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kob131 · 6 years ago

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https://sokumotanaka.tumblr.com/post/185075585017/chill-disscussion

Ah yes, because the guy who shat himself in rage because RWBY ended up in the same game as Persona is such a reliable source....

So with death battle’s upcoming Mitsuru vs Weiss match I wanted to talk about, mostly nerd out about mitsuru, look regardless on weather you like rwby or not weiss isn’t on mitsuru’s skill level.

Spoiler Alert: he uses numerous conflicting examples and sources to effectively inflate Mitsuru as a fighter.

(I mean she fought two gods and lived to tell about it.)

Neither of which she is confirmed to fight. That’s the issue with feats like these: they rely on possibility. And it's equally likely that Mitsuru did nothing. Only Makoto is canonically confirmed to fight the Nyx Avatar.

In fact, the closest thing to a canonical representation of the battle was the P3 movie Winter Of Rebirth...where Mitsuru is fighting Shadow hordes, not Nyx who is getting soloed by Makoto. And since Makoto is a Wild Card user. he would be VASTLY more powerful than Mitsuru.

As for Erebus: Again, only one person (Aegis) was required in the fight. So we don’t know.

So let’s talk about mitsuru and then weiss as combatants. Both women fight on teams and manipulate ice in some way. They both summon things That’s about all I can compare, why? cause I took a deep dive into both series, and I’ll be frank, mitsuru fighting gods and monsters that can cause nukes is a feat enough.

That was enough for ‘Yu Vs. Jotaro’...

And again: That’s not confirmed. The only god you could be talking about here is Erebus-

And you know what? I’m just gonna preemptively go full Autism on you.

here’s Erebus’ stats according to the Megami Tensei wiki:

STR: 80 MAG: 75 END: 90 AG: 60 LUC: 70

And here are the stats of all the party memebers in Persona 3 at Level 99:

Junpei: 82 44 69 56 53

Yukari: 50 91 55 55 53

Akihiko: 69 70 55 63 47

Mitsuru: 55 85 52 61 51

Aigis: 61 58 84 56 45

Ken: 55 66 58 70 55

Koromaru: 58 56 58 82 50

Notice something?

The so called ‘mountain crusher’s’ STR stat is LOWER than the best physical attacker and Junpei’s never seen cracking any mountains.

Not just that but Mitsuru also has average agility (which dictates speed and hit rate with physical attacks) and average luck (dictating the success of status attacks) alongside the LOWEST END stat in the game meaning she wouldn’t be able to keep up with Weiss, she’d most likely fail using status attacks since they have a base success rate of 25% and one solid physical hit would do serious damage.

So right there are reasons why Weiss would have a chance if we follow your apparent standards of using gameplay.

But mitsuru is the team’s tactician and well studied in her academics despite fighting monsters, she’s top of her grade, she’s a great fighter and when she returns in persona 4 arena/ultimax she’s kinda insane as a fighter. (going through the full story in both’s massive text walls would take ages But I played through both a few months back and the things they write them capable of doing is insane)

yeah, like saying a monster can crush mountains but is weaker than an above average baseball player?

Then we have a little issue of; she’s not the tactican. Makoto is. Mitsuru is just the boss.

Yeah and? Can see use it in the battlefield?

Most death battle fighters are great fighters.

Also so now we’re using Arena as an example? Does that mean you accept her moveset in that game as canon? Meaning No status moves and no Diarahan?

so I decided to come up with a post (originally a power point before it crapped out) as to why mitsuru at her current skill is just too much for weiss.

So we’re using gameplay as a basis with Mitsuru’s P3 stats and her P4A moveset, judging how you’re talking.

Let’s talk about mitsuru first

Mitsuru kirijo:

Feats/Abilities/skills:

Mitsuru is top of her grade, she’s so good the school often ask her to make speeches for assemblies that rouse the school so much, the principal tried copying them word for word out of jealousy.

And? So is Weiss so which school has higher standards? Also speech giving ability Is not the same as tactical thinking.

Despite also studying for school, she leads and runs S.E.E.S as a tactician (a chairman actually has the final say on everything but she leads them in battle) Her persona is both good for combat and sensory support (meaning she can sense her allies and other people, persona and non persona users)

On and off mind you as you’re only required to go into Tartarus occasionally and extended time in Tartarus will wear out a Persona user.

Meanwhile, Weiss’ studies ARE fighting since she needed to qualify for Beacon so her life has been revolving around being a good fighter.

Mitsuru’s persona can conjure ice in an instant and is completely unaffected but any ice type attacks done to her, she doesn’t even react at all.

