profounddefendorcrusade-blog - Tumblr blog

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They all have to grow

... and by that, I mean grow EVEN MORE.

Dalv is yet to make friends.

Martlet is yet to discover herself.

Starlo is yet to rediscover himself.

Ceroba is yet to heal.

Axis is yet to experience love.

(... also, Mo is yet to enjoy life. El Bailador is yet to throw awesome dance parties.)

Clover's arrival brought each of them luck. But they each have to put in the work, too.

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the parallels

"Nobody, and I mean NOBODY, picks on this wandering weirdo but me!"

"NOBODY PICKS ON PEEPERS, BUT ME!"

Syl 'n Hater are such protective big siblings/parents to Wan and Peeps sometimes, it's adorable

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Just to clarify

Dalv is NOT supposed to be that present in this game. He's been a loner for a long time. He's only started making friends again during the events of uty. Plus, if you know his backstory… it becomes understandable why we don't see him that much. Character-wise, it makes 100% sense.

The reason why Martlet feels like she's not on screen that much (she does get a good amount of screen time) is because she's scatterbrained. That's why we never get a "full" section with her like with Dalv (Ruins), Star (Wild East) and Ceroba (Steamworks). That's why the Snowdin section focuses more on other characters. Martlet comes and goes but always means well. Again, it has to do with her personality, and I think it's clever writing, much like with Dalv.

The reason we spend so much time with Ceroba is that a lot of things have been tied to her and her family right from the start and it all unfolded perfectly imo. There is foreshadowing:

Just had to get that out quickly because I heard some people complain about this stuff.

...also I forgot to mention how some complained about Ceroba's arc "not being completed by the end of pacifist"

To that, I say: IT MAKES SENSE. She's gone through too much trauma for it all to be resolved so soon. Healing takes time (Martlet gave a nice speech). I always thought that, by the end, the whole point wasn't for Ceroba to get closure, but to TAKE THE FIRST STEP (which she did)

The difference between her and Starlo (both have been through a lot in their own way) is that he's more idealistic and hopeful by nature (as we can see after he quickly bounces back from basically having his entire life shattered). Ceroba is emotional. Too emotional. She needs more time. Let's respect that and be patient.

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Friendly reminder that Clover gave up their entire life just so monsters could maybe be free one day. This child believed their friends and everyone else would get a happy ending. They believed a good human would show up one day and that everyone would finally see the surface.

Everyone except Clover.

I still get chills.

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I feel bad for Starlo. (pt. 8)

The FF could have just told him how they felt years ago if this "damaged personality" started as soon as the Wild East came to be (which now I think only happened after Clover showed up... so... for a few hours. For a few hours was Starlo's personality "damaged"). Star is the type who'd give up anything for his loved ones, even his biggest dream. Ceroba didn't have to pretend all this time and lie to him to make him feel better (we know this whole Wild East thing often annoys her though she tries to hide it).

His friends just spilled the truth to him when he was at his most emotionally damaged (after they admitted that they didn't like or appreciate his efforts, he STARTED to break), then decided to leave him all alone. And you wonder why he cracked. And you wonder why he tried to kill Clover. Because the kid represented everything you all were shaming him for, for no reason other than he was too passionate for your taste, too willing to feel important, too hurt to face the truth of feeling like a nobody. And you were not willing to understand.

this is what ultimately broke him

No one tried to ask, "Hey Star, you doing okay? Need some help? What's about Clover you admire so much?" No, they just leave. Feisty Four, you could have quit this job long ago and gone home (but apparently they DO like the job since the gang doesn't split up; in other words it took them less than 1 day to give up on Starlo until he came to beg them for forgiveness.. sigh).

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starlo meme dump

ft. ceroba & chujin & star's kid

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I just had a weird thought

Starlo = star + lo(ser)

what's wrong with my brain

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I feel bad for Starlo. (pt. 7)

Staroba is... not my cup of tea.

Still can't get over the fact Ceroba showed so little empathy for Star. It becomes even worse when you remember she started lecturing him ALL while wanting to take Clover's soul herself and lied to his face just so she could later betray the kid. At least Star tried to fix things. She started digging deeper and deeper into her plan and in the end got forgiven really easily.

