#so funny this is my first time meeting a spn fan given how tumblr is basically like

[salsakiyoomi]

OMG YOURE WATCHING SUPERNATURAL WHAT SEASON ARE YOU ON WHAT DO YOU THINK?? Supernatural is my to go and too favorite 😭 😭

hi 😭 the uhh, description thing is from a LONG time ago 😭 but i watched up till season 15 like, im still stuck on episode six ever since last march and havent moved on since 😭😭 i LOVE supernatrual, fav seasons were definitely from 4-6 they were at their peak, season eight's finale still does something to me from the way all the angels were falling from the sky, i! love! crowley! LIKE HIS DYNAMIC WITH THEM IS LITERALLY EVERYTHING TO ME, so sad he died him and rowena, rip to bobby, best father figure out there, his death was literally so sad but i really loved season 7 too, also im a dean girl 😭 miss him when he was still a baby in season 1 but man aged like fine wine and i'm down bad for him, castiel is my child like actually, i love him, my cat is named after misha collins bcz my mom loves misha collins

[ambiguousdisorderken]

in your expert opinion what are some of the most destiel-heavy episodes of spn? i stopped watching around season 7 and have no interest in engaging w the plot of the show at all but i’m in the mood for some gay yearning ykwim

Hi anon! Thank you for reaching out to me about this, I’m, no-joke, very flattered. I’d seen a couple posts on this same question, very thorough and detailed lists on Destiel-centric episodes, but at the moment I cannot find any of them, that would’ve answered your request much faster. So, in advance, sorry, my reply is probably coming in extremely late, but I did write this from scratch, so yeah.

Even though storylines in SPN can be very shitty and hollow, I do feel that to get the full Destiel experience -that long-drawn yearning- one would have to watch the entirety of the show, even if Cas isn’t in the episode or if there’s no explicit mention of their relationship/bond because it gives you a better understanding of them as characters and of how their relationship affects the narrative.

Now, you mentioned you stopped around S7, which is completely understandable and justified given the Dick plot game was very weak and, in my opinion, annoying (so little Cas!). I’m going to start listing from S7 in case you want to refresh your SPN before jumping straight into unseen episodes. Also, since you mentioned no interest in the plot and are specifically craving those sweet crumbs of gay yearning, I’ll skip most one-sided / too subtle episodes and cut to the chase.

Lastly, I hate spoiling things, but you’ve probably seen it all on Tumblr. I tried to keep the episodes’ descriptions short, as it might come in useful. Stuck to key words, quotes and/or little comments.

 Season 7

7x01 – Meet the New Boss: Godstiel, sincere apology. Cas: “I'm gonna find some way to redeem myself to you.”

7x02 – Hello, Cruel World: Mourning. Trench coat melancholy. The heart-wrenching eulogy: “Dumb son of a bitch.”

7x17 – The Born-Again Identity: Emmanuel!Cas, reunion, longing, hurt.

7x21 – Reading is Fundamental: Honey!Cas, hug, hurt, reunion, that painful SORRY (board game) scene.

7x23 – Survival of the Fittest: Honey!Cas, forgiveness, adorable, wified Cas. Dean hits us with: “Nobody cares that you're broken, Cas!" but also “I'd rather have you, cursed or not.”

Season 8 (this season is so good and Destiel is the driving motor of it, I swear. If you can, watch it complete.)

8x01 – We Need to Talk About Kevin: Dean in Purgatory looking for the angel.  Cas is referred to as “your [Dean’s] angel.”

8x02 – What’s Up, Tiger Mommy?: HUG!!!, Purgatory reunion, face touch, very romantic. Monster: “ You'll find your angel there.” //  Dean: “Let me bottom-line it for you. I'm not leaving here without you.”

8x05 – Blood Brother: Cas vs. Benny cat fight lol. Dean: “Cas... we're gonna shove your ass back through the eye of that needle if it kills all three of us.”

8x07 – A Little Slice of Kevin: Cas comes back from Purgatory, but before that Dean starts seeing him in places. Very tragic; hallucinating your dead significant other trope. Has That boner scene. Dean: “I did everything I could to get you out! EVERYTHING!” Cas helps Dean see what truly happened in Purgatory and not his self-altered memories. PACKED!

8x08 – Hunteri Heroici: Hilarious, romantic, intimate. Dean and Cas have an heart to heart. They actually communicate. Cas “I’ll watch over you.”

8x10 Torn and Frayed: They work a case together, and when I say heart eyes…

8x17 – Goodbye Stranger: THIS. EPISODE. Dean “I need you.”

8x19 – Taxi Driver: Separation. Naomi to Dean: "You're hoping Castiel will return to you. I admire your loyalty; I only wish he felt the same way."

8x22 – Clip Show: Lack of trust, hurt, tense interactions. Romantic too (basically, Cas gets Dean an apology basket).

8x23 – Sacrifice: Meaningful conversation and a gay couple hit by Cupid parallel. Dean “So this is it? E.T goes home?"

 Season 9

9x01 – I think I’m Gonna Like it Here: Dean prays to Cas IN.A.CHAPEL. Worry, longing, separation. Dean “Please, man, I need you here.”

