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Okay we're making this quick and short, and then we can be detailed later
I switched antidepressants at the end of December, and it turns out I am allergic to the new one. I am allergic to a Lot of things, some of which aren't seasonal (like I mentioned being allergic to mold the other day... every day I wake up,) so I don't just have allergies in spring, it's 365 days a year.
So earlier in January when I was having hives and itchy, watery eyes, I assumed it was the ush, took benadryl (benadryl my friend benadryl), and moved on. But, towards January 20th, I started having trouble swallowing pills, struggling to breathe, and my throat/tongue felt swollen.
My mom's allergic to 2 medications, so I know what anaphylaxis is like. Hives are relatively harmless, your throat closing up is not. Any reasonable person would go to the ER, but...
I've been there before, and it was basically what these reviews are saying. A wait time of 7+ hours despite visibly empty rooms, pain dismissed, staff that treats you like you're dog shit on their shoe. I have to be actively dying to go in there willingly again.
I had a follow-up appointment for January 30th, but as the days progressed, the anaphylaxis got worse, and it was taking longer for benadryl to help. When it had been 5 hours after I took benadryl and I was still struggling to breathe, I knew that I needed to just stop taking it.
I don't know if it was because of me being allergic to it, but... these withdrawals are the worst I've ever experienced. I don't want to list all the symptoms, but it's been Very Supremely Bad. At first I was worried about bursting into tears in the lobby, but I've barely been able to hold down food or sleep, so I got worried that I would be too weak to walk/stand up. I felt bad doing it, but I rescheduled the appointment, and it's tomorrow. So like, I'll be fine, over the last week the withdrawal symptoms have lessened in severity, I made it through the worst part of it in one piece even though it was a little scary
I wasn't sure when I wanted to talk about this, if at all, because I don't like being vulnerable and I kinda just wanted to pretend nothing was going on and continue posting silly things, but . this morning I decided to post about it today . because . last night I went bananas about sound horizon, and I realized it was like that one meme that's like "sorry I stopped posting about (x), I'm on mood stabilizers now"
Like, I'm kinda forced to stop taking my antidepressant, and I revert to my 12 yr old self and start cage-trilogy posting non-stop 😭
(I'm mostly joking, part of me not being as active a la/urant was that:
We didn't get any new music from 2015-2023 (2021 if you count the prologue of ema, but that's still Six Years . do you know what the average shelf life of a kp/op song is? Like, at most 9 months. If people really like it, they'll start calling a song "timeless" after that point. If people don't like it, suddenly it's overplayed, overhyped, etc. When kp/op groups go more than 1 year without new music, people start accusing the management of mistreating the members 😭 We waited 6 years! And we've been waiting for the 8th album since 2010, in 2015 we got the 9th album, and this latest one is "8.5 or 9.5th" . I've been waiting for the album about timeloops/reincarnations for 14 years 😭😭😭 I know this sounds deranged but please every day I wake up)
Those ex-friends of mine I met through SH so I took a step back from listening as obsessively so I wouldn't associate my bad feelings with music I loved
Regular fandom burnout
The 9th album caused a huge schism in the fandom that caused a lot of hostility & stopped people from being as... "innocently" creative, less fanedits and theories and ask games/challenges about it. I think that's understandable to a certain point since it was 2015, but you can clearly see that everyone's afraid of putting posts in the tag, or asking others questions, etc. There were definitely things we didn't need to keep from 2008-2010 era fandom, like reposting fanart or talking about how much they hate (woman performer) for being on stage with (male performer), but the stiffness and hostility is really sad.
But when I realized I was like genuinely Coping with my Mental Illness the same way that I did at 13, too young to be on antidepressants and birth control... listening to the most fucked up, sad songs ever, I was like... that is funny as hell
#erin talks#text#long post#sorry I really did try to make this short 💀 I don't know if anyone will read the bullshit about SH but I wanted to add some context#also 1) I have the url reinemichele and would use it but I couldn't save it on twt fast enough & I don't like not matching 😥 I want#the person who has it to enjoy it but I do like periodically try to change my relnemlchele to reinemichele#2) I've had thanako as my lockscreen since 2019 & the bg in my music app as michele#3) my phone lets you put a short piece of text on the screen by the charging port so it says 'thanatos.......'#4) in 2020 I installed premiere and the first thing I did with it was put soko ni aru fuukei over that one 'they hated jesus bc he told the#the truth' comic . I also wanted to put the 'thanatos....' from sango no shiro over it (since that's what line I'm referencing in this post#but it was so short that I went with soko ni aru fuukei#so like you can take the nb out of the shk but you can't take the shk out of the nb
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Pacifism Isn’t A Character Trait
Or: MLK Day is Upon Us so Let Me Do You a Learn
Or: As An Aang Stan I Got a Bit Over-Zealous But Lemme Explain Why For A Hot Minute
Plus some History and Tumblr commentary that even non-ATLA fans can chew on
And by ‘hot minute’ I do mean this is going to be a long meta, so strap in. For those of you who just might be tuning into this debacle, I, a person who has not used Tumblr, much at all, except for the last half year, ran into some trouble.
If you wanna skip the whole TLDNR interpersonal stuffs and get straight to Why Aang is the Best Thing Since Sliced Bread, I will embolden the relevant parts, and italicize the crit of Korra, if you want that alongside.
I was excited that ATLA was seeing a resurgence due to the Netflix remake. I wasn’t even trying to apply any steep expectations for it. (learned not to do that the hard way with the last live action adaption, and to a much lesser extent, ATLOK, since it had good . . . elements, *ba dum tsshh*)
So, these are a couple aspects of the issue: (1) Even on the internet, I am extremely introverted and until recently mostly came for content, not socializing. My main online interactions thus far have been in forums and artist-to-artist on DA. Tumblr is still very strange to me because it splits up its ‘threads’ so you can’t see all the replies if a certain pattern of users responds in their own space. I’m not even 100% sure it’s in chronological order, and replies are not nested next to each other so you can look in the comments and someone will be replying to something you can’t see in that window. And also since it is a bizarre hybrid of a blogging system, posts are somehow considered ‘owned by��� or an ‘extension of’ OP in a way forum threads are not. (2) ATLOK was good in a cinematic and musical way, to be sure. It also had some good concepts. I can go into it just appreciating it for the worldbuilding and be somewhat satisfied. But the execution was terrible. I was on AvatarSpirit.Net for years, and If I had maintained my presence on ASN to current day and had gotten around to downloading their archive now that the forum is dead, I would include some links to other peoples’ detailed analyses on just how flawed both the plotting and Korra’s frustratingly flat learning curve was especially in the first two seasons. But, that is a task for another day, and only if people are interested.
No, what I’m addressing today, on the issue of Korra as a writing exercise, is how Mike and Bryan said specifically they wanted to make her ‘as opposite to Aang as possible’ and in so doing, muddied the central theme of the original ATLA series.
