#they'd feel so betrayed by obi-wan

[antianakin]

@theneutralmime

Personally I feel like Anakin crossed that line when he decided dictatorship was a good choice of government and massacred an entire village of Tuskens down to the last child. Anakin is unrepentant about BOTH of these things and so I find it hard to believe he can be "saved" at that point in any way that matters.

However.

Star Wars is all about choices. Anakin is making some irrevocably bad ones by AOTC already, he's not a good PERSON truly in AOTC (I find it hard to believe that someone who is as racist, sexist, arrogant, and selfish as Anakin is in this film can truly be considered "good" still). But that doesn't mean he can't still make BETTER ones. He recognizes that he's made a bad choice regarding the Tuskens in the sense that he knows a good Jedi wouldn't have done it, so there's like... a GLIMMER of hope in that, the last vestiges of Anakin recognizing that he's making bad choices. And maybe if someone OTHER THAN PADME "THE ENABLER" AMIDALA had been there with him in the wake of the Tusken massacre, someone like Obi-Wan or another Jedi maybe, they'd have been able to grasp onto that glimmer and help him move back towards the path he can still see but is choosing to walk away from. But what he gets from Padme instead is an excuse. He KNOWS the Jedi would consider it a bad choice, but Padme, like Palpatine, tells him that what he's done is okay, that it's different because it's HIM, because Anakin is SPECIAL. "To be angry is to be human" gets translated in Anakin's head as "It was okay to kill the Tuskens because I was angry over what happened to my mother and this was a normal and natural reaction to have" which allows him to DISMISS what he knows the Jedi would've believed about it as unimportant.

So like. Anakin CAN be saved. That's always true. It just won't be by Padme, or Obi-Wan, or Ahsoka, or even Luke. Anakin HAS to be saved by his own choice. He can be saved because he can ALWAYS make better choices. That's the whole point of his choice in ROTJ. He's been Vader for over 20 years, he betrayed the Jedi, destroyed the galaxy, killed his own pregnant wife, upheld a fascist tyrant, allowed Alderaan to be blown up and forced Leia to watch, enslaved the clones, and chopped off his own son's hand. And he can STILL make a better choice. And that's just as true on Tatooine after the Tusken massacre and on Mustafar after Order 66 as it is on the Death Star over two decades later.

The problem is that Anakin, generally, doesn't WANT to be saved because that requires acknowledging he NEEDS SAVING TO BEGIN WITH, which requires acknowledging he's done something wrong. And Anakin is just incapable of actually being able to admit he's actually IN THE WRONG about anything and constantly finds ways to excuse the things he does and the way he feels in order to see himself as in the right and as the hero of the story because it's easier and less painful.

So when Padme and Palpatine offer him excuses and tell him he's special and it's the Jedi who are wrong, Anakin grabs onto those excuses with both hands and refuses to let them go. He uses them to paper over what he's done in his head so he never has to look at them again and if he does, that he can interpret them as his triumphs instead of his failures. On Mustafar, this becomes particularly obvious. He yells at Obi-Wan that he "turned Padme against him" despite that being an utterly ridiculous thing to think. He tells Obi-Wan that from his point of view, the Jedi are evil, because it's easier to excuse murdering them all if they're the villains. He claims he has brought "peace, freedom, security, and justice" to "his" new Empire, even though he has brought none of these things and the Empire is not his at all.

Anakin is the King of lying to himself about his own crimes because he refuses to do the work of acknowledging his own failures in order to do and be better. So he CAN save himself, but it will only happen when he is actually willing to take that first step. When Padme shows up on Mustafar, that isn't something he's willing to do. When Obi-Wan tries to talk to him on Mustafar, that isn't something he's willing to do. When he sees Ahsoka on Malachor, that isn't something he's willing to do. When Luke comes to Bespin, that isn't something he's willing to do. Anakin CANNOT and WILL NOT make a different choice until it benefits him to do so. And that's exactly what happens. He only is capable of making the selfless choice when he has no other option if he wants to save Luke.

So COULD Anakin be saved on Mustafar? Yeah, sure. He COULD save himself. He just won't. It's not a choice he's willing to make at this point in his life, so it isn't going to happen even though the choice is always available to him.

