#them being Claude and Byleth

[sieglinde-freud]

today i FINALLY got a friend that i have been asking for YEARS to play fire emblem (crazy part is i wasnt even the one who brought up fire emblem today. it was a whole thing and actually it was my other friend who just started who did most of the convincing for me (hence the YEARS ive been trying not being successful up until now) probably because shes normal about fire emblem) so i gave her my three houses copy bc. yanno. 60 dollar game. just play mine. unfortunately i am still right in the middle of fodlan brainrot and my golden deer playthrough. but luckily, i still have this:

THREE HOUSES: 2!!!!!!

[rioblitzle]

well it took 3 seasons but the poorly written high school au nintendo youtube fan cartoon that's weird about women that i was watching primarily for the rhythm heaven etc background references finally did a "bowser and mouser poorly disguise themselves as girls to sneak into the female characters' slumber party and get publicly humiliated in revenge" episode

[dragonsarecats]

To be fair CF is just as much about found family than VW

Hi anon! I'm gonna link the post I talked about the Golden Deer here for clarity's sake lol.

I think when discussing themes of found family in different three houses routes, it's important to talk about Byleth. In a game where the single, main variable between possible futures is Byleth's interference, it means the story has to be written in a particular way--I mentioned this before when talking about character supports and endings; each character needs to be able to have a romantic ending with Byleth, which affects how their supports are written. In the case of the Lord's, this means you're given tangible reasons why you should've chosen them.

I mean. Let's be real here. Claude has the highest survivability rate of any character in the base game. He can't die if you're completing Verdant Wind (for obvious reasons), or Blue Lions. He's heavily implied to live to see another day in Silver Snow, and you can spare him in Crimson Flower! Edelgard and Dimitri die without the professor's stabilizing influence--but Claude? What does he lose without the professor.

That's sort of how I determine subtler themes of each route in a way--by comparing what you get with and without Byleth.

So when I argue that Verdant Wind is the most about found family, I mean it thematically; the other routes don't have tangible less found family, but without Byleth members of the Golden Deer just blatantly disappear unrecruited post time skip in several routes!

Without Byleth, the option for found family is removed for Claude in a big way, I personally feel, and not just by full recruitment runs lol. Not completely, of course--even in Crimson Flower a recruited Lorenz laments having to face off against Claude and Hilda is willing to die in defense of him and the city--but enough that it was blatantly shocking to me that if you don't recruit Marianne, she does not appear at all post time skip, no exceptions.

In a narrative sense, perhaps slightly unshocking; but in a practical sense? This leaves Claude without a healer.

Claude can't hold onto all his Deer even if you don't recruit any of them in the Academy phase. Silver Snow, Azure Moon, Crimson Flower--Marianne will always be gone; consistent, non variable. Depending on the route other characters like Lorenz might disappear as well.

The themes of found family are prevalent in all the routes, but since each route is pretty much defined by the Lord who leads it, I feel as though their personal relationship with the found family is most defining, if that makes sense.

People stand by Edelgard, Dimitri, and even Rhea for better, or for worse. Even recruited, characters like Felix make it abundantly clear that switching sides doesn't change the immense emotional attachment they have to their original lord.

This just. Isn't true for Claude.

Without Byleth, he doesn't get to keep everyone together. Without Byleth Hilda is recruitable in two routes. The idea that you could ever do the same with Hubert or Dedue is blatantly laughable.

Byleth's presence is what enables Edelgard, Dimitri, and Rhea to remain the most of themselves, if that makes sense. Edelgard's war strategy in Crimson Flower is a lot less aggressive and scorched earth then it is in the other two routes because she's had the professor as an emotional rock. Similarly for Dimitri, he's able to recover because Byleth is there to keep him alive and safe. And then Rhea will blatantly die in the Verdant Wind route where she doesn't in Silver Snow. Byleth, in every sense of the word, keeps these three characters alive and well.

But without her? They still inspire loyalty and devotion--unquestionable, again, if no recruitment takes place. Dimitri, Edelgard, and Rhea can all face up against you as enemies with the full force of their houses/allies (save for, oddly, Annette).

Claude does not.

Claude's whole route is about learning to trust others in a way that allows them to trust him. The Deer are devoted to Claude in Verdant Wind in a way they just, textually aren't otherwise, and that's due to Byleth's influence, both as a Professor to these individual students, and to Claude.

When I say that Verdant Wind is the most found family thematically to me, I mean it at a very base level. Claude knows he doesn't have what Dimitri and Edelgard seem to take for granted. It seems almost effortless, in Verdant Wind, the loyalty and devotion he inspires in his friends despite how often you, as Byleth, are told that Claude appears to be an untrustworthy and sneaky individual.

