#stop trying to excuse her behavior just because shes a good guy now in s5 who loves bellamy and some of our other mains

[yiangchen]

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[swordlesbean]

rewatching the first 3 eps is kinda frustrating at how much Adora does NOT think about Catra covering for her not even once while she's playing around in beds, plays pinata, eats good food etc, she's gone for days and like Catra says later didn't even think she was taking the fall for her damn. and didn't even spare a glance at Catra while celebrating with her new driends at selinas

This is actually something I've wanted to talk about for a long time, so thanks for giving me an excuse to finally do it! I think when people are annoyed with Adora for supposedly not thinking about Catra in early s1, they aren't giving full consideration to Adora's perspective during that time period. She's, uh... dealing with a lot, to say the least. There's been a fair amount of analysis about Catra's perspective during this time, but not nearly as much about Adora's. I will try to remedy that here, in my typically long-winded way.

Let's take it from the beginning. Adora touches a mysterious sword in the woods that gives her visions and makes her black out. She’s still having these visions and hearing voices when she’s back home, so she sneaks out at night to find the sword again because she wants answers. Reasonable. She plans to be back by morning, but she asks Catra to stay behind because she doesn't want Catra getting in trouble on her behalf in case something goes wrong. Also reasonable. Boom, nothing goes according to her plan, and everything goes wrong.

Adora finds the sword, but runs into Rebellion soldiers. She tries to fight them for the sword, but when she touches it, she has another vision and blacks out again. She wakes up with her hands tied, a prisoner. She bides her time instead of trying to escape because she still wants the sword. During this time, she's told information that conflicts with what she knows about the Horde, and oh yeah, she somehow randomly transforms into an 8-foot-tall legendary warrior princess. Then she and her captors get chased by a giant spider to an abandoned temple, which she’s able to open because she can apparently read a long-dead language, but then they’re trapped in the ruins.

Once they get out, she’s no longer being held captive, so she can now go back to the Horde. But she needs answers and decides to go to Bright Moon so someone can give her an explanation for all this crazy shit happening to her. At this point, is she thinking about Catra and what might be happening back home? No. But frankly, there is a lot on her plate! Like, life changing stuff. She can turn into a princess! But princesses are evil and the enemy! But this angry sparkly princess and nice archer guy are saying the Horde are actually the bad guys? What is going on? What is she?

Adora still intends to go back to the Horde, but she feels she can't do that until she gets more intel about what happening to her and what it means. She’s always wanted to know more about where she came from. This may be her only chance. And even though her overprotective streak sometimes makes Catra think she feels otherwise, Adora absolutely believes in Catra and knows she's smart and resourceful and can handle herself, so it doesn't occur to Adora that there's reason to worry.

Then Thaymor happens. They stop there for transportation, but Bow insists they stay for the party because he realizes Adora's life has been utterly depressing, and he wants her to experience something nice. I think it's pretty harsh to hold it against Adora that she gets excited and awed and distracted by encountering a party and eating good food for the very first time in her life ever. Can the girl please be allowed to live a little? Like, she's an anxious, guilt-ridden, duty-burdened mess 90% of the time, so let's maybe not blame her for having a good time for once.

That good time is pretty quickly ruined anyway. Reality ensues. The Horde ensues. Catra ensues. But even as Thaymor is attacked, Adora thinks it's a mistake. It's bad intel; she just has to explain, and the Horde will stop. It's only when she comes face to face with Catra that she understands the truth about the Horde and makes her decision to leave. Let’s be clear on this: Adora doesn't just leave the Horde without any consideration for Catra. Catra isn’t an afterthought here, she is literally standing right in front of Adora when Adora makes her decision.

Thaymor from Adora's perspective is finding out that her whole life has been a lie and that she doesn't know her best friend as well as she thought. What Adora sees is Catra being part of an attack on defenseless people and seeming to have zero concern or regret about it. What she perceives is Catra refusing to join the good guys and choosing to remain part of a lying, destructive army despite the truth of a burning village in front of them. What she feels is Catra disregarding her decision to leave and tasing her in the back as she tries to walk away.

