#please stop telling me adult women can be childish when I'm not talking about any generic person I'm talking about 2 specific characters

[danny-chase]

A lot of how we view teenage girls is based on misogynistic standards. There is a lot about adultification of teen girls and how we portray teen girls in media. A teen girl with no make-up actually looks very young. People constantly thought I was 14-16 even when I was in my early twenties. I know 20 and even 30 something women who like bunkbeds, stuffed animals, and act silly/goofy.

Look. I get it. I got pegged as an 8th-9th grader last weekend (I'm in my senior year of college). I sleep with a stuffed animal, and only stopped sharing bunk beds with my sibling a little bit ago. I am literally the type of person you are describing.

Cass does not act like she did in Batgirls.

Here's Batgirls:

Batgirls #1

Here's from the second issue of her solo

Batgirl (2000) #2

Here's Batgirls:

Batgirls #1

It pretty much makes no sense for them to be seeking her approval constantly. Here's Cass:

Batgirl (2000) #7

Cass goes on in this issue to run around Gotham not as Batgirl, but her own vigilante even Bruce told her no (and Barbara clearly implies she wants her to stay home). Cass semi-cares about Bab's approval, but her sense of duty is stronger. (She wouldn't go to Barbara first, she'd jump out the window and likely wouldn't worry about Babs being upset when she got back).

Steph's also not the type to ask permission:

Batgirl (2009) #2

She didn't go to Barbara for permission being Batgirl, Barbara showed up at her house unannounced to talk her out of it, and Steph pretty much just completely ignores her. Neither of them would be constantly seeking approval for their actions from her.

I'm not exaggerating much when I say their expressions hardly change throughout the entire issue. It's like they took one look at Cass, and assigned her entire personality as "goth" because her costume is all black.

Here's her after showering in Batgirls:

Batgirls #1

And here's her taking a bath in her solo:

Batgirl (2000) #65

In both scenes she's portrayed childishly, the difference is in her solo she's enjoying it, whereas in Batgirls she's just -_- the entire time. Which is starkly different from her solo run in which she is incredibly expressive.

Meanwhile Steph has a smile plastered on her face the entire issue. Can she be goofy in her solo? Absolutely! She is!

Batgirl (2009) #3

Is that her only personality trait? No. Not by a long shot. For comparison, here's Steph being goofy in her solo, without her face being stuck in one setting:

Batgirl (2009) #1

And of course Steph has more serious issues going on too. She's coming back from dying, no one treats her seriously (especially Tim, who tried firing her from spoiler, which she didn't listen). Her father is a pest, she's not an only happy-go-lucky character (aka smiling is not her only personality trait). She's optimistic yes, but that's not all she is.

There are ways to show "childish" behaviors without losing the depth of these characters. Batgirls gave Steph and Cass 1 personality trait each and had them act childishly the entire time and mind you, I would not care at all if it wasn't Cass and Steph - if there names were Laura and Mary or smth I'd be like this is fun. I would reccomend reading Batgirl (2000) #1 and Batgirl (2009) #1 as comparison to see just how flat Batgirls #1 portrayal of these two characters is (and Birds of Prey #1 for Barbara, although she wasn't who this post is about). It legitimately takes reading 1 comic to show the difference, you don't need to take my word on this, and I encourage you to read each issue and judge for yourself whether or not Batgirls did Cass and Steph justice.

[locoluis]

Pam's visit to the doctor

DISCLAIMER: This is a fictional story. I have no medical knowledge, so the following is all artistic licence and stuff taken from the web. Please consult a proper medical professional if you experience any of the symptoms described below. Oh, and sorry for the sloppy writing.

It has been from bad to worse during the last weeks. I don't like summer, I get way too sweaty and dehydrated. I get sunburned easily. I am self conscious about my body and will need to wear less than the normal amount of clothing I usually enjoy wearing, which attracts the stares of people who look like they haven't seen a girl with more than a B cup in their entire lives.

Like they never get out of this town.

I like going to the city, even though the climate is warmer there than up here in the hills, because nobody bats an eye about my appearance there, or at least not that much. The city centre is a couple hours away by bus. Only a few, elderly people are joining me in this trip I absolutely need to carry out.

The local paediatricians are as useless as the painkillers they prescribe. One of them said: “ At this point, you should consider going to an adult's doctor. ” Madam, I'm only twelve, and you're supposed to be able to take care of people through their late teens. Don't come at me with such rubbish.

Then my PE teacher recommended me this children's hospital in the city, and I got an appointment. I got so stressed during the bus trip that the box of chocolates that I brought with me didn't last long enough. I hope this isn't as bad as it feels.

Even though this is the second time I've seen this particular lady, I immediately recognised her. Shorter than me, dangerously skinny, with a childish face despite being in her mid-thirties, and a brunette ponytail of ridiculous length.

— Pamela Evans. I remember you.

— Dr. Eliana Martínez. You were the lady who awarded me the gold medal at the swimming competition a few months ago.

— Indeed. That was… a random, unusual philanthropic gesture from me. I must confess that your victory caught me by surprise, as you looked like you didn't even want to participate.

— Well, Mum taught me to swim at an early age, and she really wanted me to participate. But I hate PE with a passion, and it was really embarrassing for me to be in a swimsuit with all those people around. You can guess why.

— Yeah, I can relate, having been pregnant once. Never again.

I couldn't quite hide my amazement. How does such a twiggy lady manage to have a child growing inside such a tiny belly?

— Indeed, I have a daughter. Her name is Violeta, and she will soon be bigger than me. I carried my baby through full term, with no complications, shattering all expectations. I guess I'm a woman after all, ha ha ha. But enough about me; please tell me what brings you here.

