manic-pixie-aquarius

[manic-pixie-aquarius]

The fact that i've heard waaay to often people theorizing that in the end everyone is gonna realize they have to kill Will to destroy the UD ....... hey, What Show Are You Watching? cause I dont think we're watching the same show. You must be mistaken.

Not only is that trite, tired, and cliché, it's corny. Like everyone's gonna be gathered in a group and then look at Will and go 'welp🤷🏽‍♀️ guess we gotta kill him' please be serious. If it was a similar case, it would be Will sacrificing himself willingly, none of his loved ones are going to kill him, be for real.

[manic-pixie-aquarius]

All of this, yes. But this part is so so powerful and I think sums up season 5 perfectly

Something Happened to Will in the Bathroom: and it parallels The Massacre at Hawkins Lab

CW: Implications of child abuse or possible CSA (non-explicit)

Will is a subversion of feminine horror tropes:

The Kidnapped Woman/ Damsel in distress

The Haunted Heroine

The Possessed Woman

The bathroom (in horror) is a liminal space to express exposure, transformation, vulnerability, terror and violence—especially for women.

Will has the most scenes of any character in Stranger Things which take place in a bathroom (Nancy is second).

Will's bathroom scenes are always associated with fear

Scene 1) Will + bathroom = scary Upside Down flashback

Joyce expresses concern and Will is dismissive (he lies).

Scene 2) Will + bathroom = The sense that something is wrong.

Scene 3) Will + bathroom = Joyce expresses concern (fear) and Will is dismissive again.

Scene 4) Will + bathroom + evil + "I'm not gonna hurt you" = fear

Scene 5) Will + bathroom + exposure = fear

Secrets and privacy

After Will is possessed by the Mind Flayer, Joyce expresses concern and Will is dismissive (lies) again.

Password = "Don't enter without my permission."

Mike: "Bathrooms are private."

Friends don't lie.

Mike: "Friends tell each other things that parents don't know."

Grooming

El is groomed by both Dr Brenner (Papa) and Henry.

Threat + coercion = a key + secret agreement

"Do exactly as I say."

Hopper: "He had a key, right?"

Joyce: "You think I don't know what goes on under my own roof?"

Secret meeting = "Be quiet." + "It's going to be a bit scary."

"If he finds me, he will find you." = "If I get in trouble, you get in trouble."

(Threat + coercion).

Manipulation + coercion = compliance

The illusion of choice: "This was your choice."

El complies with Henry's wish—but was manipulated into thinking it was her own idea.

El gets the sense that something is wrong (in a tiled room...)

Walkie talkie = communication

Friends don't lie + Friends tell each other things that parents don't know

Mike: "Bathrooms are private."

Confirmation and affirmation that something is wrong.

Henry's hair and appearance changes = "I see you differently now."

The abuser's true colors are known.

"You tricked me." = "He made me do it."

Resistance

El fights back and succeeds (she has superpowers)

Will tries.

1979—The first gate is opened

The doorway (gate) is opened by a key which emits energy.

Gate = wound: opening vs healing

Psychological wound = trauma

Memories are lost but the trauma is still there.

1983—The second gate is opened

El attempts to make contact with Henry (Dr Brenner's orders)

Will has a lightbulb moment (realization, recognition, illumination).

1984—Will is diagnosed with PTSD

Will's reaction when he encounters the Mind Flayer:

Anxiety—goosebumps and the feeling of being “frozen” in fear

The inability to “breathe or talk or do anything”

A sense of evil and impending doom: "I felt this evil, like it was looking at me.”

“Looking at me” = exposure + invasion of privacy.

Will reveals the Mind Flayer does not want to kill him—it wants to kill everyone else.

Henry did not want to kill El—he wanted to kill everyone else.

Homophobia and victim-blaming

Ted: "You see what happens?" = victim-blaming mentality

What happens = "He was probably killed by some other queer."

Lonnie = used to say Will was queer

Lonnie: "That boy was never very good at taking care of himself." = victim-blaming mentality

The implication? This is just what happens when you are queer, and Will should have defended himself better.

El was blamed too (despite being a victim)

"What have you done?" = what she was coerced into doing by an abuser.

The blame is internalized

Will = feels like a mistake. El = feels like a monster.

El's powers alone were not enough to make her feel like a monster:

It's her fragmented memories of the Hawkins Lab massacre (and internalized blame) that made her feel that way.

