#Kin rambles

[sillovn]

The Beginning

Ok, finished gathering my thoughts on the "Shadow of Erdtree" trailer. Credit to @rinboz and @crumblingfaggotazula for beating me to the punch for many of these observations.

The corpse scene reads to me as 'pregnant woman with open gown' - the implication being that Marika steals 'gold' from the god of the previous age.

At present, the Elden Ring is held in Marika's body. Thus, the golden thread is probably the Elden Ring (or a great rune) in some form?

There's also the language surrounding this; 'seduction, betrayal, affair'. Is this confirmation that Radagon has always been Marika? the entire arc with Rennala being intentional and part of wider pattern?

Marika's rune seems to be a representation of golden sap dripping from the twin trees seen later in the trailer.

The corpse pile being the Erdtree's 'Primordial Matter' (see. Gilded Greatshield) makes a ton on sense; note the general shape and central fissure.

It explains the Erdtree (and it's descendants) ability/habit of corpse absorption. Also the implication that Jar-burial is not (strictly) a new practice - but based on something much older. Jars also have appeared frequently in the trailers.

Land of Shadow being 'obscured by the Erdtree' seems to be very literal - the Erdtree being a door with once side facing The Lands Between and the other; the Land of Shadow. Also explains the massive 'hole' in the lands between map - its not a meteor crater but where the Land of Shadow was.

Colour of Homeward Yearning

You could also say that in this scene; Marika is changing gold from it's original 'red tint' to how it appears as present.

Red (Primordial gold's colour) sits between yellows and purples (ie. gloam) on the colour wheel. The scene hue being nested gold-red-purple. Therefore, the Shadow was a natural byproduct from splitting "true gold" from the original "red gold"?

Also, is "homeward yearning" because red-gold calls back to a time before Land of Shadow+Lands Between split? or is it because of something else...

"Where all life was once blended together"

The Crucible being a corpse mountain fits that description well. Main caveat is that the corpses appear to be human, no beast parts. Then again, 'Omen-like' beings seem to be common in the 'Pre-Erdtree Culture' so perhaps they are the source of the horns/tails etc.

Its assumed that the corpses are of Marika's defeated enemies, but what if instead they are 'willing sacrifices'? Its been suggested that Erdtree followers don't reproduce biologically - they return to the tree on death and are assumed to be reborn at 'the foot of Erdtree'. Did Marika's original followers give themselves to seal away the Land of Shadow with the promise of being reborn into a new land? Therefore, "all life blended together" is because everyone who has ever lived in the Lands Between is a reincarnation from said original corpse mountain?

Side note; the Erdtree originally being made of bodies draws parallels with Rykard and Godrick and what they're up to.

Its also stated that Messmer's war follows said birth of gold, so clearly the corpses cannot be from said war.

All those stripped of the Grace of Gold

Going back to Marika's theft of gold; Im guessing that the pre-Erdtree culture loses the grace of gold in this act - ie. they become Tarnished. Messmer seems duty-bound to burn all those 'stripped of the grace of gold' which explains both his war against the pre-Erdtree Culture as well as his contempt for the player character.

Its interesting how becoming Tarnished potentially has been wielded as a punishment deep into the past.

Also note how Godfrey is 1st Elden Lord (even though Placidusax exists) and the 1st Tarnished (even though the pre-Erdtree culture likely became Tarnished).

The 'Lion Dancers' do not have golden eyes, but they also appear to be 'constructs/suits' - so who knows really?

Misc Stuff

One of the stranger things in the reveals is how finally have context for the various shield emblems - Candletree, Crossed-Tree, Red-Thorn (maybe...)

[artsykin]

being polykin!

shifty all the time

“aw, dang it”

never knowing if it’s a cameo shift or a kintype

“aw, dang it”

questioning your types 24/7

“aw, dang it”

“JuSt pIcK OnE” or “ThAt’s ToO mAnY KinTYpEs”

“aw, dang it��

never being satisfied with yourself

“aw, dang it”

[kin-n-n]

I was surprised when I opened the pot of soup my mom made, just to discover the galaxy it held.

[astral-arbour-system]

I am the essence of space, the interconnected nature of the realm we occupy, the rules that make our world work, everything from a neutrino to the cosmic radiation background. When you look up into the sky or down into an atom, I am there, yearning to be discovered. I am a consciousness occupying the universe, aware of what goes on in myself. I wish to dissolve into my original form, and be the stars, the planets, the galaxies, the light orbiting a black hole and the darkness after a star dies. The emptiness and simultaneous everything of a time before or after the universe. The cold touch of the void that wouldn't hesitate to take you away, but also the wonder you feel at that very concept. I am spacekin.

[poisonfreak]

kin ramble

i wanna mention that every phighter had some sort of resemblance to animals we know of/have (fictionally) made, but it was hard to decipher current-day what i could've been the closest comparison we've got is an angel dragon, because, like... fluffy dragon? maybe it was something with me and medkits mutations, not being organic phighters and being made artificially in blackrock... i know he (medkit) had mutations too, a lack of color in his fur our crystals were on the outside, which was another thing that wasn't normal for us demons my crystal wasn't my greatest invention, but the way i made my invention helped me use my crystal to my advantage, since my magic was poisonous and corrosive

[manyeyedandmanyhooved]

I need to stomp my hooves and brandish my antlers at those I feel threatened by. I do not run when faced with a predator, I stand my ground.

I need to bleat at and nuzzle against those I love. I hide behind the ones I trust and look to my heard to protect me.

