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#wheel of time s2 spoilers
onaperduamedee · 8 months
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Sea Folk might be good at the game, Master Domon, but the Aes Sedai invented it.
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theoraclej · 7 months
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THAT SEASON FINALE!
light, where to begin, a disjointed ramble of things I observed:
Dovie’andi se tovya sagain! - Mat said the words, he said the words!
And he made his own ashandarei! I hope he gets the raven-inlaid one though because I’m sure no one wants him running around with that dagger
And I know he’s going to get a massive S3 glow-up because he sees himself as MORE, now. Yay Mat!
RAND exploding the shit out of the Seanchan including Turak; nice way around his general lack of swordtraining which I’m sure will be remedied
Once the Heron, to set his path!
The interplay between Rand (and Lews Therin before him), Lanfear, Ishamael - they were besties in the Age of Legends, lmao!
I had expected the intro to be a high society polyam party they were attending, not the Sealing of Ishamael, 🤭
The Warder bond was beautiful, flowing, intimate, just what I imagined when reading these books some 25 years ago
I knew Moiraine was gonna say Lan was her better!
I’m so glad they’re back together though, legendary qpp
Nice to see the S1 intro sequence with the gorgeously woven Aes Sedai tapestry
I was a bit sad Nynaeve didn’t heal Elayne OR Rand but she DID swear to make Seta’s mother curse the first kiss her father ever gave her and THAT was cool
Hopper, my beloved! 😩 I would be chopping Whitecloaks too!
It was so satisfying to see Perrin obey his wolfly instincts already!
Elayne being the one to heal Rand’s wound was an interesting choice, and you can tell he was dazzled by her!
Book lines, book lines, book lines making me have conniptions every time one was uttered
“From birth to death I serve the Blood.”
UNO I KNEW YOU WERE COMING YA SHEEP-GUTTED MILK DRINKER
“For the Light, and Shinowa!” still gave me chills even without an expanded story behind it for Ingtar
Egwene al’Vere. I hope she earns a title of “the Unbroken” someday. Remember, Nynaeve even said that about her when Egwene was captured by Whitecloaks in S1!
Egwene, spitting out the damane gag and refusing to rain down fire on innocents, ah my girl, that’s that Two Rivers steel
Egwene, collaring Renna and choking her to death, being stronger than Renna, being able to withstand the pain of that because that’s exactly what Renna taught her
Egwene later, with that amazing shield against Ishamael to protect her friends!
Lanfear pushing Lan and Moiraine out of the ocean Waygate was very unexpected but totally within Lanfear’s lane, just to keep Moiraine away from Rand
Lanfear working to sell the Seals to Bayle Domon, which was so lmao also, and it really enhanced her utter shock when she entered the room later with the Seals all broken.
M O G H E D I E N 🕷️
She is perfectly creepy, perfect in every way. I can’t wait to see her tear shit up, or to see how she will be used in S3 and beyond
Never expected her to cage Lanfear in her webs, either, dang. Lillen Moiral wasn’t near so strong as Mierin. But we know some things are just Talents, and Moghedien is better in Tel’aran’rhiod than Lanfear
Did you notice Rand’s wound swirling with evil bits throughout the healed part? Really cool effect if you catch it
Aviendha, Bain, and Chiad showing they can fight just as well in close quarters in a city as in the Three-Fold Land; and then later acknowledging Rand as Car’a’carn
Though I’d hoped we’d get some good old He Who Comes With The Dawn in here too
Moiraine’s outstanding torpedo weaves that fucked up the Seanchan boats! And she understands the stakes - if the Dragon is gentled, or harmed, or captured, everyone’s life is in danger and that includes her and Lan
Anyhow fuck the Seanchan
Did it look like Suroth got blown up too? Does that mean she’s dead? I guess we’ll see who gathers in the scattered remnants of the Hailene!
