#it didn't even occur to me that sebastian would get angry about this

[not-poignant]

So I was thinking about Stain while making lunch, as is now apparently my wont, and I found myself wondering... we know Martingale ousted Joja, and presumably Pierre gets most if not all his fresh goods from him... so does Sebastian go out of his way to avoid buying Martingale's produce, or does he grit his teeth and accept it as an unfortunate but necessary evil for continuing to live in Pelican Town?

Hi hi hi,

So, Sebastian doesn't hate Martingale, and he has no reason to avoid his produce at all.

Sebastian is angry at Martingale, and exasperated with him, but he doesn't hate him. He did, but then he left the town, moved to Zuzu, saw a therapist, got over it, made an absolute mint, learned how to become an even better fighter, and came back with enough bank to build his own house and live his own kind of life.

He's the kind of guy who still has issues but has taken all the thorns out of that particular vine. And also, as we've seen, Sebastian has issues with himself in that relationship as much as he does with Martingale. He's said more and more that his relationship with Martingale wasn't as simple as Martingale just being evil or bad or mean, that it was a joint situation.

So yeah, Sebastian has... really no reason to avoid buying Martingale's produce, and also no reason to grit his teeth or even resent doing it.

I'd say he grows some of his own stuff (he does have a shipping bin, and he is in a section of mountain forest where he'd have arable land - I'd say Alex has never seen it because he only visits at night, and light pollution isn't really a thing), and also has no problems eating at the Stardrop Saloon, and otherwise keeps his fridge stocked via Pierre's.

Like, he knows better than anyone how much Martingale cares about his farm and how much work he's put into it. He was there when Martingale stayed up until 2.00am night after night, and he was there when Martingale nearly died trying to get enough iridium just to upgrade his sprinklers so he could have higher and higher quality goods. He knows he's getting the best, which matters to him.

And then on top of that, he's always been a big believer in fairly compensating someone for their work no matter how he feels about them. He started backing Alex in that long before he considered himself to be friendly towards Alex overall. In fact he was supportive of Alex getting paid better even when he still thought Alex was an active homophobe and bully!

So yeah, Sebastian can be immature in some ways, but that's not one of them!

(Also I feel like Sebastian is the kind of person who wants Martingale to know when he's pissed at him, and then the rest of the time is like 'well, that's a waste of my time.' lksfjas)

[possibleplatypus]

Holy fuck no so true the only time bucky ever shows an ounce of displeasure with steve is at the gayest bar scene known to history . Also nothing will ever haunt me than getting out of the eg showing at 2 AM and having bucky half turn self deprecating smile to himself that screams “what did you expect , buck” after steve disappears on the platform like seared into my brain for eternity. You can tell the last ounce of hope he held onto vanishing. Like that whole scene he has hardly two lines but his fucking eyes tells a whole different story.

I will never forgive Endgame Steve and Marvel/Disney for putting that look on Bucky's face. Props to Sebastian Stan, he knew Bucky wouldn't have been happy about Steve going back in time for good. And he acted the shit out of this in the, what, 40 minutes he had to process that Steve and Bucky were going to be separated forever?

In the interview, Sebastian also confirmed ‘a conversation’ had occurred between the two brothers in arms prior to Captain America’s unexpected return to the past - hence their heartfelt goodbye in the film.

He said: ‘When I found out that we were doing that scene, which was probably about 40 minutes before it was filmed, I said “Look, don’t you think if this is really happening wouldn’t there be something more to be said?”

‘But then you know the producers were like “You guys have had that conversation, you’ve had that moment, you know what is going to happen and what Steve is doing”.

‘In the last interaction there is a lot of subtext which is like “Alright, here we are, you know, I’ll see you when I see you”.’

Like, the producers cared so little about Steve and Bucky's relationship-- the relationship that forged Steve into Captain America and carried these two characters through three movies-- that they didn't tell Bucky's actor that he would be separated from his best friend forever until forty minutes before filming. This was for Endgame, what was supposedly the capstone (pun unintended) movie for the MCU, their pièce de résistance.

Sebastian Stan had 40 minutes to devise Bucky's expression to show his feelings about Steve's departure, that he only showed once Steve had already left for his happily ever after.

He had to point out that Steve and Bucky would have had a bigger conversation, only to be told that they already had it. 

The disrespect that Marvel/Disney have for not only the actors, but the characters and their story, is breathtaking.

