#kotlc discourse

[lucyshypemaster]

one thing you'll never catch me doing is hating on sophie for the way she acted towards oralie. this girl is quite literally the most patient character I've ever seen. it took her like, 8 books to finally snap for a GOOD reason. she had to live for years in the lost cities without knowing who's her biological parents and when she did find out? turns out the person was right infront of her face the whole time.

and now, it's not like she can go around telling people that oralie is her mother because oralie is a councillor and with this news hitting the council and the elven world, it'll cause mayhem- mayhem that's perfect for the neverseen to just swoop in and take everything. oralie's reputation will be ruined. sophie HAS to stay unmatchable for the rest of her life and forkle has the AUDACITY to tell her to wait for a few more hundred years.

nahhhh sophie is incredibly patient. if I was her, I would've already lost my mind after the events in everblaze. my sanity would've been held together by spit and gum just like keefe in neverseen fr

[everliving-everblaze]

are we posting about common fandom misconceptions?

(Disclaimer: I think it's fine to do what you want. But per Fin's last post, it's good to know the source in order to break from it.)

Alden is a kind and caring person. He's one of the people that Sophie trusts most, and he's doing his best under difficult circumstances. Is his best good enough? You can decide that! But, as an example that stands out to me: When he brought Sophie to be his guide in Fintan's mind break, he told her emphatically that he would go back and fight for her to not be involved if she didn't want to be. It was very clearly not malicious. Intent doesn't equal impact, I get it. But his intentions are always good.

Linh isn't quiet and sweet! We don't see a lot of Linh, I get it. But in what we do see of her, she's strong-willed, determined, and protective. Tam is seen in the fandom as the protective one, when she's just as protective of him. Also, she's goofy! She might be the goofiest character next to Keefe!

Fitz isn't dorky. This is one that I fall prey to myself. But his nerdiness doesn't actually translate to dorkiness in canon; he's very self-assured and charismatic. That's a huge part of his character, in fact!

Those are off the top of my head. And again, you can do what you want. Sil's old "#awkward fitz should be canon" tag is one of my favorites! But she made that with the understanding that it wasn't canon, and that's part of what made it good.

[an-ungraceful-swan]

You ever see a ship so antithetical to everything you know about characters and how they would act and you have to grit your teeth and suffer through it. Like “it’s not my cup of tea” But also I’d rather drink arsenic rather than it

[gay-otlc]

Hey kotlc fandom. The way some of yall are talking about mpreg is pretty fucked up ngl

[bookwyrminspiration]

politely, can we please express our differing opinions without being rude/using ad hominem attacks? "you just can't handle [thing]" is so condescending for no reason, and unhelpful/inaccurate to boot. "just say [different point]" is, once again, condescending and dismissive. "how did you even come to [certain conclusion]?" logically, same as you. disagreeing doesn't mean it's senseless or baseless. these are just some common examples; there are others

no, you don't have to agree with everyone else's opinions/theories/characterization/analysis. I certainly don't. but the way a lot of the fandom's been expressing it lately feels so antagonistic and unpleasant.

[timelessbibliophile]

so i'm finally getting around to reading Stellarlune and I'm so confused as to why Ro slept in Sophie's bed...?

Last time i read kotlc, I thought Ro was so cool and funny, but now like 3 years later she seems less fun and more invasive. She keeps pressing Sophie to talk to her about the boys even when she keeps telling her no, and then she just randomly sleeps in her bed without asking, even though Sophie is visibly uncomfortable with it.

They live in like a castle, why didn't Grady and Edaline suggest Ro slept in another room? Sophie's kind of a people pleaser, so it's understandable if she couldn't tell Ro to leave, but Grady and Edaline were also there when Ro just decided she was sleeping in the same bed as Sophie, so why didn't they speak up?

I'm guessing the whole thing was written to just be a funny gag or whatever, but I keep getting really weirded out at the fact that Ro just doesn't respect Sophie's boundaries.

Am i reading too much into this?

[frizzle-mcshizzle]

why are people complaining about the way the kotlc fandom is rn, if you don’t like what the general populace is posting then post your own stuff? if not let people have their fun without complaining!

[uni-seahorse-572]

everyday we must rise and fall again with the terrible knowledge of the golden sophie in fitz's head vs. keefe's imperfect drawing. you can never go back. if this is what must finally drive me to violence so be it

like! tell me you don't understand fitz without telling me you don't understand fitz. being cognates is about the ability to see the other person wholly and you can't tell me in good conscience that they could have reached this level of trust without knowledge. you think fitz is oblivious to people's flaws? the boy who's so angry at the world, who picks at the faults around him because he's been betrayed so badly by the promises he thought he could hold onto? you think he isn't intimately aware of every mistake and every moment of weakness? the fitz who said "we could all use a little more weird in our lives" and who's known Sophie from the beginning, through her darkest moments and her greatest ones. who's been with her through all of it and who bore witness while staying by her side. the whole time. you can't tell me he'd put sophie on a pedestal because she's the one person he never did - not like with keefe or alvar or his entire family, because she's the part of his life that always drags him from his perfection and he wouldn't have it any other way.

