#beforus culling mention

[cringefail-clown]

hateful gaze

[beforus-for-real-justice]

[] This sh[]uld start a discussi[]n! What ab[]ut culling? If y[]u were t[] write the system's laws, what w[]uld y[]u decide, as the best way t[] handle it? []

[trollocs-ooc]

Mod second any time beforus culling is mentioned

[nekropsii]

You mentioning Beforan Culling is like adopting a living person as a pet… explains so much about Kankri to me. Everyone really but Kankri just comes off to me now as like… iunno how to put it, a fancy dog that likes so yap a lot? I’ll go with that.

That descriptor there takes the fangs away from the topic a little too much, honestly. The "pet adoption" analogy isn't meant to say "these characters are genuinely analogous to animals", and more me commenting on how Beforan Culling is based in stripping people's agency and autonomy in a way that dehumanizes them severely.

It's a system that treats "lesser" people like helpless children, regardless of their actual capacity to care for themselves, and regardless of their need for independence and space. It stunts the growth of the culled severely. It disables them from experiencing negativity, conflict, and consequence. Cull means Coddle. Remember, their ruler is Feferi, a Witch of Life.

The reason I specifically remarked upon them being treated like animals is because the lower castes, disabled, and mutants essentially have the same rights as them. Beforan Culling actually does parallel a real world form of bigotry: Extreme Ableism.

Here's a few essays I've written on the topic of Beforus: [Beforan Society], [Kankri + Beforan Culling], [Alternia vs. Beforus]

[tired-gay-wreck9]

beforus sexy sex sex

this is a serious essay i promise

aka i do a lot of meenah cronus and meulin slander also rufioh he sucks dickballs

You may think that Beforan society in Homestuck was free from the effects of the Hemospectrum, and everyone lives together in a post-casteism utopia. Actually, no you don't. No one thinks that. I just needed an opener.

Everyone knows that there are still some bloodracist Beforan trolls running around. For example, Cronus wouldn't need to specify that 'dating down on the spectrum' was a positive and good thing that separated him from the trolls who only dated in their caste if said trolls didn't exist. And even though Kankri's rants are annoyingly long and pointless, they do have some merit. His mention of the highbloods using their long lifespans to gain control over the lower castes sounds like an actually plausible and important thing.

Their whole culling this is also shitty.

But you didn't click on the 'read more' for me to regurgitate the same bullshit you've heard a million times before. You clicked on it for the Beforus sexy sex sex. Or, as I like to call it, fetishization and objectification of the lower castes. Now if that's something that makes you uncomfortable, here's your go-ahead to stop reading this and do something else.

One example I'd like to call is Damara Megido. Specifically her relationship with Rufioh Nitram. He was a member of the lost weeaboos, a group, which, in our world, is heavily associated with fetishizing East Asian culture. Then we have Damara, a troll who's heavily implied to be East Asian. They date, and he cheats on her with someone higher on the spectrum, which solidifies that he never really cared about her actual feelings. Now, what did he care about? You can figure that out for yourselves.

"But Max", you may say, "that has nothing to do with the hemospectrum! That was just because Damara was associated with an oppressed minority in the real world, not because she was associated with an oppressed minority in Homestuck!"

And while that may be true, as we see no one higher than Damara on the spectrum being treated like this, we do see someone lower on the spectrum being treated like this. And no, I'm not talking about Kankri. Why would it be Kankri.

Karkat is also treated very strangely by the adults in Openbound. I'm going to be talking about pedophilia and grooming so yeah, if that's something that makes you uncomfortable, here's your warning. Adios.

The first is Cronus. Karkat is the only member of the kid's session who Cronus mentions hitting on or attempting to hit on. And we know from Meenah's remark about Vriska being a more 'acceptable age' when she learned she was older that pedophilia is a very real and bad thing that is looked down upon on Beforus. And Karkat was the only troll who motivated Cronus to do that.

The next is Meulin, who agrees to write porn of Karkat and Meenah, without Karkat's knowledge or consent. It's Karkat, out of all the kidtrolls who she thinks of doing this to. She doesn't think about his feelings. She only thinks about how to get the highblood off. Then she says that she'll get Meenah and Karkat's consent before sharing it with others like it's some great, heroic deed.

Sidenote! A lot of the Beforan trolls try to make themselves seem more moral, forgiving, and kind around Meenah. It makes me wonder if Meulin said that she'd get Meenah and Karkat's consent before spreading the fic around out of general respect for every troll's boundaries, or just the highblood's.

Then we have the big fish. The dilemma. The Godfather. Meenah. Her creepiness is a whole basket case. No, fuck it. It's a shopping cart case. A truckcase. An airplane case. You get my point. But because of her creepiness towards both Vriska and Karkat, we can discern which parts are general creepiness and which parts are bloodracist creepiness.

Meenah's crush on Karkat coincided with the point in his life where all his friends didn't care about him nearly as much as they did pre-Murderstuck, to the point where in the post retcon timeline he tells Dave that he's his only friend (not Kanaya, Terezi, Vriska, Aradia or Sollux), or are dead. She wanted him where he was in a point in his life where he was completely alone and vulnerable. She then tried to befriend him, not because she felt bad for him and thought that he needed a friend, but for her own romantic benefit.

Meenah also did this with pre-retcon ghost Vriska, when she had tossed aside Terezi, the only person in her life who still gave a shit about her, and had driven away all her other friends with murder and violence.

But Meenah, despite how gross she was to Vriska, made an effort for romance. She braided her hair, listened to her problems, and their first kiss was full of smiles.

She did not do that to Karkat. She describes herself as having a 'manic obsession' with him, asks Meulin to write something of them 'doin it' and says that she doesn't want her to set her and Karkat up. She never wanted anything romantic with him. She just wanted him for her own concupiscent pleasure. WHILE HE WAS FOURTEEN. SHE WAS NINETEEN. FIVE-YEAR AGE GAP.

You may say, "What about Kankri? No one acts like this to him except Cronus, and not even in a weird blood way." To which I say, Kankri. Kankri, the guy who if you've read my last post you know that he acts mean and awful for protection. The guy who used to wear tight revealing clothes and now is rarely seen outside a baggy sweater. The guy who hates being touched.

To sum it up, the alpha trolls suck dickballs and hussie, for some reason, made a fourth of them pedophiles. In Beforus, those lowest on the hemospectrum are sexualized by the masses as well as infantilized by the culling system, all wrapped up in a nice package of dehumanization.

or in other words; all these kids need therapy

[suboptimal-xenobiologist]

Headcanons About the Fuschia Caste

Aka Alternia is. So genocidal.

Fuschiabloods have insane lifespans spanning hundreds of thousands of years. This one's mostly canon but I'm not sure we ever got a number range other than "way too long"

For lack of better terminology, Fuschias have ridiculously high attack and defense stats, but ridiculously low hp. For example, it'd take a lot of effort to stab them because their flesh is practically impenetrable, but once you get the blade in, they're dead immediately. This is a well kept government secret for the most part.

All alternian fuschiabloods other than the heiress are culled at birth. Beforus didn't do this, and instead had a different method of choosing an heiress, but honestly I could make a whole other post about that.

Fuschias are incredibly territorial, spending most of their lives geographically isolated despite their ever-expanding empires. Part of the afformentioned Beforian practice was a long training on how to resist murdering everyone in the same room as them. Their similarity in violent and territorial instinct to red cherubs is of interest to all who study either species.

Oh yeah it's worth mentioning that even before Alternia's genocidal manifest destiny deal, the empire was fucking massive and encompassed hundreds of solar systems. There are so many fucking planets inhabited by trolls, some of which were populated in the Beforian era and have no association with Alternia whatsoever. The Condesce's insistence on reforming Earth instead of one of the many planets already under her control was 80% a Lord English thing and 20% an expanding the empire thing.

