#not even like. hateful just 'wow everything you said in that statement was ill-informed and wrong and I don't know where to begin' | Explore Tumblr posts and blogs

darlington-v · 4 years ago

Note

I know different interpretations of a work are generally enriching and cool... but c!dream villan interpretations is like how to tell me you only watch Tommy without saying you only watch tommy.... which would be fine but its not a great place to be making statements about the whole nature of the dsmp lol

Wild speculation, but sometimes I wonder if like, because the dsmp didn't really start as a narrative, and a lot of fans don't nessecarily enter it expecting a narrative, but then there is one and the fandom is really discourse heavy and everyone is sort of excpeted to have an opinion while maybe not expecting to form one from the begining or not having a ton of experience with narrative in a way that would "expect" them to have an opinion or not take things at face value??, I don't know if I explained that well at all... and I don't really even think thats right nessecarily... but like wow sometimes some of the takes about power and government and villany...

Honestly, it makes sense!!!

I think something interesting is like.... looking at how animatics have shaped the like tone and culture of the fandom essentially. Like, an interesting fact that I didn't really fully grasp until SUPER recently is like...

c!Wilbur out the gate admits he is manipulating c!Tommy. Like his first youtube video on the Dream SMP he admits his goal is to manipulate c!Tommy and people like c!Tommy into helping him achieve a potion ("drug") empire to monopolize on potions because there were a lot of people on the server who like to min-max, which is to put all of your effort into this one specific skill essentially. so like... i know minecraft doesnt have a skill tree but if it did, it would be putting all your points into that one specific branch of a skill tree. So he wanted to exploit the labor of all the TommyInnits to.... maintain a Potion Empire.

THIS IS A LONG POST BC I GOT CARRIED AWAY SO BUCKLE UP

And I don't think a lot of the fandom who joined later on knows this. I certainly didn't until like a week or so ago? Like... I knew c!Wilbur had been manipulative from the start because I'm a mod of (shameless self promo incoming) @dsmpanalysis and we have a lot of different POVs in that mod team and discord and we talk about it really frequently. I joined the fandom as someone who was really big on L'manburg ESPECIALLY crimeboys, and have turned into.... *gestures vaguely to my blog*

And ngl I owe a lot of it to @1-michibiki-1 in terms of c!Dream "Apologism" but all of the mods there have expanded my thoughts and views on the storylines of this narrative.

My application consisted of like largely essays about like... how I think Dream was the villain but he was meant to be the villain because you don't get any insight into his character WHICH.... IS A FAIR ASSUMPTION AT FIRST GLANCE. People are easily villainized when you cannot get a glimpse into their thought process. It's easy to dwindle someone down into this flat character and starting out I knew Dream didn't stream the SMP on purpose.

And I personally came to the conclusion of "Oh! So Dream is supposed to be the villain." However as the story continued and I learned more about what Dream went through I began to realize that... it's more than likely a form of a red herring. My opinions on this were immediately solidified when I watched Ranboo's 2 MIL stream because both Ranboo AND Dream agree on enjoying red herrings.

There have been MANY times were Dream has said that c!Dream is a complex character and he's not a wholly evil guy and there have been times where the narrative has honestly just proved that.

Anyways, what's important though was that... I learned most of this from other people who were more focused on c!Dream rather than myself. Eventually I shifted from c!Tommy to c!Ranboo and c!Techno after c!Tommy betrayed c!Techno and I began to realize.... everything I learned before hopping in wasn't exactly what it seemed.

Part of this is because I'm older, I heavily identify with c!Techno's sense of loyalty and philosophies on government, but I especially identify with the anguish c!Techno voiced in... a lot of lore but especially the lore around Doomsday.

I'm not 16 anymore. I don't always feel wronged by adults, or older people in my case, whenever they absolutely have done something wrong by me, but I do feel wronged by my close friends. I also felt like c!Tommy's sense of loyalty didn't line up with mine after what felt like him constantly flip-flopping and refusing to understand c!Techno's morals on government didn't line up with his.

In short, it was easier to identify with Tommy in these animatics versus in the actual stream content because c!Tommy is played by a 16 year old. I'm not a teenager and my line of thinking doesn't entirely line up with people that age anymore. It's harder to place myself in the same shoes of someone's OC who is played closer to their actual age, because I'm not that age.

Regardless, I was still on the c!Dream is a villain train. I wasn't ever like... c!Dream is repulsive I hate him, but I was like omg hot villain lad go brrr.

Even when the first like... mellohi, panic room, Ranboo lore stream popped up I thought "Oh! c!Ranboo corruption arc?"

And I was excited because I really wanted this shy, nervous character to turn into villain buddies with his good pal c!Dream. I'm a total sucker for villains and corruption arcs and all that good shit.

SO I STARTED GETTING REALLY INTERESTED IN ENDERSMILE. I'VE BEEN ON ENDERSMILE SQUAD OUT THE GATE. NOT THE SAME WAY I AM NOW, BUT I'VE ALWAYS WANTED THEM TO TEAM UP.

So... upon not really keeping up with c!Dream and being relatively??? indifferent? I don't think I started arguments on c!Dream back then, but I might have. But I remember like... starting to participate more whenever c!Dream came up and looking more into Dream's character BUT ESPECIALLY TALKING WITH OUR SERVER'S C!DREAM SPECIALIST MICHI ABOUT DREAM A LOT MORE.

And because Michi has been a watcher since day one and was a DTeam fan rather than a SBI fan, she was able to provide me with more information on how the server worked pre-Tommy but especially pre-Wilbur.

Now, you could definitely argue well Michi probably has clear bias but it made sense to me when I looked back on how the storyline had been constructed and was going along, and everyone in the server talks a lot about our own biases and how we want people to maybe not lean so hard on them. Michi would also provide like anecdotes on what had happened and I'm sure links were probably provided at one point but the point was I felt like Michi had no reason to lie or manipulate how the story was told and if she did, eventually someone would have pointed it out because... Group of like... right now it's around 20 or more analysts but I don't remember how many at the time there were. POINT BEING, WE'VE ALL GOT POINTS TO PROVE AND IN MY EXPERIENCE NOT MANY OF US HAVE BEEN SHY TO PROVE THEM.

So if anyone ever had any differing opinions they would be talked about and we literally had and still have discussions.

REGARDLESS.... I DIDN'T FACT CHECK IN DEPTH BECAUSE I THOUGHT PEER REVIEW WAS ENOUGH WHEN YOU HAVE LIKE HOURS UPON HOURS OF STREAMS TO WATCH.

Anyways. Eventually I started paying closer attention and looking more into c!Dream lore but only recently have I started to triple check before speaking about c!Wilbur lore because I know everyone has biases and while I did trust everyone's thoughts and analysis in the discord, whenever I make essays I typically like it to be largely air tight and if theres a mistake, I want it to be because I forgot not because I just trusted what was said. Plus, I wanted to get down to the specifics of how Wilbur had always started with manipulation on the mind.

SO I WATCHED HIS FIRST VIDEO ON THE DREAM SMP.

AND WHAT I WAS NOT BY ANY MEANS EXPECTING WAS WILBUR TO SAY WORD FOR WORD, VERBATIM,

"SO WHY DON'T I START AN INDUSTRY WHERE I USE THE TOMMYINNITS OF THE WORLD TO WORK FOR ME, TO CREATE THINGS THAT THE MIN-MAXERS OF THE WORLD WILL WANT."

Like... this is in no way an attempt to like hardcore villainize c!Wilbur like everyone does Dream, it's just more so to like REALLY outline how far off a lot of fandom interpretation of c!Wilbur is....

Because of SBI focused animatics.

Now, when I joined I watched A LOT of animatics that really highlighted like... Wilbur being this self-loathing JD-esque, "I destroyed it because I had to because the world was against me because no one loved us, Tommy" type of character. At least... that's what it came across as.

And it definitely highlighted the fact that Tommy was a victim, which he is. He is undoubtedly a victim and no not even any dream apologist can change my mind otherwise. Tommy, despite being an instigator sometimes, didn't deserve the abuse he received.

But these animatics never shown the fact that c!Wilbur started L'manburg as a shady ploy to exploit people like c!Tommy and vilify c!Dream so he could have power.

And that was easy because Dream and Tommy had wars before. They had spars and pranks and here's the plan to take back my disks and here's the plan to out smart the thieving little child etc etc.

And all of the animatics I watched never mentioned this. Neither did the recaps though. The recaps gave the events flat out, there didn't sound like there was bias, and honestly I don't really know if there was rather than like... a lack of nuance. And it's hard to provide a recap with that much nuance in a short period of time for a youtube video, to be perfectly fair.

However, this creates a perfect formula for entirely rewriting the history of a server. c!Wilbur quite literally fucking succeeded TO A META LEVEL. He slandered and ran smear campaigns against Dream and like he even does that with Sapnap in the beginning. But what's crazy is that it transferred over into the meta! Most of this fandom understands Wilbur as a victim of mental illness, and yeah maybe? He definitely wasn't mentally well by the end of pogtopia, but he never started out with honorable intentions. L'manburg was never a victim, only its citizens. The TommyInnits of the world.

I just think it's like... such an interesting case study. Because this is like... an opinion like shared by at least half of the fandom, but the vilifying of c!Dream is shared by MOST of the fandom I would argue. Which is like even more crazy for me because that was c!Wilbur's goal!!!

LIKE I GO INSANE WHEN I THINK OF THIS BECAUSE HIS REACH IS JUST TOO POWERFUL. HE'S NOT EVEN ENTIRELY REAL, JUST A MANIPULATIVE PERSONA OF SOME BRITISH GUY.

And I mean... maybe people who have watched Wilbur's video on the SMP still maintain this idea that Wilbur wasn't always the bad guy, but honestly... I wouldn't be surprised if their introduction was still an animatic. Like bias is hard to check and I'm not going to lie I could have sworn I watched both Wilbur's AND Tommy's video on the SMP in the beginning and yet I STILL was a ride or die for tragic yet on some level still honorable Wilbur and a resilient Tommy.

Like... upon watching Wilbur's first video... possibly again I was surprised because I thought I did watch it like right before I even started watching the streams and yet I was still so invested in c!Wilbur as this tortured anti-hero.

It took 6 months of... not being in an echo chamber, full of multiple different people of different ages, different stream POVS, and people who joined the fandom at different points in time.

IDK IF THIS WAS EVEN ENTIRELY RELEVANT IT JUST FELT TANGENTIALLY RELEVANT AND THIS WAS SOMETHING I'VE BEEN THINKING ABOUT FOR A HOT MINUTE AFTER LIKE WATCHING WILBUR'S FIRST VIDEO AGAIN.

TLDR;

SBI CENTRIC ANIMATICS HAD A LASTING AFFECT ON THIS FANDOM AS IT'S HARD TO GO BACK AND ACTUALLY CHECK THE NARRATIVE FOR SOLID FACTS FOR YOUR OWN INTERPRETATION BASED ON THE FACT THAT THIS NARRATIVE SPANS OVER HUNDREDS OF HOURS WORTH OF TWITCH STREAMS.

#asks #anon #dream smp #dsmp #dsmp analysis #dream smp analysis #dsmp meta #dream smp meta #my analysis #long post

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themurphyzone · 4 years ago

Text

PatB: Snowball Ep Talk

You know, I really do love the episode Snowball (my personal favorite AKOM episode) but I don’t think I’ve ever talked about it here much, and if I did it’s probably really only because of the flashback sequence.

Okay so all looks good so far. Chain letter scheme and superstition, a standard introduction to Brain’s latest plot of world domination. All looks good. Plus I just like this shot of Pinky. Don’t mind me, just starting off light here with a smushed Pinky.

I just like Pinky’s pose here. He’s so cute.

You will bow before Troz.

“I met a Snowball today! Right here in the lab!” -Pinky

You know, I just find the implications of this line hysterical. This means that Snowball was in the lab that day, waiting for the moment to strike, and he definitely pushed his stolen chain letter through the mail slot.

And then he lets Pinky see him, and no it’s not just a passing glance either cause Pinky specifically describes a tattoo with an A and a circle and points to his leg. Which means Snowball deliberately lifted the fur on his leg and showed his tattoo to Pinky.

Like, wow.