The first “I’m not Lews Therin” from Rand
Mat taking a moment to mention Rand’s “shit hair” to Perrin while they were in the mix, lmao
That shadow ashandarei is really scary, it is a laser knife (lightsaber?) on a stick
I can’t wait for Perrin and Hopper to meet again in the Wolfdream
Speaking of which, I think Perrin’s eyes are permanently golden now
I cried at the coming of the Heroes of the Horn, I’m sure many of you did too 😭
Cool Hero fighting effects, I liked those
BIRGITTE SILVERBOW MY LOVELY
I figured Min’s vision of Mat “killing” Rand would be something like this, an accident, not an intentional thing
His blood on the rocks of Shayol Ghul…
AL’LAN MANDRAGORAN, the Uncrowned King, Sworn to the Flame, bonded again, fighting as he was meant to, just slicing through armies, snatching arrows out of the air and stabbing people with them, chef’s kiss
I wonder if Nynaeve’s “failures” and inability to channel at these vital moments will give her the drive to break her block
Ishamael’s channeling at the end was really impressive, a testament to how much more he knows than Rand
I hope that’s not the last we see of Fares Fares, he was remarkable as Ishamael and a truly enjoyable villain
And since they didn’t have the Dragon banner of Lews Therin Telamon found with the Horn like in the books, Moiraine saw to it that he was heralded with literal fire
This I can imagine many people seeing from far away, and of course rumor travels further
The Falmen sure seem to appreciate it and of course the Seanchan are gone for now
Lanfear asking the LIGHT to protect Rand at the end is something interesting and NOT LOST ON ME
I REALLY ENJOYED IT and am looking forward to a full rewatch of S1 and S2!
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Proclaimed across the sky in fire 🔥🐲
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butterflydm · 7 months
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show changes to the One Power
So they've now officially made two changes to how the One Power works in the series and I like both of them.
1. last season, they made it clear that a circle doesn't prevent someone from burning out from using too much of the One Power. Fantastic change! Makes linking much more of an act of trust! Will make the idea of linking with a man who is potentially influenced by the corruption/madness of the Dark One's touch on saidin terrifying! Explains why Aes Sedai aren't in circles all the damn time in the latter parts of the series, once they know how much danger is around them. Creates drama and creates a reason for people to hesitate to link.
2. this season, they've shown that being able to sense a channeler (who is not currently embracing the source or using weaves) is a Talent with a capital T that only a few specific people have. Love this change as well and it has some fascinating potential knock-on effects.
a. This helps solve our numbers plotholes about why the Aes Sedai are having such a hard time getting new novices, but other cultures still have plenty of channelers -- if this is a relatively rare Talent, and there are currently no Aes Sedai who possess it (or maybe the only Aes Sedai who does is Black Ajah?), then that puts them at a significant disadvantage when trying to find new novices and waiting for women to spark on their own and come to the White Tower really is possibly the best they can do right now. And it can help explain why Egwene is able to find those women later on -- all she needs is one person with the Talent and she has an advantage there (they could even potentially make it Miri herself, if she is freed from the Seanchan this season).
b. It means that the Seanchan can be more effectively targeted in order to try to save women from them -- find out which damane have the Talent of sensing channelers and focusing on freeing (or killing) those specific damane. And it means that it makes more sense that no one has figured out the sul'dam secret, if this is a relatively rare Talent and the amount of intense 'training' that the damane undergo.
c. It explains how the Aiel can get every single potential channeler -- Wise Ones are explicitly allowed safe passage among all the clans, so you only need one Wise One with the Talent in order to spot every single potential candidate (similar with the Sea Folk, who also have big meet-ups).
d. It also shows us how much Moiraine was relying on wishful thinking in s1 -- when she separated Egwene out, it really was an act of hope/faith that the woman in the group would be able to channel and potentially be the Dragon Reborn.
e. It gives Logain a strong purpose for the Black Tower, so if Logain is our major Asha'man who has this Talent, then he's irreplaceable as a recruiter.
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cosmic-llin · 6 months
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I am still processing S2 of The Wheel of Time but one thing I've been really enjoying is the musical choices, especially the Peak Drama of going the whole season with, each episode, just a fleeting, haunting few notes of the main title theme (which is also Moiraine's theme) to follow the teaser, and then in episode 8 when she has her powers back WHAM there's the full theme and titles again. I just think it's neat.
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eyepatchcrow · 21 days
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god i cannot wait to see mat and olver interact on screen. i love their dynamic in the books but it has the potential to hit so so much harder in the show. specifically him having had a quasi-parental relationship with his baby sisters and then being forced to abandon them, even if it was to keep them safe, plus bonding with that other little farm girl only for her to be brutally murdered simply because she was nearby to him, is going to have absolutely layered on the guilt and self loathing. we all know his self worth is through the floor and while finding out he’s a hero of the horn will have helped, i refuse to believe it will have entirely healed that wound (particularly since he then accidentally stabs rand less than 5 minutes later)
but then for him to be dropped into that same caretaker role with a little boy of a similar age to his sisters has so much potential. mat is absolutely going to want to run a mile, even more so than his usual avoidance of responsibility - he sees himself as the absolute last person a kid should be looking up to - but his fundamental decent streak and established fondness for kids will in no way let him turn his back and neither will olver himself. mat is going to have to forgive himself for leaving the girls by stepping up for this little boy and i cannot wait to see it
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isagrimorie · 7 months
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the way i just discovered that lanfear was a PHYSICIST.
no wonder she wants her flying car back, over a horse.
i adore the conceit that this is a post apocalyptic world.
