#but maybe el knows what she deserves... and it's more than what mike is able to give

[sacredindigos]

i say this as an el stan. a hardcore el stan. and i am able to say this bc i know how to admit when a character i love does some not so nice things. just keep that in mind.

el is not a good girlfriend to mike.

sure she puts his pictures up in her shrine and whatever. but those are miniscule things in a relationship. those are just flashy little things you do for show. but when you dig deeper into their relationship and look at things like how they connect emotionally, their overall behavior towards each other, how they communicate, accountability, and etc .... el falls just as short as mike does in those categories. maybe even more for some of them.

i mean like with the accountability thing. at least mike attempts to apologize to el when he fucks up. el on the other hand has hurt mike but has never apologized or attempted to apologize to him.

for instance, she broke his trust in s3 and invaded his privacy when she spied on him. and instead of apologizing when he was clearly upset about it, she just played it off as something she was allowed to do bc "she makes her own rules." making her own rules is totally fine and an important lesson she learned from max, but not when it comes at the expense of other people's feelings and privacy. and that is what happened. she didn't take mike's feelings or privacy into consideration at all and she got away with thinking what she did was ok. and then in s4 she consistently lied to mike for 6 months straight. and he was mad and hurt when he found out she lied to him for 6 months out of their relationship and she wasn't actually the person she was said she was. and yet she never apologized for that either. when he politely tried to figure out why she had lied to him and he apologized for how he treated her, she spun all the focus onto him and started grilling him abt how he never says he loves her. which yes is something she should have done bc that was clearly an issue between them, but that could have waited til after she apologized to him. mike deserved an apology for that as well. they both should have apologized but mike was the only one who ended up saying the words "im sorry." that isn't ok. relationships take accountability and effort on both sides !!

mike's "apologies" to el are definitely not perfect and they have their issues. like a lot of issues. but at least he tries. he makes an attempt at apologizing to her and fixing things between them. el doesn't. she has never really made an attempt to make things better between them when they are having issues (that they both cause). she just pushes all the blame onto mike and all the pressure of fixing things onto him. and she's never apologized to mike for her mistakes that have upset him or taken accountability.

i think it just shows us that mike is really the one who cares more abt their relationship and puts in more effort. el definitely does not care as much as he does (granted, i don't think he cares for the right reasons but that is for another day) or puts in as much effort to fix their relationship. mike ends up having to do it all and that isn't fair to him. mike deserves better than that, despite what the people who think his character revolves around el think.

el is a bad girlfriend to mike just like mike is a bad boyfriend to her. not enough people want to acknowledge that.

[lucystark12]

Read your post on your opinions on Byler and why you think it’s a genius love story. I’m curious though you mentioned Mike being gay, rather than Bisexual. I’ve been in the fandom since s1 and never actually thought abt it that way, what’s some evidence that made you see gay Mike instead of bi Mike?? I’d love to hear your thoughts!

up until i got on tumblr a few weeks ago (very new to this business haha) i didn't really have super strong opinions on his sexuality either way. i was kinda just like, okay, mike is queer in some sense of the word, but the more i've read theories and thought about it, i feel it's almost more powerful if he's explicitly gay. this is in no way biphobia- i'm bi- and i don't at all believe that him being bi would discredit the importance of his character being queer in the grand scheme of queer representation, but i do feel like having a character who actively grapples with feelings of inadequacy out of insecurity based in not being able to love his girlfriend the way he thinks he's supposed to and deep seeded disgust and internalized homophobia with himself and his own faults especially when there's just SO MUCH beautiful and real love between straight couples around him- think lumax and jancy- is really intelligent and insightful writing. as far as evidence goes, i think there really is a lot of importance in him not being able to tell el he loves her. yes, you could say that it's just because he flat out doesn't love her, but you could also say that he knows that he doesn't and could never love her in the way he thinks he should should, in the way she deserves. that's why will's real and genuine love confession through the eyes of el makes him think "okay, maybe this could work. she loves me in the way she's supposed to, maybe it's possible". the reason will's words are so fueling for him is because they serve as proof and validation that he isn't doing anything he deems wrong and that there is the same level of beauty and intimacy in their relationship that there is in lumax or jopper or jancy. this leads in to my painting theory and how i think learning the truth about the painting will ultimately be the thing that makes mike face his internal conflicts head on because he will realize that he doesn't and can never have this perfect heterosexual relationship because he isn't heterosexual.

wow i just went on a crazy rant there hello

also- lucas's season one line about mike only liking el because she's the first girl to look at him or something like that is a good one too

[therainscene]

Will Byers: Be gay do crime, amirite?

Growing up means putting away childish things, choosing between marrying a woman or remaining celibate, becoming a wage slave with no free time, and accepting that this is how life works.

Fuck that!

Will would rather spend his time doing things he actually enjoys with the people he loves, and if he has to break some of society’s rules to do so... well, clearly the rules were bullshit to begin with and deserve to be broken.

But the spark of defiance we see in the van is a smoldering ember compared to the fire of S3.

Will jokes about Vegas and D&D, but that’s all it is -- a joke. Getting to spend the rest of his life with Mike has begun to feel like a silly fantasy, akin to using superpowers to commit fraud as a minor.

It doesn’t occur to him that Mike’s cries for help could be because he wants to escape comphet, not be pushed further into it. He weeps quietly over his self-inflicted heartache, back turned and mouth smothered, like there’s something unreasonable about his feelings.

What happened to the brazenly authentic boy who openly admitted that he expected to spend his life with Mike? Where’s the offended boy who called Mike out on his performative heterosexuality? The furious boy who screamed and sobbed and swore as he felt society’s homophobic standards closing in on him with all the inevitability of growing older?

Will is authentic and headstrong, but even he is getting slowly crushed under the boot of forced conformity.

Some of the GA think this is an acceptable outcome; just an inevitable part of growing up gay in the 80s. It’s realistic and relatable. Great queer rep!

Others decide that Will should become a villain -- after all, hasn’t he earned the right? The narrative has done nothing but torture him, so doesn’t he deserve to go a little apeshit? As a treat?

Henry Creel: Be gay do crime, amirite?

Henry is scathingly critical of society’s rules. He refuses to compromise his true nature by playing along, and no amount of punishment can force him to change.

His backstory is presented in a way that makes it difficult to sympathize with him -- I mean, ok, maybe he didn’t deserve to be jailed and tortured when he was just a child, but surely the Soteria was necessary, right? He’s dangerous.

But the real threat that Henry poses isn’t his willingness to kill -- it’s the power he has to rewrite the rules. And both he and his oppressors know it.

By locking him up (forcing him into the closet), torturing him (subjecting him to homophobia), and implanting him with Soteria (castrating him), they stripped him of agency and reduced his options to a rock and a hard place:

Continue suffering in obedient silence.

Go apeshit and commit whatever atrocities are necessary to escape. Embrace his role as the villain in a story where people like him aren’t allowed to be the heroes anyway.

(Hmm, those are same options that Will is expected to choose from. What an interesting yet surely meaningless coincidence.)

The tragedy of Henry’s story is that he did end up conforming to the rules in the end.

He didn’t choose the option his oppressors would have preferred, but he did choose an acceptable one -- he became the monster they’d already branded him as. Once upon a time his fellow outcasts might have gladly allied with him, but now they’re forced to stop him.

