#teerf

[velvetvexations]

TERFs hate people they perceive as men and frequently turn their aggression to trans men as well, please see this link where I compiled examples to teach people who haven't ever exposed themselves to anything TERFs actually say.

That is not to say transmisogyny in a wider context is anti-perceived masculinity, but it is in the unique case of TERFs specifically. That's the only group it works like that for.

If you have any further questions, I'll be happy to answer them. I suggest following me for more based takes and educational resources.

we need to refer to terfs as transmisogynists again bc everyone is forgetting what that word actually means. plus half of them aren't even 'feminists'. jkr HAAAATES women.

[velvetvexations]

Something I would add about Michfest : In the 90s, there was a scandal involving a trans man there (Tony Baretto-Neto). He had phallo and simply took a shower there, but then the staff confronted him because people started saying there were multiple "men" / "transsexuals" / male invaders walking around exposing their erect penises in front of women, and blamed him.

It caused a lot of controversy and he literally ended up having to make a public written statement about it to debunk these claims, saying he was just 1 guy taking a shower (he even said that due to the nature of his penis, the thing about him harassing women with his erection was literally not physically possible, people were just making shit up to paint him as predatory). He explained what really happened : he had told the women around that he was gonna shower and explained his situation, they all said they were fine with it, some shower malfunction happened and some women who helped him with it therefore saw him naked. (He also said that he went to the festival as a trans man because he'd been a lesbian activist since the 60s and had fought in these spaces for decades, even having played in a band in similar festivals in the past).

He had explained all that to the staff and, despite them fully knowing he was AFAB, they didn't care. They didn't want it to be a place ~ for AFABs ~, they wanted a place without any people AMAB or penises, and decided their policy also included people AFAB with penises after this "incident". (Also this story has been largely misrepresented and said to be about a trans woman's penis in the showers, but yeah, the real story behind this was actually about a trans man.)

It's not even a rare occurrence, it's actually pretty common for things "for AFABs" or "AFAB-only" to reject/ban trans men who are deemed "too much like cis men" (or mysteriously find a reason that makes them "not a good fit"). I guarantee you that most shit like "AFAB-only housing" or whatever would also reject trans men with penises. Pretty much every space or thing "for AFABs" will have some secret threshold for trans men, where if you have certain features you will be seen as "too much like a cis man" and not allowed to join because it "makes the others uncomfortable". They won't dare to admit it out loud if they market themselves as open to trans people AFAB, and the exact criteria varies from group to group (it can be as little as "vibes" and not even medical transition related). But "having a penis" will pretty much unanimously be seen as crossing that line and get you rejected.

It's just really frustrating to see some people take them at their word when some group says "we are open to anyone AFAB" and then react like "see ? TME privilege once again, they only exclude trans women !!!!" and act like all trans people AFAB are included in that when there's always, and I cannot state this enough, *ALWAYS* a cutoff point for transmascs in these things, over which they're seen as predatory, invading, untrustworthy, violent, dangerous, and are excluded (and its not necessarily for being mistaken for transfem, it's very deliberate) no matter how "welcome for being AFAB" they are on paper. The entire spectrum of transmasculinity is never welcome in these spaces. It's always a lie.

TRFs love taking other radfems at their word except when those radfems say they really do see trans women as men, then it's all "why do you believe TERFs?" and shit.

Thank you for writing this up. <3

[velvetvexations]

it's amazing how some TERFs will just admit that their primary grievance is being sex pests entitled to pussy and they don't like there being less people to have drunk hookups with.

[velvetvexations]

It's an interesting outgrowth of the TERF refusal to envision a better world. Obviously, a lot of it is trauma-induced paranoia, but that makes it so that the movement is entirely geared towards mitigation.

The idea that some people AMAB are women should logically be a great win for feminism, something that proves it's points, but TERFs have decided 'men' are the enemy and 'women' are the victims as decided by whatever a doctor happens to say about your physical traits at birth And since they can't define themselves as anything other than victims, the best they can possibly do is make misogyny less of a problem.