Now, again, I was mainly an art consumer for my first major round of ATLA fandom. Tumblr is an alien beast to me. But, after I write my first major Aang meta, talking about how amazing it is that he has the attitude he does, and how being content in the face of this overwhelming pain and suffering is an ONGOING PROCESS and an INTENTIONAL DECISION and not a simple PERSONALITY TRAIT, I start hearing that Aang gets a lot of hate from the fandom. Now this would be bad enough if it were merely people not liking his crowning moment of pacifism because they don’t understand the potential utility (I’ll elaborate on that in another post) or the ethics involved.
Aang is easily the most adult member of the Gaang. But he apparently gets hate for his few moments where he actually acts his age, a preteen, and maybe kisses a girl in a historical timeframe in which ‘consent’ discussions were probably nonexistent. Even in the present day, we are still practically drowned in movies that reinforce this kissing without asking trope. And even some female bodied people complain that asking kills the mood! But somehow he is responsible and reprehensible for this, even though the first time she kissed him back. I’m only going to get into the pacifism discussion today, but that was just another layer of annoyance bouncing around in the back of my head. Other peoples’ crit of Korra that was stewing in my subconscious, plus this Aang bashing, which thankfully I had not directly read much of, made up the backdrop of gasoline for the match that set it off. Even that seems a pretty melodramatic way to phrase what I actually said, which was: Aang, on the other hand, lost dozens of father figures and was being steamrolled by Ozai who was gloating about genocide TO HIS FACE, yet he still reigned in all that quote, ‘unbelievable rage and pain’ (The Southern Raiders). We Stan Aang, the Superior Avatar. No I did not f**king stutter. #AangSupremacy In another meta, someone complained that I was too defensive of Aang as a character and didn’t apply literary analysis enough, which I quickly rectified.
What set this off? Someone was kind of indirectly praising the line from Korra, “When I get out of here, none of you will survive” To them it was emotionally resonant or whatever, and I have to point out that no, it was a martial artist not having control of their state of mind, as is the bedrock of the practice. It was never addressed by the narrative, which is a severe oversight. I had a conversation with someone in the chats, making this distinction between Korra’s character traits and life philosophy. If she were to kill people while enraged and she was fine with that, that’s one thing. But if she regretted it, that’s a whole other kettle of fish. People argue that she comes from a warrior culture, unlike Aang.
Never mind that warrior monks are a thing. That’s what Shaolin monks are. You can be a pacifist and skilled at fighting. Those things are not mutually exclusive, which is the whole point of Bagua, Aang’s style. And also, Katara’s style.
That’s one reason I like Kataang so much- their congruent styles. Both of their real world martial arts are dedicated to pacifism, even though ATLA specifically doesn’t spell that out for Katara and her learning arc.
There was a meta where someone briefly tried to argue that knowing “martial arts” is against pacifism. No. Quite the opposite. I’d argue that you are not a true pacifist unless you know exactly how to handle yourself if someone attacks you. If you are not in a position to make conscious decisions about how much force to use, rather than merely operating on survival instincts, that is not pacifism. Or at least, not any energy or effort towards pacifism as a practical everyday tool. I’ve made a few attempts to learn some tai chi and aikido, and it’s improved my physical and mental health, but some other things have gotten in the way. #lifegoals
I’m not going to tag the unfortunate soul whom I was replying to, because they’re probably tired of all this, but I’ll be sending them a PM to say that I’ve made this into a different post, because as I mentioned before, threads are somehow considered “owned” by OP, so it’s been pointed out to me that I should separate it. I also said, I have basically ZERO respect for Korra uttering violent threats when the writers already minted a far more emotionally devastated and yet still resilient and centered character earlier in their franchise. People always try to excuse away people who genuinely like Aang more. As if it’s just nostalgia or whatever. For me, no, it’s absolutely not. It is respect for a character who stands toe to toe with real people who are kind in the face of overwhelming injustice. (I have another meta on that).
Both OP and people in the chats try to make excuses that she wasn’t raised as a pacifist, and that would be fine if they had addressed it with Tenzin and she had stated outright that she was rejecting pacifism and mind training. As it is, we are left with this nebulous affair where the lines between ideology and personality traits are blurred.
We are told she “has trouble with spirituality” but what does that even mean? Does she have trouble with focus? Does she have trouble relating to the canonically real spirits? And pacifism specifically nor inner peace that it flows from is never even talked about as an extension of spirituality, which is canonically tied to airbending.
“Aang didn't have to deal once with the loss of his autonomy in atla” OP claims.
This was after I had noted that Aang was getting kicked around by Ozai and was most likely going to die. Similarly, someone in the chat rejected the idea that a 12 year old trapped in a stone sphere that is heating up under a cyclone-sized blowtorch feels powerless.
Sorry but that’s flat out ridiculous.
No one wants to admit that both of these people were faced with similar situations, and when push came to shove, one showed his LIFE PHILOSOPHY through conscious effort, and the other was abandoning the basis of martial arts, which is, no matter what the situation, keep thinking. Hold the panic at bay. Non-attachment would have served her well in this situation. Tenzin should have told her this. Before, or afterwards. It should have been addressed in the writing.
People see this as “bashing” Korra, and oh well, can’t help that. If I think the writers didn’t follow through on their themes, that is my concern. OP said I was “offended.” No, not really.
I wasn’t offended by the post itself, or its commentary. Thought I made that pretty clear.
This is not dramatics. Let me be blunt.
As a ideological pacifist, and an actual practitioner of meditation, based on Buddhism, NOT just the fan of some show, I am for calling out writers who write one way from the survivor of genocide, and then stray from that ‘thoughtless aggression is immoral no matter HOW hurt I am’ to ‘let’s not address this character’s aggression in the narrative whatsoever.’ OP attempted to derail by accusing me of being racist or sexist against Korra. Also ridiculous. It honestly should have set me off more, but it didn’t.
Meditation is about reigning in your emotions. Managing your anger when it gets out of hand, and digging down to the roots of it. Being responsible for your own behavoir. Acknowledging ownership of your own actions. Not blaming anything YOU DO on anyone else or any circumstances in your life. Like an adult, or should I say, an enlightened adult.
Or at the very least, that is the ideal ypu strive towards while being imperfect in the present.
. . .
Now.
I’m going to quote a passage in a Google Doc of mine, even though I’d really prefer if you asked to read the whole thing, with context.
“What do humans do when it is necessary to, or greed makes a nation want to recruit?
They go to the army to get trained, right?
Granted, having someone scream and get spittle on your face is, in the grand scheme of things, poor preparation for having bullets whiz past your chest and grenades shatter your ears. And, what do you do to prepare you for the pain of getting your leg blown off? Hopefully, nothing. Like taking a test where you only got half the study guide. But, it’s about the most ethical way to go about it, right?