She can also heal and is a pretty good healer in battle (When she isn’t casting marin karin! Regardless there’s no rule in death battle that says they can’t heal, the only rule was outside help and with the last handful of death battles some of them had healing factors)

She can also charm her enemy or cause them to go into panic

Yeah and she’s super weak to fire.

And-wait a minute. Why are you referencing Diarahan and status attacks in the same post as the one where you try citing feats from Arena? Are you just picking choosing what Mitsuru gets?

Mitsuru doesn’t need to use her evoker and can actively summon her persona in the real world. (This is also mentioned in persona 4 arena and shown in battle as mitsuru states she only uses it out of habit.) This is also stated by when she calls her persona in both the game and manga she doesn’t use her evoker.

Bullshit.

This is from Mitsuru’s first battle in Persona 4 Arena.

And even IF she does summon her Persona without her Envoker here: She’s in a different world. Same in Ultimax.

You’re just lying at this point.

Also: That ice spear doesn’t look very impressive when you remember Weiss summoned an ice WALL that fast in Volume 1. Yeah, if you’re gonna use outlier feats, so will I.

She is able to again as I said snap second conjure ice within seconds in any shape she deems necessary

Proof and no, the ice mirror from P4A doesn’t count.

Non persona users can’t see persona (one guy remakes on how he sees a silhouette but only cause he’s standing next to her, another character natsuki walks into a battle and can’t see the others persona from the distant she’s at.

And yet in Persona 4 Yosuke reacts to seeing Yu’s Persona awakening.

Her persona Artemisia has a whip that can reach long distances and instantly freeze her opponents, she can also make floating and homing projectiles.

A. That whip thing: proof

And B. Only in Arena which you pick and choose which to use.

Mitsuru herself is remarked as moving faster than the eye can react when others watch her fight her shadow, this is also reflected in her normal combots where she moves faster than the eye can see and can hit a person over 15 times (don’t believe me? watch her combo video)

https://youtu.be/fw-2yn_vKG0

Pretty sure the same thing happened in CTB with Weiss-Point is?

And at one point while fighting naoto a person with a gun who is also a persona user is able to disarm and disable in two fluid motions.

Disarm who? When? under what circumstances? Also a gun shoulding matter if Mitsuru can tank nukes right?

Need I stress mitsuru is incredibly smart, she has to run a magic C.I.A and outsmart a bunch of idiotic men in suits who think she can’t handle it, and had to at one point outsmart detective naoto, which is a feat in itself.

https://sokumotanaka.tumblr.com/post/185075529807

A. She runs it with help

B. You said ‘idiotic’

and C. Your post proves nothing

Weaknesses:

Fire is mitsuru’s weakness and while that sounds like an easy solution remember when weiss’s weapon starts burning with fire, mitsuru is either gonna back off, or disarm her.

That being said it’s her only weakness.

She also has average agility, less versatility, unreliable versatility, no debuffs or buffs aside from Mind Charge, limited mobility, a reliance on her Persona for big attacks and Mitsuru is never shown disarming someone so thee fire weakness is still major point. Especially by P3 standards which would cause her to be dazed and buy Weiss time.

That might seem bogus as being it but mitsuru has a lot of “human” weaknesses that won’t come into the death battle.

as a fight she is the superior, not just because I prefer her but because she’s been doing this longer and has to manage a fighting lifestyle and being a normal woman dealing with people who probably think she’s breaking the law for speaking out of turn with them.

Like what? Are you afraid they’re gonna bring up how Mitsuru and other Persona users tire out in places where they can use their Personas?

Also most of what you said doesn't pertain to Death Battle.

Up’s:

(this here is the things each fighter has against the other in terms of the fight.)

Persona is invisible to weiss

Persona and her ice magic have the superior reach

Mitsuru is older and more experienced

Mitsuru is smarter as she was the tactician of a team while also juggling high school.

Wrong

Unproved

Unsubstainated and unreliable

Unproven

Great upsides

Weiss schnee:

Feats/abilities/skills:

Weiss on the other hand doesn’t have much going for her. (let’s list these first)

Weiss’s semblance

Weiss’s fire dust (albeit finite)

Weiss’s speed glyph

Ignored how her glyphs can be used to leap and jump in air

Ignored how fast her glyphs can make her (stunning Flynt)

Ignored her Wind, Ice and Earth dusts

Ignored her Time Glyph which gave Blake the ability to slice lazer beams in order to cut down missiles in mid flight (outlier feat I know but has that stopped Soku?)