I love the symbolism of this shot. El’s rainbow is larger and pushes Henry back, while his is upside down, foreshadowing how the battle is going to end -- but more than that, it symbolizes their approaches in battle.

The motivation that Henry is using comes from the same place as El’s -- a desire for self-preservation, to defy authority, to fight for the rights of fellow outcasts -- but his has been twisted. He advises her to use a memory of injustice that makes her feel angry and sad...

...and while it’s very effective, it’s not enough. It isn’t until she thinks of a memory that makes her feel loved that she’s able to gain the upper hand.

Interestingly, the lights surge around her as she does this, bathing her in an ethereal white glow:

It fits the symbolism of the rainbow room perfectly -- after all, what is white light if not a focused rainbow?

But more importantly: where have we seen this before?

Will Byers carries the light with him wherever he goes, because he has the benefit of something Henry was cruelly robbed of: the unconditional love and acceptance of his family and friends, which helped hinder society’s efforts to crush the authenticity out of him.

So why should Will suffer the same fate as Henry? What’s stopping him from being the hero and earning the happy ending he wants, instead of the tragic ending homophobes expect him to settle for?

Like Henry, Will has the power to rewrite the rules -- and this time, they’re actually going to be rewritten.

[gayofthefae]

"El should have had a response to the speech so we know how she feels about it!" No. El should have had a response to the speech so Mike knows she loves him. Really loves him. We heard what he said in that van. We heard what he said to her. When she says it, he doesn't fully believe it. In a Milkvan endgame world, Mike has told us that he believes he loves El more than El loves him and that is going to get him hurt.

That isn't just the resolution to El's feelings in 4x03. It's a recreation of them. El told Mike she didn't feel like enough, now he's telling her she is. But in it, he's telling her he doesn't feel like enough. If they really wanted this romance to resolve everyone's issues, she would have told him he is. At some point, find a time. Or make the speech be in a point it can be a dialogue in the first place. Yes, we're curious what she thinks, but even if she's simply happy and nothing else, he still needs it. He deserves it.

He deserves the van speech. Straight from her mouth. And I guess that's what it is. The only reason it works that he doesn't get it from her is that while before, he was saying he didn't feel like enough. Now, he's saying "I want you to know I didn't tell you because I didn't feel like enough. But Will told me that wasn't true so now I know better and can tell you this." Yeah, super romantic. Bring up your other love interest in your speech, that's not threatening to your girlfriend at all. He doesn't actually do that, obviously, but that is the meaning behind the words and why it (sort of) resolves for us.

Mike feels feels like enough now. But El had nothing to do with it. My point stands. Poor El she's so sad about Mike and he needs to fix it. But we were so focused on that, we forgot: Mike is sad about El too. And she needs to fix it. He did his part, she didn't do hers. In her defense, it was solved before she got there, which that being possible is another rant I kinda just gave and will also be cutting the rest of off for another time.

They said "El deserves to feel loved by Mike" and had Mike love her. Then they said "Mike deserves to feel loved" and left it there. It does not matter that it was fulfilled by El indirectly. Will fixed it. Whatever you say, if you lie to your friend to comfort them, so long as it works, you still fixed it. If my friend says he's scared his girlfriend doesn't love him enough and I say "yes she does she told me firsthand" I'll send him off smiling and someone saying "wow it's so nice of his girlfriend to cheer him up" is fuckin rude tbh.

Mike deserved love too. El's could only be fulfilled by Mike or herself. They pretended the second one wasn't true so for the purposes of this post, we will too, and in that case, Mike fulfilled it for her. But more importantly, no one else did. No outside person but Mike at that tie could have fulfilled that for her. Or maybe they could, but they made sure to not let us ever know for sure. They told us for sure with Mike. All these romantic moments with El are actually just further inherent proof of his relationship with Will. What Will did worked. That is a bad. sign. He succeeded in getting Mike to tell El he loves her, yes, but break it down and you get: Mike needed to feel like enough to tell El. El did not succeed in that, Will did. AND more importantly, that was enough.

That being enough tells us it did not have to be El. El deserves to be loved by Mike. Mike deserves to be loved. That's what they said. El deserves better than Mike but Mike deserves better than El too. That's why they literally already did, and actually had to for the plot to work, give him better.

Yeah. Mike and El and receiving the solutions they need to the sadness over each other from other people before each other gets to it and being completely fulfilled and able to move on without the other just fine now.

[sunflowerharrington]

apple juice and apologies

written for the @strangerthingswritersguild daily prompt “I’m so glad I found you” (10/3/2024)

pairing: jim & el hopper (not romantically, obviously)

wc: 696 haha nice

no warnings

🩵

El wakes up to a faint knock on her door. She sleepily rubs at her eyes and pokes her bed head up out of the sheets, looking around to make sure she isn’t dreaming. Her dad pops his head around the door.

“Hey kid, can I uh… Can I come in?”

She nods, she wants to stop herself from nodding but does it anyway. She doesn’t want to have to face what’s about to come her way in a few moments. El had one hell of a night with almost no sleep after the explosive argument, and after dad told her straight up how he felt about things with Mike, she danced around her own issues with Hopper, afraid he might yell at her even more.

She takes a deep breath, sitting up in the bed. When she looks up she notices that he’s carrying a tray in his hands and puts it on the bedside table. It has all her favorites; apple juice and eggos drizzled with chocolate sauce and topped with blueberries and some kind of powder. Sugar, maybe. Oh, it’s the one they use for baking cookies sometimes!

Her heart swells for a couple of seconds until she remembers what she’s supposed to be doing. El gathers her courage and looks up at him again. He sits down on the edge of the bed.

Hop— dad looks as devastated as El does; deep bags under his eyes, hints that he’d been crying, and the top of his forehead isn’t shining the way it usually does. He’s not wearing his work uniform today, even though he should be. Dad’s still in yesterday’s clothes.

El reaches out to hold his hand. “We need to have a talk, and no shouting this time.”

He looks at her, eyes full of hurt and regret for the things he said. “Come on, kid, just—”

“Dad,” she says. “I know our things didn’t go the way we wanted them to but we have to talk it out. Joyce tells me that’s what I should do with you. If we don't, I'm scared we will not talk ever again.”

“El…”

“It’s a hard conversation to have, dad. I know. I know you want to set these.. Is the word boundaries? …between me and Mike and you, but you could have said it without shouting at me. I know I shouted at you too and I’m sorry.”

Dad sighs. “I know you’re getting older and you're changing, and that’s what’s scaring me. That at some point you won’t need me anymore and you’ll be able to make decisions all on your own. I just don’t want you to grow up, but I know that’s not how life works…”

“I will always need you, dad,” she replies, making room in the bed for him to sit next to her. As soon as he sits down, she wraps her arms around him and cuddles into his side. Even though they had that fight last night, he’s still her dad and she’s still his daughter. “I will always thank you for taking care of me and making me feel like a person.”

She looks up at him, wiping away a tear rolling down his cheek.

“I’m so glad I found you, kid. You deserve someone who’s going to take care of you and look after you every step of the way.”

“Someone like Steve?”

Dad laughs, warming her heart. “Sure, kid.”