9x03 – I’m No Angel: Human!Cas and jealous!Dean.

9x06 – Heaven Can’t Wait: Human!Cas TEXT-BOOK LONGING. GAY AS FUCK. Gazing, touching, they even TALK (for real).

9x09 – Holy Terror: Adorable Cas, flirty vibes, happyish, funny. Cas: “Cas is back in town!”

9x10 – Road Trip: Cas comforts Dean, Cas and Crowley bitching at each other, overall protective!Cas.

9x18 – Metafiction. Cas finds out about the Mark of Cain.

9x21 – King of the Damned: Hug, strong boyfriends vibes.

9x22 – Stairway to Heaven: Cas gives up an entire army, for Dean. Metatron about Cas “He's in love………………………. with humanity.”

9x23  – Do You Believe in Miracles?: At this point, it’s canon stated that Cas will do anything and lose everything if that means saving Dean. Metatron to Cas “You draped yourself in the flag of heaven, but ultimately, it was all about saving one human, right?”

 Season 10

10x01 – Black: Demon!Dean and sick/brokenhearted Cas in a slutty robe missing his man.

10x03 – Soul Survivor: ICONIC. Angel on Demon action! Cas turns down Hannah because he’s too gay and in love. Intimate Deancas talk.

10x05 – Fan Fiction: No Cas, but Destiel references. 

10x09 – The Things We Left Behind: That.Lunch.Date. Deancas introduction to co-parenting.

10x14 – The Executioner’s Song: We get Daddy Murder aka Cain. This is a Pivotal episode to understand Dean’s character development. Plus, it has Deancas interactions.

10x16 – Paint It Black: No Cas, but Dean opens up in confessionary; repressed BISEXUAL AS FUCK.

10x18 – Book of the Damned: Charlie meets Cas. Gay energies everywhere. Cute domestic little scene.

10x20 – Angel Heart: PARENTING! Essential to understand Cas from this point forward.

10x22 – The Prisoner: Just… just watch it. One of THEE Destiel episodes.

10x23 – Brother’s Keeper: No Deancas interactions but it’s the finale, and I recommend watching it because next season takes off literally right from here. No time jumps.

 Season 11

11x02 – Form and Void: Could skip to the very end which is when Cas comes back.

11x03 – The Bad Seed: Cursed!Cas. Dean takes care of him, even wraps him in a blanket. He also cradles his face. Extreme Hurt/Comfort. Jacting joices rejoice.

11x10 – The Devil in the Details: Could skip but has Casifer in it. Interesting to see his dynamic with Dean.

11x18 – Hell’s Angel: Casifer. Dean "It? It's not an it, Sam, it's Cas!"

11x23 – Alpha and Omega: Huggg! Cas willing to go on a guaranteed suicide mission with Dean. Very tender and sad.

 Season 12

12x02 – Keep Calm and Carry On: ANOTHER HUG! Dean presents his boyfriend to his mom<3 Soft and romantic.

12x09 – First Blood: Reunion hug<3, Cas pining… as in he counts his every minute without Dean.

12x10 – Lily Sunder Has Some Regrets: Direct parallel with canon couple. Crystal-clear mutual affection. One of the best. Angel Ishim to Cas about Dean “I'm gonna help you. I'm gonna cure you of your human weakness same way I cured my own… by cutting it out.”

12x12 – Stuck in the Middle with You: A dying Cas confesses his love. “I love you. I love all of you.”

12x19 – The Future: We find out Dean gave Cas a MIXTAPE!!! Very romantic and full of yearning, also worry and what could be seen as a betrayal (ish…).

12x23 – All Along the Watch Tower: Hands down, one of the most distressing Destiel episodes. Cas dies.

 Season 13

13x01 – Lost and Found: This is the worst because you have Dean trying to assimilate Cas’ death. Core of Dean’s widow’s arc. Jack introduction, that’s their new kid.

13x02 – The Rising Son: Widow’s arc (you could skip it, but why would you?).

13x03 – Patience: Widow’s arc (you could skip it, but why would you?). Dean to Sam “He manipulated him, he made him promises, said, ‘paradise on earth’ and Cas bought it and you know what that got him? It got him dead! Now you might be able to forget about that, but I can’t!”

13x04 – The Big Empty: Continuation of widow’s arc and Cas wakes up in the Empty. The Empty to Cas: "I know who you love. There's nothing for you back there." // Dean to Sam “I need you to keep the faith, for both of us. ‘Cause right now, I… Right now, I don’t believe in a damn thing.”

13x05 – Advanced Thanatology: Suicidal and hopeless Dean gets his win. Cas comes back. Gives me the chills.

13x06 – Tombstone: COWBOY BOYFRIENDS!

13x14 – Good Intentions: Happy and fun Destiel scene. So Very Married.

13x23 – Let The Good Times Roll: Season finale, Dean talks about retiring (plans include Cas of course) and just very nice to see them interact.

Season 14

14x03 – The Scar: Reunion.

14x08 – Byzantium: Deanand Cas dealing with their child’s death, then bringing him back by Cas making a deal with the Empty. IMPORTANT EPISODE.

14x09 – The Spear: Cas uses the royal We – married behavior.