Ignored her Armor Gigas which is shown to be incredibly durable and powerful, slicing apart a Grimm that tanked several boxes of Dust exploding on it without a scratch

Ignored her Queen Lancer giving her projectile attacks, aerial mobility and backup

Ignored her Ice Wall which historically held the stringer of a complex sized scorpion in place for several minutes.

Wow you ignored a lot.

Weaknesses:

Weiss drops her weapon, alot, it happens often.

When weiss is surprised, she freezes up

weiss doesn’t have the experience to fight off mitsuru.

weiss hasn’t fought against opponents on mitsuru’s level or fought against gods/god tier monsters.

Example

Unproven

Neither has Mitsuru

Up’s:

Fire dust

Speed glyph

Summon size change.

And the stunning coming from Fire Dust

And The ice wall giving her a time borrowing option

And the Armor Gigas being stronger physically

And The Queen Lancer being agile, flying and having built inprojectiles

And her Time Glyph giving her a powerful ranged option

And her glyphs giving her far greater mobility

And her speed glyphs giving her a blitz option.

Funny how if you explain shit and pay attention, you see things are actually very even. But hey, Soku’s never been honest when it comes to RWBY so why start now?

Real talk?

Weiss in her one on one fights has lost to all her opponents. White fang lieutenant, Flynt, And Vernal.

All powerful close range combatants. Something Mitsuru is not.

The third whom I must stress is a normal bandit, she doesn’t summon things herself, use magic, she’s not a god trapped in a human body, she’s just a normal woman, and she beats weiss down, while weiss struggles to get afoot and she loses this bout as well.

Let's just ignore how vernal is technically stronger than a complex sized scorpion and was posing as a demigod at the time....

Now I know it seems like I’m only glossing over negatives, which I must stress I’m not doing out of dislike, I took a deep dive-

Bullshit. One look at Persona then RWBY shows you doing the bare minimum for RWBY while giving Mitsuru the best versions of all her elements.

For example super and goku one which has insane feats that the other will never reach, hench each one literally ending with clark winning.

superman just has feats that are too insane.

Superman lifted infinity. Mitsuru help weaken one giant Shadow that was aid to be strong enough to destroy a mountain and yet it's strength stat is weaker than Junpeis. (And before you complain about me using gameplay on a supposed non gameplay feat-Erebus HAS NO non gameplay feats.)

They are nowhere compatible, even in the comparison range.

Weiss can kick some grimm ass, but we’ve yet to see her have a decisive victory against an opponent single combat.

where as we get to see/play (depending on weather you read the manga or play both arena/ultimax (both are canon because it’s the same thing but contextualized as a comic) mitsuru fights people with the same skill as her and comes out on top.

A. By the same standards, Mitsuru is in the same boat as Weiss

B. You’re using Arena as your line for feats but not moveset (or even consistently as feats since you still quote P3)/

And C. Np she didn’t. The investigation team is LESS experienced than Weiss so logically they’d be easier if we accepted your interpretation.

The winner should be Mitsuru with all due respect.

And yet you feel the need to lie about Mitsuru and completely gloss over and lowball Weiss.

God, now i’m scared because not only does this scream ‘Ben and Chad, do as I say or else’ but since you’re lying, it makes it seem like Weiss will WIN in a fair fight.

Word of warning Soku: I will tear you verbally into shreds if you so much as glare at Ben and Chad. And god help you if Dudeblade recognizes your bullshit.

#sokumotanaka

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theseveredhead · 6 years ago

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#secondary

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errant-light · 3 years ago

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@spindlewit yet again turning my babbling into something absolutely gorgeous.

#persona 3 #c: aragaki shinjiro #c: aigis (aegis)#everyone needs a time travel fix-it au #this one is mine + c's #the ng+ verse has turned into 'okay who didn't get a chance to bond in the original version of events'#and I'm good with that

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mystech-master · 5 years ago

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Persona Legend Powers Part 1

In a post I made recently, I asked which personas would be the most powerful if instead of the usual Persona powers they got the powers of the mythological figures they represent.

Here we will speculate on what those abilities could be.

I compared the idea to the Fate series but really I am only taking a few powers or over simplifying it.

Lets start with the P3 team aka the Shadow Operatives (no Minato, Shinjiro, or Metis as they aren’t a part of the currently living P3 group, also I am including Labrys). As they don’t devolve their Personas I will only be looking at their ultimates, which is good b/c Yukari and Mitsuru’s initial Personas seemed to be known as victims (Io was turned into a heifer by Zeus and Penthesilea was killed by Achilles, not the most glamorous legends).

(I may also cite some YouTube videos or other sources in this, also I looked at a lot of stuff on the superpower wiki and it has a lot of ideas, specifically look at Greek and Roman Deity Physiology for a lot of stuff on what these guys could do.)

