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ominous-meme · 3 years

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Speculations and Questions about Free! The Final Stroke Pt. 2

WARNING: MAJOR SPOILERS OF PART 1 UNDER THE CUT

Okay, so I’m writing this on desktop because it’s gonna be looooooooooooong. Tagging @caffernnn since they’re also keen on speculating and have welcomed my brainrot.

Having watched The Final Stroke and broken my heart over it and the trailer for part 2, I’ve been wondering what exactly might happen in the next movie, because it’s likely to be the final major installment in the series, and there are several plots and character arcs that need to be wrapped up within a max of 1.5-2 hours (given the runtime of Pt. 1). Note that my Japanese skills aren’t the greatest, so I’m basing my theories and questions off what I understood during the movie and from posts of other viewers whose skills are better than mine. It’s also possible that some of these speculations have been inspired by other meta posts whom I have forgotten about, so please do let me know if that’s the case, and I’ll tag/cite them appropriately! (Part two of this speculation can be found here)

Guide:

S1 - season 1

S2 - season 2

S3 - season 3

FS1 - final stroke pt 1

FS2 - final stroke pt 2

So, what are the things that could possibly happen?

1. Early on in FS1, we learn that Kaede and Ryuuji (whom I hate now) have known each other for several years, and Kaede’s brother? cousin? was seemingly the childhood friend who got into an accident, making Ryuuji have to choose between his friend and his career. Now that Haru has done what Ryuuji “suggested” in terms of cutting Rin off and getting the creepy purple eyes, it’s possible that we the audience will get a greater insight into Ryuuji’s past through Kaede’s perspective, and/or Haru’s friends will encounter Kaede and learn through a conversation with him what exactly went down and why Ryuuji is the way he is. It might also show us how KAEDE became the semi-scary dude we catch glimpses of in S3 and FS1. Mikhail might also be involved here, since he and Ryuuji were rivals, and might tell Rin more about their past as well, giving Rin some clarity on what the hell Haru was on during their confrontation at the end of FS1.

2. Now that Haru has cut Rin off and turned to Ryuuji’s side, there may be at least ONE official swimming meet/tournament where Haru displays his new strength and destroys his enemies a la Albert. But that will be a very different Haru, and his friends are going to be shocked, because his swimming style obviously wouldn’t be what they know is genuinely his. Haru will shut everyone out and focus only on becoming stronger and winning under Ryuuji’s tutelage, and Makoto, Rin, Ikuya, and the others will attempt to snap him out of it. This may lead them to Kaede via Hiyori, and he’d give them a better insight into wtf is up with Ryuuji’s obsession with giving up your loved ones to win.

3. We still haven’t gotten a look at Albert’s past. How did he become the way he is? Why is that old man in a wheelchair calling him a machine? We HAVE to get that insight into Albert, given the effect he’s had on Haru and his swimming abilities and perspective since S3. That definitely has higher chances of happening than some of my other speculations.

4. Free has always centred itself around the value of the medley relay. It’s what kicks the whole story off and has been the central point in both S1 and S2. It fades away during S3 somewhat, but Ikuya and Hiyori participating in it plays a key role in their relationship towards the end. In the trailer for FS2, Makoto VERY CLEARLY mentions something along the lines of it being “400m” towards the next goal, and I believe it was @caffernnn who speculated at first about it implying a relay. I would strongly agree with that, and I think that to get Haru’s head on straight, his friends are going to drag him into a medley relay (formal or informal), and remind him of what swimming truly means to him. In addition, he'd remember that even if he's swimming a solo race, he's never truly alone, because his friends are supporting him from outside. That then raises the question: who would be IN the relay? I think it will be the three with whom Haru has the strongest emotional connections, both inside and outside the water: Makoto (backstroke), Ikuya (breaststroke), and Rin (butterfly). Whatever the results of the relay are, I think it will give Haru some clarity, and enable him to recognize who he’s become and what he wants to be, particularly as he approaches 20 in the coming months - the year he’s supposed to be “ordinary.”

5. Rin and Haru may compete together in one last freestyle race. The ending of S2 showed them taking their positions for one such, and KyoAni has repeatedly done these throwbacks to older seasons, the latest of which was in the trailer for FS2 where they showed the original water commercial with the guys. It wouldn’t surprise me if, in a callback to previous seasons, Rin challenges Haru to a freestyle race in order to see whether Haru is actually as good as he claims to be now that he’s gone all cold and Albert-like. The question would then be, what will happen if DESPITE cutting his loved ones off, Haru STILL loses? That would call into question Ryuuji’s entire policy and whether Haru hurting Rin so badly at the end of FS1 was even worth anything, since Haru can’t even beat someone who doesn’t specialize in freestyle as much as he does in butterfly.