“It means, Pinky, that evil lurks among us. By the name of Snowball! SNOWBALLLLLLLL!” -Brain

Talk about a bad breakup. *Alexa play Bad Blood*

Personally I think one of the interesting visual cues is that Snowball purposely plants himself into the mice’s space. There’s a lot of that in this episode. He knows how to rile up Brain and hit him where it hurts, namely through Pinky.

Brain values his personal space, and he values a sense of control. When Snowball invades that space, Brain loses control, and his anger can lead him to make some very ill-informed decisions. Which is exactly what Snowball aims for.

“You think Pinky is an asset?”

“Anything I can take from you is an asset.”

Ah yes, Snowball’s mission statement. Crush everything Brain has into dust.

The flashback sequence. Dear God this flashback sequence. They were both so cute!

You know, it’s really sad that a younger Brain acted more like Pinky. Making silly faces and trying to get someone to laugh are such Pinky things to do. I know canon is loose but if you consider this flashback taking place shortly after Brain was captured from the wild, then young Brain didn’t gain a grasp on what happened to him until after the gene splicer.

Ok but Brain was literally right there when the gene splicer exploded. Imagine having your cranium size dramatically increase, you’re injured, you’ve suddenly gained sentience, and as if all that wasn’t enough, you see the gene splicer explode with your only friend inside.

Oh, and said friend’s mind was probably damaged in the explosion and now he hates your guts. And though you’re angry with him for his betrayal, some part of you will never stop caring about him.

Once again, Snowball needs to learn to keep his hands to himself.

This conversation here establishes Snowball as the perfect third character. He appears only in a handful of eps, but he’s fun to watch and love to hate. Snowball challenges the mice’s relationship. Snowball sees the weak points; the insults, the reliance on each other, and twists them to his advantage. And Pinky even admits he’s hurt by Brain’s insults occasionally, though he still loves being around him.

“Pinky, the Brain doesn’t care about you. He’s just using you.”

“No, he’s not.”

It’s really interesting to me how Pinky denies Snowball’s statement, yet his ears go down to show that he’s affected by the idea of being used. Pinky and the Brain may be night and day, but one thing they do have in common is their tendency to deny certain things. Brain with emotions and affection and Pinky with concepts he’d rather not admit the possibility of.

Coming back to this later.

Non plot related but Brain is teeny tiny and I love how he just trusts Pinky to catch him

Side note: I apologize if any of these screenshots look weird. It’s an AKOM ep.

WHY ARE YOU TWO SO BAD AT SNEAKING AROUND.

I just find it hilarious how they clearly run around where Snowball can see and hear them. Like they just shout Snowball’s name in the middle of the room. You’re terrible at being sneaky little mice. Please.

Those dang boomers and their old timey 90s computers. Technology is ruining boomers. Can’t even hold a conversation anymore cause they keep looking at their screens.

No touchy!

Well, it’s awful nice of Snowball to engage in nepotism and offer Brain a position in his administration...and then tempt Pinky with an amusement park when he refuses.

You really gotta appreciate the complexity of Snowball’s plans. Stealing the chain letter fails->plant seeds of doubt in Pinky’s mind, even if this doesn’t work right off the bat, the idea will still be there-> take over a corporation->impersonate Bill Gates->When the mice show up, offer to co-rule the world on expectations that Brain will refuse->make co-ruler offer to Pinky->wait for Brain to open his big mouth and drive Pinky away.

All to take everything Brain has. His dignity, Pinky, his meager resources. Like holy Snowball, Batman.

And then Snowball reveals the amusement park he had specifically built for Pinky.

And here we have the most heartbreaking line of the ep. If I had the ability video edit I would’ve put the entire line on audio because Brain’s tone is very important here. It’s about 12:38 to 12:57 in the ep if you want to see for yourself.

“Oh, go ahead, Pinky. I don’t need you. What did you think, I just have you around so I can steal your brilliant ideas and claim them as my own? That I’m just using you, Pinky? Oh yes, I’m using you for your brilliance!”

First of all, very poor word choice, especially to someone who has trouble understanding sarcasm. I just want to dissect this statement here.

The Literal Meaning: You’re an idiot to think you were ever more than an assistant.

This is what Pinky hears.

But if you listen to Brain’s tone rather than just reading the line, he sounds genuinely hurt that Pinky would ever be tempted by something as frivolous as an amusement park. It’s Pinky, so he just sees ‘ooh fun rides, cotton candy, and carnival games’!

But Brain is perfectly aware that this is Snowball’s well-crafted method of taking away the only thing he truly has, and he knows it’s working. And he’s hurt.

The Actual Meaning: Snowball’s trying to separate us and you’re falling for it, Pinky. You may be an idiot, but many of my plans never would’ve come to fruition without you. You’re much more than an assistant. You’re my friend and my world.

Unfortunately, all Pinky hears is that Brain was only using him. That Brain values him for manual labor and an extra hand only, rather than a treasured companion. The fact that Brain often falls short of making Pinky feel appreciated just adds to this.

And now that he no longer has Pinky, Brain’s spirit is crushed. Brain is persistent, but without Pinky, he has no reason to be.

As far as he knows, his only two friends have turned their backs on him and couldn’t care less if he has nowhere else to go.

Poor thing. He needs hugs.

“I didn’t think it was possible. Humanity has actually gotten dumber.” -Brain

OK I think this one shot establishes what the world would be like under Snowball. His name is everywhere, and he tells the population to do stupid things just to bask in his own superiority.

However, I can’t see Brain putting his name on every building so frivolously like this if he ruled the world. Sure, he’d name a bunch of things after himself and Pinky, but it would be more meaningful to them.

Brain wants humanity to advance, not regress.

Poor Pinky. Despite all this new extravagance and luxury, he’s also lonely. The room and bed are large, but it lacks personality. He’s sleeping with an ACME Labs snow globe, and other than a reference to Citizen Kane, it also shows that he’s not happy with this.

The worst thing in the world for these mice is separation from each other.

Suicide by cat.

Poor little guy can’t make it on his own. Luckily, he snaps out of it.

“My world. I must save MY world!”

Said while looking at a picture of Pinky. Real subtle there Brain.

“Look, you fool. You have no brilliant ideas. I’m only using you to get at him! So just stay quiet!” -Snowball

“You’re...using me?” -Pinky

He was just a bargaining chip. Never a friend.

“What do you want?”

“My friend. And MY world!”

AWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW

He makes martial arts noises like a dork. I love him.

I love how their characters are reflected in the mecha designs (also I had no idea Snowball was Iron Man!)

Snowball’s is overall the more efficient design. It’s also much more combat ready and violent. In comparison, Brain’s suit is simply operated with a bunch of levers. It’s alright for peaceful situations like getting around faster or simply blending with a human population, but in a straight up fight the levers take too much time to operate.

Snowball is more efficient than Brain, and while he’s got the ego, he lacks the insecurities that hold Brain back. His confidence makes him such an effective foe. And more importantly, Snowball doesn’t value Pinky’s companionship. He’s a tool and nothing more. Compare that to Brain. While Brain struggles at showing it, he ultimately wants Pinky’s input and values his jumbo-sized heart.

Somewhat off topic, but I feel like the reboot missed this aspect of Brain and made him too overly edgy and violent (reboot!Brain would probably prefer Snowball’s mecha design over his counterpart’s). The only time Brain should become violent, if not for comedy, is when he’s protecting Pinky. His plans should have a level of restraint to them, and Pinky is the moral compass.

I just like this shit-eating grin right here (I mean, he did eat shit in Welcome to the Jungle so...lol)

This is such an insanely clever move for Pinky. I feel like Brain would be like ‘oh my god Pinky!’ and then ‘wow, that’s actually brilliant what the heck is this tingling feeling’.

ACME LABS IS IN NEW YORK CITY??????

I know this is a case of Where the Hell is Springfield but gdi aren’t they supposed to be in southern California.

Ok fine I realize the ending to this ep is a reference to North by Northwest cause they somehow got to Mt. Rushmore but still

Weird tangent but North by Northwest’s ending bothers me (not gonna fault this ep as it’s just a parody)? I’m sorry the girl is barely hanging onto Mt. Rushmore, the dude pulls her up, and then they have sex in a car. The sudden transition always seemed weird to me.

I am ending this analysis post with a weird shot of Snowball cause i can and it’s his episode.

#pinky and the brain #patb analysis #patb snowball #long post

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hydradrive · 5 years ago

Text

Go Hellnalysis (aka : hydradrive gets mad at the fanbase for ignoring go’s ongoing 2 season long breakdown for like, 5+ paragraphs)

We are talking S1 foreshadowing as it relates to the facts of S2. As already mentioned, I think it sucks of the writers to do it to him like how it sucks how they treated Emma and Aoi throughout the entire series and reeks of colorism like. having your two darkest skinned characters be actively antagonistic as s2 goes on is a bad fucking look.

But it’s there, and I am not happy that people defend Lightning weirdly when he treats people he knew for years badly, and then turn around and say wildly fucked up shit about Go.

I guess today is the day i Get Into It Again. I’ll be rehashing some of my points from my old thread on nac, so strap in i guess.

This is said to Playmaker in season two.

‘After i lost to you’.

So, by episode 4. And the text backs this up. The text in season one aligns.

In Go Onizuka VS Genome :

[ transcript for subbed text:

Dr. Genome : Did your defeat at Playmaker’s hands force you to evolver?

Go Onizuka : As much as I hate to admit it, yes. That was when everything changed.

/end text screenshot id ]

That was when everything changed.

Let’s look at the rest of it, then. How it affected him, in the long-term. The Go Analysis... Is here.

MASSIVE CWs for discussion of canonical weight loss, brief discussion of disordered eating in the context of that, and a whole bunch of other stuff re: the brain hack that I don’t even know how to tag, really. medical? Basically, if you have any triggers relating to that, please exercise due diligence because I will not pull any punches about the implications.

tldr version :

This is real dialogue from Go Onizuka’s first (and only) duel against Revolver.

No matter what he says trying to spin it a different way after this segment of text, that it’s about fighting for yourself, these statements exist, and they exist with the context given by his own words; that he was struggling, mental health-wise, when he said these words.

[ transcript for subbed text:

Go Onizuka : Until now, I’ve battled in front of huge crowds. (There is a single beat frame, to indicate silence.) But I realized I’m all alone. There are no fans rooting for me here. I realized... We always duel alone. We fight for ourselves, not for anyone else.

/end text screenshot id ]

But perhaps this isn’t compelling enough for people. Fine. Let’s go even further back.

[ transcript for subbed text for screen readers : Go Onizuka : It’s my fault that Makoto is in this condition. /end text screenshot id ]

Go has an easily seen habit of assuming the worst, and with regards to stuff like Makoto, blaming himself, to the point that if his manager hadn't said more on Makoto, he would've been going into VS Genome blaming himself for Makoto getting into duel monsters in the first place.

In episode 5 it was shown that with one loss he was entirely certain that nobody would care about him in any capacity:

But why?

... It’s brought up in one of the first episodes of the entire series.

[ transcript for subbed text for screen readers :

Go Onizuka’s Manager : That’s exactly it. It’s a winner-take-all world, after all.

/end text id. ]

And given an even more... depressing? Spin later, when Go thinks about it throughout S1 and S2 during his duel with Takeru:

[ transcript for screen readers :

Before I was placed in the orphanage, I only relied on myself. The world I lived in was all about survival of the fittest. “You must protect yourself” was my credo.

/ end text screenshot id ]

It’s genuinely that simple. He slipped back into his old way of surviving because the way he did in season one didn't. save him. it didn't save him from a duel he needed to win, not just for himself necessarily. he would have died if playmaker had lost. a lot of people would have. He was already starting to have these doubts about his entire reason d’etre for dueling, and his loss only further spurred it on.

It’s repeated, again and again:

[ transcript for screen readers :

Go Onizuka : For everyone to appreciate me, I must win!

/end text screenshot id ]

That sentiment. “People won’t like me if I lose.” “People will abandon me, if I lose.” In his own words, his losses, losses in duels that were important, rotted him. And it /is/ true. His manager said he’d leave if he went to try and stop the Tower Of Hanoi and lost. And he followed through with it, by all implications. He didn’t come back until season 3. Keeping in mind that Go’s self-hatred spiral regarding guilt over in his mind dragging Makoto into the mess that was season one-era Hanoi shenanigans was only cut off because his manager and other people talked him out of it... Yeah.