14x10 – Nihilism: Dean is stuck in his own mind, and Cas and Sam try to bring him back. Cas “Please, you have to -- you have to try to remember, because the people in your life -- in your real life, out there -- we need you to come back.”

14x12 – Prophet and Loss: Dean gets his very own Dr. Sexy, aka Dr. Cas.

14x14 – Ouroboros: Basically another date (their kid tags along) and They TALK. Very intimate and established marriage vibes.

14x18 – Absence: Shits starts to go south. [ Dean: “Who cares what Jack said? We don't know what happened! But I swear, if he did something to her, if she is -- (points to Castiel) Then you're dead to me. (Castiel looks crushed after Dean says that).]

14x20 – Moriah: Tense and very upsetting. Relationship very damaged.

 Season 15 (I would advise watching the entire season because it relies heavily on Destiel. They’re the heart and the emotional motor leading the plot onwards.)

15x01 – Back and To The Future: Deancas’ in the aftermath of their kid’s death. Tension gets worse.

15x02 – Raising Hell: Tension rises, this is very intense. Cas “Dean. You asked, "What about all of this is real?" We are.”

15x03 – The Rupture: Breaking point ends in divorce.

15x06 – Golden Time: Painful phone call which speaks volumes about the current state of their relationship at the time. Also, good to see where they’re standing and how they’re coping.

15x08 – Our Father Who Aren’t in Heaven: Strained relationship so obvious they’re offered couples’ therapy.

15x09 – The Trap: MASTERPIECE. Back to Purgatory. Can (and is) taken as Dean’s love confession (because it is). 

15x12 – Galaxy Brain: So married. Little domestic date, you can see LOVE written in their faces.

15x13 – Destiny’s Child: AU!Dean and Sam. Not a yearning episode per se, but AU!Dean? SO GAY.

15x17 – Unity: God reveals that the only act of free will in any universe he ever created has been Cas choosing Dean.

15x18 – Despair: Cas confesses his love to Dean.

[missjackil]

SPN Did Something Pretty Amazing

One thing I have always liked about Supenatural, is that theyre willing to try things no other shows have done. Most of the time it works, sometimes it doesnt, but theyre not affraid to think outside the box. Things like having a cross-over with Scooby Doo, or episodes like The French Mistake, or Fan Fiction, are great, though theyre doable only because of the premise of the show. In the supernatural world, nothing is impossible. The heros die and come back a lot, old characters come back in various ways, in dreams, time travel, or even as the same character, and this is ok because again, in the supernatural world nothing is impossible. However, this newest amazing thing, at its core, didnt come to pass because of supenatural influence, but because of human actions, and viewer acceptance.  Two brothers and their Angel buddy, adopt an adult orphan son.  Think about that. What show has ever done such a thing? None. In similar cases, like 3 Men and a Baby, Full House, Two and a half Men, there is one defined Father, and then the other men are uncles or support for the one father. But not on SPN, all 3 have been defined as this kid’s father, even though none of them are biologically his father. Even before Luficer died, we saw this beginning. And even stranger still, there were always strong efforts to keep Jack away from his biological father, which is also not a common practice. When dealing with an older child, theres always a “let them chose” clause. But thats never really been the case on SPN, it was always “Keep Lucifer away from this kid” and justifiably so, I might add, but its still strange for TV isnt it? Yet, somehow this all worked. Now, this isnt a debate on who deserves to be Jacks main father, which would obviously be Sam but to just talk about how the show managed to make this happen and be completely accepted by the viewers. 

