#zionism is separate from Judaism

[jacobtheloofah]

just wanna share some quick rosh hashanah thoughts: it's incredibly bittersweet trying to celebrate the jewish new year as the 1 year mark of the genocide against palestinians is literally days away. but I will stand by my faith that judaism will be able to separate from zionism and show to the world that we believe in love, peace, and a desire to improve the world. that's the judaism i know, that's the judaism i was brought up in, and that's the judaism i want to see in the world. israel is not us, zionism is not us, we will be better.

to all palestinians I hope your peace and justice is just around the corner, and I hope one day we will be able to sit together over some apples and honey.

l'shana tova, from the river to the sea 🇵🇸

[centrally-unplanned]

This article about Hamas's strategic planning in the lead up to the October assault was at least a partial mind-changer for me. So far I had been viewing Hamas as executing a "bait" attack on Israel for international & domestic political reasons. Kill enough Israelis, and in particular take some hostages, to force Israel to invade Gaza; which you want because that will re-inflame radicalism, tank Israel's growing coziness with Arab states like the Gulf Monarchies, and keep the Palestine Question front-and-center on people's agendas.

What it was not about was achieving any sense of a military victory; Hamas did not think they would be able to defeat the IDF on the field, or even truly hold them back. They thought they would do better than they have in defending Gaza, to be honest, but the goal wasn't to "win" in that way or anything. The actions of Israel, in their inflamed bloodlust, would be the fulcrum of progress for Hamas. It was the most logical interpretation of their strategy, because tbh its working, Israel's strategy void has bungled this war at every level. Of course if it is "worth it" is a completely separate question - Hamas is playing a game from deep, deep in the red, if you aren't going to fold and pack it up from that position these are the hail mary plays you make.

This article, a long (and sometimes overly windy) interview with two career members of the Palestinian governing orgs (primarily Fatah), shines a very different light on that. They outline that over the past ~decade, Hamas leader Yahya Sinwar coalesced power around his own faction of highly fundamentalist adherents that convinced itself that divine favor was shining on them and they would be able to actually defeat Israel in the field. The most compelling evidence for this is a conference they held planning the post-conquest occupation of Israel:

So detailed were the plans that participants in the conference began to draw up list of all the properties in Israel and appointed representatives to deal with the assets that would be seized by Hamas. "We have a registry of the numbers of Israeli apartments and institutions, educational institutions and schools, gas stations, power stations and sewage systems, and we have no choice but to get ready to manage them," Obeid told the conference.

They even called people up to ask if they would take the job of governor of this-of-that province! This was not a bored-Friday white paper by any means. They discussed defensive plans and counter-offensives like that was on the table. Sinwar outlined conquest as the goal.

If we accept this premise, it naturally lends itself to the question "okay how did they get the rest of Hamas to go along with this?" Because Hamas is not all These Kinds of People, its a governing state that does politics on the international stage after all. One of the reasons I leaned towards my interpretation was that, for the past ~decade, Hamas has actually been doing a glam-up rebranding of the org to make it more moderate & respectable in international eyes. The 2017 Charter Revision is the biggest example, which included say disavowing the idea that this was a religious war (distinguishing between zionism & judaism), and loosely admitting to the idea that they could recognize Israel as a country if terms were met. Actions like these show actors who are pretty level-headed. Were they inauthentic? Did they change their mind?

Maybe a bit, but its more than they aren't the same people. Right alongside the build-up to the October attack was a purging & sidelining of whole swaths of Hamas leadership. Many were not even informed of the attack - though they knew something was coming. Apparently it leaked on October 2nd, and a bunch of leaders just immediately fled the Strip for safety. This one is the most amusing:

Haniyeh's eldest son took a similar course of action. Around midday on October 2, Abed Haniyeh chaired a meeting of the Palestinian sports committee, which is headed by the minister of sports, Jibril Rajoub. Suddenly he received a phone call, left the room for a few minutes and then returned, pale and confused. He immediately informed the committee – whose members were in a Zoom conference with counterparts in the West Bank – that he had to leave for the Rafah crossing straightaway, as he had just learned that his wife had to undergo fertility treatment in the United Arab Emirates. (He was lying.) He granted full power of attorney to his deputy and left the Gaza Strip hurriedly.

That is one way to duck out of a pointless meeting, take notes people!

So instead of my hail mary politics play, what you have is a story of an institutional coup by a radical faction - which for extremist resistance groups is an ever-present threat. None of this means the "bait" strategy part is wrong of course, that was definitely still the point - but this argument here claims that goal of the bait was to bring the IDF into Gaza where it could be defeated in the field with their extensive fortifications, and then presumably inspire others like Hezbollah to jump on the moment of weakness and besiege Israel proper.