Not everyone even sees action. So any more more extensive mental preparation for physical pain than that, and you’d have people definitely protesting.
Well, as it turns out, pacifistic protestors themselves, if they were in the right time and place, also very intentionally do this type of mind training. Except, when they did it, they actually did sit still and took turns roughly grabbing each other and throwing each other down and in some cases, even kicking and bruising each other.
Turns out, those pacifists are, in some ways, more hardcore than the army.
Why is this?
Because a pacifist’s aim, unlike a unit, who wants to gain the upper hand in a situation, is to grit their teeth and grind their way through all those survival instincts, and totally submit.
In this, they aim to get the sympathy of the public, who clearly sees they are not aggressive, or a danger, no matter how much the footage is manipulated or suppressed.
In this, they hope to appeal to their attacker’s better nature.
Make them stop and think, wait a second, are these people a threat like we’re told they are? I’m attacking someone who’s letting me beat them up. Or a bunch of people. All forming a line, and letting us peel them off. Or sitting, and bowing their heads. If I’m on the ‘right’ side of things, the law, why am I doing this?
It’s not like a bully, who’s just a kid.” They’re more self-aware.
And might I add the situation influences a pacifist’s actions too. There’s no reason to let a single or a few random attackers beat you up if you can evade or disable without permanent damage.
Pacifism is a dynamic set of responsive actions informed by values. Not a proscribed set or a checklist.
But in terms of organizing against state power, and recording wrongdoing, which unlike during the Civil Rights can happen from all angles from smart phones nowadays, these are the motivations.
“So, the pacifist knows this, and that’s why they go through all that trouble of training themselves to, not only submit, but not turn tail and run, either.”
See, a character trait is something like being a morning person, or ways of handing information, or a given set of emotions a character feels. Once you cross over into actions, you must make the distinction of whether an impulsive character agrees with their own uncontrolled actions, or is embarrassed or remorseful. Those are life philosophy. Now sure, one type of person or character may be more likely to subscribe to pacifism, but there is no gatekeeping on what you have to feel or how you look at things. You can be easygoing, or feel all the rage in the world, but as long as you at least attempt to have a handle on those desires and feelings to where they do not cross into actions, you are still doing the work of metacognition, which is what martial arts and its accompanying mind training are for.
It’s what we see Aang do.
He’s informed us, during the Southern Raiders, on how much rage and pain he feels.
Pain points, TRIGGERS, that were directly struck at when Ozai gloated over him.
He joins with all the past Avatars for several moments, and just like every other time he is in the Avatar State, he is enraged. He wants to exact revenge on the unrepentant grandson of a baby murderer.
We see it when he turns his head away, face still screwed up in anger.
For another example, I could cite my difficulties in being aware and reining in my tongue sometimes. I know the roots of these issues and I seek to let them go.
It’s just that process takes way longer than Guru Pathik would have us assume.
In fact, I would even say that Aang’s portrayal throughout the three seasons is not strictly a realistic representation of at least the sad side of grief. I addressed that a little when I talked about real life figures. But what it IS, is a metaphor that cuts very deep to the heart of pacifism. As I showed in that Doc . . . There is no limit of suffering a pacifist is willing to go through, internal or external, for the preservation of peace.
This was demonstrated during the Civil Rights, and with Gandhi and all his followers beforehand, inspiring them. The pacifists’ method of swaying hearts is probably the reason BLM exists in such numbers as it does today. Will the types of narratives that correspond with their full stories of the way they collectively planned and trained for and approached conflict make it into fantasy media? I’d say, probably not. For a host of reasons.
It could be hoped for, I guess.
But we DO have Aang.
As for myself, whether speaking sharply is an “action,” per se is up for debate- certainly it doesn’t seem to violate the non-aggression principle put forth by the vision of a “stateless society.”
For another example, let’s take my explanation at the beginning. I am examining how circumstances affected my actions, and now am attempting to fix it, if indeed it needs to be fixed.
At least one person said that it not so much what I said, but how and when I said it. I don’t actually think I’ve said anything “wrong” per se. So I have to figure it out.
[I’m considering splitting up this next part into a second post, as it only slightly relates to pacifism itself and is just kinda some more commentary on Tumblr itself- Tumblr discourse, as it were]
[I’ll put more brackets when I’m done in case you want to skip this part as well]
An interesting social difference between Tumblr and other places is this command you often get, “don’t chat/reblog/message me back.”
This is interesting for several reasons. For chats and reblogs, other people may be following the “conversation,” so it’s actually pretty rude and presumptuous to tell a person not to respond to whatever you said, because other people watching still may be interested in your take.
In a forum setting, if someone involved in a conversation doesn’t have anything left to say, usually they just don’t respond.
This method would work perfectly fine for Tumblr, but for some reason, maybe its super odd format, probably due to the “ownership”/“extension of self” I mentioned at the beginning of the essay, people don’t tend to do this.
Now, in comment sections, sometimes you’ll run across an amusing sort of “mutually assured destruction” where two people both say this to each other. You’d better stop responding. Omg just give up. Why are you still arguing. Etc.
But see, no matter where this behavoir pops up, and no matter who starts in on it, those who do this usually want to have the last say on the matter.
Instead of merely not replying, they want to assert verbal control over the conversation.
Tumblr, in its weirdness, is also sort of like a mutant comments section. You can post comment section threads as your own post.
Which is one reason why I’m puzzled when people say ‘don’t read the comment sections’ when Tumblr is so popular.
I’m an oddball in that I browse comment sections for fun.
Probably due to alexithymia, I didn’t really comprehend the emotional toll it takes on many people, so the warnings to “stay out of comment sections” read to me like “hey don’t eat that dessert.” After I’m done with the ‘meal’ of an article or art, I like to see what lots of different people have to say about it. The fluff. Anything vitriolic I either blip over, or extract anything useful, or if I judge the person is reasonable enough, I might engage.
Sometimes I mis-judge on how reasonable someone is, and I shrug and move on after being cussed out or whatever.
In this, I suppose I succeed much of the time in being a verbal pacifist.
[But let’s get back to the more serious stuff.]
We’re talking about what is done in life or death situations, here.
For myself, I may in the near future be working more with dangerously mentally ill people. I’ve had a little exposure to it through various means. Nurses are obligated not to retaliate against patients, and those who have, have been fired in some situations. Again oddly, this is not primarily what triggers my anxiety. Unfortunately enough, this requirement has also resulted in nurses getting seriously injured and violated. I hope to influence whether “no harm” techniques such as tai chi and aikido and arm locks may be allowed. The voluntary philosophy I was luckily already on board with is enforced by bureauacracy, directly relevant to my potential profession.
Were someone to get involved in a dangerous profession, such as a police officer, their moral duty would also be to own up to any spur of the moment anger or fear they acted on.