6. Haru will likely get back to his old self, or maybe become a new version of himself that is better - unless KyoAni decides to be particularly sadistic and denies us a happy ending. Both S1 and FS1 have referenced Haru waiting to turn 20 and become ordinary, and given the canonical birthdays of the characters, Haru is literally six months away from reaching that age. Summer is also when many of the major tournaments would happen. So how will Haru view his abilities once he’s reached that age? Will he celebrate his 20th birthday during his purple-eye phase or afterwards? I think Haru will eventually come to terms with who he is, and find a way to swim that allows him to take on the world and win WITHOUT compromising on the things and people that mean so much to him. It’s possible that if Haru gets rid of Ryuuji, then Makoto will become his coach and guide him to that balance, since he understands Haru the best.

7. Now, in S3 when we heard about Ryuuji’s past, many of us remember that the next shot was of Makoto who (thankfully) was spared in FS1, despite many of us worrying that something bad might happen to him. However, there’s a chance that Haru may be forced AGAIN to choose between his friends and his success if FS2 has something bad for Makoto in store, particularly given the strange vision Makoto had in FS1 about losing sight of Haru. Will Haru be able to leave MAKOTO of all people behind? Even if he’s in his purple-eye phase?

8. I’m sure I’m not even the only blog to have considered this, but they’ll definitely be bringing all the time capsules out by the end of the movie, and reflecting on who they’ve become.

One thing is for sure: the soundtrack is going to be badass as always. Unfortunately, I don’t know if the movie will end with Haru being in therapy, because God knows the poor guy needs it now.

So these are my speculations and questions about what we might expect to see in April! Feel free to add in your own thoughts!

#free!#free! the final stroke #free! the final stroke spoilers #final stroke spoilers

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gra-sonas · 2 years

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I deeply apologise for this, I honestly don’t have anyone else to talk to about this and you’re so nice and kind that I feel like I could do it with you. Please, ignore me if you want to, you don’t have to answer or post this. I’ve recently started writing fics (my first time doing it), and I’ve published 3 of them so far. But I cannot help but feel like they are bad, that I shouldn’t be writing them. I don’t get many "hits" and the ones that I get, don’t leave kudos or anything which makes me think that people hated it. They are "short" (the longest one has 4000 words) and I feel that that is not enough. I’m just having a hard time. I know that I shouldn’t care about if people like it, if they comment or leave kudos because I’m writing for me and all of that. But I really can’t help feeling like shit about it and comparing myself with other fic-writers out there. And every day I’m struggling with the idea of wanting to just delete everything. Maybe I just don’t have the mental state to deal with things like these and maybe I should just stop. Thank you for reading and I’m sorry again, you don’t have to answer this. Have a great day!

First of all, there's no need to apologize for anything, nonnie. *sends you a looooooooooooong virtual hug*

Secondly, I'm so sorry that you're feeling the way you do. Putting any kind of creativity out there is always nerve-wracking, especially when you're "new" to doing it. I can imagine how difficult this must be for you, especially bc you don't have anyone to talk to about it.

When I posted my first fic (well, technically not the very first, but the handful of things I wrote long before RNM don't really count imo) 3 years ago, I was dying inside. If it hadn't been for lovely fandom friends, I NEVER would've posted it.

As a non-native English speaker I always felt inadequate/not articulate enough to write in English, plus a million other things I thought my writing was lacking, so I never even tried (before RNM I hadn't written anything in over a decade). Until Malex came along and the urge to write was so overwhelming that I gave it a shot.

And man, I'm so happy that I did. But again, I only posted it bc I had friends who beta-read it for me, who encouraged me and told me it wasn't in fact crap. And lo and behold, I've written a couple more fics over time, and I feel more confident about it nowadays (still dying inside tho when I post something new, that will probably never change :P).

Something that's really hard is not comparing your own writing to that of other writers - especially those who get tons of kudos and comments. In that same regard, it's really hard not to compare the number of hits and kudos your fics are getting to the numbers other writers' writing generates.

Anyway, comparing ourselves to others, that way madness (and unhappiness) lies. Looking at other writers' writing as an inspiration, YES, comparing our own writing to that of others, NO. Easier said than done, I know. :/

Anyway, I think what could be really helpful to you, is joining one of RNM (I'm assuming that you're writing RNM fic, if not, please replace that with the fandom you're writing for) Discord servers. Many fandom writers gather there, chat about fics, bounce ideas around, organize writing sprints, offer beta-reading, and so on. Getting input from others is just so cool and reassuring.

Additional plus: when you post a new fic, there are already a couple of people who know about it and they are often willing to signal-boost a new fic with reblogs.

As for the length of your fics: 4K is amazing, but by far not a necessary word count to attract readers. Most of my fics are shorter, and while I'm certainly not the queen of Kudos/comments, people are kind enough to read my fics. So, really, shorter fics are absolutely okay.

