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#idk we see the kind of asshole steve was and it wasn't like that
findafight · 1 year
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My fav part about most of these “violent Steve” fics is that they don’t remove the bits of canon that mock Steve for not being violent and masculine enough (Dustin mocking Steve for never winning a fight). Like I’ve seen people be like “yeah when he became good he lost all of his skill!” I want to scream. Like. Like Girl. This is NOT a prince Zuko situation, it is not about the spirit. If Steve had at some point enough violence in him and enough confidence to just stroll around the school and randomly hit people with the only man in his posse being fucking Tommy, then he would still be able to fuck shit up. Like come on. Come oooooon
it's so silllly. It's also kinda sad because steve's whole thing is realizing that his friends were enabling him to be an asshole, and do/say cruel things, and thought he was chicken shit for wanting to apologize! he realized tommy and carol tore people down to feel better about themselves and didn't want to do that anymore, or miserable like that. So he stopped being friends with them.
They were Mean Girls tm. They weren't like Billy, who absolutely would have been using (and did)violence to assert dominance. They were more of a whisper and giggle or completely ignore/don't register other students. They did not have the physical intimidation game. They didn't need it!
The first fight we see Steve lose is immediately BEFORE he decided to change. If he was shoving kids in lockers and giving out swirlies, he would have done better in that fight! So it really isn't about the spirit! he had a change of heart after his gf slapped him and called him an ass and being cruel to a guy whose brother is missing.
I don't get why people make steve some violent and cruel monster in pre season 1? He can be a callous jerk without being violent about it!
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blank1eboi · 2 years
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so my mom got me into stranger things right. we binged all of s3 today because i'm sick and why not. these characters are giving me brainrot.
steve? gets sillier every scene. what a silly guy. my mom says he and robin look like little sailor babies in their uniforms and i thought that was silly. also? shut up. everyone in this group is a nerd. you are a nerd, just maybe.. not in the same way. ur little car stunt? that poor car but also FUCK YEAH GET EM!
dustin? perfect silly guy and everyone who hurts him makes my blood boil. he just a little guy. he looked so silly in his snow ball outfit. his relationship with steve makes me so happy they r like brothers.
hopper? idiot. silly idiot. why are you emotionally constipated so BAD. at least he is LEARNING how to communicate properly. i'm proud of him. silly guy.
joyce? good mom. im proud of her and she goes through so much shit. i hope she and hopper can properly get their shit together but also kinda not because let me tell u it can be FUNNY. she needs a break i think. give joyce byers a break.
robin? <3 i got so excited when i saw her ace ring my mom had to pause it so i could do a mini-ramble about ace rings. she is also a nerd. she does not act like it at the very beginning of the season but she is SUCH a nerd.
erica? sometimes she can be VERY RELATABLE. very mood and i am happy she is safe. also top tier sibling relationship when she said she believed dustin ab the crazy shit just not that lucas could ever be involved.
nancy? kind of an asshole again but that's ok. she's p chill otherwise and i think she just has too much trauma and isn't very good at handling it. also BAMF. nancy wheeler BAMF and you can rip this from my cold dead hands. her hair looked very pretty this season too. i love her
mrs wheeler? the beginning of the season, that thing with billy? that had me wince quite a few times. icky yucky. but. also good mom at end of it after nancy got fired and just. after the thing with billy she was p cool.
(idk if u can tell but these characters are in ZERO order it's just who is on my mind)
billy? VERY ICKY. s2 and almost all of s3 i had ZERO sympathy for him. then his dad was an ass and when he sacrificed himself because he thought of his mom that was actually like. ouch, but still i hate you. also his hair is ugly change my mind.
max? actually kinda of hated her the first few episodes she was in. like. she was kind of a bitch. she grew on me tho!! and by the time she and el started talking i was happy to see her. she's also. not as whiny as most of the boys in the group so. that was nice and her hair is always cute.
el? able to consistently get on my nerves and make me happy. it's a little funky. GREAT style tho i would steal a lot of her clothes. her relationship with hopper makes me go <3
suzie? did not like, personally, but i wouldn't protest if she showed up again. also if she wasn't annoying and made dustin sing hopper wouldn't have that shit happen to her and i would like her more.
