#me being an upset comicbook fan

[harperhug]

I am so, so fucking tired of being told to “criticize media” all the fucking time. I get that you’re upset that Cassandra Cain is not the same character she is in the comics, but how exactly is telling a person who’s only never read a comicbook before that I’m ableist supposed to change anything? You’re not just trying to “teach me about ableism,” not when you open with calling me a bigot and accuse me of loving that they changed a character I had no idea was even changed. And why are you yelling at me and other fans instead of Margot Robbie or Cathy Yan or someone who actually had some say in what happened in Birds of Prey?

Oh wait, I know the answer: it’s because I don’t have the money, time, or social power to retaliate in any way that would actually affect you. And let’s not pretend that perfect movies exist. No movie, no comic book, no media of any kind is entirely unproblematic or entirely problematic, nor are the fans of said media entirely unproblematic or problematic. Holding onto this extreme black and white thinking is going to make you a lot of enemies and no friends.

Black Panther was made by arguably the largest monopoly on the planet (Disney). The live-action Wonder Woman movie was produced by Steve Mnuchin (someone who directly funded Trump’s rise to power). Blizzard has queer female characters of colour in their games and banned players for openly supporting Hong Kong’s rebellion (edit: and also the sexual harassment). And financially supporting any of them means putting money into the pockets of billionaires.

On the other end, Mulan stars a horrible actress, as well as numerous other East Asian stars whose careers will be derailed if this movie fails due to people boycotting her (Crystal Liu). There’s no small number of people (myself included) who are only alive today because a transphobe wrote a book called Harry Potter that is full of racist caricatures and cultural theft. And if I had a dollar for every time I saw a blogger who vocally hated Call Me By Your Name also support someone who vocally loved the film (like Xavier Dolan, Barry Jenkins, and Lil Nas X) I would be able to buy the intellectual property rights to all of the above.

Oh hey, you know how I know this? Because—surprise!—I do criticize media I consume. I just don’t make the mistake of defining critcism as being a bottomless well of negativity towards the fans of it and picking everything apart. So I’m unfollowing and blocking you until you start acting your fucking age. You’re not twelve.

[kaseshipearth]

Christopher Markus and Stephen McFeely were against Tony from the beginning.

as evidenced here in this tweet. a fan asks what idea they were most happy about making it through every single draft of Endgame. it was Tony’s fake death, and Steve’s OOC reunion with Peggy.

CM, SM, and the Russo brothers decided to have a quarantine watch party to celebrate the 1-year anniversary of Endgame (CM and SM took over the Comicbook twitter account). quite dumb if you ask me; basically painting a target on their backs from Tony stans and Steve stans who are still bitter about how the characters were written. I, like any person with eyes and logic, am still quite upset at how OOC Steve’s ending was, as well as Tony’s untimely death. 

but this watch party has just given us more receipts. SM and CM are completely against Tony.

just look at the twitter feed on Comicbook’s account. really and truly, there are only two tweets around the time of Tony’s death in the film. one is a quick, one word response not even about Tony, but about Pepper’s final words to Tony. there other is about the score at his funeral. there’s another tweet about Morgan wanting cheeseburgers, and another tweet about filming the funeral scene and about Bucky’s thoughts on being at the funeral. 

there are no tweets about the meaning of Tony’s noble sacrifice. nothing about what this means for not only his family/friends, but the future of that world going forward. they barely react to his sacrifice. there’s no mention of Tony grabbing the stones, or, “And I am Iron Man.” it’s like their eyes glazed over during that part of the viewing.

BUT!!! then you have SEVEN tweets about Steve giving the shield to Sam, and about the Steve/Peggy dance scene. tweets with pictures and emojis. tweets answering a fan’s question about the music selection, and about the other characters’ thoughts during this scene. they talk about it so much! 

and Tony, who actually died, doesn’t get any valuable attention from the writers. just a few about the circumstances, like music and side characters.

I’ll repeat myself. Christopher Markus and Stephen McFeely were against Tony from the beginning.

(Also, let’s not forget that they killed Natasha over Clint because Clint was a  “family man.” So, with Pepper, Morgan, Peter, and Harley, what was Tony? Chopped liver?)

[bubblegxmed-blog]

lowkey the ppl in the harl!vy tag have me sick???? like they highkey ignore the abusive moments in their relationship for the sake of “”””precious gays!!!!!”””...like girl this is not the representation you want...this is directly tied to domestic abuse being swept under the rug in lgbt community. none of these ppl have read a comic and simply regurgitate mediocre and it’s starting to get on my nerves!!!! i just want quality, logical content not thoughtless cult status gays for no reason?????? ya know bc emotional abuse and choking ain’t real abuse ;). demeaning your s/o as long as your both girls ;)

[irondevilpunisher]

captainouat replied to your post “If Iron Fist S2 had had 13 episodes, the Danny/Joy fallout maybe...”

I thing they friendship should be restored but liek Raveln sayed Ironwing is MCU Canon. ANd i thing the Colleena nd Danny powercouple thing tehy writing towards now is amazing and i hope Joy can get redemption by helping out Joy

This is becoming a trend with you isn’t it? Okay I’m not one for making snarky retorts to things like this. I usually just go about my day without bothering anyone but this...I’m not going to ignore any longer.

