#jonsnowask

[what-do-1000-swords-look-like]

Hi! I was wondering if you saw Kit’s recent Q&A session about Jon Snow? He made some really interesting comments that I appreciate him finally starting to feel safe about coming out in support of Jon’s actions and mindset. One of things I found interesting, that I think you have touched on well, is Jon’s relationships with women. In a nut shell that he’s drawn to abusive relationship dynamics because of his childhood with Catlyn. Would love to hear your thoughts and analysis.

Hey, Anon! =) Actually, I had no idea until you just told me. I feel horrible that I had no idea a convention was happening. That is definitely one I might try out in the future! So thank you for letting me know about it.

The questions were great and Kit's answers were very well thought out, and really gave us a glimpse into how he works as an actor and how he approaches his career and life as well. So I completely agree with you! It was nice to see him starting to finally feel comfortable enough to be honest with his answers about the show, no matter what people might say. As soon as he said he felt it was right when he saw that Jon was going to kill Dany, I literally clapped and went "Say it a little louder for the Dany/Jonerys stans in the back! Someone was paying attention in class!" And it gave me even more respect for him, not only for being able to say that in that room (and the ensuing boos in the mix of reactions was ridiculous but predictable) but also because he gets it. Like he said, Dany gave Jon no other choice realistically; he had to do it. I also appreciated what he said about Jon, Arya, and the NK. I felt he was very respectful to the show but still shared his opinion, while making sure to state that this was his own personal feeling on it. A lot of good stuff.

Before I get to the Catelyn topic, I will mention that the one answer I sort of didn't agree with was his answer about Jon loving Dany. And that's not because it wasn't what I wanted to hear but because that's not the story the show is telling up until Dany's death in 8x06. That wasn't in the final product that made it to air. Tbf to Kit, perhaps he knows something we don't whether that be through conversations with D&D, GRRM, or what the scripts originally stated in a certain draft. Jon fiercely loving Dany or however he phrased it does not match up to what we were shown on screen. But I do believe when the final season aired, Kit hadn't seen it yet. So it's possible, in post production, several changes happened (like certain scenes getting cut, certain takes used instead, etc.) that neither he, Emilia, nor any of the cast members had seen. But I'm pretty sure he implied he has seen it by now so I'm not quite sure, based on his own reasoning, how he still feels Jon loved Dany. But then again, and also tbf to him again, he did not say how Jon loved Dany and he did not directly answer the relation/incest portion of the question. It's obvious in the show that Jon cared for Dany as family and he may have had some feelings for Dany herself, but the show purposely makes sure to focus on the physical with them, never the emotional. So for me, when he talks about how Jon never got time to focus on finding out who he is, this again lines up better to the show/story we got than the one D&D/the cast/HBO/promo was trying to sell us at the time.

Now this leads into the Catelyn comment he made. I found that particular viewpoint interesting but I didn't lend it a lot of weight if that makes sense? Because he kind of mentions it off the cuff in relation to him thinking about it the night prior which makes complete sense that he would be thinking "what if I get asked about Dany? What do I say?" and that leading to that whole thought track. But while I found this amusing as a mention, I not only didn't take it seriously but I also tend to disagree with that take. Yes, Catelyn's treatment of Jon as a child was horrible, and like with any type of trauma, this can be impactful on a person in ways that they don't always know. But for him to seek it out subconsciously or even purposefully? No, I disagree.

Speaking purely from the show perspective, Ygritte challenges him and she can be dominating like Kit says, but she doesn't mistreat him the way Catelyn does. Even when she gets angry at his betrayal and shoots him full of arrows, she doesn't mistreat him. If anything, she proves to be his ally in many ways and even accepts him for who he is (not only as a crow but also knowing that he's not really a turncoat). She wants him for him because she loves him, and every one of her actions speaks to that fact. So that blows the Catelyn thing out of the water for Ygritte.

