#is interesting context for how he interacts with Gotham and Bruce in the times he visits after the Cataclysm

[umbrellajam]

Superman (1987) #91

Lex, after half destroying Metropolis, paralyzed in a dying clone body and about to be stomped on by his own rampaging robot: NOOOO!!! STOP!!! 😭 betrayed by my own creations oh the cruel irony!!! the humanity!!! 😭 STOP you can't do this to meeeee, I wanna live, I wanna LIVE abloobloobloo 😭

Superman: *arrives and tackles the robot away at the last second* ugh. why couldn't I be half a second too late just this once... 😑

Lex, once again saved solely by the grace of Clark Kent: smh that DAMN Kryptonian 😤 I would have WELCOMED death instead of the TORTURE of being LOCKED in this WORTHLESS BODY 😤 CONSTANTLY thwarted by that ARROGANT alien he WANTS me to SUFFER!!!!! 😤

[seleneprince]

Please drop hints , i love guessing game. I'm really eager to learn the new relationship between batboy(especially damian and jason) and lucia (if it's still her name) but also between mattheo (and his twin) and damian😊.

Also i'm wondering if in this new timeline ,lucia's family are villain or antihero or something else.

I was actually planning on dropping the hints through the chapters, but seeing that i'm taking too long and i'm a fucking disaster when it comes to organizing my ideas, I guess I can drop some little hints..🥰

As for now, the entire family will become yandere at some point for Lucia's family (they're referred by their mother's surname but seeing they're meant to be x reader as well, i won't use unless it's necessary), but in total three of them will be the romantic type of yandere. For now at least...

For context, Lucia's family are very, very morally grey, leaning towards villainy most of the time. Lucia's mother comes from a very shady upbringing that has shaped her world views radically and the way she raises her children. She only blackmailed Bruce to marry her so the Wayne name protected her children and herself, since they survived a murder attempt in their house. Lucia's mother had no intention of reaching out to Bruce, since Lucia's conception was an accident he didn't know about. Again, she's only his wife because she ran out of options.

The obvious neglect and even downright disdain they faced from the Batfam only pushed them closer to the criminal lifestyle, feeling that they couldn't trust anyone else to have their backs. Rosa raised them to be survivors, to be cunning and sharp and always think of what's best for themselves. She instills in them that relying on anyone outside their inmediate family is not allowed, to use masks when they interact with the world, and if they must break the rules to get their way, she teaches them how to do it. To her, moral ground means nothing compared to her children's survival and happiness.

When Damian tried to kill Lucia, this only cemented their dark path. To them, it was the ultimate confirmation the Batfam would never care for them. That they weren't completely safe in that damn manor either. No one would lift a finger for them anyway. They only had each other.

So Lucia's mother made her decision. Raise and prepare her children to follow in her footsteps. To thrive in Gotham's underground, building their own network to not depend on the Batfam so much. She taught them to be dangerous, ruthless and put themselves first at all times.

So yeah, I'll say they're more like villains, but they're also anti-heroes sometimes. They're not really bad people per se, they just do what's best for themselves and their interests. They've been isolated from the batfam for years and feeling no one gives a fuck about them. Therefore, they found their own path.

[a-bad-case-of-the-stephs]

Okay, so I'm gonna give a little bit of needless context to this ask before asking the ask -

Every time I find a "new" character that I'm interested in and scroll their tags, I find one or more canon panels with Dick Grayson being a little shittt to them. This is often accompanied by the in-universe justification of him being stressed/brainwashed/misled/possessed. This has happened with Helena Bertinelli, JPV and Donna Troy.

I also generally dislike the man because he's a batboy and I am generally peeved by their presence in other tags.

Now I have come to you, my primary source of Stephanie Brown facts, to try to confirm my biases against this man.

I remember that he was in Gotham for the Gang War, and that he was Batman during her run as Batgirl under Oracle. But it has been a while since I've read those comics.

Was Dick Grayson ever present in any meaningful capacity during her Robin and Batgirl days? Was he nice to her? Did he have any reaction to Bruce "losing" another Robin?

Dick Grayson and Steph have had extremely limited preboot interactions, so this question is actually pretty easy and straightforward to answer!!!

I don’t know if I’ll be very helpful in confirming or denying your Dick Grayson related biases, but I can give you list of every interaction I can think of, and leave it up to you to interpret them as you’d like!

(I will say ‘character wasn’t an asshole to stephanie brown at least once’ is a pretty high bar to clear. Weirdly enough a lot of the characters she meets will at first lowkey have unsubstantiated issues with her. Babs has had her beef with her, even before Steph took up the Batgirl mantle, Cass has said some hurtful things about and to Steph (and vice versa), Alfred fucking HATESSS Steph’s guts before her death and makes it very clear, Tim despite how close he and Steph are also has his more insulting moments and Bruce is like.. self explanatory. Damian’s character was just generally prickly when he met Steph, and their first meeting makes him no exception to this rule. A lot of these characters warm up to her eventually, it’s just rarely automatic. A lot of these preboot relationships are complicated, and messy and fun and nuanced. Just something to keep in mind)

Alright!! Itemized list of every interaction I can think of in order of occurrence:

- Tim and Dick have a convo where Steph’s pregnancy comes up. Dick is familar with Stephs name, presumably from talking with Tim at some nebulous point beforehand

Nightwing #25

- Dick makes a surprise appearance in Stephanie Browns giving birth dream sequence (we have not seen them meet or interact at all on panel at this point btw. No clue why she would have him appear in the dream sequence)

- Dick and Steph are both in the Last Laugh, thought they don’t rly work together or see each other except for this moment, which is like barely an interaction:

Last Laugh #6

- they also are both in BW:Murderer/Fugitive but iirc this is the only moment they are in the same room, and Steph’s pretty much only there as Cass’ tag-along buddy. It’s complicated because Steph is dealing w a VERY different layer of BW:Murderer than Dick. Steph is hardly involved at all besides her hanging out with Cass, and doesn’t know why everyone is so invested in solving this murder or the broader implications at all.

Batgirl #27 (2000)

-we don’t see them interact during Steph’s time as Robin, and we actually have no indication Dick even knows Steph even took on the mantle. Though he very well could have found out through talking with Tim, once Tim found out.

-Steph during very early War Games reflects on Nightwing and his role as the first Robin. She states she didn’t know more abt him than pretty much the barebones ‘legend’ everyone knows about Batman and Robin, the fact that he’s friends with a lot of the superhero community, and that’s he’s very loyal to Batman.

Batman: The 12 Cent Adventure (2004)

(You’re right that Dick Grayson was in Gotham during War Games, but he and Steph do not interact)

-After Steph’s death, Dicks in the middle of reeling after a genuinely horrifically intense downward spiral angst arc he has been enduring over in Nightwing 1996 for the past good while, but we do get to see his direct reaction to Stephs death:

Nightwing #99

He later (its weird timing wise) over in Batman participates in the ‘Bruce Wayne did nothing wrong / Steph was a screwup innately’ lovefest, but I find his reaction in Nightwing a lot more true to form and focused.

Batman #634

I don’t think there is another interaction until Batgirl 2009, where we get the meat of their interactions and also a source of conflict

-Dick underestimates Steph’s abilities and basically tells Babs to make her fuck off until he eventually comes around and gives them the go-ahead to operate out of the batcave

Pretty common kind of story in Batgirl 2009, various vigilantes (Babs and Tim both) are at first adamantly disapproving of Steph acting as Batgirl, with that disapproval often times portrayed as out of fear for Steph’s safety, before they discover Steph is more competent/determined than they believed.

So there it is! A pretty complete overview of Dick and Steph’s preboot interactions and relationship. You can make of it what you will.

If anyone noticed I missed anything, please lmk! Hope this was helpful and thanks for the ask!

[celaenaeiln]

C: Hi there! Even if I've been reading dick Grayson(and in turn batfamily) fics for a few weeks now, I've never actually watched/read DC stuff because even if I liked superheroes, I'm not invested enough to read the actual comics. The most I watched was the Teen Titans 2003 cartoon(which I love). I was brought into interest cause I was brought in through crossovers of other fandoms (which may be hated by some/many😅)

To give myself context, I tried to read around for Robin, and imagine my surprise there's more than one? Which, okay mantle thing I guess. But in the end, Dick Grayson caught my attention(not rlly for his looks and design, but more of his heroism and entire personality and affect in the DC world). Which leads to looking at other tumblrs and I love reading yours and when you answer the asks cause it's so much easier for me to understand the kind of person Dick is and how he interacts with the world.

Sorry for this long context, but I just want maybe your opinion, what if your opinion in the combination of how Dick Grayson should be written for him to Thrive

- Should he stay in Gotham, being in with the batfamily more? Soloing in Bludhaven? Staying with the titans? Or others?

- what about his romantic relationships? Who should be is one true one(based on canon gfs), or maybe stay single? (Just gonna be biased, but I've only knew about dickbabs and dickkory (but I heard he has other girlfriends and I've remember reading he was almost married...a few times??) but dickkory had always been for me)

- What about mentally wise? (Of course, I do think Dick needs a long vacation because of all the trauma that he has to go through), but even if I like the idea of Dick being admired for his looks because he deserves it, but I do rmbr posts that he is uncomfy with this(sexualisation, Def only staying true to the person he loves (then there's the whole...Tarantula and more thing)

Tbf, I do think is a little bit of all is what makes Dick, Dick. Haha

Sorry for the long ask, feel free to not answer because i just needed to get this out😅. I know it's actually bad I'm reading fics without canon knowledge for personality, but your posts makes me understand him more that I understand what's real and what's fanon in fics (that makes me..ugh.. but I read anyway for plot cause i don't know better)

But thank you anyway for reading this and I love your content!

(last one for this ask I swear: I've been seeing stuff where Robin name is actually Dick's mom calling Dick that. Then it's passed down as a mantle starting from Jason without Dick consenting. I tried to read at wiki, maybe I missed out but I can't find anything. Is it true? Does the other bats (except Bruce and Alfred?) know the actual meaning? Because as much as I love Dami, the whole bloodson, birthright to take the mantle of Robin beside Batman give me ugh feelings if it's true) :C

First of all, thank you so much!! I'm so happy to hear you like my stuff <333!!

I think it's fine that you started in the fandom since I sort of started out that way too lol. I had only watched Teen Titans Animated show and Young Justice before I got into fanfics and my first comic I ever read was actually Teen Titans (2011) which was Tim's run. It's been a journey.

Dick's personality was also what captivated me so here I am!

"Should he stay in Gotham, being in with the batfamily more? Soloing in Bludhaven? Staying with the titans? Or others?"

That's a really good question and a complex one. Ironically, for being such a people person, Dick seems to be doing best when he's by himself. When he's soloing, he has a sense of freedom and independence that he's been craving for a long time. The whole reason he left Bruce was because he felt like Bruce was suddenly treating him like a kid, like someone to look after, when he had been treating Dick like a partner the whole time. When Dick feels like his independence is being stepped on, it unsettles him. This is another reason why the Tom Taylor run and Dick's relationship pisses me off but that's for another time. As much as he likes Gotham, he loves Bludhaven. He thinks it's a dirty, crime-filled city, sure, but he loves it there.

He's a little crazy like that.

He doesn't have the same attachment to Gotham that Bruce does. Instead he feels that for Bludhaven.

The only reason I'm saying Dick is better off staying alone than with the Titans is because of his leadership mentality. There's a comic that I forgot the name of but Dick teams up with members of the Justice League and they trapeze through a jungle under the orders of this corrupt military general. He teams up with Arthur and automatically starts commanding people to which Aquaman tells him off, saying this isn't the Titans. Dick is genuinely sorry and backs off. For a minute. But immediately goes right back into command mode but Arthur lets it go, realizing that Dick's not conscious of it and that his behaviour is automatic. "Too many leaders" he calls the situation in his head. For Dick, the Titans have become a responsibility now. He loves them like crazy but they look up at him automatically for directions and order and he's gotten so used to leading them that it's his go to mode.

He just likes doing stuff without someone hovering over his shoulder or having to take care of others.

"what about his romantic relationships? Who should be is one true one(based on canon gfs), or maybe stay single? (Just gonna be biased, but I've only knew about dickbabs and dickkory (but I heard he has other girlfriends and I've remember reading he was almost married…a few times??) but dickkory had always been for me)"

Yeah, I've actually loved almost all of his romantic relationships. I hate Dickbabs but every other one has been fantastic. Kori was great for him.