Is Will's queerness alone enough to make him feel like a mistake? I don't think so, actually:

It's his fragmented memories of the bathroom (and internalized homophobia and blame) that make him feel that way.

1987—The gates will close

The story isn't over until the gate (wound) is closed (healed).

In 1987, Henry/ Vecna and the Mind Flayer will be confronted and defeated.

And when that happens, El and Will will finally have the chance to heal.

Henry abused and killed children. El is going to protect and save them.

(She will not become the monster he is).

Lonnie blamed Will’s abuse on his queerness. Will is going to save Hawkins—with his love for Mike.

(His queerness is not a mistake).

[manic-pixie-aquarius]

Oooh had a thought reading this (kinda similar to the suggestion made at the end). What if Will starts feeling very unsafe at home -- likely due to Lonnie, maybe he's drunk and scaring Will, either way looking to take out his frustrations on Will-- and because of that Will flees the Byers house, practically mirroring his abduction in season 1, and he decides to go to the Wheeler house instead because he feels safe with Mike. Mike would of course immediately take him in, but then Jonathan would realize Will was nowhere to be found, go through the motions (looking in Castle Byers, the shed, etc.) before ending up going to find Will at Mike's house, worried sick, but glad to find him alright.

Idk, obviously this doesn't exactly connect to the school set, but it's not confirmed that this scene takes place there, is it? I'm not the one to know😭

Really really excited about this leaked argument between Mike and Jonathan though, it seems real based on how we saw them interacting last season, Jonathan has a lot of significant and almost biting glances at Mike, so I think they were definitely trying to lead up to a real conversation between the two of them

Why I think the flashback scene in ST5 is about Lonnie (and Mike and Jonathan's complicated relationship...)

CW: This post discusses potential spoilers and mentions implied abuse (It's about Lonnie, after all...) proceed with caution!

So, we already know about the casting call for a scene featuring 8-year-old Mike and Will, and 13-year-old Jonathan.

I've had multiple thoughts about what this scene could be (so many possibilities!) but after reading a leak regarding this scene, I've finally settled on (an admittedly speculative) theory.

(Of course, not all leaks are accurate, so take this with a grain of salt. And if you’re avoiding spoilers, consider this your cue to stop reading!)

Based on the leak, here’s what we know about the scene so far:

It is not a supernatural or horror-based memory (unlike Will’s 1983 flashbacks of the Upside Down).

It takes place on a school set (likely Hawkins Elementary, which makes sense if they’re reusing sets e.g. Holly Wheeler’s school).

The scene includes multiple parallels to Season 2.

This made me wonder: what Season 2 themes involving Mike, Will, and Jonathan could be echoed here—without needing the supernatural?

It’s difficult to answer because Will’s entire plot in Season 2 revolves around the supernatural. Namely, his possession by the Mind Flayer. But if this flashback isn’t supernatural, maybe the show is drawing on what the Mind Flayer represents: trauma, fear, and abuse.

The Mind Flayer as an allegory for trauma and PTSD

I don’t need to make this section long—most fans are acutely aware that the Mind Flayer is associated with trauma and PTSD. This is supported by the fact that these hauntings begin when the anniversary of Will’s abduction approaches, and that Will is diagnosed with PTSD by Dr Owens. The only thing that people may need convincing of, is that the Mind Flayer (and Upside Down) serve as allegory not just for trauma, but for Will’s specific trauma concerning his father. @greenfiend has an excellent series which delves into this theory.

Will is good at hiding

Season 2 also clearly shows us what Will's primary trauma response is: He initially freezes, be he also runs and hides. The way Will ran and hid behind the stairs on Halloween seemed practiced to me. Like he had done this before. He doesn't panic, and he doesn't keep running. He chooses to close his eyes and hide in a self-soothing position.

In fact, Jonathan himself has said that Will is good at hiding:

He wouldn't know this if he hadn't witnessed Will hiding before. In fact, Will being good at hiding implies he is also difficult to find.

It would make sense for us to see this play out: Will hiding, and Jonathan attempting to find him. And if Mike is also there, and we're paralleling Season 2, then that means...

Mike is good at finding

Despite Will being good at hiding, Season 2 also showed us that Mike is good at finding him. There are three Mind Flayer associated scenes in which Mike is the one to find Will, and in two of them, he's also the one who breaks him out of the visions.