[tobiasdrake]

Do you think Anakin Skywalker's redemption balances out the evils of Darth Vader? I ask because sometimes I think about it, and it seems disproportionate to think that killing one old fuck who was harming a blood family member makes up for murdering people indiscriminately for decades. But maybe that's just cynical thinking on my end.

I have such complicated feelings about the redemption of Darth Vader. Because. Like. Star Wars and I do not get along well on a pretty fundamental level. Despite being built on a pretty simple basis of White-and-Black morality - White Hats and Black Hats with very little nuance or moral complexity between - I don't think Star Wars as it exists today really gets morality.

Here's the thing.

At the time it was written, within the scope of what Star Wars originally was, it made sense.

Star Wars was not designed to be this massive multimedia franchise with hundreds of entries and elaborate storylines starring every single character ever to appear for even five seconds. It was not made to be the story of a vast universe with no true main character.

Star Wars was made to be the story of Luke. It's a Chosen One space opera faerie tale about a young boy receiving a call to adventure, discovering great power within himself, and finding his place in the world.

Vader's redemption, as originally written, wasn't about Vader. It was Luke's catharsis; His reward for resisting the temptations offered by both Obi-Wan and the Emperor and instead choosing mercy. Luke ends his story by putting faith in his father's love for him. Vader's redemption is his reward for choosing to believe in better angels.

Strictly within the context of The Story of Luke Skywalker And Nothing Else, Vader's redemption works.

But Star Wars isn't the story of Luke Skywalker and nothing else anymore. Now it is about the vast universe of characters and ideas. This transition has resulted in a lot of friction because the original trilogy made choices that work for The Story of Luke but are not conducive to horizontal storytelling.

Like. The idea of the Jedi being gone, that Luke is the "last hope" for the Jedi because there's literally nobody left but him and Leia? Yeah. Writers have been going "NO HE DIDN'T SAY THAT YOU'RE WRONG" pretty much since the EU began. The original trilogy said no other Jedi but we want to have Jedi characters in stories we write so the original trilogy gets told to go fuck itself.

There are like eighty billion Jedi running around the Imperial Era now. Nobody actually died in the Purge 'cause not being able to write Jedi characters isn't fun.

And. Unfortunately. One of those problems is Vader. Because if he's not just Luke's cathartic reward for believing in his father's love? If we have to actually engage with this man as a "real" person within the context of a universe? Then. Uh. Yeah, he's Patient Zero for unsatisfying lightswitch redemptions.

The problem, the fundamental problem underpinning Vader's redemption, is that he doesn't change in any meaningful way.

There was a bit of that already present in the original redemption. In Empire Strikes Back, Vader wanted Luke to join him and then they'd kill the Emperor together. In Return of the Jedi, Vader joins Luke and then kills the Emperor for him. Right from the get-go, he already wanted to kill the Emperor with Luke; It's only the context surrounding the act that's different.

Within the Story of Luke, it nonetheless works because Luke receives his father's love and approval without compromising his, Luke's moral values to get it. His father kills the Emperor and dies for him, which is super meaningful from Luke's (and only Luke's) perspective.

But as the series grew, Vader's redemption became further devalued. Revenge of the Sith told us that this is a man whose road to wickedness came about when he threw away everything he loved, when he murdered the people in his court, out of a violent and desperate love for his family. For his family, he will betray his own side and slaughter those he was meant to be loyal to. That is the action that brought him to where he is today.

That. Uh. That makes it feel a lot less impactful when he suddenly betrays his own side and slaughters the Emperor for Luke. Like. I don't know how Palpatine didn't see that coming when it's just Anakin doing the thing that made him Vader in the first place.

There is a point to be made that Anakin's love for his family up to that point was possessive and violent. In jealousy and rage, he choked Padme to death. He cut off Luke's hand. This is not a man who loves his family well. But Return of the Jedi doesn't undercut that in any meaningful way. He can be violently possessive of his family and stab anyone who looks at them funny; These two things don't contradict each other.

This man butchered children and lightsaber dueled Obi-Wan because he was mad about his family. Did Palpatine really think he wasn't going to huck him down a reactor shaft for literally the exact same reason, no difference whatsoever?

But that's only the tip of the iceberg, because the developing Star Wars universe makes another significant point about Vader dying for Luke: In the grand scheme of things. Like. Who gives a shit whether or not he loves his son? Insufficiently loving his family is the least of Vader's transgressions.