Action Comics (1938) Issue #618

Dick says it again here. He used to envy Roy's freedom. He's also said in another comic that he fell in love with Kori for her freedom.

Secret Origins (1986) Issue #13

You're right, he has gotten almost married a few times

The first time was with Kori

The New Titans (1988) Issue #100

But then

The New Titans (1988) Issue #100

their pastor gets vaporised and body-controlled Raven feeds the soul of one of Trigon's children into Kori and she goes crazy but she recovers but it's a whole ordeal. In the end they don't get a chance to complete their marriage. They were spectacular together though. The only reason their wedding didn't go through is because the Batfam writers wanted Dick back so they took him from the Titans' writers and they needed a big dramatic scene to cut him off from the Titans. Another reason why Barbara was deaged and created as a love interest- to gatekeep him in the family.

He's also gotten married to Barbara before the retcon though.

Batman Family Issue #11

But here they were forced to by Maze and they went along with it and tricked him. At the end though, they just grab a bite to eat.

Ngl I actually would've supported this marriage. I really love this Barbara. Yes the age difference is a bit much but whatever, I still like them.

Dick and Barbara have gotten married in an alternate timeline.

Convergence: Nightwing/Oracle Issue #2

yeah, definitely didn't like this one.

Dick's also gotten fake married to a woman because Batman and Dick thought she was killing her husbands after marrying them so Dick married her to see if it was true.

Nightwing (1996) Annual #1

I liked her. She wasn't the killer and Dick did a fantastic job raising her son but even though she loved him, he didn't love her and they divorced amicably. I wish I could see more of her and her son though.

To be completely honest, my favorites for Dick are Kori and Bea.

Bea was a fantastic partner. She was understanding, loving, caring, and responsible. She was there when he was Ric Grayson and just loved him for who he was.

Nightwing (2016) Issue #53

If Kori's truly out of the picture, then Dick really should've settled down with her.

Nightwing (2016) Issue #57

She and Kori, they don't tell Dick what to do or who to be. They let him be free which is why I loved them an extraordinary amount. I'm a sucker for soft moments and Bea and Dick are couple goals.

Nightwing (2016) Issue #62

They give him the freedom he craves.

"What about mentally wise? (Of course, I do think Dick needs a long vacation because of all the trauma that he has to go through), but even if I like the idea of Dick being admired for his looks because he deserves it, but I do rmbr posts that he is uncomfy with this(sexualisation, Def only staying true to the person he loves (then there's the whole...Tarantula and more thing)"

I think Dick does need a break. His life has been a series of unfortunate events but despite all that, I think he loves it that way. Dick loves the thrill of adventure. It's the heart of who he is and why he became robin. The excitement he gets when fighting or doing crazy stunts - he loves all of it and that is his coping mechanism. I guess in order for him to thrive, Bruce needs to stop dumping all his trauma and stop expecting him to be there for him at all times of the day. Dick keeps getting dragged back to Gotham to take care of Bruce and his problems and he would go in a heartbeat but he's much happier wacking his own goons in Bludhaven. But since Bruce is so codependent on Dick, this pattern's not gonna stop anytime soon.

Truth be told I also like Dick being admired for his looks. I don't like him being called out by it though. First of all why would you comment "hot booty" to someone? It's degrading and humiliating even if you think it's a compliment. Some things are better left untold. But regardless of what people think, Dick will always be pretty and everyone in the DC universe knows this. Heroes, civilians, villains - they're all attracted to him on some level because he's so beautiful. And honestly? I'm all for it! Because that boy is the prettiest human in existence and he deserves that recognition. Just not vocally or physically.

The best thing is that Dick's beauty has no bearing on his mentality toward people. This man will choose one person and stick with them forever. He values intimacy and trust and love in his relationships which is why he's so attached to each one. This plays a massive role in his relationship with Kori. He would never cheat. Actually in all the future comics, after his spouse passes away or leaves, he never remarries. The only one exception was Batman Beyond (2016). The only one and he remarries Barbara after his wife passes away. Aside from that he remains a single parent. That's how dedicated he is.

"I've been seeing stuff where Robin name is actually Dick's mom calling Dick that. Then it's passed down as a mantle starting from Jason without Dick consenting. I tried to read at wiki, maybe I missed out but I can't find anything. Is it true? Does the other bats (except Bruce and Alfred?) know the actual meaning? Because as much as I love Dami, the whole bloodson, birthright to take the mantle of Robin beside Batman give me ugh feelings if it's true)"

Yup Dick's mother called Dick Robin.

Nightwing (2011) Issue #0

Robin (1993) Annual #4

Here's a couple but there are more instances of his mom calling him Robin.

Dick had no idea Bruce passed on the Robin costume. He finds out through the newspaper because Bruce is pissed at Dick. Like he's so mad that when he told Dick to leave, Dick actually left.

You know how there's a saying about not being able to take back words of anger? Bruce is feeling that heavily. He already had suspicions that Dick wanted to leave but before Dick could tell him, he fired him so he wouldn't have to hear those words. But Bruce is super mad that Dick left anyway. So what does he do? He makes the first boy he sees Robin.

And Jason finds out Dick was Robin when he confronts Bruce why Nightwing knows Bruce's identity. And that gets Bruce more mad because he's now feeling guilty which is when Dick comes to confront Bruce.

Batman (1940) Issue #416

But instead of meeting anger for anger, Dick expresses his hurt. About how they were partners and then talks about his life after leaving Bruce.

And Bruce loves Dick. His best friend, son, brother, and partner for nearly 11 years. They raised each other and despite his anger, he smiles in pride and love.

Batman (1940) Issue #416

Look at his smile!! He's so proud of his son.

And that's when Dick stops pulling his punches.

Batman (1940) Issue #416

Bruce looks so wrecked. The guilt and sorrow is tantamount to his pain.

Then Dick asks Bruce why he choose someone new.

Batman (1940) Issue #416

So Bruce tells him. But Dick and Bruce's relationship go way deeper than just friends or family. They know each other. They revolve around each other so Dick calls him out.

Batman (1940) Issue #416

And out comes the truth

Batman (1940) Issue #416

But Dick has always been the bigger man and instead of letting Jason become some sort of spite move, he turns Robin into a legacy.

Batman (1940) Issue #416

He passes it down like it was meant to be passed down. Because let's be honest here. The Robin name and costume is Dick's. If he wanted to, he could've taken it back, Bruce be damned. And that was one of Jason's fears.

Batman (1940) Issue #416

But despite Bruce's words to Jason

Batman (1940) Issue #416

He's not sure himself.

Batman (1940) Issue #416

But it's only with Dick's approval that he becomes Robin which is what Bruce is thanking at the end.

Batman (1940) Issue #416

And this has been a sort of tradition.

Dick approved of Jason being Robin, he endorsed Tim, and he made Damian Robin. The only exception being Stephanie. This is why Dick feels a heavy sense of responsibility over the robin predicament. He created the tradition. He approved, supported, and mentored every robin that walked in his colors and name. That's why he feels the burden of it.

I don't think any of the other robins know the meaning behind the name. Maybe they do. But ironically, the one who wasn't robin is the one who knows the meaning of it.

Duke.

[kindlingkeen]

do you have any good fic recs? i've just finished reading all of your fics (AMAZING btw i LOVE competent jason and you write him sooo well) and obviously you have good taste so i thought i might as well ask (i will say that i don't really do ship fics tho)

thank you! looking forward to what you have in store for jason and the batfam next!

First, thank you for the ask! And I’m so glad you’ve been enjoying my fics!! 😊 I’m on vacation this week and finally writing again (had a bit of a rough writer’s block patch). So hopefully I’ll be posting more content in the next couple of weeks.

Fic recs - boy do I ever. I will say, I have super varied tastes in fics, I’ll read just about anything Gen that’s Jason-centric, plus a few Jason ships (although I’m pretty picky about what actually makes it into my bookmarks). All of the fics I’m rec’ing below are Gen, although some might have flavors of a relationship (likely JayRoy since that’s my preferred pairing). I tried to pick a selection of different styles and tropes, so hopefully you find something you like. Almost all these authors have multiple fics I’ve loved, so look at their other works on ao3 for more great reading (you may need to be logged into ao3 to see some of them). Enjoy!

Fic recs

Glow in the Dark Stars by essspressso (stylesmakethefight) 

This is a time travel fic that made me bawl ugly tears, like seriously bawl. Read if in need of a good cry.

The Cold Like Coming Home by cabezas_de_vaca 

An interesting one-shot of Jason and Bruce finding their way back to each other.

More Chances Than Deserved 'Verse by Skalidra  @skalidra

A series that starts out post batarang, Jason does not rejoin the family.

Gotham CPS by ebjameston 

Not sure how to even describe this one, it’s pure hilarity told by an outsider POV.

Nests and Cages by LanternWisp, Lysical @lanternwisp

A series detailing Jason’s journey back to the family. The last installment of the series has probably the best reconciliation discussion between Jason and Bruce re: Bruce taking on another Robin that I’ve ever read.

Buy One Get One Free by Here_we_go

A series that starts with catatonic Jason. I love how Jason is written in this one so so much (especially the main first part), and there’s a short segment later in the series with Talia that’s lovely.

fever by r_astra  @heyy-its-skip

One-shot. Quality batdad in the context of a sick fic

nightmares and daydreams by r_astra @heyy-its-skip

One-shot. Beware, there’s some heavy duty torture in this one. Jason & Tim isn’t usually my thing, but I really like their brief interaction in this one.

all the small weights by sparkycap

One-shot. More quality batdad, this time in the context of fear toxin

a (cat)astrophe in the making by mikkal

Part of a loosely connected series, if I’m remembering correctly. I’m a firm believer that Jason Todd needs a cat.

Red Hood by envysparkler @envysparkler

An amazing Jason rejoins the family, classic fix it, set early in Lost Days continuity. Envysparkler’s works are pretty much solely responsible for getting me into the Batfam. This fic in particular motivated me to start writing TPWC.

Overcoming Our Antecedents by Batbirdies @batbirdies

De-aging fic, this isn’t my favorite trope, but of what’s out there, I like the dynamics in this one.

Things We Only Talk About After Dark by BabblingBookends

One-shot. More good batdad, but not fluffy like the other two above. I really like how Bruce is written in this one, how he struggles with the unknown.

Kidnapped! by Cerusee @cerusee

One-shot set in Jason’s Robin days. One of my favorites for father and son feels.

A MOMENT THAT'S HELD IN YOUR ARMS. by orpheusaki

More baby Robin Jay and good dad Bruce.

White Lighters / Afterglow by lurkinglurkerwholurks @lurkinglurkerwholurks

One-shot. Another one that legitimately made me cry.

Druthers by d_aia @e-alexandrescu

A really creative, not-your-typical-take on Jason rejoining the family. Sniper Jason is so frelling cool.

I linked the tumblr’s for the authors I know of. If you have any to add, leave them in the comments and I’ll update!

