#how the game says ''as long as we're together we can do anything'' (paraphrased) and abt how bees dad isn't there anymore

[welcometogrouchland]

Thinking abt how in lazy in space bee was raised on video games that taught her how to spell, defend herself, etc and how the cooking game we saw deckard play congratulates him even after he burns the cake, and how much that might play into why bee is the way she is

[jackienautism]

hi again!! hope you're having a good one. and yeah that is my icon :)

i do play things pretty fast SDKDFLS i've found that if i don't like. race through as fast as possible i'll end up leaving things unfinished for forever. glances at my p5 playthrough and glances away LOL. played practically nonstop, hit okumura's palace, had to leave my pc for a long weekend, and just. never picked the game back up again whoops

YEAHHH eagle among lions is like. my most anticipated fic that i put on the read later list SDJFLKSD i'm saving it for once i finish all the routes to make up for the fact that i won't have any more routes to play hahah. and HMM... i thinkk the fics that i'd most recommend are child of light by riahk, ghosting by greyimperia, homeroom (or, if we're not recruited in 15 minutes, we're legally allowed to leave) by Schistosity, and let the devil in by greyimperia. which are, respectively, a mercedes character study (speaking of mercedes, she has absolutely rocketed up my rankings. i love her), a linhardt character study, byleth recruits everyone possible (barring hilda) on a blue lions run so edelgard, hubert, claude and hilda have homeroom together and develop a friendship, and uh. not super sure how to describe the last one? but i liked it! it's a one-shot about the lords. inspired by we know the devil if you've played that game.

funnily enough none of those are the time travel fics i've read but i can't like. seem to find the best ones i read?? i didn't spend a ton of time looking through my history tho so if i find them later i'll send another ask lol.

yeah i definitely get that :/ haven't experienced that Too much yet with fe3h but i'm sure once i start searching for more specific dynamics barely anything's gonna turn up :(

YEAH. YEAH ON THE INGRID STUFF. idk maybe im overreacting or misremembering stuff but i feel like since we're both saying similar stuff i'm probably not like. seems like the nightmare scenario! idk it also really bothers me that sylvain and ingrid's paired ending is like. mostly about sylvain's political situation and then tacks on at the end "and he couldn't have done it without his wife and they had many kids" (paraphrased) like. okay :| uncomfortable!

and yeah the game sort of plays up the whole. ingrid as the one responsible for sylvain and felix but it's REALLY the fan emphasis on that that i've seen which bothers me. like they reallyyy like to shove her into the mom friend archetype. idk.

yeah berniegard is semi popular!! i definitely have some art of them in my queue sdjfls. i thought their b and c supports were pretty standard and enjoyable, but their a support (which i've now seen lol) was really good. not one of my absolute favorites, but definitely up there! i can see why this pairing is popular.

MAN. YEAH on the marianne supports thing. AND. YEAH about dorothea and marianne..... as soon as i noticed that they both had themselves in their dislikes my mind IMMEDATELY went to their potential dynamic.. i also really like a potential marianne/edelgard dynamic just based off of her dialogue about edelgard in cf??? like i'm gonna be mad forever about their nonexistant support chain. also marianne and mercedes.. those two were always at the cathedral praying you're telling me they couldn't have a conversation about faith? and like. mercedes can Read people and she has a desire to help people.. the supports could've been so good.... similarly i think dorothea and mercedes should've had a support chain. and mercedes and edelgard. maybe i'm just shoving my favorite girls together in different combinations but like. the potential is there who can blame me!! and YEAHH you're absolutely right about marianne and lysithea!! genuinely it feels like the a support is missing for those two :/

and yeah despite having sylvain attack felix i didn't even get their special dialogue :( apparently you can only get that one on CF and not VW? well. there's always next CF run :) and yeah that was where mercedes showed up! the caspar linhardt dialogue is. sad. as is the mercie annette dialogue which i also didn't get? that one, based off the wiki, it seems Can occur at the gronder battle on VW, but maybe because they were fighting i didn't get it?? not sure. but i watched it on youtube and it makes me sooo sad. but truly NOTHING makes me sadder than having dorothea kill ferdie especially considering her monastary dialogue after???? awful. petra and edie have the standard eagle vs edelgard dialogue but i feel like petra's political position makes her landing a hit on edelgard like. extra juicy lol. i would've had dorothea also do it but a) she was too far away and b) i still felt bad for having her kill ferdinand.

YEAH SDJFDLDKJ I WAS. not expecting to s support sylvain LMAO but. well! it's kind of funny i made the decision IMMEDIATELY after waking up from getting my wisdom teeth out??? like i was telling my mom about it in the waiting room they put you in before letting you leave. so i'm gonna say s supporting sylvain was a side effect. i did end up enjoying his s support + paired ending though!

as for silver snow, i thinkk you get to keep your class, barring edelgard and hubert? and YEAH it's that particular bond that i sort of envisioned when i first played cf and got to the branching path (as well as seeing dorothea's character shift post-timeskip) that largely held me back from s supporting her on vw. and YEAH the incentive is for SURE needed. i do notttt want to side against edie :(( and i haven't enjoyed siding with the church!! but i hear you get a lot of insight into byleth on that route and i am interested to see all that for myself.

