#so it feels better talking and sharing posts about OSDDID while having that

[werewolfdog]

Gonna be OSDDIDposting on this blog more fyi

[rayssyscourse]

hi!!

first off, thank you for the kind words!! I'm so glad to hear, from you and a few others, that my syscourse stuff is respectful, even to people on the other side of the argument. I'm glad that I can be a, albeit small, force for good in a community that can often be polarized and hateful. :)

and what you're saying absolutely does make sense, and I agree with basically all of it to be honest.

thank you for sharing your experience as a non-disordered but still traumagenic system! I had honestly never heard of that before, and I'm low-key really glad to hear from somebody who's not necessarily OSDDID or endogenic. you asked if I had thoughts on that, and I do! I think that makes a lot of sense, and honestly it really goes to show that this debate isn't just black and white; it's not just "us vs them" or one side against the other. plurality is different for each individual system, and labels don't and shouldn't box people into a specific designated experience or set of beliefs. so thank you for that reminder, not just to other ppl reading this, but to me, that this is a highly diverse and not black-and-white problem.

honestly I also just appreciate you bringing this from both sides, where you talked about how both traumagenic and endogenic systems feel hurt and are unhappy. that's also an important reminder.

and yes, what you said about separate spaces is exactly what I'm saying! we need that kind of separation, because, like you said, our current situation is not helping anybody. it's driving wedges between us, which I understand is what I'm arguing for, but those wedges shouldn't be out of hatred. what we need is mutual respect, which means acknowledging our differences as well as similarities, and respecting each other's spaces and right to community with others who share their experiences.

about what you said about being pro endo but agreeing with me more than you expected, and about me being one of the few anti endos who differentiates between individuals and community: thank you so much :) It genuinely makes me so happy when i hear from pro endos and anti endos alike that im respectful and open minded; and i hope that I can set an example, even if just a little bit, of how we can have these debates respectfully while still having our different opinions!

and I'm sort of the opposite end of the spectrum as you when you said you used to be super pro endo but have stepped away from that; I used to be valiantly anti-endo, and I will admit that I didn't always understand the difference between individuals and communities. my anger, as does many antis', comes from a place of hurt, and that hurt is valid, but attacking individuals only spreads that hurt when it should be focused on the general issues with the community (I'm planning to make a whole separate post about that at some point, lol). I have been far from perfect, but I like to think that I've gotten better about that, and it makes me glad to hear that I come across as such.

last thing: yes I (unfortunately) know about the radqueer community, although to be totally honest I have all their tags blocked LMAO. so I'm not updated on all of that. could you explain the link between them and the endo community? /gen

anyways, sorry for how long this got haha. and you're all good, I think I understood all of what you said, so ofc if it seems like I misinterpreted anything let me know. otherwise, I appreciate how mindful you are about it, and I don't feel at all like you're talking over my experience or making it about you/others. in fact, thank you for sharing your opinions and experience! I am always happy to learn about new/different experiences, and this blog is 100% an open place for sharing differing opinions.

I hope you have a lovely evening! :)))

I'd like to clarify, when I say I am anti-endo, that doesn't mean I hate every endo system, etc. My issue lies not necessarily in the existence of non-traumagenic plurality, but the way it is presented.

The OSDDID community has the unique, and often extremely difficult, experience of having the brain forcefully cut itself off from itself (forgive the strange wording, lol) due to severe stress/trauma, and we live with heavy dissociation, amnesia, and many other trauma responses. It is a very difficult disorder to live with. That's not to say that endos never struggle with their plurality, but they do not have the experience of struggling with this disorder. OSDDID spaces and communities were created to support people with the disorder, to give them a place to talk about the rather unique struggles of having it, to share resources to help manage it, to bond and help each other with it.

Endogenic systems have come into our communities claiming to be the same as us, and that they should have a place in these spaces, despite not sharing the fundamental issues that the spaces were created to address/help with. Because of this, it has become increasingly hard--sometimes impossible--to find spaces where we as a traumagenic system can talk about these experiences solely to people who understand and can relate. These days, in most spaces traumagenic systems cannot talk in too much detail about the disorder and its (often scary or upsetting) symptoms, because the science and experiences aren't 'inclusive' of endos.

And yes, these spaces still exist. But they have become much fewer and farther apart, and are more and more likely to be put under fire and called exclusionary for restricting to just OSDDID systems. It has become absurdly difficult to find a space where we can talk about our disorder without censoring ourselves, and when those spaces do exist, there is a constant worry of being harassed for being exclusive just for talking about our struggles.

I would also like to add that I've heard every form of "not me though" when talking about this. If you are endogenic and you do not go into OSDDID spaces, this is not about you. I take issue with the community as a whole, because I feel it has become a general community-wide problem, but as I said in the beginning of this (stupidly long) post, I do not hate, or even really take much issue with, many individual endos.