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theuncannybookdragon · 7 months
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As per my last post
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flickerintwilights · 7 months
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somehow the fucking wheel of time tv show just got onto the list of ‘things that have made me cry Actual Real Tears’ yeah im just. crying a little at this random ‘ooo we’re so dark and gritty and realistic’ fantasy adaptation i was just watching for the self sacrificial plotting lesbians what the fuck
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I need to lie on the floor a bit.
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onaperduamedee · 7 months
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"Moiraine Damodred..." "No, if you have ever loved me, don't do this." "I command you to close the Waygate."
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theoraclej · 7 months
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After all has been said and done, I feel super bad for Lady Anvaere Damodred. Lady thinks she’s played the absolute shit out of Daes Dae’mar to manuver her House into prominence again after “Uncle” ruined them, and she comes to find out that her dirty rotten offspring bargained with the fucking Dark to make it happen instead! All her effort, all her work, all the indignities she suffered, all her diligence, it just kind of breaks my heart, you know?
And now what is she left with? Surely Barthanes will be executed for being a Darkfriend, that’s what most nations do when they’re found - though I don’t know how his status as Queen Galldrian’s fiancé will affect that because she could be a Darkfriend, too! In Cairhien, you never know!
So yeah, my sympathies are with Lady Anvaere. (Plus she was so well done, gracious me.)
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butterflydm · 7 months
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wot deeper dive 2x8: what was meant to be
So excited to take a scene-by-scene look at this epic episode. This post will be dealing only with show spoilers and there will be another post later on that includes spoilers from the books.
I really loved season one, but season two has been richer, deeper, and so emotionally powerful. Have loved it so much. Posts that I'm planning to do in the next few weeks: I want to do a post covering each main character's s2 journey, I'm gonna do some speculation for s3, and I've got some posts planned on the imprisonment/control themes and the 'alone-vulnerable; together-shieldwall' theme that was so beautifully realized in the finale, and more.
But that's for the future.
For now, let's get into the show-only deep dive!
I don't think I really talked about the opening scene in my previous posts about the episode, but I really enjoyed it! I hope that future seasons continue the theme of having the final cold-open of the season be something from the Age of Legends.
2. What they did with showing the close relationship with Lews Therin and Ishamael really plays well with how Ishamael feels a kinship with Mat and thus believes that Mat is vulnerable to the same kind of philosophy and influences that Ishamael fell victim to -- he sees that Rand and Mat are close in the ways that he was close with Lews Therin, and thus believes that Mat being Rand's downfall is what is most likely to tip Rand over to the dark (alongside Egwene, who is our modern-age Lanfear counterpart imo). I really love what they've done with this relationship and with how Ishamael essentially tricked himself into believing that he understood Mat when he was really projecting himself onto Mat, just as he's been projecting Lews Therin onto Rand.
And we get the symmetry of Ishamael asking for death here and being denied, and then Rand killing him at the end of the episode, like he wanted.
3. We get confirmation here that LTT sealed the rest of the Forsaken first and Ishamael is last. This is where we get another name drop: Sammael. So the names that we have for sure are: Moghedien, Graendal, and Sammael (plus Ishamael and Lanfear, of course).
4. It looks like the other Aes Sedai here are all men, which ties us into the discussion/argument that Lews and Latra were having in the 1x8 cold open.
5. "They say this seal is so strong, not even I could break it." And while the seals do appear to be weakened by this modern point in time, we saw the effort that Ishamael went to in 2x4 to break out Lanfear. He did that six more times in this episode before he went to confront Rand. He was worn out, y'all.
I do think it's interesting the ways that Ishamael's nihilism interacts with his behavior with Rand. Once he realizes that Rand is here, he knows that his plan for turning Rand to the Shadow has essentially failed. Because Rand's friends have come to help him, and because of Lanfear's betrayal, Ishamael knows that it's over. And part of him is grateful when Rand kills him, and relieved. He doesn't really believe that he's going to reach Rand on that tower and turn him to the Dark -- that's why he sets two back-up plans into motion: a) releasing the Forsaken and b) trying to get Rand gentled.
6. Lews Therin's resigned apologies to Ishamael here for trapping him into a Fate Worse Than Death vs Mat's frantic apologies to Rand after he accidentally stabs him with the dagger from Shadar Logoth -- Lews Therin has been forced into this because of Ishamael's choices, while Mat was tricked into hurting Rand (both here and back in 2x6, when he 'abandons' Rand).