But it's easy to see in routes where you don't chose him that without Byleth, that image mantains. Claude is an outsider. And maybe he doesn't need Byleth in the way the other lords do to survive or achieve his dream (after all, there's nothing saying he can't open diplomacy with his former classmates after he goes back to Almyra so long as he lives to do so), but just as Byleth is uniquely able to be a peer to the Golden Deer, so can Claude uniquely trust and gain the trust of his house in full.

It's not as dramatic as the other two houses, and I think it's the point. Edelgard and Dimitri have already built a solid foundation of devotion and loyalty. Ferdinand and Felix (your "rival" characters in those houses) are loyal without Byleth, even if Ferdinand claims it's to guide her or if Felix complains every step of the way. Lorenz isn't. In Verdant Wind, you sort of take it for granted that everyone will be there at the reunion if they survived the Academy phase. Of course they will--they promised, didn't they?

But outside Verdant Wind, it's clear to see that you as the player took it for granted. And that's why I think Verdant Wind is thematically the most found family. It's not because the other routes don't love each other as much or aren't as complex or there isn't devotion. It's because fundamentally Verdant Wind is about Claude, for the first time in his life, having a group of people he can rely on and who will rely on him without hesitation. It's about the formation of found family, and how Claude doesn't need it to achieve his dreams, but man, does it give him something to achieve those dreams for.

[inkperch]

Okay, so, I made Kronya half human for a joke in an Au, and somehow this has spiralled into two, equally tragic, backstories for her that, regardless of which I'm using, she has jack shit all idea about and is fully unaware that one of her parents was human-

[dimiclaudeblaigan]

Imagine Dimitri finding out how ass Claude's parents were to him. Like, at first Dimitri is quietly envious of/upset at Claude for never contacting his parents and seemingly not appreciating them enough, but then he finds out the (likely) reason why Claude never talks to them... the ideas are interesting 🤔

I do think about it a lot actually! Dimitri really loved and respected his father from what we can gather. It sounds like they were very close, and he loves hearing Rodrigue's stories about him.

I think initially Dimitri would be more inquisitive about it, asking why Claude doesn't visit his parents and such. I know in-game Claude often talks more like he didn't care or mind about what his parents put him through, but I feel like that sarcastic "lucky me" line was kind of the one time it slipped through? Like, showing how all of it bothered him? I can definitely see Claude appreciating how much Dimitri compliments him and sees bright things about him, to the point of getting so used to it that he knows if he sees his parents he'll be humbled back down quite a few pegs.

I imagine his self esteem would improve with Dimitri's kindness and letting Claude know he's appreciated, and I think maybe Claude would start to realize he's getting kind of afraid to go back to not having that. He's grateful to have someone talk him up so much and be excited about him, and he starts to realize exactly what it feels like to have this thing he's been missing all his life.

From how Claude acts in-game about all that stuff, I think at first he would brush it off and just say they're not close or too busy for much contact, but I actually mentioned this one time that I've had this idea of Dimitri being with Claude when Claude sees his parents again. I think based on how things went, like how they conversed and the overall vibe of the room, that Dimitri would realize exactly why they're not close and really not appreciate how they treat him and probably snap at them.

I think he would believe that's not how any parent should talk to/treat their child based on what he knows from the parents he knows. Regardless of how complicated some of the families he knows are, the parents do love their children and I think it would be a huge shock to him to go from that to Claude's parents and seeing how detached they are. Faerghus has/had some terrifying training, but (at least from what I gathered) they usually do it in groups and try to be as reasonable as possible about it.

Finding out what Claude had to deal with on top of his extended family trying to kill him I think would be enough to make Dimitri snap at his parents for not prioritizing their child's life over absolutely anything. Letting him lick his wounds and find out the hard way, I imagine, is not something Dimitri would consider just "tough love". Dimitri is also a very emotional person, and I think he'd probably snap at them not as a king to another king/former king, but as someone who cares about their son and is disgusted by their treatment toward him. I think he'd apologize later, but I think he'd still feel that way.

Ultimately I think it would result in him showering Claude with a lot of compliments and constantly trying to inflate his ego LOL. It wouldn't make up for Claude's parents not raising him to know warm affection and being very hands off with raising him, but it would at least remind him he's cared for and that he doesn't have to do anything to be worth being shown love; because, really, I think once Dimitri knew how lacking Claude's childhood was in affection, he'd be immediately wanting to help him learn and understand that affection and kindness.

He'd have done it anyway, but I think he'd always want to go the extra extra mile for him after learning all that. Considering how loving and full of excitement Dimitri's childhood was with his family and friends, I imagine he'd want Claude to experience that, even if it was as an adult instead since he missed out with his childhood. I feel like he'd want to make up for lost time for him and make it so that Claude would never feel so lonely and isolated again.