I keep thinking Ceroba sees Starlo as a childish little bro or smth and even mentions how the reason she chose Chujin was because he was "mature." Yeah he WAS more serious in terms of personality but everyone's different. Chujin wasn't morally perfect anyway

'Back when I was a naive kid, kinda like you' and 'hey, it's science. your brain is still developing' rub me the wrong way. Basically what I got from this is how she thinks only someone childish and emotionally underdeveloped would consider a relationship with Starlo

Ceroba seems to view Star as a "poor naive manchild" who needs babysitting. She feels so bad for him that she'd sometimes tag along with his antics but won't hide the annoyance most of the time.

She'll also spare him from his feelings getting hurt, which is nice but it's not her honest opinion:

She seems to show little appreciation for what he tried to do for her even though they're supposedly best pals. She says how she's been burying her sorrows in the saloon but not how spending time there even slightly cheered her up.

She envies Star's optimism but imo it sounded more like an adult envying a kid's naivety than one adult admiring the other.

And APPARENTLY the time she spent with Clover in Steamworks cheered her up a little but not what Star's been doing for her for months.

heck she didn't even notice he had been doing it for her. too stuck in her sorrows, probably

I think the reason for this is because the Steamworks reminded her of Chujin and Kanako and the life they used to have. Btw, she loved Chujin waaaay too much (and even though he's gone now she still doesn't think she'll ever be with anyone else except Chujin, she's proud of Chujin for a useless award, she still calls Chujin 'her love,' she keeps talking about Chujin's legacy and how Asgore and everyone else never believed in him), to the point she stubbornly supported him without question, only (maybe) seeing him more realistically at the end of pacifist. I just feel like Ceroba doesn't take Starlo seriously. It's not that she doesn't care about him at all, but… she definitely doesn't get him.

For these reasons, I'm not a fan of staroba.

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I feel bad for Starlo. (pt. 6)

I think the main thing we were supposed to see as Star's character flaw wasn't that he was acting proud/arrogant/reckless/badass (I mentioned that it's fine for him to act that way because he deserved it after everything good he did and obviously I still mean it 110%), but how that proud, charming guy was never the real him. He literally lost himself trying to feel worthy and please everyone in town. For years he's been acting the role (for a noble cause) but the price was him losing touch with the nerd he is.

Yet STILL, if only everyone had been a bit more gentle with him, I bet he'd have toned it down during the WE section, and even before that. But they all decided to let him know the truth at the worst possible time, right when he was supposed to make Clover his deputy. Right after they attacked the kid because they were jealous. It was supposed to be the PEAK of Starlo's day and they randomly threw the "we never liked any of this" bomb at him instead of trying to talk it out BEFORE things escalated. I'd be pissed too.

Oh yeah...

... his brother doesn't take him seriously apparently and doesn't realize that staying positive and strong 24/7 is tougher than it looks, especially with Starlo's insecurities (and yeah being a farmer is hard work, but so is being in Star's position; on the contrary, it's even TOUGHER) ...

Orion should try being an entertainer for a day and see what it's like, let alone doing it for years

...Solomon says how Star thought him and Crestina didn't support his life choices...

... and how he rarely talks to his family...

...and it suddenly came to me: in all these years, they didn't ever bother telling him that they did support him? They didn't bother trying to reach out to him more? Understand his passion (Ceroba doesn't get it either; once again, I don't blame Starlo for caring about Clover so much, that kid understood)? Have an honest talk?

No wonder Star stopped interacting with them for the most part. Maybe him feeling worthless came from his family? Who knows (or he was bullied as a kid for being a nerd). In any case, he clearly had to deal with these feelings by himself.

This man's been through some stuff.

P.S. I know he has flaws like everyone, but you've gotta ask yourself the important question: WHY? where did all this come from? But clearly nobody in his life ever asked themselves this. So it all kept building up till he almost killed his deputy for... status. He was SO desperate to feel valued and get his friends back (who made him feel less alone.. but ultimately just left when he needed someone the most, at least ONE person) that he was ready to go all the way to achieve what he'd been lacking his entire life: *feeling like he MATTERED.*

I wonder If he'll ever go 100% back to being his true self. Slim chances :'( this is him now. Half farmer half sheriff

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Flaws/imperfections of each main character

because we all have em'.