But anyway, yes-- Bucky was not happy about Steve going back in time, even if they discussed it prior to Steve leaving.

Look at this look he gives Steve before Steve says “Don’t do anything stupid before I get back.” He’s not asking Steve to stay in words, but his eyes say it all. Stay with me, don’t go. 

It does look like Bucky's resigned before Steve leaves but is trying his best, as always, to be happy for him.

After Steve leaves, though. He looks heartbroken but he's trying to keep it together. He looks like he's about to cry. He even nods a little, like this is what he expected would happen but hoped wouldn’t. Steve left and didn’t come back. “I don’t think I’m worth all this, Steve,” he’d said in Civil War, and this just confirms it.

And when Steve comes back an old man... He doesn't go up to talk to him. He tells Sam to go ahead. What is there to say? Thanks for giving us the shield? Did you have a good life? Did you save me in another universe and spend your life with a version of me that wasn't tainted by Hydra, or did you sit at home and do nothing while your wife's coworkers tortured me for 70 years and forced me to kill people? Or is the reason they didn’t talk just that Marvel/Disney didn’t care about the end of the MCU’s most beautiful (platonic) love story?

I'm not angry at Bucky or Steve. I'm angry at Marvel and Disney for their terrible writing.

[k-s-morgan]

Hi! This isn’t an ask, but more of a rambling that I deemed too long for the comments, that stems from your post claiming Book of Circus as your favourite Black Butler episodes. and to that I say - YES. Book of Murder is a masterpiece. It houses one of my favourite scenes - the one where Sebastian says: "This wasn't a scenario decided by God or fate, but one decided on by my master, with timing decided by my master. I was killed by the criminal expected by my master, by the Hione who came to torment my master", which really captures the essence of whole 'Ciel vs God' dynamic that's woven into the duration of the show.

Throughout the plot, there are three major instances in which an offering is made to Ciel - offerings of redemption. The first is from Angela - a chance to purify himself and have an afterlife - which he so vehemently rejects in the knowledge that he quite literally *is* his darkness, and therefore refuses to rid himself of it.

The second is comes from Abberline in his death, where in his final words he tells Ciel he has a chance to take back his future. And Ciel has to watch him die with the knowledge that he has already made up his mind about his fate. I don't think he's so affected because he regrets selling his soul. I don't think he suddenly wants to live, or no longer wishes for revenge. But I believe the reason he is so affected by Abberline's death is because he holds a sentimentality for him that is not dissimilar to the one he feels for Elizabeth. Ciel is cruel, I don't think he regrets the steps he has taken to get to this point, nor the ones he knows he must take in the future. But though he is cruel, I believe he has a sort of fond curiosity for the untainted goodness that characterises those like Abberline and Elizabeth. Like you said before, he feels condescension towards the man perhaps due to the naivety his blind heroism implies, but I think his attachments to him come from an underlying curiosity to see if such goodness can exist in such a corrupted world - a silent hope to be proven wrong in his cynicism. When Abberline dies, that very hope he didn't even know he had gets shattered. It brings about a sort of forced perspective that makes Ciel question himself in ways we haven't seen before.

Abberline's death had been avoidable and it was certainly in vain. Abberline had died for someone who had already made up his mind - someone who had rejected God once before and would do it time and time again as proven in the anime. Ciel is such an interesting character because, although he is dark, he still values the light and makes some sort of effort to preserve it in spite of the contempt he feels for them. It is the thought of dying in vain that seems to bother him so greatly, not death itself. No, Abberline dying isn't enough for him to want to live again, or to even think about throwing away his revenge - that was never in question. But it is enough to extinguish the lingering flicker of hope he had for humanity (despite being so distanced from term himself).

This, combined with the disappointment he feels at Sebastian's actions, causes the existential haze of uncertainty that leads to the third and final offering. And the most surprising thing is that this offering comes from Sebastian himself. He senses the doubt in Ciel and, like every thought the boy experiences, fails to understand it. He mistakes it for him second-guessing his revenge and decides to discontinue their contract. But he isn't angry - that much is clear. Instead, he wishes him to "forget everything and have pleasant dreams", with a rather wistful expression on his face. What this line ends up reading as is a bittersweet  goodbye from the demon - an offering for Ciel to let go of his revenge and find happiness in the afterlife with his now soon approaching death.  There is almost a strong disappointment in him, but is not resentful of it - Ciel is human and he can't keep expecting him not to be. His offering almost acts as a thank you for the moments of excitement their contract had given his monotone life and I believe that is why he makes it.