He spots him outside the arcade:

He's the first to find him at Halloween: "I couldn't find you!"

And he's the first to find Will outside Hawkins Middle on the field: "I just found him like this!"

The 1979 Theory

If we're able to acknowledge that the Mind Flayer serves as an allegory for trauma and PTSD, then the gates which allowed the Mind Flayer to penetrate Hawkins (and Will by extension) are also relevent.

Interestingly, the first gate was opened by El in 1979. In this flashback—if Mike and Will are aged 8 years old—that means it also takes place in 1979.

I've made a fairly visual (rather than analytical) post about what I think may have happened to Will in 1979 and how it parallels the Hawkins Lab Massacre.

(Content warning: while nothing is explicit, the subject matter involves implied child abuse).

TL;DR: I believe Lonnie’s abuse escalated in 1979, and it marked a significant trauma for Will—one that he likely repressed or fragmented, much like El did with her memories of the massacre. That would make 1979 a foundational year for both of them: the year their “gates” were opened.

Jonathan’s guilt (the Mike vs Jonathan argument leak)

Additonally, there is a leak which claims Mike and Jonathan will get into an argument about Will's safety this season.

If this ends up being true, I think it will feed into this flashback scene as well. Specifically, Jonathan's guilt and possible quiet resentment of Mike.

I say resentment because Jonathan has made it clear that he views Will as his best friend. He also took on a somewhat parental role helping to raise Will, despite only being 4 years older. He likely feels that Will’s safety and wellbeing is his responsibility.

However, the show has also told us that children aren’t always honest with their parents/ family, but they usually tell their friends everything:

Once again, I’ll point to my previous post about 1979, and the fact that I believe there is something concerning Lonnie’s abuse that Mike is somewhat privy to, that Joyce and Jonathan are not. Because Will told Mike things he didn't tell anyone else.

Jonathan on the other hand, is concerned and insecure that Will no longer comes to him when he needs help or advice.

He said so himself in Season 4:

Jonathan also has a track record of not being around when bad things happen to Will—or not being the one to "rescue" him—but Mike usually is:

Will was at Mike's house before he went missing, and Jonathan was supposed to be waiting at home for him. While Jonathan was focused on capturing the Demogorgon, Mike was focused on finding Will.

Will was trick-or-treating with Mike when he was chased by the Mind Flayer, and Jonathan was at a party when he was supposed to be supervising Will. While Jonathan was partying, Mike brought Will home to his place.

When Will was possessed by the Mind Flayer, Mike stayed by his side the entire time, while Jonathan met with Murray to expose the Hawkins Lab scandal.

It was Mike's memory of meeting Will for the first time that allowed Will to (partially) break out of his possession and use morse code.

None of these are Jonathan's fault, but he has clearly expressed guilt:

If an argument does break out between Mike and Jonathan this season, I think it will be fuelled by exactly that: Jonathan’s quiet resentment and frustration that Mike keeps “butting in,” keeps (trying) to protect Will in ways that Jonathan believes should be his responsibility.

And if emotions run high, I wouldn’t be surprised if Mike snaps back with something like, “Well, I’ve actually been there when Will needed someone. Can you say the same?”

Likewise—Jonathan, who is aware of Will's romantic feelings for Mike—would find that quite rich coming from him, as he's witnessed his brother's heart break.

So for Mike to throw Will’s emotional well-being back in Jonathan’s face? That would cut deep. It would feel hypocritical. And that’s what would make the fight so compelling—two people who love Will deeply, clashing over how to protect him, while unknowingly tearing open wounds they both helped shape.

In this post I point out that Mike and Jonathan's "heart-to-heart" conversations with Will in ST4 were very similar: they were both seeking reconnection with him and expressing concern that they have become distant.

This tension will culminate in Season 5.

How it culminates (my actual theory regarding the flashback)

I speculate that the flashback will show Jonathan arriving at Hawkins Elementary to pick Will up from school, only to find out that Will isn’t where he’s supposed to be. But not because he got lost—because he’s hiding.

The reason why Will is hiding may not be explicitly stated, but it's because he's scared to go home—scared to see Lonnie.

Jonathan will search for Will, but it will likely be Mike who finds him first, or Mike who is already with him (and alerts Jonathan).