As early as Attack of the Clones, we see that Anakin Skywalker is a violent fascistic monster with a propensity for genocide. The Clone Wars cartoon does a phenomenal job of portraying Anakin's gradual seduction into fascistic systems of belief.

Anakin loves the idea of keeping peace via brutal military dictatorship. He has "fun" political chats with Tarkin about the merits of a galactic police state. He's emotionally abusive and violently possessive of his secret wife. He slaughters children who've done nothing to him without hesitation, sometimes because he's pissed off at other members of their family and sometimes 'cause that's just the price of keeping peace yo.

Hell, even his desire to kill Palpatine and make his family into the official galactic monarchs gets reframed into something he's wanted since Revenge of the Sith. That wasn't even a reaction to meeting Luke; he's legit wanted to supplant Palpatine with a Skywalker Dynasty forever. And we're supposed to take it as a major act of repentance when he ultimately stabs Palpatine for Luke? This man has been trying to stab Palpatine for Luke for twenty years.

All of this context makes Vader's redemption difficult to swallow in the grand scheme of things. He lived as an unrepentant brutal fascist monster guilty of multiple acts of genocide, chomping at the bit to betray his master for the sake of his family. He died as an unrepentant brutal fascist monster guilty of multiple acts of genocide who betrayed his master for the sake of his family. And the best thing that can be said of him is that he accepted Luke's lifestyle choices in the end.

A sweet moment for Luke, yet far from an inspiring transformation of a vile man into a hero - but which nonetheless inspired a thousand unsatisfying, terrible copycats.

[galadrieljones]

In regards to Varric's flagged death

- he's getting up there in years. He's reaching toward the wise old mentor trope, and those don't usually survive

- it would be a pretty emotional opening and an immediate reason to be angry with Solas/Rook - especially new players

- his writer was let go from bioware

- Varric has always been willing to let others take the spotlight, but this time, he put himself in the most dangerous position possible to try to talk Solas down while Rook ran the slidelines.

And then there's this:

https://www.tumblr.com/corseque/753195522694774784/im-sorry-if-other-people-saw-this-already-but-i?source=share

Hmm, yes. I saw that post, and I reblogged. Just playing friendly Devil's Advocate here. I think most of this is interpretive. Killing off a "wise old mentor" takes a while longer. Varric hasn't really been a wise old mentor. I don't recall that really as his role at all in Inquisition. He's terribly reluctant, in fact, to be there. Plus, he's what, like fifty? Maybe I'm old, but that is not that old lol. And even if he is a "wise old mentor," wise old mentors, like Obi-Wan Kenobi, or Hershel Greene from The Walking Dead, typically die as self-sacrifices after having completed their narrative purpose in a truly meaningful way. That is not what's going on here with Varric. If he's just getting stabbed by Solas, then like, that's not meaningful at all.

Also, the writers really don't need a reason to rally us against Solas. If a player is so new that they don't know Solas, then they don't know Varric either, so killing him off would be largely meaningless to them and instead would just alienate older, more loyal players. Killing Varric in the first scene would feel very "The Last of Us 2" in that it would seem to serve no real purpose other than to create moral hardship for the player, in a way that has no connection to their choices. That's not really Bioware's style.

The writers have also expressed a lot of sympathy toward Solas. Why would they have Solas stab Varric?? Even if Solas was so far gone, he's just killing everyone left and right (the trailer doesn't communicate this at all, btw), why would Solas stab anyone with a knife? Solas can kill people with his eyeball lasers. We've seen it.

I suppose that if Varric dies, and it's an accident, then that is different; however, this would, I feel, betray his character in a way that would greatly disappoint me and many others. His writer being laid off is also not really a reason to assume they'd kill the character she wrote, too. If anything, I would think they'd try to preserve his integrity, unless we think they're just sadists, and if we do, why are we playing their games?? Maybe it's wishful thinking, and possibly it is, but killing a beloved OG like Varric on day one, with the player having zero choice in the matter, just to piss people off and also because Varric is getting a little "old" is illogical. It would, I think, betray their tendencies up until now. If it happens, it's probably a bad choice. Just my two cents, of course!

[desireandduty]

🤍 + ANIDALA (sithdestined specifically)

Who cooks meals for the other? HAHAH the kitchen droid or someone in the kitchen of one of the many restaurants in Padmé's rotation. I think you said Anakin isn't that accomplished of a cook and neither is Padmé.