He sticks around to see if Ciel accepts his offer, though already expecting him to, and is there to witness the very moment the boy rejects it. Gone is the uncertainty of Abberline's death and the Paris crisis, and Ciel, the Earl of Phantomhive, returns to him - sharper, colder, more ruthless than ever. Sebastian realises his misjudgement and returns to his side, ready for the final battle. Killing an angel. It's laughably symbolic.

The rejections of God, the evasion of the Hope Diamond's curse (where he even wore two rings as if to taunt the fates), the references in Book of Murder - they all depict this metaphorical sort of battle between Ciel and God. And the ending of Kuroshitsuji II is the depicts how he triumphs over fate, claiming his rightful place as an immortalised creature of Hell.

I know I've gone on a bit of a tangent here in your inbox, but that one quote from Book of Murder is so symbolic to me in the way it sets up the comparison between Ciel and God (in which 'God' represents power over fate).

Before I sign off, though, I just want to make light of the existence of the show's final offering, occurring in the last few minutes of the series. This last offering has nothing too do with God, nothing to do with any complex battle between the Phantomhive and fate, but is much simpler than that. In fact, the final offering of the show comes from Ciel, and he gives it to Sebastian - it's almost poetic, is it not?

"Are you sure you don't want to pull it any tighter?"

In this single, unassuming line, Ciel is asking Sebastian if he wants to kill him, and release himself from the eternal contract they've found themselves in. Such a noble and dignified soul as Ciel would always be sure to make through on his word and, despite the loophole that now extends their contract, he would still be willing to let Sebastian kill him should he wish to do so. The man may no longer be able to take his soul, but the boy can still give the order to kill him and free himself. Ciel's respect for Sebastian is complex and contradictory at times, but what never changes is his willingness to die by his hands and see through to his side of the contract.

“Is it over? The one who plunged me into bottomless darkness… I don’t even know why she did it.”

In the episode where Angela is crushed by the Church, Ciel offers his soul to Sebastian. Even when unsatisfied with the result, his unwavering nobility led him to make good on their deal and fulfil his end of the contract. The earl faced the demon, his expression calm, and with a steady voice said “A promise is a promise. Take it.”

This unwavering dignity and nobility he holds in himself I believe is the reason for this offering and Sebastian's turn to reject it is almost a 'love confession' (as you have brought me to see it) in itself.

As a final sort of note - I just wanted to let you know that, since reading your reply to my comment on TGSTLTH (from a while ago), I brought myself to rewatch Kuroshitsuji II with your interpretation in mind and ended up really enjoying it. You've singlehandedly made me do a complete 180 on a season I previously hated - looks like I had just watched it from the wrong perspective. So, for that, I thank you

Hey! Sorry for getting to your ask just now. I absolutely loved it :D And yes, Book of Murder is a masterpiece - I still remember watching it for the first time. It was late at night, I had to go to bed, everyone was sleeping, but I kept watching because stopping just wasn't an option, I had to know what happened next.

Ciel vs God is such an interesting topic. In some ways, Ciel and Sebastian exist in their own universe where there is no place for anyone else. There is a God aka Ciel and a demon aka Sebastian. And they are both allies and adversaries at the same time - they are tormenting each other and uniting to torment others.

I agree absolutely that Ciel holds a fondness for certain people, with Lizzy and Abberline being a good example. He has a degree of contempt and irritation for them, but they do mean something to him. Ciel's curiosity is a big and detached thing, and this places him on Sebastian's level in such an interesting way because sometimes it's almost like Ciel isn't human himself - humanity intrigues him as if he doesn't belong to it. His fascination with the light just underlines his affinity with the darkness.

I have many thoughts about Ciel's behavior during the days following Abberline's death, and you certainly introduced many excellent points! My general opinion on Ciel's motives is... complicated. I agree that he never felt like really giving up his revenge and trying to live a 'happy' life - he knew it's not for him at that stage already. However, I feel like Abberline's parting words affected him a lot, even if briefly. When Abberline tells him that he can start everything from the beginning, Ciel sounds absolutely heartbroken when he confesses, "I don't have a future." The way he acts later, telling Sebastian to stop and not kill the angel, hesitating, reinforces this idea to me. I think you described it best - Ciel is having an existential crisis. It's not like he suddenly regrets his decisions, but he's temporary unanchored and unsure what he wants and what he should do. Having a dream where Abberline urges him to give up his hatred also seems to affect Ciel, but it's so telling that he wakes up and immediately says, "Sebastian." It's a fascinating arc and I can't wait to explore it.

