#if you're threatened by Lucien and Elain getting to know each other then you're not confident in your ship

[exinewine]

I've been thinking long and hard about why an Elriel book would bother me so much, and I've finally figured it out. It's the lack of development between Elain and Lucien. I refuse to accept that SJM is going to take a fated mates pair, the most sacred thing in her universe, and pair them up with others without explicitly showing why they aren't right for one another or that they would cause harm to each other. She's done it with Chaol, Celaena, Dorian, Feyre, and Tamlin. SJM has the potential to write it, and after reading ToG, I know for a fact she's not a lazy writer. Lucien having a half assed conversation while Elain is not in her right mind, while being chaperoned by a group of people who dislike and mistrust him is NOT enough. I will be the first one to accept an Elriel storyline if I can see that Elain and Lucien are just not right for each other, otherwise, I will be very disappointed.

[deathsweetblossoms]

Azriel's Bonus Chapter, Mating Bonds, and Mor(e)

This was another find that had me PAUSE (if "YELLING SCREAMING AT THE TOP OF MY LUNGS" can be likened to a simple "pause" then, okay.) Disclaimer: we talk about a potential mating bond between Azriel and Mor in this analysis, but I still tie it back to Elriel in the end.

I had intended to debrief each bonus chapter, but instead of approaching Azriel's in the simplistic way I approached Feyre's, I want to zero in on this one particular breadcrumb because ... WHAT?

"if Lucien finds out you're pursuing her, he has every right to defend the bond as he sees fit. Including invoking the Blood Duel."

Azriel hears Rhys say this, balks, and then thinks about how there was one other time, before this one, where he had thought about invoking the duel against Eris and Beron for Mor. /ALARM BELLS/INSTANT ANXIETY ATTACK/SARAH WE ARE GOING TO FIGHT.

Look me in the eyes and tell me this isn't weird. If we break down what Rhys is warning to it's simplest form:

Lucien, as the mated male, has the right to invoke the Duel for someone who posseses a threat to his mating bond (aka, if some other male wants his lady, he can fight to the death for ownership of his lady. An outdated duel, for sure, because...why does the female get no say? This seems like something Mor would vehemently want to run away from, or do anything in her power to avoid getting roped into. Think about it - why is she so desperate for freedom?)

When Azriel thinks about how he wanted to invoke the Duel for Mor, he says he seriously considered invoking it against Eris and Beron both "despite being an outsider".

So my question is, uh... WHY would he invoke the Blood Duel for Mor? Can it be invoked in a non-mating bond situation? I laughed off the theory of Azriel and Mor being mates but now I'm kind of like, WAIT. WTF IS GOING ON HERE? Because Mor was set up in essentially an arranged marriage with Eris, correct? So, that can be perceived as a direct mating bond threat, which Azriel could have invoked had they, in fact, been mated.

Also, as if my poor nerves weren't already suffering, Rhys even asks, "What about Mor?" which always drove me a little bit crazy because you're telling me all-knowing, all-seeing Rhys, who constantly told Feyre to stay out of it, DIDN'T NOTICE that Mor wants nothing to do with Azriel? And "prefers women" anyway??? Why would he even bring Mor into the conversation when they're discussing Elain and tenuous political alliances that would implode if Azriel pursued her? What is this, high school???!?!

*RIPPING MY OWN HAIR OUT*

But also, it explains a lot in terms of Mor being scared shitless of Azriel's response when she's threatened. If SHE also knows that they're mates, it would make sense for her character to want to run as fast and far away as possible to avoid putting him in that sort of mate-induced rage to invoke something like that.

It also explains "What if the cauldron made a mistake", as in, if he's somewhat aware of a potential bond between him and Mor, he is also aware that the cauldron CAN MAKE A MISTAKE. Because it did with them. Mor clearly prefers something else, and pursuing something else would make her happier although she still has a lot of love for Azriel and they remain friends.

See also: A Brief Overview of Feyre's Bonus Chapter and Analyzing the Necklace, The Mother, & Azriel's Bonus Chapter

Below the cut is some Elriel leaning theory and screaming given the above information.

So consider this: both Elain and Azriel have mates but they still end up choosing each other. WHAT A WILD STORY. You cannot tell me you wouldn't be on the EDGE OF YOUR SEAT over something like this?!?! Especially if Elriel would be a threat to *checks notes* the fragile political alliances of The Autumn Court, The Spring Court, Jurian and Vassa?

So with all of that hanging over their heads, and with their own mates, these two still choose each other?!