bob? i was sad and i probably cried idr. he grew on me and i think he was sweet. he made joyce happy and he made me happy that he liked to help even when he had no clue what was going on and sometimes his advice didn't work.
mike? whiny bitch. learn how to be a decent friend and i'll give u another thought. why is nothing ever your fault? have you ever considered that it MIGHT be at least partially your fault?? ass.
will? honestly, the kid grows on me. he's always caught up in some shit and its hard to actually get anything from that but what you do get... he mostly seems like a sentimental guy who just wants to play games with his friends. i can respect that.
lucas? if he does dumb shit in s4 i WILL call him out. no hesitation. he is prone to doing dumb shit with zero regard for the consequences it seems. he's at least useful when you need him and can find him.
jonathan? he switches between "oh he's p chill actually" and "JONATHAN WHAT THE FUCK" so. idk. u kno what i mean. he's pretty smart tho he carries the party when they're stressed and i'm proud of him.
um. i think that's it. i started this post the day that i finished s3, got tired and went to bed, and now it is a whole 5 days later and i am one ep off from finishing s4. yay?
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cloudinterlude · 2 years
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I mean, yes you can sympathise with any character you want but imo some characters are just evil.
Howard is racist because he is a white man born in 1917 and he was involved in deals that are rooted in bigotry raging from Manhattan Project, operation paperclip, probably involved with the experimentation of Isaiah Bradley and others. He literally allowed Nazis infiltrate SHIELD. He also a part of the military industrial complex. He must have been involved in the NRA lobby.
And yes, you can criticise Tony for similar shit (including sexism) but the difference is we saw Tony develop unlike Howard. Howard was getting worse and worse in his treatment of women and his greed. I think it was in iron man 3, where there was a deleted scene in which Maria was crying due to Howard’s treatment so he’s a shitty husband. Regarding the abuse he inflicted on his son, it was more than just emotional abuse. If you read MCU tie in comic (which is canon MCU) he physically abused Tony.
My thing is: nothing about this character screams complex, just abusive and narcissistic. This is for MCU Howard. Idk much about comic Howard. I just know he was an ass too.
He can be evil to you, that's fine. I have no energy or intention of convincing you otherwise. I'm not protective in the slightest over Howard as a character. You can say he's evil incarnate and Id hardly bat an eye - I'm only ever defensive of Steve (and Wanda).
Manhattan Project, Operation Paperclip (which in turn allowed more room for Hydra to infiltrate them), yeah sure. He was involved in those things, fully agree. Don't know about canon evidence to support Howard being directly involved with Isaiah or the other AA test subjects. In fact, that seems as the least likely of all this, seems like Zola's work. Military industrial complex, yeah. NRA lobby, maybe? Definitely possible, although doesn't seem like his scene. Not being he'd have moral objections (Howard's morals as time went on definitely get looser), but for the same reason he stated he'd been avoiding joining Hydra-lite in Agent Carter. I'll probably address most of these in the Howard vs social issues post (if I ever make it lol) but I don't think he was an active racist. Sure there are more subtle forms of racism that you could probably convince me he was - Howard didn't come off as a violent, hateful racist. Also, I don't know if you were implying this, but I don't think I can ever get behind the "Howard (and Peggy) intentionally allowed Nazis to grow in SHIELD because they were Nazis" train.
And yeah, fully agree he wasn't good to his family. I already said I wouldn't defend him on that. Never saw the deleted scene or read the MCU tie-in comics and only heard of the ones involving Wanda w/ AOU. I just scrolled through it. It might have been missing something, but I didn't see any physical abuse. He did slap Tony's car out of his hands but that's all I saw. I'm willing to believe it happened and I'd take that right in stride. Nothing I've felt about him has changed with this, though.
Most of these things are post-Agent Carter. Which is the Howard I comment on the most and I've stated, hopefully clearly, that his downfall and everything that contributed to it is what makes him interesting to me. I don't I see all of the things mentioned as contributors to his character and gives me a clear map on how his mental state plummeted to Hell. And how he contributed to his own lack of well-being. I love characters that cause problems for themselves and then sit around and wonder how it all went wrong.
Unless you think Howard from the very start was the worst person ever which is where the disconnect is.
And yeah, the fact that we see Tony, who is scarily similar to his father, kind of change in ways his father didn't is also apart of why I like both characters.
