invidiatechdemo

[invidiatechdemo]

Bunch of potential Flower King Dark World Talk

People have been talking about potential stuff with the flowers encouraging Asgore's problems narratively/being clingy, and something that's stuck in my mind is Miss Mizzle / HolywaterCooler mentioning the Bluest Flower specifically; as a result I have unfortunately developed an unlikely but really funny opinion:

. . . I hope the Bluest Flower in contrast to the other flowers is a boss (possibly a secret one? unsure) who cares deeply about Asgore but wants Asgore to move on, instead of continuing pursuing the 'get family back together' stuff, possibly in direct contrast with the other flowers theoretically...?

I also think it would be a REALLY fun direct contrast/narrative foil to Tenna, who hates thinking of the divorce, who wants the family be together again, who accidentally reopens little wounds here and there by talking wistfully about the old days, to have one of the literal expressions of Asgore's refusal to let go in the form of one of the flowers from a wedding bouquet under glass turning against the idea. This also works wonderfully with the fact Toriel's name in Undertale is initially shown in Blue.

Probably would turn that flower to stone soon after the boss fight, but... I think it would be fun!

I think it also works narratively with the fact Asgore keeps trying to give Toriel bouquets that get dunked in the trash, also.

Additional thoughts/some general thoughts and opinions about character ties:

-Holywatercooler's lines are as follows:

"The Bluest Flower, A disciple of my speech

Shy to no camera, And a specimen of

Elegance and kindness.

Should you meet, Please give my regards."

The mentioning of a camera, imo is not Just a reference to the wedding photo; TV World sure has a good number of Camerathings, after all, does it not?

This combines with a second point of interest:

Shuttah has a lot of interesting dialogue, but I want to call attention to this:

"There once was the great wilderness here!

Yes... But, the world became the theater, and us, children of Tenna's contract.

Those that did not sign the paper, set off for the far land and were forgotten.

Now... only the legend old hermit still knows the way to the place."

Now, the far land and being forgotten is a pretty on-the-nose hint for Forgotten Island, especially with references to the hermit.

... What about the 'great wilderness', then?

I think... The 'great wilderness' was because there used to be more flowers and plants in the house. Asgore's mentioning that 'these flowers are still kicking' implies they used to be in Toriel's house, especially with the mentioning of the climate being bad for them.

Many other plants probably also used to be there, at one point or another. And the fact that it's SHUTTAH mentioning these, a camera! When we know from Miss Mizzle that the Bluest Flower is 'shy to no camera!'

My other most evil opinion is that 'Those that did not sign the paper set off for the far land and were forgotten' is not JUST about Forgotten Island but also about THE DIVORCE, considering how Chapter 1 events with the playing cards and toys is reflected in the lore of those items.

Those who left for the far land can then also mean 'items that went with Asgore to Flower King', and those who stayed in Toriel's house, and with Tenna and the rest, 'children of Tenna's contract'.

. . . Asgore has his own CRT nowadays, after all. :]

[invidiatechdemo]

most alt a deer girl can get before people (her mom) start getting scared.

dess attempts. might redo design/try some alternates

[invidiatechdemo]

Yup! I also sort of think that this type of dynamic with Kris is Also Relevant to the fact that Tenna is primarily focused on having Susie and Ralsei when talking and keeping those two entertained, because, well. Those are Kris' friends... right? Like, the new viewer angle is also huge imo, but the general pattern being 'Kris might have fun if people they care about have fun' imo is very important too to this.

Hope it's okay to yap about a slightly distant from Kris topic, but your mentioning of Tenna being quite aware Kris is not particularly taken in by escapism/ Tenna being 'not sure if they love tv'; I think based on some scenery details and stuff Tenna says to Kris if you go back and talk to him after Susie talks to him, I personally am of the opinion that Asgore and Asriel, Specifically, were the biggest users of the tv outside of holiday (ha!) get-togethers. Like. "* By the way... Seen your father recently? Your brother?" and then talking about Asgore, followed by profusely apologizing is suuuch a 'keenly aware Kris doesn't like tv that much, and doesn't want to be reminded of Asgore pre divorce era' thing, To Me. I also think the fact Asgore /has/ a CRT in Flower King also leads me to this idea, but idk. What do you think?

