Not many people talk about Moments: Choose Your Story.
It started more than 5 years ago, with small, sweet stories. Some awkward drawing style... That migrated to a more realistic style almost photographic style for art.
As they released tons of stories, the characters would be reused on other stories as extras and side characters. It might sound lazy to some people. I think it's funny as you have a photographic MC and then, their mother is drawer and painted in the old style.
They started giving us stars to play, and charging Rosy Diamonds for premium choices.
The stories became more s*x driven. But some stories got set aside. And we're left with no sequel or a proper closure. Like The Flower and Thorns one. I really loved playing it years ago. At that time, I was still able to buy diamonds on Google. Now it's not allowed in Brazil anymore. They never gave me an answer why they left Brazil. What made me stop playing the game, since I couldn't farm enough diamonds to play things properly. Even though I know the choices doesn't matter that much. It's like:
"annoying character is calling you. Pay 12 diamonds to answer it. OR don't answer it for free"
You choose the free option, just to read the next panel telling you someone picked your cellphone for you, answered it an made you talk to whoever was on the other side of the call.
A couple months ago I restarted playing it.
Here's my question: what story is ILLREN from???
Seriously we make the worst fandom ever. There's no Wikia on the stories, there's no images about the stories. Even Stardust Works' social media is kinda dead. Last post is like from 2 years ago.
I even started a Google Sheet listing all the 271 books they have inside the Moments App. (9 are openly LGBTQIAP+, the others are probably a side LI, if any)
It's a lot. I may have started and / or ended around 30 books.
I need your help guys! Does anyone knows about ILLREN?
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friendships as marital ties (and other notes on relational ties) in mlc
this is sort of a third installment in the series of meta on 'mlc as an exemplar of constructing queer narratives out of chinese ideological frameworks' (1. jianghu as queer space and 2. how it manifests in li xiangyi) - focusing on the nature of relationships in it. (which I've briefly mentioned in the first one and finally actually getting to it!!)
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I would like to first call attention to chinese ideological frameworks as a premise of queer reading in mlc. the goal of chinese philosophy is to explore the becoming of human, taking two broad paths of the (mainstream) secular vs. escaping the secular. (these two paths are not a strict dichotomy, and rather, are ever in flux and in conversation with each other.) as said by @markiafc too, chineseness is so much about the rigidity of structures, and in equal part, a desire to break out of them. thus, chinese ideological frameworks can very much offer a rich reading of queerness - that mlc, a story very deliberately structured based on chinese ideologies (more accurately, with good reasons for me to believe that it is as such), has managed to materialise.
if the conceptualisation of queerness is premised on a defiance against mainstream norms, then a reliable way to read queerness in chinese ideological frameworks can be to deconstruct it by the mainstream confucian frameworks.
in mlc, this is implicitly set up with its stage of wulin/martial jianghu. then it is further broken down by asking, hey wulin jianghu is still closely related to the hegemonic values and the mainstream structure of authority (historically, 侠 xia being politically involved says a lot about this), so what is the true meaning of jianghu? what does it then really take for jianghu to be a queer space offering comfort and freedom to those who have escaped to it - to be the space that allow the transcendence of rigid roles and labels? mlc took a step further to resist the proxy to mainstream values that wulin jianghu has become.
this is why there can be a very strong buddhism reading of mlc (suggested here, expounded in the A+++ meta by @markiafc here and here, and also what I've seen discussed by cnet as well), given that buddhism is one of the 'extra-secular' ideologies, alongside (philosophical) taoism. I've also touched on a taoist angle in this meta. both schools are articulated in different sets of languages, but ultimately convey a same ideal of what it means to be human and how to live well - that is, to resist the roles and labels defined by the norms.
so, back to confucian frameworks.
a lot can be discussed about mlc with it. but in the context of this meta about relationships in mlc, it's specifically drawing on how confucianism conceptualises social relationships with familial ties as a cornerstone, and how these relational ties are inextricable from the conceptualisation of the 'self'.
as such, one of the things about mlc that has fascinated me is how deliberately it seems to ignore and reject the conventional familial ties (the kind by blood and marital ties). I've joked about how it is a miracle for me to love mlc as much as I do, as a prime dysfunctional family story enjoyer, despite none of its main characters struggling with any complicated feelings about their (biological) parents. but on closer examination, mlc is also making a comment on the model of familial-based relationships that dominates mainstream society - but through the absence of it.
with this, I want to talk about 1) how mlc rejects the conventional ties; and then 2) how it repurposes these ties in its own ways.