As for Dany, no matter what Kit's personal opinion might be on the Jon's love for her aspect, she was no good for Jon. And the show made sure to tell that to the viewers in each episode and even Kit himself said "She turns a corner and doesn't really leave any room for him to continue being with her". We all knew that had Dany survived, Jon was going to become her latest barbecue grill project. Dany was abusive to him, she abused the authority she had over him, and she definitely abused the power dynamics between them. And on top of that, she didn't want Jon to be who he was, not just his Targaryen heritage but also being King in the North, a Stark but not in name, all of it. She wouldn't accept him for who he was and wanted him to stay a bastard, same as Catelyn when he was a boy, and stay subservient to her. So for Jon to go from Point A (Catelyn) to Point B (Ygritte) back to Point A again (Dany), speaking strictly from character development's sake, this doesn't jive. Why would Jon go back to that and want to be subject to that type of cruelty (and this time way worse imho) after he broke away from it and not only did he start to get to know himself as a person and what he stood for, but also after he had a different type of relationship altogether? Story wise this doesn't make sense, and that's even before we look at the story the show actually ended up telling. (and this is why Sansa as a potential romantic interest for Jon would have made so much sense imho, she's set up as Catelyn 2.0 in framing but she's not actually Catelyn and she echoes more closely to Ygritte than Dany ever did like some Jonerys stans try to claim; she accepted Jon for who he was & wanted him for him - she should have been Point C imho)

I'm not saying Jon wasn't traumatized by Catelyn's treatment; I believe he was. But in telling this linear narrative that the show did, and comparing it to other characters and how they were developed, it wouldn't make sense for Jon to go back to this type of woman/treatment as Kit's comment infers. So that's why I don't give any weight to it: it doesn't make sense speaking from character development, it doesn't jive with the story we saw, and the way Kit said it was more conversational than it was a full-on answer.

I hope I was able to answer your question thoroughly, Anon! Again, thank you for telling me about the con. =) I still have to check out Kit's general panel. I hope you have a wonderful rest of your evening!!! <3

[what-do-1000-swords-look-like]

I agree that for Jon as a character to make any sense and for his past journey through the GOT series to make sense, political Jon has to be there. One thing I thought was off, maybe I'm crazy, is Kit saying between filming S7 & S8 that he didn't know when Jon fell for Dany. If the scripts he was given for the end of S7 WERE the ones used during the filming, then how could he not have known? Also, as you pointed out, what the script says and how Jon acts on screen don't match up. Fishy maybe?

Hi, Anon!

I don’t think you’re crazy at all. I completely forgot that Kit had said that (thank you for reminding me!). Which brings me right to the point that I actually agree with you 100%. Something fishy definitely went on bts. I just don’t know exactly what since no one really spoke on it or confirmed it. I know D&D talked about the show when they were in Austin but I think they only did it in general terms? (I could be wrong on this) I do remember back before the Emmys happened and they uploaded the 8x06 script for the nomination - I remember reading that and going “wtf?” with everyone else. Lines like Sansa and Jon looking at each other when Arya asks what’s west of Westeros because they “both failed geography” (that line still makes me laugh). Or Daenerys in that dragon wings shot being regarded by everyone as Her Satanic Majesty (like what? lol) or Drogon accidentally melting the IT in a fit of rage and grief. But I think during this, iirc, people were able to point out that the script didn’t fit to what we saw on screen. I don’t remember the exact examples and if they also included 8x05 in this but I do remember there had been something.

So for me, there is definitely something fishy. You would think Kit would have known exactly when his character fell for Dany or even who he was politically manipulating kindly in season 7. Not to bring another show into GoT discourse, but him not knowing reminds me of another show that had a bad ending that I’ve also been heavily mired in recently: Supernatural. One of the characters confessed that he loved another after years of clues in the narrative and moments that showcased he had though the show never confirmed it and actually tried to deny it at times or even shut the conversations down. When the actor who plays that character was asked just when the character fell in love with the other, he claimed he didn’t know. Kit is a very similar type of actor to these two actors (as well as Emilia I think) - they’re fully in their character’s skin and very interested in the arcs for their characters. I find it hard to believe that Kit didn’t wonder just when Jon fell for Dany if the romance was meant to be a genuine epic sweeping love saga that it was being portrayed to be in the main narrative, especially if his character was going to be sacrificed in the end so to speak. So, these two shows with these types of actors really kind of mirrored each other in a way - GoT was trying to prove a romance was there and SPN was trying to prove there wasn’t and in the end, they got the complete opposite effect but one similar theme: what they showed on screen did not match what was in their scripts, editing, and acting regarding those two relationships. At the end of each series, things had changed in the narrative. Jon has to kill Dany and the SPN character has to confess his love to the other character. This to me proves not everything is as it seems when it comes to the Jonerys romance for Jon’s character. In the end, yes something is definitely off.

Thank you so much for the ask. <3

Edit 3/20/21: in 7x06 script, in the boat cabin, when Jon sees Dany mourning Viserion, this moment is written that this is when he realizes he has feelings for her.