YEAH ashe and marianne can support and it's very sweet! which makes sense since i mean. it's ashe and marianne. caspar and annette's supports, without going into spoilers, do a good job of showing caspar in a more like... competent/insightful light which i've found tend to be my favorite caspar supports. like yeah he's great for comedy but i like when he's taken seriously. and their dynamic is very sweet as well. and yeah shamir is a former mercenary i think?? yeah a lot of leonie's endings are. not the greatest? without spoiling specifically, either she's with someone i do Not want her to be with, it doesn't seem in-line with where her character would naturally progress, or it's just very bittersweet? but her ending with shamir was super in character and seemed relatively happy so. and YEAH i get that for leonie i wasn't really sold on her until post timeskip really? i think also the fact that i'd seen a lot of hate for her beforehand had me prepared for her to like do something bad or be Super annoying and then when she was like. fine. i was like huh i think im gonna like her more. out of spite.

im honestly a major fan of a lot of the nonromantic paired endings but this one was just.. i really think it was the fact that maya was completely offscreen that bothered me. and the fact that their supports weren't like, majorly about her?

yeah annette's songs are sooo silly i love her sense of whimsy and her dynamic with mercedes is sweet! weirdly enough i like their dynamic outside of their supports more than i like the supports themselves, with just the two of them hanging around the monastery together + their dialogue in azure moon cutscenes and stuff. their supports weren't bad or anything, i just felt like their fight was a little awkwardly pulled off, and i feel like there's probably more substance you can get from a potential support chain for these two considering they're one of a handful of duos who have a close history before the monastery.

and ah i get that and i hope that if you want to play the game more, you get the chance to!

i ended up recruiting ferdinand, bernie, leonie, marianne and raphael. planning to get dorothea as soon as i raise my charm! i'm alsooo raising linhardt to b support and if he asks to join my class i'll let him, but i'm not raising the reason skill to get him lol. i kind of want to recruit him bc i miss him, but i don't want too many recruits, so my compromise is leaving it up to chance.

as for hilda.. yeah her supports with byleth have her mentioning a LOT that she just. doesn't get the concept of dying for someone else. and then if you kill her in cf i think claude says something about how he told her to retreat.... much to think about. i think that may have been my biggest character defining moment for her, but i also loveee all of her supports where people sort of. see through her in a way? so her a support with claude and her b support with sylvain are some of my favorites (and she absolutely reads them right back which. again. i love that). and i'd consider those sort of character defining moments for her as well, if not to the same degree and not quite the same thing.

YEAH LMAO LORENZ... i feel like. i definitely see hints of what could be redeeming qualities in him but like... yeah. eventually i'll go through all of his supports, because it's not like i Like disliking potentially interesting characters but like. the dude does NOT make a good impression.

YEAHHHH THE SUNSET MOMENT WAS SO GOOD.... so was the part of their c support where marianne like. apologized for being a bad conversationalist and ignatz was like. "there's no need to apologize, if we'd been talking we would've missed these flowers!!" like. idk ignatz isn't a standout character to me but he's so sweet.. like that's my friend ignatz!! yeah annette and claude have supports!! featuring more of annette's singing. and claude singing i think! they're fun. YEAH SDJKSD sylvain's supports are pretty interesting across the board. and i def get why he wouldn't be your cup of tea LMAO, like.. based on your blog, he doesn't really line up with the sorts of characters you usually seem to get attached to lol. but yeah his supports usually do a good job of showing a different side of his character than much of his other dialogue, especially in the early game (can't speak for post timeskip am obviously). idk there are maybe three characters i got Really attached to before actually playing their route and he's one of them. the others being marianne, mostly due to her paralogue, and annette honestly just based off of general vibes once i'd recruited her.

YEAH CLAUDE AND MARIANNE'S A SUPPORT.... idk i really love how he goes from pushing her a bit to recognizing her boundaries and instead offering reassurance and understanding without crossing them.... so sweet. and YEAH marianne on the end art makes me soooo happy. yeah leonie and claude's.... b support i want to say?? was the two of them discussing religion and stuff and at the end claude's like "hm some people might call this conversation sacrilegious huh" and leonie's like "yeah probably. good thing i don't care and won't tell anyone though" and i just thought that was fun. MAN YEAH marianne laughing at the end of her and hilda's supports was The highlight of that support chain to me....

thank you i am enjoying the lions route so far!! playing white clouds for the third (kind of the fourth, if you count me watching my brother's playthrough lol) time in like. a month? month and a half? idk how long it's been actually.... ok checked and it's been a few days past a month?wow. anyway. playing it That many times has gotten me moving through it a bit slower, although i did play quite a bit today and i've gotten to chapter seven :) i am enjoying the lions! i could see before that white clouds was lions centric in a lot of ways but. man. it is sooo lion centric. i'm not like, super complaining about it? i mean. sylvain annette and mercedes are all probably in my top 5 characters. i am really liking dedue, ashe is sweet, i have Some complicated feelings surrounding ingrid but she is SO interesting to me (man her relationship with knighthood plus the ways you can view her character thru lenses of gender and sexuality..... what a character). while felix isn't my favorite he's still very well written and interesting. and honestly i'm enjoying dimitri more than i thought i would? idk my initial impression of him was very meh and then due to like. the way a lot of people who hateeee edie like. LOVE him gives me the kneejerk reaction of oh well i'm not gonna like this guy. but i'm enjoying him so far! he's like, middle of the pack of the lions for me, but that's still pretty good all things considered.

and man. side note because if i let myself get into it for real i'll get frustrated but. goddd the takes i've seen about edie just going through her character tag........ awful. i've blocked sooo many people already SDFJSL.