It's important to remember that in this moment, Adora feels betrayed by Catra as much as Catra feels betrayed by Adora. People always talk about Adora breaking their promise by choosing to leave, but Catra breaks it too by choosing to stay. They both make decisions that hurt the other, and they both feel abandoned.

So that's what Adora is carrying with her in regards to Catra in early s1. She's internalized this betrayal, these hurt feelings, but she's also really trying not to let herself feel any of it. Not just because it hurts, but because it’s what she’s been taught to do. She’s well-practiced in denying herself, denying her pain and her wants and needs. This trait of hers is given specific attention in s5, but it's a necessary lens to view Adora through in every season. She won't ever put herself and her feelings first. She doesn't think she's allowed to be weak, to feel hurt and express that hurt, not when more important things are at stake. Shadow Weaver always said her feelings for Catra were a problem, and for the first time, Adora agrees, so she tries not to feel them.

She can also avoid thinking about Catra because she has so much to distract her. Catra is still in the Horde, surrounded by reminders of Adora, so it's impossible for her not to think of Adora. But Adora's situation is different. She's in a new environment, suddenly overwhelmed by a huge destiny and all these new experiences and stimuli and social dynamics she has never experienced in her life. So she puts all of her attention into learning the rules and expectations of this new life. She hyperfocuses on her duty as She-Ra.

That doesn't mean there aren't reminders of the past. Adora doesn't feel comfortable sleeping alone, and the clear implication is that she can't sleep without Catra. She isn't "playing around in beds," she just has no idea what to make of a soft bed because she's used to austere conditions. And she's certainly not able to forget what the Horde represents to the people she's now living with. She gets run out of Bright Moon because of the Horde symbol on her back, and she receives a thinly veiled threat from Angella in front of Micah's portrait. She doesn't feel secure in her place in the Rebellion, so she's definitely not going to talk about missing anything or anyone from the Horde, however much of it she actually lets herself feel.

Salineas is the first time Adora encounters Catra after Thaymor, and the wounds from that confrontation are still fresh. She asked Catra to come with her then, but all it got her was a taser to the back, so she's not feeling too charitable towards Catra and isn't keen on reaching out again. She's completely in She-Ra duty mode, trying to restore the Sea Gate to protect the kingdom from the Horde. But then, Catra isn't making real efforts to try and bridge the gap between them either. In fact, from Adora’s perspective, she appears to be perfectly happy widening it. 

While Adora is fixing the gate, she’s getting hit with electric feedback and also can't risk moving or fighting back, but that doesn’t stop Catra from lashing out at her. Catra mocks, scratches, punches. Even when she softens up a bit, she talks like Adora is just going through a phase. She's trying to convince Adora to come back to the Horde, but in the same way Adora wasn’t thinking about what Catra might face by covering for her while she was away, Catra’s not thinking about what it would actually mean for Adora to come back, the terrible consequences she would face as a defector.

Adora knows she can’t go back to the Horde, not just because of her morals, but also because it’s too late to do so without something bad happening to her. So she wonders, if Catra cares about her, why would she want to bring her back to that? If Catra cares about her, why won’t she just leave the Horde and come with Adora? Adora can't see into Catra's mind, so she doesn't know the underlying motivations and feelings driving her behavior. And Adora’s never really had the "you hurt me, so I'll hurt you back" impulse, so she’s more inclined to read Catra's aggressive actions towards her as a sign that Catra maybe doesn’t care about her as much as she once thought.

After Salineas, things continue to heat up between them during Princess Prom. This time Adora is highly confrontational towards Catra. She fully believes Catra is planning something bad, and she's absolutely right, though she still tries to save Catra's life when they fall off the cliff. That act doesn't seem to matter to Catra, and she ups the ante and hurts Adora worse then ever by taking Glimmer and Bow as hostages. 