So....is this true? There are two gigantic caveats on this article: the first is that the people being interviewed do not primarily work for Hamas - they are members of Fatah, the leading faction of the PLO. They hate Hamas, they are not Hamas leaders themselves, they have every incentive to paint Hamas as irredeemable. You really can't take this story simply at their word. But they aren't outsiders - they hate Hamas but they work with them constantly, that is how it works, people rotate around in the Palestine orgs. They have met personally and worked with dozens of Hamas leaders; one of them was even called to be offered one of those post-war occupation governorships! (He said no lol) So its a big red flag but not a damning one. And things like the fleeing leaders, the conference on the occupation, those all 100% happened. They released press on it, they weren't hiding it.

The second caveat is that its just really not uncommon for large organizations, particularly extremist ones, to engage in mainly performative actions at scale. The South Korean government still maintains a department that plans for the administration of North Korea for example! Not totally useless ofc, but it writes exactly the reports you think it does that get put in a bin and never touched. Sometimes its appeasing internal factions, sometimes its PR, sometimes its just institutional inertia. Its absolutely believable that Hamas would make a big plan for how they would conquer Israel because otherwise...what do you tell the commanders, exactly? Why are they fighting again? A significant percentage of the lower-level fighters need that belief, so you give it to them. While certainly there is a fundamentalist faction in Hamas, are they ones winning? Or are they just another faction being played against?

I don't see enough evidence to say, but there is enough to make me pause. I'm not sold on it in the end, that is my final conclusion. I think more brains than Sinwar were involved in this and they had more realistic aspirations. And yet the level of commitment and disorganization does suggest that at least some of what was pushing events forward was a group immune to doubts being at the wheel. Certainly interested in researching more.

[luthienne]

i have been trying to provide historical context for the ongoing genocide and ethnic cleansing of palestinians, but i want to make it clear that i do not and will never tolerate antisemitism, just as i do not and will never tolerate islamophobia.

it is never acceptable to conflate zionism with judaism, nor the state of israel and its oppressive policies with its people or with jewish religious or ethnic identity. anyone of any religion or ethnicity can embrace zionism because zionism is a political ideology. there are, and have been from its conception, many christian zionists. just as there are, and have been from its conception, many jewish anti-zionists. the zionist movement as it came into being in the late 1800s is deeply rooted in western and european imperialism. 

of course palestinians and israelis both have the human right to live in peace and safety, and that is why i call for an end to this occupation and for the liberation of palestinians. palestinians must be given the right of return to their homes, they must be allowed to have access to their own lands and resources, to not be harassed violently, fatally, and daily by the israeli occupying forces and settlers in their homes and during commutes and at checkpoints. palestinians must be given equal rights and the right to return, and to live in safety.

indiscriminately surveilling, detaining, torturing, abusing, killing, bombing palestinians will never provide "security" to the state of israel. enforcing a brutal and endless apartheid regime will never provide security. erecting barriers that cruelly separate palestinians from their families will never provide security. no amount of oppression will provide security because that's not how it works. oppression creates resistance. violent oppression creates violent resistance. only liberation and equality can begin to provide safety and the opportunity to move forward. free palestine.

[jewishbarbies]

I (a non Jewish person) just learnt now that the word people are supposed to be using to refer to people who wish for the extermination of Palestinians is not “Zionist” but “kahanist”. I just learnt about kahanism today and learnt that it is something that is shunned.

That makes me think… maybe it was deliberate that the rhetoric of Zionists being wicked and evil deathwishers is being spread. As propaganda maybe. Because it’s very apparent that most (not all, but most) Jewish people are Zionists, I think about 80-90%. So when people say, “we hate Zionists, not Jews”… don’t they still just hate Jews?

Makes me think that since hating Zionists is the basis of the pro Palestine movement, then the Pro Palestine movement was always eventually going to turn vehemently antisemitic at some point. Because it’s literally based on hating belief in the existence of a Jewish homeland.

And while Zionism and Judaism are not the same thing, you cannot talk about Zionism and its history without acknowledging its roots in Judaism, since it’s quite literally the belief in a homeland for Jews.

So in that sense, while Zionism and Judaism aren’t the same thing, the concept of Zionism cannot be separated from Judaism since it literally stems from it.

So that means that the efforts of the pro Palestine people to completely separate the ties between Judaism and Zionism are in vain, because when talking about Zionism, it’ll eventually lead back to Jews.

So I think the pro Palestine movement would’ve turned out as antisemitic as they are no matter what. Because their movement isn’t founded on loving Palestinians, it’s founded on hating Jews.

Maybe I have a tinfoil hat on, but I think the perversion of the concept of Zionism was deliberate. A quick google snoop session (especially prior to the misinformation after the 7/10 attacks) would have given you quick and clear definitions of Zionism and kahanism and their ideologies.

So why is Zionism being so demonised and kahanism barely talked about? Makes me think that this misinformation mishap was intentional.

