#like newsflash all the candidates are just as bad as they are good

[volley-ball-101]

Uhhhhh not sure where everyone's position is on this but I think Scott Cawthon shouldn't be cancelled 😐.

[sunset-telepath]

Why I hate Ro

So, I was asked to explain why I hate Ro. And I’ve been compilating several arguments that I’ve heard and written myself. And I’d like to put a disclaimer here - it’s not because she’s this “sokeefe idol.” It’ just... her character and what she does in support of sokeefe.

Disclaimer: I’m condensing several conversations that I, JaxTheShade, and [Redacted due to them not wanting to be credited] had on the wiki about a month ago. Around 40% of these ideas are mine, 40% are Jax’s, and 20% are [Redacted]’s.

Right off the bat, she’s a misandrist. She quite literally calls boys as stupid as amoeba in Legacy. You can say that that was a joke, but it’s not funny. It’s not okay to blatantly call anyone or generalize any group stupid. It’s not ok. It’s the exact same thing as saying that women belong in the kitchen or that blacks are criminals. It’s not ok. It’s disgusting, despicable, and repugnant behavior.

In the Flashback Short Story, she objectifies Sophie as a prize for Fitz and Keefe to fight over. What the actual f***. That is not acceptable behavior under any circumstances. It’s repugnant, disgusting, detestable, and f****** evil. Treating any person as a prize to fight over is textbook objectification and it is blatantly evil. It is not ok. And it’s disgusting that this narrative has leaked into some of the fanfics that I’ve read. THIS IS NOT ACCEPTABLE UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES. IT IS NOT EXCUSABLE. IT IS EVIL.

She flat out bullies Fitz. She alludes to him being a nasty microbe in Legacy. She ridicules his desire to perfect himself. There is nothing wrong with being or trying to be perfect. Don’t push yourself too hard trying to be perfect, but if you should always strive to be better (and if you’re naturally talented like Fitz is, achieve your dreams. Fulfill your potential. Ignore the haters). She mocks and bullies him, calling him names and ridiculing his desire to be perfect. Newsflash: There’s nothing wrong with trying to be perfect. Who the hell is Ro to decide how perfect someone can be? Who the hell does Ro think she is? As a perfectionist myself, I despise Ro and her adversity to perfection. It’s not her place to decide how perfect a person can be. I admire Fitz simply shrugging her off and not letting her flat-out abuse get to him. It’s the proper way to deal with people like her.

Her entire character can be summed up as a chronic-complainer who ships Sokeefe. Shannon basically turned the Instagram Fandom into a character and made it Keefe’s Bodyguard. She never confesses to making mistakes and she’s never humbled or knocked down a peg. 30% of her dialogue can be attributed to complaining about sparkles or “elf-land,” 20% of it can be attributed to her flat-out bulling Fitz, and 50% of it can be attributed to her pushing Sophie and Keefe together. None of the characters like her. The other bodyguards detest her, Bo wants to kill her, Fitz thinks that she’s awful, Sophie is embarrassed by her, and Keefe wants her to shut her mouth.

She’s blunt, she’s rude, and she’s just awful. She interferes with a relationship that is none of her business. She has no regard for the emotional abuse that she inflicts. Ro and Keefe are very similar, and clash often. Ro always wins, however, either because she’s stronger than him or because she can emotionally manipulate him. (These sound like big claims now, but they’re backed up later)

Ro dismisses Sophie by saying that “blondie doesn’t know what she feels.” And it’s disgusting. She’s objectified by “blondie” - a term focused on Sophie’s appearance rather than by her personality. She’s Sophie Elizabeth Foster, not “blondie.” She dismisses Sophie as naïve and disregards her feelings by saying that Sophie’s doesn’t know what Sophie feels.

~The Following Section was directly quoted from JaxTheShade because he summarized it so well~

Well...no, Ro. She does have an idea of what she feels. In fact, she was ecstatic and perfectly fine with dating and eventually sorting out her issues with Fitz until you started "hinting" about Keefe. Sophie does understand her feelings - and those feelings led her to Fitz. And even if she does have some underlying issue about who she likes (which has admittedly been hinted at), it's up to her to figure it out. Not a brash ogre bodyguard who scoffs at the notion of the Elvin culture and thinks she has a right to intrude in a teenage relationship she isn't apart of.

And Fitz...well, I'm sure Ro doesn't hate him. But she's pretty close to--that's not hard to deduce. Because Ro has ever bothered to pay attention to and sympathize with Keefe ( and yet she still finds a way to neglect his feelings ), she hasn't the slightest inclination of who Fitz is. So, like most people, she decides to consider him "the opposing candidate" in the love triangle and never look past the surface of Fitz, just calling him "Captain Perfect" and thinking that he could never be right for Sophie because he's competing against Keefe. 

Sometimes I wish someone, anyone, would call Ro out for amount of sheer insults she layers on Fitz, whether he's there or not. Although most of the time it's done behind his back--what a surprise. 

I mean, look at this:

She slyly calls him a 'nasty microbe'. And while some have argued that she wasn't calling Fitz this, she was very clearly expressing her disdain for Sophie's favourite colour being teal--and, by proxy, calls teal things 'nasty'. 

“[...] But I thought it was only right to save your imp from being sparkle-fied—and I was going to be nice and turn him your favorite color. But apparently your favorite color is teal—and yeah, yeah, we all know why. But, um, do you realize how many of the nastiest little microbes are that color?” She shuddered. “I couldn’t do that to you—or the little dude. [...]”

Ro also calls him "Captain Perfectpants" and openly admits that Fitz would have problems with all the time Sophie is spending with Keefe. Essentially admitted but disregarding how upset Fitz would be--because who cares about Fitz's feelings when Keefe is having emotional turmoil? And as a little bonus, she also pulls her classic, "I can't take this anymore! I simply have to intervene in this situation of which I'm not apart of!

"Ro snorted. “Of course he would! He’d be super, super jealous!”

“Don’t,” Keefe told her.

“No—I can’t take it anymore!” Ro stalked toward Sophie and tapped her on the nose with a calloused fingertip. “I repeat: Yes, your Captain Perfectpants would be jealous! He scraped together the courage to get all share-y about his feelings, and now you’re ignoring him, and being all mysterious about why, and telling everyone who asks that you’re not dating him. And I’m not saying that’s a bad call. Trust your instincts! Hopefully they’ll lead you out of the oblivion. But in the meantime, count on your teal-eyed Wonderboy feeling a little insecure, particularly if he finds out you’re spending lots of quality time with other dudes. And you know what? That’s good for him. We all know that boy could use a little help in the humility department. So make him sweat a little. And you”—she spun back toward Keefe—“need to stop being so afraid.”

And those are just two instances, of which I can search for plenty more. 

Ro is not a good person. She's a rebellious princess who ultimately works for her own gain. She thinks she's got it all figured out with Keefe, and decides that, since he shared his story of liking Sophie, she'll take it upon herself to get them together no matter what. 

And I mean 'no matter what'. She has put down Sophie for liking Fitz, interrupted conversations so she can drop hints about Keefe's feelings against his will, and made fun of Sophie for being oblivious--even going to the extent of getting fed up with and blaming Sophie for her oblivion "becoming less and less cute".

She's also tried to actively break up Sophitz and push together Sophie and Keefe. She's insulted Fitz and holds a very hostile disposition towards him simply because he's "perfect boy" who's against the Saint Also Known As Keefe. Ro tries to subtly force Sophie's feelings for Fitz out of her while dropping in some "isn't Hunkyhair so great?". I wouldn't for a second put it past her to succeed in shutting down as many Sophitz moments as possible all so she can continue to ignore the pleas to stop and the embarrassed faces surrounding her. 

And her excuse?

"It's the only fun she gets to have here in Elf Land".

She isn't apart of this relationship. She isn't affected by this relationship. She's only seen one side of this relationship, and uses that to base her opinions of the other two. Which is a terrible idea considering that leads to opinions like "Okay, well that other boy is awful because he's the competitor, and that girl must like the boy because the boy likes her, and sometimes she acts shy around him, and that's totally how relationships work".

Ro has absolutely no excuse for the amount of hurt she's inflicted on all three of these teenagers.

And yet she's regarded as a saint amongst all, while people like...say, Alden ( who made mistakes, but ultimately went about it in a calmer, gentler, and more well meaning way--as well as having much more justification and reasoning behind his actions ) are seen as evil and deserving of death. So what's the difference? Is it just because Ro is all for Sokeefe and Alden is really pushing for Sophitz? Have we really sunk low enough to the point where we can adore one character and hate another--despite performing the same actions--simply because of shipping preferences?

Everyone has decided to hate Alden because he showed up to speak with Keefe, ended up getting sidetracked and talking about relationships ( because of Ro, go figure ), sympathized with Keefe and shared meaningful advice from personal identical experiences, and then making sure Keefe knew that he considered him apart of the family.

That was what Alden did. And we have absolutely no reason to believe that Alden was anything but genuine when he stated that he "long considered him part of the family".

And yet Ro is the one who starts ranting about how "he didn't mean it" ( and saying something like that to a teenage boy who never felt loved by his father means a lot--but Ro has to ruin it and say that Alden's words were "a stinking load of garbage" ). Ro is the one whose objectification of the triangle by saying that Keefe being there for his friends is "sabotage" is what sparks Keefe to tell her that Sophie's feelings do matter. Ro is the one who interrupts every conversation by either stating her obnoxious opinion that nobody asked for, or calling a time out so she can bash on Fitz again. Ro is the one who has spent every waking moment since she arrived in the series either making Keefe's desire to be happy for his friends feel invalid, insulting Sophie because she's her own person with her own feelings for someone else, and coming up with every insult under the sun to throw at Fitz. Ro is the one who has no justification for her actions, seeing as she a) is not apart of this triangle, and b) has minimal relationship experience considering both her boyfriends hate her, and one was an arranged marriage.

