#it’s been obvious since season two that will has a thing for mike and mike doesn’t share those feelings that’s not queerbaiting

[pinkeoni]

Will is Going to Die by Sacrificing Himself

...and come back to life. To me, it seems pretty obvious, but I'll explain why.

Will has been characterized as someone who puts others before himself since season one, even if it means costing him his life. The entire series starts off with Will casting fireball instead of protection during their Dungeons & Dragons game, putting his character in danger for the sake of the rest of the party.

This self-sacrificial nature is echoed in season two, but two a much more extreme end, when Will instructs everyone to close the gate to stop the Mind Flayer, despite knowing that doing so will kill him.

While we don't see this same self-sacrifice from Will in seasons three and four, we do see two related characters make their own sacrifices, possibly hinting at Will's future fate.

First we have the other character named William, Billy, sacrifice himself at the end of season three in order to stop the meat flayer.

Then in season four, we have Eddie sacrifice himself while the same song that played for Will after he came back to life in season one plays in the background— "When It's Cold I'd Like to Die" by Moby.

There are also little ways that we are told/shown of Will's selfless nature, such as giving a girl his tonka truck because she was sad, or giving Mike his painting under El's name. While this trait could be seen as admirable, I think it will ultimately be his undoing.

But why would Will need to sacrifice himself?

Well, we know that despite all of this time, Will still holds a connection to Vecna, and likely to the Mind Flayer and the Upside Down himself. Putting a stop to all of these things is going to be intrinsic to Will's arc next season.

I don't know how many people know about Noah's letterboxd, but he has been rewatching the Harry Potter movies.

Perhaps for personal enjoyment, or perhaps to study for his character?

The comparisons between Will/Vecna and Harry/Voldemort have been made before, and the Duffers are derivative of other sources if anything.

I think that this could be likened to a horcrux situation. At the end of season four, we saw Vecna be totally flambéd by the older teens, and yet, he's still kicking, and Will is the one to tell us this.

If the brain dies the body dies, but also, could the brain latch on to another body in order to keep it alive? Similar to how Harry had to die so that Voldemort could be defeated, I believe Will might have to die (at least temporarily) in order to take down Vecna/MF/UD.

We know that the show is bringing back "Should I Stay or Should I Go," which is going to prompt an important question that Will needs to find the answer to, should he stay or should he go? While this could also relate to his romantic endeavors for the season, I think that the song could be alluding to Will's choice to sacrifice himself in order to save everyone else.

What I think will probably happen is this: At some point in the season, Will is going to learn what has to happen, and he is going to go off to sacrifice himself without telling anyone so no one can stop him. (I'm guessing that Will can't just off himself, there's probably a specific way that it needs to be done).

Something I realized while making this post is that Mike is always the one who figures out what needs to be done, or brings up Will's sacrifice to others. My guess is that Mike is going to find out what Will is up to, and try to stop him. Emphasis on try, because I think this death is inevitable. However, bringing the show back full circle to season one (and because ST can never keep a main character dead), he will come back to life.

[eddiemunsonbrainrot]

The Importance of the Tiger Pride poster on the season 5 bts video

I’m slightly insane so I spent 2 hours this afternoon analysing the entire video, and this tiger pride photo caught my eye as a little detail no one has mentioned. This may be a bit of a reach BUT the stranger things crew repeatedly show how important even tiny parts of the set are to this character.

The tiger pride poster is obviously in support of the Hawkins tigers, and what is drawn on there is a paw print. But I don’t know if it’s just me but I think that’s an odd way of drawing a paw print. The pad isn’t the right shape (on the poster it more looks like a heart) and the toes are too thin. Here is the poster, then what a tiger paw print should look like. I know they’re a bunch of high schoolers who have made this poster, but this feels like deliberate foreshadowing.

Keep the heart shape in mind.

Additionally, the paw print is coloured in red, which seems an odd choice. The tiger colours are orange and green, literally shown behind the poster, so it would make sense if it was either of those colours. So if we flip it upside, it actually looks like a red bleeding heart.

And you know where we have seen a very important red heart before - on Mike’s shield on Will’s painting

There are many reasons this heart could be included.

I think including this little detail ultimately ties together the importance of the painting to everything Mike does this season, and how it is essential in everything he does, if it is showing up in insignificant places like a poster at school.

However, since the heart is bleeding it could also suggest that Mike gets hurt, or alternatively, his shield gets damaged. We know that he has been building up an emotional shield/guard for the past two seasons, so this could go show that this season this is broken down and he is finally truthful to himself. He stops trying to push Will away, and push his feelings for him aside. Furthermore, to have a bleeding heart means to be a softhearted person, which reinforces the idea of Mike opening up this season.

It could also suggest that since Mike is protecting the whole party with his shield that he fails to save everyone and feels like it is his fault. I think the obvious candidate here is Will, since he is undeniably the person Mike cares most about in the party. I think this links well to the theory that since each season starts with Mike being late to something, he will be too late in saving someone (or so he thinks)

Just some fun little thoughts, let me know what you think.

TL,DR: Mike will be EMOTIONAL this season

[lucystark12]

how to convince the ga that byler isn't rushed (kind of just a rant about lettergate)

they need to and i mean NEED to vecna mike because the only way the ga will understand that byler has been built up since the beginning is if we’re given scenes in context. we as bylers obviously get it but byler is at risk of being labeled “too rushed” if they don’t put effort into referencing the important parts of mike’s feelings developing.

the audience doesn't really have a problem with believing that will is gay and in love with mike because there are things in his arc that are just obvious and clearly point to that.

but mike on the other hand is in the middle of a love triangle. unlike most of the other main characters, mike isn't open about his feelings. we don't get his internal monologue. he doesn't tell others how he's feeling. thats why its so easy for bylers and milevens alike to interpret his every move in either direction. it's purely because we don't know. so, in season five, there are things they have to address and give concrete meaning to so that people understand how byler actually does make sense.

the most important scene that i’ve already kinda talked about to do this is...

this one, obviously, the most important little part of all of byler's season three. i want vecna talking about this. i want mike thinking about this. it’s crucial. it’s essential. his behavior here is weird as hell! it even reads weirdly in a script that was released and then edited quickly after. it's important and it needs to be addressed and treated as such. in the script (forgive me if i'm off, i don't have a copy of it so this is from memory) it reads as "what's wrong with me?" that obviously points our way, but since we don't get his internal monologue there's no way to be sure. it needs to be addressed.

this is also kinda lettergate proof because i think the unsent letters and the fact that mike did try to call will also be essential to proving what was going on with him during the gap between season three and four. if i were in charge of the show, i would do a whole flashback sequence to these six months. i want to know exactly where he is, what he’s doing, what he's thinking, how the people around him are reacting to his behavior. we need a shot of the love, mike. it's SO IMPORTANT.