Trans people are corrosive to gender lines. We break down walls. But walls are all TERFs have, all they've ever planned for. There's a subtle difference between wanting to eliminate misogyny and wanting exclusively to be safe from misogyny. It's like giving up fighting a war and simply hiding in an underground bunker for the rest of your life.

So we have a lot of not only trans women being feminists, achieving feminist goals, operating in the space of being a woman and experiencing misogyny as allies to cis women, but also trans men showing a clear and positive vision of what a truly glorious and joyful version of masculinity looks like, setting wonderful examples for even cis boys.

But all of that is about, like...solving the problem. And TERFs don't actually care about doing that.

its been said a thousand times before but the fundamental premise that men need to feminize themselves in order to get away with abusing women is quite possibly the most laughably ignorant idea ever ascribed to feminism. as though society wasn't built around manhood being the role that gives you access to the bodies of women.

[genderkoolaid]

weird question but how do you pronounce TIRF so as to distinguish it audibly from TERF? i always pronounce terf like "turf", and my brain wants to pronounce tirf the exact same way, but thats so confusing when trying to talk about tirfs out loud. is it like "teerf"?

I've never actually had reason to say it out loud, so good question!

I think "teerf" is probably the best pronunciation we could aim for, to try to distinguish the two. Though it'll probably require explaining since TIRF isn't nearly as well-known a term as TERF is.

[shanastoryteller]

out of context bits from tonight's group chat conversation:

"The HOA is the spiritual antithesis to pegging your boyfriend"

"*a la Dinkleberg* Teerfs..... 😒"

"i like saying wlw for it to stand for random things like women loving wanimal crossing"

"It's not for deep throating it IS for sipping like a precariously full martini glass"

[fandomohana]

Had a dream I was in a teerf war with the raccoon that hangs out in the garage. 😳

[velvetvexations]

that reminds me that I saw some TERFs reblog something from a misgendering/detrans kink blog and I nearly laughed myself to pieces

like listen yall if you see transphobia where some words are colored blue and some are colored pink that's not transphobia that's trans people getting off in ways you can't comprehend

[velvetvexations]

Velvet, I dont think lesbians are sitting there obsessing over trans MEN saying attracted to them. It really feels like a massive disservice to lesbians to assume they want trans men to stay women so they can keep crushes on them. It makes lesbians as a whole sound horrendous and is really disheartening to see from you.

lol have you heard TERFs talk about trans men literally ever? half the time they're just openly pissed "women" becoming less fuckable without even attempting to disguise the fact that they're simply raging femcels.

"makes lesbians as a whole sound horrendous" yeah they should feel horrendous when they act like this, it's a horrendous thing to do, so hopefully I'm hitting the mark here. Lesbians of all kinds need to be Normal about others and take care of the shit in their community, and a big part of that is entitlement to bodies they consider female because they refuse to accept that some people simply prefer being men to whatever fantasy the lesbian in question has in mind.

It's mostly cis women, if that makes it any better? But trans women, as I repeat often, are women, and not immune to transandrophobic biases like this. Trans men aren't even immune to transandrophobic biases. It's not some super secret evil invented by lesbians in a lab to take over the world, feeling negatively about something you find appealing going away and being replaced by something you personally liked more is an intuitive, human emotion.

And when you say it's ridiculous to propose lesbians obsessing over if men are attracted to them, like, come on anon. They don't think trans men are men. The very subject we're speaking of right now is the way that TERFs feel existentially threatened every time they "lose one" to the transmasculine curse and do everything in their power to help drag trans men back over to The Good Gender.

[velvetvexations]

I like the transbian seperatists because their stance on trans women and trans women alone being safe for each other is creepy and cultish but it's at least less cringe than thinking cis women don't despise us and are in fact eager to welcome us into the fold as soon as we prove we hate men as much as they do.

Which is especially funny, since, like, very many more cis women hate us than they hate cis men, and most of the ones that hate cis men hate us so much it's completely derailed their man-hating and consumed their movement to the point that every few days another of 'em expresses bewilderment at the fact that everyone around her would now elect a guy who wants to make The Handmaid's Tale real as long as he kicks one ten year old in a state of millions off her volleyball team.