I work with several SPN fans, though Im the only one who wouldnt really be considered a casual viewer, meaning Im the only obssessed one LOL but the others arent involved in SPN SM on tumblr or twitter, they dont go to conventions and none of them are into shipping. (thats right, it seems most casual viewers dont ship the characters) yet all of them think its cool that Sam, Dean and Cas are Jack’s fathers, none of them think its creepy, incestuous, or gay. One did joke that it sounded like the synopsis of a very bad porno, (2 brothers, and their buddy take in a young adult orphan as their own) but then said that its a very cool concept.  What I think made it work, is everything thats gone down in the last 13 years. I dont care if youre a wincest shipper or not, but theres no closer relationship on the show than Sam and Dean. We know now they are “stuck” with each other, they wont be finding a significant other and building their own family, and even in the end, they’ll be together. Be it on Earth, in Heaven, Hell or the Empty. Also, they have no closer companion than Cas. Whether or not you like the character, canonically, Cas is their best friend that they love as a brother.  Since the show revolves around family dynamics, good ones and bad ones, we’ve seen Sam and Dean in every position. As brothers, sons, cousins, friends, and even as husbands breifly to Lisa and Amelia. we never really got to see them as fathers. The show could have remedied this by having one of their ex girlfriends show up with a kid “Surprize!!” but Im glad they didnt. This would automatically put one brother in the position of Dad, and the other as Uncle and Cas is just that buddy in the trench coat. The way it was done, put all 3 men in a fatherly position that developed over different time lines and circumstances.  Im going to try to break this down in an unbias manner. We can all feel free to disagree with the outcome, but its how the show itself unfolded this little highly unorthodox family. Cas was the one appointed to be Jack’s father. Kelly gave this duty to him when she decided to allow herself to die to let her son be born, and Cas accepted. So it looked as though Cas would be this boy’s father, but as it was, Cas was dead when Jack was born.  Sam came to the plate next. His relationship developed organically with Jack. Some may not have seen it coming, but Sam was determined long before Jack was born, to NOT kill him, but to try to let him be born without the worry that he would be evil. When it was apparent they couldnt take his grace and make him human, Sam knew it didnt mean Jack HAD to be evil. Sam took the role as mentor right away. Caring for Jack and having genuine compassion for him. We were given the hint Sam felt fatherly when they showed him reading a parenting book. (my god that was the cutest thing) So the writers flipped the script and gave Sam a head start in the father field. Also, with Sam being first, it added this layer of beauty, because Sam fell in paternal love with the son of his torturer. He wasnt enlisted, or pushed, it just happened, and thats beautiful. Dean came last, and as a story teller, I can see why they chose this route. It had been established since S1 that Dean is good with kids and naturally paternal. To have him be the first “father” would leave Cas and Sam on unlevel ground through lack of experience. For Dean to follow up second from Cas, would make it too shippy, and Sam would probably never make it out from under the  “uncle” title. and wouldnt we always wonder if Sam held a little resentment inside? Jack being the son of Lucifer for starters, and Dean taking him in as a son? Over the seasons, Sam has made it very clear, he never wants to be #2 in Dean’s eyes, and this could bring around some bad brother drama.  Dean starts off hating Jack. Indeed he was way too nasty to him in the beginning. Not even gonna debate that, but for Sam, Dean gives the kid a shot. He discovers that yes, Jack is a good kid and now Deans natural paternal side clicks on. And keep in mind he didnt try to step onSam and take over. Yes they showed Dean and Jack bonding more than they did Sam, but he didnt take over. He made sure taking Jack out was ok with Sam, so did Cas. They both respected that Sam has been Jacks primary care giver since day 1, and Sam isnt selfish or possessive (over anyone/anything else besides Dean) so Sam is happy to share Jack so he can have as much positive influence as he can.  So I give TPTB credit for coming up with this formula, my only complaint being that they didnt need to make Dean as hateful as he was, they could have just made him hessitant and standoffish at first and that would have been enough but it is what it is, and that part is over thank Chuck. Now, most of us knew the “3 dads” thing was coming because the cast talked about it a lot, but those of us who dont follow the cons and interviews, still were pleasently surprised that this came about. I havent heard anyone complain that its creepy, even though if you tell someone whos never seen the show “On my show, the 2 brothers and their friend adopted an 18 yr old kid” they’d look at you funny.  We complain about the writers all the time because they do screw up a lot, but I like to give them credit when I can. This is one of those situations. They made something that seems creepy on the outside, not only acceptable, but wonderful, simply by how it was written. I feel the same way about how they handled the return of Mary. It didnt pan out as well as it could have, and thats really a whole other meta, but Im glad they didnt take an easy route with her making her a zombie, or Super Mom and put her in a really human position of a mother meeting her adult sons for the first time, but Ill save that for another post :)

[surflove808]

Fan Wars:  A New Hope.  Damnit.

I sure do hope you like reading lots of words!!

Here's the remix (Edited.  Longer.  Angrier.  Yay!):  I’m about to get all fire and brimstone up in here.  I apologize in advance.

Regarding my blog post re:  The Joke Debacle, most everyone has been so thoughtful, mature, kind and open minded about the discussion matter, even if they didn’t necessarily agree with me.  So that right there, shows me that it’s possible for all of us to be more understanding with each other regardless of our ships or faves or whatever.  And I’m an open-minded, open book, so even if you don’t agree with me, this is a safe place to vent concerns or frustrations with what I say.  We can all respectfully disagree, meet in the middle or go just back to our own corners.  Whatever.  

I'd like to encourage those of you who are taking your frustrations out on anyone who agrees with points made in my article (on Twitter or wherever) to come speak directly to me if you have an issue. I wrote it, after all.  My blog is helpfully linked right there in the article.  I don't bite. And for those of you who aren't overly familiar with what's going on, please check out the many, many comments attached to my actual blog post, and you will be able to see that there are far more people that are fed up with these bad apples, than there are bad apples.  I hope.  And if there are apples that don’t feel like they’re being given a fair shake, I’d like to hear from those apples too.

When I posted my angry rant last week, I didn’t expect it to gain so much traction.  But it did…and it showed me I wasn’t alone, and that there are a lot of fed up fans out there, and justifiably so, who are looking for an end to this ridiculous inner-fandom civil war.  I'm relatively new to Tumblr. I wasn't expecting to become the unofficial mouthpiece for this issue.  

I was approached by movietvtechgeeks.com asking if they could use my blog post in an article about the cyberbullying that’s happening in this fandom, so I said “Sure!”  I’m honored that someone would want to print my rambling.  But of course, it’s also opened up the floor on Twitter, yet again, for certain people to deliberately misconstrue the content and twist it to suit their own agenda in the comment sections.  What they fail to realize is…they’re only proving why we needed this article in the first place.  So, joke’s on them!!  However…. now I feel obligated to come on here and clarify my intent and that’s friggin irritating.