I will say that the word endogenic has gained a connotation of being one of those who invade/impede on OSDDID spaces. So, I will take slight issue with people who align themselves with that terminology, because it implies that one agrees with, or is at least tolerant of, the actions generally associated with the word/the community it describes. The separation of systems into "traumagenic" and "endogenic" also implies that they are the same fundamental thing, just with slight differences in origin. However, I completely understand that a label does not define anybody's beliefs entirely, so that's not really a main problem in my eyes.

In my ideal version of this, endos would have their own community, defined as separate from the OSDDID spaces. I believe that the terminology should be more distinctly separated from that of OSDDID systems. There needs to be the understanding that endo and traumagenic systems, while sharing some similarities, are on a fundamental level different experiences. OSDDID systems should not have to be associated with the idea that they could/may have been formed without trauma or without the distress that the disorder causes, and likewise endos should not be associated with those aforementioned struggles.

I am not saying I think we need to completely divide ourselves or cut each other out. I see no problem with different types of plurals interacting with shared spaces or relating to/with each other. But the situation as it is right now causes harm to many traumagenic systems as it muddles the definition of who we are and puts less weight on the struggles we face, and takes away spaces that many of us take great comfort in. So, when I say I am anti-endo, I am saying not that I take issue with the concert of the existence of non-traumagenic plurals, but with the current community's idea that they are equatable.

I personally do not see how non-traumagenic plurality could work, because there is no science to it the way that there is for OSDDID. HOWEVER, research on plurality is still in its infancy, so that opinion is subject to change as more research is done. Most importantly, whether scientifically proven or not, I will not tell anybody that they are not experiencing plurality, endo or not, because I don't get to tell people about their own experiences. I will respect endos as long as they respect me, but right now, the situation is such that I feel the endo community as a general group is disrespecting us, so while I can respect individuals, I cannot fully respect the community as a whole.

Sorry for how long this got, lol. Thanks to anyone who actually read it all. Have a lovely day, everyone :)

[thepetrichorcollective]

Splitting; OSDDID VS BPD

The term "Splitting" Is used by both people with forms of osddid and bpd. We dont see it talked about much at all and we have both did and bpd so we thought we'd start the conversation about it and talk a little bit.

fair warning, because i know from having dyslexia, there are some large blocks of text as i go into this so if its hard for anyone to read i'll have a tldr at the bottom.

Lets start with what splitting means in osddid. Splitting is the 'creation' or forming of new alters or parts. Typically alters split under the conditions of stress/distress. Its not always obvious when an alter splits, sometimes it may happen without the system or even the alter themself knowing, while sometimes it may be more clear that someone new has split but things are different for every system so the identifiers for it can vary. (the link goes a bit more into depth about this)

As for splitting in terms of bpd. While splitting is a symptom in more personality disorders than just BPD, i chose to talk about bpd because its the one i have therefore making it easier for me to talk about from experience. When someone 'splits' they are subconsciously using a defense mechanism, typically when in an uncomfortable situation, "seeing thing as black and white" as some people put it. It can make "grey areas" hard to accept/recognise in the sense that to someone whos splitting things are either one or the other and no in between. ("x must be lying or telling the truth, its a yes or no, theres no way there can be an inbetween" for example) (This sight talks about it a bit more, though im personally not fond of the phrasing it still seems to explain it a bit better than i can.)

I'd like to talk a bit about what its like having both bpd and did. I dont always recognise when i split a new alter or have splitting episodes, honestly realizing a new alter has split is much easier for me to identify than when im splitting in a bpd episode. When i recognize a new alter has formed i notice things that are normally familiar, like people we know or things about the space around us, no longer seeming familiar. other things that give it away for us could be the alter having a different mood than whoever was fronting before (ex. going from feeling upbeat to suddenly feeling very uncomfortable), a change in music taste or something similar.

however when we split during a bpd episode, as a mood disorder it, at the very least, only shows up in a few of our alters. Not every alter may show symptoms of bpd but for those who do, like myself, it can vary between what symptoms show themselves. On the topic of splitting as a symptom, when one or more of us have a splitting episode it can cause an argument.

The arguments usually involve matters of protecting the system in different ways, whether we should cut contact with a person or theyre actually safe for us to be talking to, stuff like that. the arguments are always something like "x could be lying or leave us when we need them, people did that before it could happen again." "or not, x is a different person, theyre sweet and caring, they like us theres no need to dump them." its very hard for us to see a middle ground, its either one thing will happen or another and theres no third option. of course every argument has to end, often ours end in a sort of 'stale mate' per say, deciding to wait things out before making a final decision on things.

to avoid making this longer than it is already, TLDR; there are many differences between splitting with a personality/mood disorder like bpd and splitting a new alter, having both can cause some difficulties but doesnt make things any less manageable.

if theres something you'd like to share, whether its your experience, a question or more resources on this topic please go ahead and share.

thanks for taking the time to read this

but! if you want to start an argument, fakeclaim, or otherwise stir something up you can take that elsewhere. this isnt a post for fights, just discussion.