#Deltarune Analysis

[damiel-of-real]

always been very interesting to me how noelle's themes are named in the deltarune soundtrack.

her tracks are "girl next door" and "lost girl", and both of these names moreso describe her role in the story and how she relates to the other characters rather than describing her actual character. she wouldn't even describe HERSELF that way. she can't just be noelle, because she needs to be your friendly neighbour, the number 2 in berdly's ideal world, queen's "New Knight", the angel with the tattered wings. it takes until the end of chapter 2 for her to break this idea, and only with queen and berdly.

this also contrasts with susie's themes, too. "Susie" and "Vs Susie". while she has titles put on her, they're all ones she takes willingly. she isn't as constrained by the roles put on her. she's the scary bully, and a self proclaimed "bad guy", but isn't she also a hero, and your best friend? it makes sense why noelle is so drawn to her.

[hazmatmaid]

I feel like people must’ve forgotten how objectively horrifying Spamton NEO is, like on a psychological level. Once he goes NEO, that’s the point of no return. The only way out of it for him is to basically die.

Not to mention Puppet Scarf’s flavor text:

Yes, Ralsei can no longer cast healing spells as effectively with it equipped, but think of the implication; that’s Spamton. By the time he goes NEO, he gave up on healing and making amends. By this point, he’d rather go out and kill everyone who wronged him (or he thinks they did) than seek forgiveness, or forgive them himself.

And in Snowgrave, he has no problem with letting (or even encouraging) someone commit mass murder if he can take advantage of the situation.

He may call you out on it, but by that point he’s mostly projecting his own self-hatred onto Kris.

But if we adhere more closely to the normal Ch2 route, it’s implied that he still had murderous intentions with NEO.

And even if you end the fight by sparing him and get the Dealmaker instead, it's already too late for him. He went NEO, and there's no other way it can end for him.

In other words, NEO spells his doom.

[smile-files]

something interesting i realized while on the vessel-making screen in the deltarune introduction is that it's physically impossible to make kris: there is no hair that perfectly matches theirs (none have the cowlick or the right jagged shape on the bottom), and there is no sweater that perfectly matches theirs (none have a single stripe). this is fascinating, as it perhaps suggest that, if we (the player) had a choice, we *wouldn't* make kris. they aren't something we want, or are even capable of wanting, rather something we're stuck with.

and i suppose the fact that they can't be *created* as a vessel is telling, because we didn't create kris -- they weren't made for us, they're not a player avatar. they're a pre-existing person we just happen to gain possession of.

we weren't made for each other; they don't want us, and we don't seem to want them either (if the inability to choose to create someone like them says anything); funny, then, that in a way we're "soulmates"...

(both pictures are from the deltarune wiki!)

[stainedglassthreads]

I feel like the four leads of Deltarune--Kris, Susie, Ralsei, and Noelle-are just. Somehow two different levels of queer-coded.

(Edit: Just to be clear: not saying any of this to disparage or insult shippers of Kralsei, Suselle, or Kriselle, I've just seen a lot of cool analysis about tropes, romance, and lack of choice in Deltarune and wanted to chime in with some of my own thoughts. If you ship any of those ships in Deltarune--fantastic! May you find a lot of content precisely to your taste.)

Like. On the one hand, if you're looking at tropes, they are very neatly set up into two romantic partnerships. Noelle is very blatantly interested in Susie, and Ralsei's feelings for Kris are often portrayed similarly. On a surface level, both pairings appear very clear. Noelle is a girl in love with another girl, while Ralsei is a very effeminate boy in love with a teen who doesn't appear to use pronouns. And a big deal isn't made of either pairing, there's nothing really in the way of Suselle or Kralsei on a societal level we've encountered so far. At least in terms of gender and sexuality. But if you look a little closer, it's kind of...'these are a very straight idea of queer ships', y'know?

Noelle and Susie are both girls, but one is very effeminately coded, anxious, uses magic, and is more traditionally cute, while they other is crass, crude, intimidating, and physically strong. Ralsei and Kris are gender-noncomforming, but Ralsei is a sweet pacifistic healer who bakes cakes while Kris uses a sword, and keeps being mistaken for a boy by much of Youtube and Reddit. The active one and the passive one, the fighter and the mage, the one with cute hobbies and the one who eats moss, the one in pants and the one in a dress.

And here, I start thinking of some posts I've seen analyzing how, in Deltarune, romance is used to explore how Kris doesn't really get choices. Kris has been cast as the leader and knight, and Ralsei has been cast as the healer and Princess, even if he is a boy. The leader often ends up with the healer. The knight often gets the princess as a happy ending. But Kris doesn't seem to like this! Their reactions to Ralsei are constantly lukewarm at best, and that's not getting into how Ralsei seems to be in love with his idea of Kris, while being very. Asriel-coded, who the game describes often as Kris' brother, in sharp contrast to how ambiguous Chara and Frisk's relationships with the Dreemurrs were.

If we and Kris reject Ralsei as a love interest, we can a different romantic partner in Noelle...but this choice has a bodycount, traumatizes Noelle, doesn't seem to leave Kris any happier, and it's still a kind of straight-coded ship. Now it's the knight being paired up with the apocalypse maiden, for the doomed codepedent toxic tragedy lovers out there. But it kinda makes sense too, right? If Kralsei is the expected RPG romance, then Kriselle would be the expected romance if there were no Dark World and Ralsei weren't an option. They're childhood friends and neighbors in a small town, their families used to be very close, Rudy is still very fond of Kris. They're even extremely angel/devil coded.