1. I’m not going to criticize the poor grammar. 

2. First and foremost I’m all about Danny Rand here when it comes to Iron Fist. He’s the story I care most about and then its the Meachums. 

3. Shipping Ironjoy is just an added bonus and I’m very proud of it. I think they’re an underrated couple with tons of potential and it’d be a shame to waste it. I adore their friendship which I felt was absurdly shelved S2 but if they do or don’t ever become show canon I’m not going to lose sleep over it.

4. I care about Danny and Joy as individual characters not just their relationship. 

5. If you don’t like Ironjoy why are you looking in their tag?

6. Why do you insist on clogging my posts with these types of passive aggressive comments?

I don’t understand the point of your responses whenever I talk about Danny and Joy’s relationship. Nor why you’re obviously threatened by them. There aren’t even many of us Ironjoy shippers out there we just want to be left alone. Of the majority of Ironwing fans you’re the only user I’ve run into who seems to have an issue that people like me exist.  

Cool you ship Danny and Colleen but believe it or not there are people in the IF fandom who don’t and I’m one of them. Everyone has a right to ship what they want and shouldn’t be made to feel crappy about it. 

captainouat replied to your post “I actually liked the ending of IF2. Like I'm not a huge shipper so it...”

Its the same as Arrow fans complaining about the creators wanting to do something new ok! You want to have the exact same thing from the comics happen? NO i ratehr have something new. I liked the twist and i cantw ait to see Colleen as the Iron Fist of New Yourk and Dany and her as Partners in Love and Vigilantism

Yah look at Arrow its a mess! Its not even the same show anymore. From my perspective the main protagonist in that was also shafted to make way for the supporting characters, everyone’s OOC and the comics history was botched. Based on comments I’ve read from Arrow fans that show is beyond repair. But we’re not discussing Arrow this is about Iron Fist.

And this is very hypocritical. Would you have the same reaction if Coll**n had been in Danny’s position? Like would you be totally fine if Colleen had been the one who worked her butt off for 15 years enduring brutal physical training to become the chosen protector of a mystic land? Only to have that identity and destiny ripped away and handed to her Gary-Stu boyfriend?

I don’t think so and many IF fans of the comics and the series [including some Ironwing shippers] would gladly disagree with you. We’re very hurt, angry and upset over this development. Doing this disregards/erases all of Danny’s character development and journey in S1, Defenders and Luke Cage S2.

I’ll repeat this is the equivalent of Matt Murdock giving away his Daredevil suit to Claire Temple or Jessica Jones giving away her strength to Trish Walker. Think about that.

Btw Coll**n is a self-admitted adrenaline/combat junkie. How does that make her more worthy of the dragon’s chi than Danny? Or better yet why wouldn’t that make her more of a dangerous threat than him who only used the fist for good? She’s already killed once that we know of while he hasn’t.

 I’m not thrilled with the back-half of S2 nor am I happy about the blatantly sick treatment of Finn Jones/Danny Rand. And I’m not alone in these feelings. You’re in the minority within the yay-Danny’s-not-the-hero anymore camp I’m sorry. This show is called Iron Fist its about Danny Rand. It’s not the Coll**n Wing show. Its his story. Comicbook fans did not flock here for a CW romance they came to see Danny Rand become the iconic Immortal Iron Fist which he is. They came to see his rich comic history and background be accurately/appropriately adapted. 

And the source material should be cherished and honored in any television or movie adaptation. It doesn’t need to be an exact blueprint but it shouldn’t be changed to the point where its no longer recognizable. That’s not what long devoted fans of these beloved heroes want. 

Here’s the thing I’ve run into similar passive aggressive stans in the past. I’m currently facing the same problems in the Daredevil fandom. I’m not intimidated. The purpose for my being here is to have fun. I’m not here to start ship wars or shove my opinions down people’s throats. They’re free to like or dislike whatever they please and move on. Or they can just choose to ignore whatever I say. 

I’m not trying to be rude here but if you don’t like what I post you’re very welcome to unfollow me [if you already do] and focus on things you enjoy. But I really don’t appreciate being told nonstop that my ships won’t happen and that I should just accept bad writing and bad changes to my favorite shows. 

Have a pleasant day.

[animesavior]

Popuko and Pipimi: “Are You Upset?”

King Records Executives: “We are not upset.”

-          Pop Team Epic (Ep. 12)

This week’s Toonami Trending Rundown is a double-feature for the nights of September 15-16, 2018 and September 22-23, 2018, as we saw the Thrilling conclusion of Pop Team Epic, while Black Clover also concludes the Eye of the Midnight Sun Arc, and Universe 7 battles Universe 9 in the Zeno Exhibitions, among other great moments.

During the night of September 15-16, Toonami, BHNA and JoJo’s would trend on tumblr, while no trends were spotted on Twitter save for some tweet counts. During the night of September 22-23, things were a little better, as Toonami trended in the US on Twitter, while Toonami, #BNHA, Attack on Titan, and Hunter x Hunter trended on tumblr.

This week’s feature was a new trailer for the upcoming English debut of the next installment of the Naruto franchise in Boruto: Naruto Next Generations. You can check it out below.