[velvetvexations]

im obsessed w that person saying "terfism isnt based on man hating" because that is literally literally the basis, terfs own definition of it. thats why its called what its called! terfs THINK what theyre doing is excluding predatory MEN! am i going crazy? is that not what a terfs self defined goal is?

That's not gender validating though, so we have to pretend they see our true soul-sex and use trans women's assignment as an excuse to treat us the way they would treat other cis women if it were 'allowed.'

Don't ask why they supposedly see trans women as women but trans men as poor defenseless AFABs who need to be protected and nurtured. The mysteries of that contradiction are the last wall between TRFs and unironically saying that trans men aren't oppressed at all.

[velvetvexations]

You're assuming this is entirely about the "negatives" of womanhood. The point here is that a cis woman can not even be down with any of the positives or feel in community with other women. Sometimes a person AFAB is going to be more at home around men, with men's perspectives, and with the general idea of masculinity. This is a neutral act that says neutral things about either manhood or womanhood.

Of course, there are all kinds of valid reasons for transitioning, including that it may alleviate some of the stress and trauma of growing up with misogyny. It's also perfectly valid if it's a fetish thing, for the record, but let's not get ahead of ourselves here. The point is that 'consignment' to womanhood is not merely about consignment to being treated badly, but the enforcement of identity. "Transness" is about deciding who you are for yourself when it goes against who you've been told you are. This would be the case even if cis women were 100% equal to men with zero disadvantages or unique problems in society.

Saw a cis (I think) woman talking about how cis women need trans women because if trans women don’t exist then being a woman isn’t a choice and is instead just something you’re consigned to for life.

I’ve been thinking about it all day because I agree but I feel like there’s more to it than that.

Idk. Gotta think more.

[velvetvexations]

gonna start telling every cis radfem that actually they're not biologically female nor are their chromosomes female. they're actually biologically transmasculine & so are their chromosomes.

forcemascing will proceed until all lesbian bars are shut down from lack of customers

then we'll have won

[velvetvexations]

Seeing the whole "let's just mock vaginas to trigger the TMEs" thing being painted as feminist is making me lose it because not only everything everyone has already said, but also are they aware that society is so vagina-phobic that if you show someone with a penis getting off you can squeeze by with a PG-13 rating, but if you show someone with a vagina getting off it's immediately a hard R. This used to be feminism 101, people talked about how it's ridiculous that vaginas are considered obscene in a way penises are not quite often and there was something of a push to change it, but eventually I guess everyone turned into anti-sex puritans and we stopped caring that showcasing a specific type of sexual expirience is punished so harshly you basically can't depict it at all(unless it's something like Deadpool or 50 Shades where an R is expected most movie studios will fight tooth and nail to get a movie to be PG-13 up to and including removing any depiction of people with vaginas experiencing sexual pleasure) so yeah saying "let's all start acting like vaginas are disgusting as a gotcha" shows that the people speaking are completely ignorant of feminist history and the issues we have always been fighting to address.

I've also literally seen TERFs use the demonization of vaginas to justify being that way about penises. It's a radfem loop lol.

[velvetvexations]

TERF dumbass I need to reblog this from you to let you know that I'm a trans woman and OP is my friend, and the response you've stirred him to make is genuinely so hot. Like, thank you for giving him something to let loose on, his justified anger is incredibly sexy, and without you having prompted him to tear into your dumb and bad response the joy in my life would have been lessened. I appreciate that. You've done me a good turn here by being stupid in his presence.

I saw a post earlier, I will not be appending my response to that post to the post itself, but I did want to touch upon it.

The post was about how trans men and transmasculine people afab don't have any media tropes that are, we'll say, problematic for them, the way that the 'funny man in a dress' trope is trans-misogynistic, I wanted to discuss that and lay that claim to rest.

Below I will be discussing some tropes in media that affect trans masculine people afab. Some may be worse than others, some accidental, some maybe on purpose, but I've compiled them because I think it's important to understand that just how the harmful tropes aimed at masculine people afab do exist, they just differ in their execution.