YEAH. i do NOTT enjoy siding with the church. eugh. i'm probably not gonna do another replay soon after i finish this playthrough, my silver snow run, and my second cf run, so either i play cf again first (because i miss edelgard and hubert and i don't like the church) or i play silver snow first so that i don't leave off on like. a silver snow playthrough LMAO. who knows.

anyway! i'm torn this playthrough between s supporting dimitri and mercedes because well. mercedes is self explanatory (i love her), and dimitri has the appeal of being like. central to the story as the lord? the thing is i probably won't replay am for a WHILE after this, if i do at all, so this is like my Shot to s support him? and i like seeing the supports myself rather than watching them on youtube or something. so i'm probably gonna do that, assuming i keep enjoying his character well enough (because like. based off of fanart and uh. the general vibes of my last playthrough, his character shifts post-timeskip). and then i'll probably end up s supporting mercedes on my next cf run :) because other than mercie (and dorothea obviously) i think the only other character i really want to s support is hubert?? and like i love him don't get me wrong but. mercie outranks him. and i will probably replay cf a third time eventually because that's probably gonna be my default route on subsequent replays once i've experienced everything once. still who knows how things will shake out i mean. last time i said i wasn't gonna s support sylvain and then. look what happened. so we'll see.

not too much going on with my playthrough other than that! i mean. it's white clouds a fourth time. not too many things to say about that. mercedes cheerfully supporting church sanctioned executions caught me off guard like. that was funny. i disagree with her on that but i did burst out laughing the delivery was sooo funny for what she was saying. and annette is fun in the lions cutscenes :) and as for supports... I LOVE DEDUE...... his supports with annette are so sweet so far, as are his supports with ashe.. liked the sylvain dedue c support as well! liked annette and dimitri's c support.. OH ingrid and ashe's c support is SOOO good. i got leonie and bernadetta's c support for the first time and it was surprisingly good for a duo i did not expect to have supports. similarly, i got felix and leonie's c support for the first time and liked it. im probably blanking on some of the supports i've gotten but like. idk. these are the ones i remember enjoying!

anyway yeah :) thanks again for talking with me about this game, it's so much fun and i'm loving hearing your thoughts!! i hope you have a good one :)

HIII hope youre having a good one too!!!! as per usual :D and okay ! hope you dont mind that i mentioned it

and AH okay i see, i can def see that! hopefully you still enjoy the thing you're racing through just as much though? im sure you do but! and rip to your p5 playthrough</3 speaking of, the same thing bascially happened to me FKNDKF except i wasnt nearly as far as you. i should get back to it. GOOD LUCK W/ GETTING BACK INTO IT IF YOU EVER DO THOUGH!!!!

YESSS THATS SO VALID..... ITS DEF A HEFTY ONE BUT ITS LIKE???? PLAYING THE GAME AGAIN SO THATS VERY COOL. the descriptions and writing style are simply brilliant and auugh couldnt recommend it enough. it seriously is like going through the game again w/ like. slight variations. it's so neat. and thank you very much for the recommendations ! ill def have to chekc those out at some point. i just recently finally made a ao3 acc (which i assume those are on? hopefully?) so i can finally interact w/ fics more properly :] GLAD THAT MERCIE SKY ROCKETED ON YOUR RANKINGS. I LOVE HER DEARLY.... and the one w/ the homeroom seems very interesting (eyeballs) love to read abt those dynamics

no worries man! i already appreciate you sharing the ones you remember :D its all good if you can't find them / you forget though!

yeah</3 its very unfortunate. bc the potential is there but there's!!!! literallt nothing for them! and its sad. im glad it hasnt happened for you for fe3h yet, and hopefully it never does!!!!! and its not a fun feeling <//3 esp since that means you gotta make your own stuff and dfkndf gthats a lot of WORK

NO FOR REAL. I WONT LIE I FEEL LIK EIM MISREMEMBERING / OVERREACTING AS WELL BUT... AS YOU SAID. SINCE WERE BOTH ON THE SAME PAGE I /DOUBT/ WE'RE DOING ANY OF THOSE THINGS. but seriously.....it DOES seem like a nightmare scenario. to be used for a political situation mainly and then on top of that have kids ? like??? thye both hate being used for their crests and yet they have kids ????????? idk if that makes sense. hopefully what /I/ said makes sense though. i just feel it seems very......blegh. for both of them. bc doesnt that just continue the cycle? of crests and shit? idk man. but you're right. that is uncomfortable!\

NO FOR REAL. THEY LOVE TO SHOVE HER INTO THE MOM FRRIEND ARCHETYPE BC THATS ALL THEY KNOW WHAT TO DO W/ FEMALE CHARACTERS😭😭😭😭 AND IT SUUUUUCKS. esp when theres so much to do w/ ingrid..... but nah shes stops the boys from doing dumb shit! ive noticed that this is a trend :///// i hate fandom! anywho. youre right. the fan perception of their dynamic is just. SIGHS. i GET that ingrid and sylvain's supports play into that but just..... theyre both so much more than that

OOOOH NICE NICE.... looking forward to seeing those pieces (eyeballs) cant wait to see their A support now!!!! i mustve gotten their C and possibly B support before but i honestly cant remember its been so long. thank u for hypingg it up for me

DOROTHEA AND MARIANNE'S DYNAMIC WOULD BE SO..... IT WOULD BE SO CUTE I THINK...... esp since dorothea seems to rly enjoy hyping ppl (esp the girls) up... and thats absolutely something marianne needs and deserves. plus dorothea is pretty emotionally aware and has her own experience w/ depression (esp post timeskip) so i feel they can both bond over that......if that makes sense. i just love the m so much. YESSS I FORGET THE SPECIFIC DIALOGUE BUT I REMEMBER MARIANNE MENTIONING SOMETHING ABT EDIE'S STRENGTH OR SOMETHING IN CF?? YOURE SO RIGHT WE WERE ROBBED OF THAT..... ooohh im actually so interested in that now. AND NO YOURE SO RIGHT ABT MARIANNE AND MERCEDES..... THEY ABSOLUTELY COULDVE COMPLEMENTED EACH OTHER NICELY...... esp mercedes potentially helping marianne w/ her burdens and just Understanding that there was something that was always bothering her.... so good. YOURE JUST PAIRING UP ALL MY FAVES TOO 😭😭 i wouldve loved to see dorothea and mercedes.... i dont understand why but i just feel it wouldve been so fun and interesting. YOURE SO RIGHT THOUGH, THE POTENTIAL BETWEEN ALL THE CHARACTERS ARE ABSOLUTELY THERE !!!!! I CAN DEF SEE IT W/ EDIE AND MERCIE TOO.... AND THERES NOTHING WRONG W/ WANTING TO SEE ALL YOUR FAVE GIRLS TOGETHER DFKGNFDG I FEEL THAT SO HARD. also some MAY have come true in three hopes? since they did add new support chains but (shrugs) im not sur ewhich ones they added and which ones they didnt