and Keefe? you think Keefe can comprehend a person perfectly complexly after all he's been through, with how he prefers suppression over introspection? everyone in his life has hurt him so so much but in the midst of that there's sophie, who's been there, this golden girl that swept him up into her orbit and has been the one he can count on despite all of his mistakes. you think this boy, who has no self worth and sees himself as a borderline curse always messing everything up, doesn't think of Sophie as someone so much better than someone as broken as him could ever deserve? because what are her faults to him when he's done so much worse. and he hasn't stood by her this whole time, because he always runs, because he's the one between him and Fitz who doesn't see her as a true partner but instead as someone he has to protect from himself. but he's never gone against Sophie either, not really, never been angry with her since she's infallible in his mind and what is a relationship when you can't even get frustrated with someone. what happens when there are no cracks, because isn't that how we learn where the breaking points are? how can he really know her imperfections like this?

shannon. shannon please i can't live like this

[confessionsofkotlc]

hey there kotlc nation on tumblr! what the hell js going on like actually. i haven’t checked the main tag in months and as soon as i do i’m met with just. wow. kotlc fandom is NOT looking good… i get loving the series but it really isn’t that srs sometimes. and thjs is coming from the alvar guy of all people! (iykyk ig.) we were always kind of. uh. horrible! which is why i’ve distanced myself from here, but why did you get worse apparently?? oomfs. 😭😭

[moonlarked]

Appreciation post for Shannon Messenger. This woman had created such an intricate and unique world and characters that so many of us love and relate to.

Is the series perfect? No, of course not. Nothing is. But I think this fandom hates on Shannon far too much.

[honey-the-dinosaur-ate-our-kid]

i think we should seriously reconsider the mental healths of the elves before we claim that they should pursue romantic relationships.

those kids have seen a lot of shit, gone through a lot of shit, and forced to go through more shit while dealing with other shit. a lot of these experiences were traumatizing and even sophie has been near a mind break at one point in the books.

they faced danger too young and we're not acknowledging that they only brushed it off?

sophie and dex were only 12 or 13 when they were kidnapped. 12.

keefe was emotionally abused by his parents and manipulated by his mother from a young age. HIS OWN MOTHER. THE ONE WHO BIRTHED HIM, CARRIED HIM WITHIN HER, HELL, EVEN CREATED HIS LIFE. MY BOY DOESN'T KNOW HOW TO HANDLE EMOTIONS AND HE'S AN EMPATH.

dex was looked down on because of his birth, parents, and siblings. that's something no child should ever face when they don't know what happened or that it's not their fault.

linh and tam were banished to the neutral territories because of something linh couldn't control. instead of blaming their parents, they blamed her. linh, who was only 9 or 10 at the time. linh, who didn't know the only people to blame were her parents and the shitty judgement system

that's not even half of it. there are countless other things I could talk about, but is that not enough proof that they should get therapy and end the war at the very least before getting into romantic relationships.

i'm not against shipping or any ships in general, but these kids should know how to deal with their emotions healthily before considering lovers. they deserve to heal a little bit.

the notion of getting better with your significant other supporting you is a nice one, but that shouldn't be the go-to solution. A ROMANTIC RELATIONSHIP WON'T FIX YOU.

you shouldn't always rely on others to fix you. you should rely on yourself first. sometimes, someone can help you, but you have to take the first step.

[lucyshypemaster]

I find it hilarious how shannon made sure to mention in every book that there's no sexism in the lost cities but if you really read the books properly and notice every detail, there are definitely hints of misogyny in their society

[everliving-everblaze]

at this point my strategy for dealing with fitz haters is just to go the complete opposite direction. i hope fitz gives the fandom something to REALLY fight over. i hope he kills alvar in front of everyone he knows while crying and then turns to his parents and wipes his bloody hands on their pristine clothes while his friends beg him to stop. and then he collapses on the ground, his mind fully broken, and when sophie goes in to try to save him, she realizes just how badly he was hurting but didn't let himself. and she just barely manages to bring him back, but his mind attacks her the whole time, and she comes out injured and scarred and unable to ever look at him the same way again. and the council exiles him, and sophie being sophie, she still wants to save him, but she does it by erasing his memory like what happened to alvar when he was spared. and so he comes out a shell of the fitz he once was, with everyone around him remembering the awful things he's done, tiptoeing around him trying to figure out who he is at the same time he's doing the same thing. the elvin world and the fandom explode into chaos. is he redeemable? how could an elf, especially one as model as fitz, have done something so awful? was he just as evil as the fandom always thought? or was he manipulated by the neverseen, who always wanted to make him violent, and does that excuse the harm he caused? what should be done from here?

or something like that.

[an-ungraceful-swan]

Why in the year of our lord 2024 are we having keefe vs fitz discourse. Where did this come from. Why.

[silence-small-child]

"idk why it just is" boy i can't think of a reason why a headcanon of tam song specifically as really really good at math might just "come to you randomly." what could possibly have unconsciously made you think of that?

[bookwyrminspiration]

"Amy was Sophie's opposite in every way, from her curly brown hair and green eyes to her lower than average grades and incredible popularity." (Book 1)

"Amy's hair was longer and straighter, with a few layers framing her face. And her skin had picked up a whole bunch of freckles. Somehow the combination made her look so much older than Sophie wanted her to be and much too young for what they were there for, all at the same time" (Book 8)

so having curls is childish and something you can grow out as you mature the way she's writing it. shannon genuinely cannot let a single curly haired character exist in peace can she