I love your words about three offerings - so true. And I'm so happy you liked S2 when watching it from a new perspective! I used to be so confused as to why people hated it: it's not perfect, but I thought it was amazing in many ways, especially its bittersweet ending.

[thedarkestcrow]

Hello! It's difficult to order my thoughts right after reading 136. I'm a bit confused. With all the guilt O!Ciel feels about his twin's sacrifice, I ended up thinking MAYBE he had a tiny percent of guilt somehow. However, the way Seb appeared makes me think (me) O!Ciel didn't actively summon him and definitely (as far as we know) didn't tell him "here, have my twin's soul". Maybe I'm being thick but I feel it was the Cult's sacrifice + how O!Ciel rejected faith while it all was happening- part1

(pt2) So, as I think it was the combination of the cult's acts + sudden rejection of faith by O!Ciel, I find it difficult to understand his remorse about what happened to Ciel. I don't see how O!Ciel is guilty in any way of his twin's fate. Ciel had already died. The one ugly thing he may have done is take out the ring but he was already dead. This all leads me to not understand Ciel's current huge rage against O!Ciel & his friends. Maybe we'll see next month but I don't find O!C actively guilty

Hi. ^^

YES! That’s the thing the current chapter clearly shows! Our Ciel had no part in any way which led the cultist to choose real Ciel first. The choice was completely random. The twins did nothing which would have led the cultists to choose one of the twins in particular. The cultists saw them not as individuals but as a pair so they didn’t care who would come first.

Our Ciel definitely isn’t to blame for the cultist’s choice one bit. And Sebastian’s appearance wasn’t intentional, either.

That the twins could survive so long and not break even after all that was done to them during that month in the cult was surely due to the fact that they were still together. They still had hopes to get out of there as long as they had each other.

But these hopes were all dependent on the fact that they were still together. That the twin was killed on the altar destroyed everything for our Ciel. It was his breaking point. That was too much for him and all of his emotions which had filled up during that whole month were released. That triggered his abandoning of faith and the appearance of the demon.

But that wasn’t intentional. And our Ciel surely didn’t offer his brother’s soul to Sebastian. It was the cultists who made that choice and it was our Ciel’s desperation over his twin’s cruel death which triggered Sebastian’s appearance.

However, we know that our Ciel still feels guilty for what happened. And this is so extreme that he even thinks he doesn’t deserve to live (as seen in the Green Witch arc). And this surely has to do with survivor’s guilt. Maybe because the choice which twin was taken first for the ritual was so random it makes it even worse for our Ciel. It could have simply been the other way around. It was a fifty-fifty chance, our Ciel was just ‘lucky’ to not have been chosen first. And then real Ciel’s death caused our Ciel to summon a demon (even if it wasn’t intentional). This enabled our Ciel to escape from there alive while his twin had to die. I would actually wonder if our Ciel didn’t suffer from survivor’s guilt.

Survivor guilt is a mental condition that occurs when a person believes they have done something wrong by surviving a traumatic event when others did not.

Sure, we still don’t know what exactly happened after Sebastian appeared (we’ll probably see more next month) but it’s clear that up until the twin’s death on that altar our Ciel has no reason to feel guilty about anything. But simply because he survived while his brother didn’t it makes him feel guilty and he surely never processed those feelings since then which might make it even worse.

Now as for the real Ciel’s rage now... The twin’s feelings towards our Ciel now are not that clear yet. I mean, sure, he has killed Agni and left that creepy message on the wall. He accused Sebastian of doing something to him but to me he rather seems obsessed with the thought of being with our Ciel forever than him being angry with our Ciel for doing something to him. But the twin is surely not the same person as he was back then anyway. He died on the altar and the person who came back now is surely being manipulated by the Blue Sect. Maybe the twin is even supposed to use our Ciel’s survivor’s guilt and make it even worse by addressing that issue. But real Ciel’s behavior now is surely not an indication that our Ciel is to blame for anything that led to the twin’s death. Because the current chapter shows that he certainly isn’t guilty of that.