El smiles, snuggling closer to him, until she remembers the waffles and juice. She rests the tray on her lap and hands him the fork. “We can share?”

“Thank you, I’m starving,” he says, breaking off a piece of the waffle for himself and a piece off for El. He hands the fork back to her.

As they tuck in with big smiles, dad puts the music on from the little box on the bedside table. Static erupts from the box and dad curses under his breath, until a song comes on. He sits back down on the bed.

“Hey, kid?”

“Yes, dad?”

“I’m a better dad than Steve, right?”

El laughs. “Yes, but you can’t tell him I said that.”

[cringengl]

I've heard people who ship m*leven say that bylers are weird because we preach El's independence but believe Will should end up with Mike, which is supposedly hypocritical because why aren't we showing the same energy towards Will and saying that he should be the independent one (because m*leven is supposed to be endgame and since we are so intent on how amazing El would be single, why is Will so different)???

Maybe it's because Will and El are different people with different narrative arcs???

El's arc is so much more about finding herself, which is why she should have the freedom to do that without a failing relationship to nurse back to health.

We see this in every season, whether it's El finally being able to dress feminine in s1, finding her long lost sister in s2, her ENTIRE arc with Max in s3 and her accepting that she's not the monster in s4.

HOWEVER, Will already knows who he is, his arc is about accepting himself.

From s1 he is unapologetically himself. He is bullied for his bright clothes, it's suggested that he's known he's gay for a long time, in s3 he is the only one who doesn't care about the bullshit of growing up and is more happy being his usual nerdy self and of course in s4 it's obvious he knows who he is (Alan Turing presentation and so much more lol). He can't even lie to Mike in s1 ep1.

The one time he does lie is when he gives the painting to Mike and it's why Jonathan's talk with Will is so important.

Will deserves to have his queer story line finished on a happy note because that's that's Stranger Things is about, finding hope in adversity and destroying social norms.

Because Will's story ending happily isn't him getting rejected by the love of his life, or him dating some random dude (there are going to be no new characters introduced in s5 and there's no one else for Will to date that we already know) who won't understand Will the way Mike does.

Will deserves a boyfriend that pays attention to him like Mike does and protects him like Mike does (even if Will is strong enough on his own) and works on being a better best friend to him.

Because what better way for Will to accept himself than Mike understanding and reciprocating his love, showing Will that his love was never a mistake, that he's not a mistake.

Well what about Mike, doesn't he get a say in this?? I could go on a whole Mike's arc analysis spree, but since this post is about Will and El, I'll keep it short. I think he already has had his say...

[starmanbyler]

not every relationship has to be romantic for it to be deep and profound. mike and el have the potential to have a beautiful friendship, i say this because although they get along well and clearly have a lot of love for each other, there just isn’t a romantic attraction between them (at least how i see it).

the difference between a platonic and romantic relationship isn’t necessarily a deep spiritual understanding, it’s as simple as just being attracted to each other romantically and wanting a more emotional intimacy with them. i hate when people act like there’s some kind of hierarchy of relationships with romantic ones on the top. familial, platonic, romantic or mentor sort of relationships are all equally important to have.

i don’t see people undermining dustin’s relationship with steve or eddie to say that suzie is above all of them, or that jonathan’s love for nancy is so much more important than the love he has for joyce and will.

admittedly, a lot of bylers may act like will and mike’s romantic relationship is the most important thing, but that doesn’t make it true. there’s room for disagreement even on one side of things. i personally think that their relationship should be romantic, not because it’s a necessity, but just because it makes sense narratively and they are romantically attracted to each other, simple as that. that is what the characters want and deserve so i would like to see that.

and in saying this, yes some fans may neglect to care about a lot of will’s other relationships with his friends and family in favor of byler, BUT that doesn’t represent everyone’s beliefs.

what i see A LOT of is people acting like el needs a romantic relationship. i know it’s been said again and again, but seriously, i think the reason she shouldn’t be in a relationship with mike is just because they don’t like each other like that and their relationship causes insecurities for both of them, and i think a lot of the reason why people push the idea of romance onto her is because of misogyny and ableism. a lot of midlevens would argue the opposite. apparently, it’s misogynistic to suggest that she can’t be in a relationship with mike and be independent. and it’s ableist to assume that she can’t be in a relationship in general. i disagree.

the reason we don’t want her in a relationship isn’t because we want her to be an ‘independent girlboss who doesn’t need a man’. although this is somewhat true, we’re genuinely just criticising the nature of their relationship, looking at it from a nuanced perspective. if you truly go in and analyse what’s going on in their relationship instead of just crying misogyny that people don’t like it then you would realise the flaws it actually has. her relationship is bad because of the way that it is, not what it is. there isn’t a problem with el having a romantic relationship, if she wants that, then great! but i do not want her to have a relationship that causes insecurities for her, and one that she is not independent in! it’s been said many times mike and el’s relationship is very codependent. she could be independent in a relationship with mike. that would be great, but it’s not the case, so maybe it’s best to accept that the relationship doesn’t work instead of forcing a potential situation that just isn’t really possible (at least not in the resolution of s5, i think it would take a few years to be able to develop and fix this).

what i truly think is misogynistic (although they may not realise it) is pushing her into this relationship that doesn’t make her happy. it’s the whole idea of amatonormativity that is certainly forced more onto women than it is onto men. the fact people are so oblivious to how upset el is in the relationship and just look past it seems very… off. and it seems to me like internalised misogyny that’s being projected onto el.

and on the ableism thing: us suggesting that el shouldn’t have gotten in a relationship with mike so young is not ableism. it’s about the fact that at that time, she was very traumatised and did not understand much at all about relationships, what healthy relationships look like etc. she has the autonomy to start a relationship if she wants (which clearly she did) but that doesn’t make it any less odd that she got into a relationship not even really knowing what that means for her. her only interpretation of romance is tv shows - highly unrealistic ones. she doesn’t even have hopper as an example of relationships because he’s divorced. the way that she’s performing as someone else to mike in s4 just goes to show how romance to her is almost like fiction and she doesn’t know how to healthily express her feelings and communicate with mike. nobody is saying she can never be in a relationship because she’s disabled. people need to look deeper into why we think that she isn’t ready for that.

what i do find ableist is the implication that she has to be in a relationship to ‘prove wrong’ the idea that she can’t. people focus too much on trying to prove points and less on what el ACTUALLY WANTS. and people also disregard what mike wants a lot, centering the whole ship around el’s feelings that to me aren’t even really there. that’s also what seems sexist to me.

[bylerisc4non]

Do you have any predictions for how Stranger Things will end?

EXCELLENT QUESTION! I have many predictions but they're more like random blurry ideas than full on theories. For the most part, I've theorized about each individual's end needs and development:

El - She'll contribute to killing Vecna and closing/destroying the Upside Down. She'll move on from Mike. She will start to find her own identity. She starts to live a normal life, healing from her past wounds. I personally would be very happy if she lost her powers just so that'd be easier for her.