literally i could scream about how important (and likely) lettergate is.

one thing that REALLY scares me about lettergate is the possibility of them reddieying us. yes that is now a verb. for any of you who never had an it 2017 phase, reddieying is where richie and eddie, two characters, had feelings for each other but never admitted it. at the end of the movie after eddie dies, we get this scene:

this is what i like to call reddieying. and yes that is also finn wolfhard. this is why we are scared.

the letters could be used in a VERY similar way if either mike or will dies to express the love that they both once had for each other. closure of sorts. i think that would be VERY poor writing (we've all heard my theory about how mike's love for will is literally essential to the ending of the show) but i think it's highly possible especially given the overlap between it and stranger thing's fandoms. the letters could be read at the end in a similar way to the way hopper's was, sad heroes and all. this draws another parallel.

yes i am bringing newtmas into this. fuck you.

above is a letter written by newt from the maze runner to thomas. newt is confirmed gay by the author of the book, and this letter is written to thomas but never read by him until newt dies. letterboxd reviews of this movie read:

"that letter at the end was the gayest thing I’ve ever witnessed and I’ve seen call me by your name."

"homophobia is thomas reading newt’s declaration of love and the shot cutting to thomas scratching his ex’s name into the rock ABOVE newt’s"

"newt, to thomas: "and i remember you. [...] i knew i would follow you anywhere. and i have." me: *im ready to be queerbaited again meme*"

and i didn't even have to search for these. these were like the top couple reviews of the movie. they were all on the first page of reviews.

all i'm saying is, by having the letter be an idea in our minds, they've set up a way to kill off one of the characters and still have a slightly resolved, weirdly up to interpretation ending. i do still think it's poor writing. i could kind of go into that too if anybody is interested.

i think that if lettergate is used as a device during mike's flashbacks to show how long he's felt this way that they will be using this thing they've set up for good, however, if they newtmas us and reddie us i might die. just letting you know.

[chronicoverthinker]

Okay but like can we talk about how this tweet :

Shawn Levy talks about Stranger Things 5

“I’m going to direct a later episode.

People talk about mythology and The Upside Down, and all that is huge, but the magic of S5 are the characters who find sense of belonging with other and through that connection, become heroes”

It’s definitely about Mike and Will

I don’t know if you guys remember , but not too long ago somebody posted a comic book page about Mike and Nancy. In said page Mike was talking about the story and how it should end with Will being able to fight back , to be a hero as well and get his own justice.

We also know that ep 7 is probably going to be called the Paladin and the Cleric so adding two and two together it’s pretty obvious to me that Shawn Levy here is hinting at a scene specifically between Mike and Will.

And I think it will definitely be their finally much needed heart to heart. A serious one , where none of them are going to hide anything from the other. Especially considering it’s the second to last episode , we do not know how everybody’s condition is and how hard they’ve been fighting to defeat vecna. I do not know what kind of confession on Mike’side it will be , but it’s clearly going to be huge for Will ,making him feel like he finally belongs as well.

I believe this to be the case to parallel Mike’s confession in s4 , and show us that it’s going to be his love that will make Will strong enough to fight back and finally break this cycle of hatred and abuse created by Henry. Because I truly believe this to be one of the main points of the show.

Ever since season 4 we’ve seen how Vecna has targeted mentally weak people , forcing them to witness horrific visions about their deepest fears and traumatic experiences. He is a perpetrator of the abuse because he was abused as well. Mind you we’re finally going to discover why Henry decided to target Will as well , why was he the first choice ? Possibly because he saw himself in him , who knows. But even tho they may share similarities , what sets them apart is Will’s incredible resilience and kindness. And with the love of the people he cares for is going to make a difference.

He’ll finally become the hero e deserves to be :)

[thebylertheory]

One thing that always makes me tilt my head in confusion is when someone says M*leven have been together for 4 seasons because...have we watched the same show? No they haven't lol.

If you really look at the timeline of Mike and El's relationship, you will see that they actually have not been a couple for that long. They have less episodes together as a couple than Jancy does. They kissed and got together in the last 5 minutes of season 2. Then they broke up after one episode in season 3 and didn't get back together until, again, the last couple of minutes of the season. And then they had a dubious break up in season 4 during the second episode where no one was sure if they were even still together or not. And then Mike "confessed his love" during the last episode and they didn't talk to each other once after the fact. We're still not sure by the end of season 4 if they are even really together or not because they didn't speak to each other to acknowledge any of the issues they're having or Mike's monologue.

So, the total amount of episodes where they are a confirmed on screen couple is about two and a half, give or take some minutes. Two and a half-ish episodes out of 4 seasons. And you guys expect me to believe they're supposed to be the main "it" couple? Not going to happen.

And this is why it's funny to me when people say they won't break M*leven up after all this time and make Byler canon. Like babe, they have already spent more time broken up than they have spent as an actual couple. And when we HAVE seen them as a couple on screen, they're almost tearing apart the party or they're lying to each other and making each other feel like crap. I think it's totally plausible for the Duffers to break them up for good and go through with Byler, which they HAVE been building up since season 2 whether you want to admit that or not.

It has just become glaringly obvious to me that a lot of M*levens don't actually pay attention when they're watching the show.

[byersfolklore]

thinking about how “let’s start a new party, you and me” is 1000000% a byler line in season 5.

- the party quite literally started with mike and will.

- there is LITERALLY a paladin and cleric on the cover of that book that they chose to tweet along with that line?? ( mike being paladin and will being cleric is canon )

- mike and will’s conversation by the end of season 3 being “what if you wanna join another party?” “not possible”

- mike and will are literally the only two characters who talk like this to each other 😭

the fact that it’s a line that HAS to be in season 5 since it obviously wasn’t said yet, and was clearly planned ahead since the tweet was made in 2019…. byler happy ending has BEEN PLANNED. also, thinking about how they said they already have the last 20 mins of the show mapped out….

this 100% seems like it could be said in the last 20 mins of the show for a happy ending between will and mike’s characters specifically. it would be beautiful… and david harbour has quite literally described the finale of stranger things to be a “beautiful ending”

by the way, it’s obvious that will considers his happy ending to be playing D&D with mike for the rest of his life. he canonically wants that. it’s such a byler line

[starbylers]

Can we talk about how Mike ‘not being able to say he loves El because he’s scared she won’t need him one day’ makes no sense when you consider that for Mike this conflict spans two whole seasons, and there needs to be a consistent character motivation throughout.

Mike struggling to tell El he loves her has been, on the surface, his main conflict since s3.