But...Ro is also the loved and appreciated one.” - JaxTheShade (I’ve been paraphrasing some of the things that he’s said all ready, but I’m directly quoting him for this. His statement is direct and gets to the point)

~End of direct Quote~

I'd like to make one thing clear though - the point of selfishness. There's a stigma to the word that I'd like to clear up, because there are two types of selfishness, rational self-interest, and sacrificing others for yourself.

Fitz is the first type - he has a rational self-interest, he's looking out for himself and his own long-term happiness first. There is nothing wrong with that, if you won't look out for yourself, who will? It's why I completely supported Fitz yelling and breaking up with Sophie - if a relationship is making you unhappy long-term, it is in your best interest to break up with them. It's why Fitz was so adamant about finding Sophie's biological parents, he wanted to avoid future stigma, gossiping, and heckling. Fitz knows how horrible these things are to experience, and so sought to avoid them in the future. This is why Fitz is my favorite character - the others are reactive, Fitz seems to be the only proactive one. (One of the few characters in any literature to be proactive, in fact). While Sophie and the others look at the now and the immediate future, Fitz is concerned with the long-term future, a trait I share with him and one that I rarely see in literature whatsoever, to my vast disappointment.

Ro isn't selfish at all. She's much, much worse - she doesn't meddle in other's affairs for her own happiness, she just does because she can. She has no respect for other's privacy, and throws out insults towards Fitz and Sophie because she just does. She has no motive, impetus, or drive, she just does, and it sickens me.

The second type of selfishness is similar to a bully bullying others because they're miserable and it makes them feel good about themselves. It's horrible and malicious, and I'm not condoning it in any way, but its far more innocent (if bullying can be called innocent) then what Ro does.

Ro is malevolent, she doesn't do it because it makes her feel good, she just does it, with no regard with the relationships and lives she destroys in the process. She's a toxic radioactive waste dump of a person. A toxic waste dump doesn't make people sick and die for their own gain - it just does. That's how Ro is as a person.

Another reason is that she has no regard for what she says or does. She constantly tears Fitz down just because she can (I want Alden to be there next time she tries that. I want Alden to step in and tell her that what she is doing is not okay, because no other character has recognized this so far). I want Alden to be there next time she calls his son a nasty little microbe. I'd like to finally see Ro get some comeuppance for her terrible behavior.

Let's be honest with ourselves - Ro hates Fitz. She hates and complains and whines about how perfect he is. Since when has perfection been a crime? Since when is it up to her to decide the maximum amount of talent a person can have? As a perfectionist myself, I strive for perfection just as Fitz does. There is nothing wrong with striving to perfect yourself - there is if you are actively hurting yourself, but if you're naturally gifted like Fitz is, and you want to be the best you can possibly be, go ahead! Make the most of your innate talent and use it to seek your happiest future. Build & write your own happy ending.

She isn't a part of this relationship. She isn't affected by this relationship. She's actively impeding their ability to seek their own happiness, and not even for her own happiness (which is still horrid), she just does because she's "bored". Her repugnant behavior sickens me.

Ro is a textbook abuser. Let's go over a list of things an abuser does, and see to which characters she applies them to:

Name-Calling: The abuser will blatantly call the abused derogatory adjectives, like stupid or oblivious

We know she does this to Sophie, calling her oblivious. She also twists being perfect into a derogatory adjective, throwing it at Fitz. She also called Fitz a horrible little microbe, along with calling him & Keefe as stupid as amoeba.

Character Assassination: The abuser will use the word "always". You're always oblivious, stupid, late, wrong, etc.

She does this to Sophie, and also somewhat Fitz.

Patronizing: The abuser will be patronizing towards the abused

She does this to Sophie, Fitz, and Keefe.

Belittling: The abuser will belittle the abused

I'm pretty sure she does this to Sophie, Fitz, and Keefe.

Pushing Buttons: Once the abuser finds out what annoys the abused, they will do it nonstop.

Oh boy, does she do this to Keefe and Sophie. (Fitz just gets out of his way to ignore her and avoid her. It's why she's irritated by him, he hasn't opened himself to her and doesn't show flaws allowing her to find ways to sink her nasty manipulating fingers into him)

These are only a few signs of someone being an abuser, and yet Ro manages to hit pretty much all of them.

She gaslights Keefe into believing that Alden is only looking out for himself and his children - something we know to be completely wrong. She's driving a wedge between Keefe and Alden, one of the few other people Keefe respects and thinks looks out for him. The only other parental individual in Keefe's life, in fact, giving Ro total access to Keefe's psyche and making herself the only "true" source of information Keefe can trust. She is a horrible, horrible abuser.

Ro doesn't have benign intentions at heart. She doesn't even have selfish intentions at heart. She just meddles just because she can.

Ro isn’t selfish. She’s just a bad person - for a lack of a better term that would describe her repulsive behavior.

She constantly complains about the elves. Yes, elven culture is a little weird, but you don’t have to complain about it constantly and in-front of the elves.

Ro is also clearly not afraid to gaslight. She forces Keefe to believe that her opinions are the only valid ones. How does she do this? She says that "Blondie doesn't know what she feels," making Keefe think that any emotions he picks up from her are wrong. She says that Fitz is just "Captain Perfect" who doesn't really care about Sophie - that Keefe "deserves" her. She says that Alden's advice is just made up, and that he doesn't really care about him. She’s established herself as the only source of information that Keefe can trust. She’s removed Alden (the one other parental figure Keefe had) and established herself as the only person Keefe can trust. And that is very dangerous and highly abusive.

She even invalidates Keefe's emotions. Every time Keefe stands up to her and says something like "I'm just being a good friend," Ro responds (like any of this is her business) with something snarky. Or, she tells him to "stop being so afraid." And that forces Keefe to believe that his desire to help his friends isn't valid enough. That he isn't valid enough. So he comes crawling back to Ro.

She’s a terrible bodyguard. She threatens to not protect Keefe in Legacy if Sophie doesn’t share her secret with her. THAT IS NOT OK UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES. SOPHIE DID NOT TRUST KEEFE WITH HER SECRET OF BEING UNMATCHABLE. RO EXTORTED IT OUT OF HER, USING KEEFE AS A LIE DETECTOR. THAT IS NOT OK; IT IS EVIL.

If you re-read the portion in Legacy where she does this, it reveals some truly horrible behavior.

Here’s another direct quote from JaxTheShade explaining why this part is so disgusting:

“Essentially, Ro is blackmailing Sophie.

Sophie just found out that if Keefe goes anywhere near the Neverseen, he will probably die. ( Because at this point, they just thought the legacy thing would kill him ). So she's desperately trying to get Keefe to make a promise and stay away from Gisela. Keefe, in typical fashion, adamantly states that he's not going to be locked up.

This is where Ro steps in.

She says that she will be the one to protect him and make sure he doesn't run off. ( Since she is his bodyguard ). But instead of just...doing her job...she decides that she can exploit the situation. She can get something out of this.

She figured out that Sophie is hiding something. And from the way she hasn't told anyone yet, Ro can assume that she's trying to keep it a secret. But she also knows that Keefe's safety is important to all of them.

So she threatens Keefe's life--yes, threatens--unless Sophie spills her secret. The situation becomes, "I have all the power here, so unless you tell me a confidential secret, I'll let my charge run off into danger, which you can't have. So I know that I've put you into a corner. I know that I've won here."

If this doesn't scream "manipulative abuser", then I don't know what does.

It's disgusting, really. Ro's behaviour is despicable.

And while her blatant blackmail is clearly the worst offense, she also sprinkled in several other "I'm a bad person" actions.

1) She said that the reason Keefe gets away with things is because she "doesn't care enough to fight him" on them. Well, if you don't care, then why don't you just go back to Ravagog? Because Keefe is the second most threatened person their group, and he needs an actual bodyguard, not a manipulative princess who makes him feel even worse about himself. If Keefe gets hurt when he runs off, did he get hurt because you "didn't care enough to bother"?

2) Ro says that she doesn't care that much about him. Well, thanks, Ro. I'm sure that really makes Keefe sleep soundly at night, knowing that you don't really care about him.

3) And why does she not really care about him? Because she only bothers with Keefe as long as he doesn't make her "look bad". She says that the reason she's stopping him this time is because it'll damage her reputation if he dies. You know, instead of being worried about his life.

4) She says "I enjoy meddling". And that's her excuse for blackmailing Sophie into spilling a confidential secret. And yet she has the audacity to accuse Alden of "meddling" while here she sits, admitting it to everyone and acting like it's not a big deal.

5) Her very last line in the quote just further proves that she's just doing this to get Sokeefe to happen. Instead of feeling remorse for Sophie, who is trying not to look at them and clearly uncomfortable, she just brushes off the secret that she just forced out of her by saying that "it should do the trick". The trick being 'getting Fitz to break up with her'.

This is probably Ro's most egregious act yet.

And yet nobody ever seems to call her out for it or even think that...it's a little weird that she would do this.

But I guess it really isn't weird at all, seeing as we've have evidence in the past that proves she would stoop to this level.” - JaxTheShade

That part in Unlocked where Shannon said that (deeeeeeeeeeeep down) Ro cares about Keefe? Well, it’s ooc. Look what Ro says in Legacy:  "I may not care that much about what happens to you, but if you get yourself killed on my watch, it makes me look bad—especially if I had advance notice. So, I can’t have that."

Re-read that portion in Legacy. Alarm bells should be going off in your head.

She reminds me of the villain Ellsworth Monkton Toohey from The Fountainhead. Do you know what he did? He turned people into slaves by establishing psychological power over them and making them miserable. By killing their wants, needs, desires, and happiness, he turned people into miserable slaves who would obey his every order. And the scary part? Ro uses the exact. same. tactics. that he does (not going to list them here, that would take far too long) on Fitz, Sophie, and Keefe. And Keefe almost perfectly resembles the characters who fall for his manipulations and tactics, while Sophie and Fitz resemble the characters who ignored him and went about their business. It’s really unnerving.