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the five relational ties in confucianism:
father and son 父子有亲 - (natural) affection between father and son
ruler and subject 君臣有义 - righteous relationship between ruler and subject
older and younger brothers 兄弟 (长幼有序) - this is actually about seniority within the family; the order between older vs younger family members
husband and wife 夫妇有别 - differentiation between husband and wife (demarcated by the 内外 spectrum of gendered inner-external spheres)
friends 朋友有信 - trust between friends
logically inferred, all these ties are hierarchical and familial-based except for the last one: friends. ruler-subject is sort of an extension of the natural familial ties, while friendship is the inverse space of 1-4 (ie. you fall back on 5 to define a social relationship outside of the familial sphere that cannot be qualified as 1-4). while all are premised on mutuality, it is only no. 5 that is defined by a sense of choice and equality.
on the surface, 1-4 don't quite exist in mlc in particularly meaningful ways to the narrative or are even outright overlooked, and friendship is the relational tie most valued by mlc. we can tell it's true just by looking at the most meaningful relationships in mlc of difanghua. but at the same time, it is more nuanced. we can take a closer look at how the story plays around with most of the ties as part of a broader queer narrative.
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1) how mlc rejects the conventional ties
mlc's rejection of mainstream relational ties can be best seen in fdb escaping from marriage. and it was not just any engagement with anybody but an engagement with the imperial family. he struggles with the prospect of being married to princess zhaoling, but generally, it's about the idea of complying to mainstream conventions and expectations that includes compulsory heterosexuality. all these point not only to a defiance against amatonormativity - the resistance of the traditional husband-wife tie, but also an irreverence for the ties of ruler-subject (the engagement being an imperial decree) and father-son (matters of marriage being sole decisions made by parents).
of course this is on top of how fdb's own biological father is a p-o-s, and the narrative gives fdb minimal struggles in this aspect, allowing him to sever this tie without looking back (I love it, yeap). along the same line is how lxy is an orphan, who came to gain important relationships that are built on natural compassion among people rather than innate, blood-based ties - even as llh. the sense of defiance from the narrative is especially stark to me considering that he could have a completely different familial-based life - as a son, brother, and ruler, if his biological family was still around. the narrative also deliberately treats his biological brother as a phantom, replaced with an older brother who he was bonded with neither by blood nor marital ties. on dfs's front, absolutely nothing is to be known about his biological family. his childhood history with the toxic patriarch of his life - who is not even his biological father - was afforded a clean break and closure.
we can keep going on, but that's pretty much the point.
ritualisation is one of the most important things of the confucianism school, especially to the honoring of these social relationships (and the officiating of social roles). the one ceremony/ritual we saw in mlc involving the main characters - or more accurately speaking, came closest to seeing - was the imminent wedding ceremony of dfs and jlq. even in that case, it was premised on non-mutuality with dfs being the unwilling, passive party. (fem-coded dfs? 25 marks.)
and that brings us to the next part.
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2) how mlc repurposes these ties
that particular wedding ceremony gets hijacked by dfs and lxy/llh, and gets turned into an important milestone in their relationship. they consummate - what is on text - their friendship after a long time being more enemies and rivals than friends. it is a clear establishment of the trust they have for each other. and here it is where I circle back to the subject of this post: friendships as marital ties.
in this article, as a part of a feminist, egalitarian reframing of confucianism, there is a proposal for spousal relationships to be reframed as a friendship tie. (this aligns with the interrelatedness of the five ties eg. the ruler-subject mirrors father-son dynamic, with the confucian belief that rulers have an obligation to their subjects alike parents to their own children.) by doing so, it removes the functional, gendered differentiation assigned to marital ties, and shifts it to something equal, and independent of gender. you exalt the value of trust between spouses, instead of basing marital relationships on gendered roles. as such, spouses become more like friends, and conversely, friends can also become more like spouses. (romance not a prerequisite. it has never been about romance anyway.)
given that mlc has repeatedly applied marital motifs to llh and dfs's characters in their joint narratives, this opens up a reading friendships as a marital tie. seeing marriage as a bridge for strangers to become family, marriage in mlc becomes a metaphor for the chosen commitment and mutual trust put in by strangers/friends (non-familial ties) into the becoming of family. the blurring of lines between marital ties and friendship encourages a genuine space of queer experience that goes beyond any pressure for strict labels - of sexuality, and relationships as romantic, sexual, etc etc.
(note: despite the borrowing of a feminist concept, I strongly hesitate to call mlc a feminist story. it's a whole discussion - or debate - on its own. nevertheless, it is definitely a gender-conscious story that lays foundation for a strong queer and egalitarian reading.)