In season 3, after blurting out he loves El, Mike brings it up again at the store. He tries desperately to get his point across, to make El understand ('I've never felt like this before', 'blank makes you crazy, like the word'). But no-one can deny that in this scene Mike is doing everything he can to avoid actually saying love. Now, what is the Mlvn excuse for this again? 'He's not good at expressing his emotions’. That's their running narrative post s3. (Let's ignore how that's not even canonically true of Mike's character and continue).

We come to season 4, and Mike is still chronically unable to use the word love, even when speaking about El and not to her. (Like this is clearly a deeply ingrained thing but I digress). Pre vol. 2, the Mlvn excuses are still related to Mike basically being emotionally unintelligent (his parents, his age, blah blah). But when Mike himself finally reveals the big reason, it's...'I didn't want to tell you I loved you because I was scared you won't need me one day'? Okay. Theoretically, out of context, that could make sense. So this becomes the new Mlvn narrative.

Here's the problem: both of these things cannot be the root cause of the same issue. It's one or the other: either he can’t say he loves her because he’s bad at expressing feelings, or he’s scared El one day not needing him would hurt more. This two-season dilemma is part of one series-long character arc for Mike. Mike in s4 is the same person with the same struggles as Mike in s3. Whatever his motivation for avoiding it in s3 (which was never addressed, it’s not like we got closure for that and then they just came up with a new reason he can’t say it) must logically be consistent continuing into s4.

Can anyone seriously tell me that Mike, here in this scene, was struggling to say the word 'love' because he was 'scared one day El wouldn't need him':

No. Of course not. He was specifically avoiding the word, and the most plausible explanation for his aversion (if we're ignoring Byler) is that Mike's just a kid and love is a big scary word. Bad at emotions etc. Which is why Mlvns and GA subscribed to that narrative, it seems obvious. But it cannot be right because Mike reveals the 'true reason' in 4x09. This is the canon explanation, finally—he's been scared she eventually won't need him. Except, that cannot be right either, because that reasoning does not align with his obvious (again, ignoring Byler) s3 motivation (love being daunting for a young teen) for the exact same behaviour. Like he literally uses the exact same pattern of avoidant wording from s3 in s4 (‘I care for you so much') and like I’ve said this is all meant to be one singular, overarching conflict.

If the initial 'bad at feelings' reading of Mike was correct, you'd expect the monologue to be more along the lines of 'I find it really difficult to express myself but I do truly love you, so this is me being vulnerable and brave'. Personally, I would've somewhat bought that. As a Byler I would've been like okay, it's kind of boring cliché storytelling but I'll admit defeat. But that’s not what happens. Basically what I’m getting at is:

Neither of these explanations can account for Mike’s inability to tell El he loves her in both seasons, so then by the logic of Mike having consistent motivations, neither can be true.

Which leads to the conclusion that there must be a different, all-encompassing, underlying cause for his heavy avoidance. Something that connects all the dots. I wonder what that could possibly be.

[alcalystrasz]

(This has been said a lot but idc)

He loses his bestfriend, he's destroyed and he cries because he thinks he's dead and he's going to blame himself because he'll think it's his fault. The song in the background is Heroes. And the lyrics, at this precise moment are:

"And we kissed, as though nothing could fall. And the shame, [changing to Joyce and Jonathan] the shame was on the other side."

Which is a clear queer coding. That means that Mike and Will kissed (= spent time together, very close) as though nothing could fall (= nothing could go wrong), and the shame (= of being gay) was on the other side (= the Upside Down, where Will is. Because he's the obvious gay one). And it changed to Joyce and Jonathan because they're Will's family.

And now, let's skip to Season 3:

This hug, from end of season 3 is a clear parallel of the first one we saw on season 1. His face isn't obviously the same. In season 1, we can see he's sad, crying and he hugs his mom desperately. But season 3, shows a confused, emotionless Mike who hugs his mother like he's in shock. Why's that? Well...

The parallel is to show Mike's feelings. In the end of season 3, when El kisses Mike, his eyes are wide open, he doesn't move and when she's done and leaves he doesn't move, instead he looks on the side with a super confused and shocked face. And in the original script (sorry couldn't find it), we saw that Mike's reaction was like this because it was written:

What is wrong with me?

So it was meant for him to be that way (and btw Finn played it well). And then, when Hopper reads his letter to El, we can hear his voice with scenes showing up. And when he says:

"And if I'm being really honest, I don't want things to change."

Mike looks back at Will's house before leaving with his bike.

This is a lowkey queer coding. Change is the liking boys realization from Mike's side. And why Hopper says "I don't want things to change" ? Because the change means the behavior change for Mike. He'll feel like a mistake, just like Will, he'll feel different, incapable of liking a girl like every other boys his age...

So what I'm trying to say is. That these two scenes are parallels to show Mike's improvement and changement over the seasons. Season 1 he was sad because of the loss of his bestfriend. But why would we only see Mike's POV and not Dustin's or Lucas' ? They also cared about Will. No, we only see Mike's because he's Will's love interest. And in Season 3 we see a total confused Mike hugging his mother, trying to understand what happened. Because what happened is that he understood, he finally admitted he was in love with Will. Why's that? Well, first he's confused by El's I love you, and kiss. Then he looks back at Will's house, knowing he just left. And finally he hugs his mom trying to figure out what's wrong with him. Cause he thinks there's something wrong with him, as seen in the script (try to find it yourself, cause I couldn't. But I remember sawing it on Twitter 'X' !). And it's even more possible because Mike's introduction in season 4, has a lot of queer coding. I'll try to list them all.

Rainbows on the letter (= signifies lgbtq+), One Way arrow pointing to an open closet (= one way arrow -> "only possible thing/explanation", open closet -> he's out to himself), Poster with a naked Dragon (= just like Steve or Billy, straight boys, have, almost naked women, on their walls, Mike has almost naked character, men and animals from dnd), poster from a movie with an almost naked man (= to understand he likes them naked, just a gay thing I guess ;-;). For this last point, yes there's also a woman almost naked, however since the movie is about men, being way superior to women (that's the movie don't blame me, and I can't remember its name, sorry), I'm not sure he'd really want to have this woman in particular in his room.

Also there's one of Will's binder under his bed, the same one where there are tons of his drawings and finally, I'd like to end up with Mike literally destroying El's letter when Nancy tells him he's late (who does that?). So yeah that's all I could find, there's probably more, which needs more attention and analysis but I did the minimum let's say.

So all of this, to say that season 1 and 3 hugs were parallels of Mike's feelings, and that the season 3's is more possible when we notice the character introduction of Mike in season 4. So yeah, he really had a Gay realization over there!