Everyone is entitled to seek their own happiness - as long as their actions don't impede others from seeking their own happiness.

Ro actively impedes Sophie, Fitz, and Keefe's pursuit of their own happiness, doing it for no other reason than the fact that she's bored. It sickens me.

And the fact that Fitz is basically demonized and hated by the fandom while praising Ro is what sickens me the most.

Ro manipulates, gaslights, and abuses Sophie, Keefe, and Fitz for her own fun. She doesn't have any long term goal, just destroying their psyche and impeding their ability to find their own happiness for short term amusement. She mocks Fitz for being trying to be perfect (since when has that been a crime?), she gaslights and Objectifies Sophie, mocks Keefe and openly abuses him, and interferes with their relationships because she finds it funny. She's also a misandrist. She calls Fitz a nasty little microbe (I want Alden and Della there next time she does that). She objectifies Sophie as a trophy for Fitz and Sophie to fight over. She constantly tears down Fitz and Sophie, and uses a number of tactics abusers use in real life on Fitz, Sophie, and Keefe. She is a radioactive toxic waste-dump of a person, ruining their lives and psyches not even for her own gain, but just for her own amusement. Her further abuse of Keefe is repugnant, her objectification of Sophie is disgusting, and her mocking and bullying of Fitz makes me want to puke. She's a terrible, terrible person.

And that is why I hate Ro.

[bloody-wonder]

sorry if you've already been asked this question, but what are your opinions on the whole 'andrew choking kevin = abusive' thing? i personally didnt find it abusive, but i do think that it isn't necessarily something andrew would do to kevin especially when you take into account his need for keeping promises and sticking to your word. you're the only person i trust to talk about aftg canon so im curious

yeah i’ve talked about it a lot already but to give you an answer more specific to your question

first of all, if something happens in the books then it’s canon period. i can understand people not wanting to accept the extra content as canon but we have to agree on some common ground as to what is canon in order to have productive discussions and analyses and i think that the books that have been published as a complete three-part story are a good candidate. books = canon. andrew choking kevin = canon. nicky forcing himself upon neil = canon. casual ableism showcased by everyone = canon. love it or hate it, take it or leave it.

secondly, in order to say whether andrew’s abusive we have to define abusive. if it’s about physical violence than he’s no more abusive than other foxes most of whom have puched someone at least once throughout the books. if it’s not just about physical violence than maybe he is what do i know. what confuses me however is that people treat it like some big revelation - as though andrew used to be this perfect gentleman who has charmed his way into our graces but now it turns out that he actually is a jerk - how scandalous! newsflash: andrew often relies on violence to achieve his ends when he believes other ways to be unproductive for whatever reason - and often he goes too far. that’s just how he is and we know why. is it good? no. is it canon? yes. sorry that you read aftg a long time ago and canon andrew isn’t as chivalrous as you remember.

and thirdly in regard to how he allegedly broke his promise to kevin - we don’t actually know the terms of their deal do we? but based on the context i suppose that andrew promised kevin to protect him from the moriyamas or from riko - he never promised he’d never lay his hand on kevin. i vaguely remember them shoving each other on the court either in book one or two, so it’s not like rough manhandling was off the table. add andrew’s generally bad temper and desperation after neil’s disappearance and it’s not hard to imagine him going too far with that.

lastly, i think a helpful idea in this discussion would be do dispense with the essentialism: if someone hits another person (= does an abusive thing) it doesn’t mean that they instantly become an abuser. watch contrapoints video on cancel culture, she’ll explain. bcs i think at this point i’m okay with the statement “andrew choking kevin is abusive”, but i still think that “andrew is an abuser” is quite far-fetched. now, even if we agree to use statement one, there’s still the question of why there are no discourses “matt punching kevin is abusive” or “allison slapping aaron is abusive” in sight. why andrew? bcs it seems there are lots of people who just don’t like him and they have to exist in a fandom where everyone adores him. while i don’t agree with them i can relate to the need to have a problematic incident from canon caused by a character who happens to be extremely popular discussed and the offending character condemned. but i talked about nicky at length a couple of month ago and now i feel better for it. so i think they should just have their discourse over there just like i have mine over here with a series of blocks conveniently dividing us. maybe they will blow off their steam very soon just like i did.

[nightcoremoon]

potentially controversial post ahead

Republicans: literally running a gestapo, literally murdering brown people, literally screaming for mexicans to "go back home", literally funding racist domestic terror organizations, literally covering up internalized pedophilia scandals, literally driving this county into the fucking ground

Joe Biden: says something taken out of context and overanalyzed to be indicative of some slight racist tendencies which is to be 100% fully expected from a white man in america

You dumb motherfuckers: they're the same thing, both evil, don't vote for biden if he wins the candidacy or you're a racist too, this is a rational mindset to have, this exact same mentality towards clinton lead to landing trump in the white house once already but I'm a dumb motherfucker who never learns so I'm gonna shit on and disparage everyone who isn't sanders (until we dig up some random dirt on him saying he's *throws dart* misogynist) or cortes (until we dig up some random dirt on her says she's *spins wheel* ableist) or whoever the fuck else while being terrible because HEY NEWSFLASH! ALL POLITICIANS ARE BAD!

so you gotta choose who's less bad. and, like, literally anyone would be better than trump for ever singly minority demographic in america.

all white people are racist in some capacity so it's fucking stupid to just discount every white potential candidate for being ~racist when the opposition is goddamn rice and milk on a paper plate in a snowstorm with an unhealthy tinge of orange spraytan. there's a fucking difference between "all blacks are rapists" racism and "hey brown skinned people are given worse opportunities for education than white people so let me make a careless offhand remark that's incredibly tasteless and sounds bad out of context" racism, and "let's shoot unarmed black kids because we cops can get away with it" racism and "I sing gold digger by kanye west and say every word even though I'm white" racism, and "fuck muslims, we should kill them all" racism and "I'm too stupid and narcissistic to understand why any person would have a different upbringing than me and therefore don't know why affirmative action is necessary in situations that I've never encountered" racism, and "BLM are terrorists and kaepernick is the antichrist" racism and "I don't like rap music" racism. like yeah it's all bad and it's all terrible and life is a fucking nightmare for poc in america but logically microaggressions are a better alternative than being murdered, right? there's no magic off switch to turn off all racism forever, but there's a way to make it less bad if even slightly.

but if the prospect of joe "literally obama's vice president" biden sometimes saying dumb and kinda racist shit is JUST AS BAD as donald "literally throwing kids into concentration camps for being brown" trump, then go off.

but like... ethnicity isn't the only demographic that's being treated like shit, being murdered, and having civil liberties stripped from them. if y'all are fine keeping trump in office because biden's "also racist", keep in mind that all the impoverished, the female, the gay, the trans, the disabled, the sick, the mentally ill, the autistic, the jewish, the muslim, the homeless, and the dissenters, they all get fucked too.

it just blows my mind that the radicals and the extreme left are so hard-on for an unattainable image of fucking perfection that nothing short of god herself will ever be good enough for us, that they're willing to let the tangerine stay??? stupid, stupid, stupid. but whatever, what do I know, I'm just affected by the decisions of the government of the country i'm forced to live in.

if biden becomes the democratic candidate I'm fucking voting for him because he'll be the democratic candidate. don't @ me if you don't like it because like it or not we have a 2 party system. so don't blame me. I voted for kodos.

inb4 I get a swarm of angry hatemail calling me racist and telling me to kill myself just because I dared to say that trump is far more of a majorly dangerous problem to ethnic minorities than joe "again, literally obama's vice president" biden ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

btw:

fuck republicans

fuck you if you're a conservative

fuck off if you're in the right wing

eat a dick if you're in the GOP

and all nazis and fascists must die

[southsidestory]

#across the stars (a wank wars story)

SUMMARY: Across the Stars dramatizes the story of the real life Skywalker clan, and fans of the show have built a legion of fractured followers across social media. Ben Solo goes by @mynameiskyloren, and his dealings with Rey, aka his rival fandom leader @jakkujunkrat, bring more than his true identity to light.

NOTES: This is the Star Wars social media fic that absolutely no one asked for. At best I can call this romantic crack with a dose of seriousness, and at worst the result of my brain weasels. Either way, it’s somewhat of an ode to tumblr and its crazy. If this isn’t a dumpster fire, please let me know! (PS my awesome husband helped me brainstorm for this, the evil genius.)

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a long time ago in a fandom far, far away...

WANK

WARS

EPISODE VIII

ACROSS THE STARS

It is a period of civil war. Fans of popular historical holodrama ACROSS THE STARS squee over the Skywalker family legacy. The show’s three arcs, Republic, Rebellion, and Resistance, have earned critical acclaim and a legion of followers. In the wait between Seasons 7 and 8, WANK WARS fueled by boredom have gripped the fandom as they never have before.

The FIRST ORDER disparages AtS for its failure to dramatize the real Skywalkers' lives with historical accuracy after Season 3. @thesupremeleader, a BNF known only as Snoke, instigates drama whenever the fandom threatens to settle down.

But @mynameiskyloren, Snoke’s loyal devotee, is keeping his true identity hidden from the fandom. It’s only a matter of time before his dealings with @jakkujunkrat draw him away from the First Order, and he makes enemies of his former friends...

—

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15 days before the Season 8 premiere

jakkujunkrat

Look @mynameiskyloren I really don’t care about the historical accuracy of seasons 4-7. Most of us are here to have fun, to write fic and make art and shitpost about our favorite characters. You and your anti brigade need to get off your high tauntauns and face facts: Across the Stars prioritizes good storytelling over everything else. If you can’t accept that maybe you should move your ass along to another fandom instead of harassing the people who are here to celebrate something we love. I mean, this is a holodrama. Don’t you have anything better to do than fight over a piece of fiction???