Adora finally softens towards Catra when Catra returns the sword and let's her and Glimmer escape the Fight Zone. Up until that moment, Adora isn't sure that Catra still cares, but this is confirmation for her. The next time they meet, Adora makes a real effort to reach out, and she again asks Catra to leave the Horde. And they actually do start reconnecting a little, until Light Hope plays on Catra's insecurities with those memory simulations, in an attempt to drive them apart and get Adora to let go of Catra in the same way Shadow Weaver always wanted her to. 

And it does successfully drive them further apart and is the true beginning of Catra’s descent into villainous self-destruction and reality-destroying levels of resentment towards Adora. But what it doesn’t do is get Adora to let go of Catra. Because it doesn't matter what Light Hope and Shadow Weaver and even Catra say or do, Adora never can let go. She does eventually let go of the idea that she's the one responsible for Catra's actions, and she puts up boundaries and becomes harder towards Catra. But she never truly gives up on her or stops caring about her, even when Catra is at her most destructive and spiteful and personally hurtful towards Adora. 

But then, Adora letting go of her feelings for Catra wasn't ever the solution anyway. Because She-Ra's power comes from love, and Catra is the first person Adora loved, and the person she loves the most deeply. So Adora as She-Ra is at her most powerful when she's loving Catra and doing it without conflict, either between the two of them or within Adora herself.

[safflowerseason]

some dan x amy musings

In response to a question from @wecouldstillbegreat...what is Dan and Amy’s relationship to physical touch/physical intimacy?

This is such a good question…although it was kind of hard to answer, because it’s so easy to blur the boundary between the show and fanfiction!

It’s an especially interesting question too, in light of the fact that Veep is not a particularly “touchy-feely” kind of show, and physical touch and physical intimacy are so often manipulated or twisted by the various characters. Selina and Tom’s relationship is a good example of this…both of them attempt to use their physical attraction to ruin one another. Or Selina and Andrew…Andrew constantly takes advantage of Selina by sleeping with her, and even Selina herself is somewhat aware that her physical attraction to Andrew is constantly getting her into trouble.

Dan and Amy’s relationship stands out on Veep because when they touch one another (or when they aren’t touching but want to), the physical dimension of their relationship is generally framed to emphasize the “purity” of their emotional connection, if that makes sense. Dan and Amy are terrible people, but they are two terrible people who have a genuine emotional connection to one another that the show isn’t interested in twisting (at least during the Iannucci years). Whether or not Dan and Amy are aware of it, touch for them is a fundamentally good thing. 

In S1, Dan touches Amy in a very “unconscious boyfriend” kind of a way—a hand on her back, an arm over her shoulder, etc. This is also the season where their relationship is played the most “romantically.” I’m assuming the acting choices for both Reid Scott and Anna Chlumsky derived from this tonal approach.

(Sidenote: in spite of my earlier statement that touch is broadly framed as a “good” thing for Dan and Amy…I have to include a caveat here. The frequency with which Dan touches Amy in S1 is quite startling, considering they are not dating and Amy is especially distrustful of Dan during this period of their relationship. As an audience, we’ve been generally socialized to accept his behavior because their relationship has been coded as romantic…Dan and Amy are attracted to one another and thus it’s “fine” for Dan to always be touching her in these small ways…but it’s really not cool. (It makes you wonder if RS would have made the same acting choices in a post Me-Too world.) Of course, for what it’s worth, Anna Chlumsky also never plays Amy in S1 as physically uncomfortable when Dan is touching her in this way, a choice which broadly shapes the audience’s reaction to Dan as well. The fact that they are in a “romance” excuses a lot of behavior that we might not look at so indulgently now.)