DISCLAIMER: If I have worded anything poorly in this post please tolerate it, English is my fourth language and it can be overwhelming to attempt linguistic perfection or the performance of it for native English Speaker.

EDIT: tumblr really messed my layout and formatting up, sorry for that but I'm not fixing it unless I really need to.

1. “Tomboy Gets a Makeover” = Suddenly She’s Worth Something (AKA: Now She’s Fuckable)

This one’s everywhere. You’ve got a character who’s rough around the edges, usually wears hoodies, maybe doesn’t shave, maybe doesn’t even care what people think. And the story punishes her for that. Until someone (usually a fairy godmother or mean girl turned ally) shoves her into a dress, puts some gloss on her lips, straightens her hair...

and then she’s finally seen as beautiful, desirable, and valid.

The core message? Your masculinity is temporary, and your value doesn’t actually exist until you conform to traditional femininity. You weren’t lovable, datable, or even visible until you softened up and got pretty.

This trope tells young people AFAB:

You're not enough unless you perform femininity

Your gender nonconformity is a flaw to fix

If you're not seen as sexy in the "right" way, you're invisible

And this sticks. Especially for transmascs, who grew up seeing their natural instincts or styles treated like a before picture.

Examples:

The Princess Diaries – Mia goes from “invisible frizzy nerd” to prom-queen level once her hair is flat and her legs are waxed.

A Cinderella Story – Sam’s baggy clothes are treated like a shield for her insecurity, until she shows up in a dress and suddenly earns male attention.

The Breakfast Club – Allison is artsy and weird and quietly masc... until she’s quite literally pink-washed and given a makeover so she can be datable.

She's All That – Laney is cool and self-possessed in her own way, but the movie waits until she’s in a red dress and contacts to take her seriously.

Meteor Garden – Shan Cai’s toughness is tolerable, but she’s still only framed as truly “lovable” after being softened through male attention.

✦•······················•✦•······················•✦

2. “She Pretended to Be a Boy” = She’s a Lying Snake Whore

When characters AFAB dress or live as boys, it’s almost always framed as deception. Not survival. Not autonomy. Not self-expression. Just trickery. There’s a dramatic “reveal” scene where everyone suddenly feels betrayed, like the character has been scheming the whole time instead of just…

living. Sound familiar?

This isn’t just about fiction. It directly echoes how transmasc people are treated in reality, as liars, as fake men, as threats to those around them just by existing. The idea that someone AFAB could be masculine, or just a guy, is treated like a trap set for unsuspecting cis people.

The underlying message:

You can’t be trusted if you present as masculine

Your gender is a mask, a trick, a crime

If people liked you before, they were duped

it’s the same logic used to justify violence and exclusion towards Transmasculine people AFAB in reality.

Examples:

She’s the Man – Viola pretends to be her brother to play soccer, but it’s all “uh-oh she has boobs” humor. Her gender presentation is the punchline.

The King’s Affection – She lives as the crown prince and does a damn good job, but the tension constantly hinges on whether she’s tricking people by being there at all. Masculinity is okay only if it’s secret and painful.

Coffee Prince – Go Eun-chan presents as male to get a job, and instead of critiquing the system that forces her to do it, the narrative focuses on her guilt and “the reveal.” Masculinity is tolerated, but never fully respected.

Victor/Victoria – Gender is treated as a clever disguise. The moment someone finds out “the truth,” it’s all shock, betrayal, and drama. Queerness framed as a con.

✦•······················•✦•······················•✦

3. “It’s Just a Phase” = You’ll Be a Real Girl™️ Eventually

You can be a tomboy for now. Run around, get messy, be loud. It’s even kind of cute! As a little kid who needs to grow up. Then suddenly, your masculinity isn’t just childish! it’s a problem. Something to “grow out of.” Something to fix!