And I love the pan-up and the reveal that the "Eye of the World" was the place where Rand and Moiraine were tricked to go in 1x8 to free Ishamael from his seal.
7. I missed the credits! Though I absolutely understand the team prioritizing getting a little more screen time in each episode, since they were forced to choose. The golden threads bursting out when Josha's name appears always give me chills.
8. Our episode proper starts with the Whitecloaks planning their attack on Falme. The way that the Whitecloaks get introduced with that fade-in from light is very intriguing. I'm not a military expert but Bornhald's strategy sounds pretty solid to me: non-military expert, lol. We can see that they're hiding in the jungle for now, and they plan to make the assault as quick as possible because they have to take out the 'witches' first or any assault is doomed.
The Whitecloaks estimate there are 28 damane with the Seanchan at this time.
I really like how we see the Whitecloaks' ranks shown by how their armor is designed. The costume design on this show has been so striking, this season even more than s1. There's an almost stained-glass quality to the bands on the armor, which helps enhance that 'church/inquisition' vibe that we are going to also get with the children swinging incense.
9. "But we have something they don't."
haha, you don't know how long it took me to realize that Bornhald was implying "we have the Light on our side". Which, funnily enough, the Seanchan ALSO believe! Both sides believe that they are the ones fighting in the name of the Light, not suspecting that here comes Rand al'Thor with the steel chair (of the Light).
But I really love how drenched this episode is in light, after a season that has been very dark (emotionally and frequently literally).
10. "The Watchers on the Waves called for help, letters to every queen, every king in the world, to the Amyrlin Seat herself, begging, but no one came."
This 100% explains the reaction of the people of Falme at the end of the episode, imo. They have been begging for help and no one has come, so they gave up hope and are just doing their best to survive each day. And then the Seanchan are driven out in a matter of hours and they see that huge-ass dragon on the tower (and this version of the story does have people knowing what a dragon looks like -- the book that Rand looks at in season one with the Karaethon Cycle has a dragon sketch in the pages (at 17:38 in episode 1x5 -- there is SO MUCH subtle lore in 1x5, y'all) -- so they know what it means when they see the dragon on the tower). They know exactly who saved them from their recent oppression.
It also ties into a theme from the books, where the different nations are so wrapped up in their own problems that they don't see the big looming apocalypse that is coming for everyone. Everyone was so busy with their own problems that they ignored the messages from Falme.
11. "These strangers are slavers and murderers. We fight them because we must."
Where's that "Heartbreaking: the worse person you know just made a great point" meme? lol. honestly, that's something that the show has been doing really well! Even people who are doing terrible things are not 100% terrible and are capable of making genuinely good arguments. And they believe in themselves and their cause. The Whitecloaks and the Seanchan are both scarier when we are seeing the True Believers in the cause.
12. And Dain brings up the prophecy here that "in Falme's greatest moment of need, the Dragon will return to us" which really gives me "King Arthur" vibes (which is fitting! one of the cool themes in the book is heroic archetypes and how the wheel turns myth into legend, and we also see the Heroes of the Horn bringing that theme into the show in the major way in this episode). So, once again, the people of Falme are going to know exactly who to credit for their big rescue and seem pretty primed to become strong supporters of the Dragon Reborn, given the information that we've gotten about the city.
Bornhald dismisses prophecy in general as "the lies of long-dead witches" and we intercut into Lanfear leading Rand & co through the Ways, which is a beautiful transition. That was excellent.
13. A lot of characters have mentioned the Falme prophecy but I don't think anyone has mentioned it to Rand, specifically. He's not coming to Falme to fulfill prophecy -- he's coming to try to save Egwene. Much like Mat's reaction to Rand was very much colored by how he abandoned Rand at the Waygate, Rand's reactions with Egwene are colored by how he abandoned her at the end of s1. We know why Rand made that choice, of course, but now he's seeing the unintended consequences of that choice.
14. Lanfear's full plan gets revealed over the course of this episode, not in a super in-your-face way, but clear enough to put all the pieces together of exactly how long she's been planning to screw over Ishamael and the rest of the Forsaken (... since the moment she woke up and learned that LTT's new incarnation was around). Some of the details of this plan go into spoilers, so I'll put it in the later post but, in brief: she's manipulated various pieces on the board to use Ishamael's own plans against him -- trapping Egwene and Nynaeve in Falme was an Ishy plan, but Lanfear was able to use Egwene's presence in Falme as a way to get Rand motivated to want to go there to rescue her and, incidentally, fulfill a teeny-tiny prophecy. After Rand killed Ishamael and was proclaimed the Dragon, she was planning to have Doman dump the rest of the Forsaken in the ocean and then she would have plenty of time to manipulate seduce her dearest Lews Therin Rand into loving her again.
