#the mutual flaws of the characters and it's kind of telling that right now casca literally is incapable of looking at guts lol

[bthump]

It’s clear that Guts irrevocably loves Casca, and holds a deep intrinsic trust for her. This has been the case since their first meeting. During golden age Guts was Casca’s one ticket out of a life of pining and living for a man and dream who had never given her a second thought. With Guts she had experienced camaraderie and understanding, and each were mutually fascinated by the other, their loyalty and motivations and their ways of thinking because in each other were they only able to find someone who would stare back. Mutual recognition forged their relationship and so they loved each other. Ignoring that they loved each other, perhaps even love each other now makes Guts’ character development post-eclipse entirely void. There is no humanity in Guts without Casca. I don’t think arguing about this from a 30 year old manga is what Miura would want for his masterpiece like don’t y’all ever get tired of squinting your eyes and deliberately ignoring parts of your favorite story just to push an agenda?

I debated just ignoring this like I usually do lol but I already had a functional answer written up in response to someone else's ask, so I figured what the hell, I'll post it first and link you to it.

voila

So like, speaking of ignoring parts of your favourite story just to push an agenda, it's convenient that you've forgotten all those incredibly unromantic, often downright cold and cruel moments that aren’t very compatible with irrevocable love.

But also since I'm answering this anyway I might as well add: Not only are their feelings for each other never described in terms of love throughout the entire manga (despite some incorrect scanlations you may have seen), but Guts' feelings for Casca are being deliberately portrayed as ambiguous. There's a reason we cut away after Roderick asks who Casca is to Guts, and it's because we don't know. We're not meant to know, yet. Guts’ relationship with Casca is far from loving, and I would argue his feelings are much more complex and darker than love.

And I don’t think Guts has to be/have been in love with Casca for his character development to make sense lol. That development started with Puck, post-Eclipse, and it started with Griffith in the Golden Age. It has continued with a whole entourage of characters, and since he let himself get possessed and nearly killed Casca, then nearly assaulted her sans possession afterwards, before letting them join him, I think they’re just as if not more important to his character development. Protecting Casca is one facet of what drives his character right now, and he doesn’t have to be in love with her to want to do that - frankly I fully believe she could be replaced with any of the Hawks and he’d be doing the exact same thing right now (aside from the assault) because first and foremost, as detailed to us in chapter 130, described by Guts in chapter 94, and often shown in how he thinks of her in her commander role, she represents the Hawks to him.

Oh and lastly as a sidenote, I assume you’re calling Guts not freaking out when he woke up with her in chapter 13 “deep intrinsic trust,” but that was textually because she’s a woman rather than a man, not because of some magic spiritual connection he has with her specifically. It’s actually pretty homoerotically suggestive, especially considering he’s also cool with Griffith’s touch in the very next chapter.

And then there’s what Miura has to say on the subject in interviews, such as:

“The point I had to pay attention to was making sure the flow of the story wasn't completely severed with the Eclipse. That's why I spared Casca. If she had died and the serialization had continued for a long time, I feared the reason for revenge would become something of the past; and if Guts were to establish new relationships, then his incentive would waver. It may seem calculating and unpleasant, but it's because Casca's by his side that he can never forget the Eclipse.”

“I actually hadn't planned for Guts and Casca to get together, you know – it just occurred to me partway through that it'd be more dramatic that way.”

Neither of which suggests to me that he ever intended to write a straightforward romance. Casca is there for added drama and she’s there so Guts can’t forget the eclipse (underlining the Beast of Darkness’ suggestion that she’s precious because she’s the wound Griffith left, incidentally).

I've never said Guts doesn't have positive feelings for her, but so far their relationship hasn’t been an epic, or even a realistic and sweet, romance, and it doesn’t have to be for Guts’ character to make perfect sense.

[bthump]

How do you feel about Casca and her relationship with Griffith? Especially with her possibly trying to protect him from getting hurt again. I am interested to hear your thoughts. Do you think she has no concept of love? Or that she genuinely loved Guts?

