#just dgm thoughts

[chocolatepiethings]

Going back to chapter 235 after reading the new one and this little flashback that Red/Allen has is probably from when he met Nea in the river right?

Also interesting that it seems he promised not to forget his name, was it so Mana could find him? Nea told him that Allen would be his sign

[kanrawalker]

SO I FOUND OUT I GOT A SEVERE CASE OF CARPAL TUNNEL SYNDROME DUE TO NEUROPATHY

And if it's true that Katsura Hoshino has been suffering with the same affliction, I cannot unsee how these panels accurately reflects how CTS feels

the pain and existential dread that comes with knowing that the one thing you know and love to do brings you pain and suffering constantly trying to convince yourself that "it will be fine - just one more drawing, it should be fine"

[jaxonkreide]

doodles i did the other day uvu

the lavi piece is lowkey a redraw of smth I drew like 6 years ago, proud of that improvement!

my friend @starsofmirkwood is at fault for catboy tyki;; they don't know d gray man and said his eyes looked somehow non human and I went "yeah, cat."

[m-kyunie]

changed my mind I do want to post this here

[nistley]

I am the only one who thought "Reunion of Allen boyfriends and his father-in-law ? “

[simply-m-a-d]

I can’t begin to explain how much the development of Kanda and Allen’s relationship means to me oh my god…Hoshino portrayed it so beautifully in this chapter; Allen opening up and telling his story for the first time and it’s for Kanda, Kanda patiently listening and the way he seems to direct himself to Allen in a much gentler way…and then both of them still having that silly side towards each other no matter how much they’ve grown…im sobbing oh my god…

[alienaiver]

i want to be the love of tyki's "light" life.. i want him to treat me so gently and warmly, living with me in my cold and run-down apartment whenever he's available. he tells me of big dreams including me and him, how he'll give me the world when he one day turns rich. how i'm his source of light and all the other sweet nothings that he deeply yearns to be true. he could give me the world right now, technically, but that would mean disclosing what he doesnt want me to see. he wants me to stay in the light with his other side, wants to be selfish and not corrupt me with his dark side. i want tyki to pour into me all of his gentle and bright love

[elegyofthemoon]

squints oh. guilt complex next to saviour complex. i see jots down notes

[icharchivist]

like, re: Dear Gray Man being for a written letter while the characters are getting lost to war

when you recall history everything always gets summed up to numbers - x amount of people died here, x amount lived to tell the tale, ect.. unless they are considered important in history's eyes. It's how history is perceived by the masses in most of the times. But historians are especially interested in letters written during those time period, especially wars. historians always learn a lot more from it and from the acknowledgement of the humanity that gets lost to the history.

the reveal that D. Gray Man is supposed to be like a letter therefore goes with this theme in general on how history is unfolding with this war, and in the grand scheme of things we'll remember mostly the big actions that would have been enough to stop the war. But the manga is like a letter the historians love so much that remind you of the humanity that lived on, even if the fate they meet was all the more bleak.

Dear Gray Man, a letter that reminds you of the people who lived through it.

[vitamiiiiins]

GIRL!!!! WHAT!!!!!!

[lady-bee-holmes]

I feel like I need to apologize for the fact that I am still, at heart, an anime geek. Like, my icon should always clue me in, but nope

I am undeniably back on my bullshit

[arimiaromage]

thoughts about dgm chapter 251

gonna throw my thoughts about these new revelations here.

bookman jr or past!allen?

she got us good! I was in shock when I first read it (all my headcanons about pasta, out the window! thrown! chunked!) but now I'm more fine with it.

I believe what happened was that hoshino drew the bookman jr in those flashbacks with nea on purpose - she wanted us to think that was allen and bookman jr. the flashbacks aren't past!allen with longer hair, this is definitely the bookman jr, as we can tell now.

it also makes more sense now why "allen" was talking about high concepts like the spiral being the force for life - it really was a bookman!

