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casscainmainly · 4 months ago

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What I find interesting about Cass and ballet in Tynion's Detective Comics (2016) is not so much the communication or artistic expression aspect, but what it means for Cass' relationships to women.

From the beginning, Cass + ballet is heavily tied to her relationships with women. In Batman & Robin: Eternal #7, she first watches the ballet with Harper Row:

Ballet isn't just about "understand[ing] everything" (as Harper says), but about the physical and emotional connection Cass forges with Harper in this moment. The way their hands grasp onto each other symbolises the potential for ballet to form women-to-women bonds. Since this is N52, Cass' relationships with Babs and Steph have been sadly obliterated, so this is her very first connection to another woman.

Then, in Detective Comics #950, we meet Christine Montclair:

Christine is a ballerina who has been "handed" a key to the main stage by "the late Elaine Torsky," and who hopes to hand "that key to another young girl." Ballet becomes linked with a feminine legacy, one tied to "know[ing] exactly who she wants to become." The ideas of a female legacy and coming into one's identity strongly echo Cass' relationship to the Batgirl mantle, and the importance of female relationships to Cass' sense of self.

Ballet is, also, a storytelling medium - Tynion emphasises the importance of storytelling through #955's scene between Christine and Cass, where Christine reads her a story. She mentions that her mom used to read this to her. This is clearly an allusion to Shiva (since this arc is about Shiva), but more broadly this scene points to matrilineal connection through stories, something that Babs and Cass actually do in DC First: Batgirl/Joker. In that issue, Babs tells the story of her first encounter with Joker, which inspires Cass to do the same. Cass' mimicry - something she also does with Christine, copying her movements in the ballet school - showcase her desire for connection with other women.

(The book is also written by Carolyn Wu-San, another connection between women, stories, and family.)

And it's this connection to women that allows Cass to say her name, harkening back to Babs giving her her name in NML. This scene is also funny to me because Tynion created Orphan but he's aware the name is not something Cass actually likes - if anything, 'Orphan' feels like a punishment Cass imposed upon herself (especially in this arc, which doesn't reference that Orphan came from her dad).

It's just interesting that ballet and storytelling are mediums in which Cass finds an expression of herself, but it's not because of the communicative aspect - she never actually performs in front of anyone. Instead, it's the feminine community and legacy that allows Cass to discover herself beyond Orphan.

All this to say it's a shame Cass couldn't be Batgirl here because I really like the parallel of female legacy between ballet and Batgirl, but it gets lost without acknowledging Batgirl (2000) and DC First: Batgirl/Joker. But conceptually, Cass and ballet is about so much more than her 'communicating' via dance, and the role women and stories play in her love for ballet should be acknowledged more.

#cassandra cain #christine montclair #meta #YES i'm tagging christine YES this was an excuse to talk about christine #but more broadly i do think cass and ballet is pigeonholed into 'look how flowery and delicate she is' which is not at all what it should b #idk idk tynion's run had a lot of problems but i lowkey love it still #no other run has explored cass' relationship to art and no other run (besides bg 2000) has explored cass losing someone (clayface)#all this to say i'm a bit sad tynion's tec got less votes in my second best cass run poll than batgirls '22...#also bg 2008 beating gates of gotham....#but at least we all agree spirit world rocks spirit world sweep!!

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starcurtain · 10 months ago

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Hey! I apologize if this question has been asked before since it seems like a pretty obvious one, but where do you think the idea of Aventurine being a sex slave came from? Other than the obvious factor of it being something fun for the fandom to mess around with, I mean.

It's something I kind of took for granted as being true before playing his quest, but after finishing it I realized there wasn't really any indication. The only thing I can really think of is his master's comments about him having a good body. Is there anything in his behavior you can think of that would lead to this conclusion if it wasn't a popular fan interpretation already/kind of just an easy conclusion to reach with a slave character?

(also kind of related but what do you think of the idea that he sleeps around/with his clients to make deals? he's obviously willing to sexualize himself with the boob window, but that doesn't necessarily mean he goes further.)