But the most interesting part is. It's implied that there IS someone that Kris is very interested in, either platonically or romantically. It's Susie. Kris never seems frightened by Susie when they're bullied by her, and rejects Noelle's offers to switch seats. They seek comfort from Susie rather than Ralsei after the Spamton fight, they call her their friend when Toriel calls, they share moss with her, they refuse to think about her during Snowgrave when Ralsei prompts them, they make it clear that out of all the people they COULD go to the Carnival with, Susie is the one they'd ACTUALLY want to choose.

And this is the part that drives me crazy. Because while Kris is so tightly controlled by genre and narrative, and those things would usually push them towards Ralsei or Noelle, and Ralsei keeps encouraging Kris to stick to the narrative. Susie is the one who refuses to be bound to the narrative. Susie is the character of Deltarune who is most unapologetically herself--and isn't that a very queer thing, refusing to be anyone but yourself despite everything? She says no thanks to the prophecy, until she comes around to it on her own terms! She makes herself and Ralsei learn to take their own actions, and drags Ralsei off to have fun with him instead of letting Kris choose who to with! She doesn't stay in her box of the damage-dealing fighter, she insists on learning Healing magic, even if she's not particularly skilled at it at first! Even Ralsei is forced to admit that it's wonderful that Susie is Susie, and not anyone else!

I think Kris likes Susie a lot. And part of it may be admiration. That while Kris is controlled by the player and the narrative and the prophecy and humanity and divorce and a dozen things outside their control, Susie refuses to ever be bound by anything. And Kris and Susie together happen to be the two more masculinely-coded party members, the two melee fighters, the two troublemakers. It honestly makes me wonder a little if Susie and Kris might be able to make their own ending beyond the bounds of gender expectations and romance expectations together? It would be cool. And I think it would make Kris very happy to break free like that.

[a-town-called-hometown]

yippee! apologies if my takes are horrendously bad

my personal take on the matter is that i definitely think the dark worlds can work as a metaphor for escapism without undermining the darkners' personhood. it can be more than one thing, yknow? the darkners are important, their lives matter. and the lightners do go to the dark world as an escape from the problems they face in their own life. but that's not the darkners' whole PURPOSE, yknow? i mean. according to the laws of the universe of deltarune yes darkners' "purpose" is to serve the lightners but like it's not their whole purpose in the STORY.

it's sort of like how, in UNDERTALE, LOVE represents how distant you've become, how easy it is for you to hurt people. but it also literally gives you the power to destroy the world.

i think the biggest reason i believe escapism is at least a part of deltarune's narrative is queen.

queen's whole speech in both of her fights is about how she intends to provide escapism for the lightners (so that they will worship her but also so that they will he happy). she wants to turn the whole world into a dark world, so that everyone can live in bliss and not have to worry about the woes of the light world. she mentions "Staring, Tapping, To Receive Joy. Staring, Tapping, To Avoid Pain." which is like pretty much the definition of escapism

she wants to help Noelle with the problems she faces in the light world ("Noelle. Who Will Be There To Help Her? Her Strange And Sad Searches" and "My One Idea To Help Noelle, Failed") by just... shoving it away for a blissful fantasy world ("Wake? No, She Has Already Awakened Too Much. Let Her Close Her Eyes And Sleep Away, Into A Darker, Darker Dream.")

...i forgot the rest of what i wanted to say!

well first off, thank you for your ask! I'm going to get extremely in depth in my answer, so bear with me here. sorry it took several weeks to write this. the escapism reading of deltarune is pretty deeply entrenched in fandom, and to refute it, I felt it required a full-length essay to completely explain my viewpoint.

yes, "the lightners desire escapism" does not automatically translate to that being the darkners' actual narrative purpose. escapism can be a theme without dehumanizing those who are used in order to escape - in fact, I've read a number of stories that use someone's desire to escape to HIGHLIGHT how they're hurting others in pursuit of that. I believe that toby fox is definitely capable of telling a story about kids having a valid desire to escape, and about them grappling with having inadvertently created a world of real, living people as a result.

(I'll reiterate again that this is not the story arc that generally shows up in fanon. the common consensus is that the game will end in an omori-esque "growing out of" the dark worlds. it's why I have a huge dislike of the fanon escapism reading, given that the darkners are shown as people whose lack of agency parallels kris' own. it would feel cheap if the resolution to that plot was that the darkners were actually never meant to be agents in their own fates. but this is a digression.)

the reason why i DON'T believe that this is a story that toby fox is telling is because of the way the world, themes, and characters are written. put simply, it just doesn't come across as congruent with the story being told.

deltarune's main themes are agency, fate, identity, and control. this is a conflict that shows up in nearly every major character, is baked into the worldbuilding, and is the central struggle involving us, the player. the protagonist of deltarune is literally possessed by us against their will. the darkners are objects that have no choice but to serve and be discarded. over and over again, there is emphasis on roles that characters play - and crucially, roles that are imposed on them.

what would escapism mean, in this thematic context? in real life, escapism can represent any number of things, but in a story, a major narrative theme generally has to dovetail with other major narrative themes in the work. I would argue that escapism in deltarune would likely mean going to a place where characters are able to choose for themselves what roles they embody, or even to discard the notion of roles altogether. a fantasy of control is the only way to escape a reality where you have no agency. and honestly, it's hard to imagine that something could count as an escapist fantasy if you don't even get to choose whether or not you participate in it.

let's talk about kris.