[not-poignant]

Why doesn't Sebastian remember the stuff he said to Alex when they were younger? Does he really not remember, or is Alex reading it wrong? Also thank you for the chapter!! I'm not going to tell you how many times I reread them all before the next one

Oooo yes I can answer this!

So, let's be real, a lot of teenagers say a lot of insulting shit to other people and frankly just say it and don't remember a lot of it. The brain-to-mouth filter of adolescents in general is not great (which is awesome for having all of that play out in online spaces). I don't know many adults who, when they think about the things they said as a teenager, don't experience some moments of 'oh I maybe shouldn't have said that' and that's just the crap they remember.

(Y'all know it gets long, right?)

This is also especially true if you're insulting someone that you feel justified insulting (like a school bully, someone you've mentally cancelled, someone you hate, someone who rubs you the wrong way, someone who has just said terrible stuff to you so you feel permitted to say terrible stuff to them). Like, in primary school and high school, it's not like your internal set of ethics is necessarily hugely well-defined, and even very well-behaved children can step into accidental or intentional bullying and verbal insults when they feel angry. It's not like we're known for mature emotional regulation of our own anger, especially if you go into places where emotional literacy isn't super high.

Also, with memory formation, it's just incredibly normal to forget a lot of this stuff. Normal and necessary to just growing as a person.

But there's an extra component with Sebastian and Alex, which is that Sebastian was saying a lot of stuff that everyone thought, to the point where I don't even think he considered that he was a lot worse than everyone else about it (which he was, he was horribly verbally abusive towards Alex, and imho, was the worse bully out of the two of them by a long-shot). It wouldn't occur to Sebastian as a kid to think that he was wrong, for example, in calling Alex stupid. Everyone thought it, including Alex.

And finally, a big part of this puzzle is - as we've seen in the story overall - Alex is quite stoic. He prefers not to let people notice he's felt hurt by their words, and in fact, is quite good at pretending that nothing is affecting him at all. He of course learned this from growing up in a domestically violent household where it was dangerous for him to show nearly any emotions at all, but as someone who could be mean to Sebastian, it also made Alex seem like he was never being affected by Sebastian's words. And in that scenario, Sebastian would have gotten angrier and angrier, and more and more determined to say something that finally hurt him, not realising that the very first thing he said hurt, and that he's just said another 15 things that also really hurt him.

So some of Sebastian's memories formed around 'Alex isn't affected by almost everything I say' - and you know, why would you remember that? Alex's memories are radically different, because everything Sebastian said cut him to pieces, but the way he behaved made it seem like they didn't. That's Alex's survival skill, and frankly, Sebastian still really struggles with it, and he's not in the habit of seeing past it. Even now, it sort of takes him a moment to realise - more and more - that this side of Alex who appears unaffected and starts giving these single-word answers is covering for someone who is extremely vulnerable and wounded beneath that.

When Alex says 'it's just words' to dismiss what Sebastian says, after Sebastian has seen him come over depressed, clean silently, and then go to leave, and realises that Alex is like profoundly affected by what Mayor Lewis said to him, he takes a moment to be like 'wait, if he's that affected by what Mayor Lewis said, and now he's telling me it's 'just words' then...it can't be 'just words' at all.'

A lot of this stuff is really hard for Sebastian to process because it goes against every kind of fundamental thing that he's thought about Alex all his life.

So yeah, Sebastian really doesn't remember, he doesn't think of himself as that much of a bully, and certainly not a bad one, and he's still sort of piecing all of this together. One of the reasons he's so reluctant to come to a 'realisation' about Alex is first and foremost - it means Sebastian has to see how ugly his own behaviours were, and that's something a lot of people don't want to see in themselves. So we have this contrasting narrative, as Alex the person who consistently is like 'I bullied you terribly and I deserve bad things' and Sebastian who consistently is like 'I was bullied terribly but I've grown as a person but I'm not going to forget how you treated me either.'

The reality is different. They both bullied each other. Sebastian was a lot more aggressive and insidious about it and also had friends who backed him up (leading to 3-against-1 scenarios all the time), because Alex seemed unaffected by anything Sebastian said. Alex doesn't deserve terrible things, Sebastian doesn't deserve terrible things, and they both have grown as people.

But Sebastian owes Alex some genuine apologies, and some real thought about the whole scenario, and Alex also needs to get better at talking about this stuff.

And y'know, that's why we're here, reading this fic. :D