Dalv

pushes people away

clings so much to how things turned out in the past that he's unwilling to make new memories

as that one sweet corn said if you backtrack, he's a "mopey mope"

deff has OCD

not trusting

not friendly

unwilling to get out of his comfort zone

trusts his own judgement too much

he's literally me. I feel called out... thanks, Dalv. You're awesome ❤️

Martlet

unwilling to get out of her comfort zone

slacker

scatterbrained

bit of a dummy (I feel so bad for saying this; love you Marts! ❤️)

blames herself too much

anxious

not sure if she's depressed, but she DOES lack self-confidence and is a bit awkward at times

REALLY likes material comforts & nice things to the point where it was her main reason (besides not having to work too hard) for keeping the not-so-moral royal guard job (also mentions how she wants to steal jewels from the mines)

unsure of herself and her future

gives too many chances/a bit naive (to geno Clover)

trusts her own judgement too much (that getting a job as the royal guard was a good idea, that geno Clover is good deep down)

Starlo

INSECURE INSECURE INSECURE

doesn't love himself :(

kidnaps a child

overly enthusiastic to the point he literally "started a fire"

reckless (while North Star)

relies so heavily on his social image that he expects it to make him feel worthy (of love, admiration)

hides his quirks

a biiit arrogant (while North Star)

mischievous childish trickster (to Blackjack, maybe… unless Jack's role-playing the role of the "victim"; while North Star)

needs too much external validation

uses distractions to escape negative things/emotions instead of dealing with them

people pleaser

puts too much pressure on himself

ignorant (of many things such as horses and gumballs, but mostly of his and others' true feelings and desires) He just doesn't get that the others weren't having a good time, and that they wanted the old him back. He just doesn't get that all he did, he did because he doesn't like who he is and wants others to love him for his persona. Thankfully he realized it in the end

refuses to accept that he was being too much into this whole thing and instead turns to STATUS STATUS STATUS (more love, more admiration = getting his friends back)

hides his true self from the world

just wants to be cool

naive and foolish (don't even remind me of geno)

my boy's totally not perfect, gotta love him for it :)

P.s: holy heck he's the most flawed of them. Love you sm star 🌟 ❤️

Ceroba

manipulative

liar and hypocrite

pessimistic

blames herself too much

won't forgive (herself) and forget (what she did wrong)

stubborn

emotionally weak (sorry Cer, Star helps ya with this)

emotions and feelings influence her actions too much (praising Chujin even though he didn't win a prestigious award, injects Kanako the second she mentions how Chujin's dream could "come true" if she injects her, willing to brutally hit Martlet and Starlo and potentially kill them just for what she felt she had to do, aka kill Clover)

clings to the past too much/nostalgic of better times instead of making new, happy memories and letting things go (you can do this, Cer ❤️)

everyone

• willingly or unwillingly killed/almost killed a child

• ok guys, I really can't excuse this one. Sorry :(( I love you all tho :))

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I feel bad for Starlo. (pt. 5)

Most see this as a Staroba moment (not saying it's wrong to see it that way), but I'm like: why is Star’s first thought after he is brutally kicked to casually admit how he deserved to be hurt that much? He could have fallen to his death! Like, dude, stop. You're breaking my heart. Just look at how chill he sounds:

no starlo.. please be more gentle with yourself And then he says how his and Ceroba's mistakes were the same?

How??

What she did was MUCH MUCH worse. It's like comparing Papyrus to Alphys or Asgore. And I don't even hate Ceroba, or Asgore, or even Alphys. They're all flawed but well-written characters (gonna discuss the fox woman soon) But like… Ceroba not only had time to process things (and plan everything) but got support from Star. He didn't get either. The posse and Ceroba all left him hanging, all because of his enthusiasm and insecurities (that somehow nobody ever picked up on; the struggle of people who always seem happy is real) and good intentions. His entire life fell apart without him expecting it, all at once. Even worse, no one who was supposed to be there WAS there. And when Ceroba finally intervenes she basically reveals to us how North Star was someone no one liked?

I really hope she meant just who he was while Clover was there. Otherwise….