This is before we bring in the other complicating factor : a certain little company, who never did anything good for anyone. A man, who despite supposedly being well-intentioned, did very little to help, until it reached the darkest point.

[ transcript for subbed text for screen readers, since that’s the primary important stuff :

Akira Zaizen : But we don’t intend to acknowledge that the network was on the brink of destruction. So I ask you don’t cause the press to delve into this.

/end text screencap id]

People focus so much on him yelling at the press because they keep asking about Playmaker but with this context?

[ transcript text for screen readers:

Akira Zaizen: You’ll continue to be the focus of the press. /end text screenshot id ]

He’s not allowed to talk about how you nearly died.

He’s not allowed to talk about what really was at stake.

In fact, he’s not allowed to even act in a way that makes people even a little suspicious about what happened.

And yet.

‘But he could just ignore this advice’ . Not really. Go Onizuka’s platform was built in Link Vrains. Being the whistleblower about the actual danger of Link Vrains would not endear him to Sol, and potential backlash from Sol, from everything we know about the company? Hmm, gosh, wonder why that might be bad. Almost as if Go is basically a livestreamer who is at risk of having the video platform he exists on die.

It would be incredibly difficult to continue working under the public eye like that. The stress from that alone would start tearing someone to pieces.

Ergo, his decision to work for Sol Technologies as a bounty hunter. Both jobs now hinge on him currying favor with a horrible megacorporation, one just has less baggage from his past way of surviving and gives him the ability to talk a tiny bit more freely about things.

This is all the leadup, of course, to the ultimate lowest point. The duel chip. Brain hack.

[ transcript text for screen readers: ‘By implanting this duel chip, the brain’s thought capabilities expand.’ /end text screenshot id ]

[ transcript text for screen readers:

Akira Zaizen: You can always refuse.

Go Onizuka : Your methods are dirty. You guide me to the gates of hell, but you don’t care what happens afterwards. /end text screenshot id ]

Let’s talk about the physical side-effects of the brain chip on Go Onizuka.

Me, personally? I genuinely wonder what came first; the most severe physical side-effects or a worsening of Go’s mental health that made him stop eating.

It’s never stated what came first. We only see the mental health side effects of the chip in flashbacks initially.

I looked at one of the instances where Akira pulled go out of the sim wrt: the listed sys/dia ratios on-screen. They have those in certain shots, btw! They’re consistently really fucked up!

Here’s what those were, in one very notable instance:

... So, right off the bat, a heartrate of 195, huh.

And a sys/dia of 187/112 with a mean of 136. Wow! I wonder what that means for him!

I can tell you.

He statistically would be in the range of having a hypertensive emergency. Having rates like this can damage your heart muscle when you don’t literally have a heart attack, hypertensive encephalopathy, ( which can cause dizziness and altered levels of consciousness, if we are getting into it.), kidney failure, coughing up blood...

I don’t want to speculate too much about why the Duel Chip caused this, but I will note that blood pressures like this sometimes come about as result of issues with the neuroendocrine system. This would tie in with a loss of appetite and some of the other things Go seems to canonically have had from the getgo of having the chip installed, and probably added on to his already pre-existing mental health stuff which I personally parsed as depression.

... I think this mostly covers the main points of what gets missed. Aka, literally all of his arc. Just, literally every piece of his arc. People miss all of it.

Also, to reiterate : it is NOT GOOD the way this is framed by the writers. it is loaded to, in a series heavily informed by the main character’s trauma, have a teenaged darker skin character ( Go is 19!! ) be portrayed as more erratic, etc etc. I do Not care about Lightning. He is a little robot, and while there is probably some ableism in the way trauma is represented therein as a corrupting force, it is far more worrying how Go is treated in terms of representation, and I am not going to bat for the guy who treated Haru like dogshit lmao.

The fact that one of the two darker skinned MOC is given more obvious mental/physical illness signifiers in terms of symptoms to mark them as antagonists (when, again, Yusaku literally CANONICALLY HAS PTSD) fucking blows, and I’m going to personally fight the writers.

But. I am also laying the blame at the fanbase’s feet for this shit, too. They literally ignored this to coo over Lightning. I’m going to bite them.

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jeremiahwasajoker · 6 years ago

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5x02: Trespassers (A Review)

It’s that time again! I got to watch Trespassers on Thursday night. I know I said that I would be watching on Fridays, but I have convinced my parents to watch the night of, and they’re pretty okay with it! Anywho, tonight was episode two, and there were so many epic scenes, along with good laughs and memeable moments. This season is my favorite by far, and it just started! At any rate, let’s start this review!

WARNING: This includes spoilers. If you have not seen the episode yet and want to avoid seeing any information about it, I would advise you to not look at this until you have done so. Without further ado, let’s get started!

First, I would like to say thank you to Barry Friedman. He was apart of the show’s post production team, and unfortunately passed away in August, when they were filming this episode. They made a title card for him at the very end, and his work was vital for the show to be aired. Rest in Peace.

Also, shoutout to the composers and musicians that make the music on this show. Wow. The score is incredible! I think I remember hearing an extended version of the theme song this episode, and it blew me a way. As a music fanatic myself, it really added to the mood and atmosphere of the episode, which really elevated it even more. Wonderful job!

Next, I would like to review what I thought about some of the arcs of major characters and scenes that were incredible throughout Trespassers. They are in no particular order! Here we go!

Bruce and Ivy

IVYYYYYYYY! Peyton List is my favorite interpretation of Poison Ivy. She really encapsulates the character from the comics in the perfect way, and her design is beautiful! I like how Bruce acted throughout these scenes as he was determined as ever to get whatever it was that Selina needed in order to get better. He wasn’t going to play any games with her and when she turned on him, he was ready to fight. I will say, Bruce has become a good liar, too, as we see that he easily spit out the statement about his fake little brother. All in all, the two had a lot of chemistry together, and I just loved the scenes they shared together.

“Here he comes, Gotham...”

Erin Richards is really killing it this season. This scene was, once again, chill inducing. I feel like the quote that she said about Jim being Gotham’s most hated son will probably end up being one of the most iconic of the season. Whenever Babs yells, you can really hear the pain and utter anger in her voice, and something about this just leaves me in awe of Erin’s magnificent acting ability. Also, it is very interesting that she would help Jim out after everything. I know she said that she did so he could get killed, but we see towards the end of the episode that she genuinely wants to help. I can’t wait to see more of Barbara this season!

Harvey’s Quick Quips

First of all, I would just like to say that this picture looks like it’s supposed to be for some kind of sit-com. Anyway, Harvey was so funny this episode! I think that he’s always the one to lighten a darker situation, and he really adds humor to the scenes he’s in. Some my favorite quotes this episode were “It's a freaking arrow, Jim! IT'S A FREAKING. ARROW!" , “Jim, I don’t feel so good.” (As someone who watched Infinity War and was utterly destroyed by Spider-Man dissolving, I’m glad it was turned into a meme. I know it probably wasn’t supposed to be referencing that, but still.), and “The Halloween shop was out of gas masks, so it was either this or sexy nurse.” Him dealing with Mother was also hilarious. Gotta love Bullock.

Mother and Orphan

This exact shot of Mother scared the living daylights out of me. I love that there was a sort of horror movie feeling to this episode, I’m not the biggest fan of those, but there was such a huge feeling of suspense in this episode, and it was amazing! Her just lurking around, and Orphan acting the way he was really did succeed in creeping me out. Those lights that knock you out were interesting, and it makes me wonder if the boy was really telling the truth about that or not. I’m glad that we got context to that random shot of teeth, as I was really confused about that when it was in the trailer. I’m so glad they introduced these two villains this season!

“I feel better...even better than before, in fact.”

I’m really glad that Selina is back to normal now. I did get scared when she was convulsing, and Bruce’s reaction really does show how much he truly cares about her. If she had died, I know he would never had forgiven himself. The fact that she’s happy again also relieves me, because seeing her in so much pain beforehand really hurt. When her eyes were glowing like a cat’s, I really liked the symbolism of the scene, as she was truly turning into Cat Woman. If she’s a metahuman or not is up for debate, but I’m not opposed to the idea! I’ll get into that a little more further down the line.

Since there were too many scenes for me to have the time to cover, I’ll have some honorable mentions! Ed peeing (face it, it was unexpected and hilarious), Jim and company versus the gangs, and the soothsayers.

Now is the time for a few questions I have about the latest episode!

Is Selina a Metahuman? I’m really not sure. I know people have been commenting about this, and if she is, I honestly don’t mind. It could be symbolism with the way her eyes turned into cat’s, but if it was the medicine really working and doing that, it’s interesting how her inner nature that is being released is that of a cat. I know some people don’t like the idea of this, but I think it would be cool!

How will Jeremiah obtain the tunnel the Soothsayers were in? At first, before we were introduced to these men, I thought that maybe they worked for Jeremiah. However, their motives told me otherwise. They want to get to the mainland, and he wouldn’t want that. I think that maybe he finds the place and hires some guys to make a maze under Gotham? Another thing that confuses me is that I thought that’s where his hideout was. Where is he hiding? Where’s his latest place of residence? I’m sure we’ll find out in the future.

If I had to sum up the episode with one Jeremiah Valeska mood, it would be:

Another entertaining and hilarious episode of Gotham! I loved it!

I know some people thought this episode was boring, but I personally felt that it was needed in order to set up plots and to develop the rest of the story line this season. From Trespassers and Year Zero, I can tell that this season is going to be my favorite by the time it’s complete. I can’t believe we have ten episodes of Gotham left!

Thank you for reading this! I hope you all had a wonderful time watching, too! I think I’m going to do one of these for each one that comes out. I’m so excited for the rest of the season! I hope you enjoyed!

#Gotham #season 5 #jeremiah valeska #jim gordon #ben mckenzie #Cameron Monaghan #Harvey bullock #donal logue #barbara kean #erin richards #Poison Ivy #Peyton List #Bruce Wayne #david mazous #Mother and Orphan #Selina Kyle #Camren bicondova #Trespassers #5x02

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ncfan-1 · 7 years ago

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ncfan listens to The Magnus Archives: S1 EP011 (’Dreamer) & EP012 (‘First Aid’)

In which I have a lot of questions, and I feel like I’m not the only one.

No spoilers, please!

EP 011: ‘Dreamer’

- The imagery of this organism like a strangling vine choking the city is nice and visceral and creepy.

- So we’ve established that there’s a limit to what sort of cases the Institute will take on. It’s nice to establish this. I do wonder about stuff like that in series like this, because if the Institute treated seriously every fever dream they were told about, they’d never get any work done.

- “I know how that sounds.” Yeah, if someone said that to me, the first thing I’d assume is, uh, very different from what you’re telling us, Antonio Blake.

- Wait, Antonio’s ex is named Graham? I… I compared the statement dates of this one and ‘Across the Street’, and I think this is in the right timeframe to be right around the time Graham from that episode was replaced by not-Graham. Obviously, if this is referring to a different Graham (and yeah, I know I said not to rely on coincidences, but I think the same given name isn’t as much of a link as the same surname would be, unless the surname was, like Smith or Jones or Patel) I’m following the wrong thread, but if it is the same Graham, then wow, there’s some nasty subtext to that breakup.

Of course, I’m not sure this is the same Graham we’re talking about. Graham Folger had such a pervasive air of isolation around him that it stretches my suspension of disbelief a little to believe he had a boyfriend. But I suppose it would explain why he was often out of his flat, and it’s not like having a boyfriend would have helped him much when he was at home. Alone.

- I winced when Antonio detailed how he didn’t wake up from the dream when he fell from the roof of Canary Wharf, and didn’t wake up when he experienced the phantom pain of the landing. I’m terrified of heights, and the mere act of dream-falling would have been enough to wake me—and indeed, I think it would have been for most people, if they’re having normal dreams. But this isn’t a normal dream.

- I wonder if Antonio’s fear of taking the elevator up to the twenty-third floor is supposed to be indicative of a premonition involving an elevator malfunction.

- So the death of the head archivist at the Magnus Institute triggers some catastrophic change in supernatural activity in London? Or was there some drastic change, and the Institute—and Gertrude—was at the epicenter of it?