Last week, Aniplex showcased a special premiere event for the highly anticipated Project Alicization story arc of Sword Art Online, and for a first for me and ToonamiFaithful.com, I headed up to Los Angeles to cover the event for the Toonami Faithful. I also got the opportunity to talk with Bryce Papenbrook regarding voicing Kirito and the show's success among other things. We’ll have those articles posted as soon as they’re finished but you can check out this moments tab archiving some of the moments from the event as well as the official trailer from Aniplex posted below in the meantime.

Beginning this week, My Hero Academia will be making the US theatrical debut of The Two Heroes, with the English dub on September 25, 27 and 29 and in Japanese (with English subtitles) on September 26 and October 2. If you're interested, check out funimationfilms.com/myheroacademia for showings near your area and give your support to the anime industry on the big screen.

Ever since the anime aired in Japan earlier in the year, Pop Team Epic has become a big fan favorite among those who saw the series across the various streaming sites it has been available on as well as being a popular source for anime related memes. Many fans have likened it to one of Adult Swim’s classic animated comedies, and indeed there have been quite a few requests for Adult Swim to pick this one up. Adult Swim eventually did, however the big stunner would be that it would air on Toonami Saturdays, rather than on Sundays as many expected and Pop Team Epic would successfully make its debut on the night of June 30, 2018.

Indeed in recent times, many fans have wanted Toonami to showcase non action programs for variety’s sake, especially with many of Toonami’s acquisitions in recent times being Shonen Jump works. While some might say otherwise, Jason DeMarco has said that he has heard such concerns, and has mentioned that the Toonami crew are looking into creating and acquiring more anime and action cartoons of all kinds to expand Toonami’s scope.

While Pop Team Epic’s acquisition has received plenty of applause, it has also received plenty of scorn as well, mainly due to the reason being it’s style of comedy may be more enjoyed sandwiched next to the likes of Rick and Morty and Robot Chicken, rather than FLCL and JoJo’s. And to say the least, its style of comedy may not necessarily be for everyone. Regardless, Pop Team Epic has been seen as a success in regards to what it needed to do, and this could signal the start of one of potentially many potential experimental shows to come.

12 weeks of Popuko and Pipimi doing…we’ll…stuff…and Pop Team Epic’s run is in the books. During the show’s run, the show successfully trended on Twitter during 11 out of 12 weeks of its run, including in the US during weeks 1 and 5. The show also trended on tumblr during its first week.

We’ve heard rumblings of a potential second season, but all such talk is just rumors so far. However, if a second season did come to fruition, I won’t be opposed. Regardless, whether it was a failed experiment, or a sign of things to come, Pop Team Epic was quite an interesting experience to say the least. So on behalf of the Toonami Faithful, thanks for the memories, Popuko and Pipimi, and we hope to see you again in the future.

Tune in next week as Toonami expands to 9pm EDT as Boruto joins the block at 10:30pm Eastern, while Black Clover begins the Seabed Temple Arc at 1am, among other great moments. And just to remind you, the new schedule will include some significant schedule changes, so make sure to get familiar with the new schedule and set your DVRs if need be.

Not much else to say other than until next week, stay gold as always.

Legend: The shows listed are ordered based on their appearance on the schedule. Show trends are listed in bold. The number next to the listed trend represents the highest it trended on the list (not counting the promoted trend), judging only by the images placed in the rundown. For the Twitter tweet counts, the listed number of tweets are also sorely based on the highest number shown based on the images on the rundown.

September 15-16, 2018 Trends

Tweet Counts:

#Toonami [5,088 tweets]

#MyHeroAcademia [1,672 tweets]

#PopTeamEpic [2,074 tweets]

#JoJosBizarreAdventure [2,026 tweets]

Tumblr Trends:

#Toonami

#BNHA

#JoJos Bizarre Adventure

Notes and Other Statistics:

#Toonami: @WhoTrendedIT reported that @MikeMcFarlandVA and @blumspew started the trend in the US.

September 22-23, 2018 Trends

United States Trends:

#Toonami [#9]

Tweet Counts:

#Toonami [6,022 tweets]

#FLCL [2,197 tweets]

#PopTeamEpic [2,774 tweets]

#JoJosBizarreAdventure [2,415 tweets]

#HunterXHunter [1,717 tweets]

Tumblr Trends:

#Toonami

#BNHA

#Attack on Titan

#Hunter X Hunter

Notes and Other Statistics:

#Toonami: @WhoTrendedIT reported that @ComicBook and @FUNimation started the trend in the US.

#FLCL: @WhoTrendedIT reported that @mariannemiller started the trend in the US.

#PopTeamEpic: @WhoTrendedIT reported that @soymilkpudding and @DawnMBennettVA started the trend in the US.

#JoJosBizarreAdventure: @WhoTrendedIT reported that @shonenjump started the trend in the US.

Special thanks to @coreymbarnes and others I forgot to mention for spotting some of the trends on this list.

The Age of Shinobi...is over. Only Toonami on [adult swim] on Cartoon Network.