Mike also might already have an inkling as to why Will doesn’t want to go home. Because friends don’t lie. Because friends tell each other things they don’t tell parents.

He might even offer to let Will come stay at his place—a callback to what he does years later in Season 2, when he says he’ll "take him home" and brings him to the Wheeler house instead.

This flashback will be seen from either Mike or Jonathan's perspective, as Will's memories of 1979 are likely spotty. It will also highlight the dynamic between the three: Jonathan and Mike are both similarly protective of Will due to their affection for him. But this also creates wounds:

Because Mike feels helpless to protect Will from harm, even if he is always there for him, and Jonathan is frustrated by Will's habit of repressing and hiding his pain.

Well, that's my theory. What do you guys think the flashback scene will be about?

[manic-pixie-aquarius]

Was considering changing my layout bc I've had this one for years now, and given how I relate to Will so much and talk a ton abt Byler I figured it might be appropriate to change it... But then I realized how much I overexplain myself in every post and i'm like oh wow. Woah. Yeah I forget sometimes that I am very Very similar to Robin in my neuroticism and autism-codedness. Like yes. If I were to make a pie chart of ST characters that are representative of my true spirit, i'd have it split into 3 major slices. 1. Will, the biggest slice. 2. Robin. 3. Mike (basically equal). And then we'd have some smaller pieces which would be Jonathan, Max, and El.

[manic-pixie-aquarius]

Rewatched The Goonies today (as phenomenal as ever) and had a thought: what if Mike and Will get wet from a similar stunt as the Goonies?

Aka: falling into water (obv not exactly like this, lmao)

Also another thought crossed my mind today: What if there's a parallel to Mike jumping off the cliff where this time El isn't there to save him, so Will jumps in after him and yknow, that's when the kiss happens, rest is history. (based on another scene that happens shortly after this one).

-/ side note: the athleisure in this film is exactly how El's s5 outfit looks, so the costume dept did a great job making her an authentic outfit, despite all the hate it's gotten

It's no surprise that ST is heavily inspired by Goonies (and every other iconic 80's movie) so idk ! these are my thoughts ! Maybe the things i'm touching on (loverslakegate) are obvious, but i'm recontextualizing them by comparing to scenes from another piece of media (like some ppl have mentioned a Romione scene as a possible explanation for Mike + Will being wet and maybe kissing)

Do yourself a favor and watch this movie, it's just so good and fun and heartwarming and if ur doing an ST rewatch, this movie is literally like if ST was a silly low-stakes show instead of a traumatic/tragic/terrifying show

[manic-pixie-aquarius]

Guys, hear me out,

femme Jonathan x Robin

that's it, that's the post.

Just thinking abt how they're both social rejects/from a similar background I guess. I just love a futch 4 butch moment

Anyway I rlly want them to be friends in season 5 but I know they're not in the same group😔 My son needs friends :,/

[manic-pixie-aquarius]

There's this guy on youtube who does ST theories and sometimes he has some unique input that isn't totally idiotic.. But I was watching one recently where he wasn't saying his theory, and instead trying to let the viewers (me) piece the puzzle together so he could in the end reveal The Theory, it was annoying the crap out of me that he wouldn't just say his idea and then expand upon it with evidence instead of the reverse, but anyway.. It seemed like his point was basically "It was Vecna who kidnapped Will all along!😱" Boy. We Know. Will literally said that in season 4, like, right? Essentially he did when he said (paraphrasing) 'crazy now thinking back, it was Him, it was always Him [Vecna]'

[manic-pixie-aquarius]

I will never not be mad about Harringrove getting less hate than Byler by the way.

It was never about you not liking unrealistic ships.

You hated the idea of a beloved straight character being actually queer more than the idea of fully redeeming an abuser in order to sexualize them and I will not forgive that prioritization.

[manic-pixie-aquarius]

He looks like he wants to kiss him soooo bad. Like I'm trying to picture other people there in place of Will, not even connecting to what they say here, just the expressions between them, and it's craaaazyy. He does not look at El like that. He looks like he has butterflies in his stomach and a swooning feeling in his chest and like he can't even control/hide/mask his expression to be anything but authentic because he's just so in the moment, hanging on to every word Will says, in utter disbelief of how perfect Will is, agghhhhh

"Stop looking at me with those eyes."

"What eyes?"