- “And the bridge was knotted high with the flashing vines.” I checked, and a cursory search with a few different search phrases didn’t show me any statistics that indicate that a statistically large amount of people jump from London Bridge in suicide attempts each year. If this was taking place in San Francisco and we were talking about the Golden Gate Bridge, I’d have no doubt that that’s what the vines are about there, but here, I’m not as certain. It might be a combination of suicides and car crashes, or, if the vines have been accumulating for centuries, it could just be the accumulated deaths of centuries upon the structure.

- The Magnus Institute, as described… is not entirely dissimilar from my own workplace in appearance. My workplace being a combination of administrative offices and archive for a local heritage center. Where I work as an assistant archivist. …You might see why this disturbs me a bit.

- And now Jonathan suddenly has so many questions. As he should. I can understand his gut response being to assume that it was a prank, and can equally understand his being freaked out upon discovering that no, this was probably not a prank.

- So Jonathan doesn’t know exactly what happened to Gertrude, and didn’t even know she was dead when he got the job? His comment about asking if she was available to give him some job training, I think, confirms something I was wondering about—whether or not he had a great deal of experience as an archivist before this. He sounds fairly young when he’s reading the statements (and when he gives his assessment of them it almost sounds like he’s trying to make himself sound older than he really is) and his seeming inability to understand that it would be better to get the hard copies of the files in chronological order before trying to digitize or record them were making me wonder. Jonathan, buddy? I hate to say this, but unless you pull some archiving info out of your head to wow me, your assistants may be better at this than you are. Yes, even Martin. Possibly especially Martin, given that he seems to have been working with the Archive in some capacity since 2010.

- Yeah, Elias sounds sketchy.

- So Tim’s the only one of the assistants you trust not to pull a prank on you? I guess I’ll have to file Tim away as the serious one.

- “But if anyone comes in ranting about dreaming my death, then I very much want to hear about it.” I’m just trying to imagine Jonathan’s possible conversation with Elias after this. Especially considering how high-strung he seems to be.

Jonathan: Hey, I just read a statement about some guy predicting Gertrude Robinson’s death in a dream. Elias: Don’t worry about it. Jonathan: But the statement is dated to just before she died. Elias: Dude, it’s not your business. Jonathan: It’s not my— You didn’t even tell me how she died! She could have overdosed on heroin at my desk for all I know! What else aren’t you telling me? Elias: Don’t worry about it. You know it’s all head-in-the-sand management around here—or did you not figure that out when I dumped you in a disorganized Archive filled with thousands of incomplete case files that hadn’t been organized according to any system, with only three assistants and no other help, and without giving you the slightest warning about the way Gertrude was running the place? I mean, if that didn’t tip you off that I’ve got no interest in giving you guidance of any kind, then I really don’t think there’s any hope for you. Jonathan: *not-so-internal screaming*

Friendly reminder that this is the kind of assignment that can make people start fantasizing about killing their boss.

EP 012: ‘First Aid’

- Yeah, so I have a new favorite episode. Already. I know; I’m fickle.

- I can speak to emergency rooms never really being empty, no matter the time of night. I had to go into the emergency room at three in the morning, once, and it was in a small hospital in a rural area, and me and my parents still weren’t the only ones in the emergency room. It wasn’t full by any stretch of the imagination—again, small hospital in a rural area—but there were other people there. There was also an asshole doctor who didn’t want to take seriously the idea that I was in any real pain or medical danger, despite the fact that my lower lip had swollen to about five size its normal size and was starting to split open and leak pus.

- So we see the weirdness start to infect the hospital early with the too-quiet waiting room.

- It occurred to me that for the two men to have been burned everywhere on their body (the older truly everywhere, and the younger everywhere below his neck where there wasn’t a tattoo), they also had second-degree burns on their genitals. I flinch in sympathy, no matter what these two were getting up to that led to the burns.

- Oh, look, Jared Key’s back! I’m sure that won’t be important at all.

- I do wonder what happened that the burns stopped at his neck.

- And Jared has been tied to eye imagery again. My Tolkien roots are showing, but I am reminded a bit of the Lidless Eye, always watching.

- The bit about everyone in the hospital apart from the patients too ill to be moved disappearing (and later shown to all get up at the same time and file outside to parts and for reasons unknown) is pretty creepy. I do wonder how the patients who could get up and go outside fared, considering it was December in Britain, where it tends to snow at that time of year.

- “It sounded like… the growl of an animal, a rolling, angry sound, and I realized that the floor was shaking ever so slightly.” What was going on with the vending machine could potentially account for this, but I also like the idea of the slowly creeping horror, invisibly stalking the halls of the hospital.

- “And then I saw it. […] But I now saw that the one on the left, a clear-fronted machine that stocked bottled soft drinks, was shaking violently. As I got nearer, I saw why. In every bottle, in every row of the machine, the drinks appeared to be violently boiling. Cokes and lemonades and fruit juices shook and bubble, before one by one, the bottles exploded, coating the inside of the clear plastic front with liquid that still kept steaming and hissing. It couldn’t have taken more than thirty seconds for all of them to pop.”

One: great description. Two: I wonder what the people who restock the vending machines made of this.

- Jared is just as ambiguous a figure in this episode as he was in ‘Page Turner.’ His actions in the events of the episode itself are beneficial to the narrator—it’s possible that he saved both of their lives—but he’s clearly caught up in the affairs of things moving just beyond our ability to see them. Things that are not benevolent. He doesn’t come off as being malicious in personality, but he’s still caught up in a lot of shady shit. And we’ve seen him kill at least once, possibly at least twice if he killed his mother and didn’t just skin her after she voluntarily committed suicide.

- “Something told me if there was a coherent explanation for everything that had happened since the ambulance arrived, then I would be no better off for knowing it.” What, no, listen, Lesere, this is absolutely the time to be asking questions.

- “Better beholding than the lightless flame.” Something to file away, I guess.

- I hope we get more information about Jared later.

- Jared was released into the care of his mother? Wasn’t Mary already dead by this point? Let me check ‘Page Turner.’ *checks ‘Page Turner’* Okay, the events of the episode take place in December 2011, and Mary turned up dead in 2008. So what, is she not really dead? Is the ghost Jared summoned with ‘Key of Solomon’ able to move around outside of their old bookstore/house? Was that someone pretending to be Jared’s mother? Well, at least now I know what Jared meant when he said he’d had worse burns than the ones you get picking up a super-heated metal trashcan.

- And now Lesere feels like she’s being watched. Lady, if I was you, I’d be more concerned by that.

- Yeah, where did they all go? Because the patients who could walk went outside, too, and I feel like standing in your bare feet in the snow for fifteen minutes would be injurious.

- “The feed cuts out for less than a second, and is replaced for a single frame, by a close-up of a human eye staring back through the video feed.” Yeah, that’s… that’s not good. You don’t want these sorts of things to take notice of you.

#ncfan listens to The Magnus Archives

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undertale-rho · 5 years ago

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Underearth: Book 5 - Chapter 2

Calibri's eyes slid open; a bitter-cold wind wailing against the sides of the house as snow fell from the chimney. Calibri let his eyes slide closed again, though shot them open upon remembering the events of the last World.

Immediately, he shot upwards, focusing magical energy into his hand as his feet touched the wooden floor of the cabin. In the center of his palm, a small glowing white orb appeared. Calibri then closed his eyes again, though the room around him was still in his sights, albeit monochromatic, his vision now heavily obscured by his hand and his face.

Rising upwards, the orb began to fly around the room, Calibri's vision keeping pace. As it continued to fly, he opened his eyes; his vision now mixed with what lay in front of him, and what the orb obtained. Once calibrations were complete, the orb shot up the chimney and towards the Citadel, specifically the closest tower.

With the orb away, Calibri pulled a diaphone stone—a small ornamented rock attached to a string—from his pocket and poured more magical energy into it. Receiving the energy, it began to glow light blue. A few seconds later, the blue darkened to a more modest blue.

"Sans." Calibri said.

"What? What's going on?" a voice came from the stone.

"I need to talk to you, in person. It shouldn't take long."

The stone went dark.

"What is it?" Sans asked after appearing in the center of the cabin.

"A RESET has just happened."

"A RESET!? But I still remember everything you told me last time."

"That's because the power to RESET has moved on to somebody else, setting a new point as its basis. Everything I told you a couple weeks ago still holds true, except for the part regarding Flowey and time of RESET."

Sans sat down at a nearby table, pulling a hotdog out of his pocket. "Alright, so who has it now?" he asked, taking a bite.

"A Human."

Sans choked upon hearing these words. "A Human? Here?"

"Yup. Don't rush yourself too hard, I'm currently searching the Royal Watchtower for them now."

Sans swallowed, then looked down at the ground. "How long have they been here?" he asked. "What have they done? Are they... as bad as Flowey?"

Calibri took a deep, thoughtful breath. "No." he said. "No, they're alright. As for how long they've been here, I wanna say... seven Runs, maybe. This one would probably make the eighth and, hopefully, final."

"Sounds like you two got to know each-other in one of the previous Runs. Anything I should know?"

Calibri gave Sans a reprehensive look. "No, nothing too important." he said. "You two did become close friends in a previous Run, though."

Sans chuckled at that statement.

"I'm serious." Calibri reinforced. "This Human even went out of their way to befriend our brother, Papyrus, and even Undyne."

"They befriended Undyne? No, that's impossible. Undyne hates Humans more than anything else in this world. I can't think of a single thing that could possibly change this."

"What about Papyrus establishing the befriending of a Human as a great challenge?"

Sans looked back at Calibri. "You're kidding."

"Nope. It was actually quite entertaining to watch. Especially when Undyne actually took him up on that challenge and ended up blowing her house up again."

Sans began laughing. "Wow, that definitely sounds like Undyne."

"Indeed." Calibri said, his smile dropping as soon as an anthropomorphic goat climbed through an opening in a purple wall. "I've found them." he said, shifting the tone of the room again. Flying through the hole, Calibri found a Human standing distracted, staring at a nearby wall. He was unarmed, even lacking the leather gauntlets Calibri had last seen him in. Shooting past his face, the Human began looking around for the orb of light that had passed but moved on when nothing came from his brief search.

"Alright, it looks like we may be in the clear." Calibri said, his vision orb keeping close watch from a distance on the Human.

Calibri, focusing back on where he was, looked over to Sans. "While we wait for more information, could you tell me the story of the Prince and the Human? It's been some time since I last heard it."

Sans was taken aback by this strange request. Despite not knowing his brother's mind, he didn't raise question.

"A long time ago," Sans began, "a Human fell into the Citadel. Injured by its fall, the Human called out for help. Asriel, the King's son, heard the Human's call. He brought the Human back to the castle. Over time, Asriel and the Human became like siblings. The King and Queen treated the Human child as their own. The Underground was full of hope. Then... One day... The Human became very ill. The sick Human had only one request. To see the flowers from Ochyro, their village. But there was nothing we could do. The next day, the Human died. Asriel, wracked with grief, absorbed the Human's SOUL. He transformed into a being with incredible power. With the Human SOUL, Asriel crossed through the Barrier. He carried the Human's body into the sunset, back to Ochyro. Asriel reached the center of the village. There, he found a bed of golden flowers. He carried the Human onto it. Suddenly, screams rang out. The townspeople saw Asriel holding the Human's body. They thought that he had killed the child. The Humans attacked him with everything they had. He was struck with blow after blow. Asriel had the power to destroy them all. But... Asriel did not fight back. Clutching the Human... Asriel smiled and walked away. Wounded, Asriel stumbled home. He entered the palace and collapsed. His dust spread across the garden. The Kingdom fell into despair. The King and Queen had lost two children in one night. The Humans had once again taken everything from us. The King decided it was time to end our suffering. Every Human who falls down here must die. With enough SOULs, we can shatter the Barrier forever."

"I see..." Calibri said, a hand stroking his chin. "Thank you..."

Sans watched Calibri with interest throughout the story. "You look troubled." he said.

"Yeah... just a little bit."

Calibri then stood up, approaching a bookcase in the corner. From the bookcase, he pulled out an old patchwork book and brought it over to the table which Sans sat at, and sat down himself, opening it up.