and oh yeah? i had no idea that it was only on CF.... but i suppose that makes a little sense? hm. sorry you werent able ot get it your VW run though </3 and okay! thank you! ill def have to get those 2 dialogue exchanges at some point... unsure if ill get it myself since ill prob jsut endd up hurting mysself but LOL ill prob search them up and watch them that way. sorry you didnt get annette or mercie's either though :/ and ooooh maybe? but i feel like the game maybe wouldn't have taken that into account but! who knows. OHHH GOSH I THINK IVE SEEN DOROTHEA'S LINE ABT KILLING FERDIE IN THE MONASTERY BEFORE.... ill have to look at it again but ): AND OHH I DIDN TREALIZE THERE WAS A SPECIAL THING FOR AN EAGLE VS EDIE..... i thought what i got was just a standard thing😭 thank u for telling me! but no youre right, petra political standing makes it That much better. and abt dorothea. YEAH FAIR. she can only take so much<///3

YOU CAME TO THE DECISION AFTER GETTING YOUR WISDOM TEETH OUT????? LMAOO THATS SO FUNNY TO ME..... good for you though 😭😭😭😭 AND NOT S SUPPORTING SYLVAIN BEING A SIDE EFFECT OF THE ANESTHESIA LMAO that made me laugh thank you for that. but im glad it worked out well in the end! and that you enjoyed the S support and dtheir ending ofc

AND OH. THATS VERY GOOD TO HEAR THEN. i was afraid that you wouldnt be able to keep the rest of the eagles.... and tbh if that were the case, itd make things tTHAT much angstier for me which i hate but also love yk. and yeah makes sense! i rly enjot that concept w/ byleth and dorothea on silver snow... i love it a lot actually. it makes sense too. yeah ): i feel that, i dont wanna side against edie either. doing VW and AM are already a lot for me lol and yeah man. FUCK the church for real. i guess thats another incentive to play SS which is nice, bc byleth as a protag is sort of ...... eh for me. mainly bc they seem like such a blank slate ):

TRUEEE .marianne and ashe are both super sweet they r very good, so i can only imagine how well they r together. and oooooh yeah? im glad they have some of those moments for caspar then... and that his and annette's supports shine a light on that side of him! def can not wait to watch them myself. of course comedic / comedy characters are needed and deserved and stuff but like...like you said, its nice when theyre taken seriously. esp if their whole Thing is being the "goofy" / "unserious" one yk. yeah shamir being a former mercenary sounds right but i couldnt remember. and oh yeah? i didnt realize that a lot of leonie endings were Bad. ive only looked at her and ignatz's but i cant remember it much. bu tmmm, i see. i dont rly think abt leonie much / im not that attached to her so its interesting to see what you think! sorry that most of her endings fall into 1 of those 3 categories :/ glad that her ending w/ shamir was one of if not th ebest one for her!!! LMAO i didnt realize ppl hated / disliked her? i thought hjer whole thing w/ jeralt towards byleth was a tad annoying pre timeskip but i twasnt enough for me to straight up HATE her yk.... so thats interesting. i didnt know any of that. PLEASE like her more out of spite. i love doing that w/ female characters. esp if the hate they get is overdramatic or undeserved

no yeah i totally get that. it doesnt make sense to throw her in there when there wasnt any sort of ..... establishment of her and ignatz's relationship? like. im pretty sure she was the girl that got ignatz to pursue art since he drew something for her but. thats sort of it right? so youre right, there was absolutely no point in throwing her in there other than to FURTHER not make his and raph's ending romantic

HER SONGS R RLY SILLY !!!! and i lvoe how that was like a focal point of her and felix's supports. they were quite cute actually dkfngdgf and that was like one of my first felix supports ever so my initial impression was that. oh! ok hes not that much of an asshole! i was wrong lmao. hes an interesting character and all and i understand where hes coming from but just. yeah man idk. but all that aside, his supports w/ annette were fun and cute. but no youre absolutely right abt mercie and annette, their fight didnt seem ? realistic whatsoever. like i get it but ????? was that something shed legitimately get upset and say they weren't friends over? and you're right, there was def a lot more that couldve been done considering they met so long ago. i DID however like how annette was like. in their A support. mentioning stuff like "ohh now dont say anything like how you dont deserve good things!" or something along the lines of that and like...i think it gives us a little more insight into mercie's character and why she does what she does

i dont remember what i said but i def want to play more! its just <////3 i wanna enjoy the experience and things havent been as enjoyable for me lately yknow? so im waiting for a time that i DO and CAN enjoy things again. but who knows when that'll be LMAO hopefully after this vacation ill be able to get back into viddy games as a whole :]

ah okay! so the recruits are rather balanced, aside from the black eagles (as it should be)! good luck raising your charm to get dorothea the beloved!!!! and hopefully linhardt randomly chooses to join your class...i enjoy when the characters come to you in the middle of the week to ask. its cute. its a fair compromise, but ill be over here secretly hoping that he does join your class!