Oh, man, oh man. I would be losing my shit. IDK about you all. But..ooooo I would EAT THIS UP.

[acourtofthought]

I’ve just realized why I can’t get excited for Az as a love interest and why he comes up short for me when compared to Rhys, Cassian and Lucien. We’ve already seen him pine *heavily* after two females (especially Mor) in a very short amount of time. We haven’t had that with the other 3 - I don’t think Lucien will pine for Jesminda, he’ll probably remember her and their love, which is not the same.

I know what Az feels for them is probably not really romantic love, especially Elain as it seems they’re kind of using each other as a distraction, but Sarah will really need to kick it up a notch because if he thinks Gwyn is beautiful, I’m just gonna think “And who else did you think was beautiful yesterday???”

Like I just realized that I am so NOT used to heroes in romance having an interest in anyone other than their HEA. I’ve kinda prepared myself for disappointment.

I feel like you're inside my mind.

This is only my opinion and how I view it so I realize I'm not speaking for others but.....

The kind of M/F romance I like to read is where the male only has eyes for the FMC. It doesn't bother me if the female is first with "the wrong guy" only to realize the right guy has been in front of her the whole time. It doesn't bother me if the guy is at first resistant to all love because he's overcoming his own personal demons or even the death of his wife. But I really don't enjoy reading about the MMC lusting over how hot another female is (outside the FMC) or reading how he meets the FMC then marries another female and has a kid with her in the same book only to end up with the FMC by the end. I realize it's hypocritical considering it doesn't bother me as much when the situation is in reverse but if I'm using books as a fun escape then I personally don't want to sit through his relationship / hook up with other girls since it ruins the idea of romance for me. I know what real life relationships look like and that we are all attracted to many people at different times and the idea of "one true love" doesn't really exist but it's fun to disappear into a fictional world and pretend that she is literally the sun and the moon for him and no one else could ever compare especially once she comes on the scene.

And unfortunately, that is not the set up we're ever going to have with Az.

I think SJM unintentionally wrote his character into a corner because I do think Moriel had the makings of an epic love in ACOMAF. There was the centuries of pining, his desire to be with her but not feeling worthy especially after it seemed she chose Cassian over him. And I strongly believe that SJM planned on them, but switched directions in ACOWAR (possibly in an effort to add inclusivity to the series?).

It's really difficult to undo all the major emotions Az had for Mor because his feelings for her seemed on par with what Cassian was feeling towards Nesta, even more so because of how long he's loved her. A love that every single member of the IC is completely aware of and it's not something SJM can realistically explain away with a, "poof! Az no longer loves Mor and he wasn't really THAT in love with her after all."

So she introduced what I consider a "rebound" in Elain. She started dropping hints that Mor was starting to pull even farther away from Az, expressed fear towards Az, where Az was really noting Mor's rejection and then he latched on to this somewhat available third sister simply because his brothers are with her sisters and she doesn't seem to want her bond with Lucien. Rather than really facing his past with Mor in a healthy way and taking time to heal from that, he held fast to the distraction of another pretty female who seemed like a damsel in need of saving so he could avoid facing his problems.

And that entire situation reads as problematic. He's fighting with his best friend over it, he's threatening allies, he isn't really thinking of a future with Elain and wonders why he wasn't given a bond like his brothers even though he KNOWS Elain can't be his mate which means he's fixated on a mate and not the person she is.

Chances are, he can't end up with Mor because Mor prefers females.

So at the moment that leaves Elain or Gwyn.

If he ends up with Elain, he still will have been staring at Mor with hunger, still loving Mor for a large portion of the time he's known Elain, still getting jealous over Helion's attention towards Mor while knowing Elain. That doesn't read as romantic to me, having "cute" E/riel moments while he's simultaneously in love with someone else.

If he ends up with Gwyn, he will not only have still been somewhat in love with Mor while knowing Gwyn (I truly don't think he's 100% over her just yet), but also infatuated with the "idea" of ending up with the third sister. Obsessing over Elain in a physical way because it's a distraction for him.