As far as I can tell, the idea that Aventurine was involved in sexual slavery comes from three (maybe four) places:

First, the comment from the master about Aventurine's appearance. People were holding this comment up as refutable proof that Aventurine was used in sexual slavery on top of being tossed into the Hunger Games; however, the response from other players on this interpretation, especially the Chinese side of the fandom, was very mixed, with a lot of people pointing out that the context in the game probably meant the slave master was talking about Aventurine's ability to attract attention from fans watching the literal Sigonian Hunger Games, rather than having a direct sexual-slavery connotation.

Second, the comment from Sparkle about stripping naked and getting on his knees for Sunday. This one has way more implication in English than I think it might for an Eastern audience, actually. In English, this pretty much sounds like Sparkle saying Aventurine trades sexual favors for success in his gambles. However, I suspect the original intention in Chinese was more about humiliation. Western audiences don't have as much history with honor-based prostration, i.e. accepting corporal humiliation as a form of reconciliation that Eastern audiences might be more familiar with. And in any case, Sparkle is Sparkle. She probably just went for the lowest blow she could think of here.

Third, the general assumption that if Sigonian slaves were being chained, branded, beaten, sent to death matches, etc., it seems logical that they would also be taken advantage of in other ways. I honestly think this is probably the fairest take--many, many real slaves around the world faced (and still face!) sexual abuse, so if slaves from Sigonia were treated so poorly you could make them fight to the death for entertainment, it stands to reason they were probably also not safe from other forms of assault. We also have no idea what happened to Kakavasha in any of the years between his being a tiny child fleeing the massacre and then being purchased as a slave as a late-teens-early-twenties person. That's a very long time for a child to have to survive on their own on an extremely hostile planet and not face risks of all kinds or end up needing to do unspeakable things to survive. So I think this is at least not that far-fetched, although it's important to say there's nothing in the game that directly confirms this.

And fourth: I read a tweet semi-recently that stated that one of the Chinese (or maybe it was Japanese) names for a quest Aventurine was involved in was actually a reference to a book about a teenage sexual assault survivor. However, when I tried to verify this myself, I couldn't find any quest Aventurine was in that was based on a book about sexual assault in either English, Chinese, or Japanese. It's possible I just missed something, but I'm taking this one with a bit of a grain of salt currently, since I can't confirm it personally.

Regarding your other question, about whether I think Aventurine sleeps around to make deals...

I definitely think he does not, for one major reason.

First, I will admit that Aventurine is definitely willing to use his appearance to his advantage. This is pretty obvious. He wears incredibly flashy clothes, baths himself in cologne, overloads on glittering golden jewels, and absolutely calls attention to his appearance when working with clients.

We see him actively doing this in his Moment Among the Stars video, where he is clearly using his looks as an equal tool (to his wealth), to daze his target.

It's not an accident that he says things like "Use me as you wish," with all the explicit connotations preserved. The implication is there. However, unless he was absolutely backed into a corner, I think that implication is all it will ever be.

The reason I think this is that the devs go out of their way to give Aventurine three fairly noticeable physical behaviors in his in-game scenes:

For one, he has some of the most closed off body language of any character in the game.

Aventurine's default conversation pose is arms crossed directly and tightly in front of himself. This is like "Defensive Body Language 101." By crossing your arms, you put a symbolic barrier between yourself and the person you're speaking to, and also ensure that your hands are up and available in case you actually need to physically defend yourself.

Virtually all of Aventurine's conversations take place from this stance, no matter who he is speaking to (from the Trailblazer all the way to Topaz). He deliberately closes his pose off and tightens up his silhouette, which just sends a glaring "Don't touch me" message.

This closing off is also blatantly apparent when you compare it to the deliberately open poses he strikes while trying to make himself seem accessible to others (like tempting clients) or seem powerful (to intimidate):

Complementing this habit of closing himself off is a second noticeable aspect of his body language: He frequently avoids eye contact to the point that he even holds conversations while entirely facing away from the person he's speaking to.

I might be a bit lenient and say maybe he's doing this to on purpose to be mysterious, whoo~~ But... in all honestly, he just does this with everyone, even with Ratio while trying to talk about an actual important issue (wanting to look into Acheron's real identity). Hell, even the fake Aventurine does it to himself!

We can even say that wearing the rose-tinted glasses in the first place is another intentional barrier, one Aventurine deliberately removes in specific moments to give people the (false) impression that he's "letting them in" to his circle:

Now, this might be a bit more complicated in Aventurine's case, because eye contact has a whole extra meaning when eyes are the defining trait of your species and come with particularly challenging racial stereotypes. So it may be that Aventurine is simply used to conducting conversation while looking away to minimize racial prejudice against his eyes' unique appearance.