yeah yeah absolutely makes sense to me... asgore being the main one leading "watching TV as a family" nicely explains why Kris left while Toriel was still watching. it wasn't a gathering thing any more, it was just, like, her wanting to watch the cooking channel and the news sometimes. no more getting excited about cowboy show with Asgore

[invidiatechdemo]

ok one passing tenna thought: i think one of the things going on with him is that he Knows, whether or not he'll admit it, that the dreemurrs and holidays didn't gather purely to watch TV. he wants to reunite everyone because that's when TV Happened, but I think he knows it's not actually in his power to make any of the dreemurrs happy when they're on their own; Asriel and Asgore left, Kris stopped watching, Toriel turned the TV off. he was important, he was useful, but he was never actually the star, and as much as he tries to make himself one it falters.

he's not really much of a show host, honestly, especially with the fact his only method of actually appealing to people is guilt trips. he's not nearly as charismatic or self assured as mettaton, he's not creative or inventive (it's all reruns and edits), he's not really meaningfully in charge of the other darkners, he's Fun and he's Giving but he's not Running Things and it shows more and more

this is why I do think he'll be much happier as mettaton's tv, because, frankly, mettaton is an actual tv fan. he's Getting Things from watching, he's learning about himself and the world, and he's already starting to put his own spins on things and give creativity Back. Mettaton is engaged and interested in what Tenna has to offer, rather than just having TV as "the thing that we do at family parties as an excuse to sit around and enjoy pie together"

[invidiatechdemo]

A child in Gaza holds his cat among the rubble. No home. No safety. No food. Yet he still protects someone more vulnerable than himself. In a place where everything is under attack, mercy survives..Support those who kept their humanity.

[invidiatechdemo]

working on thumbnails and realizing you have to actually redraw when you upscale *vaporizes*

[invidiatechdemo]

snd_howl is so cutes so i'm putting it here so i can listen to it.

[invidiatechdemo]

I mean, to humor the joke theory premise, the prophecy does say " THE PRINCE, ALONE IN DEEPEST DARK..." and titan spawn in their description say "Appears in places of deep dark." which is a very similar phrasing to the prince prophecy mural, so honestly? Ralsei being titan-adjacent isn't completely unreasonable, especially considering motifwise the like. Gradient between dreams and nightmares / escapism and fear.

Like, the fact Jackenstein exists at all and is also themed around fear even as a Darkner, and has similar mechanics to Titan Spawn certainly makes it seem like this sort of thing probably does also exist as a gradient re: Darkners themselves?

If the entire 'Titan Spawn = darkner heartless' thing panned out, Ralsei would be like. the ansem seeker of darkness' of titan spawn (horrendously mean thing to say). He's already got the robe for it and everything. It's fiiine.

Partial joke theory that Ralsei isnt even a true darkener and is actually a titan spawn in disguise hence why he looked like a funny shadowbug thing in Ch 1.

But on a more serious note all the info we get in Ch 4 really makes me wonder what the heck is up with Ralsei's fountain and why is it like that? Why can that one specifically handle ALL Darkeners and none of the other ones can? There's other things too like it being in a Dark Supply closet not really affecting much it feels like? Cause like while a lot goes on the Church due to two fountains being next to each other... two were next to each other in Chapter 1 too! And titan spawn like the shadow bug things show up in the first sanctuary while the thing that chases you in the dark areas are one of those fetus things. I DID notice one of the Rudins had its colors... fade slightly though I dont know if that's anything to seriously take note of. Just. So many questions...

im so tied to horn headband ralsei/Somehow Influenced By Kris ralsei like. him looking so like Kris' fursona for no reason would confuse me so much. he can be a titanspawn tied to the horns maybe???

@craftlands hypothesized that the storage closet works for all Darkners because. any object can be put in storage lmao. as for the dual fountains not interacting I'm not sure; churchworld seems to have more going on than Just "2-3 fountains intersecting", like why it doesn't have a ruler and has the statues from the fountain that hasn't even been made yet.

my best guess on the bluedinn: the seven flying aces in the ch3 egg room are missing a member

[invidiatechdemo]

oh huh, weird!! that still makes the fact that post-patch you Cannot throw it away baffling/eyebrow-raising, like you said in tags

I've been thinking a lot about the fact that Kris' title changes to 'Sheath' after the final sword route fight, and how this works in concert with the 'Without play, the knife grow dull' line, and the possibility that Kris' current circumstances with it was arranged for a purpose, considering Kris' hidden agendas and discussions on the phone about promises, and mumblings of needing the soul for things (likely the banishment of fountains/own life to continue as it stands).