It’s just that their bureaucracy acts differently, in excusing their actions.
Ideally, they would be taking steps far in advance, to avoid this often-cited fear of death reaction. As training pacifists like Aang do.
And yes, army people are trained differently than police officers because the army, often, even when threatened, is supposed to avoid engagement or deploy deterrents that are non-lethal almost all costs, unless ordered otherwise. Whereas American police are given pretty much complete discretion and often not taught de-escalation techniques. Even police from other nations are better trained in that regard.
Enter the ironically named @avatarfandompolice whose account description should really speak for itself. Combative, dismissive, and their attention-hungry bread and butter is to find people they think it’s acceptable to ridicule. They basically tried to say trauma was a valid excuse to take out your anger on other people, and in this situation, potentially kill.
Now, does this hold up in the real world? Yeah, sometimes. Especially if some law breaker or law keeper has not been given the anger management tools, they perhaps could be excused, or better yet, rehabilitated.
But especially if anyone finds themselves in dangerous situations, or intends to put themselves in such, it falls to them to do this preparation.
As an aphant, I am at a bit of a disadvantage, compared to an average martial artist, being unable to visualize an attacker. But I still attempt it.
As the main “police officer” of the world- the coincidentally blue clad figurehead that is supposed to keep order, it is apparently fine for Korra to not do the work Aang did to keep level. To blow it off as too much trouble: clearing the First Chakra of fear. For herself or others. And its resultant anger. Had she had access to the Avatar State, the authority figure pretty much would have killed people. This is what the “fandom police” and a certain chat goer ultimately support. Maybe they didn’t understand it that way, and since the second had blocked me, they will also never see this explanation. Unless I were to share it in Google Doc form I suppose.
So, I responded. “Remember kids, you are not responsible for your own behavior if you have the excuse that someone else did something bad to you.” A frighteningly common sentiment on this site.
When it’s low stakes like CAPSLOCKING or internet fights, that’s not such a big deal. But what happens if this attitude leaks into the real world? This isn’t even about Korra or Aang anymore, it’s about toxic mindsets. I didn’t know fans taking pro-Korra posts as anti-Aang was a common in the fandom. I’ll say again I’ve only just gotten really active on Tumblr like the past few months. This is about pacifism itself. MLK and his hardworking, training followers (yes some of them sixteen and POC and not super-powered like Korra) facing down firehoses and staging sit-ins long trained for would shake their heads at this defense of reactionism.
Pacifism is not a Personality Trait.
It is deliberate actions and preparation taken over a period of time.
Then the “fandom police” tried more of this, and these two conversations ensued, the comments with another user resulting in the title and main thesis of this essay:
https://captlok.tumblr.com/post/638777472806273024/avatarfandompolice-response-to-my-independent
https://captlok.tumblr.com/post/638806142933467136/the-plight-was-not-what-i-was-getting-at-it-was
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This is the anon who had that bad experience with a blog after warning them about a panphobe they reblogged posts from,
They did it AGAIN. They reblogged from a loud and proud panphobe. You don't even have to search on their blog. I think it may even be part of their pinned post?
Honestly, they reblog from a LOT of panphobes. I got tired of this and made a post talking about how it's horrible to give platforms to panphobes, that it shows a privilege not many of us have when they don't "worry about whether or not OP is a panphobe" a.k.a ignore the fact they're a bigot, that panphobia should be taken more easily than any other type of queerphobia, and to just stop platforming pan people by educating themselves on the struggles we face.
It was my nicest post, but I'm just so done being nice with these types of people. It seriously isn't that hard to be a decent person and make sure OP isn't a panphobe. If you can do it with TERFs, you can do it with them.
I don't know if I'm looking into this way too much, but I later saw the blog which reblogs from panphobes also reblog a post talking about how "we need to stop guilt-tripping each other into worrying about everything!! It's okay to not concern yourself with every issue going on! Especially other communities issues! Stop being fake woke by guilt tripping people!" And it kind of felt like a vague-post-reblog since they do follow me, and possibly even saw my post.
Either way, even if that isn't the case, I ended up unfollowing their side and main blog because no. I'm not dealing with it anymore. I hate being nearly constantly triggered when I find out they reblogged and platformed another panphobe, and that I can't even tell them about it because the last time I did, I got told "man just don't worry about it you'll make yourself paranoid"
This became a really long vent, but god. I'm just tired of people not taking panphobia seriously. I'm tired of having to unfollow blogs I thought were cool and helpful only to watch them give platforms to people who have s//cide baited me, made me feel like a monster for my identity, and have genuinely left me with trauma from my interactions with them.
It's awful, and I hate it.
wow i'm sorry. that really sucks, you deserve better.
i fucking hate that this is what it's like for pan people on here. we're told we're just being paranoid when we bring it to someone's attention that they reblogged from a panphobe, only for that person to turn around and do it again. just proves that if someone being a panphobe isn't a deal breaker for you, then you're a panphobe, too.
also, i think i saw your post. i thought i saw something about deplatforming panphobes when i was quickly scrolling through a pan tag earlier, but i didn't stop and read it at the time. i'm gonna have to go back and find it again, and share it if you don't mind.
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Christmas with a stranger
This is my submission for 'gift of cheer' by @cordonianroyalty and @texaskitten30. This is the fluff one shot requested by @anjanettaexcordonia.
Characters belong to pixelberry
Pairings:LiamxRiley
A/N: this is the first fic I have ever written, so i apologize for any mistakes. Criticism is openly accepted, negative or otherwise. Feel free to say anything!
Tags: @texaskitten30 @cordonianroyalty
@kat-tia801 @eadanga @xxrainbow-princessxx @knightthunderis @kingliam2019 @anjanettexcordonia @stuti-singh @queenrileyrose @bbrandy2002 @twinkleallnight @bebepac @ladyrileyrussel @hopelessromanticsposts @dcbbw
Summary: Two strangers spend Christmas day with which each other, which changes the rest of their lives.....
Song inspiration: All I want for Christmas is you
Word count:2683
I don't want a lot for Christmas
There is just one thing I need
Don't care about the presents
Underneath the Christmas tree
I don't need to hang my stocking
There upon the fireplace
Santa Claus won't make me happy
With a toy on Christmas Day
I just want you for my own
It was the morning of Christmas, and Riley was overly excited. She always waited for this time of the year, especially Christmas. Nothing is more enjoyable than sipping cider in the presence of her beloved and enjoying the Christmas meal, she always thoughts. Orphaned at 4 ,she didn't had a blood family to celebrate with , but was blessed with a great deal of foster family and friends. Every year, during Christmas, as a sort of tribute, she spends the entire day celebrating with the children of her previous foster care. Watching those kids playing merrily reminded her of her own good days in the past.