[mikesbasementbeets]

this is gonna be long, but i want to explain why i think mike wheeler is gay

we all know mike is queer, i'm not gonna try to prove that he wants to kiss boys (because duh), i want to look at the things that indicate mike is specifically gay, not bi - the relevant difference being, in mike's case, attraction to women. in my opinion, the show is full of evidence that points to mike's specific brand of queerness being not only attraction to men but also lack of attraction to women. (which is why i'm writing this, i just think there's so much textually in the show that backs it up) i'm mostly going to focus on his dynamic with el, but i want to make it really clear first that i love el, and i believe mike really does love el too, just not in the way he thinks he should. his arc is about realizing that the love he feels for el is not romantic (while the love he feels for will is).

romantic ambivalence towards el

this has been rehashed so much since the season 4 monologue, but the way mike talks about el when they first find her in the woods, about sending her back to the asylum, handing her over to mike's parents, and getting her out of the way so they could focus on will, and then later calling her a weapon and using her to find will... this is not love. obviously

he starts feeling protective over her when she confides in him that she's in real danger - mike is naturally protective, he’s the paladin of the group, and because she's under his care, he feels responsible for her safety, defending her even from dustin and lucas. he develops a bond with her. however... nothing about this is romantic. the duffers compare their relationship dynamic this season to elliot and E.T., but alongside mike, the audience is told (by everyone except mike himself... he can never seem to get the words out. more on that later) that mike likes eleven... so we start to believe it

there are so many analyses of mike being the one targeted by the homophobic bullies (and we know why - mike is queer). but more than that, the very first time the idea of mike and eleven as a romantic pair is introduced in the show, the scene is interrupted by the homophobes. while lucas is imitating mike professing his love to eleven, troy show ups and starts talking about will, using homophobic language to provoke the party, particularly mike, and then tripping mike as he tries to get away from them. it's the juxtaposition of these two ideas: mike being teased by his friends for possibly liking el vs. mike facing homophobic bullying

anyway, before the bullies show up, when Lucas starts teasing mike about the way he's been acting with el, mike doesn't get it (and he continues not to get it throughout the series... this is a theme), and lucas has to spell it out for him. it's so obvious mike, you like her.

a few episodes later though, lucas actually calls bullshit on himself -

"you like that a girl's not grossed out by you."

it's not that either of them actually like each other but, as lucas says, and as is repeated by mike and others several times, "she's like a stray dog." they're both using each other, mike to find will, and el for safety and protection (not that this is necessarily bad on either of their parts, it's just not romantic)

later, almost immediately after finding out about el, nancy asks mike if he likes her. (a boy and a girl? oh, they must like each other.) mike's response is a very adamant "ew, no, gross."

this scene is interesting to me because you could take it several ways: nancy lies about not liking jonathan, so then mike lies about not liking eleven... (which is still fine, he may think he does at this point) but i actually think it's more than that. season 3 shows us a mike that associates growing up with liking girls. and before eleven, mike hasn't ever liked a girl. at this point, he's still in the mindset that it's okay for him to not like girls "yet." and if he tells the truth so vehemently that nancy must think he's lying... he's probably ok with that (lucas is right, he likes that a girl's not grossed out by him... and he likes the idea of other people thinking that too... maybe it makes him feel like he's growing up, or like other people think he's growing up. idk though that's just speculation).

soon after this scene with nancy is the scene where mike tells el that when this is all over, she can move into his house and his parents will take care of her. genuinely... he was imagining his family adopting her... his sister would be her sister, his parents would be her parents, she could even have his old bedroom

and then she asks if that means he would be her brother... and he realizes something's not right (honestly though i don't think he even understands where it went wrong at this point).

he was feeling a protective big brother type of love for this scared, lost kid he found in the woods, but when everyone started assuming he "liked" her, it all started getting confused in his head. he assumes he must like her, because he's been conditioned his whole life to think that's just what happens (it's classic comp het!!!)

you could argue that he did really have a crush on el, but just never fell in love with her, but i think the far more logical, narrative based explanation for it is compulsory heterosexuality and internalized homophobia... he was told by all his friends and family that he must have feelings for this girl, so he believed them and tried to act accordingly.... but here's the thing. he has never ever gotten the hang of it

extreme discomfort with expressing romantic feelings toward el

mike's storyline in season 4 was entirely centered around his inability to have an open, honest conversation with his girlfriend. specifically, a conversation about their feelings toward each other. honestly, it's about time el called mike out for this. ever since their first kiss in season 1, every time he has had a moment alone with el, (except for their makeout scenes in s3 i guess... but he's kissed her to avoid using his words before. their first kiss.) mike has tried, struggled, and ultimately failed to voice his romantic intentions or inclinations toward el. (and if we know one thing about mike..... he hates lying)

it's such a pattern that it seems obvious to me that the nature of mike's feelings toward el have not changed over the course of their relationship. even the first time, when he tries to explain that he wouldn't be like her brother because..... that would be weird. why, mike?

he is talking around telling her that he likes her, which... fair enough, honestly. he's hinting at it and trying to get her to understand, and i mean, it's hard to tell someone you like them. and like, he's 12. this is fine

but it's about the context. and it's about the pattern

mike is constantly trying to explain how he feels about el, but he keeps putting it in a romantic framework, and that's his problem. it isn't romantic. it never has been. so he can never find the right words, because the ones he thinks are supposed to fit don't feel right, and mike doesn't want to lie to el. friends don't lie

this discomfort also extends to other expressions of romance, like kissing

🧍🏻 yes, he makes out with her a lot in season 3, but like... he's in way too deep at that point. this is heteronormativity and comp het at it's peak. el is his girlfriend (and they're months into their relationship atp), he's a 14yo boy with a heterosexual facade to keep up, and like, kissing is a fun way to pass the time... (it's better than spending it idk talking and finally getting to know each other, right?) and there's also that drawing of will behind her and the way he moves her hands away like he doesn't want her to touch him... idk seems kinda gay to me

......and then there's this

just like in the season 1 scene, with lucas' teasing cut short by the bullies, it's about the juxtaposition. mike's scene with will, followed by an intimate jancy moment, and then this. el kissing mike while he stands (eyes open) in front of a closet (in will's room), the light inside it lit up over his head. i really think this scene is a big moment in mike's realization of what he's feeling, and what he has been feeling. (one of many... he is just constantly being struck with how gay he is in season 4) the coding of this scene cannot just be about mike simply not having romantic feelings for el specifically, (or about it having started as a real crush that just didn't develop further or something). his absolute indifference to el, a girl (the girl he supposedly likes), kissing him is what is making him realize his queerness... which means that part of his queer revelation is disinterest in girls. they're showing us with every narrative technique in the book that mike doesn't have romantic feelings toward girls.