She better not be saying that, for the years this persona existed, they all hated it. That they hated this part of Star, the insecure part. They obviously wanted him to go back to being the Nice Guy™ (but like, he was always nice. The only time he was overly enthusiastic was when he met a real human for the 1st time and got to live his dream. Ceroba basically says how, well, the guy’s lived a pretty unfulfilling life before he found out about westerns. They gave his entire life meaning. She should have been more patient with him istg.)

Ceroba’s actions were manipulative. She never planned to tell anyone the truth. She wouldn't have told anyone the truth, EVER, if Star and Ed hadn't found out about her secret. Starlo on the other hand felt lost, since he got 0 support. Ceroba had Star. He gave her a free home. He was so thoughtful as to think "my childhood friend is currently crying herself to sleep, alone at home, why not give her company and ask her to stay with us?" Ceroba got a hug from Clover, lots of understanding from the kid, Martlet and Starlo. She got easy forgiveness. Star had to make up to his group himself and be the only one who apologizes. Even though they’d been gaslighting him (is that the right word for this situation?) for years apparently, or didn't let him enjoy himself for once in his life (depending on how you choose to interpret it). He even said sorry for forgetting to turn off the rock machines. Yeah, he deff goes back to Nice Guy™ AND does it pretty damn quickly when you think about it, after how much he was forced to deal with all at once ALL BY HIMSELF before Ceroba came and lectured him for the most part. He really is emotionally strong

yeah, ceroba didn't comfort star like this when he was at his lowest (bonus points for him soothing her all while grieving for the child he clearly saw as his own)

Even though she thought she was doing the right thing, Ceroba was a twist villain. Starlo was no villain. He just really hated himself, was glad to find someone who could understand both his passion and his beliefs (aka Clover), really wanted to finally feel useful and expected others to enjoy his fantasy world as much as he did. As a farmer he felt like he couldn't do anything for himself and his community. He only wanted to help the best he knew and got carried away.

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Imagine this scene

Clover and Starlo are having a duel with the Feisty Four observing nearby, but with WATER GUNS and neither is wearing safety glasses (au where Clover still doesn't know what Star looks like without his hat)

Suddenly Clover splashes him so much in the face that his hat falls off and there's a moment of stunned silence as everyone can now see Star's true face (he can't stop blushing and tries to keep his cool but fails miserably)

I wish I had the skills to draw this... oh well, maybe someone else will

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they're the same person/monster

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Let's talk about genocide Starlo

... because on one hand, I understand where the devs were coming from. They wanted to highlight that Star was not the cool, badass sheriff he'd love to be. Some pointed out how, realistically, he couldn't have defeated Clover and especially delivered the final blow (he does it in pacifist/neutral bc hes in the worst possible headspace). Star is a big softie and a "naive fool," lets be real. But still, there is one more thing that he is: caring.

He cares about the town, toursits, especially his friends. It's been shown over and over and OVER again. And i'm sure as hell disappointed he didn't bring a real gun. Yeah, he was always aware this was all play pretend, but just for a few minutes, this man should have tried to be the sheriff he never got the chance to be before.

For the sake of everyone. For the sake of justice.

I'm not even asking for an epic battle. I'm asking for a battle that wouldn't even be close to Undyne's in UT's geno. But it would be Starlo's battle. A battle he was robbed of for the sake of Ceroba getting the spotlight.. for the 2nd time. Because this dude is clearly seen as a joke by the devs. I'll ask:

Why ceroba AGAIN? she shone in pacifist, while Star was always more of a comic relief and its depressing. Especially since the genocide route ties too well with a twisted image of justice. Star values it as much as Clover, but here he could have been the hero of justice. I just have to say....

STARLO IS THE ONLY ONE OF THE MAIN CHARACTERS WHO DOESN'T EVEN HAVE BATTLE MODE IN GENOCIDE WE WERE ROBBED HES LITERALLY THE EQUIVALENT TO MONSTER KID OR METTATON NEO i'm not sure BUT EVEN MK GOT A BATTLE MODE. METTATON NEO ALSO GOT A BATTLE MODE. EVERYONE GOT A BATTLE MODE EXCEPT STARLO

He should have said... "I may not be a real sheriff by title, but my soul will deliver justice!" Or smth Then just like during the Asgore fight, he'd almost be dead, ceroba arrives, tries to protect star, gets shot by Clover, they say goodbye to each other, then, before he is about to get shot too starlo says smth like genocide undyne and that's how he goes out.