I fully think she did this switcharoo on purpose. if we look at her most recent livestream (translated by ponkotsubluuues), someone comments that they were shocked past!allen and bookman jr weren't the same person. her response is basically "yes, I know". she's not surprised people would think that, this was probably deliberately on purpose.

bookman jr & past!allen

okay, now on to some thoughts on who they actually are. I won't stick long here as we'll probably find out in just a few months and we don't have much to go on right now.

personally, I don't really care to ever meet allen's blood relatives. it's never interested me who he's "actually" related to and I always felt it would add even more complicated feelings for him and even more complexity to an already messy as hell family & relationship tree.

that being said, I wouldn't be surprised if bookman jr and allen are some kind of family unit, be it blood related or not. when they begin talking about the two of them as separate people, lucia refers to them as "two young men". so they're probably not father and son, but I could see them as brothers or some sort of brotherhood if they're not blood related.

maybe past!allen is a traveling clown who toured the world with bookman jr LOL.....?

either way, bookman jr was so compelled to protect allen & nea that he gave his life for them. I'm so, so eager to see their bond.

cross marian

who the hell is cross marian in all of this?

we know the cross has been around since almost adam's time, having been with mana and nea since they were children-

so we know that regardless of who is he, he's known about and visited the campbell manor for decades.

in this chapter, they even bring him up by name.

not only does allen ask about him, but lucia talks a bit about him as well.

and note that they're not saying something like "my master left a message for me" and lucia just goes along with it- allen says "my master cross" and lucia continues by saying his full name. she knows exactly who he's talking about.

(allen specifically says "cross shishou" = "master cross" but lucia called him "cross marian")

to me, this is one of the main reasons I don't believe cross is bookman jr. I believe he's somehow tied to the bookman, but I don't think he's the missing jr. if he was, why does lucia refer to him as cross here but not later? she clearly knows who allen is referring to, so wouldn't the bookman have searched for cross and found him with relative ease, given he was at the order for quite a while with bookman & lavi up until apocryphos attacked him?

lucia and the master only refer to bookman jr as "junior", not cross marian. if you're desperately looking for cross marian and are fully aware allen knows who that is, then why not call him that? what do you have to lose at this point?

and furthermore, if cross was this bookman jr, how did he forget who HE made the host? how did he lose allen? redarm!allen looks a lot more like this new past!allen and they both have redish brown hair - if you were traveling with this guy, you should be able to recognize him even if he's de-aged like 8 years, ESPECIALLY once mana takes him in and his hair becomes styled the exact same way.

I know we always have the deus ex machina of apocryphos' memory changing but I really don't want that to be the case for every character, the more you do it the more it becomes a contrivance.

cross definitely has SOME connection to the bookman, I don't feel like his mask and knowledge of bookman things is entirely a red herring. lucia makes it sound like cross reached out to them regarding the campbell manor, but I'll get to that in a bit.

the other leading theory is that cross is cyrus campbell, katerina's brother and head of the family. I feel like this holds a bit more water than him being a bookman, as it'd explain why he was the campbell manor when mana and nea were so young (and presumably before nea became a noah) and why he has worked so tirelessly for both of them.

remember, his innocence maria greatly resembles katerina. it's possible this is katerina's corpse, being infested by innocence. maybe this is from innocence cross was carrying finding its way to her corpse or maybe it was a failed attempt to save her, we don't really know yet.

(I'm not fully convinced about the cyrus theory either though, as why does nea refer to cross as cross instead of cyrus or uncle? how would the order not know about his family and how obviously tied to the noah he is? how could he not recognize allen, his nephew's most trusted friend?)

there have been some theories that maybe the campbells are a bookman family, which may be the case and would help explain why cross has a connection to both, but the way lucia words this part makes me think otherwise.

she makes it sound like the campbell manor wasn't always under their jurisdiction, that it came to be that way but wasn't always. but that might be pulling at straws. I just don't think she'd word it this way if cross = bookman jr.

I'm not fully convinced about either theory about cross as I see holes in both of them. just have to wait and see~

personally I'd still like it if cross was just a childhood friend who got way too attached but we'll see 😂 or maybe he was just pining for katerina from afar....

crown clown

I feel pretty confident now that this is past!allen being hugged by bookman jr, possibly for the last time / as bookman jr's way to protect him.

but I also can't help but feel.... it reminds me of crowned clown, you know? the way it wraps around allen, covering him in an attempt to protect him. even the cut off tips. it really reminds me of that.

the bookman are no stranger to innocence. we also don't know when allen acquired his innocence- did past!allen have it? or...... did bookman jr give it to him as he was dying? did he think it would protect him and nea (and why would he give a noah innocence)?

I would not be surprised if there was some connection between bookman jr and allen's innocence.

allen

I absolutely loved this part.

the pure conviction in his face. no regrets. he finally has a chance to clear up his mind, to cast away the fear he's dealt with for so long about who he actually is. so, so good.

but........ WHO IS ALLEN WALKER????? the burning question. who knows at this point.