With Gwyn, at least we get confirmation that he's not currently fixated on her in a romantic way in the way he's tangled up his confusing emotions for Mor and Elain. I do think SJM will first have Az deal with then move on from whatever he felt for Mor and Elain before developing a romantic interest in her and I do believe SJM will show us how Gwyn is the right person for Az. I think she'll use words to convey that what Az feels for Gwyn is greater than what he felt for the others but like I said above, I really dislike when the MMC has feelings for another female after meeting the one he'll end up with. For me, it ruins the intensity of the romance and does make me somewhat question how strong the feelings are. While she'll use words to convey he loves Gwyn the most, will I as the reader feel that? I like Chaol, but I can't say he and Yrene are my favorite pairing because that was another situation where he had to let go of what he felt for two other females before really falling for her and I'm not sure I was completely convinced that what he felt for Yrene was more powerful than what he at one point felt for Celaena (despite them being wrong for one another). Will one book be enough to prove that Gwynriel is superior to Moriel even if they are mates? I think their compatibility will be proven as such but Az pined for Mor, someone still in his life, for 500+ years, wanted her to be his mate for 500+ years and that's hard to forget. Especially because the only reason Az didn't end up with Mor is because Mor did not want him because of her preference and he had to move on because of that.

With Lucien, it's a bit of a different scenario and one that for me as a reader, won't be as difficult to overcome.

Jesminda has been gone for centuries and while I do think Elain is going to struggle with wondering whether Lucien wishes Jesminda were still alive in place of her, it's not a scenario that we've been forced to watch in real time. Jesminda hasn't been sitting in the same room and it's only for Elain that we've witnessed his longing. The time since her passing has been more than enough to show that when it's their time, Elucien getting together can happen without her memory being this giant elephant between them. Again, I'm sure it will come up but it's not as oppressive as Az's history with Mor considering it's only been a year since he's really started to let her go and zero months since he's actually let her go completely. Plus, unless SJM brings Jesminda back from the dead (the Deathly Hallows Resurrection Stone should be warning enough as to why that's a terrible direction to go), we're never going to have Lucien, Elain and Jesminda sitting in a room together, wondering who Lucien is more drawn to. I know SJM will tell us Gwyn is IT for Az but that doesn't mean it's still not going to feel a bit awkward for me to read about Gwyn, Mor and Az being in a room together.

[bookofmirth]

Something I've noticed with this fandom throughout my rather short time being in it, is that there is no simplicity to the reason someone likes something that you don't.

If you ship Gwynriel, the reason you like it isn't because you enjoyed their interactions or though they were cute. No, you like them because you hate Elain and think Azriel deserves better.

if you like Nesta there is no way you can enjoy Feyre and Rhysand too because their characters are at ends with each other.

If you like Elucien, you only want Lucien to be happy and don't care about Elain's happiness at all.

If you ship Jassa it's only because you don't want V/assien to happen so you're scrambling for another couple to shove Vassa with.

If you call yourself an Elain stan, you don't like Gwyn either because the two are in a ship war over Azriel (and vice versa)

If you think Azriel was toxic in the bonus chapter that was only so that you could try and find a reason to not like E/riel.

If you dislike Elain it's because you're a misogynistic person who hates feminine characters or those who are quiet/demure.

I'm not saying that there aren't people who fall into the points listed above, but the vast majority of us just like what we like and dislike what we dislike. There are scenes that we are uncomfortable with not because we want to try and tear down a ship, but because we felt that way when we read it. Or there are characters that we just don't feel attached to, not because we're misogynistic, sexist, etc.

I'm not sure if anything that I'm saying is making any sense because I've just gotten back from having a physics class, but I've never had this experience in any of the other fandoms I've briefly been a part of. In those ones, if I said "I don't like this ship/character/scene etc" or I love this ship/character/scene etc" everyone was just like "Fair enough" even if they disagreed.

It's just really aggravating sometimes that I can't say I enjoy something or I dislike something, without some other opinion being tied to my original statement/feeling

It's people desperately trying to invalidate other people's opinions and feelings, and it's nasty.

I can like what I like and hate what I hate and the reasons WHY I feel that way have nothing to do with anyone but me and my vagina! And sometimes my heart.

I totally get what you mean, btw. "You just don't like e*riel because you don't like Elain" or "you just like gwynriel because you hate Elain" or "you just like Elain because you're gay!"

wait.... I lost the plot...

This is why I hate all the "anti a specific character" stuff. These characters aren't diametrically opposed, I can like both Elain and Gwyn! I can like Mor and be intrigued by Eris! (Not that I am lol but you know what I mean.) In fact, I can like.... wait for it......... just you wait................. you'll never fucking guess........................

All

Three

Archeron

Sisters

I KNOW!!!! Who fucking knew it was possible!!!!!!!!!!

I personally can't stand all the hate the sisters get, honestly what the fuck. You want to talk about misogyny, how about hating on a woman character who has had like ten lines of dialogue (Elain), but bending over backwards to forgive a dude character who slut-shames and threatens a queer woman with outing her (Eris).