Who spams the other with memes? IDK about memes in the GFFA, but Padmé is very communicative. As often as she can, she'll send him little messages to his comm. Also, pretty early on in the war, she starts sending him and Obi-Wan off with little care packages. Obi-Wan's include some of his favorite treats. But Anakin's include those PLUS love notes.

Who likes to tidy around the house? Padmé keeps a VERY tidy home, so I'm guessing she is the neat freak in the relationship.

Who likes to play pranks on the other? I.... don't really think this is part of their relationship? Padmé would view pranks as a little bit mean spirited and deceptive. There's an element of trying to one up or get the best of the other person. Being pranked would make her feel foolish or exposed or betrayed. She'd never do that to Anakin, and again, I just don't see him as a prankster.

Who asked the other to move in with them? irrelevant bc they can't really officially live together anyway :'(

Who is in charge of the music during a car ride? Genuinely think they'd just take turns.

Who is more likely to tickle the other mercilessly? I feel like this one is Anakin. Padmé pretends to be mad, but she's really not, because one of the things she loves best about Anakin is how he makes her laugh.

Who needs to hold the other during scary movies? The only way Padmé would consent to watching a scary movie is if she can be sitting on Anakin's lap the whole time. Does that answer the question?

Who has to help the other when it comes to technology? I mean Anakin is the tech whiz here. Padmé has the same tech knowledge as your average person. But if something breaks, you can bet she will be going to him to fix it vs the other way around.

Who likes to get a bit frisky in public / an inappropriate setting? LMAO p sure this one is Padmé. Miss "Here I Rented a Speeder and Brought Some Blankets So You and I Can Bang in an Alley in the Lower Levels." She likes a little bit of risk in her life okay? Underneath her disciplined and principled exterior, she is a very passionate woman with deep emotions. Anakin lets her finally burn off all that steam ya know?!

Who wakes up first, and do they wake up the other or let them rest? Padmé is an early riser, because she likes to have time to herself in the morning before work to collect her thoughts, prepare for meetings, etc. Knowing how Anakin is always bopping around the galaxy, she would try her very hardest not to wake him up so he can get as much sleep as possible.

Who is always taking pictures of the other when they aren’t looking? My guess is both? Padmé would definitely do this, because she wants as many little mementos of Anakin to rewatch/look at as she can have. I envision Anakin being the same way? I mean... wouldn't he want to have pics/holovids of her so he can gaze at her beauty while he's off in some corner of the galaxy fighting Seppies?!

Who always forgets their wallet and never ends up paying for anything? I.... am pretty sure Jedi don't get paid, so any time they go out and do things, Padmé is footing the bill.

Who can’t sleep because the other snores or moves too much at night? Padmé is a deep sleeper. She doesn't snore, but I can see her moving around some. Honestly, she is used to having the whole bed to herself, because of how little Anakin is able to be home with her on Coruscant. When he's home, she likes to fall asleep snuggled up with him (she is the little spoon okay!?!?!) but in the night, she'd probably shift away from him because he'd make her too hot. For some reason I view Anakin as running warm bc the whole sun/star thing ya know?

Who is better at video games, and do they let the other win or show no mercy? Pretty sure Padmé has never played the GFFA version of a video game in her life. So even if Anakin wasn't an elite warrior and ace pilot IRL, he would win this by default.

Who always gets up in the middle of the night to use the restroom and accidentally wakes up the other? Probably Padmé but it depends on how light of a sleeper Anakin is I guess?

(tagging @sithdestined so you see it here too)

[lukeleiahan]

Watched OWK and now I can't help but think about an AU where Obi-Wan does kill Vader after their last duell.

It's the hardest decision he's ever had to make.

Vader says that he killed Anakin, and Obi-Wan...

Obi-Wan believes him.

Maybe it's just that he needs to believe it, maybe it's just selfishness, but he does believe it.

And if Anakin is dead, truly dead, then Vader is nothing but an enemy.

Obi-Wan never wanted to be soldier, but the Clone Wars made a very good one out of him. He knows what to do with enemies.

Especially enemies that threaten two most important children just by existing.

It's just one swipe with his lightsaber, targeted to the neck. Vader doesn't even scream.