I really hope you'll reconsider re deleting everything. It would be a loss - for the fandom, but also for yourself. You put a lot of work into writing these stories, be kind to yourself and just take the [current] lack of "interaction" for what it is: you are new to this, and most people probably just haven't realized that there's a new writer in town. (Also, if you're writing RNM fic... fandom is still in total hibernation mode, I really hope that changes when S4 starts airing)

Sending you lots of love and writerly encouragement, nonnie. Please keep writing. Please keep putting yourself out there. And most importantly: find "your people", a "cheerleading squad" (and if it's just a squad of one person, squad is squad!) that has your back.

YOU CAN DO IT, I BELIEVE IN YOU! ❤️

P.S.: Funny enough but I'm not a member of any of the open RNM Discord servers, so, if anyone knows of a server or even runs one, please drop a link in the comments or send me a DM and I'll add a link to this post, thanks! 🙌

#nonnie asks

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niko-jpeg · 3 years

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The SAVEd Project Master-Ish Post

“The SAVEd: A self proclaimed “team” of four surviving beings from scrapped, destroyed or collapsed AUs who managed to SAVE shortly before the destruction of said AU, allowing them to exist in a blank void of nothing as something similar to Outcodes. Thanks to the work of W, they were able to meet under very strange circumstances… These four more often than not go by the names ‘Beta’, ‘Ai’, ‘Mist’, and ‘W’.”

Howdy! It's me, Jpeg, and that weird description of a group that I just wrote is a rough run down of the dumbest idea for a project yet. I titled it “the SAVEd project” and if you read the description above, then it may be clear why. In this semi Masterpost (more like a concept post) I’m going to list the characters and their overall bios. If you don't care about this, then I understand. If you don't feel like reading all of it at once, I’ll link the individual posts at another given point in time.

It is also likely that the plot for the project will be written out a while before I make a black and white comic version of it so I have more time to get the character designs down and until then, feel free to ask questions if you're interested. And if youre not and you think Im a stupid wanna be, then thats fine too. I don't care.

In case it is not obvious, this is a fan project made by someone who's not the greatest with digital art since I still don't really know how to use my art program. Ai is the only truly original character of mine and was not based on anyone. Beta, Mist, and W are my takes on characters and the non existent AUs they're from belong to me, but the concept for Gaster, Chara, and Sans belong to Toby Fox. I hope that makes sense. Anyway, I'm going to go in that order too. Beta, Ai, Mist, and W. That's also the order I drew them in lol. Anyway, enjoy (sorry about the fact that this is inevitably going to be a very looooooooooooong post).

Name: “Beta” Dreemurr

Age: 11 (Incapable of aging)

Gender: Male

Soul Type: Red (Determination) fading into Light Blue (Patience)

Physical Features: Hair covers left eye, and scar covers right. He can see through his right eye, just like Frisk can even though their eyes also appear to be closed. Baggy jumper that resembles Classic Chara’s sweater. Locket was a gift from his AUs Asriel. Always walks around barefoot, and is the shortest of the group (not shown to scale in the drawing above). Does not appear to have a mouth physically, no one has any idea how that's supposed to work or if he uses photosynthesis or not-

Personality: Mute, but very expressive otherwise. Likes defenestrating people he doesn't like and is pretty chaotic. Can be chill and a good child sometimes. Sometimes. Always wandering off.

Name: Ai

Age: 16 (Incapable of aging)

Gender: Female

Soul Type: Green (Kindness)

Physical Features: Fluffy medium length tan-ish hair and light blue-grey eyes. Where's a pure white dress and leggings and white boots. Gold star hairpiece is a solidified SAVE point.

Personality: Tries to be serious and the ‘mature adult’ of the group even though there is in fact a real adult in the group. Was kind of adopted by W. Has a very dirty sense of humor and swears a lot.

Name: Mist

Age: 18

Gender: Male

Soul Type: Purple (Perseverance) but like, monster

Physical Features: Looks like any other sans, albeit a little shorter and younger. Sewed jacket and scarf. As he was homeschooled by his very busy father (W) he had a lot of down time in between lessons. (A note about their family. Papyrus is not present in the timeline as he was sent to train with Undyne in the capital. Mist and Papyrus were adopted by W at a young age when they were abandoned by their parents, their father being W’s brother. Papyrus’ nickname is Vapor.)

Personality: Overall relaxed and very dedicated to spending every waking moment of his life doing something. He can't just not do something. Mah bois a little hyperactive. Loves creating things and reading, overall the most open minded and creative of the group. Usually the one coming up with crazy plans and sometimes they even work. Has the slightest bit of survivor's guilt.

Name: “W”.D Gaster

Age: No one really knows...