speaking of which

truly, what is this about if it's not mike projecting... what else could this mean (yes, sure, it could mean a lot of things, and maybe they really did mean it more like "yet," but they chose this line. it's way too on the nose to not mean this: mike doesn't like girls.)

it's about a lot more than el. she just happens to be the unfortunate one in the role of "mike wheeler's girlfriend" (she truly deserves so much more). throughout season 3 we're shown over and over again mike's romantic ineptitude with el. lucas, still assuming mike's romantic feelings toward her, spends a good amount of time this season literally walking mike through how to interact with his girlfriend. mike simply doesn't get it. still.

it doesn't feel natural to mike to have a girlfriend, he doesn't want to pursue el romantically, so he has no idea how to act.

i fully believe that lucas has been doing this for mike since the beginning of their relationship. he teased mike about being with el before the movie double date, mike presumably having confided in lucas about his relationship, and vice versa. mike has definitely been taking intensive notes from lucas.

and this isn't just mike being romantically inept in general. his relationships with el and will continuously parallel and contrast each other. (their fights and mike's reactions, for example) and in season 4, with no help from anyone, mike flirts so naturally with will. like he can't help it.

but with el, he's been forcing it since day one.

in real life, obviously things are wayyyy more complicated: relationships, gender, sexuality, all of it. but this is a fictional show that is telling a specific story, and so when i put together all of the narrative evidence from his entire relationship with el (especially when comparing it to will), it seems clear to me that the story stranger things is telling is not about a bi kid confused about his feelings between a girl he sort of likes and a boy he loves; it's about a boy realizing, through the constant juxtaposition of his relationships with a girl and a boy, both of whom he truly cares about, that he actually likes the boy and not the girl. aka, he's gay.

indifference toward other women

there's so much more in their relationship i could point to (other character/relationship parallels, heavy platonic/familial coding, etc), but i'll move on from el. honestly, i'm almost done though... mike doesn't really even interact with any other girls on the show that aren't adults and/or related to him. unless i missed something, the only other girl mike actually interacts with is max.

and istg they are the most platonic just look at them

but seriously, max's whole introduction into the show was primarily contrasting dustin and lucas' positive reaction to her with mike's negative/indifferent one. mike is a complex character with lots of little feelings, but i agree with most of the analysis i've seen about this: mike resents max's presence initially because it reminds him that he doesn't actually like girls in the way that his friends do, that what he has with el is not the same sort of first crush romance that he wants to pretend it is, the kind his friends are actually experiencing now. he sees max, and he sees the way dustin and lucas look at max and... he doesn't get it.

he doesn't like el (his love interest and girlfriend) he doesn't like max, (the only other girl his age he's even been on screen with), he's never shown interest in talking about, looking at, or pursuing any other girls. but... he is in love with his boy best friend. he did smile incredibly dreamily at eddie in the cafeteria. he does have more than one poster of a buff shirtless man on his bedroom wall.

i don't want to go on a bunch of tangents about minute details so i'll end the actual analysis here. i think those are the most important and relevant points. if you've read this far i appreciate you.

here's a couple more random things i consider gay mike subtext

the way his friends react vs the way mike reacts to a girl almost undressing in front of them

self explanatory

you're seeing this, right?

(should i make a post about all the shots of will over mike's shoulder?)

i know this isn't about mike liking boys but. look at him.

mike wheeler... i know what you are

.........gay

[a-strangers-thoughtss]

Omg I just figured out why on my stranger things rewatch I’ve only really been picking up on Mike’s obvious crush on Will. (The only reason I didn’t see it before was bc of El) but none of Will liking Mike.

I’m not even joking, I knew Will was gay by the end of season 2, bc no straight man dances with a girl like that. But I didn’t pick up on him and Mike until season 4 (the air port scene). And I think I know why!

I just found this article (yes, I’m probably late to the party, no I don’t care if you like Noah Schnapp or not, he’s still the actor that plays Will, and he’s good at it.)

“But even as Will’s entire storyline in Season 4 revolved around his unrequited love for Mike — and he was actively playing him as a closeted gay teenager — Schnapp says he just refused to allow himself to connect to what Will was going through.”

He wasn’t playing him like he was in love with Mike. You do have to connect to what the character is going through to act authentically, especially on screen! Maybe it’s just me but that’s what I’m getting out of it.

Finn has to know dude, he has to have known since like season two. You don’t just accidentally play a character that looks hopelessly in love with their best friend?

I’m not rlly sure exactly how to word it, but coincidences like that just don’t happen in acting.

[nothoughts-onlywomen]

random duos wishlist for s5

obvs elmax, rovickie, stobin, and lumax go without saying. those are REQUIREMENTS for s5

madwheeler - truthfully it would be cool to see their friendship kind of come full circle. or at the very least mike should do/say something that signifies that he truly cares for her now.

madwise - honestly the most underutilized dynamic. both targeted by vecna, both the quieter ones of the group, both sensitive (though i think max refuses to admit this about herself).

el/lucas - by some of the leaks' accounts (taken with a grain of salt), el and lucas should have some good scenes together this season. and that would be a poetic full circle moment since he started off hating her and thinking she was a freak, to her then becoming one of the most important people in his life. and they bond over almost losing max, and fighting to get her back.

nancy/lucas - i think this has been underexplored. they could relate over having a loved one who's been attacked by vecna.

robin/will - i mean they're the only two gay characters. there has to be at least ONE scene between them (though if the leaks i've read are right it looks like that may happen).

steve/jonathan - by all accounts it looks like we might be getting some of this duo in s5. i'll be very interested to see how they handle it, especially since both of them love nancy.

ronance - OBVS. don't know if the duffers will go there but i'd love at least a spontaneous kiss in a death scene or something. if not that then there should be SOMETHING that signifies that their friendship has grown.

erica/lucas - now that erica is a bigger player in this game, i would love to see some sibling bonding. it would be cool if it was over max, especially. like erica says something snippy to comfort lucas over max being in her coma.

dustin/lucas - i know we're going to get scenes of the OG four boys but i think this would be a nice callback to s1/s2.

nancy/mike - another nice callback to s1. she mentioned that her vecna visions involved mike getting hurt and she was understandably distressed by this. it would be lovely to develop their sibling relationship to something more mature.

karen/literally any of the kids - i'm thrilled to hear karen wheeler is getting a bigger role this season. i've always really liked her, so i hope whatever they do with her gives her an opportunity to interact with some of our faves.

hopper/el - another obvious one, but i think their found father/daughter relationship is one of the sweetest things in the show and i don't want it to get lost amid all the chaos.

joyce/jonathan - another essential callback to s1. their dynamic's been shelved for a minute so it would be great to bring it back.

dustin/steve - we have ALWAYS got to have this duo in some capacity, it's too damn fun. bonus if we get a scoops troop callback.

also max/consciousness would be nice too

[wakeupthemembersofbylernation]

I get ship loyalty/nostalgia and all that, but at this point it’s genuinely baffling that people are still riding for Mlvn THIS hard. Like what are you even fighting for? What are you excited about? I too initially used to ship Mlvn back in 2016/2017 just cause I was easily swayed by what was literally, explicitly canon and on screen. I thought Mike had a crush on El, and I thought it was cute, so why wouldn’t I ship them? Then they were separated, and it was sad! And Mike never gave up! And then the Snowball dance, when viewed through this lens, was a lovely, romantic moment of promises fulfilled. And the rest is history, right?