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it is to be noted that it is intended - and also beneficial to take the confucian framework of relational ties beyond face value. the framework offers what it believed to be the most fundamental social relationship dynamics, and sees room for extension and matching to other kinds of relationships (all if not, most). a relationship such as teacher-student, which is outside of the five ties stated, can also mirror the affection of father-son ties, albeit not in a literal and identical way.
speaking of which. fdb and lxy/llh.
indeed they're known by others to be good friends. fdb thinks they're good friends too - insists on it, and puts his best efforts in keeping it that way. but does it really go both ways? if it does not, then can it really still be friendship? my humble take is that, ultimately - weighing in with llh's perspective - this is a relationship that is not so much based on trust, and rather, based on an innate affection that is only unique to family. (in this case, not blood/marital-based but one that was chosen and built aka lxy's relationship with sgd.) in other words, less of a friendship, more of a familial one.
it is a lot clearer considering their relationship from llh's point of view: some brat you never wanted in your life came barging in, and whether he was going to bring any positive effect to your life was secondary to the tranquility - which you have carved for yourself in the past decade - that is so integral to your personhood. no way. but the moment you hear that he's family? well, that changes the game completely. even before learning about fdb being sgd's son (then beginning to take initiative in showing greater acceptance), it is apparent in llh that there was an instinctive resonance with fdb as his shixiong's nephew. (eg. he remarked to his shifu's grave about how alike fdb is to himself.) this is unlike with dfs whom he had taken a much longer time to build trust with. you do not apply trust - aka the quality of friendships - to family. family is something deeper, more instinctive than that. if fdb was never family, I find it hard to imagine given llh's personality, that he would have let some brazen, bratty stranger intrude for that long. (boy invited himself to llh's home, sat himself down eating the owner's dinner and nosing in his cooking abilities!!! ily bb but that was uncalled for 😭)
of course there are many more layers in their relationship. there is a substantial degree of their history as (unwitting) teacher-disciple: fdb is still healthy and alive all thanks to the existence of lxy as a spiritual teacher role model in his life, regardless it being one-sided or not. there is also indeed some part of friendship in it, especially from fdb's point of view. he sees llh as a kindred spirit who he could enjoy a life of freedom with for life. but llh never reciprocates. he knew this was short-lived. and so ultimately, the hierarchical layer of their relationship overpowers the equal one, where llh's treatment of fdb as a nephew/小辈 younger family member and a disciple is the one that sealed the fate of their relationship.
if (blood-based) familial ties are irrelevant in jianghu, then the closest proxy to a father-son relationship in the martial world would be a teacher-disciple relationship. lxy and his shifu are a clear, indisputable example. for fdb and llh, their teacher-disciple tie is murkier and not consistently applied. they were also never ritualised as teacher-disciple, and thus are not teacher-disciple in any official capacity as far as confucian ideas are concerned. yet in crucial moments, it is invoked by llh as a card of authority over fdb to get out of sticky situations with fdb. and there was their final scene together: in a moment of sincerity, llh gives the approval to fdb as his disciple - then entrusting fdb with the secret manual of his techniques, up until his final letter in which fdb was recommended to dfs as a successor to his martial abilities.
in an imperial setting, this would have been the relationship of an emperor and his crown prince that straddles both ruler-subject and father-son ties aka a tag-team of disaster. the teacher has an obligation to nurture his disciple as a successor to himself, and love him like a son too. on the flipside, he holds the final power in their relationship - withholding knowledge and feelings from the younger one. they are only equals in a way a parent-child can be. they are only equals as much as the parent allows. and this is how fdb got left behind in the dust of llh's departure. he was the child treating his parent like a friend, supporting him emotionally and begging to be loved back the same way he loves his parent - but the parent had a lifetime way ahead of him and stayed out of his reach, physically and emotionally.
llh and fdb operate with the trapping of a friendship but have always been family in the core. llh had known that way before fdb did, just like everything else he had known and put out of fdb's reach. because. fdb did not have to know. fdb is different and will forge his own path. and that's a kind of love llh has for him that nobody understands (in fact not even fdb himself) - one that is on a different plane from friendships.
by repurposing the framework of relational ties, mlc showed that the essence of familial relationships aka its intimacy and closeness can be independent from biology and formalised rituals. and it is important to myself for stories to say that people can build close ties and deeply meaningful relationships even without being born or ritualised into any.