Idk I’m dumb

oh it was definitely intentional. the russian and hamas bots have been having a field day with the disinformation and antisemitism since the second news of oct 7th hit social media. it’s intentional, because hamas and its allies want jews to be hated worldwide as much as they themselves hate jews so that the world will want us dead too. who would think twice about killing jews when everyone believes jews are evil white colonizers who wouldn’t hesitate to murder children? it’s like the slippery slope of “pedos belong in wood chippers” to “anyone I don’t like is a pedo and therefore belongs in a wood chipper”. the west didnt invent it but damn are we good at it, and hamas knows this.

the houthis, hezbollah, they all know how easy it is to manipulate our views based on the content we consume and how trigger happy we are. all they have to do is point in the right direction and leftists don’t hesitate to fire. to these terrorists, all of us are the same, there is no difference between zionist or kahanism or anti zionism. jews are jews. and they want all of us dead. why would it matter if only one group of jews wants all muslims dead when, in THEIR eyes, all jews deserve death anyway? so now to leftists a jew is a zionist and a zionist is a bloodthirsty, colonial child killer. it was 100% intentional.

[thecapricunt1616]

thank you for speaking on jon bernthal's blatant zionism, the fact that he has people defending him for that is so nasty. not to mention his support of domestic abusers it's really crazy the amount of support and defending he still gets on this app

Oh my god hi!!! Don’t think I am ignoring you holy heck!! I’m not sure where my brain was on Monday if I’m honest I have 3 whole asks just sitting!!!

I agree. And let me be clear here (since some sick people equate loving and supporting the Jewish Community with also supporting Zionism) That I LOVE and support every ethnicity and religion! I love Jewish People. If you are Jewish OR Palestinian - know you are SAFE, and LOVED, and SUPPORTED on this blog.

Separating ART and the MUSE is very important. We can appreciate Mikey Bear, we can appreciate how touching and sad and gut wrenching his story is -

We can ALSO recognize that Jon B-🤢🤮 sorry I can’t even say his name. That he supports HORRIFIC people. That he supports the literal blatant murder and torture of children and other innocent human beings, and animals! Let’s not forget that even when this ends - all of the bombings have destroyed ecosystems and natural land.

Palestine will take so long to recover when this finally stops. I don’t care if people unfollow. I really from the bottom of my heart will not miss you in the slightest if you support ‘Israel’ (the land of make believe!).

Judaism all though I am not Jewish is such a beautiful religion and to its fucking core it condemns the behavior the IDF it is imposing on the Palestinian people’s. I truly identify with the morals that Judaism holds. But just like Catholic or literally any other religion ever!! There are evil people who claim to be that religion but it’s a wolf in sheep’s clothing.

If you support Zionism God isn’t proud of you. If you hurt any of gods children, he isn’t proud. And it doesn’t matter I think this, because when it comes time for their judgment day - their god will shake their head and tell them just how horrid they were.

All this to say to my core fuck zionists, and abuse defenders like Jon ber-🤮🤮🤮🤮🤮🤮🤮

[grecoromanyaoi]

The whole "are jews white" thing drives me crazy bc whiteness is not an innate state of being it is a position of power in relation to other people and therefore it is more complicated than "russian ashkie = white and sephardi = brown" but everyone wants to make race into a biological fact so we're stuck unable to acknowledge that in the same way that jews are seen as both capitalists and communists for the purposes of antisemitism, we can also be seen as both white and poc for the purposes of antisemitism AND some jews do access, use, weaponise white privilege. it's not hard

As a side note I happen to think using a "white israeli vs brown palestinian" is functionally inaccurate. while zionism obviously emerges from european nationalism and therefore includes those strains of racism, it is a nationalism aka it is about jews and not white people. ANYWAY.

right right!!! like. u cant rly "separate" jewish ppl into a white/nonwhite binary in terms of oppression bc a. whiteness is a construct, n often applies differently in different situation n b. this may break some of u all's brains but white sephardim also suffer race based discrimination. white ashkenazim n white sephardim have different experiences w race, judaism n antisemitism. there r different ppl from the same city even w wildly different relationships to ethnic identity n race. there r 5 separate synagogues in the venetian ghetto belonging to 5 different ethnic groups. theyre all italian. theyre all venetian even.

ashkenazi/sephardic/mizrahi trinary doesnt work either - many ppl r mixed, white western ashkenazim, asian ashkenazim n ashkenazim of color have different experiences w race, judaism, antisemitism, identity, culture, etc. n so do european sephardim n noneuropean sephardim (even different european sephardim between themselves, ntm how different noneuro sephardic identities r from each other), many ppl identify as both sephardic n mizrahi, etc.

n to the last point at the end of the day its still trying to erase the diversity of palestinians. like while theyre all equally palestinians n their identity is, for the lack of a better word, valid, n palestinian is also obv a cultural identity, there r plenty different ethnic, religious n racial groups within the palestinian identity. i think it connects to how many ppl, esp westerners n esp americans, refuse to analyze any global situation, usually indigenous struggles, outside their specific dichotomy of xyz oppressor n xyz oppressed. they cant fathom that brown n black israelis can b relatively privileged based on their ethnicity, so they decide to just ignore their existence alltogether. like how they refuse to comprehend that americans of color can also b privileged - both globally n as settlers on stolen land, but instead of saying that any and all criticisms of american r racist n targeting poc n usamerican is a racist dogwhistle, they go the in opposite direction n treat all israelis as white, n israel as a white country (dont tell them abt the demographic statistics in both countries). thats also why ppl refuse to b normal abt russian or ottoman imperialism - they cant rly neatly fit it into their idea of what racially/ethnic based oppression looks like.

