him, he was still Dionysus, his Dionysus. But the other just, well, doesn't feel anything when hearing that. So used to actors and mysteries, that he's incapable of believing him, even if he wanted to.
"Ariadne hugs me. Mother hugs me. Artemis hugs me. You hug me. What's the difference between you all?" that gesture just doesn't reach him.
i just love how Hermes is... Always looking at Dionysus when they are represented together? How he's always next to him? How he's always like... Feeling bad for the way Dionysus ends up being due to their own mistakes? He feels everyone should have told him the truth about his origins, but the rest insisted in not letting him know.
I KNOW I KNOW there are no actual heights for the gods and they all look the same BUT BUT in human form, Dionysus is taller than Hermes and LOVES to pick him up because it bothers Hermes, since, well, when they were younger it was the other way around, Dionysus was the small one... How the turn tables.
They're both gods and they both had to do things that we might not like to see from a human point of view, but i love how they execute them so... Differently. Hermes seems to try to be more, like, peaceful, when ending someone's life; yet Dionysus will give them the most horrorific and violent punishment a mortal can recieve. Perhaps that's why Hermes took pity on the Minyades.
Hermes LOVES dropping hints towards the rest, because they always laugh and get them, but Dionysus can't !!! You need to tell him JUST what you wanna say, he does NOT get hints !! And that's hard for Hermes because he doesn't express "i love you" by saying it directly. He's SCREWED.
i've always adored the fact that Dionysus is a god so focused with fertility and insanity and whatever that he forgets how sexual themes actually work and. and he. doesn't get that kind of jokes either. You know:
Dionysus: Hey, your legs look great in those clothes. Hermes: You should see me without them. Dionysus: Hermes: Dionysus, confused: Why would you take off your legs??? Hermes, snorting: That's not—
After his own travel around Greece, Dionysus changed a bit. He was always a little different compared to the rest, but due to the resentment he holds now, he doesn't like being asked about what he does much. And Hermes knows that, so whenever someone does it he inmediatly goes "NOPE NOPE NOPE CLOSE YOUR MOUTH I APPRECIATE THAT YOU'RE ALIVE"
i love to imagine Hermes jumping behind Dionysus' back when he arrives back at Olympus, and that startles him because doesn't matter how many times Hermes does it, he NEVER remembers it.
Hermes is very clingy due to Apollo educating him in order to be like that, but Dionysus isn't. Not that he dislikes it, just as i explained, he has a hard time understanding what you truly mean OKAY he's had a rough life OKAY he was born three times OKAY
Hermes has rams as very important animals in his whole symbolisms and all that AND i associate Dionysus with rams. i know he was more associated with bulls and goats but RAM HORNS are a metaphor for a LEADER and that's how i view Dionysus. So anyways i just think he would hide between Hermes' rams, but Hermes doesn't get startled because he already knows he does this lmao
"Really, Hermes, what do you even see in that guy" Hermes: he has so many issues and he has me enamored with that
HEAR. HEAR ME. One of the few ways Dionysus actually learns to connect with the other is by DANCING. A very important part from his festivals. And he dances in a different way depending on who is the other. And for Hermes. He's. Elegant, graceful, decorous... He really feels like a LIBERATOR for Hermes. Like. Someone who isn't connected to his duties, because even the twins, who are precious to him, remind him of that somehow. But Dionysus doesn't and everytime they dance Hermes feels so good. Dionysus is just. Chilling. He knows what he's doing for once.
Persephone is Dionysus' mom, and after being separated from him for a long time, she has some fear for the rest of the gods getting near him. You know. Just like Demeter. Persephone was kidnapped from her AND Dionysus was taken away from Persephone as well. So Persephone doesn't, you know, trust Hermes that much. She loves and appreciates everything he does, she doesn't hate him, she can't, he's very dear to her ( just like Hades for Demeter ) BUT she has that resentment feeling tormenting her everytime she sees them together. uuggghhh
After Ariadne dies Hermes has even a harder time to connect with Dionysus. He doesn't know how he feels after that. Due to having various mortals around him (Semele, Ariadne, and others perhaps) die since, they're mortals, he doesn't know how to stay near him without making Dionysus feel he's taking advantage of him. That hurts him a lot, because those aren't his intentions. But he also wished that he learned that, he needs to learn the consequences of getting attached to mortals. Consequences Dionysus never accepts.
Dionysus can act very distant with the rest, BUT he always ends up being gentle with Hermes. He will hold his hands with care, lean on him carefully.
Hermes: [Talks a lot]. Dionysus: [Listens].
Hermes is a master at lying but HAH you can't lie to Dionysus. He's very, VERY good at reading people's minds. Which is even worse for Hermes since almost NO ONE can read Dionysus' thoughts.
HNNNNNNN I'M SO SORRY THAT'S SO MUCH......... If you've read this far ilysm with my entire being ty for listening to my ramblings. Dionysus and Hermes make me sick. In a good way. Biting the air again.
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