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then back to how these relational ties are inextricable from the conceptualisation of the 'self' in confucian worldview: the roles you play in these relationships are intended to define you. there is no 'self' independent from it. while the concept of a social, relational self is fully rooted in reality, being locked into social roles can be a painful way to live - a way that llh has experienced as lxy the sigu sect leader. so, in order for lxy/llh to realise a sense of self that exists outside the norms, it inevitably points to another way that requires a cut from these relationships. that is then the buddhist (or taoist) answer of looking past attachments to the world such as the confucian idea of relationships defining your being. only with a dissolution of a sense of 'self', can there be true liberation.
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I lOVE LOVE LOVE your brudick fics, I cannot stop reading them they are so delicious and addicting.
But I was wondering what got you into this amazing ship😌 and what is your favorite canon moment between them.
🖤💛🖤💙🖤
Thank you 🥹 I really appreciate it because I often struggle to see the worth in my own writing.
I had liked Batman from childhood but only got interested in brudick around 2016, not sure what it was exactly that opened my third eye to it, but I love toxic age gap yaoi so it was destined to happen lol there are several formative fics that I read at that time that really cemented my love for brudick, such as @holy-batmans story A Baptism of Fire, lacemonster’s Mirrors (currently privated and unavailable on the archive), & [orphaned account]’s You are forever in my mind.
As an adult I have a greater appreciation for adult Dick and Bruce’s relationship and the dynamics that form when they are older. But I still love any point of their relationship.
As for my favorite canon moment! That’s really difficult! What even is considered canon lol I’ll just share some particular moments in the comics that I really appreciate.
I love the scene in Robin Year 1 where Two-Face is beating Dick to death with a baseball bat and Bruce flies toward Harvey like a wraith
I love the embrace between Bruce and Dick in Robin & Batman after Dick saves Bruce from Killer Croc. Bruce’s horrifying realization that he’s trained Dick to kill himself to save others, not anticipating that it’d be his life Dick was willing to die for.
Bit of a throw back to the golden age (so maybe technically not canon), but I love when Dick gets beaten up so badly that Bruce is rushing him to a doctor’s house in the middle of the night for emergency treatment, and he threatens to kill the doctor with his bare hands if he doesn’t operate on him.
Also when Bruce goes out as Batman without Robin but keeps a portrait of Robin with him the whole time because he wanted to have him with him in spirit, are you kidding me???
Golden age Brudick is amazing. Also a huge fan of Bruce just. Giving up completely when he thinks Dick has died. He just goes limp and says “whatever guess i’ll die” . and this happens multiple times.
Literally any time Bruce thinks that Dick has died and either becomes brutally murderous about it or becomes a wreck. weeping for him like in Injustice or golden age comics. it really shows how integral Dick is to Bruce’s mental stability. How much he means to him!!!
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30 day fluff challenge: day five
"painting together"
(aka, a mini deleted scene from The Devil Doesn't Bargain)
Evan leans back against the wall from his space on the floor, staring at the canvas in front of him. It’s definitely…something.
He looks up at where Tommy is standing a few feet away, his own unstretched canvas stapled to the wall. He’s working in much larger dimensions than Evan an his little eight by eight tile, but the work is also far more definitve than the little swirls of the brush Evan is making.
“You seem at peace,” he states softly, staring up at his boyfriend.
Tommy doesn’t reply right away, giving his brush a spin around the glass palette in his right hand before he goes back to the canvas, working in a layer of blue to properly coat the canvas.
“It took me a while to find something that was calming enough,” he admits when he finally steps back from the canvas two minutes later. He glances down at Evan, smiles at the tile in his hands.
“I mean obviously you like art,” Evan replies. “I’m surprised you don’t commission it.”
Tommy shakes his head as he swipes another line of paint across the canvas and then presses a finger into it, blending together two shades.
“I don’t do it because I want money,” he states over the paintbrush between his teeth. “Sometimes I have an idea and it happens, sometimes it doesn’t.” He pauses as he steps back from the canvas again, and then moves and sets the palette on his supply cart before dropping the paintbrush in his water cup and turning his attention towards Evan again as he sits down on the stool he never uses.
“When I was first working with Rob, he knew I would draw; sometimes these really dark things that I would remember,” he explains. “But we were in a session one day, and he’d told me to draw the memory I couldn’t get out of my head, onto a canvas. He said ‘whatever it is, however dark it is, just draw it’. And I thought that was crazy because it brought up all of these really dark emotions about it all. I got really angry.”
Evan nods, watching Tommy with rapt attention as he talks. Something about it has him drawn in. It might be that it’s the first time they’ve really discussed Tommy’s trauma without him being upset about it.