Aigis (Athena): Goddess of wisdom, olives, weaving, and battle strategy. One of her well known objects was the Aegis, either a shield or a breastplate but seemed to have Medusa’s head in it in some cases possibly giving it her paralyzing power.

Mitsuru (Artemisia): This is hard because Artemisia was an ancient Queen (wikipedia page), and not some big mythological figure. She isn’t even a Fate servant so I can’t look at that, but the main thing I see of her is her participation in a naval battle, the Battle of Salamis. I mean Artemisis summoning a giant warship would be cool and factors into another cool idea but it doesn’t seem like much.

I guess this is where I can suggest that another possible way to look at all this is they still have their initial Persona skills, but they have the legends added onto them.

Akihiko (Caesar): Again a real person, but looking at its description on the wiki “ Augustus was known as the "ruler of the world", which is represented by the globe carried in Caesar's hand.” So it isn’t Julius Caesar, but Caesar Augustus (here is a great video by Overly Sarcastic Productions on the guy, these guys do good work imo). But still, where do we go from there? My best guess would be to expand on the Planet thing. I mean Akihiko already has minor gravity powers in Arena (he would totally use that power to do DBZ style increased gravity training), maybe expand into geo-electricity or some other Earth based powers, IDK.

Fuuka (Juno): Now Juno is the Roman equivalent of Hera, wife of Zeus, so Queen of the Gods, BUT Fuuka is a full on support Persona user, so she can’t have anything TOO big. Maybe expand on the Seer stuff since Juno’s design really goes after the whole Peacock design imo?

Labrys (Ariadne): Her Persona is the princess who helped Theseus make his way through the maze to reach the Minotaur. She already sort of HAS a unique ability, what with her power to make string constructs (I know tat this is basically to make her an equivalent to Nu-13 from Blazblue in Persona 4 Arena but it is still interesting). So maybe expand upon those string constructs.

Ken (Kala-Nemi): This one is hard because outside of the Persona wiki and wikipedia I find NOTHING about this guy. Looking at the wiki we get these descriptions:

“ Kala-Nemi is the pre-Vedic spirit of the Zodiac, encircling the universe like a great serpent. Also referred to as the Rim of the Wheel of Time, Kala-Nemi's association to the zodiac is closely linked to the observation that all seasons are determined by the position of the zodiac in the skies. In the Ramayana Kala-Nemi is a Rakshasa, as well as Ravana's uncle.”

“ Kala-Nemi is the ultimate Persona of Ken Amada. Prior to him gaining this new power, Ken's initial persona was Nemesis, the goddess of divine retribution. After a dramatic event took place, his attitude and resolve changed: It was to never look back again, facing the future, and his fate, straight-on. Kala-Nemi, a Vedic deity of fate, would probably best reflect the personality of a boy who finally knows his way.”

More talk about the deity of fate stuff rather than the Rakshasa thing (something from Hindu mythos), so maybe some powers connected to the Zodiac based on the symbols on its shoulders would be interesting.

Koromaru (Cerberus): Not much I can think of here other than combining the Dark and Fire attacks into Hellfire.

Yukari (Isis): As I mentioned before, Isis is the most powerful magic user in the Egyptian Pantheon, out-foxing Ra and learning his true name to become more powerful than him. She is also known as a healer and a Sky goddess both fitting Yukari’s Wind and Healing spells. But I don’t think she’s gonna be getting her Osiris back if you know what I mean.

Junpei (Trismegistus): This last one is tricky because in gameplay Junpei is a physical attacker, but his Arcana is the Magician and his Persona is a magic god. Trismegistus being a merged identity of Hermes and Thoth (Ancient Greeks liked to equate gods whenever they went to a new land), and he already has Chidori’s Spring of Life ability (which does fit Hermes as he is also a god of healing, given his Caduceus staff), so how do I match Junpei’s physical fighting style with his Persona’s more magical basis? I just had the idea of doing more minor indirect things. Like using fire magic to warp Junpei’s baseball bat into his usual two-handed sword, or using the life power to just enhance his own muscles. I’m not going to do something crazy and turn him into Girono Giovanna from Jojo, that doesn’t fit Junpei.

Sorry if there were a lot of idk or maybes in here, these are just base ideas. I have more ideas for the P4 cast which will be covered in the next part.

#persona #persona 3 #p3 #aigis (persona)#aigis (persona 3)#mitsuru kirijo #fuuka yamagishi #akihiko sanada #labrys (persona 4 arena)#labrys (p4a)#labrys (persona)#ken amada #koromaru #yukari takeba #junpei iori #persona legend powers

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