By Alternian law, the only trolls who can become the heiress are Piceses(es? Picesi?), but due to the urgent need to have one on planet at all times, usually the government just lies about about the heiress's sign.

There were quite a few heiresses before Feferi, she was just the one that happened to be on the planet during the events of Homestuck. Needless to say none of them are alive anymore.

When an heiress dies, her name is completely erased from history, to the point where saying it at all is a cullable crime.

[sugar-plump-gal]

Go on do it, tell us about the ocs >:D

I've got so many of the fuckers I don't even know where to start so! Hey how about the setting, that's basically an oc right?

Basically, I was making a shit ton of troll ocs but Alternia isn't a great setting for that. The oldest people around are like 19 in human years which isn't great, and everything has a constant specter of death which, although admittedly great for vore, isn't as good for stuffing and the like.

Obviously there's Earth C, but it hasn't got the same weird alien shit Alternia has. You haven't got buses walking around on spider legs, y'know?

So I went 'hey what if Universe C had a new, less shitty Alternia as well' and named it Externia bc duh.

At first it was pretty much just an excuse to have trolls be horny and not exiled into a space empire but then I accidentally gave it actual lore and backstory about how it was actually created and how it works and woops now I have an entire setting with just HEAPS of lore. A lot of it carries over into my hcs for Earth C but the jist of it is

-They just sorta had a god bring an empty Alternia/Beforus from a dead timeline. Nobody's sure who exactly did it or why

-A combination of them living in a universe with knowledge of sburb, the fact the sessions that made their universe were So Broken, and their planet having never used remnants of a previous game means they all have more or less free access to a decent bit of sburb shit, namely alchemy and like. Basically resurrection pods like in bioshock or something

-At some point someone figured out that a full battery was worth way more grist than an empty one, so by making an empty battery and charging it w solar panels or something you can basically generate infinite grist. Pretty much everyone just has infinite money and resources. Specifically food. It's really fucking easy to be a fat fuck.

-They don't have mandatory cum buckets, so instead new trolls are just cloned w ectobiology. Since culling isn't a thing and ectobiology is weird there's LOT of mutations. Usually horny.

-Trolls are still raised by lusii and kept separate from adults, but instead of having their own planet and getting kicked into space empire hell they just sorta. Have their own neighborhoods and internet and then once everyone is grown up it just gets added to the wider city.

-They've got drones and shit but they're less bioweapons and more like. Imagine if you just replaced all the spikes and weapons with the aesthetic of baymax from big hero 6. They're mostly just there to do menial labor and/or detect and help with any emergencies.

-Since pretty much all labor is handled by drones and resources are infinite, more or less everyone is free to do what they please, with the only 'jobs' being ones people Want to have for their own sake. Sometimes that means writing or making music or blogging, but usually it means porn. LOTS of porn. Of the trolls I have, like FOUR are pornstars. Everyone fucks incessantly.

-Between that and the fact that anyone under like twenty lives in their own separate communities it's entirely socially accepted to just give sloppy to someone on the bus.

None of that is even TOUCHING the actual Plot or anything. I haven't mentioned a single fucking OC yet and already have a dash filling wall of text. Fuckin warned yall

[fefairys]

so like. in the candy epilogue the entire drive is that jane is xenophobic and justifies it because the trolls are a “naturally violent” species. but that... is not even true.

the beforus trolls were the original ones, and they were not violent. the alternian trolls were made violent when doc scratch put gl’bgolyb on their planet. he made them violent so they would win sgrub.

the beforus trolls didnt seem to have any sort of struggle with overpopulation like jane implies there would be without culling, and beforus didn’t have culling either! (well they did but it didnt mean killing lol)

but even the narration of candy seems to just completely forget this. this moment where swifer (a troll from earth c, NOT alternia): “then twirls the mop over her wrist with a martial flourish that absolutely recalls the fact that she is from a natural-born warrior species” like huh??? shes not though.

they ARENT a “natural-born warrior species” thats like the entire point of like karkat and vriskas and terezis arcs in homestuck. terezi doesnt understand why it gets her so fucked up when she has to kill someone because her species is SUPPOSED to do that. what she doesnt realize is that they were NEVER meant to do that. doc scratch MADE THEM DO THAT!!!

it just really pisses me off. it’s never even brought up like hey jane remember than whole race of non-violent trolls that literally came BEFORE the violent trolls? no one ever mentions the beforan trolls for a second! the entire epilogue is one enormous plot hole!!!!! fuck!!!!

[ardenttheories]

Your takes on gender can be applied these ways also: 1. Their species could be transphobic solely because they might view gender as unnecessary (which isn’t true, due to so many trolls being trans with no problem, so that’s out the window,) or 2. The Condesce herself or her generation created gender roles on Alternia; it would also make sense with The Signless preaching beliefs of freedom and possibly even expression, if we were to go that route. While it doesn’t fix all, it’s better than nothin

Continuing on with Signless and the Condesce, it would have actually made more sense for Sign to be a Fuchsia if society is based on blood caste, for more than one reason (I mean the political implications of a thief of BLOOD being a tyrannical emperor and what you could do with that are pretty fucking apparent but hey who gives a shit amiright) and while life can be just as politically aligned as blood, the inherent structure of blood and the way it’s broken and set up makes Sign a better fit

The bulge-nook standard is all just a bunch of useless bullshit, but it wasn’t in the past apparently; I think it’s mentioned somewhere in the comic that they’re actually close to extinction because the mother grub method is unsustainable and was created BY the Condesce? And that they actually could procreate together but they’re slowly losing the ability? Therefore you could also say that those who are still able to reproduce via encounters could be labeled differently, but that’s still shit

Continuing once again off of the whole mother grub thing (Sorry I’m spamming your inbox I just really like your think thoughts,) the only reason I could see a troll harboring certain ‘gender’ traits (boobs for example) would be for advantages in different climates, besides possible ovaries which, if trolls are more bug than human-like, don’t even make sense anyway. It’s all just a bunch of crud BUT the argument for being trans lies solely in what could remain, OR societal reconstruction I guess

I suppose HIC could have been the generation to assign gender roles to her society, but my only issue would be this: why? I pointed this out in another anon, but there’s no actual divide into “trolls who are superior for being x gender” and “trolls who are inferior for being x gender”. She’s the empress, so you’d think she’d have a preference for women - but her closest and most valued are both men. And even then, she kills indisciminately between genders. Her only preference I’ve ever seen gender-wise is that she always views women as heiresses (or, people who are possible to take her throne), and even that doesn’t entirely make sense; it can easily be explained away as Hussie trying to build a matriarchy where one just didn’t need to exist, to parallel Alternia and Earth. 

To HIC, hemospectrum trumps gender. A male and female rustblood could be standing side by side, both accused of a crime, and neither would be considered more or less guilty on a gendered basis: they’d both be culled for being rust. Likewise, two violetbloods could kill a purpleblood, and the male wouldn’t be more likely to get caught than the female, or viseversa. They’d both get away scot free because they’re highbloods, and higher than the purple they killed - or, they’d both be revenge-slaughtered by other purplebloods.

This isn’t even getting into the fact that, although our canonical legislacerator is female (Redglare), the actual judge (His Honorable Tyranny) is male. So, again, we have a male in power. Yet there’s no explicit bias towards or against men. 

It’s this foundational issue for trying to put a gendered system - as we understand it - on a system that just doesn’t work for it. I do very firmly believe that the trolls would have a gender system, yes; but I think it would revolve around something entirely different. More like how bee genders work; if they’re all “female”, then how do you differentiate the “gender” of bees? By focusing on what actually differentiates them societally: their roles in the hive. Queen, worker, drone - these are the bee genders. How you could implement that to Alternians, I’m not totally sure; I’d have to think on that a little more.