Wrong. I adjusted my perception of things based on the actual events of the show, not based on the hypothetical romantic Mlvn that never was. Even taking out Will’s obvious love for Mike from the equation (which is hard to do since he’s my favorite character) and even pushing aside Mike’s obvious queerness (which is also hard to do cause that boy is fruity), romantic Mlvn is something that just isn’t working. On a structural level.

And the last two seasons post Snowball have made that very clear. So when diehard Mlvns comment all day on Instagram about how Mike and El are apparently soulmates, send Bylers weird hate anons en masse, and post on Twitter how excited they are for Mike and El to finally be together, I have to believe they’re watching a completely different show. Or they have poor media literacy and can’t see something like Byler until it’s literally spelled out. Or they’re holding onto 2016 nostalgia instead of watching the show and adjusting based on what they see. Because if your excitement for S5 Mlvn is based on the idea that things will finally be amazing once they’re together, what exactly do you think has been happening for the last two seasons???

[lucystark12]

it’s time to face it here.

there’s no way byler isn’t real.

like are we actually fucking kidding?

i don’t even know why it is that we as a collective do so many analyses of things like b roll or outfits or song choices when byler is the most obvious and inevitable thing to happen in the history of television. literally all three of these characters arcs would be finished if byler were endgame. throughout the entire show, el has been a vessel for somebody else and their agenda, starting from when she was literally raised in a LAB. the fact that some of these mileven shippers who claim to love her don’t realize that the BEST POSSIBLE thing for her is to come into her own and find independence where she isn’t being controlled by somebody else or tied down by somebody else is absolutely ridiculous. that’s the entire point of her character!! the entire point of mike’s character since the second he was first bullied by troy was that he isn’t meant to be a conformist. he’s supposed to stand for what he believes in and be proud of his own identity. in dating el, he was quite literally suppressing his own identity. will is a character who was picked by vecna in season one because of the lack of practical love in his life. his father was absuive and he is constantly bullied at school. he’s the shy one in the party who gets overshadowed by dustin, lucas, and mike’s loud personalities in most of the scenes they have together. vecna targets him because he assumes that he will be an easy target who’s own insecurity will end up being the death of his morality. this is the same will who is only able to be broken out of a trance by mike’s monologue to him, proof of the fact that there is love in his life and people who care about him. will has spent the whole show going back and forth from madness. the only logical ending for him is the manifestation of this love that he has lacked his whole life, that of the one from mike. true, unadulterated devotion. it will be the thing to restore his full sanity and the person he was before all of the strange things went on because love is what keeps will tied to his morality. i fully believe that had i not been eight years old i probably would’ve been able to put this together the second we saw el run away and mike go on about “the best thing i’ve ever done” in season two. i truly believe that all of you milevens would be on board with this if will were a girl. get a grip.

to conclude: milevens are all fifteen year olds and not cool ones like me, they’re the kind who probably thought the great gatsby was a cool vintage romance novel 🤗

[mlchaelwheeler]

Mike, presents, and the painting: analyzing the van scene

There has been so many analysis posts written about the van scene and Mike's feelings, but I just wanted to write my own interpretation of how we see Mike's feelings develop through the end of S3 and into S4, using the painting as the main proof. In this analysis, I'll be mainly talking about the van scene, but also a few other scenes in which Mike's feelings for Will are clearly illustrated.

In my opinion, the goodbye scene between Mike and El in 3x08 is the first scene where the audience can clearly see that something is off between the two of them (if they hadn't caught on to that fact already). Mike's been struggling all season with letting El be her own person, realizing she's more than just her superpowers, and finally being able to express his feelings for her. During their goodbye however, none of these plot lines get wrapped up. Instead, Mike tells El he "knows her powers will come back," doesn't kiss her back, and stands there with a confused look on his face afterwards. Those are all overt signs that mlvn is not where the narrative is headed in S4. That's all old news. Instead, let's look at the more subtle clues that hint towards Mike's real feelings.

Before Mike and El kiss, Mike tells her that her and the Byers should come back to Hawkins for Christmas. It's clear Mike is excited to open presents, and even mentions talking about presents makes him "sound like a 7 year old." (It's fair to mention here that 7 is a number associated with Will and byler, but I'm just going to leave that here and not analyze that). Mike clearly loves receiving presents! There's even a track from the OST that plays during this scene that mentions presents.

Why is the line about presents so important? At the time, it felt like a throwaway line-- a random bit of dialogue added to give Mike and El something to talk about before their awkward goodbye kiss. However, that line was actually perfect foreshadowing to the painting plot in S4.

S4 opens with El's letter (full of lies), in which she mentions that Will is painting a gift for a girl he likes. Now, it's clear that this is a gift Will has spent a lot of time and effort on, and it's for someone special to him. I'm sure Mike heard about this and was immediately saddened, since he's usually the recipient of Will's art-- just look at his binder full of drawings or the walls of his basement and bedroom!

So when Mike arrives at the airport and sees the painting, he lets himself hope. He wants that painting to be for him. He's figured out by now that he loves Will. He desperately wants for Will to love him back, but internalized homophobia's a bitch. Mike is constantly guessing as to what Will's feelings are, so when Will says the painting's "nothing," Mike crushes his hopes that it could be a gift for him.

It's important to note that Mike is fixated on the painting. It's also right after Mike gives El a present (the flowers), so perhaps he's thinking the painting is actually a present for him. Why else would Will bring it to the airport? But when Will assures him it's "nothing," Mike goes overboard with sticking to El, trying to ignore his disappointment the painting seemingly isn't for him.

Later on in the van, Mike is shocked to see Will still has the painting with him. I'm sure he assumed Will had already given it to whichever girl it was for, so when Will hands it to him, he has to check it's actually for him.

And the thing is, yes, Will spills his own feelings using El as a cover. But I think Mike understood. He desperately wanted to believe those were Will's feelings. That's what he's wanted for so long now. Will loves him! The painting-- a present for Mike-- was Will's way of telling Mike he loves him. Even after Will finishes talking about "El's" feelings for Mike, it's obvious (at least to me) that Mike knows Will's talking about himself.