But back to the original point, like I said it's just people trying desperately to gaslight others because there is no way that other people can ever have different feelings, and somehow our feelings are threatening. IDK how or why, but me saying I hate the ship e*riel is somehow a personal affront. Not sure what to say my dudes, I just fucking hate it. I like Elain and think she could become a favorite, Az is interesting, but together as a couple is a big fucking NO from me. Come up with all the alternative explanations you want, it won't change my mind and your reasons won't be accurate anyway. Have fun wasting your time though.

I don't need some rando asshat dumpster on tumblr to tell me why I feel the way I feel or who I am, thanks! Just so they can feel justified and somehow superior. If other people's opinions are so threatening, yikes! Sucks to be them.

[aquafaith]

My lengthy, angry ACOSF rant review.

Spoilers, TW for mental, emotional, physical, and sexual abuse.

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I loved ACOTAR. I still love ACOTAR. I always will love ACOTAR. But every book afterwards made me give up more and more. ACOMAF romanticized an abusive relationship and assassinated characters for the author's convenience. ACOWAR was a bunch of boring and inconsequential death scares. ACOFAS was all-round dreadful. And each book kept shitting on and pushing away Lucien for no reason.

I'd like to preface this by saying I hated Nesta too. I hated the way she treated Feyre in ACOTAR especially, and I wasn't even too excited for this book because I wasn't that keen on Nesta as a character.

Nesta's POV and her backstory changed my perspective. It does not excuse her actions. All Nesta stans can hold these characters accountable for what they do - trauma is a reason, not an excuse. I, and many others, sided with Nesta because of the way she's treated by everyone else in this book. Also, if you're going to hate Nesta for not teaching Feyre how to read and letting her hunt at fourteen, (which I did, and are very valid things to hate), AT LEAST hold Elain accountable too.

This book. This fucking book.

Shall we start with the intervention? Feyre on her little power trip thinks that her boyfriend that hates Nesta and Nesta hates back, Nesta's ex-best friend, and her possible mate who she never talks to should be at this stupid fucking intervention??? Excuse me???

Remember in ACOMAF when Feyre wouldn't shut up about how rich Rhysand is? Feyre literally has four or five houses and is always talking about how much jewelry and lingerie she can afford because Rhysand is so rich??? Well, Nesta has a few shots. So you know what Feyre does? Humiliates Nesta at this "intervention", TEARS DOWN HER HOME, and forces her to go to the Illyrian training camp.

That was the god awful premise for this book.

Did you think Elain wasn't there because she was against the "intervention"? Nope! She was packing Nesta's belongings without permission.

Remember in ACOMAF when it's made a big fucking deal that locking up a traumatised woman is extremely damaging? Well, when Nesta decides she doesn't want to be in Illyria, Feyre locks her in the House of Wind. Nesta can't fly, so her only way of leaving is down the TEN THOUSAND STEPS, that Feyre KNOWS Nesta isn't capable of climbing.

Feyre's pregnant. In ACOFAS she randomly decided that she wanted a baby to remember Rhysand by if he dies. Which doesn't make any sense because they made that stupid fucking death pact in ACOWAR. It's just SJM superimposing her pregnancy onto her early 20's protagonist. Ignoring the fact that Feyre isn't ready for a baby and Rhysand CERTAINLY isn't, and with a war just ended and another looming and so much trauma and a DEATH PACT are all such horrible circumstances to bring a child into, Feyre is already pregnant. Remember when SJM made a big deal about Fae babies being so hard to conceive, and Feyre said in ACOFAS they wouldn't have to worry for a long time because it can take years to conceive your first Fae child? Well it's been no more than 3 or 4 months and Feyre's already pregnant. Yep.

Also the birth will kill her. Because of course it will. Rhysand KNEW this, and still agreed to try for a baby.

There's no solution. Abortions don't exist for some stupid reason, and a C section would apparently kill Feyre?

(Wasn't this book supposed to be about Nessian?)

In ACOWAR, Cassian was on the battlefield with his entrails around his knees. Someone had to literally hold his guts in for him, and he's fine, but you're telling me a C section would kill Feyre?

Don't worry, this is just setting up the AWFUL ending to this book.

ACOSF amounts to Nesta being gaslit into believing her abusers are right. Her friends and family slut shame her and shame her for her lifestyle constantly. Cassian says it took him decades to work through some of his trauma, and he tried to drink and fuck it away too, but suddenly when Nesta does so it's heinous? Nesta's barely twenty five and she's expected to cope better than these ancient immortals.