In general Dimitri is very considerate of other people's feelings, but I think once he knew why Claude was the way he was and how his parents did fuck all to make him feel safe in his own home, that he would really amp up trying to make every day special for Claude and make him feel safe.

I would hope, of course, that how Dimitri treats Claude would make his parents open their eyes and realize they dun fucked up and appreciate Dimitri's efforts.

[boomgun]

Reading about the Japanese text of the game giving Claude a few lines talking about how he was an angry kid is sending me in circles. Like, of course he was, ostracize and bully a kid he might turn out angry. Very humanizing. It also tells us that Claude is at odds with himself.

Fight or flight, right? The common two responses to stress, avoid a problem or run into it. Claude is neat because he learned to avoid, to be indirect, to fight smarter and not harder, when he was young. However, Claude has an inner desire to fight, you do not even need to know about his past as a kid to figure this out. Claude chose to come to Fódlan, on his own, the moment he learned he had a crest and was invited to be his grandfather's heir! Claude saw that Fódlan had the same problems as Almyra, that xenophobia was everywhere, and he chose to stay! Edelgard started a continental war and Claude did not run away! Claude has a fight response, a desire to rise to challenges when they present themselves to him. Which is at odds when we first meet Claude, that he ran away for a better position when the group got ambushed by bandits. Claude takes pride in being the 'embodiement of mistrust.' Claude thinks that being evasive is the smart thing, it is what helped him survive this long, but being forward is the right thing, it is why he is in the story to begin with. Claude is flexible in his methods, but is inflexible in his principles.

Claude is a person with two distinct halves, in more ways than one! Fitting for a kid born of two nations that are at odds, Claude has his desire to stand his ground be at odds with his wisdom telling him to approach problems indirectly and to manuever around them. Just as Claude mends two nations in Verdant Wind, so does Claude mend his two halves. Claude pushes his own agenda, he does not sit on the sidelines in indecision like in the other routes, but in his own way. Claude makes Byleth into the figurehead, but he plans the strategic maneuvers. Claude has a bombastic duel with Nader, but the whole thing is a subtle piece of theater to teach the Leicester and Almyran soldiers present to respect the prowess of both nations (remember that only Nader knows Claude is of mixed heritage in that scene, to everyone else he represents the Alliance). The supports with Marianne! Claude is so direct with Marianne in those supports, you can see a lot of the angry and impatient kid who just wants to get to the center of the problem, but the resolution is Claude opening up about his own past, but in the form of a story that is very indirect and gives him plausible deniability. How Claude's final gambit against Nemesis is a bold one, putting himself in harm's way in order to distract the crusty bastard from his arrow.

Claude's greatest weakness is that he constantly has two voices going in circles in his head, he is as ponderous and indecisive as the very Alliance he leads at times, but that scope of perspective allows Claude to approach problems in a unique and genuinely brilliant manner. Fight or flight is a false dichotomy, just like the world telling Claude that he is Fódlan or Almyran, Claude will find a way to choose both.

[plotthotrobin]

I continue to mourn the fact that Claude and Yuri do not have supports. They’re born to be scheming rivals. I think those cheeky little bastards have much stronger feelings about one another than simply neutrality - at least within the context of White Clouds and Verdant Wind.

Now, don’t get me wrong, I believe 100% that they respect each other from the start. I don’t think they’d ever be truly enemies. But Claude, particularly during the academy phase, does not like when he feels like someone has gotten the upper hand on him. For example: his supports with Balthus show him growing tense and mildly irritated when the dude starts prying at his background a little too much. After all, he has a lot on the line. I suspect he’d be likely to clock Yuri as a potential threat - or a potentially very useful ally - super quickly. He’d probably spend time verbally sparring with him and trying to feel him out.

I also believe Yuri would be in more or less a similar situation for a while. Claude testing the waters would likely put him somewhat on the defensive. He does not seem to like when people get in his business any more than Claude does. (ie. Yuri and Byleth’s C-Support, which consists of Yuri being tense and on the defensive. This includes him threatening to slit their throat despite him relenting a bit.) I can only imagine the passive aggressiveness. The thinly-veiled threats. Potential outright hostility. 🤌 Chef’s kiss.

I ultimately think it’d take a support chain for them to come to a more genuine understanding, and possibly even a solid friendship. Maybe up to B or B+ with the last support being locked until post-timeskip? A paired ending would be much more difficult to pull off for them considering their priorities.