[manic-pixie-aquarius]

Ok I FULLY intend to nerd tf out for each volume's premiere. And given that my interest in ST pervades every aspect of my life--a lot of my style is subconciously ST inspired??-- I've gotten the idea to dress up as one of the characters for at least one, if not all of the premieres for s5. I already found a green henley like the one Will wears at the start of s5, but i'm struggling with the bomber jacket he wears😕 it's so specific (obviously made by the costume designers, if not sourced) and I can't find any similar. But at the same time, I think i'll probably be sweating too much watching this season that I won't even need the jacket...

But ahhhh. Is anyone else thinking of doing this? I'm such a nerd. I'm also baking/cooking ST inspired cookies (we have lightbulb cookie cutters!!!!!!!) I wanna make ones with quotes from the show on them! Like Crazy Together, Friends Don't Lie, It was a 7, Bitchin, etc.

This is the first season i'll be watching with family instead of alone... This is my superbowl.

[manic-pixie-aquarius]

Does it ever drive you crazy?

Because it surely drives me crazy and I’ll never get over it. Not only are the characters positioned identically and the scenes are shot in the same way (except for the fact that there’s no table in between Joyce and El), El is also wearing two iterations of what is essentially the same outfit in the scenes with Mike and Hopper while the scenes with Joyce and Mike have the same context of crafting glasses that block light, and the scenes with Mike and Benny both take place at a fast food restaurant with the serving hatch in the background. The colors yellow and red are also present to varying degrees.

Furthermore, we have the dialogue with Hop in s2/ep.3 “The Pollywog”:

EL: “[Mike] said he needs me.”

HOPPER: “I know you miss him kid, but it's too dangerous. You're the last thing he needs right now.”

And the dialogue with Mike in s4/ep.9 “The Piggyback”:

EL: “I- missed you”

MIKE: “yeah, I missed you too[…]”

And the fact that both scenes function as reconciliation between the characters after a fight. I’ve written a post on this before, so you’ll find more about this HERE

Then the dialogue with Joyce in s1/ep.7 “The Bathtub”

JOYCE: “This will keep it dark for you. Just like in your bathtub […].”

And the dialogue with Mike in s4/ep.9 “The Piggyback”:

MIKE: “Okay, so, hopefully, this blocks out any peripheral light, right?”

As mentioned before, Mike and Joyce are both crafting blackout goggles for El to use in the sensory deprivation tank here.

The scene with Benny in s1/ep.1 “The Vanishing of Will Byers” has Benny speculating about how El ended up in her current condition and although I wouldn’t draw similarities between this and the particular scene of Mike and El at the Surfer Boy Pizza, I do want to point out that this is the first time we see El in the Benny’s Burgers t-shirt. A t-shirt that gets mentioned by Mike later on during his infamous monologue.

Additionally, Benny’s Burgers is actually featured as a location in s4 for the first time since s1. I personally think this is reason to believe that s4 aimed to remind us of Benny and s1 to some extent. Which then brings me to the similarities between the aforementioned scene of Benny and El and the scene of Mike and El in s1/ep.2 “The Weirdo on Maple Street”.

Dialogue with Benny in s1/ep.1 “The Vanishing of Will Byers”:

BENNY: “My name’s Benny. Benny Hammond. See? Like this, here. I got you. Don’t worry, it’s okay. Nice to meet you, yeah. And you are? *reaches for her arm, revealing the number - El flinches and pulls her arm away* Eleven? What’s that mean? What’s it mean?”

EL: “No”

BENNY: “Well I’ll be damned, she speaks.”

Dialogue with Mike in s1/ep.2 “The Weirdo on Maple Street”.

EL: “No”

MIKE: “Oh, so you can speak.”

[…]

MIKE: “Hey uhm, I’ve never asked your name. *El shows her the number on her wrist* […] *Mike surges forward to touch it- El flinches and pulls away her arm* Sorry, I’ve just… never seen a kid with a tattoo before. What’s it mean? Eleven?”

Which is almost identical. Now, considering that Mike makes a direct reference to s1 in which he mentions not only Benny/Benny’s Burgers, but also meeting El for the first time, this similarity doesn’t seem entirely irrelevant. Especially keeping in mind that the above depicted scenes look identical, this probably functions as a way to underline that Mike is clearly lying about his feelings during his monologue to El.