I'm very excited to see the next parts, even if it apparently isn't the 35 year flashback (her own words, from the aforementioned livestream) - I assume it'll be a flashback to past!allen meeting nea possibly, or them finding out nea isn't a typical noah, or some major event that happened before shit went down.

yeah that's about it, see yall next time ✌️

[shiroganeryo]

DGM 252: New perspectives and confirmations it has given us

⚠️First of all, I'll be tagging this under DGM spoilers so if you have somehow stumbled upon this even if you're avoiding spoilers for Chapter 252 (or the most recent DGM talks as a whole), this is your warning to turn back now!

And secondly, I'm under the effect of allergy meds so please pardon me if I'm talking gibberish 😂 But the latest chapter has given us some food for thought and I've been mulling it over.

There are two points I want to cover in this post; the first one being much extensive while the other is rather short.

1. Bookman Jr.

The reveal that the guy we had thought to be Past!A all along was actually the former Bookman Jr. in one of the best twists Hoshino has given us in a while - she sounded very proud of how we were all misled by her narrative and honestly I tip my hat at her for such genius - has also fueled questions about his identity.

I'll start by saying I do not believe he and Cross are the same person. That's not what I'll be talking about so I'm playing this card right off the bat. This theory, although popular, has always had way too many gaps for my liking and after the latest chapter, the chances are practically null that it's true.

If you want a discussion as to why, this post has put it into words better than I could and I agree 100% with OP's point, hence why I don't see the need to say anything on the matter.

But there's one thing that I'm yet to see people discussing and it's about the talk Lucia had with Joe back in The 222nd Night: Searching for A.W. - Hypokrisis.

(I'm showing what I believe to be the official translated English version by Viz and there's a reason why)

For a long time, people have debated about this small exchange between Lucia and Joe. There's no doubt the one they're talking about is old man Bookman, so we can confidently affirm he's the one waiting at the Campbell Mansion.

And what about Lavi? This is where the next dialogue from Lucia comes into play:

Since this is probably the version a lot of people have read, I must make it clear that the like "Junior, his successor, isn't here" was a mistranslation. Here's the original:

Lucia: Koukeisha to naru Jr. wa mou imasen. (The one who'd become his successor, Jr, is no more.)

I've double-checked with the Brazilian Portuguese translation because it tends to be as close to the original as possible, and surely enough, it's translated correctly:

(image courtesy of the volume I own by my so-so phone camera 😋)

"Junior, who was his heir, is no more."

The literal translation for what Lucia is saying is "isn't among us anymore", but that's an expression in Portuguese that means that someone has died/doesn't walk on Earth anymore.

While the mistranslated English version and the original Japanese/Brazilian version have similar meanings, the way it's worded gives the sentence a completely different meaning: in one we're led to believe Jr. isn't physically there at the Mansion, while the other two make it clear that Jr. has died.

And that's exactly why that, after Chapter 252 dropped, this scene is given a new perspective - because Lucia was referring to the former Bookman Jr, and not the current one.

We don't know the whereabouts of current Lavi - cue in the chair jokes, I unfortunately love them all - and while I might be wrong, I have my reasons to believe he's alive.

It just doesn't feel like Hoshino to kill an important character off-screen, plus she has said we'll see him again eventually and that the mystery of what's behind his eyepatch is still to be revealed (and will only happen once Bookman passes away, something that will possibly happen before the story reaches its end).

I have the feeling Lavi still has much to contribute to the story and he's actually one of the characters that, to me, seem to have the highest odds of making it alive until the end. It also isn't mere coincidence that Bookman picked the same alias for both Juniors, since Lavi has mentioned in a discussion room that the aliases refer to their record logs and the Holy War is being recorded under 'Lavi'. There's unfinished business to be taken care of.

Using the mistranslated version to illustrate was important because I've seen people wondering where Lavi is if not in the Mansion, while others were afraid he has died. He's very likely in a predicament, but dead? I don't think so.

So that only leaves us with one viable subject for that dialogue, that being the former Bookman Jr. (now affectionately dubbed Lavi Sr. by the fandom).

"But how come they didn't know Bookman already had a new apprentice back in Chapter 222 if the Zoogles mentioned it in Chapter 251?"

Yes, it's a little odd. What I can infer from this is that they either 1. Didn't know Bookman already had a new Jr. because he had been unconscious and only after they stabilized his situation they could talk, or 2. Did know about the current Lavi but believe him not to be ready to take on the mantle yet while Lavi Sr. was (but unfortunately deserted the clan).