I see a lot of discussions around kris that say that kris goes into the dark worlds to escape. the dark worlds are posited as kris' fantasy of heroism. it's a world where they can seem heroic and cool, a world where they can have friends. this theory makes a decent amount of sense on the surface level, but only until you consider that kris is being controlled in order to go into the dark worlds. and it is not a control that they appear to welcome.

if those worlds represent kris' fantasy, then why don't they get to choose what happens in those fantasies? why are they being controlled by an external force, one that they actively push back against? if it's really an escape, then why does everything about this world reflect their lack of agency? if they really think this world is just a pure fantasy, then why do they care if spamton falls when his strings are cut?

because they're being deliberately obscured to the player, it is hard to say how kris actually feels about many subjects... but I do seriously doubt that they view the dark worlds as an escape. they don't act in a way that is consistent with that. they resist their lack of agency, and what little we do see of their reactions to darkner characters doesn't suggest that they view those characters as part of a disposable fantasy, either. they seem to have complicated feelings on ralsei. and of course, one of their biggest emotional reactions in the game is to the spamton fight. I would argue that that suggests they have empathy for spamton, which is a hard emotional reaction to have if you believe he's just part of a fantasy. not impossible, mind you, but it seems unlikely that kris believes that all this is simply fantasy.

also, considering that snowgrave both actively discredits the idea that the dark worlds are mere fantasy and is actively traumatic for kris... I seriously doubt they'd open another dark world in chapter 3 on a snowgrave run if their motive was purely to escape. on that route, they've seen the damage we can cause in a dark world. they know that berdly has sustained lasting damage due to our actions, assuming he's not outright dead. why would they want to try and "escape" to a place like that again now that they know what can happen?

the only answer is that they have a motive that isn't escapist.

now, as for ralsei... what part does he have to play in all this?

ralsei does play a lot to the fun, fantastical elements of the dark worlds. he delivers the prophecy that kickstarts the adventure. he flatters both kris and susie endlessly when they act appropriately heroic. he welcomes them into the castle and even makes nice rooms for them. he initially seems tailor-made to enable a fantastical experience where no real issues can ever complicate anything, and where the pain of reality can successfully be hidden from. but there's a lot of complications to the idea that he might represent an escapist fantasy.

the first, and what honestly seems the most important to me, is that he doesn't encourage kris and susie to remain in the dark worlds. he is welcoming and kind, but once the adventure is over, he prompts them to return to the light world. he wants them to deal with their more "real" problems like homework. that doesn't feel like he is trying to facilitate escapism in them. a real fantasy would encourage you to stay in it, wouldn't it?

and while ralsei is definitely invested in making sure the lightners are happy, there are always cracks that show. he isn't able to make kris ignore what happened in the spamton fight. he isn't able to convince susie to be peaceful and kind. and in his very essence, he represents a number of uncomfortable ideas. very importantly, he represents a number of uncomfortable ideas to kris.

this probably ain't your first fandom rodeo, so I'm not going to explain all the different ways that ralsei interacts with kris' personal issues. there's plenty of posts on it out there. what i will point out is, once again, it feels odd that a character who seems tailor made to bring up kris' most uncomfortable associations with their lack of agency and their outsider status in their own family would be part of a fantasy of escapism to them. you'd think that they'd prefer something that didn't have an inbuilt hierarchy, a prophecy that denied them autonomy, or especially a person that reminded them how little they fit into hometown.

that doesn't mean kris doesn't care about him at all - it seems very likely that they do. what I mean to say here is that he just seems ill-suited to an escapism reading, both behaviorally and on a conceptual level. it doesn't seem like that's at all part of his servitude towards the lightners.

of course, there is another non-lightner entity that ralsei seems diegetically engineered to serve. but I'll discuss that later.

now as for susie...

yes, susie definitely views the dark worlds as more fun than the light world. and why wouldn't she? the light world sucks for her, and she doesn't seem very aware of the fact that the dark world can also suck. you could definitely make the argument that she views the dark worlds as a fantastical escape from reality... were it not for the fact that she treats her darkner friends with just as much importance as she does kris and noelle.

can someone treat components of an escapist fantasy as real and important? of course. but given deltarune's themes of agency and control, as well as the fact that darkners exist in servitude to the lightners, I feel like you'd have to make escapism tie into forcing others into a lack of agency if you wanted the theme to feel coherent with the rest of the work. this would require susie to be limiting the agency of the darkners around her. and obviously, she doesn't do that. her presence around them might be inherently limiting, just by simple virtue of being a lightner, but she isn't aware of it, and clearly is uncomfortable with the idea of limiting anyone's agency. she encourages ralsei to make choices. and she supports lancer in basically anything he wants to do. her treatment of lancer is integral to chapter 1's narrative, and it seems like that treatment of ralsei is integral to the ongoing narrative as well!

her preference for the dark world feels very rooted in her engagement with it as its own reality. rather than trying to avoid her real-life problems by engaging in a pretense, she seems to simply want to spend time with her friends in a place that isn't cruel to her. she isn't ignoring any of the dark world's problems in service of that, either. she notices when things don't line up. if she thought of it as a fantasy, wouldn't she be inclined to ignore issues that impede the fantasy?

and critically - like kris, she does not intentionally choose her imposed role in the prophecy at first. she steps into the role of bad guy to resist it, but that role is limiting too, and she eventually acquiesces to being a hero. it's never something she's completely on board with, though. she actively pushes back the limitations that the role places on her. I find this important to reiterate when we are discussing the notion of the characters viewing the dark worlds as fantasy.