#ats #wank wars #first order bs #fuck you very much

mynameiskyloren

You’re a hypocrite @jakkujunkrat. You’re arguing over a holodrama too, so you must not have anything better to do either.

And in case you haven’t noticed, this isn’t just fiction. These are real people’s lives being portrayed for mass consumption. Seasons 1-3 dealt in facts, and it still managed to draw all of us in, so don’t feed me that shit line that following real events doesn’t make for a good story.

Just be honest: you’re here to ship Han and Leia, and you don’t care what their marriage is like irl as long as you get their perfect love story in AtS. Maybe YOU should gtfo and find somewhere else to fangirl.

Or you know, just stick to scavenging, since that’s probably all you’re good at.

#ats #hanleia shippers are the worst #and jakkujunkrat is their queen #fuck you too sweetheart

fn-1337

Calm down, mynameisasshole. Dragging Rey’s real life into a fandom fight is a dick move. Especially since your privileged ass probably doesn’t know the first thing about the kind of hard work Rey does every day. So sit down and shut up.

#wank wars #first order bs #leave my friend alone

—

—

14 days before the Season 8 premiere

jakkujunkrat

unpopular opinion: Yav Korren is a good-looking man and a great actor, but he is not as hot as the real Ben Solo.

#ben solo #my husband #apologies to yav #but otherwise sorrynotsorry #all these candids of ben cropping up on my dash are fucking me up #han and leia made the best looking son #they have good genes

starfleet-ace

lmao someone is thirsty. that’s an unpopular opinion for a reason, rey. you know i love you, but we’re gonna have to agree to disagree on that one. back me up @fn-1337

#yav korren is almost as hot as my boyfriend

fn-1337

Sorry baby, no can do. I’m with Rey on this one.

#<3 #ily poe

jakkujunkrat

Ben Solo is boyfriend goals. Fight me.

#we appreciate ben solo in this house #don’t come on my lawn and disparage my man #ben solo

themaidofstarkiller

Sorry @jakkujunkrat, it’s gross enough to ship real people, but openly talking about a 19-year-old celebrity child like he’s a piece of meat takes it to the next level. You’re really something else. Am I right, or am I right @therealhux @mynameiskyloren

#RPF is the stuff of nightmares #creeping on a real kid is even worse

therealhux

100% correct, Phasma. I couldn’t agree more.

mynameiskyloren

I hate to ever support @jakkujunkrat, but I don’t think it’s fair to criticize her just for having a celebrity crush. Who the hell doesn’t?

And she’s right about Ben Solo. Definitely better looking than Yav Korren.

jakkujunkrat

@themaidofstarkiller I’m 18, which I have plastered across the top of my blog. You stalk me too much not to already know that, so you can stfu with pulling Ben Solo’s age like it’s a receipt.

and kylo… did you just defend me??

#is the sky falling?

mynameiskyloren

Don’t get used to it, junkrat.

—

—

13 days before the Season 8 premiere

thesupremeleader

Just a reminder to the First Order that I have a zero tolerance policy for talking to Resistance fans.

I’m not going to call you out, but you know who you are.

#stay away from the resistance #if you want to keep your place on the right side of this fandom

therealhux

There’s no accounting for taste these days.

#not that I would expect better from the fan in question #he has so much trouble following the rules #like a toddler

mynameiskyloren

@therealhux if you have something to say to me, go ahead and say it.

#vagueposts are for cowards

therealhux

I just did. Or did you miss it with that goldfish attention span of yours?

#don’t see you calling thesupremeleader a coward

mynameiskyloren

Fuck you.

therealhux

So eloquent.

thesupremeleader

I don’t think you have room to further alienate your allies right now, Kylo. You’re on thin ice.

#get it together

mynameiskyloren

sorry @thesupremeleader

—

PRIVATE MESSAGES

jakkujunkrat: finn, are you seeing this?

fn-1337: you mean mynameisasshole taking heat from the first order BNFs? yeah i’m seeing it, and it tastes like sweet sweet comeuppance.

jakkujunkrat: i know i shouldn’t, but i feel kind of bad for him. he’s getting roasted by snoke and hux just for being nice to me. do you think i should say something?

fn-1337: rey. are you kidding me? this is the guy who’s been giving you hell for *four* years. remember that time he left a nasty review on your post-canon fic? he called it what… “repetitive and trite”?

jakkujunkrat: okay. good point. he can fend for himself.

—

—

12 days before the Season 8 premiere

jakkujunkrat

This is the worst selfie in the world, but here you go. My sunburned face in all its glory.

#it me #forgive me for dirtying your dash with this

themaidofstarkiller

You should change your handle to jakkuleatherface. Or buy some sunscreen.

#she’s going to look 50 when she’s 30 #jakkujunkrat

therealhux

No wonder you’re single @jakkujunkrat

#I knew that someone that bitchy couldn’t be pretty

fn-1337

Don’t listen to a word these shitheads are saying, Rey. You’re beautiful.

#say one more word and i will drag you guys to hell and back

starfleet-ace

hux: i don’t think your pasty ginger ass gets to talk about anyone else’s looks

phasma: you’re as pretty on the outside as you are on the inside. which is to say ugly af

rey: you’re stunning, and they’re just jealous.

#you guys are really reaching here

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PRIVATE MESSAGES

fn-1337: Rey? You okay?

jakkujunkrat: yeah. i’m fine. just don’t really wanna talk right now.

fn-1337: all right, peanut. let me know if you need me. i’m here all night.

—

JAKKUJUNKRAT INBOX - ask me whatever as long as it’s nice

Anonymous

Hey. I’m really sorry to see all the hate you’re getting about your selfie. I hope this isn’t creepy coming from anon, but… I just want you to know that you’re really pretty, and those guys are being assholes. It’s got nothing to do with the way you look. They’d say the same thing to any Resistance fan.

jakkujunkrat

Thanks, nonny. I really needed to hear that.

And thank you @starfleet-ace and @fn-1337 for being awesome. You guys are the best friends a girl could ask for.

—

—

11 days before the Season 8 premiere

jakkujunkrat

I need to take a break from fandom for a little while. Real life is catching up with me, and the rig I’ve put together to even get a slow shitty connection to the holonet is breaking down. I need to put my scavenger hat on and do some maintenance.

See you guys in a few days.

#it’s just a brief hiatus #i promise i’m not ghosting #personal

fn-1337

Take care, peanut. <3

#best friend #see you soon rey

therealhux

Maybe with the queen gone the peasants will settle down.

bee-bee-ate

I have a finger to point at you @therealhux. Here is a clue: it is not the index or the pinky, or the ring or the thumb. It’s the one you put up when you don’t give a fuck. :D

#choke bitch

—

—

10 days before the Season 8 premiere

fn-1337

Look, all I’m saying is that old!Han and old!Leia’s actors absolutely killed it in Season 7, and I can’t wait to see what they do in Season 8.

#my dash is flooded with promo photos of my OTP #and all I want to do is write HanLeia #ONLY TEN MORE DAYS

mynameiskyloren

Newsflash: your OTP is separated irl. Kills the romance a little doesn’t it?

If Season 8 is full of the same used romantic tropes that 4-7 was full of idk if I’m even going to stick around for it.

#god i hate this fandom #fuck the resistance

fn-1337

I’ve never prayed harder for used romantic tropes in my life.

#mynameisasshole strikes again #and for the record i only ship HanLeia in AtS #not irl #wank wars #first order bs

—

—

9 days before the Season 8 premiere

JAKKUJUNKRAT INBOX - ask me anything mean and you’ll be blocked

Anonymous

Hi. I know you said you were going to be gone for a little while, but I was just wondering if there’s an ETA on when you might be back? The fandom is pretty boring without you, junkrat.

—

PRIVATE MESSAGING

jakkujunkrat: ...did you send me that anon?

mynameiskyloren: no. if i have something to say to you i’ll say it to your face

jakkujunkrat: come off it, kylo. nobody calls me just “junkrat” but you. i’m “rey” to everybody in the resistance, and first order idiots would never send me anything that nice.

jakkujunkrat: kylo? you there?

mynameiskyloren: i’m here

jakkujunkrat: well. you sent it, right?

mynameiskyloren: yeah i did. but i can explain

jakkujunkrat: explain being decent to me? yeah that’s gonna require a fucking thesis.

jakkujunkrat: you’ve done nothing but harass me since i got involved in this fandom

mynameiskyloren: give me a break, rey

jakkujunkrat: i’m not giving you anything

mynameiskyloren: fine then there’s no point in having this conversation

jakkujunkrat: just be honest. why’d you send me that ask?

mynameiskyloren: because you seem all right. i still disagree with you about pretty much everything AtS related but… i don’t know. i’m starting to think that’s not a good enough reason to give you hell

mynameiskyloren: i think if i’d met you irl we could have gotten along. you have to admit that we keep up with each other pretty well.

mynameiskyloren: rey? say something

jakkujunkrat: i have to go

—

—

8 days before the Season 8 premiere

therealhux

Attention, all First Order fans: one of our own has been fraternizing with the resistance. And what’s more, he’s been stringing us along from day one.

@mynameiskyloren has lied about his age, where he lives, and who he is. He also has a relationship with the Across the Stars cast and their real life counterparts, which he’s been hiding for seven years.

Kylo Ren is actually Ben Solo, and if you don’t believe me I’ve got receipts and all of his personal information below the cut.

[Read More]

#payback is a bitch #mynameisalie

themaidofstarkiller

Hux. Is this some kind of joke??

starfleet-ace

@therealhux did you seriously just doxx one of your own??? wow you’re a piece of shit

fn-1337

Why isn’t anyone commenting on the fact that one of the biggest antis in this fandom is BEN FUCKING SOLO?!! ACTUAL SON OF THE REAL HAN AND LEIA!