After confirming these feelings are real ("Yeah?" "Yeah."), Mike looks back down at the painting. A depiction of the party, Mike with a heart on this shield. To Will, he's the heart. It's clear that painting is all Will. Mike knows El doesn't know anything about dnd. There's no way she could've commissioned it. I think Mike knows exactly who the painting is from, and what it means. Or at least he's desperately hoping he knows. And then he looks back up! At Will! Not out the window (perhaps thinking of El), or at the painting for a longer amount of time, but back at Will seconds later. Will isn't looking back at him, but the way Mike is looking at Will... that boy is in love. And for the moment, he believes it's requited.

For the rest of 4x08, Mike believes Will loves him. And that's why, during their reunion with El, we get shots like this:

Obviously, Mike is overjoyed to reunite with El. He cares about her so deeply, and even though he doesn't love her romantically (platonic with a capital P), that doesn't make him any less happy to have her back, knowing she's safe once again. However, the clear framing choice of Will's silhouette between mlvn, as well as Mike's reaction after he hugs El (they don't kiss, which is interesting) further prove the fact that Mike's romantic feelings are towards Will. He's still thinking about the painting. Will's feelings for him. The fact that his own feelings might actually be returned.

Mike goes into the monologue scene still believing that Will loves him. So as El's visibly dying on the table, and Will tells Mike again ("You're the heart") feelings he thought were Will's, Mike is confused. Maybe they really were El's feelings? Maybe Mike was too in his own head and misinterpreted everything? Maybe Will doesn't actually love him and never has?

You can see the confusion written clearly on his face. His eyebrows draw down, his mouth tightens, and he rethinks every interaction he had with Will earlier that day. If Will doesn't love him, then he was completely wrong. His feelings are unrequited. He's completely alone. El is dying in front of him, so he does what he can. He forces himself to say "that thing."

He lies his ass off, but what else is he going to do? Will doesn't love him but apparently El does. He cares for El so much. He obviously doesn't want her to die! So he bottles up his own feelings and tells her exactly what he thinks she wants to hear. He makes up lie after lie, but at that point, he's saying anything that might help. His face right before he says he loves her is heartbreaking. That is not the face of a boy professing his love to his girlfriend. That is the face of a boy forced to lie to save a life. Forced to push aside his own feelings after apparently misinterpreting everything. That is a face of despair.

Two days later, it's clear Mike's lies didn't help anyone. El is more distant than ever. Max is comatose. Will is ignoring him. No matter what he does, Mike can never seem to get it right. Yet he does know one thing: he loves Will. So even in his mind, even though he now believes Will doesn't actually love him, Mike keeps hoping. He resigns himself to the fact that he'll just keep being Will's best friend, because that's how he can stick by his side. It's clear he's still contemplating this on the drive back to Hawkins.

And it's even more clear that he loves Will in the scenes in Hopper's cabin. Mike and El have barely spoken two words to each other after his grand confession of love-- despite the fact they were sitting inches apart for 48 hours. Yet who does Mike gravitate towards, as he always does? Will. We get a beautiful parallel to S2, in which Mike would've moved heaven and hell to keep Will by his side.

If one thing's for certain in Mike's mind, it's that he loves Will. He's not losing him again. Despite finding out that the malicious presence that's been out for Will for years is now back, Mike is resolute. Vecna is not touching Will ever again, not if Mike has any say in the matter. They'll figure this out together-- as best friends, as a team, as something more. Because even if Mike believes that Will doesn't love him, Mike does love Will. He always has and always will. And he's not losing him ever again.

[statusquoergo]

do you think, when mike left the firm and stopped being a lawyer (that handshake gif you reblogged. sidebar: your tags 🥺), if mike had been single...do you think harvey would have tried to progress something romantic in this situation? he asks him out to dinner as it is...bc he just wants to be with him. he loves this man. their work arrangement was the obvious reason nothing could progress, and mike's developing relationship with rachel the obvious other. if, say, there was no rachel in the picture...I just wonder...

I could see the argument of harvey not wanting to risk their friendship and losing mike fully; he's one to take mike however much he's able to have him, and he'd take friendship over nothing any day. but, honestly...the way harvey just oozes love for mike (particularly in later seasons)...it might not even be an active choice; it might just be something that happens because he loves mike: he can't help being doe-eyed on dinner dates, and their flirty banter, and if mike is receptive then, well...full romance it'd become

(also, I don't buy harvey being too emotionally stunted or whatever to go after him. I don't think donna's all-knowing about him at all in this regard. he's a man who knows how he feels and what he wants.)

oh, and to add on to that. I haven't rewatched in a while, but a scene that sticks with me through EVERYTHING is harvey going to mike's office, "Flowers die. I thought I'd bring something better. Me" mike LOOKS UP like HELLO "...across the table from you." Like that was So charged and Mike was So receptive. he's been attracted to harvey from the beginning, too. obviously had no thought that that would ever be a reality lol and concurrently fell for rachel. but if there is no rachel, and no work relationship...mike is So down. he seriously would be. they flirt as it is...with no obstacles how could it not become something

Every time those two have to go their separate ways, no matter how long, they always have to do it in the most heartbreaking way they can come up with 😢

The thing about this is, I don't think Harvey's biggest obstacle is that he's not in touch with his own feelings. Or Mike's, for that matter. He knows he wants Mike, he knows he loves Mike, he knows he would give up everything he has and everything he is for Mike, and at the very least, he knows Mike is into him, too, although I imagine it would take some time once the barriers are all down for him to fully comprehend just how much.

As you said, the argument for him not wanting to lose his friendship with Mike isn't a hard one to make. For all his bluster and bravado, Harvey doesn't have a lot of friends; he has Donna, who's his nearest and dearest confidant but also kind of really controlling and a little manipulative, and he has Louis, who he treats like shit the vast majority of the time and prefers to toy with rather than bond with, and he has Jessica, who's mainly a mother figure and role model. And then he has Mike. Mike, who he fights with probably more often than he should because they both have absolutely godawful communication skills, but who he would (and does) tell literally anything and everything, no matter how personal; who he trusts to have his back in any given situation; who he tried to go to prison for; and who gives him all that back tenfold. Or at least in kind. This is in all likelihood the first and only relationship he's ever had of that caliber, and he'd be a fool to give it up, so why risk it seeking something more? ("More" as in "additional," not "more" as in "romance is more valuable than friendship." Just...clearing that up.)