[lightdusk96]

Hello! Batgirlgrayson here! I couldnt send you a message so Imma just send it here! Thank you for being nice. I take it you’re a dickkory shipper? Anyways, nawh it’s fun, I’m honestly just laughing tbh and I cannot comprehend how one can string those too many ugly words together, for too long! Like wow I can’t even bring myself to type all of those! Thank you for your kindness :) may we never be like them lol

Hello! Thank you for responding!Indeed, I'm a RobStar shipper! (I prefer the cartoon RobStar to the comicbooik DickKory, namely because of the nutso comicbook elitists and salty fans.Anyway, I'm glad you're taking this in stride, cuz I\d be upset. I still can't wrap my head around how deranged this whole thing is! Why put all these awful things when you can just walk away, block and be merry? The whole shipping wars BS makes me tired and shake my head in exhaustion.

[marvels-runaways-fan]

@mcufandomhatespeopleofcolor (don’t know why you wanted to tag me, I never once tagged you or mentioned you by name. Guess you people still wanna argue?) *Sigh*

 I read you points and for the people who feel Alex’s family and his own portrayal was screwd up, that’s fine. I’m apologize to those people if it seemed like I was saying how they felt didn’t matter just because we have other poc characters in the comic and even more so in the show.

But the thing is, I hear more people upset about Alex (because he’s a villan)  than Xavin’s treatment, which was truly screwed up imo (if I had to pick the worst thing about the comic, I’d pick Xavin’s treatment). 

I’ll probably see far more people upset about Alex than they will be upset if (I’m not saying this is what has happened, but it could) Gertrude being jewish is earassed in the show.

But, If people feel the need to demonize the comic, let them. If there are issues in there they don’t like, let them talk about it then. If they want to complain about the show, on which they have no evidence if it will even follow the comicbook as far as character motivations and story goes (they are making major changes already), then so be it. I don’t care.

But if they are allowed to stat their opinion, than I am allowed to say how I feel about it and if it doesn’t make sense to me, so no, I will not, “shut the fuck up”.

I will also not tell anyobe else to, unless they come into my inbox (strange how I only started getting the guys in my inbox after I said the boycott was stupid (my own opinion m, mind you) and not before when I was queit on the issue). Because I noticed the boycott before an elected to ignore it at the time because I was going through some personal issues, but the moment I say anything, here come the nasty anon (some of which i just had to delete because I didn’t want that sort of gross negativity on my blog). Some I posted because ai wanted people to see how cowardly and downright racist some of these anons were. 

Sorry, if I implied that was your fault (probably wasn’t but how can I know either way) but anyway, I aint shutting up like you wish I would so let’s just elect to ignore each other from here on out. I don’t want to be tagged in anymore of your stuff.

This blog isn’t even supposed to be about discourse. It’s purely about Runaways fan stuff, fanart, fancast, theories, and the new show and comic, so all I can say is have a good day and do what you you feel you need to. 🤷🏾‍♀️

[nikki-reuclife]

Superhero

Need to purchase X-Men t-shirts on-line? Whether or not you have got a love for The Avengers, Unbelievable Four, Thor, or X-Men there are a lot or t-shirts and different merchandise to personal. My childhood included a love for 60s and 70s Marvel and DC comics, and my capacity to attract originates partially from learning the tales I learn in those days. We labored for a yr collectively on the piece to plan and draw it. Toy corporations like Hasbro and Kenner used to produce hundreds of Batman motion determine than is launched every year with some variation in it. Transformers 2, the science-fiction film is the latest sensation, and is the most awaited movie of the yr. Let's take the film Avatar for instance. Now and again I went again to the game to take just a few more screenshots to increase a plot. Inside a couple of minutes, I started making comedian strips. Unlike his different comic strips, in Battling Boy, the hero is a child, who's on a mission to save the town.

In truth, the opposite sequence of battling boy grew to become well-liked. To conclude on this matter, I feel it's an excellent idea to offer our children the humorous comics created manner-back-when, comics from your and my childhood. To learn a narrative in adventurous manner is quite thrilling for all the kids. You have to overcome the limitations of speech bubbles and the issue of telling a narrative frame by frame. Admit it you've got! I’m certain you have heard this standard on-line retailer. Since Kids's Graphic Novels are actually simply an outdated concept with a fancy new title, why should not you discover taking old successful comicbook ideas and reinventing them for a brand new technology? The idea was to convey the same which means with phrases that I instructed by way of colors, textures and pictures. Fashionable On-line Comics solidify a which means of a phrase because footage help meaning to phrases. The nomination was a serious achievement for an artist who had - fairly actually -started out small, drawing Post-it be aware sized comics and hiding them in different people’s work in bookshops. The primary comic strips appeared in Germany in 1865. It was about two boys who're getting punished for at all times entering into mischief.

Moreover, if we're sincere with ourselves, we all know that loads of mischief is downright funny. Why are old coins worth more than right now's coins? Full collections will fetch too much greater than random individual comics. Our goal is to provide our readers a great piece of entertaining and academic comics on which is able to develop up not one of the long run generations. These blockbuster motion pictures plays an important function in the comeback of comics. People who need to cherish their childhood memories with the comics; they'll easily discover cheap comics to start their comic assortment. In this day of "I need the newest and latest," we actually discover that a few of the actual treasures are things of outdated. Comedian books are detailed tales. Other than conventions, yard sales and used guide shops can also be extremely value efficient sources for collectible comic books. A comic book adaption as well as a novel publication is being finished for the film's promotion. That assumption is unsuitable and is an insult to the entire comic book neighborhood.