noelle has a complicated relationship to the dark worlds. susie tells her that it's a dream to make her accept the strange reality she finds herself in, which works well on her. she continues to think of it as a strange dream throughout the chapter. (though, like the others, it is not a 'dream' she entered of her own volition!)

it is also a markedly unpleasant 'dream' at times. she has her agency restricted, is kidnapped, has to evade a controlling monarch, and is even tied up in a weird evangelion cross thing on the hand of a giant robot. it's not purely fun. noelle does like scary things, and while it might be healthy for her to have an experience where she stands up to a controlling adult figure... again, the circumstances make it difficult for me to assume that this is a fantasy she would choose for herself. not impossible, mind you, but it's not the first reading of the situation that comes to mind.

and while she does say she wishes she could dream like this every day in the normal route, that does happen specifically because she was talking to the girl she likes. it makes sense she'd find that pleasant. I don't think that necessarily equates to her finding the dark worlds escapist.

and importantly, this isn't the sentiment that she expresses in every route.

again, there's a lot of analysis on snowgrave, so I won't bother regurgitating it much here. but it's nightmarish for both kris and noelle, and very likely fatal for berdly. noelle needs to believe that the event is a dream, for her own psychological safety, but one of the most important parts of snowgrave...

...is that its events, and the world it took place in, are very, very real.

noelle wants to have the strength to face her problems, both in the regular route and in the snowgrave route. rather than escaping from them, she views the "dream" as a chance to practice dealing with her day-to-day issues. it's just that in the regular route she finds that strength authentically, and in the snowgrave route, that desire is manipulated and pushed until she is forced to kill berdly. she doesn't interpret snowgrave as an escape gone wrong. she views it as a dream that became a nightmare. and those are two extremely different things.

but i haven't even gotten to the biggest thing that undermines the concept that the dark worlds are a metaphor for escapism! which is: this fucking guy is dead wrong about everything.

so full disclaimer - I really love berdly. I think he's slept on a lot in the fandom because he's annoying and weird. which is fair, I suppose, but I think ignoring him hinders a lot of people's understanding of deltarune's overall narrative. because berdly often illustrates a lot of concepts in the game, but his narrative framing as a joke (usually...) prevents the player from taking it completely seriously. he has things to say and ideas to show off, it's just that he's often very loud and kind of dumb in his expression of them. which is kind of the point!

ralsei brings up the idea that the darkners are meant to serve the lightners very seriously in chapter one. by extension, and by way of the literal mechanics involved in a dark world's creation, we can infer that this logic is probably something that also applies to the dark worlds themselves. they are allegedly worlds and characters that only are supposed to fulfill a dream of the lightners. but due to narrative framing and deltarune's themes, we know that that's not the full truth. however dark worlds and darkners are created, they deserve to have their own agency. they can't just exist to fulfill a higher being's wishes.

you know who else undermines that view of the dark worlds? berdly! berdly does!!!!

because berdly is the only lightner in the game so far who does take the dark worlds to be an escapist adventure! he wants to turn cyber world into smartopia. he views this as a chance to be a cool hero. he believes he's going to get the girl, he's going to shape this world to his own liking, and maybe also he's going to get queen to acknowledge him or something so he stops being a forgettable little bluebird. and not only does none of this happen, his steadfast belief that it will happen is continually a joke within the narrative!!

berdly's wishes for uncomplicated escapist fantasy are flat-out denied by the dark worlds themselves. as a lightner, those worlds should be serving him. he should have the power to do whatever he wants within the bounds of an escapist fantasy. these npcs should be singing his praises!

but he doesn't have the power. and this world doesn't sing his praise. because it just isn't an escapist fantasy. he isn't right to view it that way. his wishes for heroism are always going to be thwarted.

so now that I've gotten all that out of the way, let's swing back over to the subject of your original ask. queen.

because, like berdly, queen's entire character arc is about how she's completely wrong about what the lightners actually want.

queen would in fact like nothing more to place the lightners into an escapist fantasy. she believes that that's the best way to serve them and make them happy forever. as a darkner, queen has very much internalized the idea that a lack of control is what actually makes people happy. since darkners have no choice in their destinies and are supposed to be happy in it, and since she personally finds her role as a darkner fulfilling, she believes that that's true of all people everywhere. if you want to make people happy, you just have to remove that pesky personal agency!

so she spends the story trying to force the lightners and particularly noelle into situations where she controls them in order to make them ostensibly happier. she does genuinely believe that this is the right thing to do, but as she finds out eventually, she's just wrong. noelle doesn't want that. queen believes that escapism is why the lightners use the internet... but that's totally wrong too.

while there are other searches mixed in, noelle is trying to use the internet to find her sister. instead of trying to hide from whatever happened, noelle wants to figure it out. queen's thesis about noelle and the lightners is proven wrong even before she personally encounters noelle in the dark world. it's just that queen doesn't realize it due to her limited perspective.

the concept of escapism being brought up with both queen and berdly is not there to say that the dark world is escapist. rather, it's there to say that it isn't. despite the dark worlds being a fantastical place, they are extremely real. to view them as a means of escape is foolhardy at best. you cannot act as though you are above consequences within them.

themes and ideas exist within the story for a sake of an audience. so let's get into the final character I need to discuss here. hopefully this will tie my thesis of deltarune together neatly.

that character is of course us. the player.