This trope trains audiences to see AFAB masculinity as:

Immature

A quirk of childhood

A stepping stone to real femininity

And what does “real girlhood” mean in this context? Dresses. Lip gloss. Boys. The implication is that your value kicks in when you start performing the kind of femininity that makes you palatable and desirable. You were allowed to be wild for a minute, but only if you clean up nice later.

It reinforces the same tired message: Girlhood = destination, not a choice. Masculinity is just the wrong stop on the way. If you are Transmasculine AFAB, you are a child who should grow up, immature, being treated as much younger than they are is a huge issue with transmasculine people AFAB.

I would like to add that this is also a misogynistic trope, but misogyny intersects with transandrophobia in ways that are valid to talk about.

Examples:

The Parent Trap – Annie and Hallie are opposites, but Hallie (tomboy-coded) only really “settles down” and softens once she’s back with her mom. Her rougher edge is charming but temporary.

Now and Then – Roberta is the tomboy of the group, and her Big Moment of Growth™ comes when she puts on a dress. Not solving childhood trauma. Not emotional healing. The dress.

Boys Over Flowers – Jan-di is scrappy, resilient, athletic! and then she falls for the male lead and gradually loses every bit of that fire. By the end, she’s quiet, deferential, and soft. like that’s her natural arc.

Hi My Sweetheart– Rainie Yang’s character starts out masc-presenting and bold. She’s mocked, corrected, and eventually “fixed” into a soft, pink, cutesy girl. Her makeover isn’t for her. it’s the narrative giving her permission to be “dateable.”

✦•······················•✦•······················•✦

5. “One of the Boys” But Never Really One of the Boys

She’s tough. She’s cool. She fights. She hangs with the guys. She might even burp. But make no mistake! she’s never actually allowed to be one. This trope gives characters AFAB just enough masculinity to seem "interesting," then punishes them if they go too far with it.

Again, this is also a misogynistic trope, but the intersectionality here is important even in the ones that don't seem obvious, some people will poke fun at me putting Natasha here for example, but if you do that you're misunderstanding my intent and I do not care for it.

I am not saying ANY of these characters are coded transmasculine, I am discussing how masculinity is treated in regards to characters AFAB.

The message is clear: You can borrow masculinity, but don’t get comfortable in it.

These characters:

Get constant reminders that they're different

Are sexualized, softened, or sidelined the moment they get too close to “boyish”

Exist to complement the boys, not compete with them

Examples:

Avengers – Natasha Romanoff is deadly, competent, cool under pressure, but also constantly shoved into the “team mom” or “sexy redhead with feelings” role. Her backstory centers around forced sterilization, and her arc in Age of Ultron literally says she’s a “monster” for not being able to have kids. Tell me again how she’s treated like “one of the guys.”

How to Train Your Dragon – Astrid starts out as the alpha fighter, but as soon as Hiccup grows up, she becomes a background girlfriend with no arc of her own. Her sharp edge gets smoothed into supportiveness.

My Hero Academia – Nearly every tough AFAB character gets undercut. Mirko is badass but exists on the fringes. Jirou gets development, but only as support. Bakugo’s mom is comic relief. Meanwhile, male characters are allowed complex, messy, powerful arcs without ever needing to "soften" for the audience.

✦•······················•✦•······················•✦

“AFAB Character Learns to Embrace Womanhood” = Moral Victory!

You start with a tough, scrappy, masculine-coded person AFAB, maybe she fights, maybe she’s emotionally shut down, maybe she just doesn’t want to be like other girls. It doesn't matter, this is how it ends:

She softens. She submits. She “grows” by becoming a wife, a mom, a love interest, a Real Girl™️.

This isn’t healing. It’s containment. The message is: your rebellion was cute, but it’s time to settle down and accept the role assigned to you.

“Growth” = compliance. “Strength” = giving it up. “Maturity” = pink, dresses, and a baby carriage.

Examples:

The Hunger Games – Katniss Everdeen is trauma-coded, masc-leaning, and uncomfortable with romance or traditional femininity. So what’s her ending? A baby epilogue where she’s in a dress, quietly settled into nuclear family life. Is she happy about it? No, but there's no denying that this is her ending.