The Signless works well as a mutantblood for the martyr status Hussie was going for; he’s a very clear allegory for Jesus as-is, and having him be a fuchsia wouldn’t have really worked in that sense (because he would have been born into an inherent place of power, without the requirement to go through the martyr journey - and he could have much more easily set about a better, more equal structure had he been an heir than he could have being a mutant). 

It’s a good way to impose on readers just how violent troll society is against those who don’t fit into the spectrum, since the hemospectrum is a class structure that was instilled by both HIC and Doc Scratch (which doesn’t exist as strictly on Beforus, except that the upper classes look after the lower). It also just allows for the equal “one troll of each caste” motif Hussie wanted to go with. So, again, this is an unfortunate instance of Hussie choosing design over lore.

That said, being a fuchsiablood - or even a mutated fuchsia, if we still want to go down the mutant route - would have been endlessly interesting. It could have completely different to see a not-so-shoddily hidden allegory. How The Signless would have attempted to go against HIC, his abilities as a Blood Player, the potentialities of him still raising a rebellion and attempting to change the entire structure of Alternia to something more Beforean - it’s definitely juicy food for thought, if nothing else.

I couldn’t find anything on the Mother Grub method being instilled by HIC, or the fact that it was unsustainable - at least, not on Alternia. Everything I’ve seen relating to Alternia and Mother Grubs very much seems to state that these are the natural ways of the world, something that wasn’t meddled with (which goes along with a theory I had with a few anons some time ago, under the “#homestuck biology” tag, wherein the Mother Grub, trolls, and Drones are actually all founded from the same ancient species, but the trolls just so happened to be the ones to evolve into intelligent life). 

(Edited note: I did find something mentioning that the threat of global extinction allowed for the implementation of the caste system to begin with - as in, the hemospectrum didn’t exist until that specific point in time. It doesn’t mention anything about the Mother Grubs before or after this event, or what caused the near-extinction of the troll race. I would assume Doc Scratch, in order to force the Hemospectrum to exist in the first place, since he takes full credit for its conception. In either case, it isn’t an inability to breed that almost killed off the entire Alternian race - otherwise, even post-Hemospectrum, they would have still died out.)

Anything regarding unsustainability might be instead referring to HIC’s attempts to reintroduce the troll population to the Alpha kids’ Earth; she tries to bring lusii into the world and tries to repopulate Earth using genetic material via the Mother Grub (including for humans), but ultimately fails to do so (partly because her attempts to do so were thwarted by a clone of her lusus, partly because, I assume, human DNA isn’t compatible with the Mother Grubs). 

So, unfortunately, it doesn’t look like trolls ever had the ability to mate with each other and reproduce in a more mammalian way. Which I still despise as a concept, if I’m completely honest; the trolls are clearly meant to be based on insects, are surrounded by insect-like evolutionary divergences, and breed in a very insect-like way. The idea that they ever, at any point, had a more mammalian lineage just makes no sense. That’s like saying that we descended from ancient bees instead of ancient apes. 

It’s, again, one of those instances were you can tell Hussie tried to make something unique and interesting, but then didn’t fully think it through and returned to what he knew most - which is a very much more human experience. 

I think the best explanation for the “gender” differences - beyond “Hussie needed a way to show male and female characters because he didn’t think to include different genders in a society that clearly needed it - probably is the climate concept. It’d be more interesting, for one, and still allow for the potential that trolls don’t have - or show - inherent sexual dimorphism. Especially because, like you said, those are very mammalian traits? Insect-based species don’t have an evolutionary need for those things. 

[theorynexus]

106:   Further Clarification on World Building

Intriguing. I do believe there was some implication that such measures were indeed already in place (presumably as a matter of practicality relating to ectobiology and the fact that it was the only means of troll reproduction before this point), and Jane was “merely” intending to push them to greater extremes than had ever been present before as a means of ensuring control over the population; whereby she might ensure she would be able to stymy any opposition to her future election and shore up her base (because demographics are highly important to a modern electoral system).   It is nice to be reminded of this fact, however, and to receive further clarification about the poliical state of affairs in the Candy version of the world, given politics was such an important topic in the Meat side of things. (Mind you, by the way, I do believe that being inflexible with regard to changing policy when such a sea change in the physical reality of how population propagation might occur goes into play is rather foolish, and likely will generate a major shift in administrations in the future as troll enmity toward the current regime builds up, but that is a matter of speculation, rather than hard fact.) I do wonder what such population control measures mean in practice, now that the Mother Grub is up and running.  Are troll parents no longer able to obtain pseudo-designer children (meaning: they were able to ensure that they got their own offspring for the first time via ectobiology; not to mention trolls didn’t, themselves, actually have parenting behavior before this world, at least commonly), instead being restricted to only getting children via limited mother grub mixing, now?  Are babies (grubs) being culled if too many are born?  These things matter quite a bit in determining how bad the “crimes against humanity” aspect of things is, here.

Is that some sort of weird sex joke? Moreover:  I wonder if Jane knows Gamzee is okay with these sorts of discussions, or if she’s just being culturally insensitive.  Hard to tell, given how much of a weird bit of shenanigans went on with the time skip and Gamzee even insinuating himself into her life in the first place.     (Is this just for a reference to him being her guide in the Game Over timeline?  Man, Jake must have been super upset about all of this, at least at first.)

To be fair, I would just like to point out the irony of him being accusatory toward her while utilizing that very word: subjugglating.  It points out that troll history (honestly true to some extent on Beforus as well, but much moreso on Alternia) is absolutely rife with exactly this type of political subjugation, and far worse. This, I would like to emphasize, does not at all make it okay.  Just a little bit ironic, and awkwardly almost funny as a result.   Despite the fact that the words come from a hate clown, however, the subject is not funny at all. “The Human Man” makes for a very interesting additional comedic undertone, though: it makes Gamzee seem like he is a hippie.

Certainly an interesting and realistic line for a pragmatist to take.  I should also admit that a situation wherein multiple species of humanoid persist on a singular planet creates political considerations which are, puns aside, alien to human political culture on our modern Earth.      I do not believe that such pragmatic issues are in fact a justification for political controls which institute unnatural imbalances in political rights and liberties, however.  This will simply create a deeply ingrained caste system over time, wherein certain types of citizen are considered second [or third] class. Not only will they have less in the way of power to effect political change and properly participate in a democratically-oriented system of government in any non-farcical level, but these lower tiers of citizen will likely be forced into dealing with systemic social and economic oppression, even if there is no initial will to promote such a status quo, simply as a result of the manner in which they are treated on a national/international scale.    In fact, one can already see this sort of unfair treatment’s propagation via the Consort Kingdom’s level of power and the social stereotyping that members thereof face.    Trolls are already at the border of being treated in a similar manner, and while it is good that Crocker was not elected, a status quo result is almost as bad, it would seem.  Status quo means political norms are ingrained, and become difficult ot budge, later on. Sadly, though, I have to go, now.