Hell, didn't SJM write ACOMAF? Nobody expected Feyre to pick herself up so quickly. The IC (excluding Rhysand) respected her boundaries for the most part and understood when it was grief, trauma, and turmoil that made her angry, sad, want to be left alone, etc. But that's all forgotten here.

Amren also compares Nesta to the people in, and says she belongs in, The Court of Nightmares. You know, the murderers, abusers and rapists? This innocent woman who had a few shots and a bit of sex is on par with them, apparently!

The sex scenes.

SJM is scared to say vagina so she says sex.

She says seed to mean semen.

Apparently the word cunt turns SJM on. I just found Cassian saying that kinda cringe because I'm Bri'ish so the word cunt really isn't a big deal.

Back to the baby killing Feyre, because this is definitely what we all wanted from this book as indicated by the change in covers and format and title... Rhysand decides not to tell Feyre. He tells her friends and family, and tells them not to tell her.

SJM loves sweeping Rhysand's abuse from the first book under the rug and claiming it's always about Feyre's choice... where is that here, MAAS? WHERE IS IT?

Anyway, when Nesta rightfully decides to tell Feyre (although it is kind of out of spite), Rhysand threatens to kill Nesta.

And I believed him. With the way he treats his """mAtE tHaT hE lOvEs sO mUcH""" and all the people he's mindlessly killed before, do you really think he wouldn't kill the person who gave Feyre an inch of autonomy?

So what does Cassian do? His lover who he cares deeply about and suspects is his mate has received a death threat from tHe mOsT pOwErFuL hIgH lORd iN hIsToRy.

Cassian simply gets Nesta out of the court.

EXCUSE ME?

He doesn't breathe ONE word to Rhysand about this. This Illyrian WARRIOR who fought with his GUTS HANGING OUT didn't dare step up to the hIGh lOrD who he considers his brother and sparrs and fights with all the time?

Cassian literally does nothing.

Was it not Rhysand himself who said Mated males are dangerous? Can kill anyone who looks at their mate? Can be dangerous simply leaving the house? Rhys and Feyre both pull the Mate card to justify their bad actions on the other's behalf... and Cassian just tried to get Nesta out of the court?

Also, this High King bullshit.

I swear to fucking god, if SJM DARES to make this abusive, power-tripping, mOsT pOwErFuL hIgH lOrD eVEr, husband-insert of hers hIgH kInG, I will fight her in the street.

My beloved Lucien is in this book. Only for him to be used and shat on.

I really liked it when he calmed Cassian down with just a look though. Yes please fox man.

Helion is also in this book. Nothing to do with Lucien.

Eris is also in this book. ERIS. Lucien's eldest brother. The same one who abused him for years, but according to SJM he's slightly better, because at least he didn't agree to kill Lucien's lover. He betrayed his daddy that one time, therefore Eris is good. Y'know, the same Eris who abused Mor? Left her laying on the Autumn Court border with a nail in her womb? Well SJM is going back on her own canon to redeem yet ANOTHER abusive male, while continuing to demonize Tamlin for things he only happened to do when SJM decided the villain from the first book was sexy.

Nesta and Cassian are Mates.

Remember when Mates were supposed to be a rare and sacred thing? Now SJM dishes them out like Oprah.

I don't want these characters to be mates. I want to see them slowly fall in love. But SJM is incapable of writing that so she forces them together with the mAtInG bOnD. That's literally the only basis for most of these relationships, Feysand especially.

The only relationship where the bond would make sense is between Helion and The Lady of Autumn. Who still isn't named. But I will die on the hill that they're mates, I can feel it between them.

I wanted someone to die in this book. I predicted that it would either be Helion or Tarquin, but Tarquin isn't even in this one.

And the ending.

SJM can't write a decent climax, so she kills both Feyre and Rhysand for the second time. Yep.

The baby is being born which stupidly kills Feyre, and thankfully takes Rhysand with them.

Nesta decides to save them. Bad choice. But she decides to save them! Because she's so powerful and she ATE THE CONTENTS OF THE CAULDRON and she's CONNECTED TO THE MOTHER.

Do you know what happens.

Nesta loses her powers.

NESTA.

LOSES.

HER.

POWERS.

The powers we've hardly seen, the powers that were briefly mentioned and used ONCE in ACOWAR, then we saw like two flashes of in this book? They're GONE now. GONE SO NESTA CAN SAVE HER ABUSIVE SISTER AND ABUSIVE HUSBAND WHO ABUSES THEM BOTH.