2. Will - He's a big key to defeating Vecna and ending the Upside Down. His connection to that world will be broken and he'll be able to start to move on. I personally hope we see him starting to heal from the trauma all of that caused him. Obviously breaking his connection and ending the UD will be a big part of him getting closure. Hopefully he'll have closure with all the miscommunications with Mike. (Byler Endgame :)) I just want him to be happy. 😭 Please let him smile. Let him be happy!!!! He better get a fucking boyfriend and it better be Mike. (if it's not Mike I'll be really disappointed/confused because wut but anyway. as long as he's happy, i'm happy.)

3. Mike - He's gonna die. Or almost die. I just know it. I may be delusional, but Idc. Mike will be dying and I'll be sobbing. But Gay Love heals so he'll come back to life. Anyway, Mike will get very close to death, but survives. Maybe that prompts him to want to hold onto Will and what's important in life. He'll learn to accept and love himself. He'll be honest with Will and honest with El. I'm still a firm believer that he's going to crack a bit in the UD or from Vecna. We're going to see those bottled up emotions. (At least, we better, or I will start a riot.)

4. Max - She will live and have her much deserved happily ever after with Lucas.

5. Lucas - He will live and have his much deserved happily ever after with Max. Movie date :)

6. Dustin - Dustin cannot die omg. If they so much as touch him I will be pressing charges. I will put the duffers in an early grave.

7. Nancy & Jonathan - End up together. I'm not sure how the whole college thing will work out... But they're endgame so.

8. Robin & Vickie - The will start dating and have their super power lesbian moment 💅

9. Steve - No longer the babysitter, he'll most likely move away. He'll meet someone new, someone he can actually drive around and have six kids with. (not nancy lol)

10. Bonus: I really want Karen Wheeler to leave Ted lol But I'm not sure if it will happen.

11. Another bonus: I want to see Holly growing up 😭

[fractalkiss]

could you do a director's commentary on 'who's gonna hold you down'? and/or ⭐ for your deaging fic!

i'm gonna do director's commentary for one of the parts that had me shaking crying throwing up when i was writing 'who's gonna hold you down' AND one from jwds deaging fic because that's fresh in my mind...rip. hope this isn't too much lol thanks for dropping by to ask these!

who's gonna hold you down commentary:

Lucas doesn't like to admit it but he's supposedly (claimed by Dustin) the worst driver out of them. Erica could parallel park better than he can, and she'd just gotten her licence. Even Will—who for some reason, swore he'd suck at driving, could back it out into a busy street with enough calm: whose wasted ass did you steal Jonathan's car for to go pick up? And still? Dustin had asked just a couple months ago in their chatroom, and Will flipped him the bird via text. That's what Lucas told Max anyway. What El tells her on timed phone calls under the phone bill's watchful numbers, was the abridged version but funnier versions, in El's flat unhurried tone. [i just love the idea of erica being able to parallel park better than her older brother and the idea of will taking jonathan's car in the middle of the night to pick up the guy he's been sort of maybe seeing on and off when he's drunk to help bring him home (shoutout to male oc lionel). will deserves so many good things and i want him to be HAPPY. @ duffer bros please dn't kill him off the next season. TERRIFIED for this guy, i want him to live. i'd also like to think that it's maxine and will who doesn't let el pull away from the group too much after her breakup with mike. i almost forgot his name as i was answering this, i was about to say finn wolfhard. my thoughts on el and mike is that there are no thoughts besides el needing to grow as her own person eventually away and separate from mike. me @ el: he's just some guy!!]

The thing is, she's never been impressed by sunsets. Not here, nor the ones that sprawled out over the beaches in California like something alive and hungry. Max imagines instead, a sliced apricot in place of the sun, glowing over the horizon. A side effect of Lucas always reading her to sleep when she was recovering from her broken body, before she got bored with the books she'd chosen herself and couldn't get past the reedy voice he put on for parental figures and asked him to talk about their friends.[max's whiplash in between wanting to die about lucas' impersonations and having to adjust seeing the world by extension via someone else while she's lost some of her vision in this fic, which i think can be pretty debilitating during the recovery phase for someone like her, whose natural inclination is to put up a wall up around herself and hold her own]

It was fine. Lucas didn't have rich or creative descriptions for them sometimes, but she listened. She listened, smiled, jabbed, and choked out laughter at all the good parts, until Lucas didn't have anything to tell her one day.[it's his loneliness upon max's loneliness!! secondhand! he does all this for max but what if it might never be good enough and max knows, so she reacts the way she does--she smiles and laughs and rolls her eyes as long as she listens. one chapter a day and they'll get through it one day at a time!! if she listens and lets him go on then maybe there'd be no need for to give any more of herself back]

"They ask about you," he said.[trying to get through to her via the power of friendship over long distance]

Max is too tired to shrug. "Same old."

"Yeah but, you know," Lucas said, in that voice Max simultaneously hated and loved.[i'd like to think they were 2 years going on strong here and then right after she was released, they took a break lucas knew she needed and then continued on strong again up to the present roadtrip scene] If she hadn't been jacked up on morphine, feeling vaguely disgusting in scrubs she sweat into a lot, she wouldn't have said anything. How unbearable, to still have gotten your feelings hurt by being told you were withdrawing into yourself, again. She thought her shame cortex for displaying basic human vulnerability should have dimmed down after dying once.[this is basically me questioning and navelgazing as i was writing: the power of friends and friendship might have saved someone, but what happens after that? what's life after that when things have to change and people naturally grow apart. in a sense, i meant for it to be max thinking she was gonna live her life every day to the fullest after escaping death, but she's still coming to terms with the life she's left with]

Now, she can smell the ocean, salt and brine after they've found a spot to sit. 

They'd brought Lucas' bike, strapped to the top of his dad's car and wheeled it atop a road that stretched on and on, easy to pedal through with speed, almost as fast as being on a skateboard. Lucas mounts it, and Max gets on behind him. 

"You wanna tell the others about today?" Lucas asks. Not what he'll think of today, but what Max thinks of, the things she wants to remember.[she remembers that there are people who's stuck with the life they're left with too, and that she can't fault them for wanting to share it with her.]

She can smell his clean shampoo, the dense thick pine along the road, and the taste and ringing of something close to happiness in her teeth.[needed sensory descriptions here especially with scent, i was not going to leave that out to describe familiarity and love] "Of course."

They start moving and set off, the wind rushing past their ears like a song[the kids biking + max going along on her skateboard really has become a staple in ST. i thought of kate bush's love and anger for lumax specifically, i think the lyrics encapsulates the kind of dread and hope for a future]

--------

hold your lost causes commentary:

i'll pick one scene that isn't too depressing (to me)

Dongsik nudges Juwon's leg with his knee hard enough that Juwon bristles and says "Don't," but he's smiling a little. Smiling just enough that Dongsik can push himself closer and crowd him in. Juwon tries to elbow Dongsik away, even though he's got his hands fisted in Dongsik's hoodie, shuddering at the warm contact when Dongsik tries to mouth at his neck, and looking pissed off anyway when he manages to straddle Juwon that way on the floor. It's not exactly roughhousing, with the quick kissing in between; Dongsik wonders very briefly if Juwon had anyone to play rough with, in boarding school maybe, or if that was too much for him.[i think i just loved the idea of dongsik trying to lightly roughhouse with juwon and playing unfair by kissing. i personally don't think juwon liked roughhousing at all growing up lmao, but it's dongsik unconsciously filing this thought away in his head to learn something about juwon for later]

"Ah fuck," Dongsik groans, slightly out of breath when Juwon shifts his weight in an actual clean semi-throw to get Dongsik off of him, and pins his leg. "Easy, my back is killing me, actually—"[i love the size difference. and age difference lol so many opportunities for the push and pull between them]

"Sure," Juwon says, but he lets Dongsik's leg out beneath him, one hand on his stomach tentatively, "I did ask you."