Do I think supports between them are necessary? Not really. But it’d be so good guys, trust me. We can just replace Claude and Ing.rid’s god awful supports. 🥺🙏

[siegesquirrel42]

okay it's been a while but I'm having FE3H Thoughts

Monica and Hubert's relationship to each other and to Edelgard is already very good, what with the ambiguously-platonic bisexual love triangle and the clash of personalities between two equally devoted people with very different ideas about the proper way to express that devotion.

But it takes on a whole new dimension if Edelgard's actual love interest isn't either one of them - and it gets downright funny if the ship here is Berniegard.

Imagine the reaction when both of them put two and two together and realize that Edelgard is utterly, catastrophically smitten with Bernadetta of all people.

Imagine Monica's response. What's a girl to do when her crush does swing that way but the lucky girl isn't her? Well, in this case by channeling her complicated feelings on the matter into trying to assist and learn about Bernadetta as well - to very mixed results.

Then Hubert runs into a problem - see, he's beginning to suspect Bernadetta doesn't like him. And if she and Edelgard were to get together, then it wouldn't do if Edelgard's partner couldn't trust Edelgard's right hand. But how is he supposed to gain that trust? (The truth is, Bernie doesn't actually dislike him. He just keeps accidentally scaring her. He's mortified when he figures it out.)

Imagine the jealousy. Monica's jealous of Bernie and feels guilty about it because she loves seeing Edelgard happy but is sad that it's with someone else. Hubert's jealous of the attention Bernie gets from Edelgard and loathes how immature that makes him feel. Both of them try desperately not to show it.

And then Hubert and Monica independently arrive at the same conclusion: they need to help Edelgard and Bernadetta get together.

Two diametrically opposed personalities. Same devotion. Two matchmakers who cannot stand each other. Same match.

Imagine the comedy of errors that ensues. The zany schemes, the attempts to sabotage each other's plans without actually damaging El and Bernie's relationship. Both Monica and Hubert getting to know Bernie better and no longer being 100% sure of who they're jealous of. Both of them trying to achieve the same goal in very different ways - all the while keeping the whole mess secret from Edelgard and Bernie.

Everyone except Edelgard and Bernie knows about it. Dorothea is gossiping about it. Caspar somehow figured out everything. Claude teases Hubert about it. Byleth doesn't say they're having fun watching, but you can tell they're thinking it. There is a betting pool.

Obviously El and Bernie actually do get together - eventually. And their reactions when they learn about the nonsense that went down to get them there are going to be priceless.

[real-fire-emblem-takes]

I really love the idea of the dynamics of Askr's tactics room cuz like

Robin and Morgan playing chess is much more of a spectacle when they're surrounded by people on their level. Plus there are 2 Robins and 4 Morgans and all the Morgans have something to prove with beating both Robin's. Hearing "Morgan is challenging Robin" does not narrow it down.

Morgan Drama in general, I feel like the four of them would be at each other's throats because "there's no way that you're me, you arent even good enough to be my fake"

All of them are tacticians who put their everything into making sure their friends survive, so any disagreements have a LOT more weight thrown around.

Also the difference in morals is interesting.

Soren is very "this is my job and that's it, we don't need to do anything further" which might change since he's now working for the Askr Royal Family and not a mercenary company, but I am not certain, citation needed.

Claude is more open to trickery, deceit and dishonerable tactics, but is very "leave no one behind" morally. He doesn't leave those under his purview helpless at the cost of the mission(particularly in 3Hopes)

Katarina is an assassin who just became a tactician as part of her cover, she keeps trying to leave but Kris won't let her. Major imposter syndrome because the Robins and Morgans keep saying she's a big deal.

Anna and the Summoner open the door to Leo and Takumi arguing and slowly close the door as they make direct eye contact with Byleth who's just taking notes on the actual legitimate points they're making.

Iago is there because he is technically Nohr's main tactician but no one listens to him or likes him because he's just objectively evil.

Aversa is also evil but the Robins and Morgans vouch for her and that annoys her even more than being ignored.

Every once in a while the Lords drop by to make sure their tacticians have eaten anything.

The more independent Lords who were their own tacticians try, but they get VERY lost very quickly.

Heaven help the students when the Byleths required them to sit in on the room and write a paper summarizing what decisions were made and why.

Different reference books from different worlds. There's a solid two weeks after anyone mentions a famous tactician that they studied where everyone's just like "who the hell is that" until they've all immediately devored every book that person wrote to debate whether or not they're full of garbage.

.

[curse-d-owl]

Edelgard waged war cause she believes Rhea and the others are villains that are against progress. Her goal is to kill them and conquer Fodlan so she can change it for the better.