AH okay so it was in hildas supports w/ byleth... its been. a LOOOONG time since i watched most of byleth's supports w/ the golden deer, so im not too shocked that i forgot abt that. ANDOOHHH RIGHT I THINK I REMEMBER CLAUDE SAYING THAT ABT HILDA TOO..... that's so ): it rly shows the bond shes created w/ claude fr. and thats real sweet. oooo i didnt realize that sort of seeingf through the mask thing happens w/ sylvain too. but i suppose it makes sense w/ sylvain...considering how he is and all. theyre both actually quite similar huh? theyre both a lot more perceptive than they let people believe. thats real cool. so thats nice that they have supports w/ each other , i didnt know that!

NO HE ABSOLUTELY DOESNT..... i just truly and honestly couldnt give less of a fuck about him. even if he does have potential to be cool and interesting. i just dgaf!!!!! have fun and good luck going through his supports though! maybe you;ll have a change of heart (you truly dont have to) but. eh. yeah

YESSS BOTH OF THOSE MOMENTS ARE SO SWEET.... and youre absolutely right abt ignatz. i didnt necessarily get attached to him but i LOVE what he is and what he is is certainly one of the sweeter characters. and i love that for him. AND OHH GOOD MORE ANNETTE SONGS YIPPEE DFGKNDFG def can not wait to see her and claude's supports then (eyeballs) esp if it features claude's singing too..... i can only imagine how fun the situations are. they definitely are! like. what made me change my mind a bit was absolutely sylvain's supports w/ dedue and his ones w/ annette as well. LMAOOO read me to filth <3 yeah he def isnt one of the characters i find myself getting attached to, so im not too surprised either. i enjoy him for he what he is, but other than that. yeah 😭 but yeah!!!! his supports def do a good job at showing a more ? impressive and intelligent side of him. you're right abt his pre timeskip dialogue though, cant say much abt his post timeskip stuff either. im sure theyre a biiiit better than pre TS but. who knows! marianne<3 my girl marianne.... he and annette are also very good choices though. annette's girlish whimsy is just super appealing

YESSSS.... you rly see a mature side of both claude and marianne and thats so cool.... and also seeing a bit more ? forceful and angrier side of marianne? so good. MARIANNE ON THE VERDANT WIND'S END ART MY BELOVED!!!!! i was so shocked when i first saw it but ouuugh i love it so much. AND AHH RIGHT OKAY... i totally forgot abt that. i just loove claudes overall distrust and shit in the goddess and church and whatnot. its so nice to see tbh. and i vaguely remember his convo w/ leonie being interesting as well! YESSSS MARIANNE DESERVES TO LAUGH AND BE HAPPY.... i just thought that moment was so sweet...i personally dont see their relationship as romantic but god... the besties

glad youre enjoying azure moon so far !!!! :D i know theres only sooo many divergences in plot and gameplay and dialogue and stuff so ! hopefully its not toooo grueling. i know we've already talked abt how quick you play games but GOSH 3/4 times in basically a month huh? good for you! and mmm makes sense that youd be going through it a little slower than usual, it IS your fourth / fifth time playing through so. take as much time as you neeeed yk? but up to chapter 7 already is super awesome! yeaaah white clouds is SUPER blue lions centric. im glad you dont hate it! bc i wont lie it rly pisses me off......esp seeing how LITTLE they gave edelgard and crimson flower. but thats just me! happy its been working for you :] OOOO wwho are your other top 5 characters? is dorothea among them? but anyway. yeah ingrid is jusr That character you know. i understand why ppl wouldn't like her, but her character is SOOO interesting to me. for the reasons that you mentioned pretty much. i find myself relating. and yeah i feel thaht for dimitri. i still dont rly care for him that much tbh. but i do feel bad for him and recognize that hes a cool and neat character (same w/ felix like you said) but i just...... yeah man idk dfkgndg plus as you said, id say the majority of edie haters SUUUCK his dick so its like.... man i jsut dont care enough yk. happy that hes been working for you though :D

YERAH I FEEL THAT LMAO. none of the characters are safe from shitty af takes (esp the girls) just recently went into the dorothea tag and was BOMBARDED by hate from this one loser. sorru that youve seen so many things just by going through her tag :/ i HAAATE wben ppl tag stuff like that w/ the main tag, ESP if its hate. pisses me off. but yeah. attleast theres filtering and blocking. ive just straight up blocked edie critical or fiuicking whatever already. sooo dumb!

NEITHER DO IIIII.... its always so painful for me kdfgfdg atleast most of the time rhea isnt there for when you're paired w/ the church? i understand shes a complex character or whatever but she rly reminds me of a cahracter from resident evil and she PISSES me off so basically i dont like either of them LMAO if it were me i'd probably do silver snow first, just so you end off on a good note yk? or maybe youll enjoy SS more than you think! who knows. but yeah id probably end off on crimson flower so it leaves a slightly better taste in your mouth

oooo very good choices... a ton of ppl certainly enjoy S supporting dimitri so i assume youre in for a treat! i understand wanting to S support the lord though since youre really only to support w/ them. during their route. and as you said, theyre very central to the story and whatnot. so yeah! and i TOOTALLY understand wanting to see the supports for yourself rather than watch them on youtube. im absolutely the same. so hope you enjoy going through w/ it ! AND YEAH LMAO HIS CHARACTER DOES RLY SHIFT POST TIMESKIP. but thats due to Mental Illness yk. he does have a recovery arc from what ive heard (that seems rushedd, just based on what an old friend told me) but yeah! hopefully you'll still go through w/ it post TS bc i do think its a good idea. mercie and hubie and dorothea <3 very good choices for S supports.... have fun w/ replaying and getting those last few S ranks!!!! youre gonna go w/ dorothea on silver snow and then probably mercie on another crimson flower run right? def sounds like a plan !!! CF as the default run makes so much sense to me LOL i absolutely feel the same. but you're right, who knows how things will pan out, do let me know what happens and if anything changes!!!!