In this metaphor. If Kris is the cage, if Kris is the sheath, if the Red Soul is the knife, a tool to reach a goal they want dearly, no matter the cost, then when that discard line for the Hot Cocoa happens in Weird Route after all of the horrible shit that happens, it-

[invidiatechdemo]

i think it's interesting considering ch 4 also once or twice deals with 'eternity' / endlessness / not wanting things to end when susie is talking about what ending she wants, for certain.

hey the like three umineko fans who read this and understand my thoughts on kris and [redacted]: how are we feeling abt kris constantly comparing themself/being compared to nonhuman objects bc im feeling things abt it.

[invidiatechdemo]

to answer your question in tags: if you try to throw out the hot cocoa asgore gives you after kris beats the crap out of the trashcan with the red soul in it in the bathroom, you can't, and narration says this dialogue. o:

it may just be generic text for trying to drop things on weird route, but it's. odd. that would be something on the cocoa...? I've seen it in a couple weird route differences vids.

I've been thinking a lot about the fact that Kris' title changes to 'Sheath' after the final sword route fight, and how this works in concert with the 'Without play, the knife grow dull' line, and the possibility that Kris' current circumstances with it was arranged for a purpose, considering Kris' hidden agendas and discussions on the phone about promises, and mumblings of needing the soul for things (likely the banishment of fountains/own life to continue as it stands).

In this metaphor. If Kris is the cage, if Kris is the sheath, if the Red Soul is the knife, a tool to reach a goal they want dearly, no matter the cost, then when that discard line for the Hot Cocoa happens in Weird Route after all of the horrible shit that happens, it-

[invidiatechdemo]

I've been thinking a lot about the fact that Kris' title changes to 'Sheath' after the final sword route fight, and how this works in concert with the 'Without play, the knife grow dull' line, and the possibility that Kris' current circumstances with it was arranged for a purpose, considering Kris' hidden agendas and discussions on the phone about promises, and mumblings of needing the soul for things (likely the banishment of fountains/own life to continue as it stands).

In this metaphor. If Kris is the cage, if Kris is the sheath, if the Red Soul is the knife, a tool to reach a goal they want dearly, no matter the cost, then when that discard line for the Hot Cocoa happens in Weird Route after all of the horrible shit that happens, it-

[invidiatechdemo]

need people in the deltarune fandom to start making angst animatics with Eigenstate Garden so bad (epilepsy warning if you check the video for that.)

[invidiatechdemo]

This is a critical time right now in ensuring the ability of Palestinians all over occupied Palestine can communicate with each other and outside. Please donate to Crips for E-Sims Gaza.

[invidiatechdemo]

i need to rip the hold controller version from game but there's a bunch of headtilt ones and each one makes kris more miserable/blank-looking than the last

lil beepo's misery is increasing: the image sequence.

i also got these so maybe it's okay though

is it me or the lightning (when playing the shadow mantle game) makes kris look gray. like.literally theyre gray. am i going insane please tell me

they definitely look really grayed out at some points yeah. concerning

[invidiatechdemo]

these are ripped p much directly from the files but yeah, in the minikris attack susie bit you can briefly see kris with head not tilted fully down and see the normal blue tone (top one) and yeah. the difference is not only VAST they are also actively frowning a little compared to normal :| face alongside turning gray/pale in second image

is it me or the lightning (when playing the shadow mantle game) makes kris look gray. like.literally theyre gray. am i going insane please tell me

they definitely look really grayed out at some points yeah. concerning

[invidiatechdemo]

I think that would make sense! I think another aspect is like. Kris feeling that small bit of hope in this specific situation sort of feels like... being able to work up that small piece of hope there does not always equate to being able to face the Full Scope outside of the game (the game Kris is playing, not the player)...

Pretty wide chasm between 'thinking about the concept of denying promises made/escaping from the things binding them in a video game' and 'oops Knight is here Right Now'.

suddenly realizing on my 500th listen of Burning Eyes that it has the spear of justice motif in it. hm

huh. why the fuck is that there