"Anything you wanna tell me about? Maybe I could help."

"Gimme a few seconds, Sans." Calibri flipped through the pages.

The two sat in silence for a time, the only sounds were that of the wind outside, and the flipping of paper. After a bit, Calibri closed the book and placed it flat against the table.

"Do you know when that story was written, and by who?" Calibri asked.

"Uh... sometime after the heirs died, by Asgore I think."

"Right. So then that begs the question; how trustworthy is it?"

"What do you mean?"

"According to this personal account of those times," Calibri pointed to the old book, "things don't exactly add up all that well. Simply thinking about it brings up some holes as well. Firstly, how the use of 'castle' and 'palace' are used as they are, though this could just be the difference in timeframe between when Chara fell and when she died. Another problem that arises from this, though, is the fact that the Palace wasn't right next to the exit at this time. It was where the Oldtown Palace is right now, which is far from any exit, or entrance for that matter."

"You're saying that people should have seen Asriel leaving and returning, right? What makes you so sure they didn't?"

"The journals from the time only mention Asriel leaving, but not returning. This one," Calibri pointed at the old book again, "is from... Wing."

Sans twitched at the mention of that name. Calibri, understanding why, simply continued.

"Seeing as he was alive at the time, and even helped Asriel leave in the first place—according to his own account, it's a good resource to work from. Asriel just left one day, and next thing everyone knew, Asgore was saying that he too was dead. Being close friends with the King, Wing even got to visit where Asriel died, though the descriptions he gives are more poetic than helpful—as though he could actually feel sorrow. All I can tell is that it's most definitely not in the palace. My best guess is somewhere in Waterfall, but those caves are dark, and most haven't even been explored."

"Shame." Sans said, the lights in his eyes gone.

Calibri delved back deep into thought.

"Wait a second..." he eventually said.

"Figure something out?"

"Maybe... Do you remember the rainy area in Waterfall?"

"Kinda hard to forget. The area around Asriel Lake, right?"

"Yup." Calibri stood up. "Let's go there."

"What? Now?"

"Yeah now."

"What about the Human?"

Calibri closed his eyes. The purple hallways of the Citadel came back into focus. The Human was talking peacefully with a Froggit.

"They're good, don't worry about them." Calibri said, stretching his hand out to Sans.

Sighing, Sans took Calibri's hand and focused on Asriel Lake within Waterfall. Like the opening of a door, he sent himself through, pulling Calibri along with. Once on the other side, they both found themselves in the last bit of shelter from the rain surrounding and feeding the lake.

"Excellent!" Calibri said as he turned around and started making his way towards a rain-drenched statue. Sans simply followed after.

Once in front of the statue, Calibri kneeled down and stared at it. The upper surfaces of the statue had weathered away from centuries of rainfall.

"You don't think—" Sans started saying before Calibri shushed him.

Still staring at the statue, Calibri slowly brought his hand up over its chest, his eyes glowing red soon after. The statue, Calibri felt, was not regular stone. It felt as though it had been alive at some point before, though the only life within now seemed to be... asleep.

Calibri pulled his hand away.

"So... this was your fate, huh..." Calibri mumbled to the statue. "But what of Chara...?"

Sans simply watched with interest, making sure to not distract.

Calibri clapped his hands together, a red pulse of energy erupting from his compressed palms out into the surrounding caves. After a few seconds, he felt a presence—familiar, yet novel. Standing up, Calibri followed the thread of familiarity, which led him to a dead-end room with a piano in the corner.

"Sans." Calibri said. "What's beyond here?"

"A 'treasure room' for a puzzle Undyne set up, I think."

"Where'd she find the treasure?"

Sans shrugged his shoulders. "Nearby? She's not really the type to put a lot of effort into puzzles or their rewards."

"I see..." Calibri turned to face Sans again. "We need to go to the primary access corridor of the Royal Watchtower."

"Inside the Citadel? Why?"

"To pick up the Human, of course."

"Wha! Seriously?"

"Don't really have much time, Sans. He's getting ready to move on."

Sans grabbed Calibri's outstretched hand and opened a tunnel to within the Citadel, exiting into a long hallway with many pale-grey pillars lining the walls.

Once within, Calibri saw a rather unremarkable Human standing nearby—one who wore a blue sweater with two pink stripes running around its middle, and dark blue jeans.

Immediately, Calibri brought his white orb into the Human's view, summoning more to accompany the first. Once his attention had been captured, Calibri drew the orbs back to him, having them circle around Sans before dispelling them near his own hand.

Emergence : Inquisitor

Previous First posting First of this book Next

#undertale #undertale au #undertale rho #UTRStory #underearth #emergence

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obaewankenope · 8 years ago

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The Gospel of the Anakin Apologist + The General Rudeness of Unrelated Comments on a Post

So @stonefreeak had an anon show up and whine about Padme. I and @sanerontheinside added our two cents in then *waves hands* SOME ASSHOLE shows up and wants to play ‘Anakin is a victim and Padme is a stupid ho and Obi-Wan is to blame for EVERYTHING EVER’ on the post even though, amusingly enough, it has no bearing on the discussion in the slightest.

Ergo I got vexed.

Actually all of us did bc wow stupid much.

The rest is under a read more because wow this got long and salty.

Also I’m tagging people so they can share the salt: @meabhair, @kyberpunk, @maawi, @markwatnae, @lilyrose225writes, @knight-kennedy, @punsbulletsandpointythings, @deadcatwithaflamethrower, @myurbandream, @jhaernyl :)

You see, we were discussing Padme as a female character and the double-standard around female characters being expected to be perfect and male characters essentially being able to do whatever the fuck they want so long as they’re pretty (pick a fandom, any fandom, you’re guaranteed to see the same dichotomy in treatment of male - female characters).

Apparently we can’t do that shit tho bc ‘oh no you’re blaming my bae!!!’ like wow, really fucking stupid much.

Anyway, to explain why I’m raging (why all of us are raging actually: it’s glorious to behold and I feel so blessed to experience the righteous fury of my spouses and friends) I personally feel like this particular person has literally pulled the embodiment of that “she doesn’t even go here” meme because whoa boy, their reblog does not belong here.

Now, in general I’m usually quite happy to let the morons roll on by like the sad little tumbleweeds of ignorance they are. But not when it’s on a post informing others of the behaviour and perception of gender/sex relations and treatment of characters in fandom. When you show up here and want to blame a single character who is flawed, especially just to venerate and excuse the behaviour of another flawed character... well, then I feel obligated to respond.

It’s not personal it is it’s just in my nature.

Okay so, first paragraph of their reblog (and subsequent stupid dialogue included) sums up the situation on Mustafar as ‘Padme should have been a good wife and sided with her genocidal husband who just helped wipe out thousands of lives (including children) bc she’s his wife’ and that ‘Obi-Wan is responsible bc he tried to do his duty as a Jedi’ and apparently that’s wrong as according to the Gospel of the Anakin Apologist.

Of course, they make a general, sweeping statement about Obi-Wan, describing him as a ‘fantastic space cop but an asshole friend and a person in general’ which, as I’m sure you’re all aware, shows a typical lack of understanding of what the Jedi are in universe, and also the background of Obi-Wan and Anakin’s interaction.

This isn’t unusual and I’m not gonna berate people for not knowing about the EU (Extended Universe) materials, or those damned benighted Junior Apprentice (JA) novels about Obi-Wan’s padawanship (and Anakin’s later on). The thing is though, there is plenty of information available about Obi-Wan, his background and so on on various websites -- Wookieepedia, to name but one -- so I don’t think it’s fair to be so quick to judge a character, any character, without understanding their background.

Even if this blogger is uninitiated into the ranks of SW lore and such, even if they only have the movies to go on, I still consider them to have a shockingly particular mindset and perspective of the relationship between the three protagonist characters.

So, here’s the thing, the below is a direct quote from their post. As you can see it’s... a particular perspective.

Padme should have sided with Anakin or Obi-Wan clearly when Anakin confronted her about Obi-Wan being on the ship, Obi-Wan killed Padme by appearing while they were talking, Padme might’ve been able to talk some sense into Anakin or join him, i guess Obi-Wan was afraid Padme would flip sides and decided to burst out with his “hello there” bullshit, if i was Padme i would have immediately said “that fucker snuck on my ship i had nothing to do with this, take care of him my love!” or “oh shit, well i didn’t plan this Obi-Wan tag in!” i know she was shocked and all that jazz but lady think on your feet, you went to meet your fugitive husband who just killed a academy full of space coplings on isolated planet and a space cop popped out of your trunk, use your words and use them quick! Anakin choking his wife in anger is understandable when you think of it from his perspective, “ok im on the hide from the law(Jedi), ill contact my wife and get her to safety” “hi love i came alone as you asked” “oh thank god for a moment i thought you might sympathize with the corrupt jedi” *Obi-Wan dumb ass pops out of the shadows* “hello there bitches!~~” “wtf Padme?! you brought a cop to our meet out?! you do know i am wanted dead right!? You little bitch! i did this all so i could keep you alive and this is how you repay me? i killed younglings to get this power Padme fucking younglings! you ungrateful little bitch ill kill you!” “hey bro let her go you said you wanted to save her right? kind of doing the opposite right now” “… god damn it i hate it when he is right, lets fight!”

First of all, they’re working on the assumption that Anakin was hiding from the Jedi. Second of all, that he was hiding from the Law(Jedi). Perhaps their memory has failed them, but I’ll provide a little breakdown of how the third movie actually went so they can understand that their initial narrative is... well, to put it plainly, ‘wrong and really wrong’.

1. Separatists vs Republic battle with Obi-Wan and Anakin going after Dooku. Dooku dies by Anakin’s hands after being disarmed (this is murder btw, rules of war mean that if your opponent loses or surrenders, then you don’t kill them -- this is generally considered a war crime).

2. Obi-Wan and Anakin talk about stuff and then Obi-Wan heads off to chase Grievous alone. This is after Anakin has been put on the Council by Palpatine even though he’s only been a Knight for a while. The Jedi do not approve, Obi-Wan is cautious and advises Anakin to be careful (Anakin ignores him by the way and continues to be friendly with Palpatine).

4. While Obi-Wan is off after Grievous, Anakin has Palpatine’s identity revealed to him. Gets played into saving him from Mace and co in order to keep Padme alive (even though she isn’t dead by the way). Anakin then goes to the Temple with a collection of Clones and helps murder every Jedi there. He purposefully murders the children in the Council chambers.

5. Obi-Wan is nearly killed after defeating Grievous because of Order 66. He escapes and hides. Meets up with Yoda and Bail. Goes to the Temple. Finds out that Anakin killed Jedi and is heartbroken by this fact. Then he goes to Padme after being tasked by his superior to go and defeat Anakin. He tells her the truth and she refuses to believe him.

6. Padme goes to meet with Anakin who is on Mustafar, drowning in his angst-ridden guilt of now having become an accomplice to genocide. Obi-Wan tags along, knowing that Anakin and Padme love each other so much that both would forsake their duties. He hides and Padme doesn’t know. Anakin doesn’t notice.

7. Padme rejects Anakin BEFORE Obi-Wan shows himself, because she realises he’s literally gone crazy. Then Anakin turns on Padme and chokes her into unconsciousness, even though she’s heavily pregnant and he ‘loves’ her. Obi-Wan gets Anakin to focus on him and they fight.

8. They fight to the point where Obi-Wan has the high-ground and Anakin does a stupid and gets his limbs cut off. Obi-Wan leaves him to burn to death (brutal) and goes to Padme. He takes her for treatment and instead watches one of his oldest friends die while her children are made into orphans.

9. Movie ends with Anakin becoming the giant suit version of Vader and Obi-Wan on Tattooine delivering Luke to his aunt and uncle.

Anakin isn’t evading the law, aka the Jedi, he’s killed them. Obi-Wan is the one evading the law because it wants him dead. Anakin is on Mustafar because Sidious told him to take out the Sep leadership. Padme meets him there after hearing the truth from Obi-Wan and only believes it when Anakin admits it himself. Then she rejects him. Obi-Wan does his duty as a Jedi -- sworn to destroy the Sith -- and the end is that Padme dies because Anakin loses his temper and lashes out at her.