Gender: Male (He/They)

Soul Type: Gold (Justice) but like, monster

Physical Features: One cracked down the front of his face, the other painted on because he thought it’d be funny. Usually wearing a labcoat of sorts and always keeps I.D on him, even after his AU collapsed. Golden eyes represent his soul type technically speaking, just as Mist’s Purple eyes represent his.

Personality: Tries to be the serious responsible adult but just cant hack it. Will get revenge on people who have previously hurt him or his children. Dad jokes galore. Mist is constantly asking him to not embarrass him in front of his friends and W takes it as a challenge. Sciency and overall just a dad friend, but literally. Rather than the usual "OooO spoopy scary bad dad man" hes "OOOOOOOOOO I see LIGHT am I dead?" crack head energy when hes not trying to set a good example for Mist and the others.

This post took all day to write and I poured two hours of work into each of these pieces of art, so I would appreciate if this post doesn't go to complete waste. So if you made it this far, thank you! If you have any questions, I think my asks are working? I dunno no ones ever asked me anything.

#undertale #Undertale au #the SAVEd Project #God I hope this is an original concept #gaster #w.d gaster #Mist!sans #Sans #Mist #Ai #Beta!Chara #Please this took all week to make this #Support would be appreciated #If people dont show interest then I'll scrap this and try something else #All I need is one person to show interest in this #have a good day!#niko.jpeg

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hellzyeahwebwielingessays · 4 years

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Superior is INDEFENCIBLE Part 2: Odds and Ends

Part 1

As a little follow up to this post I want to wrap up some defences I have encountered for both Superior #2 and the Superior storyline in general.

To start with we have more hypocrisy from the man I once admired as he tried to defend his position on Superior.

He was challenged on his primary argument that Peter and MJ’s separation justified her obliviousness now that they are back together; for further details see the above linked post.

In response to this challenge he said:

“I think there is more to my argument then "They've lived apart for a year" and her relationship with him during that time doesn't have to hold relevance to their relationship after being apart.”

Like…this guy was for fucking real.

OF COURSE their relationship back then is going to hold relevance to their relationship after being apart.

Obviously with the benefit of hindsight Nick Spencer’s run proves this to be the case. And you can refer back to my prior post where I dive deeper into the topic.

However, in that post I was talking about the specific nuances of Peter and MJ’s relationship.

What’s mind boggling is that in the above quote he’s making an even bigger reach. Jesus Christ OF COURSE their past relationship is going to hold relevance for their then-current one.

That’s how relationships work!

FFS, romantic or otherwise everyone’s relationship with everyon else is shaped by the past. This is like arguing Peter hating Norman for killing Gwen Stacy doesn’t have to be relevant to their relationship after his return to the Clone Saga.

I mean shit dude, Peter’s high school romance with Betty Brant was relevant to their romance after he graduated college!

This is how all types of relationships work. You don’t just jump in after awhile, start fresh and then nothing from the past has any bearing on the present. Even in the most positive of scenarios the fact that you are getting together again would still be shaped by the fact that you liked each other in the first place.

And for the life experiences those two shared that’d go a thousand fold.

Now let’s move on to some over miscellaneous comments sent to me a looooooooooooong time ago.

I’ve had this stuff in my drafts for years!

For the sake of catharsis I’ve decided to clear it out. It revolves around Superior Spider-Man and the comments I’m responding to were made before the original volume ended in 2014.

“Rob Wrecks wrote:Why would Aunt May even react to it? She doesn't even know the identity of Spidey now.”

In Civil War she was able to tell that the Chameleon, a MASTER of disguise who was being more subtle than Otto was, was not her nephew.

Whilst she might not know he is Spider-Man she knows her nephew so she should react and become questionable regarding his change in demeanor and behavior. What’s the old saying ‘A mother always knows’.

“As for MJ, they aren't even married anymore either. Sure she remembers who is under the mask. But I doubt she's gonna bring trouble on herself for prying.”

I address a lot of this in this post.

Basically, not being married anymore has nothing to do with it. This woman lived with this man for years (five to be precise) and had a very close relationship with him which involved countless tragedies and traumas. That doesn’t just go away. This is to say nothing of the fact that she has known this man for about 10 years and has been his friend and girlfriend during that time. In fact in Stern’s run when she knew who he was but didn’t let him know, she was depicted as knowing him better than anyone and was able to read him as a book. This was back when they weren’t as close as they are now, hadn’t known each other for as long and she didn’t know him as intimately as she would later come to down the road. In ASM #290 Peter himself says MJ knows him as well as he knows himself and this was before the marriage.

Even in Slott’s run this depiction of Mary Jane knowing Peter better than anyone else was highlighted in various stories like Spider Island, a time travel arc, Alpha, and a Lizard arc at HORIZON labs.

In JMS’ run Peter and Mary Jane were shown to be somewhat in synch even though they were separated at the time and had been for a long while going back. This was showcased in ASM V2 #50 and they had been effectively separated with minimal interaction as far back as ASM V2 #13; arguably even issue #1.