[yvtro]

struggling to phrase this concisely but do u have any thoughts on how stephanie and cassandra would relate or struggle to relate to jason given that his death was held over both of their heads and the timing of his return to gotham being RIGHT after steph’s death in war games… i just think it’s such an underutilized dynamic and there’s a lot of interesting stuff there bc i think cass would find jason infuriating whereas steph would find him unnervingly relatable and similar to her… add in the context of jason’s relationships to dick babs and tim (or lack thereof) and i just think there’s a lot of much more interesting storylines and conflicts than the half redeemed uncommitted to anything jason we have now where most of the batfam is like simultaneously disdainful of and indifferent to jason’s presence/choices

disclaimer: i'm moving blogs. still here to go through my askbox, but you will find me at @boyfridged from now on.

i’m sorry but I think this might be a mad disappointing answer… (which is why i’m very curious how you see it! maybe there’s some interesting angle that i am missing – please do tell!)

i think it all depends on what moment in the timeline we are thinking about for jason. utrh doesn't offer much space for anyone other than bruce and jay to interact, and i believe this (and lost days) is the only time when he is truly committed to any particular moral 'code' or a specific cause (like 'controlling crime'). even in comics in which jay is portrayed as a villain, he doesn't really... do anything other than displaying severe mental illness symptoms? no more crime empire, no more fixed agenda, just dogmatic murder and wandering around in some maladaptive state. but since you mentioned that in most scenarios he is “half-redeemed”, i will go with what i think is going on with jay post-utrh: he's not truly committed, but he's also not rehabilitated; nowhere near to it, even. 

now, the question that i always ask myself in terms of what dynamics can arise for characters is what both of them can get out of this relationship (on a meta level). 

which kinda leads me to perhaps a very underwhelming assumption that jay is just such a mess in that period that it's difficult to imagine scenarios where characters like steph or cass actually gain anything from sharing the narrative with him. it's a bit ironic in a sense that jay could get plenty out of it in terms of his storyline: cass' very presence poses a threat to his already very wobbly philosophy, and it would probably unnerve him because of how her personality reflects his own innate compassion. steph, on the other hand, is like a still frame of his worst time as robin, right before his death. (and by *the worst* I mean his emotional turmoil and issues in relationship with bruce rather than an assessment of his skills or even morals), which i think would also terrify him. as such, i reckon he would actually avoid both of them. in terms of cass, I don’t think she would necessarily want to interact with him either, mostly because while *ordinarily* she would fight anyone of his views, and she for sure wouldn't have much sympathy for him, she would be able to see that his philosophy is a result of immense trauma. we could conceive circumstances in which they are forced to work together, and as i once mentioned, if we put them in a box and shook hard enough, a conflict would definitely arise. but at the end of the day, does cass get anything out of it in terms of her own development? at this point she is (for the better part) way past the internal conflicts that jay experiences; she is simply more mature. 

as for steph, i could see steph seeking him out if the comparison to the ‘failed robin’ was fresh in her mind. but I think, to an extent, she would be disappointed – because while they do share a lot of characteristics and background, he is reckless only as much as he is suicidal. it’s definitely not his typical trait and as a child, he never had the same issues with bruce until the very end (starlin’s run). i'm not saying there's no room to still bond over certain things – but jay's self-isolating tendencies definitely would not help here at all. and i think if steph realised how big of a mistmatch there is between all of stories she was fed and his past + current attitude, she would maybe pity him.

so tldr it’s very difficult for me to imagine any particular dynamics nor stories for them within that timeframe. i don't think it's the case for *all* characters btw – i think people who knew him before (dick, donna, perhaps leslie or dana if we want to go in the direction of civilians), people who don't even know who he is and don't really care (kyle), or parental figures/older gen (talia or even some jl members) generally have a better set up to get involved with jay in meaningful ways (for both sides involved.)

but when it comes to characters around his age who only heard of him in a context of his death, it's simply... sad, especially that he *is* still a walking tragedy at this point.

now, on the other hand… the lost days? here, there is some grand potential for cass & jay or even jay & steph content. but that’s a topic for a whole another post.

[stxleslyds]

MY TOUGHTS ON THE END OF RED HOOD BY CHIP ZDARSKY.

Dishonour! Dishonour on you, dishonour on your cow! 

Well Jason Nation, it happened again, fanon wins over canon. The amount of bullshit that DC made Zdarsky write in this issue is insane, I have never seen this many fanfiction tropes shoved in a single issue in my life.

This book has been a constant insult to Jason’s character and his Red Hood “persona” since the very first issue but I never thought it would end this badly. It’s incredibly sad.

I will go ahead and say it, this tumblr and this post is not “Batfamily” friendly and it definitely isn’t fanon friendly when it comes to Jason Todd.

Fanon is destroying canon for Jason Todd. I am sorry but that’s how I see it, fanon doesn’t belong in canon, I would never get tired of saying that. But here is the thing, DC latches on to Jason’s fanon version because it fits their narrative of “the Batman is all that is right and all must follow his rules or they shall disappear”.

DC has been dying to make Jason bland and flavourless just like Batman. And now here it finally is.

Let’s be honest the story in this book, the new drug, Cheer, Tyler and his mom, none of that shaped this story, none of those things were the support beams for it. It was all about this never ending “daddy issues” thing that DC pretends is going on between Jason and Bruce.

It was all about those two fighting because they “think differently” so in the end they can push Jason towards the “no killing rule” being also the Red Hood’s modus operandi.

Its utter bullshit.

From the moment that Jason had to put a bat suit on I knew that this was going to be a mess. Luckily like I predicted they didn’t make a big deal out of him wearing it but the “Jason admires Batman” feeling was very present in the issue.

I will not talk about how easy it was for that one thug to land a punch on Jason while he was distracted and I will also not talk about Jason being a dumbass for not securing his dumb mask better when he knew the fight will involve gases. I will not talk about it.

Anyway, let’s talk about the Cheer Gas induced illusion, shall we?

In Jason’s illusion he finds Bruce at the manor looking at the picture of Joker’s death (?) and even though that is strange what Bruce says next is even weirder, he says this: “I did it. He was the last one, but I did it…Joker is dead. I am done.”

Now what the hell was that? This is Jason’s illusion, and by the looks of it in his illusion Bruce has killed every baddie in Gotham and left the Joker for last? Am I reading that right? Is this this a joke?

I understand that this is an illusion so the gas is making “real” things that Jason probably doesn’t know he wants, like wanting Bruce to go on a killing spree, which Jason never wanted because he said it himself, do you guys remember the iconic “I’m not talking about killing Cobblepot and Scarecrow or Clayface. Not Riddler or Dent…I’m talking about HIM. Just him.” Because I remember and it’s so important to Jason’s character, Jason never wanted Bruce to go on a killing spree, he wanted Bruce to kill the clown who had killed him when he was only fifteen. Is that so hard to remember DC?

And then it gets worse! Since WHEN has Jason wanted a perfect family life with the people that he has tried to kill, harm or looked down to? Why is “being with a bunch of people who NEVER get together for anything other than “help” the Bat in a fight against a fucking clown” the idea of happiness to Jason? Has this man ever interacted with any of these people in a positive way without the intrusion of a Batman/Robin event in the way? I will give you the answer, it’s no, the answer is no.

Jason Todd doesn’t care for your “Batfamily” bullshit DC, why would it matter to him? Because he was Robin? He was killed by the Joker when he was Robin, and he was killed because the man in charge of him didn’t pay enough attention! Jason Todd who was written as Dick Grayson’s number one hater for so long (and fandom loves that) is now having an illusion where he enjoys happy times with him along the others? Cass and Stephanie? What? Am I missing something, is this actually AO3, is this fanfiction?

I think Zdarsky got confused, this illusion is what would happen if Jason were dosed with fear gas. That must be it, I solved it everyone! Zdarsky just got confused by his own writing!

I wish.

Let’s go back to the sad reality, Jason has a moment in which he actually puts all his training in motion and shakes of the gas’s grasp on him. He does that but he is grabbed by so many people (who are this people?) and he is unarmed and I believe that’s the only reason why Cheer is still alive after saying that he has someone in Tyler’s mom’s hospital room ready to kill her if he doesn’t join him.

(If this were the real Jason, Cheer would have dropped dead instantly.)

But this is not the real Jason and this is not a *real* comic, it’s fanfiction! So just like that time in Batman #100 when Dick was fighting alone as Nightwing (for the first time since his “family” left him alone after losing his memories) the rest of the “family” shows up to fight Cheer and four random thugs.

Yep, its like the MCU had considered having Cap say “Avengers Assemble” when they were fighting a couple of robots instead of Thanos.

What a mess.

Also having Jason say, in real life (not illusion world), “You know what happiness is? It’s knowing that others have your back.” about this group of people is the perfect recipe for a big OOC moment for absolutely everyone. I cannot believe they have dragged Jason back to this awful concept and that they have sank him so low. It’s quite honestly, disgusting.

But the horrors don’t end there, we have a wonderful moment after Jason gives Batman the antidote, Jason stops Batman from punching the living shit out of Cheer. Because I am not stupid. There is no way in the world that you can convince me that Jason just stopped Batman from killing Cheer.

How incredibly delusional do you have to be to write Batman finally killing someone and that someone being Cheer, a guy that was introduced to comics two months ago?

Yes, later its said that between the gas and the antidote Bruce was a little too crazy and couldn’t help himself BUT I call bullshit once more, because Bruce has gone completely bat-shit-crazy on people before! I remember two recent instances in which that happened. Batman #57 in which Bruce beats the living shit out of KGBeast after he shot Dick. And the other one is Batman beating up Jason more brutally than he ever beat up Joker in RHatO #25.

DC cannot fuck with me. I might has bought this digital comic for 8 dollars but I am not buying that bullshit.

ALSO, there was no need for Zdarsky to do Jason as dirty as he did him when he made him say: “If you are going to come down from mount judgement to MY level for once… he’s not the guy to do it for.”

Zdarsky, why did you write a Red Hood story when you hate Red Hood? Couldn’t you have just told DC that you wanted to write a love letter to Batman? Once again, I am reading a Red Hood story for RED HOOD content not Batman content. Is it really that hard? I bet that if Zdarsky had asked DC to let him write a Batman story they would have said yes, there are like 20 Batman stories, they wouldn’t say no to one more!

Can you tell I am mad? And salty?

This post is so long and so full of anger, I am truly sorry for that but I have to write these feelings down or I would explode. And I am not even done, our suffering, Jason Nation, continues.

But first a little break from the pain, Tyler. Thank you after all the pain this book has given me Tyler is back and just like I predicted his mom is fine and he will stay with her, they both have been given a place and money to rebuild their life (not given by Jason nor Dick but I was close enough). The only happy ending that Tyler could have, he had and I am thankful for that, we even got a little adorable moment between the Red Hood and the Blue Hood.

I am weak for these little glimpses of a good Jason take in the middle of an incredibly awful/OOC story. And just to live in my own fantasy world I will headcanon that Jason promised himself to keep an eye out for Tyler and his mom. He would have wanted to know about their life and that they are still out of trouble.

Jason is a good man, don’t you forget that DC, I don’t care how much you twist it. Jason killing Tyler’s dad wasn’t a horrible act, it was fair game. That man was a horrible person, he drugged his child and made his wife (?) almost overdose. You never gave context as to why that man was working as a drug dealer but you told us those things so Jason should never feel like he did something wrong. As far as we know, Tyler and his mom are better off without him.

Having said that, lets go back to the pain of what is reading a Red Hood story.

“I’m giving up the guns.”

You know what, fine, as long as DC doesn’t pull another “I will stop being Red Hood for you Barbara” I will be fine. He can kill people with other things, he used to have the all-blades, he had normal swords and he had crowbars.

I will sacrifice Jason looking hot as hell when he pulls out his guns just to keep him as the Red Hood, all DC has to do is not give him that stupid… bat… symbol… oh no…. oh my god I can feel it… that thing, that horrible thing is making a comeback! NO!

Jason and Bruce’s talk is basic and it doesn’t do anything for anyone, in the end saying that Jason isn’t changing his ways for Bruce but that he is doing it for himself is more of the same. We know he is doing it for Bruce and we know DC is doing it because they cannot handle good, complex and interesting characters. We know that and sadly we have to live with it.

About Bruce’s illusion, well, Bruce has said that he wanted to kill the clown for a very long time and in the King run it was basically said that if Bruce were to be happy then the idea of Batman would die.

Listen, between me and you, sometimes I think that the Joker isn’t that big of a problem for Gotham as a whole, that clown has beef with the Bat and no one else. If Bruce has killed the Joker Jason would have been happy with Bruce all those years ago but killing the Joker wouldn’t make Gotham a safe place and any of his kids happier.

Bruce needs to care for his children, but he won’t do that, he has Dick for that. Taking care and raising Damian? No, thank you, I will not do that. Giving a shit about my son who lost all his memories and is alone? No thank you, I won’t do that and then I will lie about having watched him over. Tim? Oh, never heard of him, sorry.

The last page of this story is the one of Jason arriving home and finding a new suit that Bruce gave him with the bat symbol on it. That symbol that he had ripped off of Jason’s beat up body back in RHatO #25 (nope, I am not letting that one go).

Oh, and Bruce leaving that suit in Jason’s home gives me the same exact vibes as the time that Bruce was like “Long overdue. This is where you belong. As one of us. One of the family” in Nightwing #74 a second after Dick had regained his memories.

I don’t know why but they make him sound incredibly cold and like these people are just his pawns that he needs to rope back in every time they get away from him. It’s very disturbing.