And it almost worked! Well, I don't think seducing Rand a second time would have gone as well as she was hoping, but most of the plan really worked out for her.
15. It looks like the show just revealed here that Lanfear also has the Talent of being able to see fellow channelers even when they aren't embracing the Source. ("I can see it in you.")
I love Lan protectively trying to step in front of Moiraine even though he has zero chance against Lanfear. It's giving real "bless him, he tries" vibes.
Lanfear just yeeting them out onto the beach cracks me up.
It also was really great in terms of how it set Moiraine up not as one of the main players fighting in the battle, but as support from the side, smoothing the way. When Rand and the rest of them come down from the tower and are greeted by the grateful people of Falme, none of those people will know that Moiraine and Lan had anything to do with Rand's success. It feels like such a natural progression of her role -- in s1, she was the driving force that led them all to the Eye of the World... and that ended up being a massive screw-up. This time, they all find their own ways to Falme, and none of our main six young heroes are there because they're planning on fulfilling prophecy or fighting the Last Battle. They're there to save one of their own (first Egwene, and then Rand). "Think not of glory but of salvation". They didn't quote it, but the thought is there in the action of what happened in the episode.
16. "How can you think I'd ever trust you again?"
"I'm the only one who actually cares about you, Rand. Everyone else -- Ishamael, Moiraine -- they just care about what you can do."
Lanfear attempting to use her manipulating wiles on Rand. Of course, at the end of the episode, he's going to get a big reminder that she's incredibly wrong and there are a bunch of people who care about him for who he is, but even in this moment, he doesn't look like he's falling for it. And Rand didn't walk away from his friends at the end of s1 because he believed that they didn't care about him. He walked away from them because he believed that he was dangerous to them.
(and she tried to use this tactic on Rand in 2x6 as well, but she failed there too, though she may believe that she succeeded, because Rand does still extend trust to Moiraine in 2x7 when she asks him why he was leaving Cairhien and he tells her everything that he knows/believes, including very much implying that he thinks Lanfear wants to kill him after he's been proclaimed Dragon)
Lanfear lost Rand's trust when he found out who she really was and that she had been manipulating him for months. And I think she's massively underestimating what she would need to do in order to earn any of that trust back.
17. After the Maidens warn Perrin that they are getting Bad Vibes and are pretty sure that today is going to be filled with people getting killed, Perrin asks Hopper to stay behind, trying to keep him safe. Oh, Perrin, that never works. And Hopper has just as much right to be in the fight as you do.
18. Lanfear accidentally screws over her own plan because she can't bring herself not to gloat before her future husband Rand kills Ishamael. This is the big moment when we see how much Ishamael and Lanfear's plans are diverging from each other (and Ishamael sees it too). Ishamael had been planning to play the long game with Rand, keep him away from Falme until he was ready to be turned to the Shadow. Now Lanfear has jumped the gun and brought Rand at a time when Ishamael only has two of Rand's friends in hand (Egwene and Mat) and even those two have not been broken yet. He's not ready for Rand to be here! There's still so much work to be done!
19. After this conversation, Ishamael is aware that he's potentially fighting a losing battle. But he doesn't give up -- he sends in Fain to try to accelerate Mat's corruption; he prepares Suroth for the possibility of gentling Rand. He won't give up without a fight.
Ishamael does sound so intense when he talks about how Rand isn't going to "choose us".
20. ...is Lanfear wearing a dragon earcuff? I think she might be wearing a dragon earcuff/earring. That is not subtle.
I like that it seems like Lanfear believes that she's tricked Ishamael, at least in part, just like she believed that she'd tricked Rand a lot more successfully than she had (since he was very much still lumping her together with Ishamael when talking to Mat and Moiraine).
21. ...I don't ever really have much to say about the fighty-fight part of battles. The image of the Whitecloaks galloping out of the incense/fog was pretty cool.
22. Nynaeve really does have a very rough go of it in this episode. While she does manage to help, that help is in the realm of "get Elayne to the tower so that Elayne can do something". And while I understand the frustration from her fans... her block needs to actually be a problem for us to understand why she wants to get rid of it. This episode made her block a problem, one that she wasn't able to overcome at the last second when it was desperately needed. Much like Mat's low ebb this season was intentional so that we could get the amazing high of the Horn scene, Nynaeve is entering a low ebb. At the beginning of the season, she was showered in praise and special attention that she didn't want. Now she wants the power that had earned her all that praise and she can't reach it (this is similar to how Rand's lack of training needs to actually be a problem so that we understand why he needs to get some training).