And yet she understood him and knew him very well, falling back into synch with him when they reconciled. Yes there was some awkwardness and them getting to know each other again but it was not on the same level of Otto guzzling champagne, creating spider bots, talking in a manner which was unlike the way he’s ever spoken before and MJ just wondering passingly then dismissing it. This woman has lived through the Chamelon, robot parents and clones and lives in a world where friggin Skrulls have invaded.

This out of character behaviour should send off alarm bells. She DOES clock something is off in Superior #10 but only when he says a phrase she’s never heard him say before. He was doing shit MUCH more out of character before then and she was dismissing it.

Later she was STILL dismissing the notion that Peter wasn’t himself as merely crazy on her part.

Again this woman knows Peter can be/has been cloned repeatedly. This woman even for awhile believed Peter himself was a clone so she knows even memories can be replicated. But Peter is acting so obviously NOT himself that it’s practically SCREAMING at her that she should get this. In fact Peter’s ghost point this out which is Slott lampshading the situation. That doens’t make it good writing that’s just pointing out how bad your story is.

“Hasn't she (I'm guessing he's referring to Aunt May?) been focused lately on her new marriage though? I don't read enough of Spidey these days so I'm only going with bits and pieces I've read about here and there.”

What does being married recently or focusing upon it have to do with anything?

In Civil War she was focused upon not dying because Peter’s ID reveal had upended her life.

If you are someone’s MOTHER and have raised them all their life you will absolutely be able to tell when something is wrong, when they are in fact not the real deal.

“As for MJ, who would she go too? Not like anyone would likely believe her unless she had a telepath scan her mind.”

Who would she go to? I dunno maybe the fucking Avengers or Fantastic Four who are Peter’s friends and team mates. Or maybe not go that far why not go to Black Cat, Human Torch or Daredevil . These are all people whom she knows (at least vaguely in regards to Daredevil) personally and have access to technology that can prove things one way or another.

Even if you argue that it’s not fair bringing in the wider Marvel Universe, Black Cat, Carlie, HORIZON labs, the Bugle staff and Scarlet Spider are all Spider-Man franchise characters.

“Now there could be a possibility she's making a list of his behavior and the like and is just waiting for the right time to say something when she knows she's less likely to die from it.

Maybe Slott's just got something going that'll eventually be revealed? Who knows.”

Oh boy, that didn’t stand the test of time did it?

This is just shitty analysis on principle. It hinges upon blind faith and writing stuff in your head about what characters are doing behind the scenes.

There was NEVER an indication MJ was doing anything like that and her actions actually contradicted event he idea of her doing any of that stuff.

The net responses are to the statement that Doc Ock was a gentleman who would treat women with respect.

“Keyword there, 'was' a gentlemen. I can imagine after years of defeats at the hands of Spidey, certain habits would change and he wouldn't care anymore.

It could have just been a subtle change that no one really noticed. He did try and end the world before #700 if I recall right.”

You need to SHOW those habits changing. The last major Doctor Octopus story before BND was in JMS’s run when he was very much a gentleman. You can’t just say his illness and defeats suddenly transformed him into a would be rapist. It’s utterly out of character for him. It’d be like bringing back Ben Reilly and making him a mass murderer. WHY is he a mass murderer.

(Fun fact. The stuff I bolded about Ben Reilly was something I wrote at the time. I kept it in because of how sadly ironic it wound up being…fuck Clone Conspiracy seriously)

Ending the world before #700 is one thing IN Doc Ock’s character. He is egotistical and wants acknowledgement of his genius.

Superior depicted him going against a character trait he’s always had. In his origin story, when he was ‘courting’ Aunt May, when he was involved with Stunner and Lady Octopus and the like he has always been show to have a respect for women and not had to resort to cheap ploys to woo them.

In Superior he was trading off of MJ’s relationship with Peter and Peter’s memories to basically abuse this woman. That is beneath Doctor Octopus. He is an intellectual a man for whom such actions are debase, the realm of the common thug whilst he is much more he is DOCTOR OCTOPUS.

BTW in Web of Death it was established that Doc Ock probably would not target MJ or Peter’s family even though he knew Peter’s identity.

So for him to suddenly switch to ‘I’m gonna fuck his girlfriend to get one over on him” is again utterly out of character.

‘Web of Death’ was co-written by Tom DeFalco btw, who established Otto’s origin. Thus the argument is flying in the face of someone who helped define the character with no explanation at all.

Slott had done this with other characters like Ashley Kafka.Suddenly the most naively compassionate woman in the world who believed she could redeem CARNAGE is saying this lesser serial killer is a complete monster. That is piss poor writing.