Anyway, that’s all from me, I obviously LOVED this book, best Jason Todd/Red Hood characterisation ever! 11/10 would recommend to everyone including my enemies!

🙃

[ectonurites]

hey! how knowledgeable are you on stephanie brown? because i got in a bit of an argument with a dc fan on reddit who claims she's all these awful things, but im still relatively new to steph and i want to see what was true and what wasn't. link to screenie right here: https://ibb.co/vh6CYCJ

these may be matters of opinion, but even then, i'd like to know your take. i haven't read her firsthand often enough and i trust your judgement over this random redditor who seems to have some sort of blonde-woman related trauma left untapped.

I'm not necessarily the most knowledgable on her in the world, but I do know a decent amount because she's one of my absolute faves and I love her

But ohhhh boy that screenshot is a lot.

I will say that several of the things this person brings up are based in canon but are taken in the worst faith and framed in the way that makes her look as bad as possible, if that makes sense? It’s ripping things away from any context, because there's a very clear bias against her here.

I'll go through it point by point under the cut

First of all though before digging into this, I want to make it clear she was a 15 year old for the majority of the things this person is talking about. Like just pause for a second and remember she’s a 15 year old victim of abuse. That is something that I think factors into a lot of her behavior! Anyways, I kinda while doing this got into a ranty 'talking at you' format in response to the person who wrote all that, so don't take any of this as me yelling at you who asked the question/you anyone reading this.

"She always acted entitled" - Saying Steph is entitled is absolutely ridiculous to me. Stephanie grew up with a very unstable childhood due to her dad frequently being in prison and her mom dealing with a drug addiction, living in a lower class part of the city. Tim is entitled. I don’t mean that as like a bad thing about him, but he is based on his living situation, she is not. She has wanted life to be better for herself and her mom, and is determined about that, but she is not and does not act entitled.

(Secret Origins 80 Page Giant)

"and stubborn" - I will give you stubborn though, that one is true. She’s stubborn as hell! I don’t really see that as a bad thing though, pretty much every bat is stubborn?

"demanding that Batman and Robin accept her untrained ass" - Steph may have been untrained in fighting but she's shown to have exceptional gymnastics skills from the start, and at one point Bruce even says that with the right training she could be as good if not better than Tim (in Robin #88)! So like... her realizing she enjoys trying to be a hero after she tried it out to deal with her personal business, so she looks to the local experts… and is determined about it… how is that a bad thing? It’s also not like she walked up to them and said ‘im perfect as i am let me in’ what she wanted was a chance to be a hero. But she also wasn't even really looking for approval, either, not having Batman's blessing was never going to stop her. ("So excuse me if I don't jump when you bark, Batman." in Robin #16) Later when Bruce does bring her in to train (and she also gets to train with the BoP) she's excited! She’s stubborn about wanting to be in the hero business, but it’s not like she’s unwilling to work for it.

"advocating leaving criminals to die because they 'deserve it'" - She’s a 15 year old who grew up knowing firsthand how dangerous Gotham criminals can be because of her dad, of course off the bat when they’re in a dangerous situation where any of them could die (because that’s the context here, this is in Robin #35 where they’re trapped in some super dangerous snow) she thinks they shouldn’t go back for another criminal who just tried to kill them and should instead save themselves. But she also literally WITHIN THAT SAME ISSUE then says she realized she learned something after listening to Tim and trying to save the guy! In the same issue! Characters in a story aren’t supposed to be perfect from the start… they learn things along the way???

(Robin #35)

"trying to steal from the shops they just stopped from being burglarized" - She’s 15 and doesn’t have a ton of money. She was gonna take two sodas, and when Tim said not to do it she paid with very little fuss. They stopped people who were robbing the place at gunpoint for prescription drugs. If you can’t understand the difference in severity between those things like… I do not even know where to start. (this situation is in Robin #56 btw)

"forcing physical affection onto Tim despite his visible discomfort and repeated objections (not even stopping when he told her he had a girlfriend)" - This one I will give you because she did cross boundaries with all that! But I do also want to clarify that she didn't start coming onto him until after Tim kissed her first (in Robin #5) while not telling her he had a girlfriend. That doesn’t excuse her later actions but for the first issue that she’s coming onto him from her perspective he expressed interest and she was just returning it! She even specifically says 'Maybe I should pay you back for saving my life the same way you paid me' (in Robin #16) before kissing him. That first time she kissed him unprompted was under essentially the same circumstances he kissed her unprompted, and she literally did not know about Ariana until after the fact. From that point once she knew about Ari she definitely should have backed off and she didn’t, that’s a very fair thing to criticize about her as a character. But Tim lead her on first, and I feel a lot of people like to casually forget that when talking about this situation. The way this is phrased of ‘not even stopping when he told her-‘ implies she was repeatedly doing the bad behavior before he told her, which is not the case. She still did bad things here but don’t misrepresent the situation.

"And lashing out at Tim, her mother, and her classmates in violent fits of anger" - Every comic book character lashes out at other people for the sake of drama like, I dare you to come up with a well-known superhero character who hasn’t done shit like that to a partner/family/friends in a moment of high tension/stress?

"She treated the girls around her like they were stupid bitches" - frankly this ones a little too vague like, I'm not sure off the top of my head exactly what they're talking about? in that era right around her pregnancy and stuff I really don't recall her being mean with other girls? I could be forgetting something I guess but the closest I can think of is a bit after this period of time when she has the confrontation with Greta in Young Justice but that was Greta attacking her first, not the other way around.

"got insanely jealous if Tim so much as expressed concern about another girl" - Steph getting jealous and thinking Tim was cheating isn’t that crazy when STEPHANIE BASICALLY WAS THE OTHER GIRL DURING TIM’S LAST RELATIONSHIP? Tim has cheated a little bit before! Tim cheated on Ari with both Jubilee from Marvel (during a crossover thing where he even mentions Ari specifically so it’s not like this was out of continuity/a setting she wasn't an issue or something) and also with Steph. While most of the kissing between them was Steph coming onto Tim which I wouldn’t count as cheating on his end, he did still kiss her which I would count. Not to mention that the jealousy thing (I imagine they’re talking about the instance with Star, the girl who taught Tim to skateboard, this arc of stuff starts in Robin #80 and continues for a few issues) is happening during the time she’s dating him while she still doesn’t even know his real name. He literally has a whole other life she doesn’t know about, and is someone who has initiated romantic moments with other girls while in a relationship multiple times before! With that in mind I don’t think a 16 (she's def 16 by this point) year old girl being kinda paranoid about how he interacts with girls he might know in his civilian life is that unreasonable? The later big instance with jealousy is the Darla situation- where Steph sees Darla kiss him and gets mad about it (and doesn’t talk to him about it) and thats what prompts her to become Robin. The important thing to remember about Steph in this time frame is that DC decided she had to die and they wanted to make her Robin first to drum up more attention for that death. They were doing ooc things with her to set those pieces in motion, and that needs to be taken into account. I think her getting upset about seeing something like that isn’t even ooc, but her using it as motivation to become Robin and not even saying anything to him about it is. In the earlier instance where she’s upset/jealous about Star, she does communicate to him what’s going on at least a little bit on the rooftop after they’d saved her. She makes it clear the thing she was upset about is that she feels like she can’t trust him because she doesn’t really know him while he knows everything about her, and that’s why she thinks he’s cheating. Her reaction to the Darla thing is not in line with how earlier in canon Steph would have handled the same situation, because they wanted her to die and needed a way to explain her becoming Robin.

"and expressed that jealousy by accusing him of cheating and throwing things at him" - I just addressed the cheating stuff but the throwing things was fucking slapstick oh my god this is a comic book for kids/teens like. ah yes this is horrible abuse in this little funny montage of how Steph wants him to leave her alone because she’s mad at him and he refuses to give her space

(Robin #82)

I don’t think anyone at DC or even in fandom would/should try to argue she’s perfect, because she’s not! And I don’t want her to be because perfect characters are boring. Steph is flawed, Steph has been compared in canon to Robin-era Jason by Cass & Bruce

(Detective Comics #790)

And I think these highlight some of her very real flaws that are an interesting part of her character. These plus her stubbornness and determination are part of what makes her her.

And for fuck's sake the world was mean to her, and to act like it wasn’t is just blatantly ignoring a lot. A criminal father who made her life really difficult (‘when my dad was mad at me he’d lock me in the closet!’), that time she got kidnapped for two weeks and her mom had left her (a 15 year old) alone at home so long she didn't even find out it happened (in text Steph says Crystal was visiting friends, a lot of people interpret that as her mom possibly being in rehab for her addictions again), that whole thing about how one of her dad’s friends tried to sexually assault her as a child, also just how due to her dad's work sometimes criminals would be living in their house (Literally the fucking Riddler at one point!), the fact that we as an audience watched her get tortured for several days because a plan she tried to enact to prove herself backfired since Batman didn’t trust her with important information (something Selina even calls him out on in her internal narration), like… sorry but in what way is all that not the world being mean to her?

She was Robin, she dated Robin, she likes Eggplant (because purple would've looked stupid), and makes jokes. She’s also impulsive, headstrong and determined, and wants to prove to herself and others that she can be more than just the daughter of a shitty criminal, that she can actually be a force to do good in the world.

She’s a complex character, and nobody is required to like her, but to act like she doesn’t have a single redeeming trait is ridiculous. You could write a paragraph like that with the worst moments of basically any character and make them look like shit if that's what you were setting out to do.

[nightwingmyboi]

Hello! I was just wondering if you had knew the proper order to read Dick as Bats but with Damian as his robin? Thanks!

Sure! I couldn’t tell if you were asking for all the comics that have Dick as Batman or comics specifically where Dick and Damian are both present, so I just did a list for both. The ones in bold have both Dick and Damian present. This list is in my best attempt at an in-universe chronological order...it was hard but I tried (cries). Here we go: 

BATMAN DICK GRAYSON COMIC LIST

Nightwing (1996) #138: Dick and Damian first meet. This is part two of seven in “The Resurrection of Ra’s al Ghul” arc. You can read the whole thing for context, but this one is the only one with significant interaction between Dick and Damian. 

Nightwing (1996) #152-153: Dick tries to reconcile with the fact that Bruce is gone, and that he will have to continue his legacy. These comics have Dick going head to head with Ra’s al Ghul, and also show him moving back to Gotham. 

Battle for the Cowl #1-3: Gotham City is in trouble, and Dick is forced to take on the mantle of Batman. 

Batman (1940) #687-688: A lot of this is about Dick learning to be Batman, but you also see a lot of him talking about how he is planning to approach Damian. You also see some of the beginning of Dick training Damian as well. Technically an epilogue to Battle for the Cowl.

Batman (1940) #689-692: Dick continues to adjust to his role as Batman. Two-Face manages to sneak into the Batcave, and tests Dick’s conviction. 

Batman and Robin (2009) #1-3: Dick and Damian’s first time working together as Batman and Robin. 

Batman (1940) #693-696: While Batman takes to the streets, Damian is mostly delegated to training, in order to improve his detective work. Unfortunately, Damian doesn’t take the work seriously, leaving Dick vulnerable to Black Mask’s and Penguin’s plots…

Batman (1940) #697-699: Batman finishes dealing with Black Mask, and goes on to face the Riddler. 

Batman: Streets of Gotham #1-16: A collection of stories showing how Robin and Batman are adjusting to their new roles; the duo doesn’t have a lot of trust yet. Interestingly, these comics show more of how Hush was handled. They are also where Damian’s friend Colin is introduced for the first time. 

Batman and Robin (2009) #4-6: Batman and Robin versus a (somewhat out of character) Red Hood. 

Batman and Robin (2009) #7-9: Dick tries to resurrect Batman. Warning: this arc is extremely out of character for Dick and I hate everything about it. But this isn’t a comic rec list so I’ll include it, ugh. Here’s where you’d read this monstrosity. If you want to skip it, here’s all you’d need to know: 1) Damian went to his mother to heal his spine after Red Hood shot him, and 2) Dick and Damian now have reason to believe Bruce is alive. Bam, now you don’t even have to read it. 

Batman and Robin (2009) #10-12: Damian and Dick uncover clues that reveal that Bruce is alive. Meanwhile, Talia attempts to kill Dick...using her own son to do it. 

Batman (1940) #700: A special event that has sections where Bruce Wayne, Dick Grayson, and a future Damian Wayne are Batman. A weird comic overall, but the parts with Damian and Dick are really pretty good. 