In S2-S4, this dimension of their relationship drops off—they are close, constantly in one another’s space, arms brushing, etc, but Dan’s not draping his arm around her on the couch after he’s gotten her to agree to a suicide pact. It’s impossible to know what the actors and the writers discussed, but subconsciously or otherwise, this change seems to reflect the broader tonal shift from S1 to the more subtle “Machiavellian work spouses” dynamic of the later Iannucci seasons.

During S2 and S4, Dan mostly touches Amy when she’s extremely emotionally fired up. The two big moments that come to mind is in 2.08 during Selina’s interview and 4.08, when she’s so desperate to deliver Pierce to Selina she’s about to blow their cover. This speaks to their intimacy in a different way, I think—that Dan feels enough of an emotional connection to Amy to reach for her when she’s furious, but also that Amy finds his touch emotionally soothing (whether or not she realizes it). In 2.08, Amy would be perfectly justified at flinging Dan’s hand off of her, of jerking her body away from him—he’s incredibly smug and condescending to her—but she doesn’t. That’s significant. 

Even in S3, when Dan and Amy are basically in an episodes-long fight over Dan’s promotion as campaign manager…Amy is the one who Dan leans on when he has his panic attack, and she willing assists him out of the room, minutes after she’s sabotaged him. (We barely see this happen, though, and I can see why they might not have wanted to show it, because the imagery would be beyond unsubtle and probably felt a bit serious for the moment…it’s funnier and lighter to have Dan freaking out in the cab and thoughtlessly running a hand down her face.) 

There are not very many of these moments, but analyzed collectively, they obviously emphasize that Dan and Amy’s relationship is, well, different than Amy’s with Mike or Dan’s with Selina. They certainly stand out in a show that’s about how cutthroat and corrupt politics can be. And not to get all fluffy about it, but it makes me think of when Reid Scott called Anna Chlumksy “partner” in that behind the scenes video. They are partners, and the fact that Dan feels comfortable enough with Amy to literally grab her when she’s about to charge into the West Wing matters very much.

Then of course, 5.02 happens and Dan and Amy are emotionally estranged for the rest of the series, basically. They don’t touch at all onscreen in S5 or S6…and I’m not going to analyze S7 because it depresses me, and because I’ve already pointed out similarities between Ep. 7.03 and Ep. 2.08 in how Dan deals with Amy. 

It’s also worth pointing out that the significance of the moments in which Dan and Amy are specifically not touching one another but clearly want to, and the lack of touch between the brings their physical chemistry into intense focus. The bar scene in 4.04, for example…or the other bar scene in 5.02, not mention the scene in the hotel corridor. In those moments, Dan and Amy are at the very edge of giving in to their physical desire for one another—they’re not touching because if they did, they might not stop. And even though we don’t see them hook up in 6.09, their reactions to that night clearly indicate that they both had a fantastic time. Turns out touching in all the ways is just as much as fun as bantering in dive bars. (Even Dan’s “yeah, yeah, we had a lot of drinks that night…” response to Amy at the very end of 6.10 has a kind of…coy intrigue to it. He knows that it was a good night, and he clearly wants to repeat the experience, while also, obviously, not wanting to come right out and say so. If it sucked, he just would have been like “Ugh, don’t remind me” à la S7 Dan.)

Anyway, so what does all this actually mean? On a super basic level, we can generally infer that Dan seems to be a pretty touchy-feely kind of guy (or at least Amy brings it out in him). That doesn’t mean he’s super cuddly or into PDAs, but touch is an important emotional conduit for him (his love language, for lack of a better word, although both Dan and Amy would hate that phrase). And Amy, who broadly does not like being touched by other people and has never been in a satisfying sexual relationship, likes it when Dan touches her (this is largely tied, I think, to the fact that Dan is the only person in the show around whom Amy can act like herself). And when they do finally give into their desire for one another, it is a very heady experience for both of them that they’re eager to repeat. At the very least, I would argue that canon takes us that far. 