[cringefail-clown]

Jakehal is very fun. But why dirkkri? I dont understand what's appealing about it :? confused

theres a lot of things i like about dirkri and honestly i dont even know where to start lmfao

first of all, and its mostly a funny reason - davekat on crack. like some traces of davekat are still there - the arguing about shit, stoic facade vs emotional mess, all the good stuff, but its also so much more exaggerated it makes it this much more ridiculous. gets even better when you consider them under the lense of swap aus like alphaswitch or tbau, where they land on the meteor together. theyre most likely hunting each other for sports by the year two

second of all, the funney. theyd be so fucking funny together. their smallest arguments would take like twenty pages of non-stop flow of red-orange text to resolve, and not because they came to a consensus but because some third party physically dragged them away from their electronics. it doesnt do any good, since it only gives them both time to think over new arguments to use, and theyre back at it as soon as they get their phones back. like if we had a tournament about which ship would do the most collateral damage to the overall group, i think these two would be Up There. karkat would gauge his eyes out from frustration, because now not only does he have to deal with his piece of shit, know-it-all other self, but now theres also Fucking Dirk thrown into the mix. their home life is absolute insanity, a small jab about the other forgetting to buy sugar once again devolves into a screaming match about the merits and flaws of communism or some other inane shit. and theyre doing it for fun, they enjoy debating with each other, because often times they have vastly different opinions, and comparing their beliefs challenges them intelectually and morally. from the outside perspective theyre one of the most dysfunctional pair in the paradox space, when in fact thats simply how they want their relationship to be, and it makes them better people overall.

third reason is that theyre thematically delicious. dirk is a control freak, micromanaging his and his friends constantly. hes terrified of losing control, but hes also desperate for someone to just tell him what the fuck he should do. dirk doesnt think he should be in control of others, because he believes hes a naturally evil person capable of horrible acts, at the same time he doesnt trust anyone else to get things done but himself. hes a whole collection of contradictions.

kankri desperately needs to be in control as well. hes constantly injecting himself into conversations he has no business being in, trying to find someone thatd listen to what he has to say. hes wants to guide others, but his efforts are flawed, because he doesnt listen to other perspectives - hes got tunnel vision, as he thinks hes the one in the right while everyone else is wrong or ignorant (cringefail seer literally). he doesnt trust anyone else to make decisions for him, and becomes defensive when he thinks others are attempting to coddle him. his ass was definitely culled on beforus.

theyre also both so fucking lonely. dirk conciously tries to put difference between himself and his friends, worrying hell "corrupt" them. kankri tries to connect to his friends, but his behavior alienates him from them to the point of no one except maybe porrim want to have anything to do with him.

my point is, kankri wants to guide people but has to learn to listen to others and reflect on his own flawed opinions. dirk has to learn to trust that people closest to him can get shit done on their own and loosen up, as well as realise hes not evil at the core. them helping each other out - dirk teaching kankri about different perspectives, kankri teaching dirk about letting others do their thing - is something i think about a lot.

also i like to think theyd spar for fun a lot as well. its not really a reason and wholly my own personal headcanon but i wanna mention it as well bc its so funny to me. i like the idea of kankris behaviour being a complete reverse of karkat - where karkat is all bark no bite and doesnt like fighting or violence, kankri puts up a front of the beacon of love and peace and tolerance, but in his free time he gets his rifle and goes shooting at the fucking squirrels or some shit. i think he wouldnt have the same qualms about strifing as karkat. like dirk would try to jokingly jab his finger at kankris side and he would just fucking flip him over his shoulder and onto the table breaking it in half, because he doesnt like being touched unexpectedly and by gods dirk when will you fucking learn. he goes from 0 to 100 real fast. its such a hysterical concept for me.

[luminescentlyricist]

⚡ Overdrive 🏹

( WARNING: MEDICAL PROCEDURES AND GORE ) (Apologies if there are inaccuracies in the medical procedure! I'm not exactly a qualified surgeon, and I'm doing as best I can without going too batsh*t fictional. I'm also trying to keep it vague enough to be comfortable to read, but do be wary if you are sensitive to this sort of content.)

~

Dietas' lungs burned. They knew that they were vastly weaker than all of the other trolls in the room, physically speaking, but they took pride in their strong psionic abilities, and nothing would deter them from their goal. After five sweeps of hard work, there they were. They were in with the other 'recruits', or so they were called colloquially, and their legs were trembling from a strange, alarming mixture of fear, excitement and pure adrenaline. Looking around, their heterochromic gaze flickered from one troll to another. They needed to know who they'd be competing with for the position of helmstroll, or working alongside.

Ever since they were a grub, practising camouflage with their chameleon lusus in the scrub, they had known where their loyalty lay. They were made to serve the Empress, the Beforan Empire, and their fellow trolls as a whole. Dietas had always considered the position they vied for on that day to be the most direct, efficient way of showcasing their loyalty. They yearned for nothing else, no freedom, only an existence punctuated by service and what they had been born for. Some would call it a bad one, but there was nothing anyone could do to deter the goldblood from their dream.

Times had changed in Beforus. The grip on the hemospectrum was slipping due to Feferi's reign, but Dietas had long realised that they needed the structure in their life, and they intended to keep to the code that had been decreed by their caste even if it were to be abolished in its entirety. They were already eight sweeps old, and knew they had until twenty four at best. There was simply no reason to deviate from what had been written in their veins unless they were going to die. They had little to no intention to do so, in any case.

Their lusus had taught them to hide, and they intended to. Beyond making themselves known enough to become a helmstroll - the position that was already fading as Beforus became less and less dependent on exports - they considered themselves a conformist. Made only to fit the mould. There was nothing else that they could do that felt properly fulfilling. They didn't want to become an engineer, coder or anything else. The thought of becoming a battery - someone for other psions to leech psionic energy from, to steal from - made their skin crawl. They had been friendly; they had had other goldbloods that they might have considered friends, and too many had been resigned to that soulless fate.

It was a mystery why they had not realised that they were resigning themselves to one, too. Their thirst for imperial service would suck them dry in time. There was no mistaking that. either. Dietas thought themself mature, but their own naivety seemed to grow by the day. This had resulted in them leaving their lusus behind, and they had no way of contact. They could be half way across Beforus searching blindly, for all they knew. This didn't make Dietas sad. They thought their lusus hadn't cared about them, so there was no sense in getting attached. This was regardless of the fact that Beforan lusii stayed with their grubs for longer than Alternian ones ever could, and many stayed until their charge died.

The young goldblood looked around again, glanced at the indigobloods that were assessing every single troll. They were strong, tall and menacing, most capable of culling a gold with a single punch. A shudder worked its way down their spine, but they refused to react any more. They had too many eyes on them now to react badly, and knew they'd be chosen soon enough to go into testing. Not that they had any idea what the tests consisted of, nor wanted to. They had to be prepared for anything and everything they were put through, no matter how tired they were afterwards. If it pushed them near death, so be it.

Dietas inhaled sharply when an indigoblood tapped them on the shoulder, turning to face their assessor with bated breath. This was it. This was their only chance. They stayed behind the stocky figure, shrinking in the shadows due to sweeps of habitual hiding and hunting they had done with their lusus. Although they were small enough in stature, they were psychically strong enough to immobilise their target for a full two minutes, or multiple targets for approximately forty seconds, even at such a young age. Their feet didn't drag on the ground, and their back was straight as a rod. They could risk nothing this far in the assessment.

They were taken to a large alcove. The training grounds had been situated in a forest so dense that the only trolls that would get through the foliage were the unnaturally strong indigos or particularly powerful psions. To get there was a challenge in itself, weeding out many a competitor before the training even begun. There was a good reason why they had left their lusus, but they were regretting it now. The air buzzed with tension, causing Dietas' gaze to fall to their feet.

"You w!ll be g!ven all necessary !nstructions !nside the tra!n!ng vessel."

The indigo's voice rang out in a way that it logically shouldn't have, given the dense vegetation that muffled the noise around the two trolls. There must have been some sort of amplification technology nearby, hidden in the trees or other areas, although their sharp gaze couldn't see it. Dietas nodded silently, forcing themselves to look up at the 'training vessel'. The cargo ship loomed large over their head. It made them decidedly uneasy, but this was no time to be expressing that.

With one more glance to their broad-shouldered, emotionless instructor, they entered.

Immediately, as the small goldblood surveyed their surroundings, they felt like the walls were caving in around them. The dark interior of the ship was sleek, more modern technologically than they'd ever witnessed before. It made them want to touch everything, to feel it all and tear it apart, knowing how and why it was made. All the same, the beauty was imposing. They kept their head down after that initial look-around, knowing that they couldn't get distracted by everything.