23. Oof, it's hard to watch Renna with Egwene. We do get clarification that the dark facepaint is for going into battle.
Renna cutting off Egwene's braid... much like the tree she forced Egwene to burn down, she's trying to attack something that she knows brings Egwene comfort.
Egwene's eyes when she's feeling at her shorn braid. Baby!
24. I've been finding it interesting to think about What's Up with Padan Fain. So far this season, he's stayed within Ishamael's orders (to our knowledge) but when Ishamael orders him to give the dagger to Mat, we hear the whispers of it calling to him. Once Ishamael is dead, does that free Fain to follow the call of the dagger? Because when Mat was under the influence of the dagger, he still was not a fan of the Shadow. Different kinds of evil. The evil of Shadar Logoth scared the Trollocs enough that they weren't willing to chase our people into the city. I will keep an eye on future developments!
25. Poor Mat has been having a Fucking Time of it. First, he has to watch Rand leave, knowing that he's apparently fated to kill his best friend with an evil dagger. Then he gets hit on the head and wakes up across the continent? With a scary lady who insults him? Then ol' flame-eyes is here and his eyes aren't flame anymore and Mat is just so exhausted and tired and he takes this tea that gets REAL trippy and depressing and tells him that he's destined to be awful forever. And then he's locked up alone in a room. And then... Padan Fain shows up???? With the dagger from Shadar Logoth?????
The one Mat is destined to kill Rand with?
Like... he has been having a time of it.
26. Oof, hard to watch Nynaeve torturing Seta. I understand why Elayne needs to keep looking away. Nynaeve wants so badly to find Egwene and save her. We actually get a lot of ruthlessness from the ladies in this episode -- Nynaeve with Seta; Egwene and Renna; and Moiraine's willingness to "kill a thousand innocents if there's even a chance [Rand] will live". But I think the show did a good job of showing you why each of these characters is driven to be so ruthless at this moment in time.
27. Rand confirms with his own eyes that Egwene is here in Falme, as he sees her and the other damane being led out of the kennels. And he sees the gag in her mouth -- I wonder if part of the reason for that part of the costuming was to make it easy for Rand to see from far away part of the indignities that are being forced on Egwene (obviously, he also saw what horrible conditions she was enduring in her cell back when Lanfear showed him Egwene, but now he knows for certain that what Lanfear was showing him was true).
28. Mat and Fain's conversation with Fain here is interesting because I think Mat is figuring it out -- so many people keep telling him over and over that he's destined to do the stupid thing; that he's worthless; that he's going to be like his dad; that he abandons his friends. Padan Fain is saying the exact same thing that Liandrin was saying (you abandoned your friends for the dagger). Having his old peddler from back home showing up to say the same things that the Aes Sedai who had kept him captive for months had said... that's kinda suspicious, bro. That kinda seems like someone else is supplying the script, bro. Because Mat is not in the same kind of despair here when he's listening to Fain as he was when he was listening to Liandrin. He's paying attention to who the messenger is (and who sent the messenger), not just the message itself.
The first time through watching this scene, it can feel like Mat is trying to convince himself when he smiles at Fain and tells him that he's not going to touch the dagger. But... he doesn't touch it. Instead, he inspects the room and comes up with a plan to escape that doesn't involve touching the dagger. It wasn't just bravado, when he was talking to Fain. He meant it. All these people, they keep telling Mat that they know him better than he knows himself. That they are the ones who really know his inner darkness. That they can guess what he's going to do next.
And Mat... he decides right here, I think, that he is going to prove them wrong. Maybe he WAS always terrible in his past lives? Well, then he'll fucking do better in this one. He makes the decision to do better BEFORE he learns that his past lives weren't rotten, and I think that's so important.
29. Moiraine and Lan's scene here is very sweet. I think this was a really sweet capstone to Lan's journey through the season and an affirmation of Moiraine trusting and allowing Lan and Rand to help her at the end of the last episode. Though the main culmination of the "alone we are vulnerable, together we are a shieldwall" comes in the fight against Ishamael, Moiraine has been very much a parallel with Rand this season in how she's been pushing people away so that she can face the danger alone, so her literally allowing Lan to share in her burden is a lovely little illustration of that same point. Plus the weaves and music here are just gorgeous. I really do love the intimacy here, between a man and woman who are fundamentally connected but not in a sexual or romantic way.
Meanwhile, Lan's journey goes back to a similar point as Mat's, I think, in that he accepts the idea that Moiraine views him as inferior and says he wants to help her anyway, before he gets rewarded with learning that she sees him not as an equal but as better than her. "Okay, what if this horrible thing, this thing that I don't want to believe could be true... what if it IS true and then I keep on doing the right thing anyway?"