These comic guides give you the type of data you want like the place to get the rare and valuable comics and where you will get first situation comics as properly as the back subject ones as properly. By selling and trading comics you might be there have been the art work is most loved and valued. Moreover, that's where you get the meet fellow enthusiasts and catch up on the most recent within the comic books world; info that can show invaluable. Some comic books editions are collector's items and if preserved in mint quality situation. Books are restricted because the reader cannot bodily see what the writer envisions. Are these behaviors to be condoned? Eyes turn into circles or dots, mouths are reduced to curved lines, and noses or ft are triangles. Get the newest news. Those that already consider extensive abilities of our website, confess that it is actually probably the most handy and simple approach to be in touch with the newest innovations of the world of comics.

Effectively conscious of the benefits that come from reading comics. Which Marvel comics must you read before (or after) Captain Marvel? Repetition. Go back to your day by day newspaper and look at the comics’ page. The cartoonist is utilizing repetition to identify the character. Due to this fact, we may say that it has nothing to do with a altering traits, whatever is new and trendy, photograph to pop art print remains within the midst of its recognized usability in subject of art. I appeared, and there before me was a pale horse! There really is something for everyone. Cosplay additionally means costume play and the followers typically come to the comic conventions dressed in costumes. Eight delectable Expansions that followed added to the joy of the sport play. Then by all means, use it. By the use of these exaggerations, it doesn’t matter what other details I embody. The possessed doll first hit the screens in the 1988 horror classic 'Kid's Play'. Corey Haim, the lead of the unique horror movie, and Corey Feldman, the 2 Coreys, reprise their unique roles. Nevertheless, in 2003 Hasbro would relinquish control to Batman's rights to Mattel. You additionally get preferential therapy in some instances and entry to particular events and performances. Is Bronze Age Comic Investing A Good Choice? The Future of Bronze Age Comic Book Investments!

When we speak about superheroes, something that comes into thoughts are Batman. This crime fighting, caped crusader has become a section of us because it was released in a Superman very comic book series. Most of us have few ideas about him like his name, his sidekick, villains, with his fantastic cool gadgets. But only a number of us learn about certain details of the dark knight. In this article, will speak about who is Batman based on more interesting information about this superhero. 1. The Hulk - This teammate is brilliant and analytical, but moody and temperamental. At her best she tackles probably the most difficult difficulties with precise analysis. She has a grasp of complicated issues and has a reasoned and systematic procedure for them. She is, however, easily upset and will become quite the "monster" when angry. The best approach for that team is to allow her to work alone, whenever you can. Solitude permits her to pursue potential solutions because they eventually her. She ought to be needed to keep another teammate appraised of her work. Because of her logical nature, she'll usually respond positively while confronting facts that disprove her position. However, when she flashes her temper, teammates informed about her will simply get out of just how. After she has calmed down she should be made conscious of the unacceptability of her angry behavior.

While becoming an adult there were this extremely tiny comic shop inside the town I spent my youth, also it was alone in the city. I remember seeing an Amazing Spider-Man #1 about the wall as well as an X-Men #1. Both were in great (VG) condition, without doubt. I remember specifically that the Amazing Spider-Man #1 was being sold for $800 and The X-Men #1 went around $300.

With this as a reboot, each goes straight away while on an origins story. If you're a fan of Spider-Man otherwise you know his beginnings, then you certainly ought to know a number of what you should expect. I'm sure the creators on this movie are stored on to the fact so in retrospect they've added some wrinkles for this existing comic classic. By adding some unfamiliar parts towards the story and subtracting a few of the things we've grown familiar with, the movie is allowed to feel fresh as well as new in some ways.

Superhero comics are becoming a fundamental element of modern pop culture, along with their popularity shows no signs of fading in the near future. As more and more people familiarize yourself with these characters from their appearances in blockbuster movies, the requirement for comic books featuring these heroes has risen. With these affordable reprint volumes, anyone can easily compensate for numerous years of a common hero's adventures.

[superscanaries]

all this Cait hate is making me upset. I understand that ppl have a reason to be upset/mad, but I feel like a lot of ppl are using Cait's recent actions to justify the large amount of hate they have for her. I also feel like ppl, both from WA&SB, have had a habit of pitting Iris & Caitlin against each other, which is sad b/c they're both awesome characters/women in their own right. I also think Cait's actions, while they're wrong and not ones I would make, don't mean she is a terrible person.

I went to ‘the flash spoilers’ tag yesterday and it was just fans of the two ships hating on either Caitlin and Iris. People hated on them before any of the things they use as excuse happened. The Flash fandom is upsetting, which is why I hardly ever go to tags.

Caitlin did something terrible, but none of it would have happened if her ‘friends’ actually focused on the fact that she’s becoming a supervillain, and since they’re scientists could have looked harder for a solution. She was surrounded by people and yet her safer bet was to betray them. Clearly the gesture of someone who is desperate and is not receiving proper attention. Proof of this is the fact that despite they know Killer Frost is triggering for her, they make references to it at any given chance and Cisco even joked about it in the last episode (despite being one of the, like, two actually people who cared about her).

I’d kill to have a scene with one of them à la Clark and Caitlin in JLvsSS, instead they had to pull that stupid romantic weird thing with Julian rather than let her have a proper dialogue like that comicbook one.