I may be Anakin apologist but considering his situation he didn’t act out of character, id be pissed off too if i contacted my wife when i am in hiding and she brings a cop there (it seemed like that to Anakin since he didn’t know Obi-wan snuck on board) before i can explain myself to my wife

Firstly, you are an Anakin apologist and he did act out of character. His behaviour after discovering Sidious’ identity and stopping Mace from killing a Sith Lord is out of character. Anakin is a bright, kind and friendly child with a temper issue. Anakin is someone who hates injustice and despises the way some people are treated by others for no other reason than because of where they were born or who they were born to. He was a slave and then he became a Jedi; he went from victim to protector. His final character jump sent him from protector to oppressor. That’s not in character, that’s specifically cultivated and justified behaviour because he puts his own needs above absolutely everything else.

He also had the chance to explain to Padme. He didn’t deny what he did and Padme actively rejected him when she realised he wasn’t sorry for what he’d done ‘in the name of love’. You’re justifying abuse and don’t even realise it.

Think of it like this, in a galaxy where there are force powers etc shit you keep seeing horrible nightmares of your wife dying, your mother gets kidnapped by space isis and killed, you butcher the village in retaliation and tell your wife about it, after which the greatest political figure of your “country” tells you that there is a way to save your wifes life from the faith that seems foretold (like someone offering you a cure for cancer when you think your wife has cancer), the old dude tells you you have to do something to get the cure (equivalent would probably be extracting stem cells from kids spines or something lethal), well you love your wife and can’t let her die because love, well you go and do the dirty deed like a loving husband would can’t let your honey bun die, now you’re kind of in hiding waiting for your old dude friend to wipe out the cops (rought shit but it will all be worth it when i save my wife from certain death), you contact your wife and tell her to meet you in some backwater planet where you two can talk it out, you can tell her why you did it and you can finally save her from her faith, your wife finally arrives the joy we are finally together, listen wife the reason i killed the younglings is “Everybody down on the ground, the Jedi man has arrived!”, all your efforts to get the cure, all you did in the name of saving your wife and she brings a cop to execute you (that’s what he thought and can’t blame him, how the fuck did she not know Obi-Wan snuck on board?)

Firstly, Shmi Skywalker was kidnapped and tortured by Tusken Raiders on Tattooine, not ‘Space ISIS’. The settlers on Tattooine are the proverbial invaders of a planet where the Tuskens are the natural species. So your metaphor is inaccurate and shows but a lack of understanding and also a clear desire to produce extreme sympathy for Anakin. We don’t know why the Tusken’s took Shmi but it’s generally considered unusual behaviour. We do know that they have attacked farms on Tattooine before and that they have been united by an ex-Jedi at one point when Obi-Wan was in exile. This is all we know. So you’re making an assumption that they’re evil terrorists when you don’t even have the material to back you up.

Anakin killed an entire village of Tuskens, including women and children. There is no excuse for that. Unless you think it would be acceptable for a US soldier to execute the children in an Iraqi village because some of the inhabitants were part of Al Queda?

Obi-Wan had already informed Anakin in Attack of the Clones that ‘dreams pass in time’ referring to Anakin’s recurring problems with his dreams about his mother. Anakin didn’t inform Obi-Wan of anything after that and so Obi-Wan has no knowledge. He tried to help, in his own way. Anakin’s behaviour and fear of what he dreamt about Padme drove him to extremes of behaviour -- the love he held for her is what destroyed him because he was so selfish as to refuse to let her go.

The dangers of attachment isn’t of falling in love, it’s in that love turning into obsession which is what happened with Anakin. Palpatine used Anakin’s fears of losing Padme to sway him into his service and with Mace’s death, sealed his fate and that of Padme.

Do you honestly think Padme would have died had she not been choked into unconsciousness by her ‘loving’ husband on a boiling planet of death, after the revelation that her husband had willingly committed genocide because of his love for her?

If you do then there’s no hope for you.

The dialogue of the Mustafar scene is below, read it and perhaps recognise that Anakin admits to having become obsessed with power and paranoid. Perhaps also recognise how Padme only rejects him after he says he’s going to overthrow the Chancellor and together they can rule the galaxy.

Padme: Obi-Wan told me terrible things Anakin: What things? Padme: He said, you’d turned to the Dark Side. That you... killed younglings? Anakin: Obi-Wan is trying to turn you against me Padme: He cares about us Anakin: Us? Padme: He knows. He wants to help you... Anakin, all I want is your love Anakin: Love won’t save you Padme, only my new powers can do that Padme: At what cost? You’re a good person, don’t do this! Anakin: I won’t lose you the way I lost my mother. I am becoming more powerful than any Jedi has ever dreamed of. And I’m doing it for you. To protect you Padme: Come away with me. Help me raise our child. Leave everything else behind while we still can! Anakin: Don’t you see? We don’t have to run away anymore. I have brought peace to the Republic. I am more powerful than the Chancellor. I- I can overthrow him. And together you and I can rule the galaxy. Make things the way we want them to be Padme: [backs away, shaking head] I don’t believe what I’m hearing. Obi-Wan was right, you’ve changed Anakin: I don’t want to hear any more about Obi-Wan. The Jedi turned against me, don’t you turn against me Padme: I don’t know you any more. Anakin... you’re breaking my heart. You’re going down a path I can’t follow Anakin: Because of Obi-Wan? Padme: Because of what you’ve done! What you plan to do! Stop! Stop now! Come back! I love you! Anakin: LIAR! Padme: No! Anakin: You’re with him! You brought him here to kill me! [Starts choking HIS WIFE] Obi-Wan: Let her go Anakin!

The end of this interaction is that Padme rejects Anakin for going power-mad, Anakin admits he’s become a stranger to her and then attacks her over a perceived betrayal -- out of character for someone who at the beginning of the movie thought Padme might have been cheating on him and then APOLOGISED for thinking such things in the first place.

In conclusion to your post that I’m not going to ever reblog, but will link here so others can read it in full, I have to say that your ending paragraph is... well, a fantastic example of selective thinking and something I daresay several of my friends from my psych classes would have had a field day with the dispositional and situational bias you exhibit.

who nearly killed Anakin and Padme? Obi-wan freaking Kenobi, well done douchebag, be sure to lie to his son that Vader killed Anakin to pit a son against his own father, Obi-wan was a fantastic space cop but an asshole friend and a person in general, dude is the reason Luke’s father is a space cyborg and Padme is a corpse, but that’s not all let’s turn their son into a space cop and tell him to kill daddy cyborg, he’ll never know it was his father, if he did this could really backfire but who gives a shit ill probs be dead by then

#Star Wars #Meta #Meta Mic Drop #Anakin Skywalker #Obi-Wan Kenobi #Padme Amidala #MAKE WAY APOLOGISTS I AM SALTING AND BURNING MY WAY THROUGH YALL

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myheartisbro-ken · 8 years ago

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Hi! 💙 I hope your are doing well. Congrats on the article. The reading will probably be okay. Are you a fast or slow reader? I read rather slowly, especially if I'm enjoying what I'm reading. It sticks with me better that way, but it takes me longer to do things. 😅 My semester ends next week, then have finals period. l'm taking Summer courses tho to get ahead. I get what you mean. I don't party, but around TH and F there's a certain restlessness about some of the students to drink/part. (Pt 1)

Ugh, I hate group work. 😐 Best of luck to you. Maybe your for a decent group. Anyway, I prefer morning courses. I get up at an obnoxiously early time to attend though. I’m fine with it though because it lets me take my courses in a block with out breaks, so once I’m done, I’ll be done for the day. 😥 Probably an unpopular schedule though. Oh, so My Immortal can actually be constructive to writers. That makes sense. It’s what a writer shouldn’t ever do. About JK, I think it’s an attempt (pt 2)(pt 3) Lowkey don’t recall my train of thought..Anyway, wow, I definitely agree with your statements about Lena knowing Kara’s dual identity. Snapper knowing wouldn’t help anything, since he’s too minor a character to do anything useful with information. Lena knowing would create more depth, tension, plot possibilities etc., which is why’d it would be a shame for her to be left in the dark. Also, I feel her not knowing (or at least theorizing Kara’s supergirl) is ooc. I suppose the writers– <3–haven’t had an issue with that based on what they’ve done to Alex. :-/ Hmph. I’m still so annoyed about that. Partially, because I’m a SuperCorp shipper, but mainly because it’s an insult to Alex’s personality to force her to advocate on Mon El’s behalf. Who was your favorite character from S1, btw? I’d probably go with Kara, but for S2 it’s definitely Lena. Anyway, yes Lena looks so amazing in the trailer! Heh, I intended it to be a soft FMK…I was going to make it all Katie, but wasn’t–(4)–words, words, something, but wasn’t going to be that cruel to you. (Hopefully that fit with my previous thing). Smh, you’ve no qualms though do you? ;-) I’m kidding. Your answers were well thought out…even though you didn’t kill anyone. I can’t blame you though. I don’t think Red K! Kara is all that bad, but she’s definitely intimidating, so is Kate. Anyway, let’s see FMK: Lena, Morgana,and Kate… :-/ 3 M'kay, that’s hard, especially since I love them all and ship SuperCorp. (5 TBC)–words, words, something, but wasn’t going to be that cruel to you. (Hopefully that fit with my previous thing). Smh, you’ve no qualms though do you? ;-) I’m kidding. Your answers were well thought out…even though you didn’t kill anyone. I can’t blame you though. I don’t think Red K! Kara is all that bad, but she’s definitely intimidating, so is Kate. Anyway, let’s see FMK: Lena, Morgana,and Kate… :-/ 3 M'kay, that’s hard, especially since I love them all and ship SuperCorp. (5 TBC)(6) Uh, let’s see. I’m going to assume they are all brought to current times, so the 21st century. I would marry Morgana. You know what? I’d marry Morgana S1 or S5 because I’ve so many emotions for her and what she went through. I’d want her to know someone would be on (*cough* and by *cough*) her side. Also, she has magic that’s cool, but not the point. I don’t really want Supergirl to kill me or be sad. I wouldn’t kill Lena as of now; she’s not done anything wrong. Also, her company is (TBC)(8?) So, yes: M:Morgana, F: Lena, K: Kate. Hmm, I see yours and raise you: FMK: Lucy, she’s a vampire now but has some control over it | Kara Danvers, more so S1 in personality, but she’s still elects to become a reporter and encourages you | Lena, before she met Kara and is still learning to be a CEO…I guess that’s a younger!Lena? Idk. Okay, that should work. I hope you have a good day and night. Do you read comics? I don’t, but was curious if you did. U seem to know some lore. :-) <3 (fin)

Heyyy! I’m not so sure I’m a fast or slow reader, it depends on my state of mind, if I take my meds and external interruptions. Usually I can read pretty fast if it’s something I’m interested in but I tend to miss things and have to read it again, with school things I’m the worst. I still have things from last year that I never got around to read and one of them was about superman (I miss studying cinema because we could have an entire class about superman and co and then write fanfiction of the world as an activity). We don’t have summer classes here, that sounds interesting, it’d be nice to get ahead, also it’s about to be winter here so after July we’ll get maybe a month off and then it’s back to being unresponsible adults. I’ve nothing against drinking and partying, I like drinking (parties are usually weird but sometimes it’s cool) but don’t freaking leave class to do it, go after the class, how disrespectful is it to leave the poor teacher there waiting 20 minutes to see if the rest of the class will show up or they’ll have to do with six or seven people? Also you pay over 1.000 bucks a month to study and you don’t give a shit about being in class? it’s throwing money away and it’s disrespectful to whoever is paying school, even if that someone is yourself. I’m not those kids that say you should only do what’s right and never skip class never drink or do anything because you have to study instead of throwing your life away. But school is expensive and respect is something you should have for everyone (unless someone is a jerk, because it’s not murder if the person is a jerk…jk)

I never liked studying in the mornings but it’s sort of better, however, my classes only exist at night, there is morning journalism classes, but it’s in another neighborhood and we have to cross the bridge and there’s no cool campus. I like my campus.

group projects are the worst. They end friendships, they end marriages, they end happiness, they lead to murder… it’s never fun. I always imagine that scene with the guy getting pizza and coming back to the place on fire and people bleeding, or that one from Mean Girls with the fighting over Aaron Samuels in animal style. Those are the only representations of group projects that are realistic.