"You have all the advantage in the world. You just liked me doing that," Dongsik says as he runs his fingers through Juwon's hair now, tugs gently. He notes how dark Juwon's eyes seem to go. "Why judo?" he asks.

"Why not?"

"Didn't take you for a close contact kind of guy."[lol judo is a martial art that's about grappling, cornering into place/locking, and taking control over your opponent so like BESIDES the close contact, i think judo really does track for juwon. this is me basically taking advantage of the character outline in the translated parts of the script]

Juwon drops his gaze, pushes himself off and sits cross-legged. "Why taekwondo?"

"Jihwa's father had a dojang and held classes. He taught us." 

"Oh Jihwa's father taught you?" Juwon repeats, as if to himself.

"My father encouraged it." Dongsik's father had simply told him when he was a kid that he had to learn how to fight. His brawl streak in middle school and high school became history. "He was always teaching me to fight for yourself as a man. Maybe you wouldn't have liked us at all if we'd known each other then."[i wanted to make sure it was clear in the phrasing that dongsik and his dad were evidently really close back then, besides canon knowledge of it from the drama. it's a reminder every time that dongsik actually had a decent positive relationship with his father in childhood up and juwon is like. acutely aware of this so he listens and tries to push aside his own experiences and understanding of fathers/family as he knows it. at this point after the deaging, it's where he's inclined to want to do this since he thinks dongsik has had a happier childhood--before the tragedy at least--and is thus by far the better person between them just for not lacking this in is early childhood--except dongsik doesn't think this and would never think this of himself.]

"Maybe," Juwon says, subdued. "I suppose it's what fathers do."

"Are you saying that for my sake?" Dongsik asks. There's truth in Juwon's words. The familiar hardness in Juwon's eyes now might have something to do with his father, with whatever Juwon had been doing in Seoul today earlier, but most of the fight inside him had been taught somewhere.

There's a rough, sharp-edged stone that seems to throw itself over in Dongsik's chest each time. He knows what that is, a reminder that's ugly and vindictive, a kind of animal in him that licked at its own wounds when Juwon stood by him years ago against his father.[the kind of animal i envisioned here was meant to be selfish with self-preservation instincts at an all time high ie. not thinking about whether or not juwon gets hurt protecting him, but thinking that it's only right that he can get hurt protecting him because i think, grief and anger is something that people want others to feel with and share and empathize with BUT at the same time, they'll cradle their own grief and anger to themselves and think "no, this is mine to bear and nurse. let me sit with it alone because you would never, and could NEVER understand." like. it's SO conflicting, jwds' relationship is like the ultimate conflict upon conflict LAYERED.] The same brutish, killing animal that imagines the look on Han Kihwan's face if Dongsik visits him just to tell him that his son's a keeper, uses his mouth for something pretty well.[dongsik imagines this, but would never do it because to see any sort of outrage from han kihwan as a father is complicated. would he rather have han kihwan show disinterest and disdain for his own son that he doesn't react? or would being able to hurt him this way actually feel good when that would just mean that he is, still a father most of all? tough choice! conflict upon conflict] But the other curious part of it now, is that maybe Dongsik's feelings are just hurt because Juwon is so careful about putting up a fort around himself. It's terribly ironic; Dongsik is supposed to be the expert here at that.

"Juwon-ah, you don't have to pretend for my sake. Not for me," Dongsik says, barely a whisper. With the rain outside, he's not even sure if Juwon heard it.

But Juwon is close enough that he looks up at him. Just stares at him from the other end of the couch, for what feels like a while, both of them silent like their heads are underwater. "Right. It's just a fighting sport," he says. He says this slowly, like he's really talking about something else.[he's talking about every toxic bad quality that was nurtured and grown in him because of his father]

"It's still you," Dongsik finally says. He'd gotten to know Juwon as a kid and he was always who he was: good. "Maybe I'd want to know. Maybe I don't. And then maybe I'd talk your ear off, would I have that?"[literally the closest to a confession i could write. "will you bear yourself open just a little more for me and listen to me talk your ear off in return??? hmu if yes". essentially, to let someone glimpse you for who you were before and still have them want to stick by you in the present and LEARN about you--that's trust and love baby!!!]

The non-committal phrasing only makes it so much easier to say. That's another thing Juwon learned to understand about Dongsik a long time ago, that he understands now.

"Troublesome," Juwon says, but it's soft. He doesn't make a move to leave. "You have that. You had me long enough."["that was all i've been trying to do with you!!!" (post-canon) "why else would i want to drink an insane amount of tea with u". lord i think i added this line like. a day after posting just because i read it again and thought a more proactive conversation seemed to have better impact, thus adding a line of response from juwon]

[thranduel]

i can’t stop thinking about how will’s love for mike was the only reason mike was able to say the words “i love you” and i’m going crazy.

el has been expressing her love for mike for such a long time. in season 3, she said “i love you” to him directly (he didn’t say it back), kissed him (he didn’t kiss her back) and then she walked away smiling while he just stood there with a confused expression on his face. while they were apart, she made a shrine for him and kept all of his letters, photos and cards. she sent him lots of letters and signed them all with “love, el”, but he didn’t do the same. in fact, mike didn’t keep anything of el’s and actually crumpled up her letters and threw one of them in the trash even though it could’ve been the last letter he received from her (she deserves so much better than this by the way).

el constantly expressed her feelings towards mike and showered him with love and affection but… it just simply wasn’t enough. he couldn’t tell her he loved her. he couldn’t even write it on paper. even when she was sobbing in his room and confronting him, practically begging him to just say it because she really needed to hear it more than anything (especially after how badly she got bullied the previous day), he still couldn’t say it. three simple words and he couldn’t say it. and then it just makes NO sense because his excuse is that if he told her how he felt, he was scared that if he lost her, it would just hurt more???? are you actually kidding me??? he lost her BECAUSE HE DIDN’T SAY IT. she went with owens even though she was warned she might not ever see mike again and that was the moment she realised she didn’t need mike anymore. she even left him a letter saying “from, el”. and you know what, even if mike was afraid of saying it, why did it have to make it all about himself? el really needed to hear she was loved in that moment and she was clearly struggling mentally, but he still didn’t say it and just sat there, lied to her and called her ridiculous. when you love someone and they’re struggling that badly, shouldn’t you do whatever you can to make them feel better, especially when it’s as simple as telling them you love them?

just look at will. his love for mike is so strong and genuine and real that he put mike first and sacrificed his own feelings just to help his relationship with el even though it absolutely broke him to do so. will would’ve been scared, heartbroken and terrified because he felt like he was about to lose mike, but he still did it because he saw mike was struggling and he loves him SO much and wanted to make him feel better. but mike couldn’t even tell his own girlfriend he loved her when she was crying? are you kidding me? and the thing that makes it so much more ridiculous is that he knows she wanted to hear the words “i love you”, so i don’t understand how he was so scared to say it. it would be understandable if she wasn’t showing him love or he didn’t think she cared about him, but she did! she constantly showed him love and literally started SOBBING because he couldn’t tell her he loved her!!!!! she’s the one who has put so much more effort into their relationship while mike has just sat there barely doing anything. he couldn’t even write “love, mike” on paper so it doesn’t make sense to me at all.