Even better, he, without thinking, throws his hat on the ground (bc he metaphorically no longer wants to admire or associate himself with humans, ever again), seeing his bff die in front of him and goes either: "I don't care if you make fun. This isn't about being cool anymore. This is about my town, my friends. This is about JUSTICE." or "No... I won't fight you/deliver justice as North Star." *pause* "I'll do it as Starlo." and the dork then just stares at clover (There'd be a "laugh" option if Clover decides to act because, well, they see him for the nerd he is) but he's DETERMINED and at this point it doesn't even matter if he's not skilled, he'd do something he hadn't done in years just for the sake of saving his remaining friends, family, and other potential victims: Starlo would fight AS HIMSELF.

But maybe he wouldn't even fight after he takes his hat off. maybe he'd try to explain to Clover violence isn't the answer like Martlet, because that's something the real him would do. He'd drop the hat, drop the gun, drop the belief that he's a badass, and instead accept that he was, and always will be, a big ol' softie. And there's nothing wrong with that.

Point is, would he actually kill clover? hell no. That would be ooc (now that I think about it, why wouldn't he, when he is able to do it in other 2 routes? And he COULD have done it in flawed pacifist? His whole world and identity crashing down and losing all his friends is terrible, losing his bff to a human he trusted and to whom he gave a gun is also terrible, but so is letting a genocidal maniac continue killing)

But he'd die knowing two things:

1)he had tried to be a real, dignified sheriff, and failed (bc he died, not bc he didn't try. In canon, he doesn't even try and THAT'S SO UNLIKE HIM especially considering the situation)

2)in his final moments, he finally became himself again

and that.. that would have been so much more satisfying than what we got.

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Starlo should be Clover's dad

Why? Because ↓

1) Both dress into cowboy-themed attire to feel braver/more important than they are

2) Clover, instead of a regular kid, wants to feel like a hero; Star, instead of a regular farmer, also wants to feel like a hero

In reality, Star is not the tough guy he pretends to be. His optimism, protectiveness and caring nature make him a hero though.

In reality, Clover started off as a scared kid who became more confident and skilled thanks to Flowey's resets. Their heroism comes from their forgiving and selfless nature and the hidden courage they got the chance to explore.

2) Both acted childish during a dangerous situation Clover came down the mountain with a toy gun so that it would bring them comfort/they'd feel more in control of the situation (if you remember, Frisk refused to play with Asriel's toys in UT, saying how they're "too old," and I assume Frisk and Clover are the same age).

Starlo brought a fake gun before confronting Clover in genocide, just to feel cool.

3) Both not only value justice, but base it on compassion

Clover's entire mission was to bring justice (avenge the kids), but along the way changed that mindset (in pacifist). Star says how him and his posse aren't bandits, tests Clover's sense of justice and morality with the trolley problem, and wants to give Ceroba a second chance despite her actions.

4) Starlo's got protective fatherly instincts

5) fatherly pride

8) a lot of monsters associate Clover with the Dunes/Wild East

9) oh and... Starlo referred to the Wild East as Clover's.... home. Twice.

he could have easily said 'Wild East'

... get the adoption papers.

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I feel bad for Starlo. (pt. 4)

p.s. it's not the last one

Let's see what nasty stuff Star actually did, shall we?

1)So first he warmly welcomed Martlet and Clover into the town

2) Once he found out Clover was a human, told Ed to fetch them because: 1) They're a human and therefore a role model. He associates humans with cowboys, who to him represent all the good, heroic qualities he wants to be associated with so he'd feel important. Better to be a sheriff and a deliverer of justice than a farmer, right? 2) he not only found a human but one who LOOKED like a cowboy aka visibly shared the same liking as him (and love for bringing justice, as he got to learn later) + he apologized for taking them so there's that

3) acted like a slightly proud, clueless dork on the stage, no harm done

charmer

4) had Martlet locked up to protect the town he built and live his dream for as long as he could + felt bad about it