"are jews white" are christians white? sorry for the long answer/rant, but at the end of the day, this remains unbeated

[socialistexan]

It is so so so so so so obvious that some of y'all's "anti-zionism" is antisemetism, pure and simple, especially when y'all will gladly, EAGERLY, accept white supremacist conspiracy theories and straight up blood libel.

Like some of y'all were absolutely secretly chomping at the bit to be antisemetic, or had not unlearned the antisemetism your ancestors passed on to you (the constant suspicion I feel from so many goyiche white people is absolutely mind boggling), that you saw a way to both be on the forefront of a progressive cause where you either 1) don't have to think critically or 2) can be seen as progressive while also being antisemitic.

It's absolutely invalid to equate anti-zionism with antisemetism. That's obvious. Anyone that does that, I'd argue, is an antisemite themselves or has an agenda that requires hijacking Jewish suffering.

But, it's like, I've been an anti-zionist for well over a decade and a half at this point. There are relatives who I do not talk to any more because I had blow ups - full screaming matches that lasted hours - with them about Palestine back in 2010, I'm not new to this. I didn't jump on this bandwagon because it was the new progressive cause to jump on. Growing up Jewish, I was forced to have an opinion on this from a young fucking age. I've taken college classes, learned from older anti-zionist Jews, did so much independent studying on this.

And I've been accutely aware of the tropes and antisemitism that was around the periphery of anti-zionism, but it wasn't the core.

But now that a lot of people who are new to this are suddenly coming in to the movement and are either unaware or unwilling to learn how spot antisemetism while at the same time a bunch of antisemitic grifters and white supremacists have keyed in to the fact that there's now a bunch of (justifiably) angry people who haven't been properly educated on these subjects and can be easily misdirected from anti-zionism to old school judenhasen, y'know?

A version of the alt-right pipeline for progressives.

I'm just saying, please be more critical of these things. Don't spread misinformation and conspiracy theories. Don't prop up grifters and bad actors. Educate yourself. Separate Judaism from Zionism, they are not synonyms. Be against the illegitimate state of Israel and their occupation and ethnic cleansing, but also be critical about who and what is being said and how. Zionists will nitpick every little thing you say for the one thing they can delegitimize you on.

All you're doing is hurting the cause you're trying to support, and one that I've spent years of my life working for.

[mylight-png]

Y'know what?

Antizionist Jews shouldn't celebrate Hanukkah.

Not because Jewish tradition is only exclusive to some Jews. Judaism is for Jews.

But because if they are antizionist but celebrate Hanukkah, they are consciously choosing to ignore all the meaning behind the holiday.

I do not use "should" as a rule I believe should be implemented. Rather, I use "should" as a way to indicate a more proper personal choice for those in question.

If you choose to ignore why you celebrate something, what's the point of celebrating at all? What are you even celebrating if you choose ignorance?

Hanukkah is inseparable from Zionism, and to try and separate the two is to make a mere shallow imitation of our tradition.

[meowssssssssssss]

It is important to separate Zionism from Judaism.

Jewish people are on Palestine's side. ❤️🇵🇸✡️

[sophie-frm-mars]

Hi Sophie! In light of the genocide in Palestine and the conspiracies around it, do you have any thoughts on how to avoid conspiracy thought?

You pointed out in Conspiracy on the Left that conspiracists will often switch from using language that recognizes incentives and structures, to language that indicates direct malice and intent. I've seen this in real time with Zionism where people will stop using it as a term to describe the ideology and actions of Israel and America (economic and military interests, the historical inertia of the british empire, the interest of capital and western nations using Israel as a base in the Middle East), to using it as a placeholder for jews (people accusing individual people (usually american) of attempting to silence voices with media platforms)

I was gonna say I find this one really straightforward, but at the same time I myself have actually rushed into condemnations of Israel that gave too much leniency to antisemitic ideas, so there probably is a bit more to it. I'll get to it

Firstly, the straightforward part of it is that there are jews all around the world who absolutely fucking despise israel and its genocidal project, so even saying "Israel doesn't represent jews" is too mild. Israel actively denies citizenship to ethiopian jews for instance. I think the main thing is to recognise it for what it is - an outpost of imperialist white supremacy in the Middle East - and to recognise Zionism as a primarily American and imperial core phenomenon rather than a jewish one.