“So, I get it done, and I bring it into my next session, and it’s this drawing on a twenty-four by thirty-six sheet, black and white and in paint pens, with a ridiculous amount of detail.” He pauses for a beat, staring at the floor as though he’s caught in the memory. After a time, he looks back up at Evan. “Rob looks at it for all of six seconds, and then takes it and puts up on this wall, and when he comes back over, it’s got all of these little holes in it.”
“Wha?” Evan furrows his brow, confused. Tommy lifts a finger, one second, a small smirk pulling across his face.
“He’d glued all of these thumbtacks backward on a corkboard with superglue. So when he put it up, he pushed all of the pins through, and then came back, and I was kinda like ‘what the fuck’ you know? Like I put all this work into this project, and he just destroyed it.”
“Please tell me this resolves in a good way,” Evan states with a small chuckle.
Tommy nods, drumming his fingers gently against the seat of the stool.
“So he walks over to me and hands me this water balloon. And I’m still miffed about the picture. But he tells me to throw the balloon. And at first I was like ‘fuck no, I did all this work and you just messed it up’. But he says ‘just trust me, and throw the balloon,” Tommy explains, bobbing his head slightly as he retells the story. He rolls his eyes as the smile reemerges on his face. “So I threw the damn balloon.”
His smile falls then, but there’s still a look of contentment on his face that Evan hasn’t seen in a long time. He sets his tile on the floor and pushes himself up, walks over to where Tommy is sitting on the stool. He rests his hands on either side of his boyfriend’s neck, thumbs circling in the space behind his ears.
Tommy narrows his eyes, his gaze pointed at Evan’s shoulder but not actually looking there.
“There was crimson red paint in the balloons.”
Evan stands in front of him, watching and waiting. Tommy’s gaze drifts up to him a few moments later.
“After the first one, I kept throwing them, and when they were gone, I went up and ripped it off the wall,” he explains. “And of course he asked me how it felt.” His gaze drops again, eyes searching before he nods at a thought inside his own head and looks at Evan again. “Felt like someone had seen the inside of my head for the first time, and what it felt like to be in here.”
Evan lifts Tommy’s head gently, presses his lips against the older man’s. Tommy’s hands rise to meet his waist, pulling in a step closer. When they finally break apart, Evan remains in the same spot between Tommy’s straddled legs.
“I still have that canvas around here somewhere,” he admits, glancing around the room. “And it was the first time I felt like paint might do something more than a pencil could.” His gaze trails back up to Evan. “That was also the first session I was able to actually say ‘I was sexually assaulted in the military’. So I guess you could say his methods work.”
Evan smiles at him, laughing silently at the statement. Tommy laughs with him, pulling him another step closer and nuzzling his face into Evan’s neck. Evan strokes his hand down the back of Tommy’s head, fingers massaging lightly against the back of his skull.
“I like seeing you like this,” he murmurs to him. “Like you feel at home in your own body again.”
Tommy nods, though he doesn’t lift his head.
“Thank you,” he rasps softly after a tick. “For loving me through it.”
Evan pulls back then, making sure Tommy is looking at him before he speaks again.
“I’d never be anywhere else,” he murmurs. “I meant it when I said I’d love you no matter how far you got in the healing process. I choose you, Tommy. Every time.”
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I feel kinda not that smart. There's a button on our page on Moments where we find every. Single. Card. There. Is. On. Moments. App.
So ILLREN is from
Detroit Underworld: Psychic.
Out of the 20 chapters (from 30) I've already played so far... No sight of the character.
But we saw:
Vampire
Warlock
Succubus
Troll (why did you have to blink right at that moment, Terrance?
Werewolf
And whatever Nick Gorgeous is....
Yest. The cards move and talk, level up and boost some things in the game.
The sad part:
I found a community on Facebook and since the app haven't been updated in the last 2 years and the stories didn't have anything new for quite some time, we were speculating that Stardust Works is no more. The company from the App on Apple Store changed, as if the app was purchased by some other company and this company doesn't have any plans to it, so they are just gonna let it die.
No responses to the fan base on their e-mails and social media.
Speaking of Social Media.... Moments twitter-X account has been dead in the last 2 years.
The community group I mentioned also contacted some authors from the stories of the aforementioned app. The response in general was a big "I don't know."
Word is this company purchased Stardust Works and offered new contracts to the authors that paid less and some left the platform. In the end no one knows what's going to happen in the future to Moments.
I really cherished this app. Now I'm sad and just playing to my heart's content until it's over... While I still hope it's back on it's tracks in the future.
I really, really hope this doesn't become a Storyscape all over again.
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