(Obi-Wan will wonder, for the rest of his days. Was this Vader, in his last moments, or was that Anakin, granting Obi-Wan peace? Would there have been a way to save him after all? It eats him, quietly, sometimes. But he is a soldier. And soldiers kill their enemies.)

He wants to bury him. It's Anakin's body as well, after all. But then he feels Luke's terror, and that's that.

After, he goes back. Anakin hated Tatooine, never ever wanted to return there. It would be cruel to bury him there. And no civilized world would want Vader. So he buries him there, on that small moon, under rocks. He doesn't mark the place.

He returns Lola to Leia, tells Bail of the Path, and then goes back to Tatooine. He meets Luke. He finds Qui-Gon. It's enough.

He thinks of telling Bail and Breha, of telling Owen and Beru. Of telling them what happened to Anakin. Of telling them Vader's dead. But what would that accomplish? It's over. It doesn't matter who Vader's first victim was. And so he doesn't.

Nine years later, he does not die aboard the Death Star. He guides the twins to safety. He holds them both as they grieve their families.

And once the battle is over, he sits them down.

"Let me tell you a story." He says.

[intermundia]

I'm rewatching episode 1 (again) and absolutely LOSING IT over the fact that Obi-Wan buried their lightsabers together!! together!!!!!!

yeahh like.... we have obi-wan, looking like that, disheveled and dirty and rough, yet still soft in his dusty blue and faded browns, leather fingerless gloves and belt slung low across his hips, hair dirty and finger-combed back, beard rough, face pained, being able to find a chest (coffin) buried unmarked in the middle of a vast sea of sand because he could sense the resting place of the two lightsabers (their lives), and feel the kyber crystals, the mournful, singing hearts of obi-wan and anakin??? oKay!

he literally digs up the past, unearths and confronts these physical tokens of everything he lost, opening the box and releasing his whole identity of obi-wan (contingent as it was on having anakin at his side), unwrapping the shared funeral shroud and seeing the murder weapons (as he thought), holding again the tools with which they severed their bond, anakin betraying him by using the lightsaber skills he'd learned from obi-wan to kill children, and then attacking him, until they were cut apart by obi-wan cutting anakin down.

it's the real beginning of ben’s journey toward reclaiming his identity of obi-wan, so long buried under a fog of numb horror and regret, forgotten and shunned out of fear, and yet inescapable in his dreams. ugh the blades.... it's just them, who they were, obi-wan doesn't need psychometry to see again in the saber hilts how they'd bonded in thousands of hours of sparring, how they'd worked together in the war, fighting like two halves of a whole, how they fell apart, the open circle collapsing in conflict and then breaking apart....... i'm still losing it about this too lmao

[catofadifferentcolor]

Revenge of the Sith (2005)

So this is how liberty dies... with thunderous applause.

I cannot remember when I first watched the original trilogy - sometime in third or fourth grade, I think, but possibly earlier. I grew up watching Star Trek, and, though I enjoyed Star Wars, I never quite had the same love for it. And then the prequels were announced.

Revenge of the Sith is the first SW movie I have clear memories of seeing for the first time. I was in HS and in the middle of one of the most intense exam weeks of my educational career when it was released... and so I didn't see the movie until some weeks later, after the school year had ended. I didn't anticipate much - TPM disappointed me and, while AotC was a solid move in the right direction, it wasn't enough to have me lining up at midnight for the sequel.

RotS was - and is - the movie that makes the prequels worth it. All of the problems of TPM and growing pains of AotC are bearable because of this movie. It's not perfect by any means (Padme's role largely being reduced to an incubator being one of many things a wilier script writer would have handled better) but close enough that I can't help but love and adore it.

Rewatching it's movie, it's clear that's it's not perfect - every second Padme is on scene is a second wondering where all her brain cells have disappeared to (who honestly agrees to run away with anyone after learning that he's helped to betray the Republic you swore to serve and lead a massacre of his entire order, from the eldest to the babes in arms?) and Dooku's quick death feels disingenuous to a fascinating character - but it's by far the best Star Wars movie of this century. It stands right up there with Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi and, arguably, surpasses of A New Hope with ease.

The pacing is spot on. The dialogue is only occasionally trite and/or clunky. Everything works in a way that the sequel trilogy proves is hard to manage even with all the power of Disney behind you. The battle with General Grievous is everything I wanted from the battle with Jango Fett in AotC. The Revenge of the Fates is the lightsaber battle, and a worthy heir to the Dual of the Fates. Anakin feels less of a whiny teenager than a soldier with valid points - even if he's so mixed up in the head that he manages to betray every one of them by the end. And Obi-Wan continues to be practically perfect in every way.