[maneaterwithtail]

Why the resistance to "fan girl" Ms. Marvel?

highlights of the discussion

Popesize1 day ago (edited)

For me, i guess it was the overexposure, and you must like her-attitude, that made me say no. Same with Captain Marvel as the new flagship. Her origin and faith never really mattered to me. I remember finding Dust in one of the young x-team (was it Hellions?) interesting. The obsessive nerd and fan-girling was a bit annoying, i can agree on that. Mostly because the fans i have come to know, never really behaved like that. But it might be more common with girls. What do i know? -But never the big tick-off

Dakina Demino1 day ago

I don't think its the character itself, but rather the relentless media worship of her as some kind of new age comic book Jesus that really took off five years ago. If you said anything that the pros and the media took as negative, you'd get called the usual things like nazi, racist and so on. You'd also get bot blocked on twitter and smeared in a closed community chat room. This has the side effect of reflecting back on Kamala who gets the reputation of being a progressive garbage character. A second point is that less than a year ago, the pros and media were still running smear campaigns against their own consumer bases, painting them as some vast army of zombie nazi kkk Trump voting hate mob made up of Russian cyber bots that wants to gun down immigrants. Kamala is polarizing in that game as she represents two things a lot of Marvel fans hate. One they got attacked by people claiming they are evil, anti minority, gate keeping old white fans and two, the character represents the catalyst of Marvel telling its own consumer base to f**k off in more of less that precise wording. As for me, I'm not angry at Kamala. I'm pissed off that an awesome cyperpunk game series like Dues Ex got axed so the studio could make a game that seems designed from the ground up to start shit and trigger outrage.

Nioh Arcadia1 day ago

As the Target Audience for Kamala I want to like her but (as of right now) I really fucking hate her 😡 She feels like the living embodiment of a subreddit and after G Willow she's Only written as a hyper Melenial 😒. Also like you said she feels like "hey you can see yourself can't you nerd?" It's pretty insulting and lazy. Also her being a mage fan of other Superheros makes her character less interesting because she lacks her own Agency. Now-a-days she's pretty boring and I or anyone else really couldn't give a shit

Raheil Rahman1 day ago

As a Muslim, the comic was groundbreaking. Grant Morrison's "Vinamarama" was the first book that spoke to my experience in my lifetime, but this was a pop extension of that. Her family life, her need to hide her identity from her conservative family, was a great update on Peter Parker. She was a nerdy fangirl, which was fun, and she was a very bubbly and enthusiastic character, which I found entertaining. For a time.

 I was turned off by the comic due to the very decompressed pace (obviously to pad a story and sell more issues) and the constant reboots. I haven't read the issues later when she was pushed into Avengers, but that's because all Marvel and DC comics are wearing thin with me. It's all reboots and re-mixes of familiar characters to push some marketing that has nothing to do with comics. I agree with [Comics, by Perch] on this.

 Kamala Khan was forced down the fans throats, but there were many fans of her that have nothing to do with her comics (which is the future of all IPs in this business, I think). The market isn't for comics, which I get is your focus, but she was made to be bigger than comics, like or not. 

 But I don't care, because Kamala Khan has allowed all of us to know and discuss things and issues that we have never done before. Particularly, the arc where they discuss Partition, the division of India into Pakistan and Bangledesh, a tragic event that my father experienced personally, was worth all the over-exposure of this character alone. This was a huge historical event that almost no one has heard of, and this book put a focus on it even among older people of the sub-continent who had never read a comic in their lives, the pages were being shared by email and on Facebook by people my father and mother's age.

Did it sell the comic? Hell no.

 But it was a good thing for the comic world, for the Pakistani world, for the American fans, on a whole.

 And to be honest Perch, I love your channel, but this very rant plays into the idea OG fans will reject this new character based on her background. Many people say her powers are boring, her character is mediocre, and they're all right, but they, and you, miss the point. I get she's been pushed down our throats and I agree that she isn't the best, but the fact that you relate to the kid who acts like a jerk, saying he represents the average comic fan (I don't relate to him, I relate to her, which might be the point of what I'm saying), while that scene is an over-exaggeration, like all superhero melodrama is, I have experienced exactly that kind of situation, being talked down to, and I've seen this happen a lot when it is a young girl and especially if it is a person of color. The fact this irks you is acceptable, but I see a lot of truth in it, even if it is over the top soap opera dialogue.

 I know you are going to say that you were only discussing how the industry, the fans of comics themselves reacted to it and her forcibly increased profile in the universe of comics, and as a fan of comics for almost 30 years, I see all your points. But I think you're reaction is an over-reaction, Kamala Khan is a small part of the Marvel universe, and if she is being artificially being pushed to the top, I personally, have no problem with that. I don't buy the comics, and no one else has to either. And if her inclusion in comics causes people to stop buying the comic, well, I have no problem with that either. Honestly, a lot of those books were never going to be bought no matter which version of Captain Marvel or Spider-Man you put into the book. 

you know nothing jon snowden1 day ago (edited)

It is somewhat insulting the bullying of her as some sort of crucial element of her origin. “What’s her pathos?” “Oppression from comicbook nerds.”

