#if ship good then why underrated

[m4ruk4ts]

adhd x autism

[dollsome-does-tumblr]

i may have forgotten some because they were too traumatic, but here is my definitive list as i could think of it this morning. oh, how i've suffered! 😢

[jupitermayyy]

Spending some time away from camp <3

[asfarblues]

some zosopp's from last year hehe

[peawinkls]

why jfabe is NOT!!!! boring and lifeless and proving that wrong, an informational thread discussing their relationship and dynamic, because honestly im getting tired of ppl saying their boring

contains s3 spoilers!

The relationship between JFK and abe from Clone High is something alot of people within the community discussed, especially before s3, being talked about more after s2's finale. Many speculated that the two would remain friends or even become more than that.

Now with season 3 out, we have a lot more things to work out with, specifically episode 3. It's something a lot of people are too afraid to admit, but jfabe/abefk would make the show a lot more interesting, rather than its repeatable joanabe plotline.

So, I'm here to talk about the inner workings of this pair, why their so interesting, and why they work out so much, whether platonic or not. If ur not a fan of jfabe/abefk, or heavily dislike the ship, I'd recommend turning away from this post.

Introduction, the who, the when, the why, the how...and their differences n similarities

So, we all know these two characters. JFK the beloved, Abe the hated. Something that many people picked out of the 2020 clone high fandom. But what if i told you that the beloved and the hated were truly meant to be together from the start?

What we already know is that they are the complete opposite of each other in many ways. JFK is meant to be a parody on 90s jocks from highschool movies and tv shows. Abe is the weak nerd who desperately wants to be cool.

JFK is buff and shorter, Abe is tall and lanky. JFK is a douchebag, Abe is the nicer guy. The list goes on and on. And they even have stuff in common, such as the fear of abandonment and the fear of ruining things.

But one difference i can note is that Abe is way more naive than JFK, JFK is portrayed as empty-headed, but not empty-headed enough to not realize whats going on. Of course, despite the differences, both characters make a really good team.

And this was even evident in s2 ep10, aka the finale, where they both realize that they make a great "duo of bros who'll remain friends for the rest of their lives". Jfabe shippers were FEEDING on this shit back then you have no idea

So with this stuff out of the way, it's time to talk about my favorite episode out of season 3.

Bible Humpers: A Much Needed Praycation

This episode revolves around JFK getting tired of having meaningless sex with girls and partying hard, and decides to seek out a new life when he and Abe discovers the prayer pals club, hosted by Lady Godiva. And at first, Abe is happy to see that JFK is taking on new opportunities.

"Where the slut goes, the wing slut follows."

But eventually, JFK starts straying away from Abe and his friendship, to the point of even FORGETTING about the broniversary that Abe had planned for the both of them (he literally baked a giant cake for him, look at me and tell me thats straight cmon now).

Seeing how Abe had already lost Joan and Gandhi, he didn't wanna lose JFK either, and does everything he can to make him happy and thats so clear. And even at the end of the episode, it's revealed that Abe even respected his choice on ultimately choosing celibacy.

He really does care a bunch for JFK, liking him for who he truly was (compared to JFK's other dates) and respecting his choices. And despite choosing celibacy over Abe, the two still remain close, which really tells you how great their bond is.

So something HAS definitely changed throughout the years, from them hating each others guts to potentially becoming clone highs next couple...which didn't happen, and I'm still petty about it i will admit.

But even if they didn't become canon at the end, you could really tell that some people who worked on this episode wanted them to be a thing, and that's a good enough sign for me that they could hopefully become canon in the next season if we ever get one (still petty though).

Let's circle back to season 1 again. I'm not making a jfabe thread without mentioning Litter Kills: Literally, which is another episode that jfabe shippers fed on. In this episode, JFK's close friend Ponce dies, and he's left to grieve over him.

And in this episode, we see a side of JFK that we never saw before. He starts wondering why the hell he's feeling all of these emotions, because he's a Kennedy, and he's not used to them. But Abe helps him realize that emotions like this are normal.

And even if the two hated each other, Abe apologized to him in the end and finally realized his mistakes. It seemed like Abe disliked him, yet he cares about him. Abe never knew what if felt like, because he hasn't lost a friend close to him.

So he starts berating Cleo for comforting JFK and was even aggressive towards JFK as well, believing that he was only doing all of this just to take Cleo away from him. That was all because he NEVER knew what it was like. But he finally understood.

He was sorry, but he felt like he couldn't do much to help because he didn't experience the same thing. So he just hugged JFK and held him...for a really long time.