Problem is her accusations are false, her war is unjustified and has done nothing to help the people she's trying to save proven by Byleth's paired ending with Rhea, Hanneman's and Linhardt's paired ending with Lysithea, Petra's, Claude's, Dimitri's Seteth's, Lorenz's, Sylvain's, Hanneman's, Lysithea's endings.

The other nations don't fight back to keep the status quo as it is, they fight back to protect their people and end her war. There is no shades of gray regarding her war. At best she is a misguided villain like Walhart.

Plus she's every bit the villain she accuses Rhea of being.

She lies and manipulates the truth herself in white clouds and cf.

She helped spread the lie that Duscur is responsible for the tragedy, didn't say anything to defend them by condeming the injustices they faced while in contrast demonized the goddess infront of a pious high ranking knight in defense of Miklan and in the original JP script callously trivialized the tragedy by claiming she doesn't care about it.

She drags Brigid into her war, refuses to free them from the Empire's imperialism and attempts to kill Petra for standing against her. Edelgard's and Hubert's "respect" for Brigid is conditional.

Uses her citizens as meatshields and launches demonic beasts in the capital

Responds to dissent with murder attempts

And refuses to cooperate and end the war she started diplomatically.

Only reason there is still discourse about this game cause her fans can't accept that fact she is the villain and provoke her critics with childish insults and waste their time with disingenuous and bad faith arguments.

You can't claim Edelgard's accusation that Rhea and the other leaders are violently against change is true the same way you can't claim Dimitri's accusation that Edelgard is responsible for the tragedy is true.

You can't deny that Edelgard bled fodlan dry the same way you can't deny Rhea didn't sacrifice defensless citizens in the last chapter of cf.

[slotumn]

Underrated VW moment: Byleth saying rest of Fódlan could be divided up among Leicester lords post-war and Claude going "damn that's a terrible idea the people there would hate our asses if we tried to rule them + we also hate each other too much for that to work"

I think this is one of the very few (if not only) places in Houses/Hopes where it's basically acknowledged that Fódlan isn't a monolith and trying to force rule of one region over others would end badly

Personally I take Byleth's reply of "Alliance lords could divide and rule" here not as them supporting it, but being more like "you guys would pull that shit if left to your own devices huh" (and Claude doesn't deny that in of itself lmao)

Also hilarious that if Byleth says "we should search for a new ruler (who doesn't feed into regional/sectarian tensions)" Claude implies that he wants Byleth to be that ruler, but if Byleth outright says "I can do that" he goes

Commoner shows one(1) ounce of political ambition and it immediately scares the noble (even when he actually supports said commoner being in power)

[butwhatifidothis]

I think the main thing that makes Edelstans' version of Edelgard so annoying is that she ultimately has every ounce of agency stripped out of her, by people who insist that they're "making her grow" into a character they already made her out to be from the start. We get told that Edelgard has this amazing character arc, and then are presented with a Mary Sue with no discernable flaws and/or who makes no substantial mistakes.

This Edelgard is perfect out the box, no discolorations or tears to be seen. She just has a bit of dust, but the doll itself is flawless. And that is, in the end, what ruins her. She’s not prideful and arrogant, she’s not stubborn and narrow-minded, she’s not manipulative and deceitful, she’s not violent and abrasive, she’s not nationalistic and imperialistic, but nor is she fearless and confident, she’s not ambitious and resolute - she has none of her character flaws or boons, because they make her too full of agency. They drive her to choose to do anything; they're not forces outside of her control that make her do things that she would just never, ever do were the WORLD not so broken and flawed.

The few "flaws" Edelstans begrudgingly allow her are only meant to further endear her to the player. She’s childish, but only because she’s oh so traumatized and that should be accepted as who she is and not something to grow out of (nor something that is truly wrong of her to be even in her 20's). She’s self-unaware, but only because the world made her unsure of who she really is, which is a perfect little angel. The only "mistakes" she makes are because others failed her; Byleth and the Black Eagles fail Edelgard in the Holy Tomb, that wasn't her fault, they didn't ensure her that they could be trusted, for example.

Claude and Rhea have flaws - real flaws, that aren't "they just don't wove themselves enuff." Dimitri makes mistakes - real mistakes, that aren't "he twusted the wrong people and got hurt fwom them." They are allowed to misstep and stumble, to steer off of a purely good path due to actions that they chose to make, they get to grow as characters. But any imperfection found in the Edelstan Edelgard is only due to her environment, not her own nature. Narratively, she never does any wrong; anything bad she ever does is really someone else's fault.

She’s just a little flower plucked of all her thorns, safe and easy to pick up and admire, weak, meek and too innocent and pure for this dirty dirty world, coveted by all for her perfection and beauty.