#holy shit #it explains a lot at least #oh god i’ve been shipping his parents’ characters

fn-1337

@jakkujunkrat REEEEYYYYYYY

bee-bee-ate

This is gross. Real life identities should be protected, not revealed. Shame on you @therealhux

a-new-rose

Wow. This is crazy. I just got to this fandom and it’s kind of exploding…

#this guy can’t really be ben solo tho right?

thesupremeleader

I don’t think it needs to be said, but if anyone hasn’t put it together yet: mynameiskyloren is no longer welcome in this fandom.

#that’s what you get for lying

—

PRIVATE MESSAGES

jakkujunkrat: kylo? is it true?

sorry, this blog does not exist

—

—

7 days before the Season 8 premiere

mynameisbensolo

Hi everyone. This is the former mynameiskyloren here. There’s been a lot of stuff said about me in the last twenty-four hours, and I want to clear it up.

1) @therealhux did doxx me, which is low even for him.

2) I was talking to someone from the resistance, and the reason why is that I’m coming to see the damage that anti behavior can cause. I’ll make a more detailed post on that later, but in short, it’s going to involve a lot of apologizing.

3) In case you hadn’t guessed from my new handle: yes, I am Ben Solo.

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PRIVATE MESSAGES

starfleet-ace: REY where are you?? finn is flipping out and i can’t handle a fanboy meltdown this big on my own

starfleet-ace: Rey?

—

JAKKUJUNKRAT ACTIVITY FEED

mynameisbensolo is following you

—

JAKKUJUNKRAT INBOX - don’t ask me anything about ben solo

Anonymous

HOLY HELL!! mynameiskyloren is Ben Solo?!! pls tell me what you think about all of this Rey

Anonymous

ok i can see that u don’t want to be asked about ben solo, buuuut… you know we’re all dying to hear from you, right? i mean, you made that post about ben solo being hot, and then he turns out to be kylo!! come on Rey, throw us a bone here!

—

PRIVATE MESSAGES

fn-1337: rey, i know this has gotta be pretty weird, but i’m starting to get worried about you. can you please come online long enough to let me know you’re all right?

jakkujunkrat: hey finn. i’m sorry for disappearing. this is all just… a lot.

fn-1337: yeah, i guess it would be.

fn-1337: can i ask you a question?

jakkujunkrat: always

fn-1337: are you the one he was talking to?

jakkujunkrat: yep. and he followed me this morning. idk what to do, finn.

fn-1337: you don’t have to do anything. you don’t owe him shit just because he decided to finally act like a human being. not after the way he’s treated all of us.

jakkujunkrat: i know that. really, i do.

fn-1337: then what’s the problem?

jakkujunkrat: the problem is that i think i was starting to like him. and now he’s… he’s ben solo. how am i supposed to talk to ben solo?

fn-1337: he’s just a person, peanut. an asshole, but a person.

—

—

6 days before the Season 8 premiere

jakkujunkrat

Guys. I know you’re interested in what I think about the Kylo Ren / Ben Solo thing, but I would really appreciate it if you’d stop sending me messages about it. I’ve turned off anon for now. All of you have a nice day.

#sorry #this is getting to be a bit much

therealhux

So are you guys running off into the sunset together yet?

#you don’t have anyone fooled

jakkujunkrat

It looks like you can’t read: I’m not talking about Ben.

#your name should be therealilliterate

themaidofstarkiller

Our resident pathological liar certainly has the money to fly to Jakku. You two fucking yet?

#jakkuleatherface

this post has been deleted

—

PRIVATE MESSAGES

mynameisbensolo: Rey? I understand if you don’t want to talk to me, but if you can, let me know

—

—

5 days before the Season 8 premiere

fn-1337

It seems like this fandom has forgotten why we’re really here. Season 8 starts in FIVE DAYS, so can we please forget about doxxing drama and focus on the fun?

#damn #ats #ats season 8 #FIVE DAYS in case i didn’t say it loud enough for the people in the back

bee-bee-ate

I am with you @fn-1337!

a-new-rose

Am I the only one that thinks @bee-bee-ate is some kind of resistance bot?

—

starfleet-ace

in entirely unrelated news, is anyone else sick of Snoke’s stupidly detailed metas with a list of citations longer than his arm? we really don’t care how many degrees you have, man. it’s just a holodrama and you’re treating fandom like a history test you have to pass.

thesupremeleader

I think it’s safe to say that you wouldn’t know much about passing history tests @starfleet-ace.

—

FN-1337 INBOX - don’t bother with hate

bee-bee-ate

Are you going to roast Snoke for calling your boyfriend stupid?

fn-1337

You bet your ass I am.

#bring it you supreme idiot #i’m about to rip you apart

—

—

4 days before the Season 8 premiere

PRIVATE MESSAGES

jakkujunkrat: Ben? I’m here

mynameisbensolo: Damn. It’s really nice to be called by my real name lol

jakkujunkrat: lol I guess so

mynameisbenolo: Rey, I know it probably doesn’t mean much, but I’m sorry for everything I did to you. I hurt you and I bothered the hell out of you, and if I could take it back I would.

jakkujunkrat: It’s not okay, but I believe you. And I guess I can see now why you were so sensitive about the show. It must be weird to see yourself represented on screen like that.

mynameisbensolo: lol yeah. Especially when the popular opinion is that Yav Korren is a lot better looking than me :/

jakkujunkrat: Well. Not to me. But I guess you know that.

jakkujunkrat: this is so embarrassing.

mynameisbensolo: i saw that you deleted everything you had tagged with my name

jakkujunkrat: what, you went looking through it? That’s not narcissistic at all.

mynameisbensolo: better than tagging a stranger #my husband

jakkujunkrat: i don’t know why i thought i could talk to you. i don’t care who you are, you’re still awful

mynameisbensolo: wait i’m sorry rey don’t go

mynameisbensolo: please

jakkujunkrat: why shouldn’t i?

mynameisbensolo: i wasn’t trying to be mean

jakkujunkrat: and yet

mynameisbensolo: Stop it. Stop acting like you don’t feel this too.

jakkujunkrat: i don’t know what you’re talking about.

mynameisbensolo: Then I’ll be more explicit. I like you. I think you’re gorgeous and funny and smart, and I’ve wanted to kiss you for awhile. Long before I had any idea what you looked like.

mynameisbensolo: Still don’t know what I’m talking about, sweetheart?

jakkujunkrat: i can’t do this right now. i have to work if I want to eat. Literally.

mynameisbensolo: please don’t disappear again

—

—

3 days before the Season 8 premiere

fn-1337

If one more person sends @jakkujunkrat another message or hijacks her posts with questions about Ben Solo I will personally escort them to the nearest burn unit.

#not kidding #not even a little bit #leave my friend alone #sologate

starfleet-ace

get these thugs, finn.

bee-bee-ate

I support this action.

#protect our scavenger queen

—

PRIVATE MESSAGES

jakkujunkrat: all right. let’s talk.

mynameisbensolo: I’m really glad you said that. Because… okay don’t be mad. Please.

jakkujunkrat: ...why would I be mad?

mynameisbensolo: I’m kind of. Here.

jakkujunkrat: what do you mean “here”?

mynameisbensolo: as in, on Jakku. I’m at Niima Outpost right now. I’ve tried getting directions from about ten different people but they either don’t speak Basic or have no idea where you live.

jakkujunkrat: you’ve got to be joking. are you joking?

mynameisbensolo: Depends on how angry you’ll be if I say “no”

jakkujunkrat: You have to leave. Right now.

mynameisbensolo: Oh. Okay.

mynameisbensolo: I’m really sorry, Rey I don’t know what I was thinking. I just knew you were here, and I wanted to have a chance to talk to you in person. But if you want me to go, I’ll go.

jakkujunkrat: then get out of here

—

mynameisbensolo

Please forgive me.

#do not reblog

—

—

2 days before the Season 8 premiere

therealhux

All I’m going to say is that you got what was coming to you.

#no i don’t regret doxxing him #stop asking

themaidofstarkiller

^^^

#lol #revenge is delicious

mitakahere

Do you think they’re broken up? Or were they ever together?

#forgive him rey!! #i don’t know what he did #but pls forgive him

fn-1337

Full offense @mitakahere but this is none of your business.

#leave my friend alone #i’m getting really tired of tagging that

themaidofstarkiller

Resistance morons aren’t welcome on this thread @fn-1337

Get the hell off Hux’s post.

#they’re just everywhere aren’t they? #but finn is the worst

bee-bee-ate

@themaidofstarkiller you have a bad dye job and a worse attitude. Perhaps you should consider a personality recalibration.

#i could help with that! :D

—

PRIVATE MESSAGES

jakkujunkrat: Ben?

mynameisbensolo: yes?

jakkujunkrat: where are you?

mynameisbensolo: on Hosnian Prime. Why?

jakkujunkrat: please come back to Jakku

mynameisbensolo: really? You’re not messing with me, are you?

jakkujunkrat: really. I’ve never had a visitor before, and you surprised me by just showing up unannounced. which wasn’t all right by the way.

mynameisbensolo: I know. I won’t do it again.

jakkujunkrat: stop messaging me and get on a ship.

mynameisbensolo: as you wish, sweetheart.

—

—

1 day before the Season 8 premiere

starfleet-ace

okay i think that no matter where you stand in this fandom, we can all agree that tomorrow is gonna be awesome. we’ve been waiting a year for this! don’t let us down, Rian!

fn-1337

You can say that again, love.