Eric D.1 day ago

Two of the best marvel titles - Daredevil and Immortal Hulk - have one very important thing in common. Consistent creative teams that are telling good stories within a larger story arc that is being told simultaneously. The issue with Kamala Khan is the same issue that Marvel has with a lot of their characters - creative teams on a revolving door and overuse of cross over events. In that shuffle, the core of a character gets lost and we end up with flat, uninteresting characters exactly like the version of Ms. Marvel that's presented in the new Avengers game. A lot of the "problems" in comics could be corrected if the industry returned to a consistent creative team model instead of this six-issue-expiration-date on creative teams and constant title cancelations and reboots that we see now.

KelpieTales1 day ago

Pretty much what others have said before: Kamala has/had potential, her concept is solid and has been done elsewhere so it can work, her early series wasn't bad but come Civil War II things started going downhill for her sadly especially with politics becoming all the more obvious of a driving force.

 What didn't also help was overexposure and the "You must love her or else!" Mentality behind her marketing and some fans as well being directly tied into two other franchises with the same problem: Carol Danvers as Captain Marvel and the Inhumans being made into knock-off X-Men. Since Disney got the rights to X-Men and shelves the Inhumans after the damage done to them I can see why they're quiet on Kamala being one. You also got a point on her surface traits being over exaggerated by other writers most specifically her being a Muslim and a Fangirl, with the rest kind of varying. One example is Waid's version of her is known for being so upset with how the Avengers wouldn't personally rebuild buildings destroyed in battle she left to form the Champions. First issue of her new series by Ahmed had her accidentally destroy a store and came off bratty to the justifiably angry owner. Some will see it as writers not doing their research which sadly happens quite a bit or worst case the character seen as  a hypocrite to some especially if they're a fairly new characters with other factors going against them. One thing that personally bothers me about her is how Marvel and certain media praise her as their "best thing since Spider-Man" when she hasn't really done much to earn that title in terms of personal accomplishments. She's made from a similar mold as Peter and there's nothing wrong with doing that kind of "ordinary kid becomes a superhero" with a different cultural twist to it but it felt like they handled Kamala (and other modern hyped, young characters) with kid gloves compared to their predecessors. I don't think she should see all her loved ones murdered in front of her but maybe at least building a rogues gallery that challenges her more other than simply "fascism" and "Islamaphobia" or something. Then again, this could be because her writers are afraid of getting called "bigots" if something bad happens to her even if it's something white guys routinely deal with I.e. recent Star Wars comic had Boba Fett kill a black woman, just like he killed so many others before, and suddenly SWHatesWomen is a trending tag. Kamala's books also seem more geared to a YA for nerd girls and maybe younger like other books out there like Squirrel Girl so I can see that as a rift between her series and the usual comic fanbase that tends to be teen boys and men. 

 Also, no qualms about the costume but I get how stretchy powers can be a little weird for some to get over or have a character be fun and creative with it.

 Also, that scene with the "real fans" bullies was eye roll worthy. I'm not denying fan elitism exists and I've seen it first hand from people of all walks of life. However, here it feels like it plays into the narrative of "fanboys are bigots who hate sharing their hobbies with girls/PoC/LGBT+" and of course, if you don't like characters like Kamala for any reason you're just like them. There's also how a lot of comic fans tend to just be super awkward, or even autistic, and just get carried away talking about their hobby while unintentionally coming off rude. I'll admit I've been there trying to talk to someone who acted like an authority on the comics when they didn't seem to ever read them and seemed to just watch the shows (while ironically talking down about others who watch superhero shows and don't read the books). Not to mention, the concern of hobbies being re-tooled to be more "inclusive" for people who never cared about them before while alienating the older fanbase.

Gabriel Hernandez1 day ago

Here's an anecdote that somewhat backs up your theory. Disney XD came out with Black Panther's Quest just after the release of the film. I remember hearing about it and thought it would be some light, fun entertainment. When the first episode came out (you can legit watch it here: https://youtu.be/0B9JOAX99pc), Ms. Marvel had as much dialog as Black Panther, certainly more than any other Avenger, and she was at the front of the team during the big fight scene in the first 5 minutes. I remember thinking "Why is this person here? Why is she getting so much attention in a Black Panther cartoon? Where's the Hulk? Why is Ms Marvel doing so much of the talking and in the same timeframe you have nothing from either Capt. America or Black Widow? What is this?" In other words, Ms Marvel was being shoved to the front and treated as a co-leader of the Avengers when - and here's the key - her canon and her powers weren't established enough to earn that spot. That's the difference. She didn't earn her place at the table, and it just comes off as forced and fake. Just my opinion.

Cole1 day ago

When I was in Washington DC last summer we visited American History Smithsonian and they unexpectedly had an exhibit on superheroes where they had some comics in a case and there was a Kamala khan Ms Marvel #1 next to a bunch of classic issues and first appearances. It puts things into perspective beyond a small internet troll bubble. That clip was kinda lame lol but the character has a large audience.