But that was just enough for JFK, all he needed was comfort, and Abe chose to do that. So even at the episode, he couldn't help but ask JFK if he was alright. And by the next episode, JFK was already feeling better. All it takes is someone to tell you that its gonna be okay.

So what I'm trying to say is despite their own anxieties, flaws, characteristics, whatever, their PERFECT for each other. I don't like how people label them as "boring", when their so much more deeper than that.

Jfabe/AbeFK is one of my comfort ships for this exact reason. Their lore, dynamic and relationship goes beyond that, i don't ship them just because i think their cute, but because their interesting, and it may seem like im going insane over a white boy ship, but i truly, truly, from the bottom of my heart, love this ship to pieces, and hopefully people can see that through me. Thank you, clone high.

[sometimes-sleeby-octopus]

Remembering the sonadow fic called Cracking shells. I hope sonic and shadow are still taking care of those chickens together <3

(10/10 would def recommend especially if you’re looking for something unique!!! Been adding more to my recs page on ao3 and was thinking about it)

[necrotic-nephilim]

What are your opinions on Casstim?

i LOVE CassTim. i've actually written a CassTim fic that's mostly just fluff and smut, but i have a lot of ideas/thoughts about them that play with the more complicated aspects of them.

i'm of the opinion that Tim and Cass were a potential romance that DC left the door open for before Tim got adopted by Bruce. (and tbh, even after he got adopted there were certain interactions in Red Robin (2009) that felt romantically implied) a lot of their interactions have implied feelings on both sides so of all Batcest ships, i think this one has a *lot* of genuine canon backing despite it being one of the most underrated ships of the fandom.

the dynamic between Cass and Tim is really interesting to me because Tim doesn't want to be Batman in any capacity and thinks that goal is actually incredibly unhealthy and unachievable, whereas to Cass it's the thing she strives for the most and if anything she wants to be even more than that. (Batgirl (2000) #59 actually has a really interesting discussion about that and that whole post-War Games arc is fun for understanding how Tim and Cass feel about each other) so a lot of their interactions clash because of that and they can't always see eye to eye on what vigilante justice and Batman's vision should look like. their relationship with each other is always going to be dependant on their relationship with Bruce first, as well as the Batman mantle as a whole. so for them to love each other (which, they do without a doubt, romantic or not) they have to accept where they don't agree with each other.

there's such a gentleness to CassTim, i think? not because i think Cass (or Tim tbh) is gentle, but i think for the exact opposite reason. there is this fullness and drivenness in the way she loves and her undying devotion to them. she would do anything to protect her loved ones. and when you combine that with Tim, who's pretty self-sacrificial at his worst, you have some interesting conflict because they're both too-willing to die for the other. their lives are defined by violence, *especially* Cass', so for her to finally let herself be loved and protected by someone else as much as she loves others is something that simply makes me feral.

they've both been trained by Shiva, which i don't think gets explored enough because it's fun for exploring the way they fight and think in a fight being potentially similar. Cass is *far* smarter than anyone gives her credit for being, and has detective skills on par with Tim, in my opinion. they balance each other out in a lot of ways. they're two people who have *chosen* this fight more than a lot of the rest of the Batfamily. being Batgirl is so important to Cass and it's something she chose because of her desperate want to be good. and Tim chose to be Robin because he knew Gotham and Bruce needed that. while they don't always agree on it, i would argue Cass and Tim understand the nuances of the Batman mantle and what it represents deeper than almost anyone else. because of that i'm particularly interested in a future CassTim, where Cass becomes Batman and Tim is in a weird limbo where he wants to stop being a vigilante but can't seem to quite let go of the life and how they end up meeting in the middle of that. i think it could be really fun with a lot of complicated arguments between them that end in a slow burn romance.

idk man this is baseless rambling, but tldr i love them so dearly and there's so much that can be explored between them. also, i think TimKonCass should be a thing. i like KonCass more than most people do (why do y'all hate this ship it's so good pls hear me out-) and i think as a complicated weird throuple they'd be fun.