Once you have those ideas down it's pretty easy to separate it out because assuming that any jewish person or org supports Israel just because they're jewish is clearly antisemitic. But here's the rub, Israel uses jewish identity as a shield to justify its actions. At the same time that there are illegal settlers literally giving interviews saying "I describe myself as a fascist" the Israeli state claims that Hamas reads Mein Kampf and that Palestinians are literal Nazis. Not only that but Israeli statesmen use references to things like Amalek to signal their genocidal intentions, basically using the cultural references of Judaism to simultaneously hide behind and also attack.

Where I fell into something antisemitic was when I found out about the IDF cumjacker squad, the guys who go out to get the semen of Israel's fallen dead. the Jizzrael Defence Force if you will. Someone who was talking about it said that the justification had some kind of origin in the hebrew bible and I parroted this without thinking until a jewish friend pulled me up on it. There was no source and there was frankly no reason to repeat it even if it had been true, right? but I got carried away. The reality is that the cumjacker battalion exists for the same reason as sterilisation & organ harvesting programs, because Israel is a Starship-Troopers-Ass fascist nightmare state that sees the bodies of the pure and good as essential to the domination of the future and the bodies of the impure and wrong as wretched at worse and resources at best.

How I think we can avoid the trap of sharing these rhetorical points is by remembering what Israel's relationship to judaism is, which is primarily as a shield. "Shoot and Cry" is the phrase to remember. Israeli Prime Minister Golda Meir said "We can forgive them for killing our children but we can never forgive them for making us kill theirs". This bogus remorse over their genocide of palestinians (because they understand genocide because of the holocaust, see?) and constant preemptive counterattack (Amalek attacked Israel first, see) is the place where Israel touches base with jewish identity, but if you can't see any benefit to Israel's strategy in association with jewish identity, it's likely someone is just trying to say The Jews instead of Israel or repeating the talking point of someone who is.

[nereidprinc3ss]

hi, I'm a huge fan of your work, and I just saw that you had the link to decolonize palestine on your intro post (since you just posted a new one). I had read the website before, as a jew (who had been told different information but wanted to double check my info) and I found some of it really questionable. so I decided to research it a bit. obviously, feel free to do your own research, I actually encourage it, but here is a tumblr post that seems? to pretty well explain how wildly antisemitic that website is (i did not fully vet the post, but given what I know of jewish history, it seems to fit). I'm all for being pro-palestine and there are a ton of good resources out there, however, this website does not seem to be one of them.

obviously, it's up to you if you want to keep it or not, or even outright ignore this ask, but there has been a lot of misinformation going around, and in case this was your main source of information, I wanted to let you know that you should maybe cross reference it.

https://www.tumblr.com/arandomshotinthedark/743280738106998784/decolonize-palestine-is-a-terrible-source-that?source=share

Hello!! I read that post and some of the comments and reblogs as well as other posts by the original poster and while it does seem like the decolonize Palestine might have source issues and skip over sections of history I don’t think the post or blog you linked is any more reliable of a source. In the comments/reblogs alone I found posts which discredited major points it made, clarifying that “pink washing” is actually a term INVENTED by pro Palestine Israeli activists and that BDS discredited the Boston branch for the mapping project which is a separate thing from BDS. Those two facts, one of which the OP acknowledged in reblogs but did not change in the original post because it was “still in the realm of bad” make me hesitant to trust 100% of their information, and also because stuff like ancestral heritage/who can claim what as their homeland is contentious and Im not equipped/qualified to discuss it or evaluate it by any means. I took a look through that blog and found some of the ways it talked about Gaza and the genocide to be suspect. Specifically when they said they see the appeal of Israel because Judaism is the “dominant culture” there. They said photos of the atrocities happening in Gaza are just a way to make you angry so you’re more susceptible to Hamas propaganda and that they discourage “higher thinking.” They didn’t seem to indicate any solidly anti genocide stances which makes me think they are no more unbiased than decolonizepalestine is, just in the opposite direction. What went implied but unsaid is that anti-Zionism=anti-semitism, with which I disagree when your anti-Zionist views are based on your human rights views. I do think some anti-semites have embraced this as an opportunity to be flagrantly anti Jewish but this is not the full story of anti Zionism and is not true of most anti Zionists.

Regardless it seems like maybe that’s not a perfect website to link because it erases some relevant history but I just thought I’d let you know that blog to me is quite dog whistley. Also to anyone who might be considering it Im not interested in fighting in my inbox and I simply won’t engage. Pls do send alternative suggestions for links I could put there maybe to better sourced sites or a compilation of vetted fundraisers!! Thank you

[politics-yippie-chat]

History of Palestine and Israel

I see a lot of people on here calling for the complete independence of Palestine and the removal of Israelites and Zionism in general, but I don't see a lot of people talking about the History, so I think I wanna hop on here and explain a little for people who didn't know (like me!).