...I could probably go on about how the older I get, the less I seem to respect Padme as a character. RotS highlights that these types of movies never know what to do with female characters, beginning with the fact she's the only female with a speaking role in this movie and ending with the fact that on her deathbed this supposedly strong, capable, stubborn, passionate politician chooses to ask if her treasonous, child-murdering husband is okay rather then what will happen to her children. (Or maybe she felt, being Obi-Wan, she didn't have to ask if they'd be taken care of. Maybe it was understood. IDK.)

...I could also argue about expecting someone to bring balance to the force and then largely treating someone as if they're incapable of basic tasks is probably not the way to go about doing things. The Council means well, but Anakin's slave upbringing for nine years outside of the Temple always meant he'd have different feelings and reactions to things than anyone else in the Temple. Understandably he has problems with attachment, but no one ever gave him an healthy way to deal with that - and though Obi-Wan obviously tried, his clear attachment to Qui-Gon and grief over losing him likely meant that the one example of healthy cooping mechanisms really wasn't all that healthy.

...Not that it's all the Jedi's fault. Anakin's habit of doing things and then expressing regret - meaningful or not - about them while the body's still cooling is hardly healthy. His inability to take responsibility for his own actions is peculiar for someone who wants so desperately to be recognized for his abilities, but understandable. Hell, the first thing he does as an adult is jump into an ill-advised marriage with Padme, who seems to make every decision in their relationship until she suddenly loses the ability to think at all with her pregnancy.

But all that said, that's why RotS is so powerful - it's a jumble of human problems and human emotions that just happens to be playing in the context of a galactic war. It's why the movie works. (It's why, when it took me three vodka gimlets to make it through TPM, even fast forwarding through the pod race, and one to make it through AotC, today's drink was largely forgotten.)

TPM gave us the setting. AotC gave us the plot. But RotS made us care, and empathize.

[theasexuwhalestuff]

Can they let this man catch a break?? Huh?

I swear to God, if they pile more traumatic bullshit onto this poor man in the Kenobi series I will fucking riot. If they don't deal with the long-term effects of his trauma and PTSD, I will throw hands. If they don't address the state of his mental health at all, idk what I will do.

The difference with him and my other favourite SW character, Din Djarin, is that there's a huge gap in Din's timeline where we don't know what he's done, how he's lived, what he's gone through. We have no idea what's transpired in Din's life between the day he was rescued to the first episode of The Mandalorian. We don't know where he was raised, who raised him, if he was raised by parents or the entire community. We don't know who trained him, which Mandalorians he holds dear, or even who his friends in The Covert are. There's a glaring hole, which is even more noticeable in Season 2, where we basically learned zilch about Din's past, since Disney was so busy tryna cash in on spin-offs, with the 2872818292 cameos.

For Obi-Wan, since he's a much older character, there are tomes upon tomes of information on his life, starting with the movies, books, comics, to TCW and this new series. Not only that, they nearly cover the span of his entire life. One would think they'd close the chapter for this character, because surely there couldn't be much more to explore with his arc. But I guess not, since he's a fan favourite, and even a fave of mine, so I guess I don't mind as much as I would have. But for him, we already know so much about his life, and most of it is just so fuckin' tragic that it physically hurts to see him go through even more bullshit.

Yes, Din goes through a whole lotta bullshit during the time his show is set in, but till now it is still one of the more smaller-scale shows in terms of the grandeur of the plotline. But despite that, we do get to see Din dealing with mental health issues; dealing with identity crises. These are things that are explored and addressed, at least to an extent. But Obi-Wan? Esp in the prequel trilogy, his reactions to loss, trauma, PTSD are simplified and sanitized to the point where you barely see anything apart from a line or two on how he's been betrayed or how he feels. The fact that a lot of this is never addressed again, or addressed with little emotional weight takes away from his depth as a character.