and in the next episode when mike is talking to will, he says that maybe if he said that thing, she would’ve taken him with her. see?! he knew exactly what she wanted to hear and he’s aware that NOT saying it is what pushed her away, but he still couldn’t say it when she was crying? this entire storyline is absolutely ridiculous and the fact that people are like “he just has trouble expressing his feelings but but he’s so in love with her” make no sense to me. because if that’s what they were going for, they wrote it SO horribly and the writing is just awful and makes no sense. it also means mike’s character is inconsistent and the entire thing feels unfair to el.

anyways, it’s just crazy because after all the love and affection el showed mike, it still wasn’t enough for him for him to say he loved her.

but you know what was enough?

will.

just will. will confessed his OWN feelings to mike. he gave him the painting, and mike’s entire face lit up. he looked the happiest he had been all season, like it was the greatest gift he had ever received. then will told him he was “the heart”, something which clearly meant the world to mike and made him feel so much better about himself. will also told mike that he’s never made him feel like a mistake for being different and he gives him the courage to fight on. he also said he’ll always need him.

it was will’s feelings that mike fell in love with. it was will’s feelings that gave mike hope, strength, happiness, courage and motivation. will loves mike for exactly who he is and mike loves will for exactly who he is. they understand each other better than anyone else and they can actually be themselves with each other.

the only thing that would make sense for all 3 characters is el breaking up with mike and mike and will realising their feelings for each other, because that’s what it’s been building up to. el should realise she doesn’t need to be in a relationship with mike, and then she can find happiness elsewhere, whether it’s with a new partner or on her own for a while. she deserves to be with someone who will love her for who she is, not just her powers. and that person should also be able to tell her they love her without being pressured into it. will deserves to be with his best friend and the boy he’s loved for most of his life since he’s suffered from the very beginning and hasn’t had a moment of peace and happiness. mike also deserves to be with the person he’s closest to, the one that he can be his true self around without hiding. he’s been pretending to be someone he’s not for so long and it’s only hurt him and the people around him. it’s not healthy or fair that mike and el are stuck in a relationship where they constantly lie, don’t feel like equals and can’t even be themselves around each other, and then will is shoved to the side like always and suffers all alone. mike and el staying together and will being by himself would be such a horrible thing to do and it wouldn’t make sense from a writing standpoint.

[tsugarubecker]

Piggybacking off of and inspired by this rad post by @admirablespoling.

@admirablespoling points out in their post above that if Byler is planned for endgame, then The Duffers have done their job where the general population is concerned. The gen pop is noticing that something is truly off with Mike, and with Mike and El’s relationship.

I want to add an idea in for us to consider.

We’ve talked here before about how in the world The Duffers could succeed in pulling off Byler when they’ve positioned Milk Can as such a central couple of Stranger Things. How can they find the time for those two to break up in such a way that the general audience won’t be confused, angry, insistent that it came out of nowhere, insistent that the show writers have done El wrong, specifically.

Well. I want to posit that maybe. Just maybe. They’re working on that.

Think about it. El went through an entire arc in S4 where she dug into her past, resolved relationships, laid things to rest. She got in tune, in a big way, with who she is through revisiting her history and her trauma. And I feel like the logical next step for her is to keep going with figuring out who she is. Seems like that journey for her is being presented as important (and has been since S3).

Okay. So what about Mike and her relationship? That hasn’t been resolved yet. Can’t she have both?

I think the next logical step was to do two things. One, reveal to the gen aud that Mike’s trying his best but he’s full of cliches and half-truths and something isn’t quite right. That’s part one that his monologue seems to have accomplished, since we are seeing the gen aud start to discuss its weird, off vibes.

Two - the story had to give El everything she thought she wanted so that she could realize on her own that it is NOT what she wants.

I suspect - if they’re doing Byler - and honestly who fuckin knows anymore - then it was an important piece of the puzzle, to have Mike tell her that he loves her. To have him dig deep and say romantic things and really give it all that he has. Which, clearly, he was! He gave it his best shot! I think that’s all he’s got when it comes to El! Which allows the audience the opportunity to ask - does this feel genuine? Would I feel happy to hear these things? Is this what El deserves, is this what she should want?

If the writers had never resolved this - had never had Mike try to give El what she wants - I don’t know if the general audience would ever be satisfied with the ending of their relationship (if it ever comes *shrug*).

I think the key will be El coming to terms with the fact that she doesn’t need Mike romantically, and she isn’t satisfied with the love he is able to give her.

I think that if she breaks up with Mike, rather than the other way around, the audience will accept it much much more easily than if Mike breaks up with El to eventually be with Will.

I dunno. Half of me doesn’t believe myself LOL but… maybe. Maybe.

[izzymeadows]

You do realize El was about to kiss Mike in Ep 7 of S1, yeah? She was doing a lean in the same way he was. The feelings between them were already there/reciprocated. It’s common for that tween age group to develop crushes, explore first kisses, ect.

And to say she had no concept of love or a kiss seems quite false. See above as to why she clearly understood the concept of a kiss. And when he kissed her in Ep 8, she was maybe a little surprised but not unreceptive. She smiled at him.

See Episode 8 as well to see that she very clearly understood/understand the concept of love. She was quite able to understand that Papa’s ‘love’ was bad. That that wasn’t really love at all. And who was she crying out for instead? The person she cries for *every time.* Mike. Who does she say goodbye to before she disappears? Mike. Who was she very obviously trying to ‘save’ the most? Mike. It’s a pattern she follows in later seasons too.

And this really isn’t even like, a Mileven thing or something…The fandom has this massive tendency to infantalize Eleven to a huge degree. She can’t have this and that because she was raised in a lab. She can’t do this and that because she was raised in a lab. I see it over and over. Should we say the same about every child raised in an atypical way? Are they all supposed to be hopeless?

Eleven isn’t dumb. And just because she was raised in a lab does not mean she can’t understand abstract things like love, kindness, ect. It’s actually a strength of her character that despite being raised in that quite terrible place, she was still able to develop her own sense of morality, good and evil, love and hate, right and wrong.

To say she can’t understand those concepts does her a distinct disservice.

I'm publishing this because the analysis is really good, but i fail to see where did i say or imply eleven is dumb. Quite the opposite, i'm always saying she's smart and willing to learn. I also never said she can't understand those concepts, I said she doesn't have them at first. Which, I'll concede to you, was wrongly worded, because I didn't mean the concepts themselves, but the vocabulary and resources to understand them in a more conscious level (i don't know if this makes the sense i want it to make, sorry).