when creating a piece of fiction, an astute author will often identify and anticipate an audience's reactions to certain things in their work, and write things in such a way that they elicit the desired reactions. in essence, a writer is directing the "character" of the audience. how we feel and how we are anticipated to react to things is an integral part of nearly every fiction.

that effect is far more overt when dealing with metanarrative fiction that diegetically involves the audience. since the fiction is saying a lot of things about the general 'you,' the audience in aggregate, your reactions to certain things in the story have to be finely cued and anticipated by the author, so that the author can thus commentate on the reactions that you have to the story. the "character" you are assumed to inhabit is posited by the author to have certain traits.

to explain what I mean in plainer terms, I'll use the player of undertale's no mercy route as an example. because undertale is commenting on the way rpgs generally work. the player's behaviors in no mercy are attributed by characters in the story to be the result of us acting like a typical gamer. we kill the characters in the game because we want exp. and more than that, it's because we want to see everything the game has to offer. the role we inhabit in this role-playing game is that of a completionist. you could say that that's assumed to be our "character" in no mercy.

deltarune also posits that certain things are true of its audience. by being written to evoke certain cultural ideas, rpg tropes, and references to undertale, it guarantees that its audience will probably have certain traits, and spends a large amount of its conceptual focus commenting on those traits. one of those traits is nostalgia, which is probably an idea that I'll expound upon in a further essay because it's quite integral to my reading of deltarune. but the main one I mean to discuss here, and why I went off on this tangent about how audiences are dealt with in metafiction, is that we are posited as someone who believes in the logic of certain narratives.

deltarune's writing evokes a lot of portal fantasy narratives. alice in wonderland, narnia, pretty much every story where it's revealed at the end to be all a dream... the story of deltarune superficially resembles a lot of those. this, I think, is responsible for the popularity of the escapism theory. because those stories are often at their end about a child learning to put away fantasy and grow up, people tend to believe that deltarune must be about the same thing. but I truly don't think that deltarune is trying to do anything with that aspect of portal fantasy narratives, at least not directly. its main characters aren't involved in that exact type of coming-of-age arc.

instead, deltarune is very concerned with what happens to characters in fantasy, and specifically fantasy rpgs. if your world is deemed to not matter because it's a dream, what does that mean for you, who has no choice but to live in it? if you are an npc whose role has been predetermined for you via script, then can you ever decide for yourself what you want? what if you want to matter? what if you want to be your own person?

as the major controlling force of deltarune, we are initially cued to believe that deltarune is like a dream. it superficially fulfills so much of what we want from undertale fanon. hometown seems like it's a perfect idyllic town, at least until you start noticing the obvious cracks. and remember what I said about ralsei earlier? he is so reminiscent of asriel, and extremely eager to help us. it's not a stretch to say that making us specifically view deltarune as dreamlike and idyllic is probably part of his purpose in the game.

I would not say that we are posited as escapist. but the idea of escapism as brought up with queen and berdly is meant to strike at the heart of a much deeper idea that deltarune is trying to deconstruct. because if we view deltarune as a dream, escapist or otherwise, then we are inclined to write the internal realities of the characters inside off. the dark world can disappear without it mattering. we can control kris without it mattering. if it's all a dream, what does it matter? why should we care to let its characters go free? aren't we supposed to be in control?

if deltarune is an rpg... what is the significance of us interacting with it?

[zorubark]

To me, I feel like the weird route has an aspect to it of the horror of cisheteronormativity.

Many players or deltarune fans project a male identity onto kris, while they are non-binary, the cisnormative, and then along with this pairing them with the most girl obssesed girl, the heteronormativity. It's like it represents the horror of having no free will combined with how most stories are cisheteronormative, many times watching, reading, etc, a story that has queer elements but the characters are forced to stay cis, to "accept" traditional gender roles, to be straight, it feels like the author is forcing the characters, just like the Weird Route, I think it's a meta commentary on the fandom and media in general.

[ariadnesweb]

Unabashedly love how Deltarune's main cast (Kris, Susie, Noelle, Ralsei) all seem to be based off types of horror monsters, combining very antagonistic/ off-putting personas with the average experience of being an awkward teenager.

There's Kris, the human, who's compared to a shambling corpse, a type of zombie lacking life for itself, bound to the most basic impulses for life, or perhaps a phantom knight, a ghost chasing after a otherwordly, personal liege to die for.

There's Susie, the bully, the gangster, the wild barbaric beast, the 'dark' one in the group, who played her role straight in chapter one, attacking anything in her path for daring to be weaker than her, and even once on the side of good, can't shake her doubts that she stands as a barely contained anti-hero compared to her friends.

Noelle, of course, is the witch & the ghost - both roles brought to the front throughout the course of the Weird Route. The Witch - she is the holder for some of the most destructive magic seen so far, a Knight capable of opening a Dark Fountain. And as the Ghost, Noelle is bound by history's tragedies to repeat them blindly, seeking a sense of closure for her family as it still cannot be found.

Ralsei, as he stands, seems to be some fae-type creature - a darkner that operates on a set of foreign, arbitrary rules - for whom friendship is paid with by acquiescence to said rules. How solid is his friendship? To who is loyalty owed to? We don't know. Neither does Ralsei - he's a shapeshifter, self variable and changing. If there is a price to pay, it will be paid dearly: Ralsei stands as the Prince of Darkners, and his CastleTown is both a hub for our friends, and the prison for our enemies.

There is something sweet about such a ragtag group of weirdoes finding community with each other, a chance to grow-up with friends and allies.