Ibena8271 day ago (edited)

I do disagree on the idea that people weren't ranting about her character when she first debut because they're were literal blogs and videos dedicated to bashing her character and her faith, and even those people who claim her comic was failing always forget to mention that while single issues weren't selling alot, her first volume actually sold remarkably well, making it the best selling series in that year. Although her character came from the all new and all different line-up there is a reason why unlike others like Riri Williams, America Chavez or even Nova she was able to go into other media so easily and it's simply because her character was able to appeal to new readers of comics with a young protagonist who held a more optimistic outlook on the Marvel universe as it was going into so much change at the time, it also helped that her story focus less on action and more on her daily life and how it involves into her heroic life. I could understand if people just don't like Ms. Marvel because she's just not their favorite type of hero but it would be weird to criticize the character for being comparable to her multiple relaunches "mentor" or with her being responsible for the decline of Marvel comics

Comics, by Perch1 day ago

I didn't say there were none... but if you look at the volume it was easily 1/20th of the volume of what occurred later in her run. For a period of time there were more articles condemning the insults than the insults themselves. Of course, that did change.

Horizon Brave1 day ago (edited)

I despise...DESPISE the fandom at times... This shouldn't even be a thing... I can guarantee you...promise you.... if Captain Marvel was not a teen girl, this conversation, this "agenda" that everyone spouts, this constant push back of anything about this character would not exist. Find it funny that all of the characters that create controversy and and bring out the cliche descriptors like SJW and MarySue are all women.  I have yet to hear anyone whine and bitch about male characters 'ruining' the story or pushing politics etc

inotaishu11 day ago

Ms. Marvel wasn't even the first muslim girl in the Marvel Universe. DUST came years before her. I think the problem with the character is that she was so long connected to something that looks like an agenda instead of having the character stand on her own.

Me

Once upon a time there was a online conflict called gamergate

 it was an outgrowth of the increased mainstreamification with it greater demographic Alteration of fandom. Where they were a vehicle for major studios putting things out as well as trying to chase different demographics and markets. 

alongside this is in fact a long-term attempt to make fandom much more female friendly. with, yes, pre-existing issues of sexism. With the sudden influx of this social capital some factions happily hook their train up either for validation, advancement, but especially social power. This all comes to a head through three major actions.

 you probably heard names like Zoe Quinn or Anita Sarkeesian.  needless to say fandom isn't just one thing. 

Stuff that happens in the game sphere creates an attitude because there are members who share multiple hobbies but especially with comics people wanted to act like they were social activists and one way they did that was by creating the bunch of traits that they knew what piss people off and then attack a group that they knew had less social capital.

 so in order to combat what was perceived as negative feelings for Muslims and girls with interest in geeky hobbies and or science fiction they created the polemic fangirl. Especially to the counter the nasty statements against then popular brown hair girls such as Bella Swan and Katniss Everdeen.

This was addressing a very real issue, much as was pointed out in the book Lovecraft Country

We had genre fiction that had, on its basis, racist assumptions ideas and so on whether that was Tarzan, John Carter of Mars, and yes Lovecraft. but much like the creation of Miles Morales and several other characters you couldn't help but feel, much as you noted with this latest version, that the point of the character wasn't to be a character to celebrate and build a relationship with audience and this genre, but to brow beat the audience. 

 This is especially with fangirl interests being lionized as a social good even when in many ways just as venal Petty and low-key  messed up. Something that nobody would own up to until it was socially advantaged to do so.  

As an example people constantly pointing out how mean male nerds are to female or anything that's associated with female or progressive or gay  fashions. Until suddenly they want to beat on those people then suddenly they can acknowledge the exact same traits those accused bigots with people were mad about as existing let alone allowing to be judged as flawed It's hilarious because I can point to things like people flipping out about the last Jedi and how people jump the gun on a character like admiral holdo. But then turn around and prosecute the in their name reylo fandom because they're all fighting against patriarchy. In short it's very clear when someone makes a character and they're meant to be a learning lesson for the audience

. And very deliberately from conception that was the point of Miles Morales and Kamala Khan. The only positive thing you could say at least with KK is that she was deliberately meant to be empathetic to that kind of girl. the problem is much like [Perch] said when they start saying she was the future it very much came with an implicit “you guys are the past and you guys sucked until we came here”

 It's with this attitude along with that, even though I don't have a problem reading the first three or so  of her trade, she's associated with the push of the inhumans which was very much more mandated by the fox marvel Disney pissing match; To the fact that she has Loki guest star along with agents of shield thus meaning that she was very much part of the then media tie in and fangirl gasm of pushing Loki which also fed into the idea of Loki as the best queer boyfriend; and they made it clear that this was going to be the future. basically they were going to be as Petty as they always were just aiming towards fangirl. as opposed to males’ preference  

 and then they were going to tell us how we were monsters for not going along with it. 

 And again those first three trades pretty well written and okay ish. They're all about character. which makes them kind of interesting but that doesn't change the fact that you can easily see what they're trying to do with having the literal villain called the inventor who's also Thomas Edison who's all about demoralizing and exploiting the younger generation, who all turn out to be super geniuses anyway,  All this and a wolverine cameo.

Added in like [Perch] noted that people who were not about comics couldn't shut up about praising her as the future of comics as if everything was crap until she showed up and it just hurt a lot. especially as you noted it was all this other mess going on but she was part of the initiative of streamlining marvel towards the media Disney push. and very deliberately made in order to push out everybody who would come before even down to the likes of the audience to push for a different audience who they said was a more moral audience 

So whether she was a hit outside of the morass of Marvel determined whether she’d be the new centralizing focus for it.