I love how you just started to talk about JK, had two words in and

Honestly Alex has been so ooc this season it’s almost sad. No offense to Sanvers, but I think even that relationship is a bit ooc. Not the fact that there is a relationship but how it is being handled. Not gonna go into it cuz I don’t want to rant here. but I would ship Sanvers if they had put a bit more of effort into getting them together not ‘I don’t want a baby gay rn, so let’s be friends. PSYCHE I just got shot in the most harmless area of my entire body, let's make out!’

The same Alex that thought James wasn’t good enough for Kara and decked Maxwell Lord for existing would never make excuses for someone that is basically the dumb alien version of Lord with worse hair and more aggression and more pretending to be a #goodguy who’s just trying so hard and changed because after 9 months on earth as a grown man he decided to read a book, feed himself and clean his own mess… or pretend to clean his own mess while Kara actually does it and he just sits there and says she’s annoying because she doesn’t want to run away from her problems. (hey look, ranting… she said with surprise in her voice for some reason)

My favorite character was definitely Cat… and Kara. Both at the same time, I can’t choose between them, please don’t make me. and now it’s Lena… and still Kara even though she’s basically dead inside and that girl who cries because her boyfriend is moving away and it will destroy her life because that person she knows nothing about and met 9 months ago when he tried to kill her and has been lying to her and shoving her self-esteem down ever since is apparently the most important person in her life and she can’t live without him. he cooked her breakfast so he can’t move away and face his responsibilities, she’s the best thing he’s ever known, not person, thing. That woman in the best thing… god, this is so gross I cannot continue even to joke about this. so yeah, Kara is SUPER ooc this season, but I still love her and have faith she will recover from this terrible illness and come back to us, I miss her.

Yes! I would totally still marry Morgana even season 5 Morgana. poor thing just needs a hug and a friend to tell her she’s not a monster for being born different. I might start crying now so I’ll change topics.

Definitely Marry Kara, no questions asked. Fuck Lena because, I mean, just look at her. And Kill Lucy, my poor bby, but she’s a vampire so she has to go, control or not, ‘vegetarian’ vampires are dumb.

I do read comics, not as much as I’d like, but I also watched all of the DC cartoons (minus Legion because it looks dumb) most of Smallville and Lois & Clark and when I want to know some more I read about the storylines and all, like even when I don’t read the comic itself, I read about the comic. I won’t say I know all about everything, but I can hold my ground, I guess, I’m also not above admitting I don’t know/haven’t read enough about one subject/character and reading about that on one of the sites I trust. Also watched a lot of Marvel cartoons and most of the movies aaaand I read a lot of Marvel comics, specially Balck Widow, Hawkeye, and Young Avengers.

Did you watch any superhero cartoons? They were a pretty big deal in the 90′s and early 2000′s.

Hope you have a great day and night 💙😊

#answered asks #💙

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erraticfairy · 6 years ago

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Podcast: Haunted Asylums – Stigmatizing or Just Entertainment?

Each Halloween we encounter the same debate: are haunted asylums stigmatizing or are they simply entertainment? While some may think haunted asylums are tasteless at worst, they don’t feel like they’re an actual detriment to the mental illness community. In this episode, we look at this argument from both sides and really dig into what happens when we use mental illness as a theme for entertainment. While Jackie and Gabe both make great arguments, we toss this question back to you.

Are you offended by haunted asylums or do you see them as harmless entertainment — or something in between? Listen now and decide for yourself.

(Transcript Available Below)

SUBSCRIBE & REVIEW

About The Not Crazy Podcast Hosts

Gabe Howard is an award-winning writer and speaker who lives with bipolar disorder. He is the author of the popular book, Mental Illness is an Asshole and other Observations, available from Amazon; signed copies are also available directly from Gabe Howard. To learn more, please visit his website, gabehoward.com.

Jackie Zimmerman has been in the patient advocacy game for over a decade and has established herself as an authority on chronic illness, patient-centric healthcare, and patient community building. She lives with multiple sclerosis, ulcerative colitis, and depression.

You can find her online at JackieZimmerman.co, Twitter, Facebook, and LinkedIn.

Computer Generated Transcript for ‘Haunted Asylums’ Episode

Editor’s Note: Please be mindful that this transcript has been computer generated and therefore may contain inaccuracies and grammar errors. Thank you.

Announcer: You’re listening to Not Crazy, a Psych Central podcast. And here are your hosts, Jackie Zimmerman and Gabe Howard.

Jackie: Hello and welcome to Not Crazy. I’m here with my co-host, who is Gabe Howard. And this year for Halloween, he’s going as your friendly neighborhood bipolar beanstalk.

Gabe: I like being a bipolar beanstalk, and I am here with Jackie Zimmerman, who not only lives with depression, but when I invited her to my Halloween party, she said, “Oh, hell no, they’ll be kids there.”

Jackie: I don’t like kids. It’s not my thing. I hate kids.

Gabe: You are not required to like children. Now, as the audience has probably figured out, we’re doing a Halloween episode and we decided to take the most serious mental health advocacy point, one that always makes national headlines, big, massive organizations take this on to fight it. It’s a real serious thing in mental health advocacy.

Jackie: Is it that serious? I know we’re doing an episode on this, but is this really a thing that happens every year that people care about that much?

Gabe: Every year it makes national news, every year it makes the local news, the national news. It makes the paper. I read about this issue constantly.

Jackie: Whoa, whoa. You read the paper?

Gabe: I mean, online. I read the online paper.

Jackie: The digital?

Gabe: Google’s a paper, right?

Jackie: I read the digital paper.

Gabe: I read the digital paper.

Jackie: We’re talking about haunted asylums. And I have feelings.

Gabe: You have feelings on everything, and in a previous episode, you said that the best part about being a young blonde white woman is that you can be offended by everything. And it’s OK. Like, I genuinely and honestly feel like this is one of those things that is just not that big of a deal. It’s just not that offensive. I’m sorry. It’s not.

Jackie: You know, Gabe, first of all, I am offended by everything and I’m allowed to do that based on all the things that you said, but also because I have this lovely platform where I can tell people how offended I am and win them over. So in this scenario, I do think that haunted asylums are offensive, like the portrayal of mental illness in them. These subconscious things that they are giving to the people who attend them. I just don’t feel like they’re helping anything. What’s the point? What’s the point?

Gabe: I love that you said what’s the point? Because the point is not mental health advocacy. The point is to scare people. It’s a Halloween attraction. You plop down your 5, 10, 15, 20, 25 dollars because some of these things are just really elaborate and you go in to get scared. It’s fun. It’s a holiday. I just I understand that there’s a nuance. There’s a nuanced debate to be had here. And we’re not going to have it. But I’m sorry. I really just have a hard time believing that any rational or reasonable person thinks that a haunted asylum or haunted house with crazy psychos is an actual representation of mental illness. I’m sorry. I think that it is so over the top that it is obviously not anything except for a Halloween fun thing.

Jackie: I read a lot of articles about this because, of course, I did. And in those articles, there are various people who have attended these things and walked in and been massively triggered, first of all, by what was happening. There was one where this woman took her two small sons. She lives with mental illness. She’d been hospitalized. And they left and her sons asked her, “Is that what happened when you went into the hospital?” and she had to sort of undo what they just saw and teach them the correct things about her hospitalization. It’s not so much that I think people walk in and they go, oh, this is what happens to people with mental illness or this is what happens in the hospital. It’s more or less that what people are walking away with is that people with mental illness are dangerous. Right. And when they go to the hospital, all these dangerous things happen. If they take over or they become in control, they’ll chase me with chainsaws and they’ll come after you. And it’s like a subconscious thought process. I don’t think anybody leaves feeling in danger. I think it’s one more thing that society crams into our brains subconsciously that tells us to be afraid of people with mental illness.

Gabe: That is probably true. I honestly can’t think of anything that is untrue in that statement, except that it’s not society’s responsibility to make sure that every single person is not triggered or bothered or offended or I mean, sincerely, where does that end? I am from Ohio. You are from Michigan. I am offended by Michigan because of a football rivalry that started before my grandfather was born. I am offended. Listen, you don’t have to not be from Michigan or mention Michigan around me. And frankly, if I sincerely believe this, which I don’t, I’m not a crazy football person, although Michigan sucks, it is important to understand that if I actually treated you poorly, your response to that is not to make sure that you never mentioned your home state around me. It’s my response to like find a way to deal with this. And in your example, you actually said she took her children to a haunted house with violence and murder and had to explain to her young child. Really? Where is the responsibility on her? So murder is okay. Violence is okay. Haunted thing’s killing you and scaring you were okay. But she didn’t like the tie-in to mental health issues. Wow. Okay. Yeah. All right. Next.

Jackie: Ok. Fair point. I can’t argue with that point. I still think that there is some onus on the people who are setting up these haunted houses, haunted asylums, Cedar Fair, which is a company that owns like Cedar Point or some of these other really large amusement parks that do haunted things in October have started changing the names of them. It’s not so much what they are doing in them. It’s the names that they’re giving them a words matter, right. So calling it a haunted asylum or even like a haunted mental institution, some of these things have horrible names. They’re changing them to just haunted hospitals or hospitals. I don’t know other names that I don’t remember, but it’s taking away this part of it that is directed specifically at the mental illness community. And I think that’s really important because not only are they showing these really awful things that people are going mental illness. We’re talking about society here again, where society doesn’t know a lot about inpatient treatment. They know what they learn in movies and they know what they learn on television shows. This is one more thing that society sees in conjunction with inpatient treatment. And they just chug that in the back of their head and go, OK, well, this is what happens in inpatient facilities.

Gabe: You’re not wrong.

Jackie: I know.

Gabe: There is misinformation everywhere. For example, on television, we see cars routinely driven off of the third floor parking garage, you land on the ground and keep going. That’s utter nonsense. We see movies where people get into fights and just get punched in the face like full power 20, 30 times. No problem. People get shot and they’re OK. It’s a flesh wound. Pop culture is not a good place to get information. It just isn’t. And this is an example of that. This is not a good place to get information. Why is that not the talking point? Why is the talking point not Americans are stupid and keep relying on fiction to get their facts?

Jackie: That is a talking point, I mean, again, you’re not wrong, but people are doing this, they are going to pop culture for information. How many times have people said, oh, I know about that, I saw it in Grey’s Anatomy or on House? People are learning from these shows. And again, it’s not so much the violence, which that’s like a whole other thing. It’s the representation of the mental illness community. This would never fly in cancer if you walked into a haunted house and there was an osteosarcoma patient on a table and somebody with a chainsaw was cutting their leg off. And then that person chased you around and was like, I’m going to cut your leg off because you have cancer. That wouldn’t happen. That doesn’t happen for any other illness other than mental illness.

Gabe: I’m going to disagree with you there because we’ve all seen the crazy surgeon. Huh, I guess crazy is in there. You’re right. I guess I guess mental illness is there

Gabe: Where they remove your brain.

Jackie: Point my team.

Gabe: Look what you did.

Jackie: And don’t you think to some extent that these representations of mental hospitals in these haunted asylums are scaring people away if they actually need treatment?

Gabe: There is where you’re going to win another point because yes, yes, I do. But let me ask you this, Jackie, on the side of mental asylums are offensive. Which do you think keeps more people away from treatment, haunted mental asylums or severe lack of funding and resources for people with mental illness?

Jackie: Well, obviously, I’m going to pick the resources, but that’s not the topic of this show, Gabe.

Gabe: Of course not.

Jackie: We’re talking about haunted asylums.

Gabe: But I think that is the point, because haunted asylums make national news every single year, every single year, they become an advocacy point. But every single day in this country, every single day, somebody with mental illness will die because they don’t have resources. And it’s not. Oh, no, no, no, they are staying at home because the haunted asylums scared them. No, they are trying. Their families are trying. They are working desperately to get well, but they can’t get any single resources. And yet, strangely, hello, national media. Why aren’t we covering these people? We’re not.

ackie: I don’t know. Maybe it’s because the conversations we give people around mental illness have to do with things that they’ve learned in pop culture, in haunted asylums, where we don’t think that they deserve funding, they don’t deserve help because they’re all crazy and dangerous. They’re going to hurt everybody anyway.