Which is just so... boring? And annoying? That literally no matter what happens to her or what she herself does, it's never a result of Edelgard doing something but something being done to Edelgard? UNLESS it's a purely good action, then suddenly she has all the agency in the world and should be responsible for it? It's so clear that this Edelgard is one that is sanitized of any pesky little flaw that could make people dislike her or like her in the "wrong" way (because liking villains for being villains Is Wrong), and that is ironically the exact reason why she's so insufferable.

Like, it's almost kinda hard to explain why having a character choose to be an asshole is so much more engaging to watch than having a character be entirely reactive UNTIL they can get Good Noodle Stars because.... yeah? Of course? Because there's more meat to bite into whenever a character makes a choice - whether kind or spiteful, whether good or bad - over someone else forcing a character to do something.

"Edelgard believes in imperialism because she has been raised in and agrees with a culture that believes itself to be the rightful 'owner' of the continent due to it being the progenitor country, and she genuinely believes Fodlan would be better if back under this 'glorious' reign of Adrestia, even despite her being around those outside of Adrestia for almost a year" says so much about her AND Adrestia. "Edelgard DOESN'T believe in imperialism, it's just that everyone else is doing so badly that they FORCE her to kill them or otherwise get rid of them" says things about the ones DOING things badly, MAYBE, but all it says about Edelgard is that she Doesn't Like Bad Things. Or, oh so much deeper, it says she likes *gasp* Good Things! How brave, how stunning! And before you can try to say "Well maybe Edelgard went to violence so quickly because she views fear and control to be the best way to force a society into being 'good' over trying to convince people peacefully," the Edelstan Edelgard is already packaged with "Edelgard went to war first because literally everyone MADE her go to war because THEY wouldn't let anything else work."

"Edelgard tried to assassinate Dimitri and Claude at the very beginning of the game because she wanted to make her eventual war go way easier" turns into the infamous "Edelgard was just trying to scare THE TEACHER away to get JERITZA installed in their place, and CLAUDE ruined it by running away; she wasn't ACTUALLY trying to hurt anyone." "Edelgard let Remire be massacred because - like she literally said she would - she was willing to sacrifice her people's lives in service of her higher cause" turns into one of "TWS forced her to be compliant" or "Edelgard definitely didn't know anything because she would have stopped it had she known." "Edelgard directly assisted in Flayn's kidnapping because TWS having more tools to work with means she gets more weapons to fight with" turns into "She was forced to do that." "Edelgard helped hide Kronya among the student populace even as she kidnapped students and mutated them into Demonic Beasts because it will help in giving her Demonic Beasts to work with in the war" turns into, you guessed it, "Edelgard was forced to do that." "Edelgard sent her army and Demonic Beasts onto either her direct Black Eagle classmates or otherwise innocent students to stop them from stopping her from getting Crest Stones to use in her upcoming war"? Oh, a surprise! "She HAD to do that, because OTHER PEOPLE were going to take the Crest Stones if she didn't!"

She was forced to, she wasn't hurting/trying to hurt anyone, she didn't do anything wrong - if her actions lead to people getting hurt and/or killed, those are the exclusive reasons allowed as to why she did it. These reasons being excuses to alleviate her of any accountability, not genuine explanations that still demand her to take accountability.

Meanwhile, Rhea distorted history to keep her and her family safe - which in verse is said to be something she was still wrong to do, and which in verse she ADMITS was wrong of her to do. Dimitri was absolutely willing to torture Randolph because he viewed the guy as less than human and felt him getting such inhumane treatment was justice - which he directly takes accountability for to Randolph's remaining family. Claude weaseled up to Byleth because he felt he could use them for his own ambitions - which he owns up to and grows out of doing. Regardless of context explaining why they did this or that, they did this and that. They own their actions and are responsible for them, no one else. And, you know, because they own their actions, they can, uh. Grow from said actions? Look back on what they did and go "huh, shouldn't have done that, I will choose to not choose to do those actions again"?

Like I'm sorry but you can't choose to not get fucked by literally the entire damn world and that's what makes Edelsue so fucking boring and uninteresting and annoying. All of that meticulous planning Edelgard did for years to enact this war, in this interpretation, boils down to "she didn't do shit, everyone else did, she was just forced to be the fall guy." Any action that isn't squeaky clean in moral whiteness has nothing to do with her agency and that sucks ass

[burr-ell]

If it's alright, can I ask why you like the Golden Deer house more than the Blue Lions or Black Eagle houses? Like, what caught your eye about them over everyone else?