Overall I actually really like Casca’s relationship with Griffith, and I think if a) Berserk was a very different story and b) Miura didn’t make Casca’s life revolve around romantic pining, I’d really love them as a v interesting platonic brotp style relationship with lots of layers and depth.

Casca has a v unique perspective and insight on Griffith, with her combination of hero worship and the way she’s seen him at his worst (pre-torture).

She’s aware that he hides himself behind a veneer of perfection, that he feels immense guilt, that he buries his emotions. She watched him self harm in front of her after prostituting himself to a pedophile. She’s more aware of his vulnerable humanity than even Guts is.

And knowing that he’s human, seeing some of his darker and sadder flaws first hand, only makes her admiration grow. I love that. I think it’s sad for Griffith because he doesn’t know this and knowing it would’ve probably really helped with his self loathing issues, and I think it’s a little… messed up, the way Casca sees Griffith’s ability to suppress his feelings and be perfect for everyone as a strength, but it’s really interesting as a dynamic.

When it comes to Griffith’s point of view, I think it’s kind of a shame that he remained so closed off to her. Casca and Guts have very similar feelings towards Griffith, but where Casca is largely shut out after he turns and puts his hand on her shoulder in the river, Guts is let in. So Casca and Griffith feel kind of like a missed connection. Not in a romantic way, but in a “if things had been slightly different between them, they could’ve been great mutual support for each other” kind of way.

If the river scene had gone a little differently, like say if Casca had assured Griffith she didn’t think he was dirty instead of asking why he was with Gennon, or if Griffith had allowed himself to accept her comforting hug, I think Casca could’ve been solid, affirming emotional support for Griffith. If she knew about the assassinations, say, she’d’ve been fine with them. She probably would’ve been a better assassin than Guts, too, lol.

lbr, Griffith desperately needed someone to see all of him and tell him he wasn’t a monster, and Casca would’ve been great at that. For Casca’s part, she wanted someone to prioritize her and trust her enough to accept her emotional support (as we see pretty clearly in the scene where she and Guts fuck.) And I think getting this platonically would’ve been just as good or better for her than getting it with a side of sex.

But at the end of the day it was Guts who Griffith turned to (and tbqh the fact that Casca’s jealousy is explicitly because she’s in love with Griffith absolutely means that Griffith trusting Guts, prioritizing Guts, and wanting Guts to see all of him, ie exactly what Casca wanted to be to Griffith, all boils down to attraction and Griffith choosing Guts over Casca as essentially his emotional support because he’s in love with Guts and not Casca. But I digress) and Casca’s relationship with Griffith never met its full potential.

But despite that, they still have a really cute, generally fairly positive relationship before everything goes down. Griffith sends a search party not just for Guts but also specifies her when they fall off the cliff. When they get back Casca’s falling over herself apologizing and Griffith just smiles and welcomes her back. At Guts’ prompting he mentions her dress to her just to say something nice and slightly make up for letting her think he was dead. When he first saves her she becomes devoted not just because he threw her a sword, but because he helped calm her down after she killed the dude, seemed to empathize with her (”he just nodded, deeply and slowly,”) and gave her a blanket. After the rescue there’s a moment where he sees her crying near Judeau from afar and clearly wishes he was still able to comfort her.

Idk honestly their relationship isn’t perfect, it has some sadness, some missed opportunities, some dark moments (I’m talking pre-Eclipse, I’m not touching Femto bc as far as I can tell the Eclipse rape had nothing to do with Casca or Griffith’s overall relationship with her and everything to do with Guts), but overall I think it’s a sweet, mostly positive friendship.

Ok lol sorry about that essay that doesn’t even address most of your ask.