Since only the Bookman and his appointed apprentice, who was born with the seal, can exchange information and records via their blood, it might be not that off the chart that the Zoogles weren't up-to-date on his affairs since they're not Bookmen themselves but rather a bloodline of people scattered across the globe who are supporters of Bookman's mission like Lucia has explained. Yet, even if they aren't all-knowing, it seems odd for them not to know something as vital as that about the person they're supporting.

And of course, there's also the possibility of option 3, something else that I completely failed to consider right now. Time will tell which one.

Note: By the way, the Lucia in 222 and the Lucia in 251/252 are indeed the same person; Hoshino seemed to hint there's a reason behind her sudden aging that we don't know yet. It's important to make this clear since what I've said is related to dialogues delivered by her.

2. Past!A = current Allen

(image courtesy of Kougeki Scans' Chapter 251's translation)

There were theories around and people still considering the possibility of our current Allen being a clone and all sorts of theories because of the unexplainable age gap between him and Past!A, but it seems the deaging theory has been fully confirmed by Chapter 252, as we saw it taking place before our very eyes.

There are still some mysteries surrounding it, but seeing how Apocryphos mentioned the "Helix", we can't help but be taken back to the explanation we've previously seen about the Helix of Life (The 221st Night - The Clown's Joke).

Since that's a topic that feels like there's more to it as of now, I won't be discussing the how and why Allen deaged, especially with the unseen variable in the mix that is Innocence; who knows if that might make the Helix energy behave differently.

I was on the "deaging theory" train because Nea was able to recognize Past!A all right when he looks in the mirror (The 214th Night: Searching for A.W. - Awakening) and also questioned the presence of Innocence on his body as well as how he hadn't aged but instead had gotten younger (The 215th Night: Searching for A.W. - By Your Side).

There are many mistranslations in the official English version of these two chapters (214 and 215) that have fueled countless misconceptions within the fandom but I won't be pointing those out in this post since I'm not here this time specifically to talk about it.

Note: Mangadex seems to have nicely translated versions of these chapters if you want to check them out for a recalling - I can't confirm fully but what I read of them looked consistent and faithful to the original.

Anyways, back on track; now that we've seen what took place 35 years ago in Chapter 252, Nea's bewilderment at the current situation of Allen back in Chapter 214/215 makes a lot more sense.

And even more interesting is that as soon as he noticed the Innocence lodged into Allen's left hand, we see the image of Apocryphos, as if Nea could feel its presence. Turned out that meant more than just Apocryphos being able to resonate with all Innocence, but rather, that the very reason why that Innocence had found home in Allen's body was by its intervention.

Just what the hell, dude. That was, once again, extremely well-played on Hoshino's part. I'm really looking forward to the next chapter!

[m-kyunie]

I steal a few breaths From the world for a minute And then I'll be nothing forever

Me and My Husband [Mitski]

[looniecartooni]

DGM Chapter 252 spoilers Past!Allen: I have a confession. Nea: What is it? Past!Allen?: My name isn't Allen. I don't actually have a true name because I am actually a Bookman. Nea: Wh-what? Past!Lavi: I've been going by the name "Lavi" during my current observations. Nea: Then... whose Allen? Past!Lavi: There is no Allen. It's just me. Nea: Well we have to find Allen then! He's supposed to be my host! Past! Lavi: N-no- I am still willing to be your host. I just thought that you should know that my name's not- Nea: *holding actual Past!Allen* I found Allen. Past!Lavi: Wha- who is this kid? Nea: It's Allen- I just told you. He's my new host. Past!Lavi: WHAT?! Real Past!Allen: I have no idea what's going on... Past!Lavi: Nea- you can't just kidnap a random child and make them the host! Hi... Allen. I am... so sorry about all this. Where're your folks? Past!Allen: I... don't... have any that I... know of. I was- well... Nea: He was fighting in a war and I found him dying in a lake. Past!Lavi: Oh my gosh... Nea: So- I asked him his name, offered to have him become my host, and saved him. Past!Lavi:... Nea- you made it worse! I'm so sorry, Allen. Allen: Eh- it's fine. I didn't really have anything to live for. Past!Lavi: *deep inhale* Okay. Allen- you can stay with us for a while. Nea and I will let you know what this whole host thing is about, and we are going to make sure that you are safe and sound and don't ever have to- wait Nea, where are you going?! Nea: I'm going to go find Mana! Take care of real Allen for me, would you, fake Allen? Past!Lavi: Um- Nea: Thank you- buh byyyyyyye.... *runs away and never returns* Past!Lavi:... I think I upset him. Past!Allen: He's kind of weird. Past!Lavi: Yeah... he's fun when you get to know him though. You hungry? Past!Allen: ...starving. Past!Lavi: Alright- let's go pick up some food then. Come along. Past!Allen: Okay... is... is he coming back? Past!Lavi:... probably- he's kind of like a cat. He might be back for food. Might bring another friend or two back too. Hopefully... Past!Allen:... hopefully.