#ONE DAY #ONE MORE DAY #THAT’S IT #23 HOURS AND 14 MINUTES TO BE EXACT

—

PRIVATE MESSAGES

fn-1337: Rey??? Where r u? I need someone to celebrate with.

jakkujunkrat: sorry finn, i’m busy.

fn-1337: what are you doing that makes you too busy to cheer with me?!

jakkujunkrat: ...you wouldn’t believe me if i told you. catch you later!

fn-1337: oh come on, you can’t do this to me

fn-1337: REYYYY

—

—

Season 8 premiere of Across the Stars

—

fn-1337

DID YOU SEE THAT? @starfleet-ace?!

#i’m fucking dying #this is the most amazing day of my life #well except for when poe agreed to go out with me #STILL #it’s great #ats season 8 #ats

starfleet-ace

yeah i saw it! best season premiere ever.

#love you finn

therealhux

I can’t believe we can agree on something.

#this is a novel experience #ats season 8 #if they keep this up the show might actually become worthwhile again

bee-bee-ate

The astromech droid is my favorite character.

#so relatable

mitakahere

Where the hell is Rey?! @jakkujunkrat

#come back our scavenger queen #we miss you

—

MYNAMEISBENSOLO INBOX

Anonymous

Did it really happen like this? Please you have to tell us!!

—

PRIVATE MESSAGES

mynameisbensolo: are you seeing this?

jakkujunkrat: of course :)

jakkujunkrat: watching Yav is pretty weird now that i’ve met you

mynameisbensolo: still think i’m the better looking one now that you’ve seen me up close?

jakkujunkrat: you know i do. at least i really hope so after last night.

mynameisbensolo: are you doing okay? you seemed upset afterward

jakkujunkrat: i’m fine

mynameisbensolo: Rey. I think we’re a little past lying to each other at this point. What’s wrong?

mynameisbensolo: was I bad?

jakkujunkrat: no! no. please don’t think that. it was wonderful, Ben, really. you were wonderful.

mynameisbensolo: so were you. and i really hope it wasn’t the last time i see you. i’d like to come back. Or bring you to Hosnian Prime with me.

jakkujunkrat: I can’t. I can’t leave. That’s why I was upset. My family left me here, and I’m waiting for them to come back for me and I can’t leave. I want to but I can’t and I probably sound really stupid right now but I’ve been waiting all my life and I don’t want it to be for nothing.

mynameisbensolo: it’s all right. You don’t have to go anywhere you’re not ready to go, sweetheart.

mynameisbensolo: And I can wait. If that’s something you want.

jakkujunkrat: It’s not easy. Waiting.

mynameisbensolo: That’s okay. You’re worth it.

—

—

[tigerlover16-uk]

What do you think of the sentiment that Vegeta is getting shafted in Super because he hasn't gotten enough fights this saga and still hasn't killed a main villain?

It’s a load of crock.

Vegeta is one of the most prominent characters in the Dragon Ball canon, and the character who’s gotten the most screen time and relevance in Super after Goku.

Let’s recap shall we. He was the most prominent supporting character in the battle of gods saga, spending a lot of time trying to keep Beerus calm and almost succeeded in getting him to spare the earth and simply give up looking for the super saiyan God before Buu screwed all that up, and then was the only character to put up anything vaguely resembling a decent fight against the God before Goku ascended later, and he played a role in the ssjg ritual as well.

He was prominent throughout the Resurrection F saga, got to kill Captain Ginyu, and managed to ascend to super saiyan blue through sheer vigorous training with Whis for half a year, effectively one upping Goku who had the power of the Gods handed to him initially via a ritual, something Goku regrets because it didn’t feel satisfying. Meaning Vegeta will always have that over Goku. Sure, he didn’t kill Frieza, but that was his own fault for being too slow to finish him and honestly it never felt like a big deal to me.

Vegeta defeated THREE out of five of the universe 6 team in the Champa saga. THREE. Most of their team. In a saga where Buu got shafted, Piccolo had a decent showing against Frost that emphasized his strategic brilliance, but was actively cheated out of his win by Frost cheating with a poison needle, and Vegeta outright forcing him to forfeit before he could fight anyone else just so he could have a crack at Frost.

The Future Trunks saga was full of scenes highlighting Vegeta’s character development by showing how different his relationship with Future Trunks is now. True, he did get defeated twice by Goku Black, once being bad luck due to being surprised by super saiyan rose and being stabbed through the chest (Though despite that he still saved Goku and Trunks by stopping a fatal attack aimed at them), but then near the end he got to deliver an epic and satisfying beatdown to Goku Black to make up for that, and we got that epic father-son galick gun, and the return of Vegito. In a saga that was really more about Future Trunks and giving him the cool power ups and final fight against the main villain (Though not exactly victory), Vegeta got off pretty decently with a fair amount of screen time.

Vegeta appears in a number of breather episodes, and gets tons of shipping moments with Bulma and plenty of decent character moments to himself overall.

And in the Universe Survival saga we got to see further character development from Vegeta involving his reactions to the birth of Bulla, and during the tournament he’s gotten to take out half of universe 9 together with Goku, fought several characters like Ribrianne, eliminated Prum and Dr Rota, as well as Magetta, one of Universe 6′s best fighters. And we know he’ll have an episode involving his relationship with Cabba coming up soon.

Quite frankly, Vegeta has been doing very well for himself. He gets more than most characters do.

And what is this obsession people have with seeing Vegeta, or just their favourite characters in general, killing the main villain of a saga? Goku usually does that because he’s the main character, Dragon Ball as a whole is his story that’s about him and his struggles and progress, so it’s his JOB to defeat the main villains. The only real exceptions were General Blue, who got his butt kicked more by Arale and offed by Tao, Vegeta himself because beating him was a team effort between Goku, Krillin, Gohan and Yajirobe, Gohan with Cell, and Future Trunks and Zen’o with Zamasu.

In the latter case it was because the Future Trunks saga was more said characters story than anyone elses, and with Gohan he was the secondary protagonist throughout DBZ, and was intended at one point to become the main character, so he was an exception. Other than that though, the other characters play SUPPORTING roles, defeating the minion villains, performing other useful duties like gathering the dragon balls and making useful wishes or helping with strategies, or getting beaten to ramp up the tension, have their own lives outside of and coinciding with all the saving the world stuff Goku gets drawn into. And occasionally helping in the major fights but not being the main focus. etc etc. You know, things that supporting characters DO.

A characters worth in a series is not determined by whether they get to beat one of the main villains or not. It’s determined by how well written and developed they are, and how much they contribute in general. And most of Dragon Ball’s characters are well written and interesting in their own right, and have their share of good accomplishments. Vegeta himself has a pretty high body count of defeated villains and other opponents, has had some of the most character development of any characters, plays crucial roles at various points throughout Z and Super (And newsflash: KId Buu’s defeat is partly attributed to him because the spirit bomb was his idea, and he helped hold Buu off long enough so it could actually be formed), and is generally a good character who gets plenty of screen time, as much as he’s worth as the main character’s biggest rival, a major secondary villain throughout most of Z, and is arguably the secondary protagonist for most of Super.

To say Vegeta is getting shafted is like saying Iron Man got shafted in the first Avengers movie because he didn’t get to actually beat Thor in that fight they had.

You want to know what it looks like when a character with potential is being shafted?

Uub was set up by the end of Z to be Goku’s student, a new secondary protagonist, and a probably candidate for new main character in new stories going forward beyond that point.

Then Toei made GT, and they tossed him away in the first episode not to be seen until half way through the show. Where he went on to get his butt handed to him twice, get no development and very little fleshing out, had his only noteworthy contribution in the whole series be to distract Baby briefly so the other characters could power Goku up, and otherwise he only shows up later to get easily beaten up by the main villains without any effort. You could write him out of the show completely, and literally nothing of value would be lost from GT in it’s present state. This from a guy who likely should have had the same prominence Gohan had in Z, or been the main character.

Or, if you want some examples in Super itself.

Majin Buu got all of one fight in Super that wasn’t him getting slapped around by Beerus and that fun little sparring match with Goku as Fit Buu. Other than that, he keeps getting left out of contributing to most conflicts because he literally keeps falling asleep! He hasn’t even had his own breather episode.

Tien did have the most character progression he’s gotten since his fight with Mercenary Tao in that he’s now running his own dojo and training students in Ki control. But his fighting performance? He got his butt handed to him by Roshi and Gohan before the tournament, and in the tournament of power itself his role amounted to “Ring out a guy Roshi had paralysed” and pull an “I’m taking you with me” on Hermila when he sent Tien out of the arena. It was underwhelming, to say the least.

Piccolo I already mentioned how things went for him in the Champa saga, and so far he’s only had some minor scuffles in the Tournament of Power, his cute Uncle Piccoyo moments with Pan, some bonding moments with Gohan here and there, and training Gohan to regain his mystic form and overcome his flaws as a fighter. Which, those moments are good, but they’re few and far between and he hasn’t had a single great fight to himself or a true moment of glory yet.

Goten has still barely done anything going on four sagas, and the only thing we have to expect from him aside from maybe eventually growing into his EoZ self at some point if the show ever goes close to that point in the timeline (Which we still have no idea about yet) is a possible episode involving him, Trunks and Marron protecting Android 17′s island from Poachers. Which, still no word on that after a dozen or so episodes.

And I could give several more examples, plus NUMEROUS other examples from GT, and even some examples from DBZ itself.

But please, tell me again how Vegeta isn’t getting as much screentime as he could and how Super is being totally unfair to him. I really sympathise.

The only people who think Vegeta is getting the short end of the stick in Super are people who misunderstand his role and place in the series, and VASTLY overestimate his importance, and underestimate or are outright dismissive of most other characters in the series. Which is most of his fanbase, aka the source of so many of the bad attitudes and problems in the Dragon Ball fandom.

And keep in mind, I say all this as a big FAN of the character, someone who considers Vegeta their second favourite character in the franchise (Though admittedly it sometimes switches between him and Gohan depending on how I feel and how things are going at a certain point, but Vegeta’s usually at that spot).