Even if Slott WERE to establish and show how Ock went from one extreme to the other it doesn’t make it a good idea. Doc Ock would be rapist is a lot less interesting than Doc Ock the lone super villain who is part gentleman and part humanitarian with a respect for women. If this was Norman Osborn in Peter’s body, or Electro, or Shocker I’d believe these actions.

The topic then changed to Carlie Cooper’s depiction in Superior as a goddam idiot who isn’t even telling MJ Peter might be evil. “Red Hood wrote: Carlie and Wraith followed Ock’s paper trail because she knows for fact that peter parker doesnt have the money to fund his own private army, the reason she hasnt said anything is because it's not such a good idea to go pointing fingers without absolute truth, remember eddie brock and how he was so sure about the sin eater?”

Carlie’s investigation was going incredibly sloooooooooooooooooowly. Not only was it dull reading, but it made her completely unsympathetic. Why not warn Mary Jane by saying “Look before he died Doc Ock told me he and Spider-Man had swapped bodies. I’m not saying Peter IS Doc Ock but just....be careful MJ”.

Or why not inform the Avengers or Fantastic Four about this. Sure the Avengers gave him a physical but they wouldn’t know what to look for. And why is Carlie Cooper all of a sudden saying “Wait I KNOW Peter doesn’t have this kind of cash so this is a big clue that he isn’t himself.” When her first big clue should have been that time Spider-Man SHOT SOMEONE IN THE FACE!

“also peter and mj arent married anymore.”

See above.

You don’t just suddenly fall out of knowing someone if you’ve been THAT close to them and known them for that long just because suddenly you are not married anymore. She has deduced subtle differences in the Chameleon and clones before this but Ock is NOT being subtle whatsoever. He isn’t even talking the same way he normally does. And Mister Red Hood even says so himself, Carlie can tell right way. His co-workers whom he’s known for LESS THAN A YEAR can tell something is up. But the woman who’s been closer to him than ANYONE in his life, she can’t tell. That is bullshit of the highest order.

“1. mj and peter arent married anymore, idk if they were married in identity crisis but remember how after the deal with mephisto they were separated for x amount of years before she even came back to new york, i can see her not being able to tell peter is acting different at that point. aunt may and the avengers though don't get a pass especially when carlie who knew him the least could tell right away.”

See above.

When you separate from someone you’ve been that close to those feelings don’t just disappear. This is especially true of people who’ve been through immensely traumatic events together. Soldiers often find that only fellow soldiers, specifically ones who were with them in combat, can truly understand what they went through and how they felt. It creates an emotional/mental bond. Same thing here. Peter and Mary Jane went through Venom, Kraven’s Last Hunt, the death of Harry, Gwen, aunt May, Ben Reilly, the clone saga as a whole, Civil War, Peter’s OWN death, Maximum Carnage and so on. They’d have that kind of connection I was speaking about, you don’t just forget it to the point where you let MASSIVE differences in behaviour slide, especially massive differences in behaviour which are different to the way he was acting LAST WEEK!

“3. Also i don't think his [Doc Ock’s] actions are entirely out of character, i mean he was dead, then revived, beat down for several years into a dying body. given time to think about all the things you would do if given another chance i dont think its out of the question for doc to say "great, second chance at life with a movie starhottie gf". also if you'll threaten the city, then the world, then mind swap with someone i dont think having sex is that big a stretch.”

See my comments above why this IS out of character for Doc Ock. Again this isn’t just him wanting to get laid this is him potentially date raping an innocent woman. You need to SHOW the progression of that change

And rape in comic book fiction is understood to be worse from the reader’s POV than the various Saturday Morning Cartoon style crimes he’s pulled.

The next comment was in response to the public’s indifference towards Spider-Man shooting Massacre in the face! “7. As far as no one caring about massacre, didn't he break out a few times and inflict his namesake? no one is going to care that a killer like that gets shot, humans aren't dignified at all. i can see aunt may saying something but no one else is going to be like "oh great that killer is back in jail, too bad all criminals break out" no they're going to be like "finally someone put down this thug, maybe my life or someone i care about will be spared from him at least in the future" and maybe it was caught on security cameras or phones but maybe they deleted it, i mean spider-man just shot a dude in the face and if he wanted there would be nothing anyone could do to stop him from putting the hurt on someone else”

This is just rubbish.

No one is going to care? For God’s sake the police in real life get reprimanded for using unnecessary force.