Mulan II– In the original, she challenges gender roles and becomes a literal war hero. In the sequel? The plot revolves around her needing to prove she can still be soft, feminine, and wife-material. Her masculinity is not allowed to just exist.

Jojo Rabbit – Rosie (the mother) is framed as the ideal woman: warm, loving, feminine. Meanwhile, Elsa (a girl in hiding) starts out guarded and hard-edged, but only becomes “redeemed” once she softens and embraces traditional femininity.

A Silent Voice / Koe no Katachi – The narrative constantly punishes her for not being “nice enough,” and her arc only begins to shift once she becomes more demure and apologetic. She cannot be both a good person and brash or hotheaded, submit or be branded evil.

Inuyasha – Sango is introduced as a demon-slaying warrior. But her story ends in the most vanilla way possible: marriage, motherhood, and sidelining. She loses her edge completely. I hate the end of Inuyasha so much it is borderline a meme in my circles.

Fruits Basket - Uotani is tall, tomboyish, and used to be in a girl gang. She has strength, history, and depth. And then her “big growth moment”? Realizing she wants to be softer and more ladylike, because femininity is treated as the finish line within the story.

✦•······················•✦•······················•✦

“Masculine Presentation” = Joke Costume or Moral Failure

When characters AFAB wear suits, cut their hair short, or pass as masc in any way, media rarely lets it land without a laugh track, or a moral consequence.

Masculine presentation is treated as:

A silly costume

A failed experiment

A sign of monstrosity

Or something to be shamed out of.

The story makes sure you feel embarrassed for them. It invites the audience to laugh, cringe, or judge, because “girl in boy clothes” is still a punchline in mainstream media. Just like 'Boy in girl clothes' is.

And yes, this hurts trans women, but it also absolutely targets butch, GNC, and transmasc folks. Masculinity is marked as wrong on AFAB bodies, funny if temporary, disgusting if permanent.

Examples:

Scooby-Doo – Velma’s masc coding (short hair, flat clothes, practical shoes) constantly becomes the joke. If she dresses even more masc? She’s “mistaken” for a man and ridiculed. Her queerness and presentation are treated like a quirk at best, a problem at worst.

The Suite Life of Zack and Cody – London Tipton wears a single masc outfit and the laugh track explodes. The outfit itself isn’t weird, but the show acts like the sight of her in anything non-feminine is a cosmic-level joke.

Friends – Rachel and Monica wear tuxedos in one episode, and the joke is entirely that it looks “wrong.” Chandler mocks them, the camera lingers on how “awkward” they look.

iCarly – Sam dresses masc semi-regularly, and is constantly mocked for acting “like a guy.” In interviews, actress Jennette McCurdy has said this ongoing joke contributed directly to her eating disorder relapse. This is not harmless.

Matilda - Miss Trunchbull is heavily masc-coded: big build, short hair, no makeup, harsh voice. She’s a literal villain, and her appearance is meant to be scary. Her masculinity is associated directly with her monstrosity.

Aikatsu! – Girls in suits are used as performance shock value. “Omg, a girl in a tuxedo??” is the whole joke.

✦•······················•✦•······················•✦

IN CLOSING.

These tropes don’t exist in a vacuum.

they shape how people see us, and how we see ourselves.

When characters AFAB exploring masculinity are only ever jokes, villains, phases, or tragedies, it sends a message: You don’t get to be this. You’re only allowed to visit. And when you're done, you better come back “correct.”

But we’re not punchlines. We’re not broken girls. Some of us are boys.

Some of us are neither.

Some of us are just butch as hell and happy about it.

We deserve stories where we aren’t corrected. Where masculinity on AFAB people isn’t a phase, a disguise, or a joke. But our lives, and the truth of them.

[velvetvexations]

My success rate with helping TERFs out of TERFism is relatively high in comparison to the Not One Single Person I've been able to convince to not horribly lie about what other trans people believe, and what's really depressing, actually legitimately depressing, is that the dismissal of my pleas are so predictable no matter how polite, patient, and exhaustively detailed they are.