Just because certain people WANT a character to get more screentime and prominence in the series, doesn’t mean that character is necessarily entitled to it. There are more than a dozen other characters in Super that actively need some extra screentime and stuff to do a lot more. To anyone who thinks Vegeta is being shafted… imagine his role in Super played out the same way as Tien’s.

As a fan of the character, I’m grateful for the focus Vegeta’s gotten, but I’d be happy if he had less going forward or his role in previous stories was actively lessened in places if it meant giving the other supporting characters more good moments and achievements, and generally more important roles in the story.

I await the flood of hate comments I’m going to get for this post for “Hating” on Vegeta, even though I’m pointing out that he gets it good and several positive things in his favour and making it clear I don’t have anything against the character.

[skeletorific]

How would uf,ut, and us sans react to their s/o's ex coming back saying their still in love with them and that they should forget about sans?

UF!Sans: Its a good date. The two of you have something of a banter going back and forth. He’s finally starting to feel like he’s getting over that awkward transition between friendship and something more. ‘Course, this time it wasn’t all his fault. You were still getting over how it had ended with your ex. He didn’t know them, per se, but he knew they were a real piece of work.

Either way, for today at least, it feels easier. It feels right.

“No, no way.” You laugh. “There is no fuckin way Papyrus sleeps with a nightlight.”

He grins. “’s the truth.”

“Seriously? Tall, Dark and Edgy?”

“Yup” he chuckles. “Used to be really bad when the power would knock off Underground. Loudest I’ve ever heard him yell is when Alphys banged up the Core energy lines to our place. He didn’t sleep for a week.”

“Holy shit.” You grin and shake your head. “Why the hell would you tell me that, now I’m not gonna be able to take him seriously now.”

“Well, do me a favor,” he slipped an arm around your waist. “Make an effort, or its both our asses.”

You lean slightly into him. “I think I can take him.”

“I’d pay to see you try.”

“How much?”

“That depends, how much are you wearin’ during the fight”

You shove his shoulder and grin slightly as he laughs when a sudden voice behind you makes both of you jump slightly.”

“Y/N”

He feels you stiffen and you take a sip of your drink. Your fists clench slightly. “Fuck off.”

“Y/n….come on, I just need a chance.”

“You had a chance. You had fucking twenty. I’m all out.”

He feels his shoulders rising unconsciously as a hard angry knot forms in his rib cage. So this is the Asshole.

They come around from behind you, grabbing your hand and getting way too close for his tastes, but he doesn’t move yet. See what you do. “Baby-”

“Don’t you fucking dare.” You yank your hand out of their grip, and the sting of jealousy is soothed. Yeah, buddy, walk away….not in the mood to pick another fight today…

“Come on, sweetie, what we had was so good, you don’t really wanna give it up, do you?”

“Oh, real good,” you snorted. “I can’t tell what my favorite part was, the looking at other people or the making me feel like shit for breathing your air. Really, there’s too much to choose from.”

They sigh, like they’re the ones suffering. Like they’re dealing with an unreasonable child. Then its like they notice him all of a sudden. “Who the hell is this?”

“This,” he growled. “would be Sans. The current boyfriend.”

“You got a new boyfriend?” They looked at you furiously.

“Funny thing about being broken up.” you say. “You get to do this wild thing called moving on. In my case to greener pastures.”

There’s a slight thrill traveling up his spine. Proud. You’re proud to be seen with him, Proud to rub it in their face.

“I don’t like him.” They shook their head.

“Well, shame, ‘cause I was really hopin to get the invite to your birthday party.” he bit out.

“Y/n, look at him.” they say, leaning into your face a little too close again. “He clearly just wants to get you back home so he can feel you up.”

You slam your drink down and whirl on them, making both of them jump. “’Cause that’s all I’m good for, right? You’ve used that one before. Every friend I made you told me wanted me for one thing and one thing only. Newsflash, I’m not buyin the shit you’re selling.”

“You’re being irrational. Look, let’s just…let’s get you home, okay? We can talk about this.” You make no move and they snatch your wrist.

Too far.

A whisper and crackle of magic and suddenly your ex finds themselves with a hand wrapped painfully around their arm.

“What the hell-”

“they said they’re not interested.” His eye is lit up with red, pulsing magic and his voice is a barely discernable growl. “so let. them. go.”

Slightly cowed, your ex turns pale and drops your hand.

“‘scuse us a second, doll.” he plants a hand firmly on the back of your exes neck as he steers them out of the building.

He comes back a few minutes looking somewhat smug. He won’t tell you what happened (although once pressed he promises he didn’t actually hurt the jackass). Still, the future is brightly ex-less. You see them once or twice more but the second they lay eyes on Sans they’re speedwalking in the opposite direction.

UT!Sans: Its a beautiful day outside. Birds are singing. Flowers are blooming. On days like this, people like your ex….

It had been going so well. For once you had managed to drag Sans’ ass out of bed before 3. You’d had the day off, so the two of you had gone to the park, just to wander around, shoot the breeze a bit. Also, Sans insisted on sampling every hot dog cart in the area.

“Seriously, is this like an ego thing for you?” You say as he dumps the fifth one in your arms. “Trying to prove your stuff was better or something?”

“Nah, ’m too lazy to be competitive.” He grinned, biting into his first one. “Just wanna find out what it tastes like without water sausages.”

“…..you need five for that?”

“Scientific process, babe.” He finishes off the first and moves onto devouring the next. “Gotta compare as many as I can to the control group so I can identify variables.”

You roll your eyes and grin. “Pulling the science thing on me, very good move. Almost distracts me from the fact that you’re full of shit.”

“No, ‘m full of hot dogs.” He grins and moves onto the third. “And-”

“Babe?”

Your shoulders go stiff and you have to force yourself to relax them. You turn around slowly to see your ex. Suitcase in hand, clothes as formal as you remember. Must be on lunch break. It had been a mistake coming this close to their work.

Out of the corner of your eye you see Sans raise a brow, but he stays mercifully quiet.

“I’ve been calling you. Over and over.”

“I know.” You stuff your hands in your pockets, somewhat defensively. “I’ve been ignoring it. Over and over.”

“Why? Am I not worth an answer?” they say. “All that time….and I don’t even get an explanation for you ripping out my heart?”

You know what they’re doing. And its working. That familiar guilt is setting in, and all of a sudden all that matters is them and how they’re feeling. You feel selfish, useless, a burden. “Look, you’re…..you’re right. I should’ve explained myself. I probably owed you that. But…..I can’t do it anymore. I can be with you anymore.”

“What are you talking about, why not?” They seem to notice Sans. “Who’s this.”

“Heya. Sans the skeleton.” Sans says, wiping his face a bit. “I’m….well, their current boyfriend. Guessing you’re the ex they won’t talk about.” He’s clearly trying to stay polite, but there’s an undertone that you know means he’s bristling a bit. 

There’s a look in your ex’s eyes as their eyes travel up and down Sans. A mild disdain. You’d seen that look before, directed at a few friends, and you know they’re looking at the sweatshirt, the old ketchup stains on the hood, the basketball shorts and slippers, and already deciding you’ve lost your mind.

“Y/n….who are you kidding?”

“What?”

“Look, if this was….I don’t know, some crazy attempt to make me jealous or something, you could’ve at least picked a better candidate.” They give Sans another look, the derision even more evident. “Look, let’s just go home, okay? I get off in a few hours, we can talk about this then.”

“No! Look, I told you, I can’t-”

“Don’t be stupid.” They say coolly. “You and I both know you can’t live without me.

“Hey, buddy,” Sans says. “I’m not appreciatin the tone you’re taking.”

“Look, Sam, was it?” They say, voice and face mocking every inch of the skeleton. “Sorry to waste your time, but y/n and I have a good thing going.”

“Had.” Sans corrects. “And based on this little interaction I have to wonder how good it really was.”

“Alright, sure, we’re in a rough patch right now. But we’re meant for each other. I know them better than anyone.”

“I-”

“Y/n.” they cut you off. “Go home. I’ll be there in a bit.”

You’re about to retort when you feel Sans’ hand grab yours and squeeze it. “Welp, you heard them babe.” He comes up closer and grins at you. “Let’s go home.”

Before they can say another word he’s short-cutted both of you home.

Okay, so maybe running away again isn’t the healthiest way to deal with it. But you’re too relieved to be out of there to really be concerned with it. 

Truth be told, that little interaction cut Sans deeper than he’ll want to tell you. Everything in that look of your ex’s had echoed every self-conscious thought he’d ever had. But one things for sure.

“They don’t know shit about you.”

US!Sans: “Come on!” You say, body gearing up for his next move. “Show me what you got.”

               His attacks suddenly fade out and the glow in his eyes diminishes somewhat. “AFTER YOU’VE RESTED A BIT.”

               “Aw, come on!”

               He smiled and shook his head. “A QUICK WATER BREAK. YOU LOOK DEAD ON YOUR FEET.”

               “Well, we can’t all be perfect.” You mutter. Your boyfriend looks barely winded despite the fact that you’ve been at it for almost an hour and a half now. Still, you comply and sit down at the bench near the sparring area.

               He picks up the water bottles from by your bags and hands you one, kissing your temple. “YOU’RE DOING WELL, THOUGH.”

               “Still haven’t landed a blow on you.” You say, taking a drink.

               “YOU’VE ONLY JUST STARTED TRAINING WITH ME. YOU’LL GET THERE SOON, I’M CERTAIN.” His eyes trace a few bruises on your arm and face that you’ve acquired since the session began. “ARE YOU SURE YOU DON’T WANT ME TO HEAL THOSE?”

               You shake your head. “Just a couple of bruises, you don’t need to waste the magic. Besides, they’ll help me learn from my mistakes.”