Dietas was trembling slightly, hands curled into tight fists at their sides, however much they knew that they had to relax. They weren't sure if it was adrenaline or anxiety. Another glance told them where they were going to go. A gleaming pod, studded with circular panels. They'd likely be pressed up against the ones on the interior. Their eyes swept upwards in the pod as they neared it, taking in all of the wires and such that they'd be hooked into. It was a strange thought, being so entwined in the ship itself, but it was comforting. They'd be safe.

The one thing that irked them was how tight the curling, vine-like binds appeared, and that thought was accentuated as soon as they slipped their hands above their head and into the clamps. It became less of a fascinating cockpit than a metallic prison, and that was exactly the opposite of the training videos that they'd watched as a younger troll. As soon as they'd assumed their more humanoid form, they'd expressed their fascination with the job that now seemed more likely to cull them than anything else.

Shivers of anticipation ran along their spine as they psionically took goggles from a stand in the pod, fitting them over their eyes. Immediately, graphics and images burst forth into their vision, and an electronic voice accompanied the flood of information. The deep tones of their instructor, but mechanical and somewhat distorted, enough to make Dietas feel tense and wary of themselves.

"Prepare yourself for the ascent. You w!ll be g!ven complete control of the vessel, and your every move w!ll be mon!tored. You are to carry the prec!ous cargo !n your hold along the marked course, and other tra!nees w!ll take over when you reach the end of sa!d course. Should !t become damaged !n any way, you dev!ate from your course or d!sobey the !nstructions, you w!ll be promptly expelled from the program."

The goldblood's body was tingling again, but it felt hot and intrusive. Jittery, tense in the wrong way. They were going to lose their grip on the task as soon as they reached the air, surely. As opposed to beginning ascent, Dietas was slowly attempting to move and ease the sudden tension clamping them. It would be disastrous for them if the sensation continued. It was difficult to relax, even more knowing there were so many trolls watching them, however remotely.

"Tra!nee, beg!n your ascent or r!sk expuls!on."

There it was again; the electrically distorted voice of their instructor was nothing but a distraction, and an unwelcome cause to worry even more about what they were doing. They forced themself to relax into their position, eyes beginning to spark even more. Their left eye was fuchsia, whereas the right retained a violet akin to the blood of Aquariuses. Both slightly brightened in tone when they were using psionics. Their lusus had seemed to praise them, mentioning that they would fit right in with the royal fleet, but they weren't so sure about that now.

Slowly, Dietas felt their body shiver with energy, and the training ship rose shakily into the sky. Their mind was focused only on their task, and gaze trained forwards through the path glowing in their goggles. They couldn't afford to think of much else, due to how taxing the task was designed to become. It tested their agility, physical and psychic strength, logic, every aspect of their brain and body to a worrying extent. There was simply so much for them to concentrate on, as well as making sure they didn't get too overwhelmed by that notion.

Their psionic grip tightened around the ship as they steered it around the bends and weaves in the path. Beads of golden perspiration slid down their pallid skin, and their breathing was stuttering as if they weren't paying enough attention to stabilising it. At one point, they were exerting themselves so much that the sweat slipped under their goggles, causing their vision of the path and the infographics in front of them alike to blur. But they kept steady, for the most part, even when they became so breathless that their whole face flushed with gold.

Their body was too tense, too rigid. Even in stressful situations, helmstrolls were supposed to be able to keep themselves calm. But Dietas was slowly weakening, and that wasn't how it was supposed to be. More than anything, they couldn't black out and risk destroying the vessel, so they decided to push themselves harder than ever while they had the power to. The cargo needed to get to the end of the course, and if they were to falter then everything would crumble. However, they couldn't help but move in irritation. Prickles of electricity sparked from the back panels - those dubious-looking round ones that Dietas had always been sceptical of in the first place - and hit their back, sending shivers up instead of down their spine.

Gritting their teeth, they forged ahead, trying their very best to ignore the prickling annoyances. What they didn't realise was that the shudders of power weren't dissipating as they steered the ship; the excess energy that was being naturally converted into psionics was building in their head, but they couldn't control it. The goggles they wore were slowly melting onto their face - the right side only, for the energy had travelled there and not evenly dispersed - and inhibiting their vision. This meant a disaster: the energy being developed and added when they attempted to steer was building, and unable to escape the goggles or disperse along the vents in the lenses.

A distorted voice rang in Dietas' ears, and dual tones of colour flared in front of their face before everything went black.

~

Dietas awoke.

Not in smoking rubble, although the acrid smell laid thick in the air. In a small workshop, of which they couldn't see a thing. Everything hurt, from their fingers to their toes. Rapid tingling accompanied the pain, causing an agonising itchiness that they couldn't do anything to stop. They didn't risk moving; they had not the slightest idea where they were, and their eyes refused to open. All they wanted to do was to get back into the training ship and finish their mission, and that was their intention. There was nothing else they could do, because they couldn't pass up their chance to be a helmstroll. It was the only thing left that they had: the drive to continue was what sustained them.

They felt so weak it was terrifying. Their head was fuzzy, filling with swarms of noise and sensations they had no idea how to interpret without using their eyes. Their eyes, those that they'd depended on more than anything else. Slowly, shaking more than they thought possible, Dietas raised a hand to their face. It felt... wrong. Rough, as if something had melted and fused onto the skin over their right eye somehow. Their fingers were met with this roughness, and nausea began to push and pull inside their stomach like unruly currents.  What the hell was happening to them? They had though everything was alright, despite the crash that they couldn't even remember.

All they knew was that their face felt weird, they could barely move and they were probably half-blind. A noise jerked them back into the world, as they lay there in a foggy haze of pain. Footsteps, heavy and methodical, heading straight towards them. Opening their mouth to try and speak their protests, Dietas found that this was futile. Their interloper spoke first, in a gentler tone than they ever would have anticipated.

"Oh, gOOd. YOu △re △w△ke. I w△s beginning tO wOrry th△t yOu wOuld nOt cOme △rOund, △nd th△t I h△d in△dvertently invited △ cOrpse intO my hOme."

Home? So Dietas themself was the interloper... They found the strength to move again, struggling to something of a sitting position before the strange figure made a noise of disapproval at the action, presumably looking at whatever injuries they had sustained and advising they not move. Having no sight was perhaps the most frightening thing about their incapacitation, given the fact they had been moved into a completely new environment lying gog knows how far from the training facilities. As soon as they felt large hands on their shoulders, the comparatively small goldblood flinched. The voice was... familiar, somehow. It echoed the tones of the indigos in the training facility, and that made them freeze up noticeably. Had they been found? Were they going to be culled?

The indigoblood in question wasn't hostile, luckily enough. She didn't seem it, in any case. After walking a bit closer to Dietas in order to inspect their injuries, she spoke again, but was quieter still due to the close proximity that they were in. She didn't want to scare Dietas, and that was clear by how carefully she had stepped upon seeing the goldblood flinching at every footfall that her boots had made on the rough flooring. She cleared her throat and adjusted something hanging from her belt.

"△pOlOgies fOr the r△ther △wkw△rd intrOductiOn, my gOldblOOded friend. But yOu shOuld △bsOlutely nOt mOve, due tO the d△m△ge yOu h△ve sust△ined △lre△dy. My n△me is ItOri△ △prein, △nd yOu h△ve been in my c△re fOr △ signific△nt △mOunt Of time. My... ex-cOlle△gues," She wrinkled her nose, sneering in distaste, "H△ve cOme tO my WorkshOp m△ny times, se△rching fOr rOgue gOlds whO f△il their ex△m tO cull, △s if lOwblOOds △re l△me hOOfbe△sts tO be hunted fOr spOrt."

Dietas had no idea how long they had been blacked out for, but it didn't matter. They had a lot of healing to do, some of which would likely involve surgery. They didn't really want it, but as soon as Itoria had stated that she was there to help, they believed her and agreed to it. Despite her implications of being highblooded, they knew that she wasn't going to cull them because of how helpless they were now. Even if they hadn't been there for a long time, the rest of the indigobloods that they knew of would cull on sight, and the last time they checked they were alive. This was a relief, though the smoking smell that invaded their nasal passages told them that they had damaged the ship as well.