yeah yeah! atleast the commentary from the blue lions is something different to look forward to during white clouds. and KFDGNDFG i thinki vaguely remember mercedes doing somethig like that but i cant remember exxaaaactly what she said. shes just so cheerful and shit i lovve her so much. but yeah. supporting the church's executions is a no no. GRRR I FORGET ABT DEDUE AND ANNETTE'S SUPPORTS.... it has something to do w/ cookingg right? and dedue helping her w/ that? DIDNT SOMETHING EXPLODE ON ANNETTE OR SOMETHING IN THEIR C SUPPORT? yesss his supports w/ ashe are very nice... so were his w/ sylvain. thats honestly what made me shift a bit in terms of opinion on sylvain. INGRID AND ASHE'S SUPPORTS ARE SOOO GOOD.... just 2 autistic ppl communicating abt a special interest.... OOOO leonie and bernie and leonie and felix huh? i had no idea they had supports.... and youre right i def wouldnt have expected either of them tbh! YEAAH no worries abt forgetting some, tjheres just sooo many that it makes sense not all of them will stick out in your mind

OF COURSE MAN !!!! THANK U FOR SHARING YOUR THOUGHTS W/ ME. ITS ALWAYS A TREAT TO READ WHAT YOUVE BEEN DOING AND WHATNOT!! and im glad my thoughts dont piss you off 😭 happy to hear that you enjoy hearing my thoughts as well :] bc i of course love hearing yours!!!!! hope you have a good one too!

[cerastes]

What do you make of Specter's operator record? Personally I liked it, but that's with the knowledge we're getting more Specter backstory soon.

Ok, so! Just as you pointed out, I went into it with the knowledge that:

We're getting Under TIDES soon.

Specter gets a second Operator Record later, some time after Under TIDES.

And with that in mind, I'm fine with it, but if I was a CN player and all we got was Specter's first Operator Record without any knowledge of the future, I would be pretty pissed, lmao. In fact, CN players were pretty pissed, the reception to her Operator Record was pretty bad. Specter is a popular character both in terms of gameplay and character (the latter more so in China, she gets a steady influx of cosplayers, fanart and fanfic in Weibo, Lofter, and such). It's believed that Hypergryph announced her second Operator Record because of this backlash.

Now, with the context and preamble on the table, I want to say: Great idea, not so great execution. Overall, I enjoyed it, but again, that's only with knowledge of the future. Despite that, I sincerely praise Hypergryph for actually having the balls to try a narrative approach like this one on a mobile game. The thing is, just because an idea is interesting doesn't mean it's good, and I think a lot of aspiring writers and designers need to hammer that in their head, especially armchair game designers that like to theorize oh so much about how cool it would be to have a game that did this or that. I don't care if it's cool or not, is it enjoyable to experience?

And that's just the thing with Specter's Operator Record: It felt lackluster in many regards. The approach was definitely interesting, bold, I'd even say, but that doesn't really matter too much if the result isn't a success, now, does it? Let's immediately address the Originium Slug in the room: Specter doesn't even appear in it. Now, is that an interesting approach to an Operator Record? Sure! Is it good? I don't really think so, especially with a character that fans really have been clamoring to see more of in actual cutscenes, given the wealth of clues they've put regarding Specter in other places:

Blue Poison' Files -> We learn that Blue Poison knew Specter personally before her descent to madness, addressing her with her real name.

Skadi's Dialogue -> Skadi implies that Specter was on a very important mission, and more or less confirms she knew her before she went crazy.

Several pieces of official art -> Specter is associated with the phrase "All seas are singing your name".

Ceobe's Fungimist -> It's implied the cursed painting depicting the end times is the same confusing painting Specter painted in her Token.

Rosmontis' Files -> It's confirmed that Specter's spinal cord is filed to the brim with originium fluid, and the Medical Team theorizes that, just like Rosmontis, her infection was artificially induced. It also confirms that they have no idea how Specter is able to fight such an insanely high level of infection.

So, see, this has been a character that fans have really been clamoring to see again. The only cutscene Specter's ever been is the secret cutscene of Grani and the Knight's Treasure AKA the very first event in the game. Understandably, after two years of the game existing, people were a bit miffed that once again we just get breadcrumbs and a non-participation 'appearance', to say the least, in what's supposed to be her day in the limelight.

Now, personally, I kind of get how they are handling her, and the Operator Records are a very faithful reflection of this: Specter is meant to be this mysterious force that we don't have clearance to know about, as Kal'tsit herself is the only one authorized to treat her or even enter her containment quarters. And, in this regard, I think the Records succeed:

It all starts innocently with Suzuran drawing Specter in a Secret Santa and then having to start deep diving to find out who the hell even IS Specter, because absolutely no one knows of her. Eventually, Suzuran lucks out by asking Meteorite, who did participate in a mission with Specter once, to which Suzuran immediately reacts: "Hey hold on, don't they send you on pretty dangerous missions all the time?", and Meteorite's answer is, "Yeah, and she's right at home there."