The law is the law you CANNOT publically execute an unarmed man. And my point was no one, not even Mary Jane or Jonah, were reacting to this mind-blowingly out of character action on the part of Spider-Man. Maybe they do not care that Massacre was killed but they should be wondering “Jesus that’s not like Spider-Man at all”. This was Spider-Man becoming absolutely EVERYTHING Jameson ever falsely accused him of and no one reacted. And I am sorry but the attitude of ‘human’s aren’t dignified so they’d react like THIS” is extremely broad and generalised. This would be a major talking point and a major issue. This is EXACTLY what the entire ‘Civil War’ debacle was about. Super heroes running unchecked doing as they pleased. It’s been what, a year tops Marvel time since Civil War? If that stuff was deleted YOU NEED TO SHOW IT. The cover story is that EVERYONE in that massive crowd covered for him. That is in no way shape or form how humans actually act. And who would there be to stop like a teenager or a kid or a lone person in the crowd from tweeting “OMG Spider-Man just shot this dude” or uploading a video or picture. They were CHEERING him on they wouldn’t be afraid of him being reprimanded. Once something like that hit the internet it’d spread like wildfire, it wouldn’t be something that if immediately taken down would die away, especially when THE NEWS was stating Spider-Man had ‘neutralised Massacre’ and then Massacre shows up dead, WTF would the public THINK happened?

“Aaron Alexander Luthor wrote: Superior is an excellent title, but I feel you approached it having already made up your mind. Doc Ock NEVER attempted date rape, and I don't know where you get that from”

Boy, I wonder where I got the idea of Otto trying to rape MJ from? What an obviously ‘excellent’ title.

Trying to sleep with Mary Jane whilst tricking her into thinking he is Peter Parker then that is categorically trying to date rape her. He didn’t go through with it because he discovered he could just wank off to her memories (I can’t believe I wrote that) but that is exactly what he was trying to do. Maybe to HIM he didn’t think of it as rape but yeah that’s exactly what it was.

“He ripped off his own shirt, not hers.”

I honestly have no idea what he’s talking about here btw.

“Mary Jane had/has mentioned several times that there is something wrong with him and that she thinks there is something strange going on, he also hasn't spoken to her in weeks in the time frame of the comic.”

Yes MJ has noticed passingly things are wrong but then he feeds her a line and she buys it or otherwise she dismisses it herself. This in monumentally out of character for her given her history and makes her incredibly stupid, which is the ONLY way this title could have worked out. Again, she lives in a world of Skrulls, clones, LMDs and shape shifters one of which is literally an enemy of Peter’s and has tried impersonating him multiple times (targeting her specifically twice). But she either doesn’t clock anything is wrong or doesn’t really react when she does. And he HAD spoken to her within weeks by the time or Superior #2.

“Same goes for Aunt May, he visited her the first few weeks as Parker, and hasnt spoken to her since. He is basically ignoring the people in Peter's life, and they have taken notice.”

See my response about Aunt May not knowing. Again, this woman RAISED him and she could tell when the master of disguise who was being a lot more subtle about impersonating Peter was not her son/nephew.

Also he wasn’t exactly ignoring the HORIZON labs staff was he?

“When he killed Massacre, some of the civilians were shocked and appalled, but when the police investigated all the officers on the scene lied for Spidey, because they think he did the right thing. That is why the only officers still interested are Carlie Cooper who does know, and is ACTIVELY trying to prove it isnt Peter, and Captain Watanabe aka The Wraith”

My point about NO ONE taking photos, tweeting, facebooking or whatever still stands as does the security cameras thing and the fact that Massacre was TRYING TO GET PUBLICITY. Again with Carlie why is she not warning SOMEBODY at this point. It isn’t like they wouldn’t believe her after Massacre. It isn’t like Spider-Man isn’t acting weird. It isn’t like body swapping is a legit THING in the Marvel universe. For God’s sake this happened to Captain America!

Kaine, the CLONE of Peter Parker with identical memories and everything. In the Sibling Rivaly crossover between Scarlet Spider and Superior Team-Up even HE couldn’t tell that Peter. Was an imposter This guy doesn’t just know Peter well, he IS Peter. And Otto was ranting none too subtley about how Kaine has bad blood with HIM. He doesn’t say he’s Doc Ock but he’s conveying unsubtly to Kaine that he is not Peter Parker and he is not TALKING like Peter Parker either. When his CLONE is still operating under the delusion that he is Peter Parker that’s put it beyond doubt this was ridiculously contrived.

“BTW, Carlie and MJ have talked about the suspicious way Pete has been acting, Carlie just hasnt told MJ directly.”

WHY didn’t Carlie tell MJ! And WHY were she and Peter noticing Peter’s different actions yet being totally blasé about them.

FFS in ‘Kraven’s Last Hunt’ MJ and Peter had been married for just 2 weeks and in that time she was able to deduce from his actions that the guy in the Spider-Man suit was NOT Peter. In the Mark of Kaine an identical clone of Peter approaches her and she is ultimately able to tell (twice) that he is not her husband. And she did this whilst pregnant and stressed out from a life or death situation to say nothing of the fact that Aunt May had recently died which would be weighing on her mind. Yet in Superior her mind was clearer and she was still buying this was Peter. This is enormously bad out of character writing for her

“As for the Avengers scans, it wasnt that no one could read them, its that they all came back NORMAL.”