As for what these characteristics look like in a real relationship…well, the show never takes us there, so it’s up to one’s own interpretation of Dan and Amy’s relationship. Obviously, fanfic writers (including myself) have broadly extrapolated all this into stories that explore such a relationship and where physical touch becomes a somewhat central feature of their relationship. Often in these fics, sex and other forms of physical intimacy represent a way for Dan and Amy to communicate their feelings without actually having to express them verbally (their least favorite thing). We never see it in the show, but it’s nice to imagine—and most fanfic writers have—that in a real relationship, Amy does things like lean her head against Dan’s shoulder or kisses him just because she wants to. In fanfiction, these kinds of small moments illustrate to the reader that Amy fully trusts Dan (or is trying to). 

Just to pull an example from my own work…in BMTL, Dan and Amy have been “together” for roughly four years, and they’ve had a kid together for five and a half years. One way I’ve tried to demonstrate the (relative) longevity of their relationship is through physical touch. They play-wrestle, she falls asleep with her head in his lap, Dan is so tired in Chapter 3 he almost falls asleep in Amy’s lap while she runs her fingers through his hair…these moments just felt, to me, really natural to write in a fic where Dan and Amy are an established couple, not to mention how frequently Dan has held Amy in his arms, in the moments where she’s actively grieving her dad (and he’s not making it about him). 

Well, answering ask somehow turned into a novel, so I’ll stop here! Needless to say, it’s a very rich topic! 

[gch1995]

I want to watch new Drama/Fantasy TV series on Netflix and Hulu to get the bad taste that OUAT and TWD left in my mouth.

Here is what I want:

• A show that is more strongly driven by the characters consistently and believably, rather than half-cocked convoluted plots, and/or the creators/writers abrupt, blatantly biased, hypocritical, petty, and unfair preferential treatment of their favorite characters/ships, who they destroy other great characters/ships that they don’t care about as much to prop up their pet characters/ships up onto pedestals that they don’t deserve-

I dealt with six seasons of the continuity and logic of every rule of magic, relationships, storylines, and most of the timeline from S1 getting deliberately retconned left and right more and more inexplicably at the drop of a hat every season afterwards for (oftentimes disappointing) random plot twist convenience, and the writers completely stopped trying in 3B when they broke the rule of magic not being able to bring back the dead and decided “Fuck all the rules of continuity and realism in characterization and organic development in any of our remaining main characters, and fuck any and all sort of sort of storytelling integrity in writing a canon that consistently sticks to its timeline and rules of magic! We’re just going to reframe the entire narrative around Hook’s “redemption” arc and CS by ruining/retconning everyone else’s original characterization and development from S1-3A, and do whatever the hell we want with magic and the timeline on this show now because LOL, BOLD STORYTELLING! We’re really just too afraid to admit that we’re a team of horrible creative writers and show-runners, who didn’t know how to write more than two-and-a-half seasons of satisfying and original character development, who, thus, ran out of good new ideas for what else to do after 3x11, and who, thus,, would have done a lot better just ending the show with that episode because that’s clearly all we could handle before ruining everything that made this show genuinely entertaining to fans in the first place with our plot fuckery and character/ship favoritism!”

I quit watching OUAT after S5, but I still dealt with watching roughly four seasons of Rumple, Belle, Rumbelle, and Emma getting made OOC, and later on, outright destroyed in favor of cheaply emotionally manipulative “Gotcha” plot twists, and A&E and their team of hacks petty and hypocritical favoritism that led them to prop up Zelena, Regina, and especially Hook/CS onto pedestals that they didn’t deserve in their favor by ruining them to make them look better by comparison without really doing much to change them, or making them sympathetic characters in their own right, especially post 3A. I still kept up with the spoilers post S5, so I know about what they did to ruin all my faves to prop up Hook/CS, Zelena, and even the dark half of the EQ some more in 6A, past the point of no return this time around, basically.