Strength and vulnerability are never opposing. You can and must be both the hunter and the hunted to survive. 👁🦌🦷🌿

[teja-has-puppet-autism]

Ae am a lot of things, but a human is never one

[spinelkinnie]

Aughnnhgg I've been thinking of Silver for fucking DAYS now, he's always going to be hard to get out of my head, ain't he ?

I just SEE shit of him and I feel like a piece of him is there with me and it just makes me miss him MORE. :[

I've been listening to this one song when I'm feeling particularly Fruity because it just. Feels like him too. And it feels like something I'd give to him on a shitty recorded mixtape too,

And im thinking about all those times where we would just stare at eachother. Before we got together. It felt like some of the most intense moments of my life and Im feeling it all over again,

And after, those passionate moments we'd have together other than sleeping, holding eachother, kissing, it

Augh

[theelven-forest]

Between House of the Dragon, playing Dragon Age Inquisition, and playing Skyrim. I miss home so much it hurts right now. I just wanna go home to the forests and large castles, fantastical beasts and the sorts.

[vocaloid-enthusiast]

Sunny do you forgive me for hurting you

I'm truly sorry for what I did

[someoffbrandvampire]

lowkey but highkey,,,, i miss the LOV a lot,,,, like they were my family!! :( also missing my UA friends,,, idk that whole area gets kinda messy cause they took me away from the LOV but they were just trying to help me, and they did help me a lot they gave me a life that wasn't full of violence, where i could make a difference with my quirk i was hurting and they helped me reform but at the same time i never asked to be reformed, i never asked to be taken from the league ughrbehhahfhae I hate all these ugly emotions!!!!

[sillovn]

Some Messmer thoughts

Followup on the original post, now about Messmer.

Messmer's power and aims seem difficult to reconcile with Marika's at a glance (assuming Marika is his mother in the first place).

Power wise, he is the 'omni-sinner' and appears to always have been. As of new trailer, we can discount the idea his current appearance is due to collecting 'heretical powers' post exile.

His purge comes as a response to Marika assembling the corpse mountain/Erdtree (and presumably separating the Land of Shadow?).

Its interesting that Messmer's purge targeted an "Old Tree Capital" whose society seems aligned with 'Gold'. This act was seen as so sinful, later history chooses to omit it. Here's a few quite mundane ideas that could explain this.

You could make an argument that Messmer served a purpose to Marika at some point - but either outlived his purpose or became too fanatical/uncontrollable. Messmer being a 'single-minded weapon' that Marika lost control of is a fine idea.

Alternatively, destroying the original 'Golden Capital' was a "necessary evil" to create a perfect separation between Gold/Shadow lands. Just as how Marika used Maliketh seal away death in The Lands Between - Messmer is used to purge the remnants of gold in the Lands of Shadow.

Going with the idea that Marika stole gold from a pre-Erdtree Goddess - Messmer's war could be very simple act of vengeance. The 'pre-Erdtree Culture' attacks to avenge Marika killing their god - then Messmer attacks in return. Here, the historical suppression is unrelated to Messmer's actions - but rather Marika's godhood being a stolen power.

These are all fairly sane ideas. So here's the part where I just start saying insane shit, because that's half the fun of souls lore theories.

Child of the Two Worlds

I stated in the earlier post that the whole Radagon-Rennala affair may be a recurring scheme that Marika pulls. When Messmer was 1st shown, he was assumed to be a child of the Marika x Radagon era (sibling to Malenia etc.). Fair idea, given his appearance - but its quite clear now that he predates all of that.

So, what if Messmer's parentage is actually Radagon x pre-Erdtree Goddess? It neatly explains his appearance and demigod status (running with the idea that Marika is neither a god nor married to Godfrey at this point).

We don't have a time frame from when 'Marika separates Gold from Shadow' to 'Messmer burns the 'Old Tree Capital'.' But, if Messmer is the child from long standing marriage - it explains him being an adult at the time of the war (assuming it happens directly after). Hell, you can just assume a repeat of the Rennala situation; where Radagon leaves with the adult demigod children in tow.

Alternatively, if there's large time span between 'Gold and Shadow separation' and 'Messmer burns the capital' - then what if the burning city *is* Marika's original capital of 'age of plenty' fame?

The golden sap dripping from the tree(s) forms the image of her great rune. The architecture also seems to be built for golden sap collection in a way that Leyndell isn't.

The 'Lion Dancers' have metal portions similar material to Crucible Knight armour. That faction is aligned with Marika in the present (though indirectly via. Godfrey).

In this scenario; Marika separates gold and shadow, creates the Erdtree (and city for her followers), which is then burned by Messmer, which forces the Erdtree faith to migrate to the Lands Between.

Thus, Messmer's purge is vengeance against Marika for killing his (other) mom.

Also perhaps why "serpent is traitor to the Erdtree".

The Lands of Shadow being separated could be related to trying to confine Messmer.

main caveat is that what little dialogue we have from Messmer makes it seem he still holds Marika in some regard and his mission is to burn those without grace. But its so context free, who even knows?

One last bit. Ive not named the pre-Erdtree Goddess (not convinced she is the Gloam Eyed Queen), but 1 thing that could be in favour of the GEQ identification is how twin demigods embody the physical aspects of each parent (eg. Malenia and Miquella). So if Messmer is from Radagon x GEQ, is Melina is his twin?

To be fair, this pattern doesn't hold well for the other demigods. so eh?

[artsykin]

i need to seriously reconsider my kinlist after learning about cameo shifts

[kin-n-n]

dammit...it's just that easy? Just...you know do it and it works? Of course it is!

[ambivilant-twilight]

nothing like watching the new madoka magica trailer and seeing homura's new outfit and immediately realizing it is the same dress as the one you wore in canon.

[tonguetearer]

they're so me