I took a long breath.

— Doctor, during the last few weeks it's been difficult for me to concentrate in class, to get asleep, to get enough rest. I sweat way too much. I feel a lot of anxiety, even to the point of paranoia. Sometimes I feel my heart beating too hard and too fast. Sometimes I feel a burning sensation in my chest. And I've been putting on quite some weight, though I'm not sure how much of that is just going through puberty.

— Well, body changes are normal through puberty, and girls grow and develop at different rates.

— I'm aware of that. All my classmates still look like children. I'm the only one with the shape of a grown-up woman at twelve.

— About that. When I was twelve, it was the exact opposite. The other girls were all grown up, while I still look like a ten years old.

— Well, you sure are tiny, even compared to my classmates.

— Yeah, yeah. Now that I think about it, you look a lot like one of mine. Blue eyes, a different hairstyle and nose shape, a slimmer waist, but otherwise she was a dead ringer for you.

— Even her breast size?

— Indeed. She was curvy and gorgeous, and all the boys were crazy for her, but she only had eyes for one boy… who just wasn't ready for a relationship. And it made me cringe that she didn't seem to feel pretty enough, that she wore more make-up than was necessary, plus her dangerously short, tight-fit school pinafore dress… she looked ridiculous.

— Oh, I have some classmates who are like that. Not me, though; I already get way too much attention without doing anything with my looks.

— Well, you seem more like the forbidden snack type, which ironically is more attractive for some men than the overly sexy type.

— … Ach-y-fi.

— … Excuse me? I'm not a native English speaker, and that's a word I haven't heard before.

— Oh, that's a local expression of disgust. Like, it seems like I can't avoid the male gaze.

— That's their problem, Miss Evans, not yours. Don't make it your problem. I've got nothing here, yet men still stare.

— Well, your body type is even more unusual…

— I know. But you have to excuse me, this is getting way off-topic. I don't usually talk to my patients about my own childhood, and I'm talking to you like we knew each other from long ago.

— Well, I don't mind. Yours seems to have been an interesting childhood.

— Indeed, but that's not why you're here. So let me get through this. Most of the issues that you describe are not necessarily associated with puberty, and no sign of pain or discomfort is worth getting glossed over. First of all, please stand on the scale to get your height and weight measured.

I do. To no surprise, I'm overweight. She also checked my heart rate and blood pressure.

— Now, tell me. Tea, coffee, carbonated drinks. How much do you drink each day?

— Not much, actually. I drink a couple cups of tea each day. Unlike the rest of my family, who just can't get enough of it. And they drink green tea, which tastes horrible to me.

— Hmm. What about chocolate?

She stopped talking when she noticed the sheer expression of horror in my face.

— What? Did I hit a nerve, Miss Evans? Please tell me how much do you eat everyday. Answer truthfully.

I started crying uncontrollably. She patiently bears with me through this.

— … Doctor. I have a lot of admirers. Every day I get several boxes of chocolate in the mail. And I can't control myself.

— Well, chocolates have a high calorie count due to their sugar and fat content. And the symptoms you've been experiences are consistent with an excessive chocolate intake.

— And now you're telling me that I have to eat less chocolates. As if my life wasn't horrible enough.

— Well, at least you don't have acne… yet.

— ACNE!? Oh my God! I need to stop eating chocolates right now!

— Well, acne is more of an issue with eating lots of carbohydrates and dairy products, and there's no consensus about the link between acne and chocolate consumption. But I still advise you to reduce the amount of chocolate you eat everyday.

— I understand.

— To prevent acne, you should eat more fruits, vegetables and fish. Drinking green tea is also good against acne, and it has many more health benefits. It contains caffeine, so it too must be consumed in moderation.

— Green tea. As I said, I don't like it.

— Add lemon juice and stevia to it. There are many types of green tea, you just have to find which one is better tasting for you. And brewing it correctly is quite important in order to get it just right, not too bitter or watery.

— Well, thank you.

— I'll prescribe you some medication in order to treat the symptoms you've mentioned. But you should follow my instructions in order to attack their root cause. Stop eating so many chocolates, and come back in a month or so, in order to check your progress. I most likely won't be around, as I travel a lot and I'm currently on a temporary contract, but Dr. Spencer is an experienced paediatrician who will be able to take your case.

— I'll do. Oh, and I have a last question. Do you think I should get a breast reduction? And how do I get it on the NHS?

— Well, first of all, I don't think it's advisable to get one while you're still developing, except in extreme cases of breast hypertrophy. Second, you should get down to a stable weight, and get an assessment with a psychiatrist or psychologist. Third, as there are many women seeking to get breast reduction surgery on the NHS, the waiting list can be up to several years, and a lot of women are being turned down as not meeting their criteria. Also, private treatment is quite expensive. And… would you like me to measure you?

— Yeah, sure.

Her procedure for measuring my breast size is a bit more complicated than what I knew. She then puts the measurements on a spreadsheet, which gets her a bunch of numbers.

— Wearing a good-fitting bra can alleviate many of the issues associated with large breasts. Also, I'm recommending you some exercises that can strengthen your core muscles, and some tips to improve your posture. But I wouldn't advise a breast reduction surgery on someone like you, as its risks and consequences certainly outweigh the possible benefits. They're not that big, actually; you just have a delicate body frame. Your ideal weight is lower than that of other girls of your age and height.

— I understand.

I need to make a lot of sacrifices in order to stop feeling like this. Mum is going to stare me down and tell me: “ I told you, Pam ”. And then I'm asking her what we should do with so all those chocolates.