Now, this is really interesting because we, as Doctor, have some level of clearance: We know things about Specter and can even converse with her to a certain degree, because Doctor is a high authority in Rhodes Island, but the average Operator, like Suzuran, Aosta and Chiave, doesn't even know of her existence. She's one of Rhodes Island's well kept secrets, even within Rhodes Island. Even Meteorite, a veteran Sarkaz mercenary and a bombardment expert, only knows about Specter in a need-to-know basis (because they deployed once together). More telling is the fact that Meteorite doesn't think she'd get along with Specter, simply based on the fact that, just on that one operation, the level of violence and carnage brought upon by Specter unnerved even her, a Kazdel Sarkaz veteran. Well, to be precise, it's not the sheer level of destruction that Specter is capable of that unnerved Meteorite, it's the fact that she does it all seemingly without a care in the world, expressionless, soundless, simply following orders to the letter without showing or taking in a single emotion. To paraphrase Meteorite, "someone that can unleash such destruction and violence upon others so easily, and that can then just not mind it in the slightest, has something wrong and concerning going on with them, no doubt".

Next up, we also learn that Folinic has very restricted, also on a need-to-know basis access to Specter. Keep in mind that Folinic is extremely competent and not at all a stranger to danger: She handles Phantom. So this is a huge hint: There's perhaps more to the secrecy regarding Specter than just her being a dangerous, unstable element. Folinic could reasonably handle Specter professionally, but it's not about whether she can or not, it's about information, and this brings us back to Grani and the Knight's Treasure: Kal'tsit makes it clear to Skadi that Specter is, as a whole, inaccessible to everyone but her, that only she has clearance to access Specter's quarters. Keep in mind that Skadi does not operate in the same conditions, despite also being an Abyssal Hunter. In fact, it's well known that Skadi is infamous among other Operators for being unreasonable and obstructive in operations, as well as unapproachable outside of them (unless you are Grani, who managed to successfully befriend Skadi and vouches for her). There's things about Specter that are so sensitive, so important, that Kal'tsit can't risk them getting out, and even using her as an Operator is something reserved for very dangerous operations. Not even Warfarin, senior staff and Operator that's been with Rhodes Island for a very long time, has full access to Specter, but she clearly knows the importance of keeping her under curtains, given she immediately diffused the Folinic-Suzuran situation by coming up with a compromise on the spot.

There's another interesting contrast between Files and the Operator Record: Meteorite describes Specter as "dead silent". Mind you, we knew from before, thanks to Specter's Files, that the shark is completely silent in battle, but we also do know that she incoherently rambles quite a lot. Folinic sheds some light onto this, explaining that Specter intentionally stays silent most of the time so as to not say anything that could be misunderstood when around others. When she's in a more private setting, however, she does let loose with the insane talk. This is confirmation of something that had been hinted at before: Even though she's insane, there's a fervent part of her clinging onto sanity for dear life with bloodied, splintered fingers, and it manifests itself in how she'll never harm an ally, and how Specter is, to a certain degree, aware of how far gone she is, and thus keeps her mouth shut around others that aren't Doctor or Kal'tsit, so as to not spook them out or accidentally threaten them with her insane rambling.

Then, at the very end, after Suzuran managed to get her present to her, Specter does in fact deliver a thank you present back to Suzuran: A music box, consistent with Specter's love for the arts. Of course, the gift might have been chosen by a proxy of hers (Skadi or Blue Poison, both known to also enjoy music), but the message is all the same: Specter clearly appreciated the gift, and was mentioned to see an improvement in her condition after receiving the doll Suzuran gave her.

So, in paper? All of this? I love it. Of course I do, she's my favorite character, and it was such a bold way to present her Record, too, I respect them trying out new things, it managed to capture the essence of "the mysterious, terrifying fighting machine Operator they don't want us to know about that's actually a pretty sweet and decent person, just going through some really hard stuff" that they've been going for with Specter, it's just, I can also understand (and agree with) fans because... It's been two years, bwahaha, let us see her again, you know? It's her Operator Record, we've gotten some VERY good insights into the lives and days of other Operators through those, like with Angelina's or Kroos'! Of course we also wanted something like that, bwahaha.

What I would've loved, and what I think would've made it all better with fans, is if the final scene had Specter actually show up in Suzuran's room like the cryptid she is, with Suzuran noting the security door had just sort of been casually pried open, Specter's perpetual smile on her face as she's holding her thank you gift before Warfarin and Folinic just sort of storm into the room like "DUDE, WE SAID YOU CAN'T--", she thanks Suzuran wordlessly, gently hands her the music box, and then she calmly turns back and walks back to her confinement quarters.

But, yeah, I've gone on for long enough. I appreciate it overall, knowing what's coming, and I appreciate the idea, I just think they could've handled it better, but the whole essence and message of it, I think lands pretty nicely.

[dutchdread]

"The promised land, I think I can meet her there".

This article argues that it's unreasonable to see the line as a romantic gesture from Cloud, and that an alternative interpretation of the line as a comment concerning the impending doom is more likely. __________________________________________________

People try to use this to prove that Cloud wants Aerith ever since 1997. Now lets be clear here, this interpretation is patently absurd as soon as you think about it for more than 2 seconds. Do you really think for a second that Square would end the game with Cloud randomly telling Tifa as they're about to die, "you know what I want to tell you before we die? I don't love you and I'm glad I'm dying so I can be with another woman in the afterlife"? They wouldn't, this is the most unreasonable story interpretation I've ever heard, whatever that line is meant to mean, it wouldn't be that. Let's be clear here, the only people who think that this line is a genuine argument in favor of Clerith, are people who are already Cleriths. They see the line, and find it to be in line with their beliefs, and it is. The problem is that that's not how science is done. The question isn't whether or not a piece of evidence is in line with your point of view, it's whether it disproves the opposite point of view, which in this case it doesn't. (Also see: "The Wittgenstein test") It should be noted that arguments like these do not do Cleriths any favors, because in addition to proving nothing, they show something fundamentally problematic about the Clerith view of the story. In order to believe that this line in incompatible with a Cloti interpretation of the story, there are a number of tangentially related positions that you'd have to defend. 1: It's impossible to want to be reunited with anyone except if you love them romantically. 2: Cloud is an absolute asshole who would dump a woman he just had sex with, just as they're about to die. 3: Tifa is the worlds biggest simp. 4: This is how SE wants you to see their characters. In one fell swoop of a bad story interpretation you've undermined the importance of all other forms of love, you've undermined the importance of Clouds character arc concerning guilt. You've basically trampled on those who suffer from mental health issues by simplifying their issues into love cliches, you've made a villain of Clouds character, made a mockery of Tifas character, and revealed that you don't understand basic storytelling.