Though I've never had the issue with Lan's storyline that I feel like I've seen some other book readers have. The only time his story felt 'slow' to me was through my first watch of 2x4 and even that changed when I did my rewatch and saw how much we were getting told about Alanna & her Warders and how it was leading up to Alanna getting folded into all the big plans. But, yeah, my main interest in Lan was never how many enemies he could kill per minute and the show has made him a much more interesting character to me than the books did.
30. I suspect all this 'getting the Horn' stuff might have been expanded on if we'd gotten ten episodes but there's enough information there to make it clear that Lanfear (as 'Selene') gave them the Horn so that her future devoted husband Rand would get his special toy before he fought Ishamael. Heists can be fun but we did get the info a couple of episodes ago that the Horn was barely being guarded, so that also tracks with it being easy for a 'slave' and a 'guard' to be able to sneak in and grab it.
...the Seanchan uniform actually looks really hot on Ingtar.
31. Perrin finds out here that Egwene is in Falme, and he instantly pivots to that information -- Egwene has been captured by the Seanchan; we have to help Egwene. We know that Perrin has been worried that all of them being isolated away from each other makes them vulnerable and here is proof! Obviously, if Egwene is here, then she has to be the priority over the Horn.
"The Horn of Valere summons the dead heroes of the past. It's the key to the Dragon winning the Last Battle."
Yeah, the show was very clear about what the Horn does. Even if you miss Ingtar's line on an initial watch, a rewatch would instantly clear it up (especially with the knowledge of what it does when Mat uses it). The fascinating thing is that Ingtar NEVER SAYS that the Dragon needs to use it, but that's clearly what Perrin assumes (and a lot of show-only reactors assumed it too, and were surprised by Mat being able to use it).
I like Loial's little speech. He shames Ingtar right out of his determination to leave the city with the Horn.
32. The way that Renna and Egwene's power struggle comes to a head in this episode was really effective I think.
We see Egwene not being able to bring herself to attack until she sees the Whitecloaks, and she takes care to place her fireball where it will only hit Whitecloaks and not any cilivians.
33. I have to admit, the view that certain book fans have that Rand did nothing in this episode are baffling (Nynaeve didn't do 'nothing' either, but both she and Rand ARE going to, I'm sure, seek ways in the new season to do more because they were both clearly frustrated by being 'blocked' from what they wanted to do). Rand did less than he wanted to do, because he got shielded -- motivation for him to want to search out some training next season, because there were several moments this season when his lack of training has been pointed out! -- but in both the Turak scene and the Ishamael scene, Rand ends the fight almost effortlessly (once he's free to do so, in the Ishy scene).
Turak and his guards stood literally no chance against Rand -- he raised his chin and looked, and over a dozen people died (but only the ones with weapons, not the Voice who wasn't a threat). I'm sorry, that is power. The idea that Rand indulging in a sword fight would have shown more power than what he actually did is ridiculous. He would have been a cat playing with a mouse instead of just killing it (and every show-only reactor that I've watched so far has had a BIG reaction to Rand doing this).
We've been shown throughout this season with the Forsaken that the less effort channeling takes and the more casual that you are with it, the more powerful you are. And that's exactly what Rand shows in this scene. Not only does he create and send the projectiles, they are precisely aimed to only target combatants.
Which means that Rand gets to see another aspect of Seanchan culture here -- the main slaves of a High Lord kills themselves when their lord dies. It really does show how deeply the brainwashing goes in Seanchan culture. And you can see that Rand is disturbed by the violence that he just did, but he has to move on, so he does.
34. I really do love how Josha embodies the physicality of Rand's channeling. He does move to channel but it feels very natural, like an extension of himself. It was that way in s1 as well. Rand channeling just... idk it hits different for me than any of the other channelers we've seen, as beautiful as the weaves can be.
35. "The Forsaken fought amongst themselves as much as they fought the Dragon," feels like a very important note for s3 -- the six Forsaken that Ishamael released are not going to be going after Rand together. Just as Lanfear ended up undermining Ishamael's plans, with the goal of killing him, getting rid of the other Forsaken, and living happily ever after with Lews Therin Rand, the other Forsaken will each have their own agenda too. So it's not complete doom and despair that they've all been released.
36. So even as Lanfear is making plans to dump the rest of the 'Chosen' in the ocean, Ishamael is busy at work releasing each of them, one by one. We learn here that Lanfear has been manipulating events in Moiraine's storyline from the very beginning of the season.
Ishamael brushing the dust of the remaining seals from his hands as he talks to Suroth: a+, lol. But to make matters even worse for him, he learns here that Turak is dead and the Horn has been stolen. And everything was looking so rosy for him before Lanfear showed up!