However, I'd also argue that the devs deliberately turned his entire model away in cutscene after cutscene to create a clear sense of being inaccessible, unapproachable, and unwilling to engage in the physical intimacy of standing closely, directly facing, and staring at his conversation partners.

While he faces away, he controls both the figurative and the literal direction of conversation, forcing people to keep their eyes on him while he is free to move as he pleases. Over and over again, it just says "I want to be the one in control. I'm not afraid to show my back to you, but you are not welcome to come near me."

And, in fact, that's a third aspect of his character's body language that I am sure the devs did not include accidentally: More so than other characters, many of Aventurine's conversations are conducted from weirdly far distances. Like, half the time he's talking, he's standing all the way on the opposite side of the room!

This habit of speaking from a-larger-than-normal distance is apparent in the first scene with Himeko...

And then in just about every other conversation too:

The bubble is twenty feet in every direction.

Like yes, he does approach and have conversations like a normal person... sometimes... But it is significantly more noticeable with Aventurine than with other characters that he often conducts whole conversations--even with his allies--from a distance. Just genuinely weirdly far apart.

Leaving space for Gaiathra, I guess.

And it's because these significant decisions were made with Aventurine's in-game body language that, when he deliberately alters his own behavior, it is instantaneously noticeable.

In 2.0, he closes the distance, the glasses come off, and he gets directly up in the Trailblazer's face.

It's uncomfortable not just because the player is suddenly being loomed over, but because this behavior has already been subconsciously established for the player as out of character for Aventurine.

The barriers the character himself was putting up are deliberately stripped away so that he can use physicality and demanding eye contact to intimidate his target. He has to reverse his own normal body language in order to come across as domineering (and, I guess if you're into that, appealing in a domineering manner).

And ummmm, just a tiny aside here because I can't resist:

This does mean that when the game goes out of its way to demonstrate Aventurine altering his own normal habit of distant and defensive body language, it is absolutely intentional.

Yes, this is a Ratiorine post in disguise. There literally isn't any other character in the game that Aventurine is shown being comfortable standing so close to and interacting with in this manner. This doesn't occur in every one of their scenes, but Ratio is the only character that this happens with repeatedly. It's not an accident that the devs literally added "They were walking side-by-side" as flavor text.

But look, I'll be fair: There's a great example of this in Aventurine's scene with Acheron too, where he closes the distance and attempts to make eye contact with her--seeking her guidance and closeness--and she is actually the one stepping away, speaking with her back turned, demonstrating her power and control (and issues with connection!) in that scene.

Anyway, this was a whole longggg tangent into analyzing Aventurine's body language, but my point is that, overall, the devs deliberately adjusted his model's actions in-game to give the impression of a person who clearly wants to be in control of every interaction he has with other people, who insists on distance over intimacy, and whose stances and habits suggest that he is significantly less accessible and open than his "Use me as you wish" motto might suggest.

Long story longer, I think that there is almost zero chance Aventurine is willingly ceding control over himself or the actions expected of him to anyone he isn't 100% comfortable with, and I think that using physical intimacy of any kind would be an absolute last resort for him. Frankly, he comes across as more likely to shoot himself in the foot than let someone he doesn't trust lay hands on him.

To me, he reads very much as "You may look, but you may not touch."

#honkai star rail #aventurine #honkai star rail meta #ratiorine #aventio #lowkey though #body language analysis #I fully respect people's sexy Aventurine headcanons #and I read many many fanfics too lol #but as far as what we're shown in-game is concerned #I think Aventurine would rather eat live scorpions than kiss a stranger #don't get me wrong #I think Aventurine will always do what he NEEDS to do #to win the gamble complete the mission etc.#BUT I also think #that he is FAR more likely to jump off a bridge to solve his problems #to commit MURDER to solve his problems #than use himself as a (literal) honey trap #it seems to me that this would be the last resort and only the last resort ever #not out of a desire to avoid sex or anything #but simply because of the issue of control #any form of vulnerability that would leave him at another person's whims #seems off the table unless absolutely absolutely necessary

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