She quickly ate her breakfast and made her way out of her NY apartment, whistling and softly humming to the tune of All I want for Christmas is you, her favorite song.
More than you could ever know
Make my wish come true
All I want for Christmas is you
Baby....
She was so engrossed in her little singing gig that she barely registered the stranger coming towards her, and crashed right into his broad chest, spilling her reticule's content on the sidewalk.
"Oof"she yelped, rubbing her forhead.
"Oh! I'm so sorry! Let me help with those! " the stranger apologized.
Riley and the stranger kneeled down at the same moment to collect her scattered belonging, and for the first time the two glanced into each others eyes. Ocean blue eyes locking onto dark ones. Damn... Those eyes.. Riley swallowed.
"Ahem" she softy cleared her thought, quickly collected her belongings, and stood up.
"Sorry for that. Should've watched my steps. " then she quickly disappeared into the crowd, not noticing the stranger eyes on her from behind.
Riley finally arrived at the foster care. Loving hearts. A bit strange name, but filling her chest with warmth nonetheless. She rummaged through her reticule for her Digital key card, but it was not there.
"Uh...?"she muttered. "Where the hell is my keycard? "
After a few moment of searching she gave up. "Im not going to get in there without my key card...."
"Excuse me Miss.... But I belive this is yours. " a voice behind her startled her.
Riley turned around and found herself staring at the pair of those same dark eyes she encountered earlier. I'd recognise those eyes anywhere, even though I had stared at his eyes for less than 5 seconds. The (cute) guy i bumped with!
"Ahem" the stranger let out a exaggerated cough and riley realised that she has been staring at his face for a solid 10 seconds.
"Right.. Ahem... Sorry... I mean... Thank you for returning this. You totally saved my ass--, i mean my...my...job". Way to make a fool of yourself Riley.
The stranger laughed quitly. "Well then I am glad I could save your job. But I should get going."
Just as he turned, a little voice in the back of her head called out to her, and instinctively she reached out and grabbed his sleeve.
"Er... Sir... I know this is extremly forward of me... But if you would be kind enough to spend the day with volunteering at the orphanage I work at? We are kinda short-staffed tonight, and there aren't much volunteers. Those children at the orphanage will be quite happy to see a new face. You could spend the with them. And me. If you are free, that is?
Crap. Crap. Crap. This i really asked a random hot stranger to volunteer?! Snap the hell out of it Riley!
Plz say yes. Plz say yes. The little voice inside her screamed.
To her surprise, he gave her a smile. "Id be happy to. I don't have any special plans for today. Btw. "
He smiled, and stuck out her hand to shake hers.
"Liam Rys"
"Riley Brooks". She said she she shook his hand. A familiar electric tinge sparked through her veins as she held his hand. His hand impossibly smooth underneath her. Woah! Are guys even supposed to have this soft hands? I wonder what kind of moisturiser he uses....
"Miss Brooks --"
"Call me Riley. "
"Well ahem, Riley.. it is rather cold outside. What say we make it inside? "
"Oh right."
She quickly swiped her keycard and stepped inside, sighing contentedly as the warm air from the heaters enveloped her. She melted a little inside as she felt Liam's warm body alongside her. Brushing this aside, she focused her attention on the scenario in front of her. Numerous gift boxes piled beneath the Christmas tree... Children merrily running and there... Volunteers mingling with each other and the children... The aroma of the food... And the Christmas songs softly playing in the background. A wide smile played on her lips.
While Riley was busy observing the surroundings, Liam found his sight stuck on the beautiful women he had known for not more than 15 minutes. She was beautiful, in a way that the noble ladies back at home in Cordonia arn't. And seeing her here in here element, smiling widely without giving a damn about public decorum or whatsoever, he found himself attracted to her. And without a second thought, he agreed to volunteer. We'll see how the day goes...
Liam cleared his throat, claiming her attention. "So what needs to be done? "
"As you can see this is a orphanage, so the children here dont have any families to celebrate the holidays with. So each year, myself and many other gather here to celebrate the celebrate with them. Thats what we have to do. Mingle with the children, play with them... And make them feel loved. "
"Sure. I can definately do that. I actually volunteered too at orphanages back home."
"If I may ask, Where are you from?
Liam immediately stiffened at the question. When he asked his father for a quiet getaway before the beginning of the social season, meeting Riley was not on the itinerary. And the fact that he was leaving Tommorow didnt helped either. The last thing he wanted to do was to lie with her, but he wasn't going to destroy these good moments he had with her by revealing that he was the crown prince of cordonia.
"I'm actually from one of the small islands surrounding Greece. "
Before she could open her mouth to ask more, Liam immediately turned away to play with one of the children.
The day went on quite peacefully and quite enjoyable for Liam. Holidays back home were anything besides spending with families. It was all about press conferences and photo ops and disguised motives hidden away in gifts. But here I was a lot more different, the sight of children playfully jostling each other without giving a damn made him smile, as that was the part of childhood he missed.
He suddenly felt a small hand on his shoulder and his pulse quickened at the feel of skin over his clothes. Behind her was Riley, holding a eggnog mug in her hands.
"Not to ruin your volunteering gig, but I got you something. "She said as she handed him the mug. Their fingers brushed, and lingered for just a moment longer.
"Ahem. Thank you. " Liam blushed, his ears turning pink.
Riley chucked softly at his antics. He is already so cute, and looks extra cute while he blushes.
Night came quickly. After winding up all the activities for the day including the gift exchanging and christmas dinner, all the children were put to bed and the volunteers were bidding their goodbyes. Only the foster care staff plus liam was left behind.
Riley glanced around. All the staff were mingling on the rooftop, with only her and Liam left in the main hall.
"Hey.... " she softly asked Liam, who was lounging in a chair beside her.
"Yeah? "
"Will you accompany me for a little walk around the times square? I just wanna clear my head a bit. " And hopefully spend some time with you...
He smiled. "Sure! Just let me get my coats. "
The pair walker out of the building and into the cold, brisk night. Celebrations were in full swing outside. Its called the city who never sleeps for Nothing.
Outside was really cold, and with the softly falling snow Riley barely suppressed the shiver that ran up het spine. Suddenly she felt strong arms around her shoulders and a moment later a coat was wrapped around them.
"I would be a terrible gentleman if a let a beautiful lady like you freeze to death. "
"Beautiful, huh? " she teased.
He blushed. That blush.
They both arrived at the square, staring at the enormous Christmas tree situated in the very middle. The glow of the lights and mini bulbs bathing them both in a gentle bluish light.
"Its really beautiful, isnt it? Riley asked. Just as she turned her head towards him liam's eyes quickly found their ways towards the decoration. Was he really admiring me than the beautiful decoration in front of him? Was it possible that he was feeling the same fluttering in his heart that she felt whenever they interacted? No, it can't be. I am reading onto this too much. We are strangers. Strangers.