It would be one thing if Hook/CS had always been a main character/ship on the show, and Rumple, Belle, Rumbelle, and Emma had always been framed/written as unsympathetic characters and a ship that the GA was supposed to consistently root against from day one. But that’s not how it was set up, no matter what A&E and these writers try to insist otherwise.

Hook was meant to be a guest villain, but A&E and these writers got distracted by him so much so that they decided to make him a regular by setting him up with Emma out of nowhere, having him take Neal’s place in the series, retconned the beauty of everyone else’s original characterizations, developments, and storylines on the show to make him look more “sympathetic” without actually doing anything to build him up that way organically post 3A, and made him the entire lead of the show.

Emma started out as a badass, compassionate, selfless, and sympathetic underdog for the little guy and the main protagonist on the show from day one until they forced her together with Hook, and ruined her to set them up post S3.

As for Rumple, he had always been written as a problematic fave from day one. I acknowledge that he had done horrible things that I could never realistically excuse, but from 1x08-3A there was a deeper sympathetic motive for why that was always explained on screen. He quickly became a fan favorite who the GA quickly sympathized with and rooted for as a sort of anti-heroic underdog, who with had a genuinely beautiful, believable, and consistent characterization and struggle for redemption that we saw, and expected to continue to see regularly once we saw his tragic and unfair backstory, and we learned about his love for Belle and particularly Bae and saw how everything he did he did out of love for them. We saw that he had a bizzarely adorable friendship with David, and we saw that he, Belle, and Neal were always willing to offer advice, compassion, emotional support, and understanding when he brokenly and honestly opened up to them for it by offering it in without enabling his bad choices, mercilessly judging him with negative assumptions without asking questions first, or giving him a chance to open up to them honestly, acting hypocritical, acting like they were so above him and incapable of having their own flaws and making mistakes, or making him feel guilty for not giving up magic for them. Belle had always had the short end of the stick on the show when they made her a regular because she often got fridged for Rumple’s man pain from S2-S3, but they outright destroyed everything that made her a great character to begin with from S4-S6 to prop up Hook/CS, Zelena, and Regina by turning her against Rumple, even when it didn’t make any sense for her to do so. When Hook/CS became the lead of the show, Neal was killed off. Rumple and Belle’s consistently sympathetic and complex original characterizations and development/redemption arcs in the narrative got so horrible butchered, and the two most important relationships in his storyline all got abruptly thrown under the bus and trashed on this show by A&E and these writers for roughly five seasons with bad writing, even in the final season when they decided not to fuck up Rumple’s redemption arc halfway through, just so they could prop up Hook/CS, Zelena, and Regina by shitting on him.

I don’t want to have to deal with watching another TV series where beautiful, complex, and relatable fictional characters and ships are abruptly made OOC, and/or outright destroyed in favor of stupid plot twists. I don’t want to deal with watching another show in which the creator(s), writers, and/or network have Gary Stu/Mary Sue pet characters/ships, who abruptly get unfair preferential treatment from the creators and writers in the narrative on the show with my personal favorite characters/ships getting abruptly, cruelly, and unfairly thrown under the bus for their benefit.

• A show that is run and written by a team of people, who don’t offensively enable, encourage, or casually dismiss ableism, abuse, rape culture, incest, racism, and sexism in the tropes they use in the writing for their individual characters, the relationships between them, the plot devices they sometimes make them use, especially if they let them get away with using them, and the plots they set them up in-

I had to watch every character and relationship on OUAT get tainted in canon with all of these offensively problematic issues in the the tropes in the writing for them in one way or another more and more from day one of this trash show of wasted potential in ways that disgusted me, including all of my faves, such as Emma, Rumple, Belle, and Rumbelle, just because A&E and their team of writers never learned from their mistakes, and refused to do so.