So I actually got into FE3H through a friend of mine, @dar-draws, who I already knew through mutual good taste (Dickkory), and fanarts like this one, this one, and this one plus the way she talked about Claude and Claudeleth caught my attention. I watched a couple playthroughs of the Golden Deer route on YouTube and absolutely fell in love (before finally getting a switch just to play it myself, for which I was violently bullied here). So like, I was already going into the game biased, which is part of why when I got it I went ahead and played through Golden Deer before doing all the other routes in turn; it was genuinely important to me to personally see all sides of the story. But even as I've played the other routes and replayed SS and AM and gained even more of an appreciation for them, I'm still always sort of drawn back to VW and the Deer.

I think it's ultimately vibes-based, but I'll try to articulate it. I'm not really a big fan of "cozy" sorts of games—I've played and enjoyed ACNH, but the things I most enjoyed about that game were finding things to do and goals to complete, like completing the main quest line or filling up the museum. So it's not so much that I find the Golden Deer to be cozy so much as adventurous. They're not inherently personally invested in the conflicts of White Clouds (they don't know Lord Lonato or Miklan, and their house leader isn't [gestures generally]), but they're also not just ping-ponging through the story. They go through the same events as the other two houses, but they're coming at it from more of an outsider's perspective, and their choice to get involved and react and respond feels more active.

The Deer also don't have any real reason to follow Claude, either, and in the early game they make sure he knows it; none of them are really all that concerned that they're speaking to the future Grand Duke of their country. Lysithea snaps at him, Leonie shoots the breeze with him, Raphael is jovial with him, Lorenz undercuts him, Hilda is blase with him, Marianne tries not to talk to him, and Ignatz gets into theological debates with him. Over the course of the game, they develop the same loyalty to Claude that the other house members already have for their leaders almost by default, and it feels a lot more earned because we see it happen. And that in turn makes scenes like the one at Myrddin, where Claude reveals his true goal of opening the border with Almyra and embracing foreign cultures and the other Deer are surprised but trust Claude and follow his lead, that much more satisfying.

I was a little surprised, when I played through the other three routes, that aside from the designated talking-with-the-cast scenes every route gets, the characters who aren't house leaders or retainers don't really have all that much to do in the story. On Verdant Wind, you pretty consistently have members of the Golden Deer appearing in other cutscenes and giving their two cents; there's even a unique scene where Lysithea realizes there's something up with the Empire's mages because of her backstory and approaches Claude and Byleth about it. It's nothing too obtrusive—they do still have to accommodate the potential for character death—but it's those small details that make a difference to me. Every house has a particular dynamic with odd silly quirks, but the Deer being just that little bit more integrated into the story really helps sell the idea that they belong here and they're making this story their own.

There's also the matter of where specifically their adventure takes them. I respect the choice to focus on Dimitri in Azure Moon, because it does handle his character and arc very well and I think also does the other Lions justice (with the exception of Dedue), but it's also focused largely on Dimitri's personal arc and the Tragedy of Duscur and doesn't really follow through on a lot of the events of White Clouds. (Which some Blue Lions stans have been okay with because they think the Agarthans are bad villains, which...that's valid, but stories still have to like, address plot elements they set up.) Verdant Wind, by contrast, does actually pull back and try to figure out the real impetus behind the whole conflict, and it ends with them beginning to properly lay Fodlan's true problems to rest.

So while the route isn't flawless and I do think there are issues with how characters are written that are part of larger trends within the game and the series as a whole, there's a very specific kind of fantasy adventure energy with the Golden Deer that I enjoy. I think the stories I'm most drawn to are the ones that keep their eyes on a specific goal but still make you feel like the characters would bring that same energy to goofing around with each other, and I think that's something Verdant Wind does very well.

[fantasyinvader]

Guys, I think I figured out why Claude believes the Central Church preaches isolationism.

Look at the history of the Alliance. When they broke off from the Empire, the were conquered by the Kingdom and ruled by them for 60 years. When they managed to become independent, they set up the roundtable which resulted in the Church not having the same sort of power within their region. But thinking about this, the Eastern Church would have broken off from what we know as the Western Church. And said Western Church is fanatical... and xenophobic, wanting to kill Rhea in the present because she allows foreigners at Garreg Mach. They call Rhea an apostate because of what she does in her own jurisdiction, but we also know that TWSITD have infiltrated and manipulated the Western Church for their own purposes and those guys are racist as fuck.

Now think about it, Lorenz believes the Church preaches isolationism, but he’s from the Alliance. The scripture he would have gotten is from the Eastern Church that broke off from the Western Church. We don’t know when TWSITD first began using the Western Church, and for all we know it could the result of difficult relations with their neighbours over the centuries, but Lorenz’s instruction would not have been from the Central Church.

And look at what the third reason is for why there was a ban on a printing press. “3. Risk of intensifying disparity between church branches.” Different branches of the Church preaching different messages. It’s saying that the Church of Seiros isn’t a monolith.