I never said Howard wasn't an asshole. I'm not as mad at him as many others are since he isn't one-dimensional to me. I fill in the nuance. I wouldn't describe Howard as pure evil because I think that kind of has to be purposefully fostered with no good intentions, which Howard clearly had at the time of AC and further than that, I believe.
I'm perfectly comfortable with you and everyone else seeing Howard as Satan himself if y'all want. I have a different interpretation, and I'm chill with leaving it at that 🤷🏿‍♀️ Steve is just about the only character I'm going to get passionate about debating tbh, but I like Howard and no one is going to get me to not like his character.
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boop-le-snoot · 4 years
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PARTY FAVOURS I CHAPTER 29
First time reader click here
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Feels like this story is flopping. Is it flopping? Idk. This chapter is 100% plot and it is spooky. Cursed demon box. Helpful Stephen Strange and grumpy Wong. Hovering Bruce and Tony. Loki being a honorary Gen-Z. Found family but make it ✨superheroes✨.
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"That's a lot to unpack," Peter stated once I had given him the bare bones report of the situation at hand. "Uh, are you okay?" The boy was obviously upset at my predicament, placing a supportive hand on my shoulder.
"Kinda?" I offered, making space for Wanda and Pietro who decided to join me and Peter, away from the arguing adults. The mission discussion - an absolute disaster - started as soon as Peter had walked in. Evidently experienced in such matters, the boy ignored the bickering and came over to steal me from Bruce's clutches to peacefully finish his egg sandwich in the company of his peers.
"I wanted to ask if I could see your memory of that time," Wanda meekly offered me a piece of candy. I accepted it - sugar sweet sugar, how I love thee so! The witch continued with a smile: "I think it would be helpful to see what we're dealing with, magic-wise."
"Sure," I trusted her. "Just don't scramble what's left of my sanity, please," All of us laughed at my remark as I laid down on the cold floor with my head in Wanda's lap. Her powers felt like small brain zaps, tingles that began at the front of my forehead and ran down into my spine. I followed her instructions and thought about the times I remembered, finding the box, placing it into my closet, the nightmares. I had a mild headache by the time she was done; no grudges against her - Wanda tactfully avoided my private moments and looked only at the ones containing the artifact.
"You've gotten really good," I complimented her with pure adoration.
"Thank you," She blushed, smoothing back my stray hairs. "That stuff is really strong. I don't think you should go near the box," She admitted. "And Doc should take a look at you. You have a residue left. I don't think that's good either."
"Well, fuck," I said in muted resignation.
"Press F to pay respects," Pietro joked in an attempt to lighten the atmosphere.
"Your luck is almost as bad as mine," Peter pointed out.
I scoffed. "Well, if I see any spiders around, I'll be sure to stay away in case they happen to be radioactive OsCorp runaways."
All of us laughed. Despite the grim situation, I didn't feel doomed. I was surrounded by friends and my boyfriends and my bestie who happened to be a mythical omnipotent god- welp, once again, I was getting too emotional. Once the adults were done arguing, we could start making sense of this mess and hopefully clean it up before the monster is out of the box.
"Mortals," I heard Loki scoff. The next moment, the Asgardian sat down noisily next to me, pout on full display. "This house is a nightmare."
His expression - or the accidental use of a meme - sent me completely, tension leaving my body via copious amounts of nearly hysterical laughter. Through tears and hiccups, I saw Wanda cackle with me and Peter show the meme in question to Loki, noting that he had been once sent to time-out on top of the fridge by Tony himself. Soon, all of us were laughing, much to the displeasure of the adults.
"Children, what is the issue?" Thor asked, irritated.
"We're just waiting for you to be done with arguing," I spoke before Loki could start bitching about Thor calling him a child. "Then I can show Steve and Loki where exactly have I buried the box so Stephen can take me to the healers and get this thing out of me or whatever," I pointed out the most logical plan of action.
Two long strides and the sorcerer was standing over me, boom-boom-whooshing and generally making very pretty golden patterns to appear and land on top of me. Tony and Bruce anxiously hovered behind him, both of my boys concerned and ready to mother-hen me. Ugh, so disgustingly adorable. Wanda's hand encompassed mine - she was nervous.