The goldblood gave into the throes of unconsciousness once again, and it was just as well they did. They were going to be surgically operated on, because the plastic and molten materials from the goggles had indeed melted onto their face around their right eye. Of course, Itoria had gained consent to perform it when Dietas had been more lucid before, and she was skilled in precision.

Although Itoria was a female indigoblood, the males of her caste were often prioritised when given jobs. It made no sense to her, due to the matriarchal society and Empress Feferi's emphasis on the dissolving of the hemospectrum and inequality. While many her acquaintances had moved on to become caretakers - a role that they were clearly not suited for - or instructors at such training facilities as the one Dietas had left, she had been forced to work in the background on electronics. Her skill lay in creating the hidden cameras that lay all over the premises, but she regretted them. After she had learned the truth, she felt disgusted that she was contributing to an unjust cause.

The truth was that the mysterious overseers, lying above the indigos that tested the golds, were ceruleanblooded. They were responsible for keeping the indigos themselves docile, in sort of a twisted interpretation of a moiraillegiance. That was the best explanation Itoria had in her head of it, though it would have been a 'hollow' pale relation, where the pacifism was achieved but nothing else. These ceruleans controlled indigos en-masse, from the moment they entered to the moment they left. Not all members of the cerulean caste were malicious and immoral, though there were just enough to cause mischief beyond the eyes of the Empress.

The exploitation and mental corruption occurring in the facilities was largely why Feferi had worked to outlaw or lessen the practice of helmstrolls in Beforus, after all.

After a few more moments of awkward but thoughtful silence, there came a clicking of mandibles as Itoria's oversized ant lusus emerged from deeper in the workshop, large blue eyes - similar in colour to the woman's own - gazing towards her charge. The lusus seemed to have dropped something to click at Itoria, as there was a glasslike tinkling noise upon contact with the rough flooring. She smiled at her lusus, standing and picking up the syringe full of a general anaesthetic. Regardless of the fact that Dietas was already unconscious, she wanted to make sure they absolutely didn't wake up.

Antmom left, presumably to dig and help expand the workshop. Itoria carefully injected the liquid into Dietas' arm and got to work, taking a glance around to make sure the windows were properly blocked out. Nobody wanted to see the surgery she was performing, and she didn't want anyone to interrupt. Steadying her shaking hands, she pulled disposable gloves onto them and tied up her hair. She wasn't going to deny that her own nervousness was getting to her. She had done many procedures, but none as intense as this.

Grabbing a marker, the indigoblood drew small lines around the area she was going to cut on Dietas' skin, outlining the upper-right portion of their face and frowning. She had anatomical knowledge, sure, but was uncertain if she should remove the horns. Deciding to do it only if she damaged the bones, she begun the laborious and gruesome process of removing the melted goggle-pieces around the eye, and clearing the skin, sinews and tissues away. She used a few more vials of anaesthetic through the many-hour process, the likes of which Antmom burrowed and stole from a local expedition of over-funded violet tourists. After a while, the tremors in her hands began to worsen, as her forearms were slick with gold.

Dietas was comfortably unconscious, and didn't seem to want to wake any time soon, which was really just as well. Unbearable phantom pains would likely greet them when they did, so the longer they stayed under the better.

Itoria Aprein, on the other hand, was all too vividly aware of what she was doing. Removing as much of the eye as she possibly could but leaving the nerves intact with the bones, she decided to leave the surgical part of her exploits there, as the goldblood's horns were also still miraculously fine. She had thought about the surgery in terms of mechanical extraction, where a slip-up could mean death by electrocution, and it had helped her concentrate. It wasn't really that different in terms of fatalities, albeit to the wrong entity. If she damaged the wires of a piece, she could jeopardise a whole machine. If she damaged Dietas' eye, she could damage them to the extent that they were forever half-blind, or worse.

However, she'd need to maintain their sedation or at least dull their lucidity for a few more days at best. If she were to properly fit and construct their mechanical headpiece, she didn't want them to be in agony until they reclaimed their sight. Looking at the vividly coloured vials of anaesthetic she had yet to decant into her syringes, a frown marred her usually stoic features for a moment. She rubbed her face after taking the gloves off, groaning loudly in exasperation. Her supplies were running low, and there was no way the tourists would let Antmom steal again. She'd have to resort to something else, and she had one more option at her fingertips. It was the worst thing possible, but there was no other way.

"Oh de△r me. I will nOt enjOy △dministering this, but it m△y be necess△ry in the ne△r future if things dO nOt Work Out smOOthly. I dO △pOlOgise."

Itoria spoke to the unconscious Dietas with a nervous tremor in her voice. She then left the room, wringing her hands in a gesture of nervousness. There were supplies that she needed, and although they were completely legal on Beforus, their use were frowned upon as if they weren't. The anaesthetic she had used earlier had contained a diluted version of the substance, as many painkillers and medical applications did, but the bottles in a heavily-guarded safe at the very back of her workshop were potent as ever. Moving out of the way of Antmom, she continued her journey until reaching the vault.

Since she had been able to break through her cerulean's control, due to her concentration training and higher caste, she lay low for a time in order to gather otherwise forbidden supplies for herself, and the Faygo bottles were one of them. Known in Beforus for its heavily numbing and mellowing properties, she had particularly stocked up on it in case of a break-in or invasion of Overseers. Running through the processes of unlocking - padlock code, retina scan, facial recognition, vocal recognition and blood sample - in her head, she performed the process rapidly and tucked a couple of Grape Faygo bottles into a bag she carried. It was said to be the most potent of the colours, even though the purplebloods who used small, controlled doses for calming didn't seem to note a difference.

Returning to Dietas, she asked for Antmom to put the bottles far in the back of the 'hunger trunk' and reapplied her thick leather gloves. Hoisting the troll into her arms, she carried them back into the private room she had set up for them earlier and mixed up some plaster. Carefully taking a mould of Dietas' left eye, horn and the surrounding facial features, she retreated into her workshop. She had a great big job to do, and it was a terrifying but welcome challenge. Clearing her throat, she curled and flexed her hands in and out of fists a few times to calm herself before setting down the mould. It had set remarkably quickly, and that was what she needed.

Heating her base metals, she was incredibly grateful for the toughness of her hands, underneath the gloves that did little to help her. Although she was young in terms of an indigo, she had worked with enough burning materials that her hands were calloused and rough. She had soon created the base of the headpiece, a shell of silvery metals that were fused together with heat and pressure as opposed to visible bolts so it would be less bulky and embarrassing for her little goldblooded friend. She had no idea why she felt so drawn to their recklessness in particular; she had seen many come and go, but they struck her as... different.

Not in a bad way, though. She had been able to find their Trainee File on Goregle, and discern who they were because of their horns. Dietas Lambda. Interestingly, they were labelled as 'culled', despite being with Itoria. She was glad to see that she'd been able to remotely modify the cameras and the facilities' entire database so the training ships flying overhead wouldn't pick her up in their radars as a instructor off-course. She knew that the ceruleans were able to track the trolls under their guide with remarkable precision, but they sent out drone-like scouting ships to round up drifting trolls or direct them, with no ill intent as far as she was concerned. All missing goldbloods were changed in the databases to 'culled' after a period of a human week.

Humming quietly to herself, Itoria busied herself with finding a lens that was the right violet colour to substitute for the troll's lost eye. Upon finding it and placing it on the worktable, she returned to the room in which Dietas lay, feeling their forehead to see if they were out cold. Unluckily enough, they were warmer to the touch and seemed on the verge of waking. The indigoblood walked to the 'hunger trunk' and retrieved her Faygo, filling the syringe with it and injecting that into Dietas' arm. Acknowledging that it was awful and immoral to effectively drug the other to sleep, she grimaced and fled back to the workshop. It would weigh heavily on her mind, but it was necessary. The only way she could get them through the process of re-fitting without pain was to keep them sedated however possible.