Batman (1940) #703: Dick and Damian have developed a solid partnership, though Damian is continuing to learn more about being Robin and about his father. The comic acts as a prelude to Bruce Wayne: The Road Home. 

Bruce Wayne: The Road Home: Bruce evaluates how things have been going in his absence, and gives his thoughts on the new dynamic duo. 

Batman and Robin (2009) #13-16: Dick and Damian struggle to deal with Professor Pyg, Joker, and Dr. Hurt. Bruce returns! 

Batman (1940) #704-712: Batman leaves Gotham to Dick while he puts Batman Incorporated into place. Damian, Tim, Azrael, and Selina all make appearances in this stretch of comics. 

Batman and Robin (2009) #17-22: Dick and Damian work together as Batman and Robin to stop Una Nemo, and then White Knight in the following arc. 

Batman and Robin (2009) #23-25: Dick and Damian team up with Jason to save his former sidekick, Scarlet. (Jason’s still acting a bit more extreme than you’d typically expect.) 

Batman: Black Mirror: This is a collection of Detective Comics #871-881. I’d say these are my favorite Dick!Batman stories ever. All the cases are very good (really chilling), and the characterizations are top notch stuff. Lots of Gordon, Barbara, and some Tim also. 

Batman (1940) #713: Damian tells the story of Batman and Robin. Very heartwarming. 

Batman: Gates of Gotham #1-5: A good story, it’s interesting to see how Dick interacts with his siblings (ie Cass, Tim, and Damian) as Batman. 

There’s definitely a bit of hopping back and forth required if you’re going to read it this way lmao. Also, here are some more comics with Dick as Batman that I was too lazy to try to put into the timeline here: 

Superman/Batman #76: Superman’s reaction to Dick taking up the Batman mantle following Bruce’s death. Happens towards the beginning of Dick’s time as Batman. 

Blackest Night: Batman #1-3: Dick, Tim, and Damian deal with an army of Black Lanterns, composed of once-dead friends and enemies. Bruce’s body is stolen, and Dick and Tim have to face their parents’ reanimated corpses. 

Red Robin (2009): Mostly focused on Tim Drake. Dick and Damian appear in minor cameos throughout as well though. It’s interesting to look at Dick and Damian as they are in issue #1, with Damian being really rude and not listening to Dick at all, and then jumping to issue #12 and seeing just how much Damian now follows Dick’s lead and has changed while Tim was away. Idk, it’s just kind of cool. Issues #13-14 also have Tim working with the new dynamic duo as well. 

Batgirl (2009): This one is mostly focused on Stephanie Brown taking up the Batgirl mantle in the wake of Bruce’s death. Dick and Damian first meet Stephanie in issue #5...and they get off to a very rough start with her lmao. The team features heavily in #6-7 also. 

Titans (2008): This series starts off with Dick as Nightwing, but then he leaves the team to become Batman at the end of #10. He appears as Batman in: #15 with Garth, #21 with Starfire (really thought this one was interesting), #23 with Wally and Donna, and #28-30 with Slade. 

Justice League of America (2006) #41-60: Dick’s time on the Justice League with Donna. Likely takes place towards the middle and end of Dick’s time as Batman. 

Hope this is helpful to you! 

[irisbleufic]

Hey I wanted to say- I love your Gotham Playing for Keeps series, Darkroom is iconic. I was wondering something about the short fic that comes before it in the series, The Talk- did you ever wonder what might happen if you did an AU take on that one, where Bruce doesn’t just drop off Jeremiah that night after they have dinner to talk about the grant, but goes in the bunker with him and- it’d be interesting if... you know what... happened to both of them? You write damn fine dark Bruce anyway, SO

What’s weird is that I never have considered pursuing that avenue? Not before now, at least! It’s probably because I see Bruce as a lot more terrifying if he makes the choice to flip his moral compass without benefit of mind-alteration. Atually, Jeremiah had the potential to be even scarier if he’d never been hit with the gas, too; I mean, we know he was at least halfway there anyway at a baseline. Granted, even if they’re scarier without the gas, not having that happen leaves the option for also choosing to exercise self control. Jerome was probably more apprehensive than he let on at any point in his brief canonical interactions with his brother. You can’t get the upper hand on someone like Jeremiah unless you weaken him with an attachment (i.e. Bruce). It cost Jerome everything, but he knew he was both setting Jeremiah up to wreak havoc and also setting him up with a weakness that leads to guaranteed failure. It’s terrifyingly intelligent on Jerome’s part. It’s no wonder I end up doing everything I can to keep Jerome alive in my sprawling projects (well, that and I love how cranky it makes everybody if he’s still around).

This becomes a fascinating exercise, though, if I think about what that precise set of circumstances would look like. It wouldn’t be hard at all to pull “The Talk” out of context and do a stand-alone AU case study on it. Playing for Keeps would have turned out so differently if I’d done that to begin with; the city would never have recovered. Things would never have gone back to a weird, tense state of normal in Gotham post-reunification that you see in PfK as it stands. I’m pretty sure Bruce and Jeremiah both would’ve ended up dead, because if there’s no capacity to put the brakes on each other, or at least capacity for one to put brakes on the other, it leads to ruin. Granted, I rarely call it the end of the world if both my lovers get to die. It’s one surviving when the other doesn’t that puts me in a bad way; that’s the worst kind of ending there is.

(The outcome for the two of them could be a turnabout that’s even less drastic than what you see in “Darkroom,” in one sense, but also a lot more sinister in another. I’m thinking about how I’d end up with a situation that takes cues from another piece of lit I love. It’s a scene I keep revisiting over time; I have this heartbroken compulsion to see various other pairings redeem it. They can all walk away from it, whereas its originators cannot. The question for Bruce and Jeremiah becomes: Can they walk away from a version of it, too?)

[toflyandfall]

I just saw a photo of "What persona. Dick Grayson isn't a mask. Not like Bruce Wayne is" from Detective Comics #725 and I find it interesting that Dick and the rest of the bats, with the exception of Bruce, don't wear "masks" per se. They are who they are with or without the domino mask/helmet. The only time I can really think of Dick faking things is when he pretended to be an incompetent BPD cop. How was he able to avoid creating and living, half the time, through a "persona" like "Brucie"?

Oooh, this is a lovely, meaty question.  There’s a lot more analysis of Bruce than I planned because let’s be real, it’s kinda weirder for a guy to run around with half a dozen personas than for someone else to run around as himself.  I hope you still find it interesting, but if you want to skip straight to the more Dick-centric stuff, head under the readmore.

A simple but significant factor is that Dick thrives on the company of people in a way that Bruce does not.  I suspect if you talk honestly to many introverts, you will find they too have an extroverted ‘mask’ they put on to the larger world, though probably not quite so extreme.

Another factor is that the civilian social circles Dick and Bruce travel in are vastly different.  Though they each have a reason for being in those circles, that difference itself enables Dick to escape much of the scrutiny that Bruce’s public identity undergoes, because he doesn’t frequently associate with the much more media-hounded elite.

An interesting thing here is that the large difference in social circles between their civilian lives is actually caused by their own personal similarities: they are 100% committed work-a-holics.  It’s just that they have differing civilian approaches to their goals.

I want to start with Bruce because as you point out, his use of persona is distinct among the bats and his reasons for using them in part explain why Dick and the other bats do not.

Bruce is a child of privilege, he has always lived a lifestyle of privilege, regardless of the tragedies that have occurred during it, and his default view of the world, through no fault of his own, is natively that of the extreme upper class.  This drastically influences his perspective and approach to change, and changing the world is his perpetual goal, the reason he put on the suit in the first place.

Bruce works a top-down society approach toward systemic change, and he works it all the time.  This is actually my favorite but woefully under-emphasized part of him: he is not just someone who punches people on the street ‘for justice’, he uses his company, his money, and his social position toward substantial systemic change. This post does a wonderful job covering the ways he does this through his corporations and personal wealth, as does this one.  I cannot recommend either enough because I constantly want to push even the most casual Batman fans to understand: Bruce Wayne is not just a violent punchy puncher man.  He is a traumatized person genuinely trying to use all his resources including himself to make the world safer.

Detective Comics #725

Bruce has many personas he maintains, and he uses all of them according to what suits his need--Batman for places the law can’t go, Bruce Wayne the CEO pushing for systemic changes, Matches Malone for street information, and Brucie the society high roller for society information and social influencing.  He is rarely ever not in a persona and simply ‘Bruce’.

His top-down perspective of enacting change are what dictated the usage and necessity of these personas. He has the means and capacity to basically disappear from society if he so chose--he in fact does so to train during his younger years so successfully they don’t even know how long he was actually gone. 

The Batman Files

So he doesn’t need the personas.  Not Bruce Wayne, CEO, or Brucie, or any of them really, to protect his identity.  That tells us that Brucie is a deliberate choice he made at some point.  He could have been a recluse billionaire Batman indefinitely.  Even though he fully has the status and means to not maintain a job or a persona or, let’s be frank, a life outside the mask at all, it’s his own work-a-holicness that led to the creation of his public personas.  He’s an obsessive strategist, so if Brucie is a choice, that leads us to why?

Bruce does many philanthropic things with his money, but he isn’t the only rich person around, especially not in a city as old and corrupt as Gotham.   But he’s one of the very few ones doing good with it.

The comic you mentioned has a very beautiful moment where Bruce touches on that, and in full context you can feel how consumed he is by this goal of creating the Gotham his parents would have wanted.  Batman mentions he never sees himself in that place, and the morbid interpretation is that the city kills him before he reaches it, but the hopeful interpretation is that in that shining city, Bruce Wayne and Batman and Brucie and all his masks will no longer be needed.

Detective Comics #725

Back in the old days they’d call it noblesse oblige: the inferred responsibility of privileged people to act with generosity and nobility toward those less privileged. Thomas and Martha Wayne ingrained this feeling of responsibility into Bruce by example, and as all things related to them, he obsesses over it.  It urges him to fulfill expectations within segments of society he finds onorous for the betterment of society as a whole in order to carry out their unfinished works.

Enter Brucie.

Brucie serves a two-fold purpose.  Since Bruce has chosen to maintain personas among society, it becomes a false face to justify any oddities Batman might bring into the life of Bruce Wayne by setting himself up as a eccentric, popular social scion.  But that persona itself also allows him to manipulate the upper crust of society.

I have some insider perspective on the kind of society events Brucie attends.  They’re all about the who’s who of making connections, name-dropping and networking, and unspoken class-based elitism.  Charity events among the upper class have these things at the forefront and the cause is the background.  You don’t get your hands dirty, you don’t go out and make change yourself, you pay money to be socially seen and sometimes it happens to go towards a philanthropic cause.  If you want to raise money from the rich and keep people with deep pockets coming in the door, you have to have social currency yourself. This is where, and why, Brucie comes in.  I believe Brucie ws crafted to maintain Batman’s cover but still attempt to carry on his parents’ legacy to grease the wheels of the rich in the directions he chooses: one of generosity towards those less privileged. 

Superman/Batman #51

The inevitable flaw of Bruce’s approach to his personas and their philanthropy is that in a city rife with corruption, money distributed from the top has many opportunities to disappear well before it reaches the bottom.  As in many of ways they are complements to each other, Dick’s approach balances that out, because his approach to helping his fellow man starts out at the street level...literally.

Nightwing #153 (Nightwing: The Great Leap)

Dick, we know, does not come from privilege.  His mother was from a middle class family before she joined the circus, and despite being world famous athletes, most circus workers are lower to middle class.  The people he grew up with, was comfortable with, were all working folk who expected everyone to pull their weight right alongside each other.  He enacts this everyone-together approach in almost all aspects and phases of his life. 

Batman #615

Even once he had settled into being Robin and adapted to living at the manor, he didn’t feel belonging to a culture of privilege, materialism, or high society. He preferred shotgun in the limo to chat with the driver to riding fancy in the back.  Once he was able to start making his own decisions about where and how he lived, despite having both Bruce’s money and then later inheriting a substantial amount of his own, he chose mostly lower-class communal places.

Batman Black and White #6

Dick also doesn’t see the value of throwing money at a problem when there is an option to fix it with his own hands.  We see this frequently, from building his own car instead of buying a finished one or outsourcing the work, to deciding the best way to clean out the BPD was to start at the bottom and work his way up (literally), to quitting college because his classes never got prioritized over crimesolving.  Most of his day jobs ended for similar reasons. 