               He looks uncertain, but there’s a flicker of pride in those eyes that warms you down to your SOUL.

               You’d been training with Sans for almost a month now, ever since Alphys had finally convinced the gym owners to set up a sparring area for former (or current, if Sans had his way) Royal Guard members. You figured if Sans was going to spend all his time here, you might as well get something out of it.

               It’d been one of the hardest things you’d ever done, but also one of the most rewarding. You were in better shape than you’d ever been. You were feeling better than you ever had. And you were certain it had brought you closer as a couple. Which was good. With all the baggage you were carrying from the last relationship, you needed all the help you could get.

               And as if thoughts had summoned them someone on the far side gym turned and made eye contact with you, and you felt your blood turn to ice.

               Blue seemed to notice you stiffen. “Y/N? ARE YOU ALRIGHT?”

               “Sans, can we-“ You’re about to ask if you can make a hasty retreat, but its too late, they see you and are striding right toward you.

               “Babe?!”

               Sans’ eyes widen a fraction and he looks at the oncoming figure while dread settles in the pit of your stomach.

               “What the hell are you doing here with that?!”

               You grit your teeth. “We’ve been over this. I don’t want to talk to you. Ever again.”

               “Is this what you’ve been doing?!” They look torn between fury, confusion, and sadness. “Going around with one of those things?”

               Sans has gone quiet. He seems to be trying to piece it together.

               “That thing,” You say, rising to your feet. “is my boyfriend. And I want you to go. Now.”

               “Babe, what are you…..he’s a monster!”

               “That fact hasn’t exactly escaped me.” You say acidly, and your heart is pounding and you hate yourself for getting this worked up again over this piece of shit and please, stars, just let them leave, don’t make Sans see this.

               “And that doesn’t bother you?! I…..holy shit….” You can feel their eyes tracing the bruises. “Has he been hitting you?!”

               “No!” You say, fighting the urge to cover them. “Look, just get the hell out of here, okay?”

               “Baby, I don’t understand, we were so good, and if you just-“

               “We weren’t!” You say, laughing somewhat incredulously. “We were stars-awful for each other! I hate how I felt with you. I hate how I made you feel with me. I don’t want it to be like that again! Hard as it may be for you to believe, I’m actually happy here. I’m happy with him!”

               They shake their head. “I don’t fuckin believe you. I give you everything, work my ass off for this relationship, and you throw it off to be some monster’s squeeze? And you’re covered with bruises and I’m supposed to buy that he hasn’t hit you? They’re savages, everyone knows it.” They dart forward before you can blink and grab your hand, dragging you away. “We’re going home.”

               You try to pull away, but before you can try to hard there’s a cyan blur and you’re turned loose, while your ex is being held by Sans, in such a position that they aren’t being hurt but they can’t move.

               “Let go of me!”

               “I’M SORRY. BUT I CAN’T ALLOW YOU TO SPEAK TO THEM LIKE THAT. WHILE I’M CERTAIN I COULD WIN YOU OVER IN ANY OTHER CASE,” he glanced at you. “YOUR BEHAVIOR TOWARDS THEM HAS CROSSED THE LINE. THEY’VE CLEARLY INDICATED THEY WOULD PREFER FOR YOU TO LEAVE. I’M GOING TO REPEAT THAT REQUEST, AND IF YOU DON’T, THEN I’LL BE FORCED TO KEEP YOU TRAPPED UNTIL YOU AGREE.”

               They struggle a bit before realizing that for as small as Sans is, there’s no getting away from him. Red-faced and humiliated, they mutter “Fine” and Sans turns them loose.

               They start walking away, sneering at you one last time. “Fine. Have fun with your pipsqueak monster boyfriend. When you come crawling back, I’ll try my best not to slam the door in your face.” They storm off, pick up their bag, and leave the building.

               You sit back down on the bench, breathing deep. Sans is at your side, kneeling in front of you and lifting your face to look at him. “ARE YOU ALRIGHT?”

               “Y….yeah.” You shake your head a bit to clear it. “Sorry, just…been awhile since our last encounter. Last one was even worse.”

               “I’D BE HESITANT TO SPEAK ILL OF SOMEONE YOU WERE CLEARLY…INVOLVED WITH.” He said hesitantly. “BUT I’D SAY YOU WERE BETTER OFF WITHOUT PAYING MIND TO THEM.”

               You laugh softly. “Yeah. Definitely.”

               “DO YOU FEEL UP TO CONTINUING OUR TRAINING, OR WOULD YOU PREFER TO GO HOME?”

               You pause for a second. “You know what? I think I’ve got some energy to burn off. Just, uh,” You smile a little ruefully. “Maybe training dummies. Got somethin I need to visualize hitting right now.”

               His mouth quirks slightly in a smile and he kisses your forehead. “ALRIGHT.” He stands up and pulls you to your feet. “LET ME DEMONSTRATE THAT MANUEVER I MENTIONED EARLIER…”

[snyrlon]

On Abortion,

I once saw it written that views on abortion were like nipples:  Most people have them, but women’s tend to be more significant. Spoiler alert: my views on abortion are less significant.

While not eligible to vote in the recent referendum on Ireland’s Eighth Amendment, I had my fingers crossed over it, having heard plenty of horror stories about healthcare for women being modified based on the chance that they might be pregnant, let alone a detected early pregnancy.

On mainland Britain an accepted rule is “Don’t say pregnant before twelve weeks”, if only because the miscariage rate in the first trimester is so high. A patient requiring treatment for cancer would be offered a termination well after those twelve weeks. 

I see termination as part of the system of modern medicine and social care. (And in fact the Irish adoption service, which the No-vote openly expected to pick up the slack, voiced support for the Yes vote.) If you’re going to throw out any one component, you’re on a slippery slope to throwing out the entire system.

Modern medicine has already grossly modified the people of the west.  While less than one hundred and fifty years ago large families were the norm as very few children were expected to get to adulthood at all, let alone have families themselves, we now live in a world in which the prospect of losing one child is unthinkable. 

It isn’t just the social consequence, as I mentioned before I’m alive to write this blog because of modern medicine. The time has already come when people who would have died young have had children themselves. The time will come when difficult births become more common, when pregnancies arise from bloodlines with histories of poor survival of pregnancy.

We talk about the rights of the child, and in the west the child has a hell of a lot of rights: in particular, the right to dream.  It’s given as a reason to keep some pregnancies that the children are so fulfilling to look after, so rewarding, so loving:  These are the things that the child can do for you.

Newsflash: It’s a human being not a pet.

At university I knew more than a few entitled arseholes, there’s no other concise word for them in the english language. One of the most chilling was one guy who was lazy, manipulative and abusive on such a scale that it damaged the health of people around him: I can truthfully write that people came close to suicide.  

That person obliquely acknowledged what he was doing on his blog; his go-to excuse was that he had cystic fibrosis, and wasn’t going to live past thirty. Although it takes a monumentally selfish person to spend their short life taking their genetic doom out on everyone around them, it’s still a useful window in to the anguish it causes.

(Tracking him down on line is bad for my blood pressure, but when last I checked he was well in to his forties and had two children, I don’t know if he owes that to drugs, a transplant, or whether it was all just a game.)

The argument is made that from the moment of conception the genetic makeup of an organism is fixed, (That at least is more or less true.) and with it all aspects of that individual’s identity.  (Errrrrr, no.)

An estimated one in three fertilised eggs fail to implant.

Miscarriage rate is pretty much a taboo subject, want to call that “Nature’s unquestionable way?” well in that case kids who died in childhood as recently as a few decade ago were also part of that too.

Identity is not solely linked to genetics, unless you think identity stops at race.

Embryos do not show meaningful brain activity for a long time.

An embryo has no memories, no past, it is not a person.  It is not a child, it is a potential child.  It is one candidate genetic profile that the mother and her immune system might select to try to turn in to a child.

This is the ultimate end of the spectrum between pro-choice, pro-life and pro-birth.

Genetics are a foundation, at once vital, and yet far removed from the whole story. A child will grow up, they will learn, they will experience, their mind will be so much more than their DNA, and yet their health and abilities will be enabled and limited by their genes.    Biologists talk about “mate selection criteria”, is it not the responsibility of parents to pick as best as they can?

Isn’t it entirely reasonable that a child born in the last few decades, might, with no chance to grow up, no way to take part in society, not able to connect with their friends who were excitedly building lives, wonder why their parents accepted this body for them?

People talk about eugenics, that we would be eliminating Downs Syndrome, then Autism, and Sickle Cell, Cancer susceptibility, Alzheimers, and yes, Cystic Fibrosis. Without modern medicine a lot of these would be eliminated a few years after being born, painfully.  The genetics of the diseases of old age are not well understood, there are markers, probabilities,  but at the end, it’s old age after a life of a fair chance.

As I’ve mentioned, I depend on drugs.  I also have what one of my lecturers described as a “Weird brain”: I’m not neurotypical.  Might the profile that I live with now, be disqualified in screening?  Arguably, given my failure to find a mate, it pretty much has.  Glibness aside, I’m old enough to think about routes not taken, and that under other circumstances, I’d be measurably different, perhaps even alien to who I am now. I can well imagine conversations of “Really, you thought frigging bipolar disorder was a good start?” might be met with “Well we were hoping you might be a Churchill or something.” (Before anyone not so much neuro-atypical as neuro-deficient jumps to conclusions, no I do not have bipolar disorder, I just know that it can be hell to live with.)  The fact is that perfect is unattainable, there are so many limits to how hard, and how many times, you can try anything.

There are other rights of a child that we take for granted in the west, ridiculously so as they are by no means certain.  There are many who do feel that unless they can support and raise a child, and do so without hurting others, it’s not fair to try. 

I’ve known several women who have had terminations, although they have all had to make a difficult decision, I don’t think any were determined so much by free choice as by circumstances that could not be changed.