Nesta is just an Amren now. They both fought for their powers, and had to give them up to save people who didn't deserve it. Now they're anticlimactically trapped in powerless bodies.

Also, and I can't BELIEVE I didn't originally include this - do you know what else Nesta TRADED HER POWERS FOR?

Illyrian anatomy so she can carry Cassian's baby one day.

EXCUSE ME?

I am so fucking SICK TO DEATH of the narrative that every woman needs a man and children to be happy. SJM clearly loves this because she's literally only keeping Amren and Nesta alive now to be sex objects to their partners and nothing else seeing as their POWERS WERE RIPPED AWAY FROM THEM, and now NESTA TRADED THOSE POWERS TO HAVE A BABY SHE DOESN'T EVEN KNOW SHE WANTS? Nesta does NOT strike me as a motherly type. She's the wine aunt, she and Cassian are the couple that go on holiday a lot and and babysit their nieces and nephews, but nope. Nesta HAS to have children.

The Feysand baby is called Nyx. That's just so underwhelming, you go from these huge, multiple syllable names like Amarantha and Morrigan and Lucien to Nyx? I get it's supposed to be unique but it's not even meaningful. It's just more shit-flavoured icing on the hAHa nIgHt uWu cake. I prefer Renesmée.

Nesta is wrong somehow. She says she's sorry as she's saving them. FOR WHAT? For being a little rude to Feyre as all sisters are? And rightfully hating your sister's abuser?

Oh yeah, remember in ACOWAR when Nesta took care of a comatose, starving Elain for months? Elain is randomly okay now because she takes care of her mental health the stereotypical way of baking cakes, and not drinking and fucking, which she shames Netsa for.

Remember the slut shaming, demeaning comments that the whole iNnEr cIrClE made about Nesta? They all expect apologies from her. For some reason.

Nesta has done nothing wrong. She coped with her trauma and minded her business in her own ways, and she's expected to apologise to the people who control and emotionally abuse her.

Nothing that any of these characters did to Nesta is right. Nesta wasn't okay at the end, this wasn't Nesta's healing story. This is Nesta being shamed and degraded until she submits.

Oh I can't believe I forgot to write this in my first draft of this review, do you know how Nesta "overcomes" her grief about her Father's death and her conflicting feelings about him and his life and her guilt? When she visits his grave for the first time, she takes Nyx.

NYX.

She holds NYX up to the grave and talks about how it's his grandson.

GO AWAY YOU STUPID DEMON BABY THIS IS NOT YOUR BOOK.

Speaking of, it's revealed that Nesta was abused by her mother and grandmother in this book? Something we were all looking forward to is seeing more of the Archeron's mother seeing as Feyre was so young when she died, but... nope. She gets a few vague mentions, and this newly revealed abuse is entirely glossed over. Nesta was also actively groomed by an older man at 14. But SJM glosses over this because of course she does.

Finally, the bonus chapters.

My edition came with a bonus chapter from Feyre's POV. It was pointless and I hated it.

There's another bonus chapter from Azriel's POV. Once I'd finished this book, he was one of the few characters I still harboured a shred of respect for.

Then I read his bonus chapter.

This exists to purely objectify Elain.

Whether you ship Elain with Azriel, or Lucien, or neither, this chapter is disgusting. He thinks about her coming on his tounge, and other things simply just to please him.

He then dares to suggest that "the Cauldron picked wrong" in choosing Lucien as Elain's mate?

No Azriel, SJM picked RIGHT in not giving each Archeron sister a bAt bOy.

Rhysand does the only right thing he's ever done by telling Azriel to stay away from Elain, but then he has to ruin it by clarifying that it's only so they can manipulate and use Lucien more.

Oh, and Azriel wants to kill Lucien.

Need I remind you that Lucien respects Azriel? Lucien is another victim of the Night Court's needless, baseless torment, and Azriel is no exception.

Lucien stays well out of Elain's way because she makes it clear that she's not interested in a mate, but Azriel wants to kill him simply for being her mate.

Lucien has done nothing. And I mean literally NOTHING to warrant any of this treatment. From the bAt bOyS, from Feyre, from his family, from SJM, from the deluded part of this fandom that think he's done wrong. NOTHING.

All I liked about this book was the Lucien scenes (which is a given), ((although I hated the way everyone talks about him behind his back)), Nesta's relationship with the house, Emerie and Gwyn, the evidence that Gwynriel is endgame and subsequently Elucien, and the book love. Everything else was horrible. Oh, and Nesta hates Rhysand. I love that for her, because everyone else bows at his feet.