Stephen took a solid five-minute silence break before coming to a final conclusion. "Wong can get rid of the residual traces of the artifact's influence," The sorcerer announced curtly. "It's good you got rid of the artifact, a few more months and you would have started slipping into insanity if the magic within it was not released," He explained, slowly reaching out a hand to place it on top of my head. I wasn't sure if it was a gesture meant to bring comfort or another diagnostic test but leaned into the touch nonetheless. "Tell me, did you have any behavioral... Disturbances after...?" He trailed off.
I chewed on my lip, evaluating. "I honestly don't know. I've always been kind of an asshole," Honesty was the best policy. "Nothing seems out of order, sleepwalking aside."
"I see," Strange gave me a tight-lipped smile. "Perhaps, it was your stubborn nature that forbade the artifact from corrupting your mind completely. As evidenced by Captain Rogers, even undesirable character traits bring good into this world now and then."
That seemed a little bit hostile. I frowned, giving a questioning look to a frowning Loki.
"Speaking from experience?" Not the one to hold back upon witnessing first-grade bullshit, I withdrew from Stephen's touch, raising a sarcastic eyebrow.
Surprising everyone, the man laughed soundly, eyes crinkling at the corners. "I most certainly do," Shooting me a positively mischievous wink. I felt like I was missing something.
The room's inhabitants slowly ticked out in pairs and threes, eager to complete their assigned tasks. Loki had insisted on coming along to the sanctum with me, even almost getting up in Stephen's face, but Bruce - out of all people - managed to calm the Asgardian down, and together we convinced him his magic would be considerably more useful during the retrieval of the cursed box. Loki was worried - everyone with a pair of functional eyes could see that the spiky attitude was his way of showing he cared about me, which made my insides briefly turn to mush. I didn't expect him to take the title of my best friend so seriously and I definitely was not complaining.
Tony was the last to leave, jittery and shaky, clutching me like it was his last time seeing me, kissing me hungrily in front of everyone. The joke or two he made were weak ghosts of his usual sharp snark.
"I love you and I'll be back soon," I whispered into his ear, feeling him freeze and his fingertips dig almost painfully into my sides. Louder, I repeated: "Not planning on dying any time soon, y'all gotta chill. Let's go, doc?" I addressed the tall sorcerer who was tactfully pretending to be busy with his smartphone.
Wanda pressed a duffle bag into my hands mouthing "clean clothes" a split second before Stephen opened a portal and with a great deal of curiosity, I stepped through it, eyes immediately drawn to the dimly lit space filled with books and antiques. So many books, so many unusual trinkets. The chandelier that hung over our heads rivaled the ones I'd seen in million-dollar-homes of dad's friends.
"Follow me," Stephen extended an arm in the direction of a smaller door, "Please do not touch anything."
I walked a pace behind him, satisfying my curiosity by looking around like a child in a candy store. The air smelled different in the Sanctum, almost as familiar as Loki's magic but less frosty... Warmer. A dash of red fabric swished from somewhere towards me; I giggled. The Cloak of Levitation liked me - not nearly as much as it liked Peter though - so I brushed my fingertips along the fabric, greeting it quietly. Talking loudly in this building was out of the question. I felt like any moment, a disgruntled librarian would appear to chastise me for making noise.
"Strange," A short Asian man appeared, book in hand and looking none too happy. Guess that's the librarian... "I got your text. The room next to yours is prepared for the ritual," The man I assumed to be Wong gave me a curt nod in the way of greeting, doing a quick 180° and walking us back to a small but tastefully decorated room with a single cot in the middle. It was pleasantly warm, a small fire lit in the fireplace, willowy smoke of incense rising from a few strategically placed sticks.
"The bathroom is that way. I'm afraid you'll have to be fully nude for the procedure," Strange declared apologetically, pointing to a door hidden behind the divide.
I snorted, but of course, the weird voodoo shit would require me to be naked. Not that I was embarrassed or anything but still. Tony would have a field day. Locating a chair, I dumped my duffle bag on it, flying out of my hoodie and sweatpants in record time. My underwear and socks followed, feet unpleasantly chilly despite the carpeted floor. I ran a hand over the faint bruises on my hips, evidence of last night, fondly - either Tony or Stephen had left marks on my body and that was... It was great. I loved it, drugs or not.