It all started in 12 century BCE, in a land called Philistine. This was around the time where the Isrealites showed up. The Arab people came in contact with them and began battling, but with their superior army, they ended up winning the fight. Then in the 10th century, they were defeated by King David. After a few more skirmishes they regained their freedom, and often had border battles.

Now lets skip to World War 1. The ottoman empire and Germany were apart of the Central Powers, the Ottoman Empire included Palestine, along with modern day Israel. When Britain and its Allies defeated the Central Powers, Britain seized Palestine. And split it apart.

World War 2. The rise of Nazism. Jewish people were fleeing as much as they could to escape the horrific genocide forced upon them by Hitlers pigs. Jerusalem was a very sacred religious place for them in Judaism and then the rise of Zionism began to start.

Zionism, also known as Jewish Nationalism, is the belief that to end antisemitism they to concentrate most Jewish individuals in a state in Palestine, specifically around Jerusalem and that God gave them that land. If you'd like to learn more, this document will held.

More Jewish people began moving to Palestine and by the end of WW2, the population grew to 30%, but was still considered a minority. in 1947, Arab and Jewish violence and tension grew, especially towards the UN and their decisions. Britain proposed the separation of Palestine into 2 states - Palestine and Israel. But the Arab countries argued that Israel was too large to house such a small minority. And they were right. Arguably right and I can prove it.

The entire area of Palestine, before the forceful split, was 10790 Miles squared or 17364.822 Kilometers squared. The Jewish population got around 8,470 miles squared or 13631.14 Kilometers squared. That is around 78% of the land for 30% of the population.

In this BBE article it states, "About 750,000 Palestinians fled, or were forced from, their homes on land which became Israel and ended up as refugees.". The population in 1946, before the split, was 1,810,037. That's 41% of the population.

And this is just the creation of Israel.

In this war along - which started on 7 October 2023 - the "Gaza’s Ministry of Health said on Sunday that at least 50,021 Palestinians have been killed and 113,274 wounded". And this article was written in March. Who knows how many have been tacked on or left undocumented.

Now I am a strong supporter of Jewish liberation and the protection of Jewish people, but not when it harms other individuals. I feel like the deep-rooted antisemitism in many of the Allied countries forced the Jewish individuals to seek Zionism, when most of them didn't even believe in it. Along with the Islamophobia and disregard of Arab countries and their people have culminated in a horrific war between two countries.

I don't believe that no one deserves a country based on religion. Christians shouldn't start colonizing up the wazoo because "God promised" them that land (*ahem* trail of tears and the cultural cleansing of natives in America *ahem*) or that any religion deserves their own state. But this isn't about what I believe, this is about cold hard facts and what has happened to the Arabs was completely unjust and extremely stupid.

If anyone would like to add their two cents or additional information - go ahead, I'd love to have a diplomatic conversation. Just please, No Gaza bots/scams, or any fundraisers, I am unable to donate and my platform is really small and I feel horrible about not being able to do anything except spread information the best I can.

Stay safe <3

[jewishmcr]

I recently made the extremely difficult decision to leave my synagogue two months shy of completing my conversion requirements because I couldn’t continue to support a congregation that aligns itself with “liberal Zionism.” I’ve been working towards conversion for nearly two years and this decision has been weighing on me heavily since October. I wanted to share the email I sent to my rabbi, in the event that it resonates with or helps other people in some way (I have redacted information about the specific synagogue for privacy). I would love to hear from others pursuing conversion to Judaism who have experienced similar issues!

Dear Rabbi,

I’ve been putting a lot of thought into the conversation we had last week, and I appreciate the time you took to speak with me and help me think about next steps. I’ve spent countless hours over the past seven months interrogating my relationship to [synagogue], Judaism, and Zionism, and am devoted to continuing to pursue conversion to Judaism. Although I desperately wish to carry on and finish out the conversion process with [synagogue], I cannot continue to do so.

I acknowledge and deeply appreciate that [synagogue] takes the radical stance of wholeheartedly condemning the actions Israel has been taking against Palestinians, and that this opinion is extremely rare among synagogues. I am glad that [synagogue] continues to push for the dignified existence of Palestinians and the recognition of their right to exist in land that has long been their home. These stances give me much hope for the future of organized American Jewish life across the country, and I hope that [synagogue] will remain at the forefront of progressive Judaism. All of this being said, I refuse to compromise my own morals, those both personal and religious, for the sake of the convenience of completing my conversion quickly. Zionism, even “liberal” zionism, is a colonial project that has, from the very establishment of the state of Israel, resulted in the deaths, displacement, and torture of Palestinians. I cannot separate an idealized hypothetical version of zionism from its concrete reality. I do not believe that the Jewish people ever had an inherent right to occupy land by forcible displacement. I do not believe that the state of Israel had the right to be established in 1948. Especially considering that on May 15th, 1948, one day after the official establishment of Israel, the first Nakba began. The day that you and I spoke marked the 76th anniversary of this horrific event, something that weighed heavily on my mind during our conversation. It is also my belief that Israel should not continue to exist as a nation. This has been my belief for quite some time, but it has strengthened exponentially since October 7th.