Nightwing #153 (Nightwing: The Great Leap)

Despite the showmanship training, he gravitates away from spotlight on the rich and wealthy, who are notoriously the kind of people who do not get their hands dirty or go out and take care of things themselves, and prefers to find or build communities around the kind of people who do.

Finally, Dick is an extrovert.  He doesn’t need to act extroverted as Brucie does because he is extroverted.  He likes people and likes being around people.  Whether by conscious choice or not, he tends to put himself in situations where he is surrounded by people in nearly all aspects of his life.  He chooses apartment buildings whose occupants frequently pass each other on the stairs; jobs that involve interacting with many co-workers, patrons, or students; and collects superhero teammates like Boy Scout badges.  And all of these behaviors come very naturally to him.  

He doesn’t need a mask or a role or a persona for those kind of interactions; his mask is pre-supplied as “neighbor” or “co-worker” or “teacher” by the situations he puts himself in.  It helps make him an exemplary leader, because just by acting authentically to himself, he automatically builds up little communities around him any time he arrives somewhere.

Bruce, on the other hand, is an introvert.  For him, interacting with people isn’t easy, automatic, or comfortable unless it has a purpose, but as a strategist, he knows the necessity of human interaction as a catalyst to achieving dynamic change. So he adapts personas to suit people’s expectations.  Extroverts have more social currency; the life of the party can generate more resources than a brooding wallflower.  

So, it boils down to just a few elements: Dick believes in living and interacting at the street level to accomplish the things that he wants to, and he is extroverted enough that the level of social interaction that entails is not a burden to him.  He surrounds himself with the types of people he is more familiar or perhaps more comfortable with, which happens to keep him further out from the media’s eye than associating with the upper crust does. The lower profile is more incidental than intentional, but it lessens his need to have a cover story for every single bruise and lets him get away with even less of a ‘persona’.

Bruce, on the other hand, is introverted and follows a more classist view that systemic change needs to be effected from the top down.   His personas are more of a self-assumed duty than a necessity, as a way of trying to carry out his parents’ legacy.  Any of his children could have chosen to follow his path in business or the high society limelight, but the sense of obligation toward it is something personal to him that most of them don’t share.

[leonicscorpio]

The Visit: A Jason Todd x Reader Fic

For @nat-wing . One of my best friends, one of my guiding lights, and the person who dragged me into Batman hell. Enjoy.

"Human kindness, gentlemen, is made for the purses of millionaires. With financial power like mine, you can afford yourself a new world order..."

*THUD*

The sound of a backpack crashing next to you jolted you out of the line of the play you were reading. Raising your head to see the source of the noise, you met eyes with your new friend, Jason. Jason Todd.

"What's wrong, y/n, you look like you just saw a ghost" Jason let out, immediately following with a light chuckle and a half-smile. Taking seat next to you at the park bench, Jason started to open up the backpack, revealing a copy of the same book you had. The Visit by Friedrich Durrennmat.

"So, how do you like it thus far?" Jason inquired. You took a look up towards his face and despite his chisled facial features, the thing that always caught your attention were his eyes. The striking sapphire blue eyes allured as much as it frightened. Beneath the mask of the handsome face of the playboy heir of the Wayne Conglomerate and adoptive son of Bruce Wayne hid a maelstrom. A violent sea of torrential anger and oppressive hatred. His eyes have always frightened you, but you never judged Todd for anything because he's always treated you with the respect you've afforded him.

"It's interesting Jason" you let out. You couldn't help but be intimidated by his presence. Here you are, a lonely bachelor living in a converted tenament in Gotham City, a barista, reading a Swiss play with one of Gotham's biggest socialites. Jason came into your cafè seemingly every day, mentioned how the espresso is his favorite in all of Gotham. Some days he came in for a quick coffee run, dressed to the bones like he's about to attend a charity event, others he came in and sat down, getting lost in a book, wearing sweatpants and a signature red or black hoodie.

"Only interesting?" Jason had inquired. Indeed, The Visit had been a fascinating, but difficult read. Following the story of an eclectic billionairess in her twilight years named Claire Zachannasan, coming back to her home town hell bent on it's destruction and rebirth. You had just entered the play's third and final act when Jason arrived.

"In some ways, Claire reminds me of you Jason." You chuckle. You pay extra attention to see how his face reacts to such a bold statement. His face contorts into half-hearted shock, but his eyes are smiling. Prideful, it seems he got the results he wanted. You almost lost yourself in his handsome face with boyish hair when you felt the coastal winds of the park beach alongside the Gotham Oceanfront Jason had requested to meet you at.

"And what makes you say that?" Jason had pushed, bringing his arm away from the book and stretching it across to your side of the bench, his arm was extended behind your back and easily could have wraped one arm around you. And Jason's arms were quite large. Hell, the man himself almost came to challenge Bruce in terms of physique. All of his adoptive brothers were always the more slim, athletic, graceful builded ones. Jason was built like a statue, imposing muscles matched only with an imposing barrel of a chest. You thought to yourself what it would be like to feel those ripling muscles under his red hoodie and modestly branded jeans.

"Well, for starters, Claire is a billionaire, as are you." you said, noting Jason's left eyebrow cock, "well, heir to a billionaire in your case." You corrected. "There is a very pretinant theme of justice throughout the play. It's clear to tell that by using the power and wealth that she has aquired, Claire hopes to enact her own brand of justice." You had listed off. Looking to see Jason's response, you saw a smile begin to purse on his lips. This time of acceptance. It seems you gave Jason the satisfactory answer.

"Very good." Jason had smiled. "But, forgive me for asking, y/n, why do you think I care so much about justice?" Manipulation. Although you can tell Jason's interest and inquirery is genuine, you can tell he has ulterior motives in asking you this question. However you cannot ascertain why. You took a look in his eyes but only met the hurricane making landfall on a beach, threatening to consume all in it's might surge. His face is telling you to explain and ponder further, but his eyes indicate that of a predator about to snap at your jugular.

"I uh.. well." You stammered. Only soon to realize Jason had wrapped his arm securely around you, this gesture would have been romantic given any other context, but knowing what you know about Jason Todd and reading his mannerisms, you felt like a deer in headlights. You were frightened, but also enchanted. Jason's arm was heavy and strong, but not forceful, it was more securing than anything. It made you feel like you were protected from even Gotham's worst.

"Don't worry, y/n, I'm joking, I'm sorry if I intimidated you. But I'm glad you're liking the play, it became a favorite of mine recently." Jason stated.

"So you do relate to Claire." You poked, Jason had scoffed and retorted.

"I never said I did." Jason stated quite matter of factly. Having said that, Jason pulled you closer to him, to the point that your thighs were touching and you were pressed up against his side. You gave out a light gasp. Shocked at Jason's suddenness. "I'm hope I'm not making you uncomfortable, y/n." Jason apologized, the sincerity was genuine. Jason may have been able to play people like the fiddle, as you have seen from interactions at the cafè. However you sensed no malitious intent from the billionare. "I want you to know I like you a lot, y/n. You make the best Cafè Americcanos, and you actually listen to people when I reccomend 1950's swiss literature to them."

Hearing the last line made you laugh a little. You soon felt yourself subconsciously pressing laying your head along Jason Todd's powerful chest. It was just as you had imagined it. Powerful and secure. As you listened to his heart beat, you couldn't help but notice the extreme radiant warmth coming from Jason. With one arm wrapped around you, you felt like you had your own supersoldier their to protect you. "Thank you Jason, I like you a lot as well." You laugh as you made yourself comfortable enwraped in the massive man. To think you, a lonely kid from the suburbs found your way into the arms of one of the heirs of Wayne Enterprises. You, you felt like a nobody compared to Jason Peter Todd. However, one thing continued to bother you, and you wanted an answer.

"Jason, can I ask you something?" You had let into the atmosphere.

"Sure y/n, ask away." Jason had invited.

"Do you hate being a Wayne? Do you hate Bruce?" You raised your head to see the face not a couple inches in front of you and saw a crack in the visage. You made the mistake of focusing on his eyes again and realized just what you had done and what situation you landed yourself in. Beneath the mask you saw exactly what you had hypothesized. Inside the eyes of Jason Todd you saw rage. Hot, blinding, searing rage. You weren't in the arms of an angel any longer, you were in the claws of an apex predator.

"What." Jason had said blankly. It seemed his face alluded to more shock than anger. You craacked the façade and found what lies beneath, and you were afraid. However, curiosity forced you to try to dive deeper.

"To be candid with you, y/n, I do have a lot of anger towards my family, but at the end of the day, they are my family." Jason stated politically. You can tell this was a diversion to try to end the conversation. Realizing just the situation you were in it was for the best that Jason was giving you a get-out-of-Arkham-free-card. "But I will say, you are devilishly inquisitive y/n. How did you deduce that?"

"There's a lot of anger in your eyes Jason, you're bottling up a lot of anger and I don't think it can be healthy for you." You stated. You felt Jason give a hearty laugh as your head bounced from his chest. You didn't even take the opportunity to breath him in while you were down on his chest. The aromas of tobacco, dried sweat, and overtly expensive colonge studded with tonka and sandalwood tickled your nose.

"I guess you're right..." You can tell Jason had more he wanted to admit, but was interupted by the vibration of his phone. Taking a look to see who was calling. Jason let out a groan. You pushed yourself up off of his chest and gave Jason the space to answer the call in privacy.

'what is it Dick I'm busy... Really, now..? Ugh, fine. I'll be there in 10. Tell Bruce he owes me for this.' with that Jason ended the call and heaved himself off the park bench. "I'm so sorry Y/n but a family emergency came up." Jason said, as he made his way back towards the enterance of the park, you exchanged your farewell with the handsome man you just had an exchange with. Before you left, Jason had yelled out "you want an answer to your question? Keep reading the play." Jason had finished. Noting what he had said you opened The Visit back to the exact spot you had left off. As you finished the line by the elder Claire Zachannasan you felt ice run down your veins. Suddenly you felt an intense fear at the thought of Jason by this last sentence.

"The world turned me into a whore, so I shall turn the world into a brothel."

[birdy-bat-writes]

Final Conclusions

A/N: So Fish and I came up with this Dad!Constantine concept while talking about this one OC I created and a few OC’s she created. The one I created is named Maya. The premise of her story is that she’s a love interest for Damian and she treats John like a mentor/father figure since he’s teaching her to control her magic. This plot is basically what has sprouted any of the Dad/Uncle/Mentor Constantine content I’ve created. Fish has contributed a lot and I love her so much. The basis for this interaction is that John finds a lot of amusement in the fact that Damian likes Maya and he just hates John so much. Even though it’s based on an OC, I’m going to write it x reader style with the reader having the same powers as my OC. So now that there’s context let’s begin!

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 It’s the opening night of the Gotham Academy’s festival of the arts. The night where young artists and musicians show off their talent in the galleries and performances, and two people who never show up to these things- like ever- both happened to be here at the same time for the same reason. You. And it irked them to no end.

Both John and Damian arrived at 6:30 pm on the dot. Damian looked so irritated to see John there. Why is he even there? He doesn’t even like going to these things. But then again, neither did Damian. He decided to put his irritation aside and began to walk into the building with John. He had to admit, John stepped up for the occasion.

John cleaned up, did his hair, shaved and actually wore a jacket that was not his usual beige trench coat, all to attend some crummy high school art show. But he did it anyway because it was your work that was being displayed. The disdain he felt towards these events was replaced with a sense of pride he had in you. He sported a grey blazer and black shirt with matching slacks, that contrasted Damian’s black suit.

“Nice to see you here, Damian.”

“Likewise.” The conversation stayed stagnant for a while as they looked around at the different works displayed. Neither of them walked around much. The silence was broken when you walked up to them, looking elegant as ever in your green dress.

“Hey, guys! I’m so happy you both could come.”

“Wouldn’t miss it for the world.” Damian said sweetly. And that was a rare sight for John to see. Damian being sweet?!

“Do you want to see my display?” They both excitedly nodded “yes” and followed you to a wall at the end of the hall. You cautiously cut through the crowd and pointed. “Tada!”

“That looks amazing, Y/N. You’re more talented than you know.”