The Eastern Church must have held onto the xenophobic beliefs of the Western Church when they splintered off, not helped by 40 years of Almyra invading them. Claude saw this, heard what the Eastern Church was saying, and took Rhea’s non-interference as acceptance. But then you look at what Lorenz says at the end of Flower, the nobles aren’t actually religious and merely using the Church as a means to legitimize their power. Thus, while the Eastern Church preaches isolationism, the nobles of the Allaince don’t care and do trade with other nations. As a result, Lorenz can believe the Church says not to interact with other nations as that’s what the Eastern Church says, all while nobles in Alliance territory do just that.

That scene where Claude questions Lorenz on this is also the scene where he talks about getting to know people rather than jumping to conclusions. He points the diversity at Garreg Mach despite the teachings of the Eastern Church, and the whole deal with the Western Church during White Clouds would only further serve giving Claude evidence against Rhea being racist. In the end, Claude actually ends up talking to Rhea, learning about her, and ends up believing Byleth needs to be just like her in giving the people salvation. Just get rid of the racism from the Western and Eastern Churches. Not only that, Claude ends up fighting the people who were controlling the Western Church and who committed genocide against Rhea’s people. Claude wants to fight racism, and Verdant Wind sees him go after the actual racists rather than the ones he assumes are racist. He also realizes Almyra doesn’t do it’s people any favors acting like a bunch of drunken frat boys.

[plotthotrobin]

Claude is not the jealous type, in my opinion. He is very secure in any romantic relationship he forms once he does open up enough to communicate his feelings in the first place. An example is his willingness to leave Byleth to go home to Almyra and further pursue his dream regardless of if romance is present or not, but I believe this is usually the case no matter the partner in question. I believe he’d be more comfortably amused and secretly proud in watching his significant other reject those who flirt with them. I think the only thing that would actually upset him is if the boundaries of his S/O are being purposely crossed in any way, for obvious reasons.

However, while jealousy isn’t much of a thing with Claude, I do not think he would take to his partner being insulted with the same level of stride. I also happen to believe he is a petty bitch (affectionate).

Claude knows that his partner doesn’t need him to defend their honor or any of that needless bullshit - but that also isn’t necessarily what he is trying to achieve when a non-fatal poison somehow makes it into the drink of a lord who had openly made some snide remark during an upscale event.

“Oh no, the viscount has a stomachache and must return home immediately? Tsk. What a shame that nobody gets to enjoy his oh so pleasurable company for the rest of the night. What, me? I thought you knew me better than that, my love! You must be mistaking me for someone who would poison somebody. :/”

[problematic-fodlan]

Silver Snow is about severing your attachments to toxic people, which is what edelgard and Hubert proved themselves to be.

edelgard is not saved by her bond with Byleth, she's enabled by them. She keeps on killing everyone who stand on her way, she starves her people, she conscripts them and executes anyone who resists. She keeps allowing people to go through the same horrific experiments she went through to turn them into demonic beasts as war assets.

Byleth would've been better siding against her and cutting ties with her. And even then, they never do, not even in Silver Snow, as it is edelgard who betrays them, even after a whole year of being nothing but supportive of her. By not treating her like the villain she is, everyone is worse off.

Ferdinand is supporting a monster.

Hubert is running a secret police, spying on people and killing rebels, of which they're a lot of, because people both in and out of Adrestia have been mistreated by edelgard, to put it lightly. Dorothea and Bernadetta can join Hubert in these evil acts (but it's ok because at least Bernadetta is out of her room! She would've been out of her room in Silver Snow too according to some ending but details, details)

Brigid's freedom can still remain conditional, requiring Petra to enter a political marriage.

Linhardt shows edelgard's nepotism.

And Caspar is made leader of the army despite obviously being unqualified given how often out of control the troops are, further showing edelgard is not fit to gauge people's "merits."

All the bad things that happen by not reaching out to people happen in the other routes. What can you do for Dimitri or edelgard in VW? Or Dimitri and Claude in cf? This is not a flaw in Silver Snow you people are trying to make it out to be.

Silver Snow makes a point of how people are coming together to the monastery in support of Byleth's side. The theme of bonds is also exemplified in Ashe and Lorenz who can be recruited if you reached a B support with them.

Fire Emblem Three Houses is a game about the importance of bonds. The point of Silver Snow is that those bonds need to be appreciated by both parties, something edelgard does not do, as her goals were more important to her than her supposed friends, as shown in her trying to kill them all in the Holy Tomb. The theme of the importance of bonds and the theme of cutting ties with toxic people are not mutually exclusive, they go hand in hand.

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