Mike is consistently depicted as and paralleled to someone who takes care of El, like a guardian (e.g.:“I care for you… so much” - right after bringing a plate with food on it, etc.) and while this is far from being new information (it quite possibly has been discussed to death), I will never get over the fact that they’re constantly trying to remind us of this familial relationship during scenes that are supposed to be romantic moments between Mike and El, going all the way back to:

S1/ep.8 “The Upside Down”

MIKE: “They’ll be like your new parents. And Nancy, she’ll be like your new sister.

EL: “Will you be like my Brother?”

MIKE: “What? No, no.

EL: “Why ‘no’?”

MIKE: “Because… ‘cause it’s different.

EL: “Why?”

MIKE: “I mean, I don’t know, I guess it’s not”

[…]

MIKE: “Well…I was thinking… I don’t know… maybe we can go to the Snow Ball together”

[…]

MIKE: “I’ve never been, but I know you’re not supposed to go with your sister.”

EL: “No?”

MIKE: “I mean, you can, but it’d be really weird”

[…]

They kiss and the first thing Mike says afterwards is “Nancy”

[manic-pixie-aquarius]

Need an established byler fic with this happening !

God I want Lumax making fun of Byler SO MUCH imagine them imitating them like “you’re the heart, mike!!!” “well you’re MY heart will!” LMFAOA I NEED IT

[manic-pixie-aquarius]

In season 1, the Duffers were like 'we ended up falling in love with Steve so much, we didn't wanna kill him, we wanted to keep him so he could be redeemed next season!'

Then they created Eddie Munson in season 4, not thinking anything of him, they killed him off. They said 'oh we didn't know he'd be a fan favorite!' Like did they not learn their lesson ?

Not saying Eddie shouldn't have been killed, obviously his death was important to the plot and will be a very major motivator in season 5, but this is just something I think about. How do you make a character as gorgeous and charismatic as Steve and Eddie, and not realize it?

[manic-pixie-aquarius]

Okay but i'm thinking abt how Will has a Little Shop of Horrors poster, and the fact that I need to rewatch that...

Also just thought of a headcanon that Will and Dustin both enjoy musical theatre, much to Lucas and Mike's annoyance-- they act like they hate it, but i'm sure they love it too.

Like imagine Will and Dustin like "SUuuuDDENLyy SEYmOUuuuUUR-"

Idk, Will repeating Dustin and Suzie's musical number enthusiastically is enough of a tell for me that my headcanon is accurate.

And of course the girls would also love musicals, so the party would have a movie night once a month where they watch a musical. And maybe even more often once Max has woken up and relies on audio instead of visuals.

Mike sheds a tear once and Will asks a well intentioned question, "are you crying?" and everyone turns around (embarrassing) and then everyone notices Lucas is also like, sobbing. LMFAO.

[manic-pixie-aquarius]

possible Byler proof #1356

I'm sure I posted about this before, but one of my favorite sitcoms is Will & Grace, a show about roommates of the aforementioned names, who are a gay guy and straight woman who used to date but broke up when Will came out to Grace -- aka Grace was his beard.

Now, the show starts right after Will gets out of a long term relationship with his ex-boyfriend named Michael ...

Just thought this was really interesting .....

[manic-pixie-aquarius]

Just when I thought there couldn't be more proof...

But besides that, this really cmtfu, Mike looks so happy, and then so defeated djicjsjkajdkd

Mike had to be jealous and ruin this Byclair moment smh just because Will hugged his other boyfriend..

fun fact: Mike and Lucas wore Venkman costumes and Venkman's love interest gets possessed and Will got possessed in the same season and Max got Vecna'd in s4, Will is Mike's love interest, Max is Lucas' love interest

[manic-pixie-aquarius]

I literally follow a gay couple who started dating in the 1960's... yeah they were closeted, but they had their circle, and after a couple more decades it was safer for them to be out in public. They're still going strong. Gay people have always existed, and have always found ways to exist even if they had to he discreet about it. Mike and Will being gay and in a relationship isn't impossible the way y'all think it is. I mean they've gone thru so much together already.

"b-but if mike rejected will it would be more realistic, especially to the queer experience in the 80's!!!"

ok & it would have been more realistic if steve didnt accept robin for being lesbian, wouldnt it? especially with the fact that it was also her rejecting him! but now theyre closer than ever.