I don’t want to deal with that shit again on another show, or try to justify it, especially not in characters who often don’t get how problematic what they did or said is because the creators and writers behind them refuse to understand how problematic their writing for some of the things they make them do and say actually is in canon, and refuse to address it, no matter how many times the fans call them out for their shit.

I don’t want to have to deal with watching another TV series where beautiful, complex, and relatable fictional characters and ships are abruptly made OOC, and/or outright destroyed in favor of stupid plot twists. I don’t want to deal with watching another show in which the creator(s), writers, and/or network have Gary Stu/Mary Sue pet characters/ships, who abruptly get unfair preferential treatment from the creators and writers in the narrative on the show with my personal favorite characters/ships getting abruptly, cruelly, and unfairly thrown under the bus for their benefit.

• A show that is run and written by people who understand how to portray realistic reactions and fallouts to trauma and untreated mental illness in their characters by acknowledging that it exists and that it happened in the narrative, and allowing them to get help for it when they reach out for it. Instead of pretending that it never happened to vilify a character by refusing to allow them to get help, or emotional support from loved ones, even when they do try to reach out to them for it honestly, or work on being better to constantly make them feel like they have no choice but to revert back to self-destructive behavior, trying to prop up the character who traumatized them, or simply because the characters, who were traumatized in their narrative are the “good guys,” and the “good guys” aren’t allowed to have realistic reactions to trauma and mental illness because they are “strong” and the “bad guys” are “weak” from the ableist show-runners and writers point of view-

I dealt with watching this shit on OUAT for five seasons from season one, and from the spoilers I read about season six and seven after finally quitting, it didn’t get any better because A&E and these writers are hacks.

• A show run and written by people, who don’t make it so blatantly obvious that they are emotionally manipulating you with false hope by dangling a carrot before your eyes, only to abruptly snatch it away with a cruel “shock” value twist in their storytelling that becomes incredibly and disappointingly predictable when dealing with it as a viewer for five to six seasons-

Look, I get it, bad things happen in life. However, it becomes predictable bad writing and cruel storytelling when it becomes obvious that you are being emotionally manipulated by show-runners and writers with false hope for your faves. It becomes predictable bad writing and cruel storytelling when there is an increasingly obvious pattern in the narrative of the types of characters/ships that these writers abruptly and inorganically screw over out of nowhere after giving their fans false hope for them in the narrative, only to deliberately and cruelly screw them over for cheap “shock value, and/or to prop up their faves by displacing all of their shit onto their default scapegoat character through making him or her look bad without actually doing anything to have their Gary Stu/Mary Sue faves truly do anything to prove that they are reformed.

Were D&D and Scott Gimple too stupid to think to think that fans of their shows would ever realize that they often tended to abruptly kill off the purest living cinnamon rolls cruelly and abruptly in their show’s universe every season for shock value out of nowhere after giving their fans false hope on Game of Thrones and TWD?

Were Adam and Eddy too stupid to realize that Dearies/Rumbellers would ever realize that they abruptly and cruelly mostly turned their narrative against Rumple and his loved ones to prop up all their lame ass faves and CS after they killed off Neal and brought him back from the dead to make him an on-and-off-again trickster, even after spending the first two-and-a-half seasons of OUAT building up Rumple as a consistently sympathetic, emotionally complex, and redeemable character on the show?

• A show that is written and run by people who understand how to give their endgame romantic couples and familial relationships realistic, consistent, complex, healthy, in-character, and well-written conflict and resolution-

A&E and their team hacks often lacked the desire and ability to write realistic, consistent, complex, healthy, in-character, and well-written conflict and resolution between their characters, especially in later seasons. The only main living romantic couple, who remained mostly untainted in canon by their increasingly OOC, gross, unhealthy, and unrealistic character assassinating plot fuckery romantic soap opera angst in canon post 3A by S6, was Snowing, and that’s only because A&E and their team of writers didn’t care enough about them to give them any significany screen time, or any interesting storylines post 3A.