[huecycles]

jevil & noelle friendship post

hi, i want to talk about how noelle and jevil would definitely get along well or even be friends! also how their characters contrast nicely with each other and could possibly have a dynamic as interesting and engaging as spamton does with kris. this is quite a long post, so yeah grab a seat lol. first off, take a look at noelle’s reaction to both of jevil’s items:

noelle likes horror movies, and jevil definitely fits that scary clown trope. the description for jevilstail is “a j-shaped tail that gives you devilenergy”, and it can be equipped on noelle. considering her comment, and how she compliments susie’s tail later, this could mean she thinks tails in general are cute (perhaps longer ones? susie is often headcanoned to have a lizard-esque tail while jevil has his j-shaped devil one. noelle has a deer tail which is pretty small lmao, kinda unrelated but i’m sure it could be for a silly reason like that, and in susie’s case, highlighted by her crush on her).

the fact noelle can equip jevilstail and say she likes an item that gives her “devilenergy” is very interesting too, and kinda goes along with what she said in the ferris wheel cutscene, how she wishes she could break the rules and be more like susie who isn’t afraid to do that. compare that to ralsei’s “i’m a good devil, ok?” and susie’s “figured i’d grow one someday” and you’ll see how noelle likes the idea of being “devilish” but is pretty shy about it as she mutters it.

now let’s talk about devilsknife. devilsknife is a susie weapon, it is pretty powerful and the name itself is already scary sounding. of course, noelle can’t equip it since her weapon type is supposed to be rings, but she doesn’t seem that scared when presented with the item, unlike ralsei who says it feels “too evil”. this is what she has to say:

devilsknife, as in jevil, smiles at her. now, how could she be seeing that? most people interpret this smile as the blade deforming itself to resemble jevil’s face, or his own smile being reflected in the blade. however, there’s a detail a lot of people have missed (as well as this little moment altogether which is one of few the indicators of jevil’s actual and current presence in chapter 2).

this is devilsknife’s description:

there’s a skull symbol emblazoned in the blade (which is a hybrid between a scythe and an ax, aka what lets susie equip it due to her weapons all being axes). 

now, according to my own headcanons due to certain wording jevil uses in his fight, like “EVEN DEVILSKNIFE IS SMILING!” and “LET’S MAKE THE DEVILSKNIFE.”, plus how tasque manager has the exact same reaction to both of jevil’s items, meaning she knows it’s him/knows of his presence there - contradicting the common idea that jevil is not the jevilstail and thus not in the inventory due to his wording in chapter 1 - but still regarding the devilsknife with some strange familiarity which could imply she knows it is a weapon and has possibly not only met jevil but fought him before: “silly tail” vs “silly Devilsknife”, capitalized...

...make me believe devilsknife and jevil are not one in the same, and are only “fused” (metamorphosis?) in the inventory. while i know certain details are hard to portray in a tiny sprite, you can see there’s no skull symbol anywhere in the devilsknife’s blade which has more empty space, and given how it’s “emblazoned” it would mean it’s a printed/engraved symbol somewhere.

so my small tangent here is that the skull only appears once jevil and devilsknife are fused together and in your inventory. considering how scythes are often seen as a grim reaper's weapon and associated with death, having jevil become the actual devilsknife and clearly maintain his conscience would nicely translate into a skull symbol appearing. the “THIS BODY CANNOT BE KILLED!” line also gives this some more depth. given how jevil’s "mind" is chained to his "body", as he gives a lot of emphasis to his body (”THEY CRAVED TO IMPRISON MY BODY”) and the association of how his mind is “free” while his body stays locked up paints a grim picture on how he was deemed insane, yet found a loophole in that, and thus “freedom”.

scythes are also famous for beheadings. jevil has no neck, his head separated from his body. and bringing all that back to noelle, THIS is how he smiles at her. pretty morbid, right? cool as fuck too :o)

of course, these are noelle’s only direct interactions with jevil through his items, but i’d also like to bring attention to how her themes and symbolism go along so well with jevil’s, just like spamton’s go with kris’s.

kris is often likened to demonic imagery, aka their creepy red eyes, the use of the horns headband, how they have an interest in summoning demons due to their search history, and finally: king calling them "lightbringer" which is just what “lucifer” means in latin + that word itself is generally associated with lucifer, satan, what have you. noelle has obvious ties with angels: being called one by both spamton and pink addison while on a snowgrave route, her comment about growing big angel wings in the ferris wheel cutscene, the angel doll her and dess made which rudy keeps around as a good luck charm, and so on. spamton and jevil, respectively, are the opposites in that regard when compared to kris and noelle, so the contrast here is really damn fun to think about and explore.

another thing is how both noelle and jevil are incredibly powerful and involved in violent acts (though you know how snowgrave goes, of course), and how kris and spamton are in a very similar predicament as puppets who try to fight back. i believe just like how spamton and kris both managed to relate to each other’s despair and tried to help each other out (albeit in a very warped way in spamton’s case), i think noelle and jevil would have a similar thing.

lemme talk about something interesting in the snowgrave route. there is a pattern going on with noelle that is slightly overlooked, which is this:

1) a order is given by the player through kris, often “proceed”. 2) the screen goes black, the iceshock sound is heard. 3) noelle is completely confused about what just happened.

in the weird route, there are several times where noelle zones out, and while the moment people focus on is when she’s using snowgrave on berdly, the iceshock on the puzzles + the pink addison to get the freeze ring are very important. she comments later on how the battles are blurring together and how she cant remember a lot of details, she just followed "kris's" command and acted accordingly. a similar thing might have happened when she iceshocked spamton neo too, as the screen goes black again.