Anyway no, i didn't see what you say in episode 7, or i did but i don't remember idk. My memory is a mess, I'm gonna have to rewatch! But either way, when i talked about that kiss, i wasn't saying she didn't want it, i was saying she probably wouldn't have known how to reject it if she had wanted to, because she wasn't allowed to have her own wants met, or even acknowledged, before. Also, even knowing what a kiss was, she probably didn't know everything it could imply (i also worded this wrongly). That's what makes it uncomfortable to me. Again, she had a terrible upbringing, which means she lacks knowledge of certain stuff, not intelligence. The show makes it clear she is, in fact, really clever. Look at how fast she learns! After living most of her life as a tool in a lab, and then what's shown in season 2, which isn't a "normal life" either because she wasn't socializing like other kids her age! And then she acts almost the same as the others! She's really smart and i never said she's hopeless. And if somebody does say it, they're wrong. What i said (or at least, what i meant, i might have messed up at expressing myself, wouldn't be the first time tbh) is that she needs more time than she's had until now to fully learn everything she didn't know. And i'm positive she will, and it will be super interesting to watch, and i'll still be able to be like a proud mother hen with her.

Sorry for the long rant, but i don't like people thinking i'm here badmouthing Eleven. I'm not. I love her. She's good, kind, brave, strong, smart and caring and deserves all the good things in the world. Including a good character development, which she's having from the beginning.

I like how you said El having the strong morals she has, despite having grown up in that terrible environment, is a strength of her character. 100% agree.

[lighthouseas]

Thoughts on st s4 v2

I know this blog is slowly turning into a stranger things blog but I have a lot of thoughts lol

Obviously, major s4 spoilers under the cut so be warned.

JOPPER KISS JOPPER CANON LET’S GOOOOOOOO

If Max dies I’m literally going to jump out of a window /hj but seriously when she was like “I’m not ready to die” I almost screamed like my poor baby jeez.  I don’t think she’ll die though just because idk why they would drag it out into the next season if they were just gonna kill her off

LUCAS MY BOY.  He deserves WAY more credit than he gets.  Lumax for the win

Yes finally Brenner is dead I hated him

Jason is also dead which is great

I CALLED Eddie dying y’all.  He was an okay character imo but he was gonna die at some point.  Especially when he and Dustin had that whole emotional convo I knew.  I KNEW.  I’m sad about how Hawkins treats him though.  That really fucking sucks. He deserved better.

Jonathan is still partially evaporated.  That Jancy reunion was half-assed and they acted like they were about to get divorced 

Ok so.  I saved this for last because...uh well.  The whole thing with Will...obviously, he’s VERY gay for Mike and for whatever reason the writers decided not to have him come out, but hey, maybe we’ll get that in the next season.  But also do take into account that this was the 80s.  I’m not saying gays didn’t exist back then, but it was a hell of a lot more dangerous to come out then than it is now (not saying it isn’t still dangerous, but y’know).  Maybe he wasn’t ready, but at the very least, it was strongly implied.  

Also, to those who wanted Byler to become canon...I’m sorry.  As a writer myself I knew from the start it wasn’t gonna happen.  Writers don’t just establish relationships like those of El and Mike and then randomly drop it for some other fan-favorite ship.  It just doesn’t happen.  I’m not talking in favor of Mileven, nor am I talking in favor of Byler.  I’m just being realistic here- it wasn’t gonna happen.  All of that hype for Byler- it was most likely just to promote the show since basically everyone knows how popular the ship is and the actors, producers, and everyone else hyping it up meant that more people would swarm to see the episodes, which means more money for them.  Yeah, it sucks, but unfortunately, that’s the entertainment industry for you.  

HOWEVER.  I do agree what they did to Will’s character was shitty.  Really shitty.  On his own, Will has so much potential, but they’re reducing him to literally just a little weak gay boy who has spidey sense.  He deserves to be happy- he’s been through literal hell every season and to top it off, he has unrequited feelings for his best friend.  I really don’t know why they feel the need to do that to him since he’s such a good person, but hopefully, that will be resolved in s5.  I’m begging you, Stranger Things, PLEASE give Will the arc he deserves- not a dumbass arc where he just suffers and is in pain.  My poor boy doesn’t deserve that.

Last thing- there’s still a lot of questions I have about everything, which I’m really hoping are answered in season 5.  I hope they’re able to tie up any loose ends, but you never know.  At this point, especially with all of the angry fans at the moment, it’s a make or break.  To be completely honest, I’m excited to see how everything plays out.

[itsonlystrange]

Since it’s the end of November, (literally 11:55pm as I’m writing this)

Here are my stranger things Hot Takes for No Nuance November!

Please respect my opinion :)

1. Billy is a racist and I don’t understand how ppl love him so much. He shouldn’t be idolized at all.

2. Steve would never date Billy after Billy assaulted Lucas, Max, and verbally assaulted almost everyone else. They’re enemies. Not enemies to lovers, just enemies

3. Btw Billy is dead lol, atleast I think he is.

4. Mike loves Will more than Will loves Mike

5. Season 3 wasn’t scary at all and I honestly wasn’t on the edge of my seat like i had been in prior seasons

6. Season 2 is superior. Not because of Byler. But because of the development we get, Bob, Max, autumn vibes, El being her own person, Kali, etc.

7. Season 3 is my least favorite. It just really missed the nail on the head for me.

8. Mileven would have been cute if season 3 never existed. I was fine with them being canon but then s3 ruined them

9. Hopper and Joyce would never work out as a married couple irl

10. Hopper was a horrible character In season 3 and a misogynist

11. Bob only died so that Joyce could end up with Hopper

12. Lucas is the most underrated party member

13. Lucas is Lowkey a misogynist

14. I love Lumax but it’s toxic that they’ve broken up six times in 6 months. I can’t see them getting married or being end game