I understand that many members of [synagogue], including possibly clergy, share these beliefs with me. I also understand that I would not feel content in my conversion if I carried it out in a synagogue that continues to ally itself with zionism in any form. The version of Judaism that I want to create for myself has no space for zionism in any capacity. I seek a Judaism that, in addition to condemning Israel as [synagogue] does, is anti-zionist in words, actions, and religious practices.

I am heartbroken to be leaving [synagogue], which has been providing me with a community of fellow LGBT Jews since I moved to [current city]. This is not a decision I am making lightly, nor is it a decision that I’m happy to be making. I do not know yet what the next steps of my journey will be, but unfortunately it will not include [synagogue]. Although I did not yet want to admit it, I knew this was my decision when you asked me towards the end of our conversation if I could see myself continuing to worship, celebrate, and mourn with the [synagogue] community if I were to continue pursuing conversion here. My answer, unfortunately, is no. My discomfort with [synagogue]’s treatment of the genocide in Palestine has already caused me to withdraw significantly from synagogue life, as well as from completing the conversion requirements. I have found it increasingly difficult to jump through the hoops when I have a strong moral opposition to [synagogue]’s identity as a liberal zionist congregation. This decision is particularly difficult for me because, as you said, I’m unlikely to find a congregation willing to openly condemn Israel any more than [synagogue] does. I remain optimistic that eventually, I will be able to complete my conversion of my own terms among a community that shares my anti-zionism stance.

I thank you, [rabbinical intern], and everyone else from the [synagogue] community who has been there for me over the past two years. I have learned much and gained invaluable perspectives during my time at [synagogue], all of which I will take with me as I continue on the path to conversion. I plan to reach out to [rabbinical intern] separately as well as share my decision with the rest of my gerut group.

Thank you for everything,

Oliver

[aguineapigcouldntdothis]

I wanna talk more about zionism here again because it still is one of my interests (particularly practical zionism in the late 19th-early 20th century) its just so annoying to have to clarify 1000 things and potentially get attacked bc I wanted to talk about jewish history. I absolutely love questions it fills me with joy any time someone cares enough abt my silly words to ask questions. I do not like insults, threats, and backhanded statements, and when I post about zionism separated from my own personal beliefs that happens.

no matter how carefully I word things there's gonna be someone whose upset simply because I wanted to talk about a very real part of jewish history. simply because they view zionism and any discussions of it as morally bad. which is obviously not my problem but it does affect me. it takes a lot of research to make sure I'm sharing good information and I wont skimp out on it, so it definitely hurts a lot more to be harassed for posts like that than lower effort posts. it feels like its an insult to jews in general, our history, and also my judaism and my work.

I will probably post about my research of zionism again someday! I have no idea when I just feel like I would. if I could do it more I would however my mental and especially physical health cannot handle the stress that comes with that.

[blessedarethebinarybreakers]

Thank you for your many insightful posts on the current conflict going on. The one giving a detailed breakdown on the "who was there first?" argument was particularly helpful given that, as someone very familiar with the "Land Back" movement in America, I struggled from trying to approach the Palestine issue from that same perspective.

I did have something else I've been struggling with that maybe you can help me out on, though: I've seen "Zionist"/"Zionism" used a lot to help separate those who endorse the concept of a modern state of Israel from Judaism as a whole, since a very large portion of the Jewish community doesn't support what Israel is doing. For me personally, however, I've frequently seen that word used as a dog-whistle for antisemitism in general (most infamously in relation to The Protocols of the Elders of Zion), so I've been kind of wary about using Zion/Zionist in regular discussion. Did I just have a misinformed first impression towards using that term, or is it indeed something we still have to be careful about using even in regards to current events?

Hello! I hope you don't mind me publishing my response, in case anyone has further information to share on the topic of zionism. I am by no means an expert on this — I'm kind of synthesizing various posts & articles I've read over the years to write my answer, and I may be missing some important elements. I welcome correction or added info from anyone with more knowledge than I.

I'm with you in feeling there's a need for care when encountering talk of "zionists," because this term is indeed bandied about inappropriately. Just here on tumblr, I've seen various Jewish folks speak out about how freely people label any Jew with an opinion they don't like a "zionist" in order to dismiss any concerns that Jewish person tries to raise.

So when "zionist" is used to mean "any Jew I disagree with," or "all Jews," or anything not specifically related to "movement in favor of a sovereign Jewish state (e.g. modern Israel)," it's being used incorrectly and harmfully.