“Not bad, kiddo. It’s the best thing I’ve seen from you since that chicken you managed to turn green.”, John said ruffling your hair. Thank goodness you left it down. If it was done up, it would have taken ages to fix, but since you knew john was coming, you took the precaution. He had a habit of doing that when he was proud of you, and it made your day every time.

“Thank you. I’m just going to check out the ceramic displays, you guys want to come?”

“No thanks, dear.”

“I’ll just wait here.”

“Okay, see you in a bit. I’m so happy you both are here.” You chimed. You had that little gleam in your eye that you always did when you were happy, and Damian didn’t fail to notice. He lingered on it. Just as he did with your smile, and the soft glow on your cheeks. He was regrettably brought out of his love-trance by the sound of John’s voice.

“Does that look like ketchup on paper to you too? Or is it just me?” Damian wanted to roll his eyes and say something snarky, but instead, looked up at the painting john was talking about. It really did just look like a glob of red paint.

“I can’t even tell what that’s supposed to be. If it’s abstract, they did a good job.”

“To be honest, I don’t really get this ‘art’ thing. Half of these canvases look like something a two-year-old could muster.” John said, and Damian sighed in return.

“You have to look beyond the surface. Art is about the emotion behind the paint and pencil.”

“Alright, Picasso, what’s that one about then?” Damian stayed silent. “I thought you were an artist; you don’t get art?”

“I sketch sometimes but that doesn’t make me an artist.”

“Ah, damaged closet-artist.” Damian groaned lowly.

“There isn’t anything in that piece to understand. It’s just paint splatters. Half of these can only be admired for their technical skill; there’s no emotion behind them. If there is one, it’s not one that I understand.

“Whose work do you like then?” Damian gave that one some thought,

“I like the classics, I suppose. The only current artist whose work I’ve liked is Y/N.”

“Interesting, so, what emotion do you get from her work?” John had his trademark devilish grin plastered upon his face. He knew Damian was head over heels for you, and it sure was fun to get a rise out of him with that. Damian was trying not to let his mind wander off to the charcoal sketches he has framed in his room. You drew them for him and left them in his room one day. They were all sketches of Titus, Batcow, Alfred the cat and his personal favorite, a charcoal rendition of a polaroid you took. It was the two of you at the beach with the family, and Damian was smiling. It was rare and reserved just for you, so he couldn’t help but think the emotion he got from it was love. That photo stayed between the two of you, and the drawing wasn’t shown to anyone but him. John doesn’t get the luxury of knowing that. Why did he even ask? Why is he even here?

“Why did you come here?” Damian asked.

“Y/N invited me.”

“You don’t like going to these events. Why’d you say yes?”

“Same reason as you mate, I care about her more than I hate the rest of society.”

Damian gave a light nod that anyone would have missed if they weren’t’ looking for it. “What about you? It’s not like you enjoy school activities and such.” Damian looked a little flustered.

“I wanted to support my friend and classmate. It’s important to her.”

“Right, you wanted to support your girlfriend.”

“She’s not my girlfriend!”

“Aye, but you want her to be.” John said with a smirk.

“Excuse me?”

“Don’t give me that. Its plain as day that you like her.” Damian scoffed and looked down for a while.”

“How did you come to that conclusion?” He tried to play it off like sarcasm, but that didn’t really go as planned.

“You hate people and yet you love being around her. You’re an artist and can’t understand anyone’s art but hers. You want to protect her from anyone who you think isn’t good enough for her, myself included. The signs are pretty obvious.” Damian looked a little flushed but remained speechless. “And besides, she’s pretty easy to fall in love with, I hear. My home phone gets calls from boys on the daily.”

“What?! From who?!?”

“Hehe, and that’s how I came to that conclusion.”

“Constan-!”

“There you guys are! I’ve been looking for you. Art awards are going to be announced soon. Want to go find a seat?” You had just found the boys and were ready to take them into the auditorium for the Art Awards.

“Sure thing.”, John said cheerily.

John smiled and Damian just returned a cold glare.

***

They were seated next to each other and chose not to complain about it. Instead, opting to tense over the fact that they were nearing the end of the awards ceremony and your name hadn’t yet been called. This meant one of two things: Either you were about to win one of the top cash prizes or you weren’t going to win anything. And the thought of the latter had both John and Damian gripping the arm rests of their seats tight enough to dent them. The anticipation was building in all of you, but it flooded away from you when you turned and looked at the boys. They looked more stressed than you did, and it made you want to laugh. Of course, you stifled it. This is what you liked to call “Chaotic caring energy”. And truth be told, these two were awfully similar for a pair of people who can’t stand each other.

It was down to second place. You had lost hope and accepted you wouldn’t win anything. The boys hadn’t, though. They were literally at the edge of their seats, and you swear you saw Damian grab John’s shoulder at one point. Just then, you heard your name called. First place, Y/N L/N, 8th grade.

“Yes! I’m so proud of you!”

“Well done, N/N! I knew you’d be up there!” They could be heard over the Loud cheering from the rest of the audience. You walked up and received your award and you waved at them from the stage. John looked at you with a genuine smile and adoration in his eyes. He knew you were talented, and he was so proud of you for working so hard for this. You had finally gotten the recognition you deserved and the look in his eyes reflected how happy he was about it. Damian noticed too. John really cared about you. Damian saw it now. Maybe he wasn’t such a bad mentor for you after all.

While leaving the hall, the three of you saw Bruce, Dick, Jason, Tim and Alfred waiting by the doors. They congratulated you and showered you with hugs. They had seen the ceremony as well, but they watched it from the auditorium balcony. While you were off showing your plaque to everyone, Damian took an opportunity to say something he felt he needed to say.

“Hey, John?”

“Hm?’

“When you said I want to protect Y/N from people who aren’t good enough… I don’t consider you to be someone I should protect her from. You’re a good mentor.”

“Thank you, I appreciate that.” They shared a look of agreement. Perhaps they had finally settled a truce. “And of course, I’m a good mentor for her. I’m the master of my craft.” John added smugly.

“I saw you light your tie on fire once.”

“Who said that was an accident?” They shared a chuckle. Meanwhile, Bruce and Alfred were making celebratory dinner plans, and you were standing flabbergasted with the boys because Damian and John were smiling at each other??? They walked up to you and overhearing Bruce’s discussion about dinner, Damian took the liberty of inviting John to join you.

You choked on your saliva, Tim looked beyond concerned and when John said he’d be delighted, everyone freaked. Bruce looked terrified, Dick squinted, and Jason was about to take a picture while Alfred just stared.

“Are they smiling at each other?”

“No, that’s not possible.”

“Um, they’re walking side by side and talking without grimacing.”

Y/N looks like she’s about to pass out. Someone catch her.”

[oh-mother-of-darkness]

asks (26)

@spickerzocker​ said:

hey there! just a heads up that i tried to click on the "why i don't ship" explanation link in your faq and it says that there is no post with that url/it's generally broken. also your "a conversation about recovery" thing is beautiful and hurts in the best way and i love it. have a nice day!

Yes, I intentionally took that link down awhile ago, and last night I went and updated some of the tabs on my blog. Here are my basic thoughts:

I wrote that link years and years ago, while I was first navigating the internet and while I was still figuring out important things about my own identity and opinions. I ran my blog differently back then, but by the end of the first few months, I knew I was uncomfortable with shipping. 

As people began to interact with me and my work, I told them over and over again no, I don’t want to talk about that, and I don’t want to write about it, and it makes me uncomfortable. I don’t think that was a common position to take at the time, so it wasn’t what people expected from me. 

During those years, I felt like I had to justify myself and give a valid explanation. I wrote that post explaining why I had that boundary, and I put it in a place where anyone could find it.

I said no when people asked, let them make jokes about it, and made jokes about it myself in response. As time went on I got more and more exasperated when I had to repeat myself. I wrote definite rules into my ask box, request tab, and FAQ. People still asked. I wrote it into my description. People still asked. 

The truth is yeah, there’s a pretty simple explanation for my discomfort. It makes sense. It’s easy to understand, and most folks think it’s a “good enough” reason to leave me alone. The difference between young-me and current-me is that I no longer feel the need to justify myself. 

None of y’all need to know why I set the boundaries that I set. My explanation isn’t relevant, and I’m not obligated to give it. I said no. That’s enough. 

I think a good number of folks remember my explanation from the past, and I don’t mind that at all. There may be a time where I talk about it again, in a more appropriate context, so I guess we’ll see.

That’s a lot of information in response to a very helpful ask. Thanks! The link is gone now, and I’m so pleased that you enjoyed the fic :)

------

Anonymous said:

U suck

Kenza sent this anon as a joke. She’s right, and I thank her. 

------

Anonymous said:

I'm a doctor and ive seen it all.....but the milk fic made me gag

Excellent

------

@wingedskyes said:

Ah. Wait. I wasn't on anon....uhm. oh well. It's fine. I like milk and am not ashamed. 😆

I don’t think I received another message from you actually, but I too like milk and I’m glad we’re on the same page

------

@thelittleredheadedmusician said:

To add to the milk discussions: my best friend from home and best friend from college have each finished a gallon a milk by themselves within 2 days.

I do that too, every once in awhile. When the milk craving hits it’s a gallon a day

------

Anonymous said:

"TIM! POUR HIM. A GLASS OF M A L K!"

Hold on I have to google some things

Yeah this is funny

------

Anonymous said:

I have read that milk fic three separate times and every time I’m laughing just as hard as Tim and dick by the end it’s just so excellently executed and builds so perfectly that by the time dick cracks I’m ready to go too and I just lose it it’s amazing I love it

Awww anon I’m so pleased :)

------

@the-smartass-under-the-mountain said:

Just wanted to drop by and say your recent fic with Tim antagonizing Damian with increasingly outrageous milk concoctions had me giggling. It was so cute and refreshing to see Dick enjoying Tim's little prank. And Bruce's reaction to just... walk away was fantastic!

Thank you! I’m always so thrilled when y’all think the jokes hit

------

@njtheboywonder​ said:

I havnt really enjoyed a fic in years, but i stopped to read ur fanfic with tim drinking milk just to fuck w dami amd it made me smile. Thanks, for writing it.

Oh that warms my heart <3

------

@bruciewayneisbatman​ said:

Tim Is totally the guy who would drink ridiculous amounts of dalgona coffee to annoy damian, according to that fic.

Had to google that one, but I guess so huh

------

Anonymous said:

(diff anon) but that birthday fic was so good oml and you have opened my eyes as to the batfam in quarantine this is such a Concept

We’re all here dying..... together...

------

Anonymous said:

Happy birthday! 🎉 or belated! 🎂 thank you for being in the fandom. 😊

&

Anonymous said:

To anon! Sorry. I forgot to add that! Anyway, thanks to them we get a lovely fic. I hope you have many more birthdays! 😊

Message for you anon

------

Anonymous said:

Your writing gives off good vibes

Hear that guys I “passed my vibe check.” Is that what the youth say these days? I am an elder now and I do not know

------

Anonymous said:

finding your blog while being relatively new to batman fandom is such a bliss. your batfam content especially is *chef's kiss* amazing.

Thank you my darling :) I’m glad you’re here

------

Anonymous said:

Best line in a fic? Hard to pick just one, but this particular one from "Just Desserts" by fyeahbatmanandrobin on Tumblr is one of my faves: “Anyone else would be hard-pressed to provide the particular brand of excitement you bring to my life, Dami.”

&

@noisypaintersong​ said:

For the line thing: "I don't doubt it. Bruce Wayne, the unexpectedly normal guy wrapped in a mystery wrapped in a superhero wrapped in an enigma wrapped in a fake socialite wrapped in a businessman wrapped in a secretive billionaire." He paused. "…You're the seven-layer burrito of Gotham," he pondered. - Barry to Bruce in 'Of Friends and Foes' by Paganpunk2 on FFN. It's one of the funniest things I've read someone say to Bruce LOL

& 

@kirakats​ submitted:

&

Anonymous said:

“I do know that according to everyone else, there is no chance, no future, no universe where I stay a hero.” Describes my frustration with the way DC treats Damian so accurately. Let the kid be a hero dammit.

Thanks! That’s really helpful. I’ve got a decent answer to my question now. 

@kurawastaken​ submitted:

So this is Kenza retaliating against me for the milk fic. I very much hate tomatoes and specifically ketchup. This photo (1) is a nightmare and (2) fulfills its intended purpose.