She muttered to herself as she worked on the interior mechanisms of the headpiece, her unusually small hands - considering the build of many Sagittarians - assisting her in fitting the wires to it. She planned for an infrared lens, so that Dietas would be able to see normally through their left eye and detect heat signatures with the other. It was gruelling work, though, as she also had to build the necessary chips, circuits and electronic additives to allow for her vision to come to fruition. Feeling a sudden boost in her confidence, Itoria smiled to herself. Everything was going to be okay. If she kept her head down and worked steadily for another few days, the goldblood would be indebted to her. That wasn't what she wanted, though. All she desired was a companion, and she'd hopefully get one.

After five days of tireless work, during which she only rested in a temporary recuperacoon she had in her workshop, the headpiece was finally finished. If all went according to plan, Dietas would be able to subconsciously meld the wires into their ocular nerve endings via psionics, at which point their vision would be restored in that eye. She slotted the headpiece back into the mould that had completely dried to make sure it was the right size once more before nodding to herself. For the first time in what felt like an entire sweep, she exited the workshop, headpiece in her claws. She hoped sincerely that Dietas would like it, though only its functionality truly mattered in the grand scheme of things.

On the other side of things, Dietas had awoken from their haze, and found that the pain in their body had lessened dramatically. They were still in agony, horribly nauseous, but it was a marked improvement to when they would blur in and out of consciousness due to the pain. They learnt not to move, lest Itoria catch them at it and scold them for it. They felt terribly woozy, feeling simultaneously hungover and drunk still from the two bottles' worth of Faygo and additional anaesthetics coursing through them. With a groan of irritation, they turned their head towards the footsteps that they no longer feared. Somehow, they had managed to avoid opening their one functioning eye, and the darkness didn't scare them so much any more.

Miss Aprein - Itoria, that was - had told them that they would be getting a gift, but not why or what it was. Her voice rang out, and hearing their own name from the Sagiun's mouth was a shock, but not bad. She hadn't raised her voice when speaking to them like many of their friends had developed a habit of doing, and it was soothing. More than anything, and any before her, she made them feel safer. They could almost see themselves as her moirail, strangely enough.

"△h, Dietas! I w△s wOndering when yOu'd △w△ken. HOw dO yOu feel? Can I give yOu yOur gift?"

Dietas simply shrugged and then nodded, not having the energy to speak. They were debilitatingly tired, despite the sedation. There was nothing they wanted to do but sleep until their troubles were gone, but their own recuperacoon was far away. Nothing felt quite real any more, because they were so lost. Their only hope was Itoria, and she didn't seem to realise how exactly they felt about the whole situation. It wasn't like they had the words to describe it, anyway, nor the breath in their lungs to speak them.

Itoria came up to Dietas, nimble fingers gently placing the headpiece down into its position. She retreated afterwards, but watched carefully to see the other's reaction and make sure they weren't being hurt by it.

"HOw dOes it feel nOw? It shOuld be prOperly △djusted to your head, but do tell me if △nything is wrong △nd I will fix it immedi△tely."

After a few moments, the goldblood opened their eyes - one old and one new - to gaze at their surroundings in awe. With a fizzling noise and a grinding of teeth, it was clear that Dietas had allowed their psionics to flow through the headpiece, the metal directing it to their nerves and allowing the connections to be established. They stood and looked directly at their carer, who turned out to be the same age as them - roughly 9 sweeps or 19 human years - old. A grin split their features for the first time in an aeon, and they spoke in a tone that conveyed 9 sweeps of suppressed joy, let out all at once in an explosion of colour.

"It's like I'm seeing the wx0xrld in a whx0xle new light."

[me-and-my-gaster]

Homestuck hot take! (that we've discussed before) Feferi is a thousand times worse as a person as Vriska.

I mean...

Yeah XD I know what you mean by that.

Vriska has a lot of reasons (not justifications, just reasons) for her personality and behavior to be Like That. She’s by all means not a good person but at least we kinda know where she comes from with a lot of her bullshit. Abusive lusus, loneliness, escaping into daydreaming, being too immature to separate the ‘fiction’ from real life, no actual consequences that might change her approach, being a victim of the very shitty way Alternia brings up children as a whole. She’s still not a good person, but we SEE WHY.

Feferi is... uh... Just spoiled, I guess. And self-centered, and condescending and patronizing. She doesn’t see she does things wrong, she’s never called out on this, she’s just pushing her own ideas on other people - which is shown basically at the beginning with how she locks up the sea creatures in cages “for their own good” and is quite a good reflection of how the Beforus culling system looked like (you’ll see, tho it’s just mentioned). I know there’s a looming threat of fighting with the Condesce over her and she has to feed the GlubGlub (WITH ERIDAN’S HELP, FFS!!!!) but I can hardly sympathize with her at all.

I’m still not over what she did to Eridan (tho I won’t say she deserved her fate on the meteor) and how she treated Sollux for that short period of time we saw them together in that goddamn horn pile. She’s likable for other people tho, because she’s bubbly and cheerful and pretty and nice, while Vriska is That Bitch most of the time. 

Just... keep her away from ‘taking care’ of people until she’s mature enough to see what other people actually need and what she thinks they do is never the same. GET A GRIP, LADY.

[nekropsii]

Since I've been thinking about this recently, what do you think it would have been like if kankri (and by extension the rest of the alpha trolls) had grown up on modern alternia? (Obviously we know what it was like for them to grow up in primitive(?) Alternia, but tbh the ancestors never really felt all that connected to the dancestors and I'm pretty sure the connection was an afterthought)

Interesting question! I’ll be largely focusing on Kankri here, since he’s the crux of the question. Putting this under the cut for its length.

T L;DR: Completely, utterly, irrecognizably different.

Content Warning: Mentions of Ableism, Classism, and Eugenics.

The social and political functions of Alternia, versus those of Beforus, is an interesting beast to study and speculate upon. It’s not one I see get acknowledged as frequently as I’d, personally, enjoy to see, and oftentimes when it is, it’s a fleeting one. Heavily watered down statements are made either in lack of understanding or for sake of brevity.

The first thing we need to address is this: Beforus is not a kind society.

Beforus isn’t a “nicer Alternia,” not by any means- that’s a misconception that I feel plagues analytical work surrounding the topic of the Beforans, and why they behave the way they do. The biggest change we need to keep in mind is the differences in Alternia’s definition of Culling, versus that of Beforus’s.

Culling, on Alternia, is defined by the legal killing those deemed undesirable for any reason. It is, to put it incredibly briefly, a form of violent eugenics. A prime example would be the murdering of mutantbloods- something touched upon rather heavily in Homestuck proper, due to it being the main source of Karkat’s natural state of hypervigilance. This definition, interestingly, is very much so marked by the classpect of their planet’s matriarchal dictator- Her Imperious Condescension, Thief of Life.

Culling, on Beforus, is defined by, essentially, the aggressive over-coddling of those deemed unfit to care for themselves for any reason. It’s steeped in a self-fallatingly progressive form of ableism and classism, and the parallels to how disabled people- especially autistics and the physically disabled- are “handled” in real life by people often claiming to be passionate allies are jarring.

Highbloods- rather than openly asserting their superiority by just straight up killing you, or doing the verbal equivalent of spitting in your eyes for being lesser- take on the roles of helicopter parents. They assume, automatically, that since they are highbloods and, say, people like Kankri- a mutant limeblood- aren’t, that they, by virtue of being a highblood, know better than the person they’ve deemed lesser than them do on matters of the self; On what they want, and what they need, and vigorously infantilize them at every step and turn. This is, interestingly, marked by the classpect of their matriarchal ruler- Feferi Peixes, Witch of Life.