considering how she says “there was so much snow, i couldn’t see anything” after berdly is in the ice, i believe whenever she uses her power while aided by the player (and later, her own, as seen in the last puzzle where she does it by herself, leading to when she encounters berdly where she was just about to freeze him, completely on “automatic mode”, seemingly just waiting for the actual order) her mind goes blank, and she just acts as instructed. noelle might even look like this while the screen is black, which is a bit haunting to me:

going back to jevil, and knowing how prone to violence/chaos he is, i believe he would be able to sense her affinity for power and maybe even help her control it, likely for his own gain as he is hypocritical (strips the player of choice once you arrive with the key and refuse to open his cell), though similarly to spamton and kris, jevil could feel some kind of connection with noelle’s power and how dangerous it can be.

i believe jevil could help noelle get a hold of herself when using her magic and not just follow someone else’s commands, as well as keeping a clear head through it all. he’s pretty damn powerful himself, so he would instead help her come up with her own strategies and willpower, even if his teachings might fall flat due to his own insistence on having her cause chaos. i believe that can overruled by noelle's kindness and gentleness, and due to jevil's own influence on her (to be more bold and assertive, as she expresses she wishes she could be more like susie and break the rules like i said before), whatever "plan" he may have on turning her into this powerful killing machine backfires simply because she says no to him. lol his own strong personality boosts her shy and scared one so that itself is his own failure, i think that’s hilarious and a great character study for the both of them!

i headcanon jevil calls her "headlights" as a reference to how she's easily scared + a cruel nod to the “deer in the headlights” thing, which fits with his character who has probably a morbid sense of humor. noelle would definitely be intimidated by him at first, but i think she’d warm up to him due to her own interests in “scary” people, firstly her crush on susie and secondly her strange friend jevil who looks like a killer clown in the flesh. an easygoing, kind kid in jevil's life would also brighten it up :) he could definitely use a gentle presence in my opinion, i mean. guy’s said to be a loner, even if he had seam.

long post, but yeah! i know the susie and jevil connection is easier to make because of their brief interaction, devilsknife etc, but i feel like noelle and jevil being friends is very unique and more interesting to me personally. if kris has their scammer puppet uncle, noelle has the silly, slightly intimidating clown (also uncle coded) who helps pick out her fits for halloween and do her makeup. she also gets to wear out five hairbrushes on the wavy mess that’s under his hat, then braids his hair during the afternoon and shows him different hairdos, choosing the one jevil’s eyes dilated at. kris takes a picture of him looking handsome under noelle’s care and hits ‘send’ saying “ey uncle spamgton check out ur lover boy” while spamton tells them to “del3te THIS”.

it’s nice it’s cool!! let jevil and noelle be friends!!

[megaderping]

My video covering the latest Deltarune Newsletter and and development update just dropped, featuring speculation, observations, and my general thoughts on the state of the game's development and all the other cool goodies this brought to the table. c:

[starisenby]

Gerson is a boss monster and here's why

As we know boss monsters age when their offspring does and if said offspring is dead they are stuck at the age they were when their offspring died

And we know Gerson is dead in Deltarune

And the surrounding graves are of characters who we know were dead in Undertale as well (which is interesting that more of the amalgamates aren't there which is either due to lack of space or it means they are alive in the Deltarune universe)

(Images from a post by @seased )

And we know that the amalgamates are dead

When monsters die they dust.

And we know Father Alvin is Gersons son

So why is Gerson dead in Deltarune where he has a son but not in Undertale where he doesn't? Because he's a boss monster that's why

[abandoned-quiche]

I just realized. All three of the Delta Warriors, tasked with the banishment of the ANGEL'S HEAVEN, have strong devil motifs surrounding them.

Ralsei is the "prince of darkness," he's a goat associated with fire, he says "I'm a good devil, okay?" when equipped with Jevilstail

Kris is referred to as "lightbringer" by King (Lucifer means lightbringer), they have glowing red eyes, and they used to wear devil horns

Susie gets the Devlsknife and... I could've sworn there was more.

Anyways I just think that's pretty neat, especially with Noelle's incredibly prominent angel motif

[nightfurynova1217]

There might already be a post about this somewhere, but I haven’t been able to get this out of my head lately.

In regards to the differences between UT Alphys and DR Alphys, a lot of people obviously point out her take on Mew Mew 2, and the thing that’s been eating my brain is like… their different life experiences??

Okay so UT Alphys hates Mew Mew 2. She thinks it’s too edgy and she prefers the light tone of Mew Mew 1, but DR is exactly the opposite, she likes Mew Mew 2 and thinks 1 is childish.

However, in UT, Alphys is quite literally (accidentally) responsible for some of the most grotesque body-horror, science-experiment-gone-wrong her world has ever seen. She’s living with the constant guilt of what she did even though the final result was completely unforeseen and unintentional, the stress of keeping it all a secret and all the extra hoops she has to jump through to make sure it stays that way, added with the pressure of having successfully lied to Asgore by “creating” Mettaton and telling him she forged an artificial soul, and now she’s gotta keep up the act, with not just the ancient king looking to her for results, but the entire underground waiting for a repeat of her “success” so they can be freed sooner.

Contrast that with DR Alphys. She’s a high school teacher. In a small, pleasant, secluded town, where everyone knows everybody. Her highest point of stress is making sure Toriel doesn’t realize how lax she is with her students and what they can get away with in her class. And of course the pressure that she does wanna make sure she does a good job, she wants to be a good teacher and make sure her students are learning. But uh, that’s about it as far as I can recall.