As for Casca trying to protect Griffith from getting hurt, I think it makes perfect sense from a character perspective, though I’m a little cynical when it comes to my thoughts on what Miura may have intended. Like, eg, I think Casca’s violent diatribe against Guts near the waterfall was meant to be a mix of genuine anger over the way he broke Griffith, partially projecting her own feelings of abandonment, and partially her feelings of jealousy getting involved too - why couldn’t Guts have stayed for her, and why couldn’t she affect Griffith the way Guts could? We see both issues come up shortly after - jealousy right before she tries to kill herself, and raging at Guts for (she thinks) wanting to leave her behind again after they have sex.

So I guess now I’m thinking Casca’s feelings when she tells Guts to leave are probably a complicated mixture of like, everything.

I think what you described plays a large part. She knows how Griffith feels about Guts, and that seeing her and Guts together every day would be torturous for him. Also lbr, a few days with another dude aren’t enough to erase anyone’s like, near decade of feelings for the first dude, and we see them come up again during the rescue mission, when jealousy starts creeping between Guts and Casca, so she’s not exactly over her feelings for Griffith, which includes wanting to protect him.

I think there’s also an element of Casca being self-sacrificing, telling Guts to leave to pursue his dream because she thinks Guts’ dream is the most important thing to him, and she believes Guts staying would be a sacrifice on his part.

I think Casca is aware enough of the weird love triangle between the three of them that she knows if they both stayed with Griffith things would get weird and fucked up real quick for everyone, probably especially Griffith. She’s jealous of Guts and Griffith, Griffith loves Guts and would be jealous of the relationship between him and Casca, plus he’s the most vulnerable, and I think there’s a strong indication that Guts would be caught in the middle, but probably would end up prioritizing Griffith.

AND THEN there’s another aspect to Casca pushing Guts away that I think could, at least in theory, be the strongest motivating factor, at least when it comes to my interpretation of Casca and my love of flawed female characters who make terrible choices just like the men do, which is that she’s been given an opportunity to take Guts’ role.

Now Griffith needs her. Now she’s the one who can comfort him and Griffith finally accepts her comfort. And sex is also maybe on the table which, taking the narrative at face value, is something Casca also wants.

There is a “yet,” there, ofc. I think Casca’s feelings are mixed. She genuinely wanted to leave with Guts, she was probably glad of the chance to get over her one-sided feelings for Griffith, but at the same time, she still has those feelings.

So like, ultimately, once she’s faced with the reality that Griffith desperately needs someone who loves him and she can’t just take off with Guts, there are three options available: her and Guts both stay, only Guts stays, only Casca stays.

Both her and Guts staying would be an unmitigated disaster of jealousy issues, only Guts staying would fucking suck for Casca (right now from her pov, in the long run lbr it would by far be the best option bc Casca needs to find herself away from dudes), but only Casca staying would give her something she used to desperately want, and still does want on some level.

So she tells herself Guts would be unhappy without his dream and he shouldn’t stay for his own sake, and tries to send him off, but the actual driving emotional reason is that only one of them can stay with Griffith and she wants it to be her.

(For the record I think this would’ve been a huge mistake for Casca even if the Eclipse didn’t happen. Despite Griffith’s nightmare vision I can’t imagine her being happy living a quiet domestic life with him. But what’s the point of a Berserk character if they’re not making huge mistakes?)

lol man this is a lot longer than I thought it would be, and I think a lot of this is a stretch and probably not what Miura intended, but it’s the explanation I want to land on.

Oh and finally, just to briefly hit the last two things, I’d say Casca can’t tell the difference between love and a feeling of obligation she gets when someone saves her. Both her feelings for Griffith and Guts started after being saved by them, and both manifest in wanting to comfort them and be their emotional support and give them something in return for what they’ve given her.

“Not just being given to… maybe I can give something as well.”

So while maybe Miura wanted us to believe Casca loved Guts, or could’ve fallen in love with Guts (tho idk maybe this is purposeful, I talk a lot about how I think he deliberately went a relatively non-romantic route with Guts and Casca’s hook up), I don’t think she genuinely loved him, or Griffith for that matter, in a romantic sense.

@poppy-moon because you asked a while back re: meta about casca and griffith and now I’ve written something lol. and the first half is more the positive kind of thing you were suggesting.