"Indeed it is. " Liam quitly whispered, hiding the blush in his cheeks. Crap, she caught him staring at her. I hope she doesnt think i am creep or something. To Liam even the most beautiful decorations paled in front of her, she was more beautiful than any sights he had laid his eyes on. Don't get too attached, Liam. Its temporary. You are going to leave tomorrow. There can nothing be between you and her. You have a duty back home. This is just a little escape from reality. They are strangers. Strangers.
Just then the local band striked up a a waltz. All around them peoples paired up, with Riley watching the couples with a hopeful gleam in her eyes... which didnt went unnoticed by Liam. And in that moment, he knew what he had to do.
Liam bowed a little in front of her, and held out his hand, his other arm draped around his back. "May I have this dance? "
She smiled as she put her hand into his, her pulse quickning, "It would be my pleasure. "
She awkwardly bowed, earning a chuckle from Liam as he sweeped her in his arms, her one hand on his shoulder, his on her waist, their free hand twined together. They elegantly twirled together on the makeswift dance floor, stepping in time to each rhythm. As they glided together, liam couldnt help but gaze down at her angelic face, illuminated by the surroundings. His gaze strayed to her lips just as Riley glanced at him, they met each other halfway as their lips come together in a magnetic kiss. Time seemed to stopped when his lips met hers, and the flutter in their chest intensified. Riley's finger gently curled in his coat as liam tangled his hands in her soft brown curls. She smelled like jasmine, a scent that liam is all too familiar with. Their hands tighten around each other, almost desperately, refusing to let go, their lips moving against each other in perfect harmony. Liam tightened his arm around her waist, pulling her into his chest, and Riley softly sighed as she breathed in the scent of him.
For that moment it was only the two of them in the entire world, all the surroundings fading into nothing. Their little bubble of heaven was broken as the pair heard the the sound of clapping and soft cheering. Flustered, Liam grasped her hand and led both of them out of the dance floor and into the streets, grinning all the way.
The two of them found themselves at the threshold of a quint restaurant, and they both collapsed onto the stairs, still holding each other while wearing goofy smiles.
"So... That was.... Something else.. " Riley chuckled.
"Indeed it was. " Liam snickered.
As he glanced down at the lady in his arms, Liam felt a sudden tinge of guilt in his chest. I still haven't told her who I am. I have to tell her.
After her laughter had subsided, Liam gently took her shoulders in his hands and looked square in her eyes. "Riley, can I have a word with you? "
"Yeah... What happened? "
"I haven't told you where I am from, or what I am doing alone in a unknown city without my family. The truth is I am the Crown Prince of a small country called Cordonia. "
Riley stared at him, then burst into laughter. "Haha, Liam, nice joke. If you are a crown prince then i'm Kate Middleton." She stopped laughing when she saw the look on his face. "Oh, you are serious?"
Liam nodded. "Of course. I have no reason to lie to you. I just wanted to let you know that....that...." He struggled to move forward. "That i'll be leaving for Cordonia Tommorow morning. My social season will commence once I get back. I have to choose a bride from all the noble ladies presented to me as suitors. "
Her face fell. "You... You are really going back... I just thought we.... " She trailed off.
"I knew Riley, and I am sorry that I didn't told you sooner. I understand if you are mad--"
"Of course im not mad Liam. You did what you thought was the best. You just wanted a nice time without wandering about your duties."
"I... I wished we had more time together Riley." He whispered.
"Then lets make the most of it. We just have this night tonight, Liam. And I want to make it count. For just this one night let's just be Riley and Liam, two peoples without any obligations.
Riley pointed to the mistletoe over their head, then leaned forward to capture his lips in a heated kiss. He immediately responded, his hand cupping the side of her neck tenderly as she ran her hair through his dark hair. They pulled apart, staring into each others eyes, then their lips came together again, more passionately this time.
"Merry Christmas, Riley."
"Merry Christmas, Liam."
The night was spend together in Liam's suite, tangled in the sheets and in each other's arms.
************
The next morning
Liam woke up in his room.... Alone. He glanced around, none of Riley's belongings were in sight. A single note was on the coffee table beside the bed.
Liam,
I want you to know that the short time I have spend with you more to me than I could describe. You gave me the one thing I wanted most for Christmas...Family. I'm grateful for that. I'm sorry that I had to convey this to you by a letter, but i thought it would be better for both of us. Perhaps we will meet again.
Riley
Liam reached and wiped the lone tear that has escaped on his cheek. "I'm grateful for our time together too, Riley.
**********
Cordonia
It was the evening of the masquerade ball in the palace. Liam was dressed in his usual black regalia with a matching ornate mask. No matter how hard he tried, his thoughts managed to make their way back to Riley. Be a good prince, Liam. She's gone.
Liam stood in the huge elegant ballroom, a queue of noble ladies in front of him. Each lady he encountered, whether it was the poodle loving lady Penelope, the diplomat's daughter Kiara, or his best friend Olivia, made him realize that none of them were her.
The next lady approached, who was adorned in a white angel costume, with a literal halo above her head, her blue eyes peeking out of the glittering mask. Why are those eyes familiar...
"Hello..." Liam greeted her politely. "I don't believe we have met... Have we?"
The women smiled, then reached behind the back of her head to loosen the mask strings, Liam caught a glimpse of a familiar face as she removed her mask.
"Riley..."
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Eren as a father and Ymir as a mother motives theory never made sense. They were represented as emotionally stunned children in paths doing the Rumbling, not as adults. Ymir never cared about her children, she doomed them to suffer after her VERY SHITTY AND SELFISH CHOICE TO DIE because her abuser didn't return her "love". That was clear before Eren revealed it. She saved him and abandoned her children. She never gave a single fuck about them. She was always looking at HIM. (1)
For his part, Eren reverted to a child, talked about the sights with Armin which foreshadowed his motivation was mixed with his mental fuckery and timeless perspective. Dina and bird twist were foreshadowed via memory shards earlier. Krueger went on a rant about protecting Armin and Mikasa (and the "others") to Grisha. We've always known who Eren prioritized above all. Last chapter offered no twists, only confirmations. The story was always about EMA, Historia never had a place in the climax.
Hi! Thank you very much for writing 😀 I put my reply under the cut, so people who scroll down while searching tags don’t have problems with my long post (...because I feel like, unfortunetely, it’s gonna be another stream of conciousness from me, sorry about that 😅)
I really like your take on the "emotionally stunned children in paths" imaginery - I fully agree that it's a nicely-done symbolism!
To me, the whole Ymir sacrificed herself because of her unrequited love was not at all as clear and obvious as you say - especially before Eren revealed it. I still have a lot of problems with this plot twist, and how Ymir's feelings towards Fritz were portrayed in the end.