Both Alphys’s are indulging in a fantasy.

UT wants a happy, feel-good story with minimal stakes or conflict. Not to say there wouldn’t be any, but to have the theme and genre leaning heavily into slice-of-life fluff, because her real life has too many stresses in it already.

DR is more interested in a deeper, darker story that delves into more adult-themes with higher consequences. Where the primary heroin is grounded and hardened through combat, and not as cute all the time. She wants angst, because her real life is secure and peaceful, and she feels safe and untriggered in consuming that kind of media.

[alpacacare-archive]

Not to post knight papyrus on main or anything but

[stainedglassthreads]

Realization. I’ve noticed before that Asriel and Ralsei’s demeanors and impacts seem almost inverse of each other: even when Asriel’s been gone for months, Hometown can’t stop talking about how much they miss him, and how each resident had some unique and memorable bond with him, while a lot of Darkners, and even Noelle and Berdly, just don’t even register that Ralsei is there.

But it’s not just their confidence, affability, and memorability that’s reversed. It’s how memorable they are compared to Kris.

In Hometown, Kris isn’t exactly neglected, but they do seem to come second or have difficulties in a lot of ways. There was everyone in class partnering up before they arrived in Chapter 1, Snowdrake and MK talking behind their back in Chapter 2, Berdly calling Kris the third-smartest person in the class, Noelle and Kris being friends but drifting apart, the way everyone in Hometown won’t stop reminiscing about Asriel when talking to Kris, talking about their personal bonds with Asriel, or what Kris and Asriel used to do.

But in the Dark World, that’s completely reversed. No longer is it Kris standing in Asriel’s shadow, now it’s Ralsei standing in Kris’ shadow. Now everyone focuses on and addresses Kris, while ignoring and forgetting Ralsei, or treating him as a tag-along.

I’m wondering if this is meant to symbolize something. Or if it does, I’m wondering what, exactly, it does. Is Ralsei reflective of Kris themself, as some believe? Is Ralsei a reflection of how Kris sees themself, always content to support the cooler and more likeable Asriel, always awkward and blending into the background? Does their theorized discomfort with Ralsei imply self-loathing? Or do they want to be the cooler and more likeable sibling instead of Asriel, and have him be the supportive tagalong for a change? Is Ralsei created by their desire to be someone’s ‘number 1’ instead of being everyone’s ‘number 2’?

Either way, I hope it gets explored and explained in future chapters. Especially if Asriel comes home before the final chapter. I want to see Ralsei develop more into his own person, but I’d also love to see Kris and Ralsei’s interactions prompt Kris to have a serious talk with Asriel if he comes home.

[hollyrogerbay]

anyone else notice how Deltarune seems to be getting more advanced each chapter, diegetically?

chapter 2 introduces the Recruits system, and updates save points to show all 3 slots in-game. chapter 1 was not retroactively updated to include the feature - it's an in-universe change. (although i believe chapter 1 npcs are automatically recruited once the system is introduced.)

and is it just me, or does it almost sound like the soundtrack is getting more advanced, too?

chapter 1's soundtrack was almost all soundfonts, chiptune, more retro synths, etc. - and the same goes for chapter 2, mostly. (mostly except for Susie, notably. her and her maybe-synth, maybe-live distorted guitars.)

we don't have much to work with, so this may not be anything worth mentioning, but the three songs for chapter 3-5 we've gotten sound noticeably more "real," i'd say?

"Hometown Day" is definitely the least notable of the three in terms of this, but still sounds relatively "realistic"/live

"My Funky Town" was what gave me this thought in the first place. the more live-sounding guitar in the left ear, something about the drums i can't quite describe accurately, the electric piano being played/recorded live. of course, it's not entirely "live" sounding, notably the saxophone being straight from the Touhou soundfont. but still much more than anything in chapter 1 and most in chapter 2.

"Green Room" is an odd case in general, considering it's pretty much just a remix of "Hip Shop," unlike any other song i can recall. but, yet again, it does sound a lot less "digital," would you agree? more effects on pretty much everything, the spacey drums and electirc pianos, everything.

this may not go anywhere, but i figured it was worth noting. the idea of chapters becoming more and more advanced as each one is added could also definitely be theory-crafting material methinks

[nonbinarycollector]

it makes me insane how noelle has been unsure for so long on if she and kris are even friends. theyve known each other since childhood, theyve played and hung out and they go to her house and and they GREW UP TOGETHER, NEIGHBOR FRIENDS!!! yet kris has always been so... distant. sure, maybe they know each other better than anyone else, but its not like they say that. any affection they have for each other isnt said the difference is noelle is friendlier and reaches out because she knows how to. she can give them pencils and help with homework and be weird, herself, around them, but kris isnt good at that kind of thing. they dont know how to put these things into words and they feel embarrassed trying to show it, and either they dont realize how it comes across or they do but dont know how to fix it, dont have the energy in recent years kris cares a lot about people! from choking up on hot chocolate to trying desperately not to have noelle involved anymore in snowgrave. they protect susie they want to hug the ralsei mannequin they feel a lot of affection toward others in their life but it is QUIET or only base protection comes out in dangerous moments. and it is so interesting to me, their emotional distance, how they either cant or havent tried to get their love across. i love kris dearly. they are so bad at this. it makes their friends and loved ones unsure in their relationships with kris and it drives me insane