Oh yeah, when Nesta DARES suggest that Rhysand is an "arrogant, preening asshole" which I think is a compliment, Cassian can't take Rhys' cock out of his mouth for one second, and has to get mad at her for having an opinion. Don't even get me started on Azriel in that scene.

If each book after ACOTAR made me slowly give up, this book made me give up altogether. I cannot go on to support this victim-blaming, abuse-forgiving, misogynistic series. I've given up on SJM, and the only characters I care about anyone are Lucien, Nesta, Helion, and Tarquin. I'll continue to read this series to see if SJM redeems herself, but I'll be downloading them for free. I'm not giving this piece of shit any more of my money.

I hope we don't get the Lucien book. I don't want her to slaughter my fox in the way she slaughtered LITERALLY EVERYONE ELSE.

Thanks for listening.

Edit: I put the review on Goodreads!

[valamerys]

hi, so i'm in dire need of some emotional reassurance as a (former?) aco* fan. i am so unhappy with the spoilers i've seen and it's making me question if i even want to read acowar, now. the rep makes me want to vomit, and it will cut me deep if my ships are non-canonical (*ehem* elucien! *ehem*) (i'm shedding salty ass anxiety tears). i need help, i need relatable advice!! ps. i love your fics/posts, you're the goddess of elucien content, i'll sing it from the rooftops

I GOT U here (elucien-specific thoughts, slightly spoilers) and here (more general, no spoilers) already. But also i am an ENDLESS FONT OF BABBLING so here's more.

SPOILERS UNDER THE CUT:

In regards to Elucien, expanding on what I said in that post I linked above, it sounds like nothing ends up at all definitive, and tbh that’s all I need. I wasn’t really expecting Elucien to get together with a bow on top anyway, if only because of the time constraints in the story/ the limited POV that means we don’t see that much of them developing/ interacting, and while i am ROUNDLY UNTHRILLED about the Elriel development, having calmed down, I am also not threatened by it. For one thing, it’s possible Elain and Az just develop a friendship/ platonic rapport that everyone is blowing out of proportion? Because, like, really, Az transferring blatant 500-year-old romantic feelings from Mor to Elain that quickly is weird, and we don’t yet have evidence of anything concrete that couldn’t be explained by... just... two nice people being nice to each other. So that’s a possibility I’m hoping for.

But even if Elain and Az are explicitly romantic? Maas has a Thing with establishing the mating bond or some other kind of weird power dynamic and then going above and beyond to reassure us that when those characters do get together, it’s not because of that/ that their relationship is super super healthy and consensual despite that thing that should make it Weird. I’m talking about Feyre and Rhysand, of course, but also Miryam and Drakon: Drakon frees Miryam from slavery, making theirs a very power-unbalanced, almost fetishey potential relationship with overtones of indebtedness and class difference-- so Miryam goes off to kick ass for a few years and, it would seem, doesn’t ever consider Drakon romantically until she’s established herself and they’re societal equals, making a relationship between them No Longer Weird. (Do ya’ll see why I think this will be a novella. It’s SO similar to Feysand; this is the kind of shit Maas loves to write.) So it wouldn’t shock me if anti-elucien content in acowar is of the same nature; if she’ll establish distance (/ other romantic parters) between them so that when they do eventually get together (as side characters in the inevitable Nessian novels, perhaps? Or else in my fic) we can be very very sure it’s not “just because they’re mates.” Which is a common criticism of Elucien as a pairing, (and of SJM ships in general) so this strategy makes sense as a sort of preemptive self-defense.

The Mor thing...... i’m not gonna lie, it’s bad, and I’m saying that based on more information than a lot of people have access to right now. (I have a Discourse Post drafted and ready to go because that’s who I am as a person.) That said, I’m willing to forgive a lot based on how it turns out (IE if Mor ends the story out to her friends and in a happy, not-dead gay relationship) and that, I don’t know. 

I understand the spoilers killing your enthusiasm, I really do. I watched an entire season of brooklyn 99 yesterday to pull myself out of Lucien-related despair. I’m not gonna, like, try to convince you to read the book if you don’t want to? ‘Cause that’s legit, and I’m not gonna tell you it won’t get worse, because it might; I don’t know enough to say otherwise, and I don’t know your personal limits and tastes. But personally, I’m married to this garbage fire for better or worse, if to do nothing other than help dissect where it goes wrong. More positively, I know that there’s going to be a ton of stuff I do REALLY want to see and will be excited about, stuff no spoilers will predict, and also generally that I want to be in The Room Where It Happens regarding the fates of these beautiful children who I love, even if the outcome is Bad.