Here is the article if you want to take a looksee:  https://twitter.com/movietvtechgeek/status/927578926397952000

I NEED TO MAKE A FEW THINGS CRYSTAL CLEAR (apparently):

1.  I don’t have a ship.  I don’t dislike shippers.  (Ship away!  I just dislike pushy people with no sense of boundaries)  So please do not misconstrue anything I say as promoting or denigrating *a* ship. You do you.  Let me do me.  Well, that sounded vaguely dirty… you know what I mean.  I’m just gonna ship me with myself now.  Nobody can love me quite like me.  

2.  I don’t stan an actor, and I don’t think that because someone likes “another” actor (whomever that might be) more, that it’s a direct affront to me or them.  I tag all these "relevant to the post” actors because I think they’re all relevant to the success of this show, and sadly….also to this juvenile ridiculousness that seems to be brewing between fan factions.  

But, if I’m being honest?  Full disclosure:  I do have a favorite!  Jensen. Heyyyoooo!  I think he’s an incredibly talented actor IN MY OPINION, and I like his extraordinarily expressive face. See?  Simple as that.  Is that a problem?  And do you feel better now that it’s out in the open? 

We can all have opinions, and favorites without “throwing feces like howler monkeys” to quote a certain dickhead angel.  And as far as personalities and talent go?  They’re all amazing, and they all belong, IN MY OPINION.  The main cast, the supporting cast, new castmates, former castmates…. they all just…gel.  You know?  It’s some kind of voodoo magic.  And they’re by all accounts, really decent people doing good things out there in the world.  Without any one of them, it wouldn’t be the show we all know and love.  And if you don’t love the SHOW, well….I guess fucking go watch something else?  Right??  

Listen....Unless you’re tied to a chair Clockwork Orange-style, and being force fed this show by some evil, covert government agency… you DO have other choices.

3.  I sucked it up and joined Twitter because there seems to be an attack dog, hive-mind situation happening that seems hell bent on cowing people into submission.  That shit doesn’t fly with me.  And if I’m on there and see bullying, damaging misinformation or harassment… I’m going to get in the fray.  But I’m going to TRY to do it with honesty, integrity and a sense of humor.  I want to sit at the adults table on Turkey Day.  Not at the kids table with Weird Uncle Augustus.  Know what I mean?  Don’t be that guy.

AND ONCE MORE FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE BACK:   To be clear - I’m not speaking to ONE specific group of people.  However, if you look into the mirror I’m holding up and see your own reflection?  I’m probably talking to you.

4.  I’m not going to choose a “side”.  I choose the show, it’s actors, crew, writers, etc, collectively.   Because they all work their asses off, both on and off the set to give us fans so much more than just entertainment.  

5.  If someone wanted to hold a mirror up to this fandom right now, via a juicy documentary on the ship wars, fighting factions, undermining, conspiracy theories, revenge tactics, harassment campaigns, etc…. I think its safe to say, we’re all gonna be pretty fucking embarrassed.  Let’s hope that never happens.  I’m cringing just thinking about it.  But we deserve it, if we keep on with this petty bullshit, ya know? 6.  My blog post was not about for J2 "stans” or about Misha “stans”, for gods sake people. This post was about how splinter groups (for lack of a better term) were being damaging and disruptive (As they do.) and how it’s bad for EVERYONE when we let warring factions steamroll over everyone else, AND each other. This post was a direct response to the organized and brutally efficient Twitter campaign that somehow found its way into the laps of a handful of online news sites in an effort to publicize an off-color joke in order to take advantage of the current climate in the entertainment industry and start a viral witch hunt.  *I just ran out of breath.  Time for a James Brown pause*

7.  My post was also aimed at the Twitter spamming campaigns that Shatner and Pellegrino, as well as J2 had to put up with in the past few weeks.  And don't feed us that horsehit about them bullying the poor fans that spoke their minds. NO.  You collectively went on, and started shit, kept coming at them, and they defended themselves.  And rather maturely, considering.  It’s about groups of people that have gotten so wrapped up and out of control, that they’re poisoning this fan family.  I genuinely feel concerned that some folks are confusing reality with fiction, here.

8.  If you look back farther on my Tumblr page (?) to the good ol days of last Thursday (?) - particularly the Silent Majority post - that post is not in reference to any fan or any actor, specifically.  It’s in reference to the majority of fans who want to do the right thing, WANT to help out, WANT to just enjoy the damn show without all this drama and hate.  But because they’re quiet, and they’re not able to speak their minds without fear of retribution…. they’re vastly under-represented.  And so, the assholes of the fandom run amok unchallenged. THAT’S the majority I’m speaking of.   9.  I abhor anyone that lurks around on social media looking for people to mess with. So, imagine my surprise and disappointment that now I’M that person, because of this fucking shit!!  I’m only getting after people who are picking on others, but still… lurking, arguing.  Utter waste of valuable time.  Yours and mine.