This is the fundamental problem with these arguments that cause many of us to develop a distinct distaste for Clerith as a ship, because when Cleriths attempt to argue in favor of it, it often comes in the form insults towards all characters and stories involved. You could have a story about Cloud loving Aerith, but if defending said story requires you to argue that Cloud would leave a girl with two children, one of which is dying, for no other reason besides being lovesick, then that does a disservice to the characters, the story, and the franchise in general. In a sense, by trying to defend Clerith like this you're insulting the entirety of Final Fantasy. Are there people who are assholes? Yes, are there people who get straight up "pumped and dumped"? Yes. Is that the sort of hero that SE is trying to show us? Obviously not. (for more information regarding this I advise you read: Insane hobbits article where he touches on the differences between clean and messy narratives) If SE wanted to end the game with Cloud proclaiming his love to Aerith in some way, they wouldn't have Tifa hanging on his side while he's doing it, and she wouldn't respond with "yeah, lets go meet her" like the universe biggest simp. So what is actually said? Well, I am not a translator, but as far as I can tell Japanese doesn't have pronouns and the line generally refers to meeting people in the promised land, which includes Tifa in the people going, and it's not specifically about Aerith. Is Aerith included? Of course, she's probably even the main person to meet there, she's certainly singled out as the person talked about by certain supplementary materials, but it's not a romantic sentiment, it's a tragic "we're about to die" sentiment, meant to convey a more generally positive message about being "reunited" with those who have died. The more likely paraphrasing for this scene is: "Cloud asks for an answer from the planet, the planet reveals the lifestream, Cloud and Tifa realize they're about to die. Cloud muses that he thinks he gets it now, they're all going to die and be reunited in the lifestream, both with each other, as well as those who have died, with Aerith being the most obvious and recent example." So is there any evidence for this? Well, for one there is the storyboard for the scene:

c「帰るぞティファ」 t「え？」 c「俺達も帰ってからやることがあった。まだ…あの山の向こうを見てない」 t「うん…帰ろう」

Cloud: "I'm going home Tifa" Tifa: "What?" Cloud "We had something to do after we got home. We haven't seen the other side of the mountain yet ..." Tifa: "Yeah ... let's go home"

"the other side of the mountain" is a reference to the mountains of Nibleheim, where Tifa believed the dead went. In other words, this is either a reference to them going home because they have stuff to do, which ties into the general idea that Cloud and Co had to live in order for their sins to be forgiven, as is evidenced by:

“I’m going to live. I think that’s the only way I can be forgiven. All sorts of things… happened.” ~Cloud in case of Tifa.

Or more likely it's be a reference to how they're about to die. Neither interpretation says anything about this scene being intended to be a romantic sign towards Aerith. Now, of course, the line was changed, and intentions can change during development. But if we're unsure on what the meaning of a line is, then going back to the storyboard is a pretty good way to get context.

Page 27 of the FFVII Ultimania omega:

"They're talking about", confirming that this is a mutual discussion, and not Cloud in isolation.

Page 203 of the FFVII Ultimania omega:

Provides context for the intended ideas the line is meant to convey. It calls back to earlier concepts concerning death not being the end, and is something Cloud and Tifa talk about together.

From: Final Fantasy Art Museum movie card ( https://twitter.com/dorobbongie )

These are not prescriptive canon, but descriptively they can give us some indication of how we're supposed to interpret the line.

Also reinforces the idea that the final line is meant as a more inclusive statement concerning reunions after death. Taking these points into consideration it becomes unreasonable to take the "I think I can meet her there" as a shipping line between Cloud and Aerith. If it were:

SE wouldn't have hung Tifa from Clouds hips.

Wouldn't have had Tifa agree with the idea.

Wouldn't have done it as the two were about to die.

Wouldn't have the storyboard refer to a shared journey beyond the mountains.

And most importantly, SE wouldn't have followed it up with Cloud commenting moments later that he's going to live in order to atone for his sins, and that things would be different now that he has Tifa. Clearly meeting again in the afterlife was more of an immediate danger rather than an immediate goal:

As Tifa looked away from the sky towards the ground, she was fearful of the future. However, Cloud beside her chose to smile gently. It was a smile that she hadn’t seen before during their journey. Cloud noticed her gaze and asked, “What’s wrong?” “Cloud, you’re smiling.” “I am?” “Yeah.” “It all starts now. A new…” Cloud looked for the right words. “A new life.” “I’m going to live. I think that’s the only way I can be forgiven. All sorts of things… happened.” “That’s right…” “But when I think about how many times I’ve thought about how I was going to start a new life, it’s funny.” “Why?” “Because I’ve always failed everything.” “That’s not funny.” “After this … I think I’ll be okay.” Cloud was silent for a long time before he spoke again. “Because I have you this time.” “You’ve always had me.” “What I mean is kind of different,” Cloud answered with another smile. -Case of Tifa; revised; released with ACC.

__________________________________________ thank you "thelifestream.net" for some of this information, as well as Kagesakura (https://otp-oasis-heavenxearth.tumblr.com).