------

Anonymous said:

I love your blog!!!

And I love you 

------

Anonymous said:

quick question: how do you think jason reconciles with the fam?? i think in the comics they kinda just reboot and now he’s on better terms. but like what conversations happened, yknow??? (you’re doin great work by the way, it rips out my heart but it’s great)

This is an amazing question, and I’ll be thinking about it for the next bit, I think. That would be a really interesting topic to explore in depth

------

@angel-gidget​ said:

*hugs you real tight* would you please send this to the first 10 people in your dash? Make sure someone gets a hug today and stay safe!

Oh thank you for the hug <3

------

Anonymous said:

I hadn’t been aware of that Memphis petition, but I live in Memphis too (Altho I know you said you just grew up there so you may not be living here currently haha) so ig I just wanted to say thanks for bringing it to my attention!

!!!

I’ve been in Texas for six years now, ever since I started school, but I’m still in and out of Memphis for family purposes. Love the trash heap of my birth 

------

@damianwaynerocks​ said:

hey! any chance you know of any other dc heroes around damian’s age?

Sure! You could try Billy Batson, Jon Kent, or Maya Ducard

------

Anonymous said:

hi! i don't know if it's okay to leave anons like these but ive been feeling down because my country has passed a bill that deprives us of lots of human rights freedom and i want you to know that i just found your blog through the damian/bruce + justice fic and it comforted me. im slowly going thru your works and so far they are all comforting. i love your stuff, thank you.

Philippines? I’ve heard some things, and I’m real sorry y’all’re going through that. I don’t know that there’s anything I could say about that to help, but I hope you’re finding joy somewhere

------

@awesomeness-ofgaybitches​ said:

Tumblr hates you. The links in your bio and to your fic masterlist don't work on mobile. I'm sorry.

FUCK

[cosmicheromp3]

Hi, I’m kinda new to the fandom, and I wanted to read more about dick Grayson and the batfamily. Do you think you could recommend some comics I should start with?

hi, of course! i actually have a comic recs blog @whatthefuckisacomic, where there’s a batfam tag and a dick grayson tag that you can browse, plus a page dedicated to tips for starting out with comics. the batfam is a bit hard to rec for because quality can vary drastically from comic to comic, and it’s hard to go “you might have to read this because the event is important to understand what’s going on, but it’s a pain because the writer sucks”. for a starting point i’ll try to stay away from those, though.

under the read more i more or less ended up following a timeline for dick, but i tried to give you options in case something isn’t up your alley and you want to move on to something else. i hope it’s still easy to follow, and don’t hesitate to ask me any follow up questions! these are all gonna be pre-reboot recommendations, because dick’s characterization was very watered down with the n52 and i frankly prefer to just stick with stuff from before.

let’s get into it!

a good starting point for dick, because it’s easy to read and quite beginner friendly, would be robin: year one – i don’t like chuck dixon’s writing in general, but this is one of the exceptions where i would recommend it. an enjoyable origin story you can also read is batman: year three, published in batman #436-439, which mixes present time events (set after jason todd’s death) with flashbacks to dick’s origin. it’s not necessary to read batman: year one and year two before to understand what’s happening in year three, but they’re important batman stories, so if you’re interested in bruce i’d encourage you to read those too.

while we’re still on origin stories, if you want a comic that goes straight to the facts, thoroughly but superficially, and is quite useful to get a good idea for how dick became robin, formed the teen titans, then became nightwing, you can check out secret origins (1986) #13. just keep in mind that it details the pre-crisis version of events, so some of it has been retconned and it might conflict with other stuff you’ve read, or will read.

personally, i find that dick’s most enjoyable stories happen when he’s with the titans, so i strongly encourage you to check out the new teen titans, if you don’t mind older comics style.

as for dick becoming nightwing, you should read the original story where it happened, which would be the judas contract, an arc published in tales of the teen titans (it’s collected as a tpb for easier reading). marv wolfman recently wrote a story set during this time in the robin 80th anniversary special and it has great dick and bruce characterization imo. i don’t recommend reading the whole special if you’re not familiar with the robins already because there’s a lot of callbacks to other comics, but after you’ve read the judas contract you can check out wolfman’s story at least. again, these follow pre-crisis continuity, but they’re very much worth it.

then there’s the nightwing (1996) solo which is... a mess, mostly. tomasi’s run (collected under nightwing: freefall and nightwing: the great leap) is usually regarded as the best from that comic. other than that this solo can be mostly boring or plain bad at times. i read all 153 issues of it (it was one of my first batfam comics i read), and i’ll say that while it could be a drag it was useful in that following a comic going from 1996 to 2009 helped me find some important events in batman history when it crossed over – same can be said for the robin (1993) solo. i’d only tell you to check it out if you have a lot of time in your hands and very low standards, but please don’t start there. i’m only saying this cause it was useful for me when i was in a moment when i wanted to read everything. if that doesn’t apply to you, better to stay away.

that tangent out of the way, let’s go back to comics i do recommend lmao. nightwing: old friends, new enemies is a good one where he teams up with roy harper. another one to go with my dickroy agenda is outsiders (2003), but before you read that you need to read titans/young justice: graduation day to understand the context under which the outsiders are formed. dick’s characterization during outsiders is very particular because it’s set at a low point in his life after he’s lost donna troy; he might seem different than in other comics, but it’s very important to understand him as a character.

lastly, dick had a pretty solid stint as batman after bruce “died” – i always say that while being batman wasn’t good for dick, dick was good as batman. for this period in his life, you have batman: long shadows, then batman: the black mirror. for more batfam interactions during this time, you can read gates of gotham, and for his relationship with damian there’s batman & robin (2009).

these should give you a good idea of some important things in his character’s history. just as a reassurance: don’t be intimidated by the amount – he’s a very old character so it’s only natural there’s a lot –, and any of these you could probably enjoy without having read everything before (except i wouldn’t recommend you start with a comic like outsiders without being acquainted with his character first, since it has very specific characterization).

as for more general batfam comics, i know a lot of people point to gotham knights for that, but i personally haven’t read it so i can’t speak for it. and i can’t make this post without recommending batgirl (2000), because it’s just great. you might also want to read jason’s death (a death in the family) and tim’s subsequent introduction (a lonely place for dying) just because they’re so often referenced, and i could go on with other important events... but there’s so many i’d rather tell you to follow another character’s reading list, than read important comics without context for the sake of reading them. this is where i plug in my sideblog again; if there’s any other batfam characters you’re interested in reading more about, you can find them listed in the tags page.

as a final note i feel like it’s my duty to encourage you to branch out to comics other than the batfam, which is what people new in the fandom tend to read the most just because it’s the most popular. i still love them and i still read their comics but there’s a lot of good comics for other characters, a lot of them better than many batfam comics since, like i said, they can be a gamble as to their quality. sometimes there’s dynamics that the fandom demands for batfam comics that can actually be found in canon for other dc families.

if you want to branch out but you’re unsure about jumping straight into another family with zero knowledge, i recommend reading team comics that include batfam members and using those to get to know more characters. i actually recommend doing that even if you’re not trying to branch out yet – reading about batfam characters outside of the gotham context, which can be very isolationist, usually adds a different dimension to them and you’ll find interesting takes on these same characters. for example, some of my favourite characterization for tim happens in young justice (1999) – another very fun beginner friendly comic i recommend –, and i enjoy bruce more when he’s with the justice league or alongside superman than i do in his solo comics.

and that’s it! don’t hesitate to ask me or DM me for anything else, and just remember that recommendations are very subjective. when reading comics what usually happens, to me at least, is that you pick something up, maybe leave it for a while, check out something else, come back to the first thing, and so on. while following a list or something you might find a different character that you enjoy and want to know more about, you might see an event that catches your interest, realize you like a writer and want to check out their stuff, and in my opinion allowing yourself to follow what you like is the most effective way to make reading comics an actually enjoyable experience.

i made it into a list in case you don’t want to read through my ramblings every time, ordered a bit better:

robin: year one

batman: year three

optional before: batman year one, batman year two

secret origins (1986) #13

the new teen titans

the judas contract

nightwing: old friends, new enemies

outsiders (2003)

for context read titans/young justice: graduation day

nightwing: freefall

nightwing: the great leap

batman: long shadows

batman & robin (2009)

batman: the black mirror

gates of gotham

not dick specific

batgirl (2000) - for cass

young justice (1999) - for tim

good luck!

[shauds-archived]

Okay that's all very interesting. Does Au Jason use hand to hand more than firearms unlike in canon? Does he have the All Caste's more magical abilities? Does he use them? i can see him basically leaving the magic to the others unless necessary. like i can picture them having a joint mission with the Titans or something and Jason surprising them by teleporting into a building or something. Since you started talking about this AU i've pictured Jason constantly fighting in his all cast uniform

2/2 does he or does he still wear the red hood outfit? How is his Mental health better? If he's not indifferent to the batfamily then how does he feel about them? What things did e hear from his friends? How does he feel about the other older Titans? I know Jason had to go on more than just a couple missions based on the fact that he knew Danny well enough to have a nickname from him so he at least hung around the tower as Robin. Did his improved mental state mean Talia let him meat Damian?

That's a bit more in depth than I thought you wanted. Okay then.

Cannon Jason got his small arms training after egon, so while AU Jason still has some of those skills, he's not as good at them as he would have been, he still keeps the guns around though because practicality, a lot of the All Caste stuff isn't that good for normal type problems. He does default to more of the All Caste stuff on a regular basis, because he doesn't really deal with that normal type stuff when Eddie's around. Like I said, he's been with them a lot longer than in cannon, so he's got the All Blades, his evil destroying punch, some advanced healing, if you've seen the All Caste do something, Jason's at least learning it. He's still young though, especially compared to people who are hundreds of years old, so he can't really do all of it yet.

I also picture him with the All Caste uniform for the most part, because 1) He's been with them for years at this point, any other clothes he has he picks up on his 'vacations' and they're not usually sturdy enough for trouble. 2) The uniform is likely to have some sort of magic resistance given where it comes from, and 3) It looks pretty cool. I imagine he has some kind of a mask with it when he's around most other heroes, but I'm always waffling on whether it's a plane facemask, or a red hood like helmet because again, practicality. It could go either way at this point. He probably plans to be Red Hood when he gets back to Gotham, but :/ that's on hold.

The biggest plus to his mental health is that he has friends to call him out when he's being overdramatic and talk him down when he starts getting self destructive. It goes both ways, and staying level headed for when a friend needs his help, helps him check himself there too. Then there's also the lack of being in such close proximity with people who only reaffirmed his worst beliefs about other people like he was in Lost Days. Some of his cannon training took place in a warzone with child soldiers and I'm sure that was a big part of what turned him so against heroes with kid sidekicks.

His thoughts on the Batfam are complicated. He can never be indifferent to them, because he does love then. Bruce is his dad, he will always think of Bruce that way, and of Alfred as a grandfather, and Dick as his brother, and he will always be hurt by all of the things that hurt him in cannon. On top of that, he heard about all of the 'reckless, violent, failed Robin' stuff from his friends, first from Eddie, who didn't have context and didn't understand, and also from some others who didn't know at first that Jason is the Robon they're talking about. That sort of took him from being hurt, to being pissed enough to raise hell, and then circled him back around to not wanting to be near enough to spit at them. He wants to not care, but he can't, and he knows he can't, but he pretends anyway and makes plots for revenge he also knows he'll never have the emotional energy left to take.

I always assumed his friendship with Danny was long distance like with Eddiez because Bruce didn't like Jason being around the Tower. He might have gone on some offscreen missions with them though. In cannon, bbyJason did get along well with Roy, and Jericho, and he had that puppy crush on Donna. If he crosses paths Either Roy or Donna, he'd probably get along well enough with them so long as they don't know who he is. If they figure it out though, they'd want to tell Dick, because he's their friend, and even if they promised not to, Jason probably wouldn't trust them. Countdown is probably still a thing here, so he'd get pretty attatched to Donna and maybe Kyle during that.

With Joey, it depends wildly on what exact point they interacted again, because wow, that's one of the character's cannon massively screwed over.

In general, he'd probably avoid any superhero teams with bats on their rosters because he doesn't want to risk dealing with them.

I honestly haven't even considered whether Jason would meet Damian before the kid went to Bruce, and then it's through Dick, not Talia.

Hope I covered all of your questions this time.