Saturday night I apparently pissed off the leader of one of the SPN gangs (what do you call them??)  when I called her out on her behavior and was ominously told:  “Wanna see what happens when I tell my followers what to think and do”.  To which I responded “I already have.  And it’s deplorable”  And then offered to provide her with my name, # and home address.  She didn’t want it.  I don’t know why.  I thought it was funny!  I NEVER get hate mail... and I was looking forward to some postcards.  I’m old school that way.  Don’t hate tweet me.  Send me a hate postcard featuring something cool from your state.

Jokes aside....that’s the kind of crap that mobilized me in the first place.  

I tried to have a reasonable conversation with this individual and even asked if she wanted to take it offline and talk.  I followed her lead, conversationally, did snark back when required...but just when I thought we were going to have a reasonable discussion, she pulled the rug out.  I tried.  If you’re reading this and you feel misrepresented, or misunderstood, or you’re trying to misrepresent our conversation - the door is still open if you want to talk.  But I’m not going to tolerate your bullshit, and neither should anyone else.

Who ARE these people?  And why is this happening?  That’s my question.

10.  I'm not here to listen to arguments that a 6-year old might find compelling in a court of law, such as:  Well, Jensen told that joke a year ago, or Misha said thisthatandtheotherthing back in the day...so why are you only talking about Jareds joke?  

Well...because this is not a tit-for-tat thing.  I'm talking about the issue that is relevant RIGHT NOW.  And this is far from a "blame it on Jared" thing.  I feel awful for the guy.  For both of them for even being looped into this insanity.  The intent of my blog post was to address very current events that have been demonstrative of the current, toxic climate brewing in the SPN fandom.  I’m NOT here to write the Unabridged History of SPN Actors and Their Fondness for Off-Color Jokes.  

11.  If you're all wound up and offended by what I wrote?  It's probably because I wrote this blog post not for you, but about you.  OR, you've not been provided with context, content or clarity, and you got swept up in this manufactured hysteria and reacted.  OR, you think I’m a total asshole, and that’s ok.  I get it!  And I understand how my post could make some of you defensive and prickly.  But hey, as the saying goes... don't start none, won't BE none.  On the flip side, as someone eloquently stated (ahem, CarolHansson) "It's ok to be offended....it's also ok to not be offended"

12.  I am not a rape apologist.  And neither are the actors.  And to even insinuate that any of us, by extension of supporting Jared or Jensen in this situation, are pro "rape culture", is appropriating a term and using it so irresponsibly that you're negating the real suffering of sexual abuse survivors.  The more you trivialize it, the more you take away its power. Stop using manufactured concern for survivors as your jumping-off point for harassment, and START asking yourself what's really motivating you to use that argument as an excuse for your behavior. BTW,  #Metoo, and you sure as hell don't represent ME.

If you want to see a record of this casts achievements for mental health awareness, LGBTQ rights, anti-bullying and womens issues, to name a few - it's a simple Google search away.  That's on your time.  Not mine.  Again....not here to write their autobiography.  This piece is an opinion piece.  I try to be balanced, but that’s as far as it goes.  I'm not CNN.  

13.  MISHA:  Misha was not mentioned in my post because Misha was not under fire last week or the week before over this stupid bullshit.  If I SEE that happening, I’ll write about THAT.  But HE was not the focus of this mess.  So I left HIM out of it.  Does that make sense?  And also?  I'm not here to equally represent all actors at all times.  That's not how this works in the context of the subject matter at hand.  If you want to see more adequate representation for your favorite actor  - write your own op ed. Easy peasy, lemon squeezy.  

And Misha as well as J2, are probably more than a little appalled that some of their biggest fans (?) are committing to some shady behavior in their honor and in their names.  Just a guess.  They’re good guys and this is probably not sanctioned behavior.  If you think it is?  Show me the receipts.  Let’s do this honestly, using facts.  Not conjecture.

14.  No, I do not excuse anyone's behavior because of their physical attractiveness.  Neither do most people.  I am not a child (Thank you, Uma Thurman), and I don't rationalize like a child.

15.  No, I am not doing this to seek approval from the actors, and neither is anyone else with the #istandwithJ2 hashtag.  As previously stated, this is an equal and opposite reaction to the bullshit that brought us all here today.  You’re grasping at straws at this point, if that’s the argument you’re going with.  Speaking on my own behalf, I have nothing to gain here, except some new Tumblr friends with a side of troll.

16.  To reiterate on previous posts - I’m hoping that all of us will collectively start sticking up for each other when we see someone harassing a fellow fan online. Even if you don’t want to comment….maybe give the person being flamed those little heart thingys (likes?).  Direct message them if liking their post doesn’t feel safe.  Show them your support in some way, so that they don’t feel alone and so that they don’t feel quite so vulnerable to attacks from online bullies.   We Have Got To Start Backing Up People who are just trying to express their opinions respectfully and are being slammed with responses that are belligerent, demeaning, threatening, obnoxious, etc.  Otherwise - these jerks will just keep steamrolling right over the more gentle viewers out there.  And a lot of them, are just kids.  And this goes both ways.  It has to, in order to be effective.

If you see something - say something.  That’s my 2 cents anyway.

The world’s going to Hell in a handbasket, 26 innocent people were gunned down yesterday in a place they held sacred and felt safe in, and it just keeps happening.