I heard someone clear their throat and turned around, nearly cracking up at the way both men suddenly averted their gazes, blush riding high on their cheeks. I snorted: "I'm hot, what else is new?"
Wong shook his head, busying himself with some sort of a book; Stephen lingered, eyes fixated on the very same bruises. His tongue darted out, wetting the plush of his bottom lip, and damn, this wasn't the time to get horny. I shook my head and with that, the sorcerer caught himself too, mutely motioning me to lay down on the cot.
"Whenever you're done eye-fucking each other," Wong piped up sarcastically - wow, I liked this man already. Stephen grumbled something quiet and rude, provoking another snort from me.
I followed their instructions - shortly after the Asian man began reading - or rather singing - something in a language I didn't know, I felt myself fall into a deep sleep. Or, I thought I was falling asleep. At one point, my eyes opened to an empty room, a thin sheet covering my bare body, and a silence that made chills run down my spine.
"Stephen?" I called out. I sounded like I was underwater to my own ears. "Wong?"
I was met with silence so deafening, I had no choice but to sit up and look around. The fire was burning strong in the fireplace, several logs blackened from it as sparks flew. It took a second for me to realize it made no sound - there was no crackling. Something was very wrong, the dread was creeping up on me.
Very familiar dread.
With the sheet firmly wrapped around me, I hopped off the cot, suddenly noticing the drawings on my arms, my legs. I was covered in runes similar to the ones I had seen on the cursed box - and my memories weren't missing. As clear as day, I recalled messing around with the box, debating on opening it, taking it out of my room only to find it back on my desk in the morning, some serious Anabelle shit.
I jumped as the floorboards cracked somewhere in the house. Every logical thought I had, backed up by every horror movie I had ever watched, screamed at me to NOT go towards the creepy noise; like moth to a flame, I was drawn in and couldn't resist the unnatural urge to investigate it. On silent feet, I padded out of the room, desperately trying not to think about the lonely, dark hallways filled with strange ancient objects. My steps made no noise.
On the couch, in the main room we'd arrived, sitting lazily, was Tony. I'd recognize his hair anywhere - and the Led Zep tee, old, frayed edges and loose threads. "Tony?" I asked hopefully, trying to make sense of this...
He turned around.
It wasn't Tony. Whatever it was, it wore Tony's face, it held his brown eyes and crow's feet around them - it wasn't him. Wrong, like the lack of sound in this place, misplaced and unnatural. The doe browns didn't sparkle, lifeless, dull color of dried mud. As much as I wanted to go and bury my face in his chest, my limbs filled with lead, my whole body screaming "DANGER".
The impostor kept quiet which only solidified my suspicions. Real Tony would be running his mouth already, poking fun at my impression of a sheet ghost.
"Princess?" The... Thing asked in Tony's voice, but it fell flat and monotone.
"Whatever you are, you sure as Hell ain't Tony," I stated firmly, hoping for some answers. "What the fuck?"
Not-Tony's face changed, familiar features twisting into something sinister, the malice making me sick to my stomach. The creature stood up, causing my feet to take an involuntary step back as he advanced slowly.
"You have no choice but to submit," The Thing replied calmly. "You're not getting out of here. Not even your little Asgardian pet god can save you," Its tone was absolutely flat. I would have thought the thing was a robot if not for the obvious involvement of magic in this situation. Its words filled me with dread as thick as molten lava; unfortunately for the creature, unlocking my memories gave me enough rational balance to be acutely aware of it and therefore, able to fight it.
I could fight it. I didn't know how exactly, but I could resist it. "That's a really bold thing to say for something that... What even are you? Magical STD?" As my brain desperately focused on finding a solution to a problem I didn't know all the details of, my mouth had a mind of its own.
The creature growled, a far more primal noise than a human could make. "You don't know what you're up against, child. I am one for we are many," Suddenly, the room was filled with shadows as if someone had turned off all the lights and cranked up the moon to be the brightest it ever was. The shadows moved, oozed, motion sinister without any light to back it up.
I had no choice but to pucker up. Nobody was coming to rescue me; in fact, I always have taken pride in being a self-saving princess. Damsel in distress wasn't really my style. The hunch in my shoulders disappeared, giving way to a stubborn and stiff expectation of the upcoming altercation, hands bailed in fists.