No, the scans DID NOT come back normal at all. Doc Ock looked at the scans and could TELL something was not normal because he saw ghost Peter was in his mind. Yeah there was a tiny inconsistency in the brain waves but why the heck weren’t there people on the Avengers team that day to take note of stuff like that. Cap, Wolverine, Black Widow and Thor are obviously NOT going to be able to properly read this scientific equipment like Iron Man or Hank Pym or the Beast. ANY of those guys would’ve been able to tell but no only the Avengers who categorically would not be able to properly read the brainwaves were there. Why? Why get the unscientific Avengers? Because of plot contrivances is why.

And where were the telepaths? One telepathic scan from SOMEBODY should have told all. And again these tests come back normal....no one thought he could be a clone? Spider-Man has joked to these people about his clones, they know about them. Correct me if I am wrong but at the time of the Avenger’s physical of Peter wasn’t there a character involved with the Avengers who was supposed to be the living universe? SHE couldn’t tell Doc Ock is Spider-Man? The universe literally didn’t know this?

“Even Dr. Strange and Wolverines tests all came back regular.”

If Dr. Strange with all his power wasn’t able to deduce the truth that’s even MORE contrived!

And what the heck were Wolverine’s test? That he smelt the same? Of course he would.

“There was a tiny inconsistency in the brainwaves, it wasnt that no one could read it, its that it was so small that no one would even take notice of it, except for Peter or Ock if they were to look for it.”

See above for why this is bullshit.

“And the Avengers are STILL very suspicious, if you read the current titles.”

At the time a ‘current title’ was Superior Team Up #1.

In it the Avengers told him they were wrong to put him in probation and are still just ‘suspicious’ when he INVADED SHADOWLAND WITH AN ARMY!. Because THAT’S so usual for Spider-Man right?

“You're entitled to your opinion, but you cant just make up facts and call it a discussion. I get the impression that you a)Havent read the whole series; b) Had already made up your mind before reading the issues you have read; and c) Havent read the companion stories (i.e. Avenging Spider-Man, Superior Team-up, Hickman's Avengers titles). If you look at the story as a whole, its actually quite good.”

Said the guy who got all the above information I outlined WRONG.

From a technical point of view it doesn’t make sense, it uses contrivances and out of character writing to keep it going. You want to write Doc Ock as Spider-Man. Okay then don’t surround him with people who should be able to figure this out. Or say there is some kind of device redirecting their attention.

Don’t have Doc Ock not act like Doc Ock because that defeats the point of the exercise. Don’t go for deliberate sensationalism or crass storytelling which was essentially everything revolving around him hooking up with Mary Jane and then the oh so lovely page of the Superior Spider-Wanker.

That issue in particular even resolved itself in a contrived manner. Doc Ock begins uttering gibberish which recalled One Moment in Time about “we cannot be together because it’s an unsolvable equation blah blah blah”.

Basically he is saying “I can never be with you because of the danger I put you in”; which is Slott using the character as a mouthpiece.

In the next issue Otto began courting a student at his college because consistency rocks. Even Ghost Peter is out of character at this moment “WOW Ock you did the one thing I could never do and walked away from Mary Jane”. Peter is right he probably can’t walk away from Mary Jane but...does he WANT to? Where the heck is this coming from? What is worse is that it’s so unnecessary. There was a MUCH better explanation for Ock breaking up with MJ. If Ock were in character he could just come to the conclusion that sleeping with MJ under these circumstances would be wrong and beneath him hence he wouldn’t go through with it. If Ock was out of character as he was in their issue but still vaguely in character he could just come to the conclusions that since accessing Peter’s memories he’s begun to have genuine feelings for MJ and doesn’t just want to fuck her, it would involve him having a relationship with here which at this point in time he is incapable of, he doesn’t know how to handle it. I will wholeheartedly admit I was not jazzed about the concept of Superior from the outset. If nothing else I want to read about Peter Parker not Doc Ock and if I did want to read about Doc Ock AS Doc Ock, not as Spider-Man and not as an rotting body.

An arc in a comic is one thing doing this long term all the problems I foresaw have come up as well as some I didn’t even predict. This could have worked if Doc Ock was separated from Peter’s supporting cast who should be able to tell something is amiss but then that defeats a lot of the point of the story. It was a lose-lose situation.

People can enjoy garbage if you want but don’t call it gold.

Part 1

#The Superior Spider-Man #Superior Spider-Man #Dan Slott #otto octavius #Doc ock #Doctor Octopus #mjwatsonedit #mary jane watson #Aunt May #May Parker #Mary Jane Watson Parker #MJ Watson #Peter Parker #Spider-man #Civil War 2006

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