[hauntingblue]

21st century "et tu, brute" moment

[beauzos]

think i might have said something to this degree before but it's a shame Beau dies before he ever gets to meet/interact with Mimi. i think they could have kind of an endearing friendship, barring Beau being. yknow. her husband's affair partner KRKFN but ignoring that, she'd probably find him to be very funny and sweet, at least in small doses. i think they'd click to the point Vincent would feel weird about it lol.

i once thought abt an AU where Beau is alive long enough to go to New York n meet Mimi and i think that'd be fun horror all on its own, though. meeting someone that she initially really likes, then getting weird vibes about his relationship to her husband, and then the slow dawning realization of "something is deeply wrong with this man and i'm scared' while Vincent seems to be completely blind to the idea that anything is wrong and there's very little she can do. tis a fun concept. too bad i can't use it

[goldiipond]

i love raydon so much i just adore the progression of their relationship throughout the series. how don admires ray and wants so so badly to be close to him and how ray wants to be close to don as well but constantly pushes him away because getting close to this hyperactive dork knowing he's going to die hurts way too much and he knows that if they did get close and don lived until his planned death date don would be absolutely devastated. so he simply continues to push him away because he thinks it's better for both of them, while don is hurt but just brushes it off as ray ‘being a downer’ because he doesnt know why he seems to be so distant!!

the apology in episode 6 being the first major breakthrough in their relationship and having don making one of the softest smiles in the series, he’s just SO happy to be making this progress with ray and its so touching. and how after that their relationship only gets better, to the point where don gets so overjoyed to see that ray is safe he tackles him, and even starts crying.

i just. love their relationship its so underrated i love the idea of don spending so long admiring ray from a distance and him finally being allowed to get close to him and actually get to know him and all that admiration slowly turning into genuine love, and ray experiencing these warm, soft feelings he never thought he'd live to feel and the weight of them all shocking him to his core, and shocking don too. i love the thought of these two boys who grew up desperately wanting to know each other but being unable to finally being given that chance and running with it, opening up about their insecurities and being soft and vulnerable and giving each other the pure adoration they both deserve <3

[aaobjectionposting-va4]

Ok but can we talk about how out of all the major male characters that Ryunosuke interacts with throughout the story, van Zieks is the ONLY one that isn't hiding something from/lying to him at one point or another?? Sholmes lies about Kazuma being alive, Kazuma hides the fact that he's going to Britain as a hired assassin, Yujin hides details about the Professor killings from him in 2-2, Stronghart lies about... Well, everything really. Like there's so much I could say about him lol. Gregson hides the fact that he helped frame Genshin for the Professor killings, McGilded lies about having been the culprit in the omnibus case, Jigoku lies about having been the one to kill Gregson... Etc etc. I personally can't remember a single point where van Zieks was hiding things from Ryuu or just straight up lying about important things to his face. He's an ass to him at first, sure, but he's ultimately on the side of justice and finding out the truth, even if it means hurting his cases or having his worldview challenged (except maybe in the case of Klint, which I'll get into).

Now one might say, "Oh but didn't he hide the fact that he had a brother from Ryunosuke at first?". And to that I say... So what? From van Zieks' point of view, details about his personal life (and ESPECIALLY about Klint) are hard to talk about and, frankly, Ryuu really had no reason to need that info about him, other than just to be nosy. That's why he's so cagey about the topic in 2-3, and why he's (somewhat) more willing to talk about it with him in 2-4/5, because at that point Ryunosuke absolutely DOES need to know more about Klint (and the Professor killings in general). And as for Ryuu's point of view, he really has no reason to be asking about van Zieks' personal life at first, other than the fact that he's just curious about it.

Anyways. I really do believe that, despite how rocky these two's dynamic is at first, it's been built on honesty and straightforward-ness from the start, and I really appreciate how we have an Ace Attorney prosecutor who's more than willing to not hide the truth from his lawyer rival (even if he's making dunks on Ryunosuke half the time, lol)

[lalagoona]

Why do people get so mad at others thinking two characters have a "sibling-like relationship" or are simply better as friends. As long as they're not harassing you or forcing their opinion on you you can just scroll down if you ship said characters romantically.

[artsy--shipper]

So uh… I may have fallen for this ship a little bit… 🙈

[namorian]

Wenvier has spuffy parallels (xavier = human William energies lbr, pathetic meow meow crush on main character, I would 100% call them an “embarrassing freak couple” if I was a teen bully)

But wenclay also has spuffy parallels (enemies to lovers, saved world together, goth x girly jock vibes etc)

But wenclay also also has coffy parallels (queen bee x action girl, queen on queen action, insane girlbosses who have stabbed people over lunch tables energies)

Also wenvier has sprusilla parallels (sappy man and deranged girl, gothic romance energies, femdom, man has entire course of his life changed by a creepy brunette girl while surrounded by death literal or metaphorical)

Hope this made any sense lol

[saph-yells-into-the-void]

have i ever mentioned on here that i watched alien stage in its entirety a few days ago :3

[skitskatdacat63]

Sebastian and Michael for the ship bingo

Aaaaaaa thankuuuu <33