The argument against that, however, is also an easy one: Since when has Harvey ever been afraid to take a risk? It's not even a big one, honestly. If Rachel is out of the picture, he's aware enough to realize that this thing between him and Mike has a shot, and it would be awfully foolish of him not to pursue it. He could go for it full tilt, running down the darkened city streets at the dead of night to show up at Mike's doorstep and make a full-on declaration of his intent, or he could soft-pedal it and leave himself room to back out if things start going south, but I don't think not wanting to risk their friendship would stop him completely from making a move if Mike is "in play," as it were. Even if it took him a minute to realize how much it hurt him to be apart from Mike for that long. Or at all.

Now, I hate to say this (I mean I really hate to say it), but I do think Harvey might be tripped up by (I really hate to say it) his own sense of misogyny.

I should break that down a little.

Harvey grew up in a very broken household. He and his brother don't seem to have had the best relationship (their camaraderie and fondness for one another is fairly superficial; they seem pretty friendly in low- or no-stakes situations, but Marcus only reconnected with Harvey to ask him for money, and he didn't even tell Harvey his cancer had come back because it wasn't worth the trouble); he childishly idolized his nearly-absent father to the point of hero worship; and his mother, well, let's not bother rehashing that for the hundredth time. His image of the "perfect family," however, isn't an unconventional one; it's a loving mother and father doting on one another, and taking care of their child, or children. He didn't have that, but it's what he always wanted, and what he's spent his life telling himself is what he should want. That is, he isn't interested in crafting himself a new ideal so much as recovering the one he missed out on.

On top of all that, he's chosen to wholeheartedly throw himself into the world of corporate law, which is an extremely male-dominated field (Jessica notwithstanding; even she has to play by the men's rules, and she knows full well that she was promoted to her position at least in part for the optics of the firm having a Black woman in such an elite role). If he's going to ride his life's mine cart rails along to a happy family, it's going to be with a woman in as traditional a household as he can scrape together.

What I mean by that is that he'd have to actively, consciously, purposefully choose to pursue any life that's not that one. He's not a misogynist by trade, I don't think, like I don't think he thinks men are inherently superior to women or any of that shit, but the overall model has been instilled in him so strongly and from so many directions that someone would have to sit him down and shove it in his face and teach him how to unlearn it, and unless Mike is the one to do that by way of making the first move, I don't really see it occurring to anyone that it's even necessary. Harvey might have his flings (Ted Phillips, anyone?), and he may be aware that a life with Mike is what he wants, but left to his own devices, I'm not convinced he'd realize it's one he can have.

This is where the "not wanting to lose the best friendship he's ever had" part comes into play. He and Mike flirt like a couple of hormonal teenagers, they're clearly both interested in going further, and if Rachel is out of the picture, there's nothing (external) stopping them, but Harvey has something deep down in his subconscious telling him that he's not allowed to have that, so the friendship alone has to be enough.

But you'd better believe they're going to push those boundaries as far as they'll go.

All that said, if someone, anyone, thought to give Harvey a nudge in that direction... I think he'd be all for it.

[kawaiidoodles95-blog]

Byler VS Mileven: Thoughts, opinions, etc.

Warning: If you are a Byler or Mileven endgame person, please stay off this. I’m gonna critique both of your ships.

To get the most controversial out of the way, let’s talk about Byler.

Byler is a ship between Will x Mike. If you are on Tumblr, a Stranger Things fan, and you don’t know that, what are you doing? Byler is like, 80% of the Stranger Things fandom. Anyways, so these are my thoughts on Byler. I don’t think it’s gonna be endgame and I don’t think it’s be healthy even if it was. Mike seems really… uh, what’s the word, rude to Will? Especially in the last 2 seasons. Mike was literally pushing Will away in the 3rd season over a girl. Yes, I do agree Will is gay. I have no real doubt about it. But if Mike really loved Will…

1. He’d probably show true signs of affection. No, not smiling at Will. No, not grabbing his hand (I do that with my friends no matter what gender they are.) Like, actual signs of affection, not just friendship signs.

2. He’d probably be more coy with Will. Just as Will is showing affection to Mike in obvious ways, Mike should probably recuperate these feelings. This leads to my 3rd and final point…

3. Is Mike just stupid? Listen. How come we, the outsiders, the people watching, the people not even being INTERACTED with, are noticing all the signs of Will’s obvious gayness, when MIKE, the person being DIRECTLY TALKED TO AND INTERACTED WITH is not getting the hint. Sorry, this topic just gets me heated. I know this is the 80’s and being gay is still taboo, but being Bi/Gay is not unknown. Mike probably would know if he himself is bi, non the less, his own friend. Will is as subtle as 100 nukes going off at once. So why is Mike not getting it?

So yeah, that’s my thoughts on Byler. Overall, I don’t have a problem with the ship. It’s just that people are thinking it’s going to 100% being endgame, and hey, maybe I’m wrong. I’m just saying Byler is not 100% on the board of endgame ships, if there are any.

Now let’s talk about Mileven.

This is the ship of Mike and El. This is a canon (for now) ship. So, obviously since I dislike Byler, I must be for Mileven, right?

Idiot.

I am for NEITHER. NON. NEIN. NIE. Here are my reasons for my dislike of Mileven. I don’t think they’re gonna break up, but I sure as heck hope they do. El deserves better. Sure, Mike was forced to, but he could have chosen not to lie to El if he truly loved her. Second, he was overprotective of El, and El deserves to have her independence. Luckily, she does in S3 and 4. Mike was great to her in the first two seasons, being not overprotective, but just caring and wanting to make sure she’s ok. He seemed to have chemistry, and then, the next season… well… it sort of turned toxic. Mike got really weird and mean to like, a lot of people. If he truly loved El, he would have…

1. Stayed like how he was in the first 2 seasons. Protective, but not overly so. The relationship shouldn’t have become the stereotypical and annoying break-up get-back-together plot. I feel like Lumax was the way they should’ve went with the relationship.

2. Again, he wouldn’t lie. He should’ve stayed with El and not have lied, because that only made the whole thing worse. Then that lead to Mike and Will fighting, because Mike is a moron (are you seeing a pattern here? That both of these ships’s issues are a lot because of Mike? Huh) and wouldn’t even listen to his own “crush.”

3. He would, as I mentioned with Will, be more coy with her. Mike in the recent seasons (also notice how I keep mentioning the first and latest 2 seasons? Odd) has been acting strange around Eleven. Almost like she’s pulling her along on a relationship that doesn’t really exist anymore. I think he’s worried El will be mad at him and not help him if he breaks up with her. But again, that isn’t healthy. That isn’t love.

So those are my thoughts on the ships. If you disagree with me and fight in the comments like a bunch of barbarians, I will not care. You can like what you like, just leave me out of it.