The other thing is fanfiction. When you have fics on Din's life and problems, there tends to be, at least in most cases a point of resolution, where he deals with the trauma and mental health issues. And from the tone of the show, I think this is something you would expect. Maybe he doesn't address everything, being a stoic Mando warrior and all, but you know that he actually tackles some of it on his own. They are Mandalorians, after all. Weapons and fighting are a significant part of their culture. To exist like that you would have to address and deal with these issues, which I'm quite sure they do, since most, if not all seem well-adjusted. That, and their culture emphasises the importance of community, and of raising and protecting children. I don't doubt at all that Mandalorians as a community have ways of dealing with mental health issues.

On the flipside we have Obi-Wan, who was raised by the Jedi. Basically taken from his family, with consent, but whatever. Not only is there the whole attachment bullshit, which is really unhealthy, but I don't think I've ever seen them deal with negative emotions in a very healthy way, apart from releasing them into the Force?? Like I don't think they even bother with processing these things. Certainly haven't seen Obi-Wan doing it. That's another reason the fics on this character are even harder to read. Not only do you have this entire shitload of suffering and pain, but a lot of it isn't dealt with or addressed in any way, and often not shared with other characters who are close to him. I understand that this emotional constipation makes him more relatable and is in fact, more realistic, but there's just so much toxicity you can deal with in media for escapism when you have enough of it in your own life. The amount of pain and sorrow Obi-Wan fics, and his life too really, bring me, is scarily debilitating.

I don't know where I was even going with this essay, but I'm pretty sure I got the main points out sometime before going on a tangent.

[mostthingskenobi]

Hellooo! So, I have a question for you I've been wondering about for ages now... What do you imagine Obi-Wan and Satines first kiss in the clone wars series would've been like if they'd done it? Would Satine kiss Obi-Wan or would he kiss her? And what would the situation be for them to finally do it? If you're not sure then maybe some ideas? Btw I love your blog and hope you'll stay much longer. I'm sorry about what's happened to you. I hope you're getting better because you're just amazing

Hello there, my friend! This ask gave me a jolt of pure joy!! What a fun and pleasant thing to think about… and I’m sure it’s no surprise to you that I’ve given this quite a bit of thought. So here’s what I imagine (I’ll try not to be too wordy and take up too much of your time… who am I kidding…. this is going to be the longest thing I’ve ever written):

OBI-WAN AND SATINE’S CLONE WARS KISS THAT NEVER HAPPENED BUT SHOULD HAVE… **QUIETLY SOBS IN THE CORNER**

OK, to start, I understand why Obi-Wan and Satine never kiss in the Clone Wars. George Lucas believed that Kenobi was the embodiment of the perfect Jedi, even to Obi-Wan’s own detriment. It’s why Lucas never allowed Obi-Wan to kiss Satine, or respond to her dying “I love you.” It’s why Obi-Wan didn’t fight Maul during The Lawless, and George Lucas certainly shot down Dave Filoni’s idea that Korkie was Obi-Wan and Satine’s child. Obi-Wan Kenobi was a pure Jedi Knight.

My problem with that: it’s boring.

It’s not boring that Obi-Wan is pure, it’s boring that he never slips. As a writer, I believe it’s more interesting when a character’s standards are challenged and they are forced to break their status quo. It’s more gratifying for the audience to see a character change and grow, to struggle, give in to temptation, relent, and ultimately succeed (Luke Skywalker anyone???). This is ESPECIALLY important when you brutalize a character. Star Wars is very hard on Obi-Wan Kenobi and he receives very little validation. For the audience’s sake, Obi-Wan Kenobi deserves just one moment where he follows his heart FOR HIMSELF.

(This is all rhetorical, of course. If it isn’t obvious by the fact that I run an Obi-Wan Kenobi blog, Instagram, and AO3 account, let me say that I love Obi-Wan just as he is. Though as a storyteller, I may have changed a few plot points on his timeline.)

That being said, there are 2 places I can picture a kiss between Obi-Wan and Satine.

THE SLOW BURN

The first scenario is a slow burn that builds through the Mandalorian Arc in season 2. I imagine Obi-Wan would be doing his best to ignore his feelings for Satine and keep things “strictly professional.” But after the multiple assassination attempts made by Death Watch, and the Duchess wrongly being accused of murder, I would say Kenobi’s guard on his feelings would gradually begin to drop. Satine is one of the few characters Obi-Wan reaches out and physically touches in The Clone Wars, and he touches her a lot. To me, that indicates a certain level of familiarity that is not present between Kenobi and other characters.