These are two vastly different systems. They’re vastly different societies, and they function under vastly different social rules. I stated in a previous essay that a primary difference between the socialization of Beforan trolls versus that of Alternian trolls is a matter of Honest Eusociality vs. Dishonest Solitude.

Trolls are Eusocial Insects, and Beforan + Alternian trolls are not different species- they’re the same exact thing, except Beforus is honest about the Eusociality of their species, while Alternia beats it out of them and forces them into behaving like a Solitary species. It’s an important clarification to make here.

Kankri is used to the Honest Eusociality of Beforus, as well as it’s definition of Culling. While he does hold a significant amount of disdain for people assuming the role of a helicopter parent around him, it’s what he’s used to, what he grew up around, and it deeply affects him as a person. It affects his interactions with people, politics, and his environment. It’s why he’s so socially clueless, why he’s so comfortable sporting his blood color, and why he’s so blind to real world issues.

It’s because he can afford to do all these things, and be all these things.

He wouldn’t have this luxury on Alternia. As I said, this is a Eusocial species forced to behave as Solitary insects. It’s a violent society. Bloodshed is routine, death is expected, mourning is an abnormality. Friend is the same word as enemy, and love is the same word as pity. Kindness is whipped out of you. If you don’t fit the mold, you’re hunted for sport.

Kankri would have zero room for casual pride in his blood color. It would get him literally killed. He wouldn’t be capable of his trademark level of social unawareness. It would get him killed. He’d be granted with Karkat’s hypervigilance and paranoia by virtue of existing as flawed in a brutally cruel environment. He’d be hemoanonymous for sure. That much is unavoidable.

And he’s not going to be a modern rendition of The Signless- the key component to the equation to who The Signless is, and why he does what he does is not just an innate heroic nature. The Signless was the was he was because of the familial love and mercy of The Dolorosa amongst the extreme brutality of the rest of the world. The Dolorosa was his starting point. Modern Alternian Kankri would not have that.

Yes, Porrim would still be there in this scenario- but assuming the same set-up as the Beta/Alpha trolls is taking place, where they’re all the same age, it wouldn’t be the same as raising him. It’s not a replication of motherhood in a society where that form of love had never existed before, it’s just a mom friend.

As for how I think his traits would change… This is far less analytical, and more so just opinions.

He’d still be a bootlicker, though this time his efforts towards having good relationships with highbloods is an act of self preservation.

Still wordy, just less up his own ass; probably better at detecting when to stop, due to the climate.

Anxious. This is unavoidable.

Perhaps his online brain rot is a result of some form of agoraphobia- Leaving the house is dangerous. The home is a perfect safe place. Why bother going out?

Would definitely have gotten culled Alternia-style if it weren’t for the session.

Though, I must admit… I’m not the best at thoroughly envisioning concepts of “What if (X Character) was Alternian,” Alternian lore is not my expertise… I picked my niche and gunned for it hard. I’m the Beforan lore guy, lol.

At the very least, I do hope this did something for you… It really just turned into me comparing Alternian and Beforan societies, but I feel like making those comparisons helps make an outline for others to build their own concepts off of. That’s a much more nice and exciting concept for me than just plainly saying my opinion on it!

(… Plus… Brain full of Earth-C edition Alpha Trolls. Hehe.)

[irninfidel]

so i think beforus definitely kind of traps culled trolls in this cycle of not teaching/knowing. i’ve mentioned this before--kankri’s cullers assume he can’t do anything, so he never gets taught, which means he can’t do anything. for example, laundry--i can guarantee that kankri doesn’t know how to do laundry. he can kind of do it, but handmade clothing? whites? etc etc? absolutely not. and when the game first started, he def didn’t know how to do any of it.

kankri himself has a lot of trouble getting out of that cycle, because he doesn’t want to ask for help and let everyone know that he needs that help. he’s also very aware that no one else really got taught--i can’t imagine very many lusi are like “here let me teach you how to do laundry.” other trolls either looked it up or just did things until they figured out what worked--but now kankri’s 6 sweeps, and he’s never had the opportunity to do so, but everyone else here at least knows how to get the laundry done.

it isn’t that kankri isn’t willing to learn, he just doesn’t want anyone else to know he needs to learn. and then he gets frustrated that he’s struggling with what he thinks should be a basic, common sense task, so he quits trying, and so forth, even though he knows it wouldn’t be an issue if he just asked someone how to do things. some other examples of things he struggles with would be like...basic first aid, basic cooking, etc

[happelei]

Fic: Kurloz; backstory on Beforus

For @clown-fest, Day 5: Hobbies and Abilities. (actually on time!!)

Dear, sweet Kurloz had some dear, sweet hobbies back on Beforus while growing up. (Some might disagree.) Then SGrub gave him a new one.

Very brief mention of gore. 730 words.

Fishing is a great excuse to have the people around you shut up and leave you the hell be--Sir, it’s only that you’re scaring the fish off, and their presence is why I aim to be cultivating a hush.

Kurloz got skilled. Diving from the deck of his guidance counculler’s ship with the merest splash, kicks as powerful or delicate with his pull-on flippers as the situation required, and his teeth flashing at the last second to tear through scales. Sometimes fur and blubber, too – but the associations of that feeling were unpleasant, and if he came back up more aggrieved than he went down, he’d get blessed with question of whether or not he was like unto a panfried moron trying to swim around and look for his lusus. Again.

Rufioh and Damara up and dropped him tips on how to fish from land with rod and line and hook, and on traversing forest glades with some assurance of safety.

From there Kurloz found his own way to some fine secret spots, and kept unquestioned peace within them.

Puzzle games are a powerful thing. Which sounds dumb. But a brother can indeed have a weakness, however much he may protest paring himself down to none at all, and so too the games can be beyond addictive to the point of being a practical hypnosis.

Being sly and smart was so wholly natural, was all.

At that point was where Mituna’s mouth came in handy. That headset of his let him hack into audio devices faster than any troll ought to have capability off, and next thing Kurloz would know was that he’d be invited to a different type of game via trash talk injected into his speakers or headphones at top volume. Add to that how it usually got rude enough to set a bi-cyclops howling in stereo, and that did go lengths to snapping a guy out of a gaming binge.

Bugging Meenah is real god damned easy.

So it shouldn’t be much fun, picking out the lines along which superiority and vulnerability would crack on her and thus crack Kurloz the motherfuck up. But it really was.

Besides, somebody who lit off to the moon when they got a lick of unsettlement in their pump biscuit needed to be kept sharp some way. For the fact that she could escape so far and none other could – probably she deserved it, too.

A seething pit of rage digs itself.

Yet catharsis came upon Kurloz when he stuck his own pick down in it. Kankri had a whole tar pit held back behind his teeth. It cost coaxing to get him fumbling for the words on what bubbled deep inside; Kurloz had to expend babble on all manner of things before some incident would set the tar a-gush and a-flame all at once. A comment from a counculler, a mention of Kurloz’s own mandated training to take a culling position.

It always petered out in due course, and he figured it was a good deed for leaving Kankri more thoughtful and honed on his arguments. Mostly, listening to someone longing and desiring to put a tear in the world felt like feasting.

The Game, and staying alive within it, does not exactly count as a new hobby for anyone. It takes up all available time for itself ... until you learned, within its reach. And within what was in reach of it.

Kurloz was blessed with knowledge enough to realise how little he knew. And how it was much more than any other knew. Any name and face and soul that was close to his own. They had nothing much real with them at all. So said the dream. So said the Angel.

For a mirthless, ascendant second of a long night, Kurloz thought that his first new hobby since entering the game was chewing.

In time, long after his tongue was gone, he smiled to himself as he realised another secret truth. Meulin and the others forgave him for the things he did, and as was righteous, his new hobby was penance. They’d been alongside him in many ways, for more things than he could easily bring to mind. They deserved that much, despite all they could not bring themselves to uncover.