4) don't know what happened inside Blackjack's based on the gun and train noises (if they fought or something), but what's definite is that Star would NOT harm anyone, especially how genuinely nice he seemed beforehand. So my guess is that this was another act (Jack knows the five are just cosplayers, so it's likely Star asked him to play along). The five often mess around but aren't violent, Star wouldn't allow it

5) believed Clover could handle a wild revolver but still reassured them (like a good dad should)

6) apologized for forgetting the safety glasses, praised Ace and thanked him

7) told Mooch how they may be rowdy and mischievous but they're not bad guys (that's why I think he did not attack Blackjack)

8) taught Clover how to attack and defend themself (he trusted the kid not to kill anyone, which is proof that he recongized the justice quality in them) + played dead to show how important it is for them to be careful with the gun

9) gave them their signature hat, but new and improved, then said:

10) thought everyone was having fun pretending to be tied to the rails, didn't endanger anyone, literally just made a cardboard train, and again taught Clover how their moral choices matter

11) lacked confidence

he would have laughed at himself if he really loved himself

12) and the many many times he praised/complimented Clover that I won't list because these moments are EVERYWHERE in this section

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I feel bad for Starlo. (pt. 3)

Starlo's friend, his BEST FRIEND, the woman who he's been in love with long ago (maybe he still is, we don't know because he's so nice as not to act on his feelings or even show them), the person who was supposed to be there for him, be understanding even tho she doesn't share the same passion, be considerate of the feelings Starlo's always been dealing with (hating being born a farmer, hating himself, hating feeling worthless and unappreciated)... Now, don't get me wrong, there were instances where she did try to understand his obsession and pretend she was into it, but it kinda just... fell flat. Even Ceroba herself admits:

Then there were moments like this:

Yeah, Ceroba's not trying too hard to "roll with his punches" here. It feels like she's constantly trying to figure out whether to be accepting of Star because he's so passionate, or annoyed because they're not on the same wavelength.

Then we get these:

Well, based on all this, you'd think she'd be understanding of him later on, at least on an emotional level (aka understand as to WHY he's been more 'selfish' and 'reckless' ever since Clover arrived,) but...

What now??

You mean how, instead of being miserble like when he was just a farmer who couldn't do much for his community, he now pretends not to be miserable by entertaining you all? Right??? Or do you mean he's changed in a DAY because of Clover?

But what?

huh

So you want to see the farmer who feels worthless, just being the Nice Guy™ he always has been (I decided to check out TV tropes for Star, and found out how he's basically been the "Nice Guy" archetype before Clover came. So I repeat: what's the issue with him stepping out of that for a day? I explained already how the guy's NOT to fully blame here and I really mean it. Yeah he has flaws, yeah Clover's presence brought out the "worst" in him, but we mustn't forget who he's been before that and that his true motivation has always been lifting up everyone's spirits).

The guy made all the sacrifices he could (not only worked hard to make the entire Wild East thing come to fruition, but basically became a rebel, when you remember humans are hated by monsters, and he's basically openly idolizing them) for his loved ones and even strangers. It's always been him relying on outer validation and doing stuff for others in order to feel important. But he never felt truly understood. By training Clover, he actually got to spent time with a human kid who's so much like him and shares not only the same love for westerns but the same "justice" quality. Sure, Ceroba had tried to understand, but ultimately failed and Star himself had to explain to her why he'd been acting the way he did, after Showdown.

You don't want him to have pride in himself and feel cool for a single day, Ceroba? She mentions how he's never been as ecstatic as he was that day. So in other words, Star's always been a wild card when it came to the sheriff business but not THIS wild. Which I'm sure means how other monsters have always been his main focus, and not him acting all arrogant (ties in well with that "Nice Guy" archetype). Even the training didn't feel too crazy to me, tbh. He only locked Martlet up because of the potential of his town being shut down. It's a town that he's been working on for so long, the town that makes him feel like he's more than just a nobody. Plus, he says how locking Martlet up was only a temporary solution:

I feel like I've said this a million times before, but Starlo's not a bad guy or a jerk, he just wants to be appreciated and loved and understood. Yet even his closest friends couldn't put themselves in his shoes and think: Why? What's the true motivation of Star idolizing Clover? Of him apparently acting "out of hand"?

I'll post the last part of this huuuuge rant sometime soon