Gabe: Let’s talk about that for a moment. I love that you walked right into that trap. So you believe this? Society believes that every single person with mental illness is dangerous and violent and a threat to us. And the response to that is to completely decimate the mental health safety net and just let them all walk around homeless, untracked, and consequence free. Now listen, I’m not saying that all people with mental illness are homeless. But I am saying that if society really believes, I mean, if society really believes that people with mental illness are responsible for all the violence, why are we doing so little to help them? You think maybe they don’t believe that? You think maybe that society doesn’t actually believe that?

Jackie: No, I think society doesn’t think about it. I don’t think that they care. There’s not a season for mental illness, right? There’s a season for Halloween. That’s why it makes the news, because it’s relevant and current. It also is a good headline. Mental illness as a whole. Lack of resources. Homelessness. All of these things happen all the time, year round. We’re completely desensitized to it. It’s not newsworthy anymore.

Gabe: I completely agree with that. I don’t know what that has to do with whether or not haunted asylums are offensive, but I can tell you that that is incredibly offensive to me. We have so many people who are in harm’s way that it’s not newsworthy anymore. But you’re right, haunted asylums are the problem. Let’s talk about that some more.

Jackie: I’m not saying haunted asylums are the entire problem. But you mentioned why is this not in the news more? Why are we talking about haunted asylums in the news? And this is why I’m not saying it’s right that we’re desensitized to it. In fact, I think it’s absolutely fucking terrible that we are desensitized to it. But we are. That’s why we’re here. That’s why nobody cares anymore about these terrible things that are happening to even people like veterans. Right. We’re supposed to really care about our veterans and we just don’t we don’t give a shit. But when something happens,

Gabe: Hey, hey, hey. That is not true. Every sporting event that I go to, we always stand for the veterans. Now we cut all their funding in the V.A. Hospitals have maggots in a bit, but no, every single sporting event, we always have a moment of silence. So don’t tell me that we don’t do enough for our veterans.

Jackie: Ok. Well, you know, you win that one, Gabe.

Gabe: But it is analogous, right? We have veterans that we are not giving enough resources to. That’s not making the news, but somebody kneels in front of a flag. Oh, my God. The veterans. The veterans. And again, I’m not trying to open up that debate. Please don’t. Just the things that we’re getting upset about. I don’t think are the root cause of the problem. I cannot get around the idea that haunted asylums have offensive parts to them and that they’re based on stereotypes and myths and things that aren’t true. I will give you that. You win. I just don’t think that this is a big advocacy point at all. Frankly, I can’t wait until I do, because as soon as I think that this is worth my time, it means everything else is resolved. All of this other stuff has been fixed and Gabe is thinking, well, shit, I have put a lot of time into becoming a mental health advocate. I don’t want to end my career, so. Yeah. Asylum’s, I guess.

Jackie: We’ll be right back after this message from our sponsor.

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Gabe: And we’re back debating haunted asylums.

Jackie: But doesn’t it bother you ever when people think about mental health, mental illness, treatment, the history of all of these things that some people think? Some of this stuff is still real when people talk to you about your treatment. Doesn’t it bother you that they think that lobotomies are still regularly practiced and all of these stereotypes that are perpetuated in the news, in the media, in haunted asylums?

Gabe: You know, it’s an interesting thing that you said, you said. Doesn’t it bother you that people think that it’s still true? Doesn’t it bother you that people think that this is still being done in hospitals? You recognize that? What you said is that at one point in American history, all of the stuff that’s currently happening in haunted asylums actually happened. They’re not based on false. They’re based on fact. They’re based on facts from the past. But they’re still based on facts. We lobotomized people with mental illness. You’re right. Now it is an attraction. And you know that’s kind of weird feeling, but

Jackie: Weird?

Gabe: I feel weird about a lot of things.

Jackie: Weird? It’s a weird feeling? Isn’t that like a terrible gut punch that people are using lobotomies and shock treatments for entertainment value?

Gabe: Yeah, but I don’t feel that way when I read a true crime novel or I watch Snapped or Forensic Files. I don’t feel that way when I watch Law & Order. And, you know, there’s two versions of that. One where they follow murderers around for our amusement. One where they follow rapists around for our amusement. Doesn’t that bother you, Jackie? Isn’t that just a big gut punch, that rape and murder is used for our entertainment? Oh, my God. So what, is mental illness special? Everything is exploited. Everything. Why is mental illness so special? What about all of these other awful things that happen? Listen, for real. Nothing that you said is wrong, but nothing that I have said is wrong. And I don’t know where the middle ground on that is. I am telling you, as a person who lives with severe and persistent mental illness, as a person who has been blamed for violence, as a person who has been fired from his job, as a person who has been discriminated against and stigmatized against and frankly just treated like shit because of an illness that I didn’t ask for. It’s a God awful, misunderstood illness. But I want to be very, very clear. Haunted asylums and haunted houses. Yeah, they didn’t factor in one iota to my suffering and spending any time trying to eradicate the haunted asylum problem. Yeah, it’s not gonna help Gabe Howard in any way. And truthfully, I don’t think it’s gonna help anybody in any way.

Jackie: I don’t know about that, Gabe. It might not help you personally, but what is the harm in erasing just the verbiage “haunted asylum” and turning it into “haunted hospital,” right? You’re right. We’re never going to erase the attraction to violence. We’re never going to have society go, this is all appalling. Let’s stop paying to go watch people get cut up on a table. It’s not going to happen. But what we can do, a very simple quick fix is removing the tie to mental illness and then walking away from it. You can choose whether or not you go in there, but they’re gonna advertise it on billboards. They’re gonna put it everywhere. They’re going to continue to subconsciously shove that information into your brain, whether you like it or not. And that goes for everybody else who sees that information..

Gabe: Why? Why is that reasonable? In general, when we see things in pop culture, we think, oh, that’s not going to happen. We all know that cars can’t do that. We all know that people can’t get shot and call it a flesh wound. We understand that there’s some differences there,

Jackie: Do we?

Gabe: But I really do think we do sincerely. I mean, honestly,

Jackie: I don’t.

Gabe: I just.

Jackie: I don’t know that I agree with you on that one. I think society as a whole are idiots and a lot of what we see in pop culture, in just general entertainment. Not that we look at and go, that’s real, Grand Theft Auto totally happens. But we have takeaways where they get, like I said, they get implanted in your brain and you just think that is a thing or that is reasonable or things like that could potentially happen.

Gabe: That’s probably true. And if we had a pop culture podcast, we would do a hell of an episode on it. Focusing in on using haunted asylums, the outrage about haunted asylums, to further our message, I just want to discuss why people believe this. Why can’t any of the articles go with, you know, in the not too distant past, this haunted asylum would have just been an asylum? We did do lobotomies. We did give people medication against their will. There is a lot of psychiatric trauma in the past of people with mental illness that we have to acknowledge. When I was first diagnosed, I honestly thought that the government was going to put me in a group home or store me away. I thought I was a disposable person, all because I heard the phrase, Sir, you have bipolar disorder.

Jackie: I almost feel like you’re fighting on my side of this argument a little bit in your discussion about the past and what happened and how we need to talk about that. Those are the things that people are afraid of. They’re afraid of what happened in those hospitals. That’s why they’re using it as the basis for these haunted asylums. It’s scary. People go there to be scared. Yes, it’s dressed up now. And it’s almost comical how bad the costuming is. But the root of it is that these hospitals were scary. Mental illness is scary. We are gonna go there to see people who are going to scare us and we’re gonna leave going, man, that guy who is getting electroshock therapy, that was scary. And then we’re gonna move on with our lives. Nobody looks at it and goes, well, this is an unrealistic portrayal of what happened. And we know that this was a real history and we know that it was really terrible what we did to those people who had no say in their treatment plans. That doesn’t happen. All they leave with is that’s a scary thing. And what are we gonna have for dinner now?

Gabe: I don’t know what people actually leave with when they say, but let’s talk about another talking point that could come out of this. You’re buying a ticket to the Haunted Asylum because it scares you and it is a game for you. And you know that you’re free to leave. And the reason that you’re scared is because psychiatric care and mental illness is scary. If we can connect all those things together in the minds of every single person that buys a ticket, maybe they’ll have more compassion and understanding for people battling mental illness. Today, tomorrow and the next day, because you bought the ticket, because you’re scared of mental illness and you don’t live with it. You’re just a tourist. I live with it. That’s why I’m scared. And that’s why telling me to do yoga or go for a walk or commune with nature isn’t gonna work. Because at the end of the hour, I’m not done. I don’t get my picture taken. I don’t get a high. I survived bipolar. Anything. It’s not fake blood and fake tears and acting. It’s my life. And, yeah. It’s not done. As soon as November hits and I can, you know, celebrate Thanksgiving, that’s what I have all year round. I want there to be a better understanding of that or I want people to acknowledge that as complete and utter nonsense. And it’s just a way to have fun. And society exploits everything, to have fun and to make money. And in this way, they’re treating me like an equal. It’s very complex. And people don’t do well with nuance because I think even as people are listening to me like I don’t understand. Am I on Gabe’s side or Jackie’s side? There is no clear winner here. That is honestly how I see it.

Jackie: Some of what you just said, I don’t understand. I can’t fathom how you can say that and still think that it doesn’t matter that these things exist. Everything you just said about your experience, about the take away that is perpetuated by these terrible freakin’ places and it just makes me want to like choke you a little bit, like shake you. Gabe, you just proved my point in your sentence and then you unproved it two sentences later.

Gabe: I get that a lot. Yeah. I just don’t think we’re gonna make it go away. I don’t even think that’s a worthwhile goal worth trying.

Jackie: But it’s not unreasonable. There are stories about these haunted asylums and the other silly names that they use. The proprietors of these things, changing the names or removing scenes from them that perpetuate these terrible things. It’s not like this is an unattainable goal. This is a relatively simple thing that may or may not have a large impact. It may not change your daily life or my daily life, but it could change the lives of one or two people who maybe are too afraid to get treatment now, who have to explain this to their families. You wanted to change the conversation. I think removing these things helps us to change the conversation, because the conversation right now is this is what happens in mental hospitals.

Gabe: Yeah, Jackie, I don’t disagree. If all of the names were changed tomorrow, I don’t think that would be a bad thing. But I also don’t think it would be a good thing. I think it would be an irrelevant thing. I think it would just be a thing that happened. And that’s where I really get stuck on when I’m having this conversation year after year after year after year. You know what I’d actually like? I would like all of these haunted asylums to put up a sign. And I would like that sign to say this is fiction. This is a stereotypical portrayal designed to scare you. And the reason that it’s scary is because mental illness is a frightening disorder. And while we are providing this as entertainment only, you should take a moment to consider that people that live with these illnesses need resources and support that society may not be providing them. Please visit your local and then boom. Get a mental health charity to not sponsor but be there to hand out information or just have the brochure or the website or something. Hand out a little card when everybody leaves. I think that there is an opportunity to educate people with the correct information after they see the misinformation and places aren’t doing that. But instead we’re trying to erase our history. We’re trying to erase the part where we abused psychiatric patients. We’re trying to erase the part where we’re still abusing psychiatric patients. And these are just the things that I think about every October when all of these things make national news as if it’s, I don’t know, new.

Jackie: Gabe, that feels like a mic drop moment. I don’t think you won this. I don’t think I won this. But I am curious to see what the listeners think.

Gabe: And the listeners can e-mail us at [email protected] and give us their opinions. Disagree with me. Disagree with Jackie. It’s okay. We want the conversation to continue. We also want you to stick around after the credits and listen to our hilarious outtake that’s put together by Lisa, our tortured editor, that does a great job putting these shows together. And also share us on social media, like us wherever you can find us. Tell all of your friends about us, wherever you download his podcast, give us a five star review and use your words. It helps raise us in the rankings and we will see everybody next week.

Jackie: See ya.

Announcer: You’ve been listening to Not Crazy from Psych Central. For free mental health resources and online support groups, visit PsychCentral.com. Not Crazy’s official website is PsychCentral.com/NotCrazy. To work with Gabe, go to GabeHoward.com. To work with Jackie, go to JackieZimmerman.co. Not Crazy travels well. Have Gabe and Jackie record an episode live at your next event. E-mail [email protected] for details.

[Outtake not transcribed, you have to listen!]

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