With the amount of abuse and mistreatment the king put her through, many fans tried to come up with different theories as to why Ymir kept on serving him. The way I interpreted it, after seeing her tortured expression over and over in many panels, was that she stayed by his side because of fear and emotional damages. With the way she was living, I was not surprised that she sacrificed herself, too - I thought that she honestly had enough, which added to the tradgedy of how she still couldn't find peace after that, and kept on being enslaved in paths.
I saw many takes and theories on her motives, but I don't think I've ever seen anyone betting on she was actually in love before ch. 139. I probably didn't search good enough, but again - with what I saw in the manga, I would have never bet on that either. My point is - before ch. 139 (...and after it too, in my opinion) Ymir was a walking mystery with unclear motives, so there were a lot of theories. Therefore, I disagree that the "parents" theory could never work - it obviously doesn’t work now, after ch. 139, but before that, her motivation could be anything really. I still wish it was something else, because what we got was too vague and problematic, in my opinion.
I simply dislike Ymir's conclusion. I feel like there was so much potential in her backstory and motives + a few different ways to tie it back with different plotpoints and characters in the end to make it more meaningful, but what we got was a brief: She was in love with the person who abused her, I know it sounds unbelievable but I couldn't look deeper into her heart, so we have to take it as it is.
In general - I can't brush it off, but to me it feels like Ymir's end goal was rushed, not explored properly, and almost pulled out of nowhere. Unfortunately, I feel the same about Mikasa's involvement in lifting the titan's curse. Don't get me wrong - I'm not at all against her becoming the hero. Quite the opposite, I was rooting for her since the beginning, and hoped to see her develop and have a big moment, but this...this honestly also felt pulled out of nowhere and, in my eyes, didn't do Mikasa justice at all. I wish there was more proper build-up and foreshadowing done so I (...and, from what I've seen, a huge portion of fans) wouldn't feel that way, but here we are.
As for the Eren/Armin conversation, I like how they got to "see" the world together, even though just as a visualisation in the paths. My problem is the [...] Eren reverted to a child, talked about the sights with Armin which foreshadowed his motivation was mixed with his mental fuckery and timeless perspective part. Again, this should have been forshadowed (...and developed in general!) much sooner - not in the final chapter, right before we learn about this controversial motivation of his.
Instead, for many chapters, we were lead to believe that Eren was acting with his original goals and personal motivations in mind; that he had some character developement which caused him to start thinking his actions through, stop acting so impulsively - and finally, that he had a plan in mind, or at least was acting out of his own free will.
If you've never seen him in this light and his motivation/behaviour seemed in character in the last chapter to you - that's fine, all power to you! But if such a big portion of the fanbase felt otherwise (me included), then it means that there were some writing issues that led to this.
The Dina situation should have been explored more, as well. It's a huuuge plot twist, which puts our MC's motovations in an entirely new light, and creates quite a few additional plot-related questions. The way we're shown the situation: Berthold couldn't die just yet, so Eren directed Dina somewhere else, which ended up being his house.
...why not anywhere else? He could literally send her back outside the wall. On top of that - did he seriously sacrifice his mother in favour of his friends? I'd really like more information on this, but the topic is cut basically as soon as it appears. I find it especially unnatural, considering the way further dialogue goes:
Eren tells Armin about how he caused his mother's demise. Armin makes a terrified face, but drops the topic, smiles and casually proceeds with: "Let's go, Eren" - like his friend didn't just reveal one of the most controversial plot twist in the series. No, who'd want to hear an elaboration on that - better talk about Mikasa, so instead we get the entire (in my eyes - really forced) Eremika-themed talk. The priorities...
About the bird thing...if I remember correctly, there were three shards revolving around this theme. Two of them just show birds flying, one of them shows Falco from bird’s perpective. Sure, now that we know that some random bird in the end pecked on Mikasa's scarf, we can kiiiiiind of connect it to the Falco's shard...but honestly, why was Eren's soul transferred into some random bird after his death? On top of that, a bird that was already existing in the world while he was still alive, as a human...did that bird’s conciousness just go poof! one day, for Eren to take the vacant spot? Should we also look for other deceased titan shifters in barns or birdhouses? 😅 I can’t believe I’m overthinking it this hard...😆
That's some three-eyed-parasitic-jeager stuff, for sure.
Jokes aside, I guess what I'm trying to say is that foreshadowing is fun and great, but it should go hand in hand with proper developement - and, in my opinion, the examples above kinda lack it (...ok, I'd let the "bird Eren" thing slide because whatever, I don't feel the need to be that serious about it, it could stay ambigous in my opinion - but I'd definitely want some more closure as for the Dina situation or Ymir’s motivations and inner thoughts)
I've always said that Armin and Mikasa were two of Eren's closest friends - or, even more, the only people he considered family. I've also never believed that he would ever willingly sacrifice them, as some people theorized (...though guess what, now that I know what happened to his mother, I have to rethink my reasoning). I understand that EMA are the main characters, and was expecting that the story's conclusion will be tied to them somehow, but definitely not at the expense of logical character and story developement (...and sorry - to me the ending just felt that way).
As for Historia: if she was never supposed to be important in the end, then, in my eyes, it's a very poorly guided plotline that only led to unecessary drama in the fanbase. Why make her situation look sus with things such us:
Incorrect conception date,
The emphasis on how she didn't marry the father of her baby (...only to reveal in ch. 139 that she, in fact, did that),
The mysterious, cloaked figure observing her talking to the farmer,
The whole talk with Eren in ch. 130, and Eren thinking back to it while talking with Zeke.
All the Historia/Ymir parallels.
Seriously, what was the point? It would be so easy to simply make the situation clear. Why not just make Historia admit to Eren in ch. 131: "yes, I'm already pregnant with the farmer's baby - I did it to save myself."? Why not cut the bs with the "she didn't marry him" - because, in all honesty, what did that information bring into the story, aside from confusion and "misunderstanding" - and just make them married, instead? Even better - why not have at least one panel showing Historia and farmer being at least somehow affectionate with each other? Why not let go of all this retconned stuff and use these panels for shelling out other plotpoints?
The theories didn't come out of nowhere - they were based on what was shown in the manga. People wouldn't be disappointed with Historia's conclusion if it was never implied that she was still somehow important. We may argue about it back and forth, but the truth is - when so many people collectively "misunderstand" a certain plotline to this extent, then it means there had to be some storytelling issues that led them to this - simple as that.
To sum it up, I'm happy that you enjoyed the chapter and found it logical and satisfying. I absolutely don't want to take that away from you, or make you change your mind, but I also can't help the fact that I don't see it in the same light as you. You say that the final chapter offered no twists, only confirmations - to me, it was pretty much the opposite. Still, I wanted to thank you for taking the time to write your thoughts, and sorry it took me so long to reply! Hope you're having a nice day 😄
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Okay, so, here we go again. Firstly, when I was making that post I intended to tag you but forgot and when I noticed later that I forgot, I didn't edit it cause I assumed you would find the post anyway, which you did. But sorry for that, next time I will tag you straight away.