[poppystheories]

An Eye Theory

There's been a lot of debate, over the years, about whether Mana ever loved "Allen".

In the flashback, we clearly see Mana is a compassionate man who wanted to help a kid in a bad situation; in his final moments as himself, he wanted to take Red away from the circus with him. He wanted them to leave together. But that was compassion, not love.

And then Apocryphos used Red's Innocence to shatter his mind. After that, it's very much a question of if Mana was even capable of loving "Allen", as mentally unstable as he was. From what we've seen, he was very affectionate, and though he got Allen the dog and Red the kid mixed up, he eventually went on to introduce "Allen" to the symbols. You don't try to teach a dog to read your secret code. He understood "Allen" was a person, but more than that, we don't really know.

But the soul the Earl excised out of himself and had Allen put into an Akuma did some stuff that doesn't line up with it being the soul of a completely clueless man.

If we go on the assumption that the Earl was trying to rid Mana of any inconvenient memories through this process, we can assume Akuma!Mana is a conglomerate of just more than "Mana Walker". My best guess is that when the Earl excised Akuma!Mana, the memories he was trying to get rid of included stuff that re-stabilized Mana Walker, including knowledge of what actually happened when he met Red. If we consider that as a possibility, a lot of other things become more explicable.

First: If he remembered their first meeting, Akuma!Mana could know that "Allen" was an accomodator with an already activated Innocence capable of combat, perfectly able to destroy a level 0. He also would know “Allen” was fated to be an exorcist, and the threat that Akuma therefore pose.

Second: Akuma!Mana could have gained access to some of the original Mana's knowledge, including stuff about the Earl, Akuma, and souls.

Akuma!Mana said the usual Akuma stuff, and did the usual Akuma stuff, which Akuma cannot seem to help. But Akuma!Mana also did more than that: the "I'll curse you!" wasn't just bluster. He actually did manage to "curse" Allen, which the Earl clearly didn't know about. The Earl must not have thought the Akuma even capable of it, so he certainly wasn't making the Akuma do that specifically.

Mana couldn't control all the instincts of the Akuma, but he could use them to his own advantage.

As evidence, we gotta go on a bit of a tangent:

In the second volume, Hoshino mentions a play that inspired Lala and Gozul. The play goes like this: Old servant falls in love with high-class young lady. She plays with his feelings and he dies. As a vengeful spirit, he decides to curse her. But in the end, he changes his mind, and decides that as a spirit, he'd rather protect her instead, so long as she promises to remember him.

I've seen people dismiss this play in the analysis of DGM before, because let's be real, the premise here is kinda creepy. And it doesn't seem to actually have much to do with Lala and Gozul besides the aesthetic of "old man" and "beautiful maiden".

But the concept of a vengeful spirit saying they'll curse someone they once loved, only to overcome their negative feelings and decide to protect that person instead is present in the story, in a pair of characters the deliberately parallel Lala and Gozul.

Or maybe even more than one pair of characters that parallel Lala and Gozul.

We'll be focusing on Mana and Allen for now though.

I pointed out before that Akuma!Mana didn't need prompting by the Earl to attack, unlike Claire. I think Mana was using the programming of the Akuma to his advantage; if he attacked, he could place the anchor (the star) he'll need on Allen's face without the Earl finding his actions suspicious, and Allen's Innocence would activate to protect Allen, destroying the Akuma shell and freeing his soul to latch on to that anchor.

This gave Allen the ability to see souls, probably because it was Mana's power originally, ensuring Allen would be protected in the future. Thanks to this ability, most of the risk of being ambushed as an exorcist is minimized, so Allen’s career as an exorcist would be relatively safer.

Mana was the "vengeful spirit" (aka Akuma) that decided to become a guardian spirit of someone he loved instead, just like in the play. Allen is "younger loved one" that, in exchange for that protection, must carry Mana's memory.

But it's not just Mana's memory Allen carries, but Nea's too. Nea's also a spirit haunting a loved one, but he hasn't decided whether he wants to destroy or protect yet.

Of course, there’s no guarantee any of this is true. I might be completely off base here. But it’s my current theory, and I’m gonna roll with it, because it does explain a lot of things.

And, most importantly, means Akuma!Mana did mean it when he said he loved “Allen”.