Mother Nature has decided she’s sick of our shit and has been upending thousands of lives.  There are actual sexual predators in some of our pasts and sadly, in some of our futures.  And this “joke” has no relevancy or bearing on that sad fact.

Women, people of color, LGBTQ people, economically fragile people, physically fragile people, etc...are seeing their protections, rights and livelihoods eroded away in an alarmingly short period of time, and the list goes on and on… and THIS is what we’re dedicating our mental and emotional resources to?

This show is supposed to be an escape from reality, guys.  Not actual reality.

Why are we harassing the actors and fellow fans of a television show that brought us all together in the first place?  This is entertainment, people.  I know how important this show is to all of us.  And I know how impactful the message of this show has been.  And I know that without this show, some of us might not be here today.  We are some passionate sumbitches.  I GET THAT.  

The question still remains.... what in the actual fuck are we really fighting for and about, here?  If someone can quantify and explain that to me in a way that makes sense, I’m all ears. 

Has it really come to:  “Maybe we need to devise a more sophisticated tagging situation so that people don’t keep dipping their chocolate in other peoples peanut butter.”  I don’t know.  But this is Nth level ridiculousness, and we need to figure it out before it gets even worse.

For now, I’m going to get back to enjoying this show for what it is, and putting my beautiful brain back to work on more important matters.  I’ve spent a week in this muck, and it’s been... enlightening.  I’ll say that.

And even though I don’t agree with some of you - I can see by the CSI-level attention to detail that a lot of us have applied to all things SPN... that we could actually be mobilized into an almost unstoppable force for real good and real change.  If we wanted that.  

We could probably figure out who ordered JFK’s assassination.  Figure out where Jimmy Hoffa’s buried.  Solve the mysteries of the pyramids.... help reunite missing kids with their families...Get Trump impeached... ahem.  You get it.

Or we could just keep wasting our pent-up aggression on other fans, and the actors of our favorite show.  Because that’s easy.  Choices.  

But wait!  There’s more!  Because I keep getting valid messages and concerns, this ridiculously long piece just got longer.  

Posting these blogs has opened the door to a lot of private communication from both sides of the fence in the fandom, and I'm going to include some of my recent responses to an SPN fan who felt that her group of fans were not getting a fair shake and felt my blog targeted them.  We had a long discussion and she was very cool and had a lot of valid concerns and examples of other bad fan behavior dating wayyyy back, so I wanted to add this in.

I'm just going to paraphrase my own replies and print them here, so that people who may feel misrepresented or angry can see that, there are other ways to discuss these issues and for everyone to see that there's a better way than Twitter Wars.

(Paraphrased conversation subject matter in italics)

What's amazing is that J2 fans AND Misha fans have private messaged me with the exact same concerns.  And you have one very important thing in common:  You ALL feel victimized.  And you have been.   Know why?  It's because you've been victimizing each other.

(Slaps own face.  HARD.)  Not because of her.  But because of this whole enchilada.

If both groups are concerned about the same issues and both want the harassment to stop, whyyyy are you still at each others throats?

Well, I think it's because good people are capable of behaving very badly, especially online.  And all they’re doing is making themselves look ridiculous.  And they do not merit support.

A lot of people have been using me as a mediator, or prism, so to speak, with regards to this issue.  But you don't need me, when you all essentially want the same damn thing.

It's time to stop participating.  All you have to do is take a step back and say to yourself (or others if you’re feeling up to it) I'm not going to support harassment, hate or damaging misinformation.  And you can do that by unfollowing abusive accounts, by not "liking" or reblogging abusive content...and/or by not contributing to it yourself.  And if enough of us did that, BOOM, on our way to a solved problem.

These are only a few suggestions.  There's no cure or quick fix for this.  

Only alternatives to current behaviors.

And I know there's a lot of bad blood between these groups as evidenced by the mountains of grievances I've been getting.  Can’t un-say or undo any of it.  But we can stop doing it going forward, can’t we?

As long as people want to keep concentrating on past transgressions and dwelling on past arguments, no one can move on.  

And continuing to keep score with hopes to "win" something on here isn’t working either.  I’ve got bad news:  There's no "winning" here.  No grand prize.  Just more of the same bullshit.  And if you’re happy to sit in this pile of crap and continue to marinate?  That’s your prerogative.  By “your” I mean WHOMEVER fits the bill.

It's not my responsibility to make you play nice with each other.  Or mediate your arguments.  Though, it sounds like mediation is exactly what ya'll might need.  I'm just here, publicly stating how this all looks to me: Like a never-ending playground slapfight.

I think that there will always be "haters".  That's the nature of fandom, and life in general.  But if we stop promoting that kind of behavior with our support, and if these individuals have to lurk in the back channels, as opposed to being allowed to thrive and build fiefdoms all over social media.  That sounds like a good compromise to me.

And if you have a lot to express on this matter from your own perspective, there are better alternatives to spamming people on Twitter.  For example... 

Write a blog!  If you’d like to provide an objective viewpoint, and also defend your stance but you’re afraid people will see that you support actor A, B, or C and automatically discount what you have to say?  Start a side blog.  Compile a list of wrongs that you’ve seen committed by both sides and be the mirror, and show people what they’ve become.