I don't know who you are referring to, because my posts are all still there. I didn't delete anything. I took screenshots and just answered you in a new post because I don't like that in the notes you have a limit as to how much you can write in a paragraph. I prefer answering this way. I don't mind debating or having a conversation but this is the third post I made and I feel like I'm just repeating myself. You can take screenshots I don't mind, I myself find it easier. Once again I intended to tag you but forgot, sorry.
As I have said numerous times, I do think a character can have parallels with more than one other character. You missed the point of my first post. It wasn't about sansa and Lyanna, it was about the 'parallels' they used. I don't mind sansa/Lyanna having parallels but the ones that were used were not Canon and something op just made up.
Again, I have said continuously that a character can have parallels with more than one other character. My first post wasn't about 'a character can only have parallels with one other character' it was about the 'parallels' the op used.
Lyanna/Arya and lysa/Arya do not 'easily have the Same amount of parallels'. In your answer you give the parallels of Arya fleeing Kingslanding and other one I can't remember right now. And I answered in the last post, why they were sansa/Lysa parallels then Arya/Lysa. So I'm not repeating myself just go read that one. Anyways, it wasn't about Arya not being able to have parallels with lysa. Just like I said in the other posts, it's was about the parallels that were used. You want to make a arya/Lysa post go ahead, I don't mind. But when you do, use parallels that are actually from the books. So, yes, you could use the fled from Kingslanding one and the other one whatever it was. The whole point of any of these posts was about stansas twisting Lyannas character until it fit what they wanted. We have a very vague description of Lyanna. But what we do have does in no way make sansa, Lyanna reborn.
Saying Lyanna might have had a softer side which could parallel sansa, is something I hate when stansas do. Why? Whenever I see a lyanna/arya/sansa parallel post it's usually about sansa and Arya being the two sides of Lyanna. Arya being the wild, will full, tomboy side while Sansa is the beautiful, romance side. This is probably one of the stupidest things I have heard in this fandom. And I'm sorry if it annoys me when stansas claim that Arya could never be loved because she is ugly, a psychopath, or unladylike. And like you said Lyanna 'might' have had a softer side. So, I'm sorry are you saying that Arya doesn't have a softer side? In my opinion Lyanna is the wilder version of Arya. For example compare the scenes where Lyanna is fighting benjen and sansa and Arya have a snow fight. When benjen falls, Lyanna straight away shouts at him to stop crying and tells him he is stupid. In the snow fight when sansa falls, the first thing Arya does is go and check if she's okay, then she throws snow at her. Lyannas reaction was slightly more aggressive than aryas, where in Arya's first instinct was to see if sansa was okay. If you meant softer side as in love and romance and crying. The first time we hear about Arya in this story is when cat tells ned about the children and the pups. The first thing we hear about Arya is that 'she is already in love'. In Arya's first chapter she runs away crying. Whether stansas like to admit it or not. Arya will have romance in her story. Whether it's with gendry or Jon or whoever you ship her with. It will not suddenly become the most important aspect of her story but it will be there. Back to Lyanna. When she 'sniffled', not cried mind you, benjen made fun of her. If this was sansa crying would bran make fun of her? No. Why?, because it would be ordinary for sansa to cry at a song. It wasn't for Lyanna. Look at how she reacted. Do you really think sansa would pour wine on his head? No. Would Arya? Yes. We have seen her throw things at people in Canon. Like when gendry was being rude and she threw an apple of his head. Pouring wine would definitely be something I could see Arya do. My point is, I don't think what happened at harrenhal should be romantized. Lyanna was a realist, why would she run away with a married man? In your last answer, you said Lyanna was the most adored character. But I have to disagree. Somebody made a similar post about it the other day. And in the notes, all anyone had to say about Lyanna was how selfish she was. I remind you the whole lyanna/rhaegar romance isn't Canon in the book. For all we know he took her against her will. Lyanna was 14, rhaegar was 26, I think. She was a child. He was a grown ass man. This story has an equal chance of being either a romance or a rape. We don't know what happened, so the whole Lyanna was a romantic is based on 'maybe'. Which was the whole point of my first post. It wasn't about who was being paralleled but rather about what the actual parallels were.
The parallels between Lyanna/sansa would not weaken the lyanna/Arya parallels. When they are used though its to prove that Arya is too far gone to ever love. Or Arya doesn't like dresses so noone could love her. The whole Lyannas softer side being the parallel with sansa is something I hate. Because for sansa to be this other side of Lyanna, it would mean that Arya herself doesn't have a 'soft side'. Arya cries, Arya laughs, Arya loves, she wears dresses, she is capable of having polite conversations (ned dayne is an example). She isn't this emotionless killing machine that so many people make her out to be. Which is why the parallels to Lyanna are important. They are there to show that you do not have to be a certain way to be loved or valued. Arya has spent her life being made to feel ugly and less. When ned tells her she looks like Lyanna she is shocked. Because no one ever told her anything like that. Her father and Jon told her she was pretty, sometimes. Her own mother never did. In a society that values looks so much, Arya felt like she was less. She still remembers that. She has really low self esteem regarding her looks and her value. When on the run, she had dirty feet and her hair was a mess, she was convinced that because of that her mother wouldn't want her. Jon was the only person, who's love for her she didn't doubt.
When did I say sansa was the mirror image of lysa?? I said she had actual parallels with lysa and that if op wanted to compare sansa to one of her aunts, it should have been lysa. I have actually already said, numerous times that I do not think parallels equal to being the same and having the same fate. The thing is though, in my opinion the parallels to Lysa are side shadowing. Side shadowing is when you foreshadow something that could have happened if the character took a different route or made a different choice. For example lysa/wed Arryn heir, sansa could end up marrying Harry the heir but I doubt that. Lysa is fat/sansa is one of the characters who is most associated with sweets. Her love of lemon cakes is continuously mentioned. Both are/were manipulated by baelish. My point is, I think the whole point of the lysa/sansa parallels Is to sideshadow how sansa could have ended up if she continues to live under the influence of baelish. I think she will kill baelish and break away from him. And that All the parallels like their weird ass relationships with sweetrobin are there to sideshadow what could have happened if she continued to let baelish control and manipulate her.
I have said so many times already that characters can parallel other characters. The whole point was that the lyanna/sansa parallels were complete bullshit. If ye were to make one again and not twist Lyannas character then I wouldn't have a problem.
@tyranossaurusbex, I can't find you for some reason, so I'm not sure if this will show up for you
Editing to see if I can tag you now, it wouldn't work earlier. @tyranossaurusbex
Edit: I still can't tag you. @tyranossaurusbex
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