And if it’s bad, we’ll be there with fanfic and communal bitching. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ that’s what i got. take care of urself.

[acourtofthought]

People saying you're downplaying e/riel scenes when you just stating facts BASED on the same book we're all reading is so funny to me LMAO

I finished this series exactly 6 months ego and tbh I knew about e/riel, elucien and gwynriel situation and the whole ship war that is going on right now so I really tried to be open minded about them so I can choose wisely.

And let me tell you when I was so surprised that there are people (so many in fact) out there shipping e/riel (SPECIALLY AFTER AZ'S BONUS CHAPTER) was so baffling to me that I was sure I missed some parts... And I asked myself if they have ever read a romance book at all!!

Bc nothing about e/riel scenes felt romantic to me, platonic? Maybe. But romantic? Nope. Like I've read enough romance book to know how romance feels like in books (good romance novels tho)

And at first I thought I was the only one who felt about them like I do. Specially when I only read the books once and obviously you miss so many little details unconsciously. But I realised so many others who read with me and in general after acosf and they weren't in the fandom while the possibility of e/riel was kinda a lot, don't ship Az with Elain. And I love that about sjm bc even though you might not see the details she carefully puts in her books, you subconsciously get to the point where she wants to take you.

Yes at first I didn't saw the possiblity of gwyn and Az but after finishing the book I felt that there might be something after all then I saw the many little scenes they had in my second read that it's passable but it's there.

Or when I read the bonus chapter all I felt was this uncomfortable and uneasiness about e/riel scene. And in my second read I knew that sjm was pointing the fact that they're not it and the possibility of gwynriel went so high for me.

And then I saw your page and saw the many details about elucien scenes and both of them individually. Like sjm is really trying to tell us how this going to be but ppl are still oblivious about it and try to drag both gwyn and Lucien down (both of them are SA survivor and possibly the nicest character in the series who both deserve so much better) bc they feel threatened by them!!

Maybe if your ship was more based on romance and love and not lust (and not mentioning the fact that both Az and Elain are not mentally ready for any sort of romantic relationship and if they were, they wouldn't choose each other but they're not ready for that argument lol) we wouldn't be here at all...

This was my experience tho... everyone has a different one based on their reading comprehension :)

I hope you have a good day and thank you for showing me how beautiful elucien story can be<33

Thank you for your message!

I think your reading experience is similar to the one a lot of others had. And that in of itself should be a pretty big sign, right?

When people read romance books, they typically feel like they're reading romance.

No Elucien's think Elucien is in love or currently have feelings for one another, they see the potential of what could be when Elain and Lucien are in a place to fall in love.

No Gwynriels think Gwynriel is in love and currently have feelings for one another, they see the potential of what could be when Gwyn and Az are in a place to fall in love.

But a portion of the fandom insist that E/riel are in love.

Doesn't it seem strange that over 50% of the fandom doesn't get a true romance vibe between two people that some declare are in love? Attraction? Sure. But that's not the same thing as love and authentic feelings. I have to say, a romance author being unable to convince nearly all her readers that a couple has feelings for one another is not a very strong writer at all (which I believe SJM to be). And you mentioned this point but it's not even that some don't get a romantic vibe between E/riel, it's that they feel legitimately uncomfortable about his thoughts and behaviors towards Elain and a good romance shouldn't make you cringe, especially if you're reading an SJM book. When a couple is falling in love in one of her books, it's very clear what's happening. That's not to say her characters aren't morally gray and they're not a G rated Disney movie or first crush kind of love but you aren't left wondering if they guy actually likes the girl or whether he's just desperate to be included in the "Mated to an Archeron Sisters" Club like his brothers are. You're not left leaving an E/riel scene knowing that Az isn't reflecting on how amazing Elain is but instead is focused on how much he hates himself and is so jealous that he's going off half-cocked about killing allies with no regards to how immature he's acting. We don't leave his Bonus Chapter feeling good because we just witnessed him going on and on about how unique and special Elain is, we leave his Bonus Chapter focused on Az and his entire truckload of baggage.

Sure, SJM likes us to know that her males don't feel worthy of their female but it doesn't encompass their entire persona. And in this case, it's not Az not feeling worthy of Elain, it's Az feeling completely unworthy at all times which proves he is in no way ready to have anything with anyone at the moment.