...And ugh, it's bad enough when randos on tumblr are doing it; it's been disturbing to see political leaders and activists and the like doing it on a wider scale these past few months.

We all need to be able to talk about the very real issue of zionism without contributing to antisemitism. How do we do that? Here are some rules of thumb I follow (and again, I welcome more if anyone has other tips):

I educate myself on what Zionism actually is. This article on the Jewish Voice for Peace site is super helpful as a starting point. It discusses where this ideology originated, how zionism takes various forms, and how Zionism is harmful for Jews (for instance, it's harmful because it rejects the diaspora as "inherently toxic and unhealthy for Jews," which means rejecting elements of Jewish culture that have arisen from diaspora).

I resist wondering if a Jewish person is zionist / pro-Israel without any reason to think they might be. (I've seen a couple posts from Jewish people now saying that gentiles do this to them. It's super inappropriate and antisemitic to do this — after all, we don't demand that of every non-Jewish person, so we shouldn't be demanding it of every Jewish person.)

If I see a claim that X person is a zionist, I don't just take that claim at face value; I investigate. See if that person has self-identified as a zionist anywhere, etc. If I can find no evidence, I don't spread that claim around; and I might reach out to whomever posted it to ask what gives.

I focus my time, energy, and concern on zionists / people who are pro-Israel in my own communities — rather than running around declaiming every Jewish zionist I can. As a Christian, I focus on trying to cultivate conversations with fellow Christians whom I know hold zionist or philosemitic views; those are the people I'm more likely to be able to change, after all. For any other Christians interested in what Christian zionism tends to look like and how to combat it, I highly recommend this post.

(Another helpful post tangentially related to this topic is this one about "the three Israels")

[jewishvitya]

A lot of things I hear and have a resistance to, I find hard to untangle and figure out. Is this Israeli propaganda I haven't unpacked yet, or is it that these people are applying a lens that doesn't fit the situation?

For example, the idea that Israeli music is appropriated when it sounds Middle Eastern, is it correct or is it because 60% of Israeli Jews are Mizrahi, coming from Arab countries, have a long history of making music like this? What did we appropriate and what did we bring with us? I don't know how to look into that, I don't understand music enough. Same with food, what's appropriated and what did people just bring with them? A lot of us never left the Middle East. So I don't know. I have no idea how to check which is which. I can point to the erasure of Palestinian culture as lending itself to appropriation, because it's real and it's insidious, but the rest I personally don't know how to pick apart.

But there's also something I hear more and more about how Israelis changed our names into Hebrew names to sound more indigenous. On one side of my family, the original name was Levi because of the tribe of Levi. It was changed to hide that we're Jewish and avoid violence in diaspora. Are people changing names because they finally feel free to have visibly Jewish names, or is it some attempt to obscure a history in diaspora? This isn't music, this is something I can look at a bit more easily.

I'm sure for many of us the freedom to go back to our roots is valuable. It's true that a lot of us had Hebrew names we used among ourselves, and "localized" names (not sure what else to call it) we used in official documentation etc. I'm named after my great great grandmother's Hebrew name that she had while living in France, and she never moved to Israel. I'm sure she would have loved the safety of using her name officially. So, of course, many people jumped on this opportunity. You give them the ability to register with a new name, and they use the name they had in the safety of their own community.

A Jewish person changing their name to Hebrew is often shedding a false identity they were forced to adopt.

But at the same time.

When Jewish refugees were brought here in early immigration waves, their names were changed often not by their choice. Leadership had a whole thing about imposing Hebrew names on people. I remember a story from history class, I don't remember which aliyah it was about, but we were told about people standing there and someone being like "All of you - your name is this. And this bunch - your name is that." There was a joke stereotype about Ethiopian Israelis having names that start with the letter alef because that's the first letter of the alphabet and their names were picked from an alphabetized list.

When my family members came to Israel, they kept their non-Hebrew surname, but they were given a list of Hebrew names to choose from. I think this was recently enough the they would have been able to say no to it, though. So they took their Hebrew names willingly.

I don't know if it's accurate to say the intention was to sound more indigenous. Because, at the time that this was mostly happening, the zionist movement was proudly colonialist. They separated between us and the Palestinians, placing the Palestinians as the indigenous population, as a way of placing us above them.

I think it was an attempt to homogenize Israeli society. To make it into something cohesive. Part of the melting pot. Another thing that was happening at the same time was all kinds of abuses to try to strip Jewish immigrants and refugees from their cultural and religious practices. Zionism had a very complicated and toxic relationship with Judaism, especially in those days. It had a goal of founding a state with Western enlightenment values, but for Jewish people. It relied on Judaism as an ethnicity for the definition of an in-group, and hated Judaism as a religion.

But about the names. I don't think it's to fake indigeniety. I think in some cases it's a genuine return to our own language now that we're comfortable, and in other cases, forced assimilation.