I don’t think Satine would make the first move. I think she would encourage it subtly, but she would not kiss Obi-Wan first and here’s why:

1. She cannot be the one to break the Jedi Code. If Satine forces Obi-Wan to betray his oath before he’s ready, then she is the villain, the temptress, the distraction. She has no wish to change him or undermine his achievements. I wrote this in my first piece of fan fiction, A Jedi’s Resolve, and I still think it’s true of Satine:

“How could I ask you to give up the Order that you loved so much?… Don’t you see that you are a paradox? I loved you as you were, and forcing you to leave the Jedi would have made you a different man.”

2. Satine already told Obi-Wan her feelings in Voyage of Temptation. She laid her heart bare. If something is going to happen between them, it needs to be because Obi-Wan wants her enough to break his Code. He needs to want her in a “we’re soul mates and the Force will not let us be apart” sort of way, not be tempted to break his Jedi vow for lust.

I know this sounds all boring and moralistic, but as discussed earlier, Obi-Wan is a pure knight, and, in my opinion, this is how he would stay in character and kiss Satine. The act has to tie back to honor.

How would it happen? Well, Obi-Wan would have to be pushed to his limit by, let’s say, the pain of losing Satine again… or by not getting to tell her how he feels before she returns to Mandalore… or by overwhelming memories of their young love… Once he’s at his limit, they need to conveniently end up alone together where they can finally say what needs to be said without the risk of being overheard. I’m building up to this in my fic The Jedi and His Duchess. Or if you want something short and sweet, A Jedi’s Resolve is a one-off I needed to write to give myself closure. These fics detail exactly how I think this situation would unfold.

As much as I love this scenario, Star Wars would never go for it in canon. It’s too hypocritical to give Obi-Wan a love interest, especially when they portray Anakin’s love for Padme as a betrayal.

HOWEVER!!!! There is a line, I think it’s in the episode Corruption, where Satine reveals to Padme that Obi-Wan has told her all about Padme’s adventurous spirit. This implies that Obitine has remained in touch during the Clone Wars.

THE ULTIMATE TEMPTATION

The second scenario would take place during The Lawless. I have serious issues with this episode, for many reasons. I cannot watch it without sobbing… because I’m a huge emotional baby. BUT I also feel like the episode is extremely rushed. Maul spends an excruciating amount of time building up his underground crime syndicate and spends all of 10 minutes exacting revenge on Obi-Wan.

As an audience member, I’m far more fascinated by the interpersonal relationships: the conflict between Maul and Obi-Wan, the love between Satine and Obi-Wan, the betrayal between Maul and Sidious. This is more interesting than 2 full episodes of crime mongering. And I’m sorry, but Satine dies in Obi-Wan’s arms and like 5 seconds later cracks a joke with Bo-Katan. WTF, Kenobi?

What we should have gotten:

1. Much more time spent between Obi-Wan, Maul, and Satine, like at least 2 episodes.

2. Obi-Wan needed to tell Satine something while she lay dying. This woman died for him, lost her home, her planet, her family, her life’s work for this Jedi. She was used as a means to an end. The least Obi-Wan could have done was kiss her properly when he rescued her or said he loved her while he held her in his arms. She died not knowing how he felt about her. (I’m suddenly feeling inspired to write a ficlet of Obi-Wan rescuing Satine properly  0_0  )

3. A moment of real Dark Side temptation for Obi-Wan. It didn’t have to be as extreme as my series, The Dark Side of Obi-Wan Kenobi, but there should have been something more significant in that moment. Or at least more visible grieving into the next episode arc. Obi-Wan gets over Satine really fast and it really pisses me off. He’s such a perfect Jedi that it almost makes him seem heartless. I’ll say it again: GRATIFY YOUR AUDIENCE!!

OK, sorry… this is a little less about a kissing scenario and a little more about asking for a moment where Obi-Wan reveals his feelings to Satine… But that’s OK… right??????

I’m so very sorry, Anon!!!! This is the longest thing I’ve ever written and I’m afraid I may not even have answered your question!!! This is probably way more than you bargained for. I apologize for rambling on and on. But thank you for the lovely ask. I honestly really appreciated thinking about something other than my own awful life :) Thank you for your kind words! And thank you so much for following my blog!!!!!!! It warms my heart that you enjoy my stuff. Please keep in touch!!