"I mean, like Legion the demon from the Bible?" I recalled what little I knew from Wikipedia. "I mean, I'm agnostic myself, but if you feel like identifying with that, you should probably see a therapist."
The entity growled, shadows gathering around it like fabric on a string, and lunged. Paralyzed by sudden blinding, deafening fear, I turned tail and ran.
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findafight · 1 year
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tbh i think ppl that genuinely think steve dragged her there kind of take nancy's behavior at the party in the best light/take nancy at her word bc,,,, we see nancy excited for the party to the point of spending time making a costume and encouraging jonathan to come only for her to start lashing out at steve right after they get there. like i always felt so bad for him when tommy and billy start harassing him and nancy literally rolls her eyes and just stalks off only to start heavily drinking specifically to spite steve given what she says about how she's just acting normal like he wanted (also that smug look she sends him right after continuing to drink). idk the way nancy starts acting out (this makes her sound like a 5 y/o throwing a tantrum but,,,, if the shoe fits) could make it seem as if she's been forced to do something against her will when taken out of context but in context she's literally just acting like a huge asshole to her boyfriend bc she's upset about something she hasn't even told him about. i get upset when i think about it too much bc ppl focus way more on the bullshit scene (for obvious reasons) but nancy really was treating steve like shit that whole night.
yeah like. Owens talks about "the anniversary effect", and I think that's hitting Nancy hard, and so she's lashing out! She's a teenager and she doesn't know how to handle her grief and her desire for justice. That's fine and she deserves to yell and cry about it. But she also isn't communicating what she actually needs from Steve because I don't think she really realized it until she saw the redhead in the library. And dropping that on him and kind of freaking out about it at school wasn't really the most appropriate place to have a deep discussion on what to do. (idk why people view this as steve just flat out refusing to talk about it ever, it's clear to me he's nervous about it because they're at school and he doesn't want to be overheard and doesn't want to risk the government hurting them/their families)
We see Steve do his best to support Nancy by going to the dinners with the Hollands, and also encouraging her to go to the party, after we have been shown Nancy talking about it and inviting Jonathan and excited for it. He is engaging her with something she was looking forward to. idk why people view this as steve just flat out refusing to talk about it ever, it's clear to me he's nervous about it because they're at school and he doesn't want to be overheard and doesn't want to risk the government hurting them/their families. Yeah maybe if she had asked him to come with her on the plan to entrap Owens he would have said no, but at least he would have known where she was at and what she was thinking, instead of the sudden one-off talk they had in the library.
I guess if people only watched tina's party and not anything that came before they could see nancy as completely correct and that steve was pretending while she didn't want to (instead of mostly pretending with Steve and having had one freak out about it in a place that people could overhear) and that he dragged her there. But it's astounding that people can watch Nancy smile and give the flyer to Jon and still say Steve was a bad boyfriend for taking her.
She is definitely drinking vindictively in the scene, even though for all Steve knows Nancy genuinely wanted to go and have fun at the party. He's trying to get her to slow down and idk I've seen some takes as this showing Steve is controlling but legitimately what the fuck else are you going to do when you see someone you care about (friend/partner/whatever) ignoring you and being kind of an ass and drinking way too much while obviously upset about something. Of course he would encourage her to slow down!
He doesn't know what's wrong because Nancy actually has a habit of not talking or communicating to her boyfriend what is upsetting her. Nancy is so over pretending but she has only barely broached that with Steve. He did try to shut it down, but I don't remember him saying he was unwilling to talk about it, just that it was a bad idea, and that Nancy was coming with this "tear the lab down" thing from nowhere.
Part of the problem is that Nancy had feelings for Jonathan and didn't know what to do about that, and so decided that actually, everything was Steve's fault, because he wanted to be normal, he wanted to go to the party and have fun, he wanted to date and be in love, when, to drunk Nancy's mind, she wanted none of that. (even though we are shown that that isn't true) So she's going to drink and she's going to have fun and she's not even in love. (idk it depends on the day for me if nancy was faking the whole time or did, at some point, fall in love with him and then out of love.) The whole party scene is a mess for Stancy and poor Steve has no idea why his girlfriend is drinking too much and suddenly acting like they're fighting when there's no reason to. and then he gets yelled at and told she's pretending to love him.
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