15. We deserve Dr Brenner flash backs

16. Season 2 had the best monsters

17. Will’s bowl cut is adorable

18. El shouldn’t be in a relationship when she didn’t even know what a friend was when she was 12

19. Nobody is the main character. It’s an ensemble show

20. If el didn’t have powers most of the fandom wouldnt like her as much as they do

21. El is a phenomenal character but she gets stunted when she’s with Mike

22. If any of the kids are gonna do drugs, it’s gonna be Max or Mike

23. Will already has powers. Sensing the MF is literally a superpower how are we all ignoring that

24. Byler isn’t just a “fanon” ship that could never be canon. It has a huge possibility and it’s v possible.

25. Why does suzie even exist in the first place??

26. Dustin is the smartest out of the party

27. Dustin and Steve In s3 was basically just comic relief and I really wish they dug deeper into their characters

28. S1 e4, s2e6, s3e7 are the best episodes of stranger things

29. Season 1 was the scariest, season 2 was the most captivating, and season 3 was the saddest

30. I want Mike to be the next one to get possessed

31. Nancy can be a bit of a priss and she acts v privileged at times

32. The best sibling is Jonathon 100%

33. The best mom is Joyce

34. The best dad is Hopper (if that counts?)

35. Erica deserves to be more than just comic relief. She became a little repetitive

36. Season 3 feels more of a parody or a spin off instead of an actual continuation of seasons 1 and 2

37. The aesthetic and colors of s3 DO NOT fit the show at all. It felt so cheesy

38. Max is bisexual

39. Mike and Will are gay. I’m still unsure if Mike is bisexual or not but for now I believe he is gay

40. If el can’t decide what type of clothes she likes she shouldn’t be able to decide if she likes mike

41. One of the kids will die by the end of season 5. I have a feeling it’ll be El or Dustin

42. One of the teenagers will die by the end of s4 I think. (Robin, Steve, Nancy, Jonathon)

43. Every couple has had a cute moment but that doesn’t mean they aren’t toxic for eachother

44. Mike loves el but he isn’t IN love with her

45. El doesn’t have to die for Mileven to not be end game

46. I don’t think any of the Byers will die ever. I could be wrong, but they’ve just been through so much already.

47. Ok maybe Lonnie will die

48. My least favorite sibling is probably Erica or Holly

48 my least favorite mom is probably Terry- just bc we don’t know a ton abt her

49. My least favorite dad is ofc Lonnie

50. El Max was one of the best friendships of s3

51. El and hoppers reunion will be better than Hopper and Joyce’s

52. El and Max’s reunion will be better than Mike and El’s

53. Mike and Will’s reunion will be better than Mike and El’s

54. The four main boys reunion will be adorable oh my god

55. Mike is Christian, Lucas is catholic, Dustin is atheist, Max is atheist/Catholic, El is atheist, and Will is Jewish/Christian/atheist. Idk those are the vibes I get

56. Lucas and Dustin are straight

57. And finally, WE NEED MORE PETS IN STRANGER THINGS. GIVE DUSTIN A NEW CAT

[hawkinsschoolcounselor]

Not sure if this has been asked before, but what are your ideal endgame pairings? Obviously Byler, but what about Jancy and Jopper? Do you want them to end up together or not? If so, how do you want their relationships to be improved/built upon? Do you want them to introduce girlfriends for Robin and/or Steve? For El to stay single? What about Lumax and Duzie? Etc.

The thing about the established relationships we’ve seen so far is that they aren’t very good. Even Lucas and Max have a very rocky relationship and have broken up five times. Or is it six now? Did they actually break up during season 3? It’s typical of young relationships, and I think we shouldn’t get too attached to them as a couple. I think the best case realistic scenario is they break up but manage to stay good friends.

Jonathan and Nancy have some major individual issues that are getting in the way. Neither one fully appreciates what the other has going on. If their relationship is going to work, they both need to acknowledge and appreciate that the other has real problems they deal with. Nancy needs to respect that Jonathan has to go around without a financial safety net and has childhood father issues. Jonathan needs to respect that Nancy is trying to thrive in a male-dominated field and doesn’t come from an openly loving home. 

Hopper and Joyce both have issues as well that get in the way. Hopper’s marriage had fallen apart after his daughter’s death. Joyce had her own failed marriage and then a great relationship with Bob that ended tragically. I don’t think either one has been able to deal with those issues yet. They both need to be able to confront and work through these parts of their pasts, especially since it seems they both tried to bury them. We see Hopper’s fear of loss when he lashes out at El and Joyce. He’s more scared than he is angry. He’s tried so hard to not get attached again, but he did, and now he’s afraid of something happening. I think they can be good for each other, but they need to deal with their pasts first.

I want to see Robin and Steve happy, but I don’t see the need to create ladies for them to be with unless it fits the plot somehow. A good friendship can be as fulfilling as a romantic relationship.

Dustin and Suzie is unlikely to work long-term. They’re long distance and very young. Either one of those alone is usually enough to say a relationship will eventually end. What little we see of them is (sickeningly) cute, but they’ll both be better off with someone they can actually be with. Remember, Suzie’s Mormon parents are an obstacle, as well.

El is an interesting case. She deserves to be happy as much as anyone else. We see that her relationship with Mike is not what it seems. They’re both really just going through the motions in their own way. She deserves someone she genuinely loves and who genuinely loves her. The problem is, and I know I’ve brought this up before, relationships depend on open communication. How is El supposed to tell anyone about her life and have them believe her? The same would go for everyone else, but El also has the added details of having grown up as a lab experiment with superpowers. How many people would up and leave, thinking that she’s crazy? Even if they did believe her, they might decide it’s all just too much. Maybe they’ll introduce someone, and hopefully it won’t feel contrived, who can make her happy. I don’t think everyone needs someone to feel fulfilled, but I think the fans would go ballistic if El ended up alone.

[fuck-mygayisshowing]

Headcanons on how Mrs. Harrington reacts to her son's boyfriends and kids: Jonathan/Billy/Steve

Jonathan: She knew Joyce in school, so she's predisposed to liking him. She's doubly happy that he's not at all like Lonnie, and that he's a good friend to Steve. When she hears about the fight at the Hawk, she yells at Steve first and Jon can hardly understand any of the actual words, then she offers Jon a hot cocoa or food. She shows her hand when she very calmly explains that if he hurts her son when he doesn't deserve it, she'll come after him.

Billy: oh god this one's worse! She's been made well aware of Billy's actions, and the first thing she does when he introduces himself is slap him. She's not calm like she was with Jonathan, because not only was Steve in the wrong in their fight, Steve hadn't blacked out. She tells Billy, very sternly and with way too much anger for a 5'4" tall woman, that if he ever does that again, she has connections to some very powerful people. She's shocked when Billy replies that if that happened, he would let her. After that, the two of them get along fairly well. She knows a lot of things you wouldn't think, and Billy's able to keep up when she talks about really old books.

The Kids

Dustin: She meets him first because let's be honest, he and Steve are practically brothers. She let's him ramble about his scientific discoveries, or some theory, and actually pitches in. Dustin then starts begging Steve to call her practically every day she's away, and won't leave the house when she's home. Steve makes a joke that Dustin no longer loves him, and Dustin eases up a little, but not without snark. Steve taught him too well.

Will: Again, Mrs. Harrington knew Joyce, and thankfully, she doesn't have to worry about smothering Will. She's had..practice being distant when she doesn't want to be. When Will gets more comfortable, she asks him about his latest campaigns in D&D, and supervises them playing if they're all in the same place. Will makes an NPC based off her, which he transfers to a proper character sheet when she asks to play a one-shot with them.

El: Billy's favorite of the kids. El doesn't trust her at first, she knows Mrs. H has hurt Steve before, not like Papa or Neil, but close enough to her. Mrs. H has to work harder to build up a relationship with her, and eventually they break through. She teaches El more feminine things Max didn't want to, and even starts making her clothes as birthday and Christmas gifts. Some of them don't even look real, but El had asked and she got what she wanted.

Max: it's actually easier than she thought it would be. Max knew she was hardly ever around, so she wasn't a threat. However, Steve let it slip one night what she had said to Billy, and Max gives a threat of her own. If she hurts Billy, Max has her own connections.

Mike: she tries, really she does. But Mike is just so contrary to everything! She tries to be nice and he claims it's a trick, and that she's going to hurt Steve more when she abandons him again. She tries to keep her distance, but he gets that look on his face and it makes her conflicted. He eventually caves, saying he'll be nice because Dustin won't shut up about her, and maybe he thinks she's a little cooler when she plays that one shot with them.

Lucas: he's the easiest to get along with, as long as she's not acting high and mighty, he doesn't have a problem.

Erica: how is she related to Lucas? Well, actually that's obvious, they're both a bit self centered and a little oblivious to other people. But by god, this girl. If she isn't a politician in 20 years, Mrs. H will be surprised.