Create your own, blank slate and start fresh.

There, now I can drop the mic.  

[elizabethrobertajones]

If Destiel is going to happen. Do you think they have non-disclosure agreements about Destiel?

If it was going to happen, they would, probably like any upcoming plot thing. I don’t really think at this point it is or really ever has been something they’d have an NDA for, which is why we have Misha casually telling people about the jilted lover note, or Jensen with absolutely no briefing on how to handle the fandom when it comes to shipping >.> That’s not to say I am agreeing that it’s not real or there, but, well, I’ll refer you to my next anon down:

Anonymous said: true, an actor gets to interpret lines and act out something, but even that is going to be re-shot and edited. actors are in a position where their opinion can reach more people, and because they are linked to process of getting the story to us, their opinions are more easily mistaken for fact than say, mine… which are on anon, on tumblr. :P

And yeah this is why I think Jensen has no clue. To use a recent example, 11x15 absolutely hung him out to dry with the writing and editing. He had no control and probably no idea when it came to setting Sam up in a scene immediately following Dean meeting Gunnar, to meet HIS childhood crush, and for the moments to be played side by side like that. Or for the scripting of his own scene to mirror Dr Sexy as much as it did. He might think he filmed a normal sort of scene about meeting a childhood idol (did he even know the camera implied that Dean recognised him by his butt? They film these things completely out of order :P) but when you add up everything about that sequence, it was directly paralleling one childhood crush to another, and the character Sam talked to played almost no further major part in the episode, really. The only reason she was more than a background character was to have this comparison.

Of course since Jensen looks like Dean and puts in all the effort to bring us Dean you would think he’d know the character best, but he’s just standing in the worst possible place to see it. I mean, like, he’s trapped in the Truman show except he’s getting hauled out to discuss it with the audience every so often. And people working with actors on film have a luxury that, say, playwrights never had, because they can withhold info - give new script pages at the last minute, be working several episodes in advance… Say, surprise Jensen with the demon!Dean reveal that they’ve known about forever and ever the audience seemed to be guessing longer than Jensen finally knew :P 

I don’t think it’s a conspiracy or anything, but the writers and crew have been playing around with implications a LONG time - almost the whole show, really - and at what to them is a fairly safe remove. If you follow the breadcrumb trail back to the knowing smirks, you get “who says Destiel isn’t canon ;)” or “the potential for love in all places” and then you go a few layers above those assholes (meant lovingly :P), and suddenly the higher ups have no idea, which takes me right back to NDA anon, because 9x03′s wank storm proved that there’s no long foretold plot about it. When we talk about the Destiel arc, it’s just what they’d treat as the regular emotional arc between Dean n Cas, and then we bring in the tools to analyse it… Which takes me to my 3rd anon:

Anonymous said: agree so hard with you on the stuff about actors and pr and fandom. whenever i see actors from various fandoms saying things like ya i play it that way, ya i think my character is this or not that, i’m like cool, but that’s your interpretation. sometimes i agree sometimes i don’t. as viewers, we’re also in a position to interpret the story. and i definitely enjoy what i get out of it.

Absolutely :D 

I also think SPN gave us the okay several times to analyse it however we want and knows its fanbase well enough in the show to give proper nods. I mean, not like we needed permission, but that the show itself doesn’t squirm away from this sort of analysis but embraces it, even if it seemed to think it was funny, it didn’t think it was bad, early on (and I think acknowledged the part they had to play in it, like, fair cop, when they first started getting meta).  Then Robbie wandered into the show and rubbed his grubby hands all over it, so now within the text of the show, it’s literally more the actors fault for not getting it about shipping, than it is the final product of the show’s fault for not encouraging it, even if “it” in this case is a fairly safe middle of the road “it’s okay to interpret Destiel out of the show if you want to and like it”… 

Anyway when it comes to Jensen, he obviously hasn’t had anyone seriously explain to him - even after 10x05 - the really complicated media theory at work here, and honestly looking at his part of Fan Fiction, or, say, that scene back in 4x18 where Sam tells him about Sam slash Dean, I’m not sure he’s ever been given a definition of what fandom does which doesn’t imply that fandom interprets secret relationships or inserts gay stuff where there wasn’t any… 

idk, at this point they’d need a long weekend and a team of scholars to set him straight on the matter, because standing where he does on the production end, I’m not entirely sure he has even really thought about interpretation. He has a role as a storyteller, but it’s so much the mechanical actions of the story, no matter how much nuance he puts into a performance, he’s thinking that he’s creating, like, a fixed event and that’s just what the story is. Even away from the queer readings the show encourages multiple takes on things, or actively tries to whip up sides in arguments between the brothers or something… The whole ambiguity about John’s parenting… 

The actors really aren’t big-picture about it, and so they’re going to miss a lot of stuff, especially the stuff which you can’t get from acting it out without seeing how the finished product looks. Which puts US the viewers in the one seat in the whole assembly line where we get to authentically describe what the story is. We might come up with different things, but our reading is the one that matters (even if it’s still technically not “correct” in a world where there’s no right answer), since this is produced as entertainment FOR us.