Ishamael's "shit, Lanfear betrayed us" back-up plans:
step 1: free the rest of the Chosen
step 2: get Rand shielded ASAP
step 3: Maybe seeing Mat and Egwene in dire straits will be enough to turn Rand to the Shadow? (it's confirmed here that Ishamael made sure to have Egwene ordered to the tower where "the whole city can see her")
*fails*
step 4: okay, we'll gentle him and then work on breaking him once he's less dangerous
*fails*
step 5: maybe I just kill him?
*fails*
step 6: well, guess I'll die. At least I screwed over Lanfear on my way out. The rest of the Forsaken will have to handle things from now on.
37. I love Mat working out a way to use the dagger without touching it. Also it kinda cracks me up that he ties the dangerous thing to a bedpost because... um... Lanfear tied Rand to a... I think that's maybe only funny to me. lol
We see here that Mat understands how the dagger works, probably a lot better than Ishamael did or Fain does. It nearly killed him last season! He's aware of how dangerous it is... but also how useful it can potentially be at the moment.
And I love that Rand's stubborn 'ACTUALLY, Mat is amazing and one of the best people who has ever lived, so jot that down' attitude from 1x7 gets proven correct here. Rand knew Mat better than anyone else, from what we saw at various points in s1, and now his certainty that Mat Is Good, Actually gets to be proven (including, very importantly, Mat himself... until the Accidental Stabbening gives Mat a brand-new guilt complex).
38. We can see here that the fireballs coming down from the damane in the tower are hitting ordinary citizens as well as the Whitecloaks -- not everyone is being as careful as Egwene.
She sees it too -- that's what makes her spit out her gag and refuse to help anymore. And this moment (among some others) really sells why this addition to the costuming works because Egwene actively and literally reclaims her voice here.
And the Whitecloaks attack on the tower work, killing many of the damane and sul'dam at the top of the tower.
39. While earlier, we saw that some of the Whitecloaks were helping pull civilians out of the way, once again, not everyone on their side is being that careful -- the Whitecloak archers shoot Seta, dressed as a damane, but they also shoot Elayne, dressed as an ordinary citizen. Both the Seanchan and the Whitecloaks are causing innocent people to get caught in between them and die.
And I do think it's clear here that Nynaeve is overwhelmed and scared, not angry. That's why she isn't able to reach the power. Her block is now officially a problem for her, one that she has a very good reason to try to get it fixed next season. This is a similar lesson to what they've been showing us in Rand's storyline: raw power isn't enough. You also need control, or other people will be able to control you.
40. And that ties into what Egwene does too -- both Mat and Egwene think outside the box in order to find clever solutions to their problems in this episode and not be limited to what their captors thinks they're capable of. They both choose an unlisted option.
She seizes control over herself and her situation, because she understands her power now. Egwene, Mat, and Moiraine all reclaim themselves after having gone through a long, rough period of being put in a situation where they feel inadequate and broken down.
And Egwene figured it out by being clever and putting together the information. We also get more confirmation here that only channelers can see weaves.
41. Reunions! Mat and Perrin's reunion here is very sweet. It's also much more straightforward than the more complex and fraught (though just as sweet) relationship between Mat and Rand. Perrin and Mat share a good long hug! Mat holds his shoulder for a moment! But when the hugging is gone, they pull away from each other and don't constantly stay all over each other like Rand and Mat were in their initial reunion scene in 2x6 (or like Rand and Mat will do in their upcoming scene, post-stabbening). So I love that we see that Mat and Perrin are very good friends and they love each other and... and it's not quite the same as Mat's friendship with Rand.
42. Poor Egwene really is so burnt out, emotionally, by her experiences and so traumatized, and we can really see how exhausted she is by everything that happened. She needs some real processing time.
I'm glad that we got Rand's apology to Egwene here, even if I think she's maybe only half-processing it at the moment.
43. I love how quickly Mat gives out the info of "Rand is alive, he's here, he's headed to help Egwene" to Perrin here. And that he takes another dig at Rand's hair, lol. When Rand regrows his hair, Mat gets the credit for it, lol. I also miss Rand's curls, Mat! You are not alone!
44. Ishamael is talking here like he's knows that it's over. He does not expect his appeal to Rand here to work -- like he told Lanfear, it's too soon. Egwene isn't broken. Mat isn't broken. He doesn't even HAVE Nynaeve or Perrin in hand. "Maybe next time it'll be different," Ishamael says, because he already knows that his primary goal of turning the Dragon to the Dark has failed.
I love the echoes of this scene to the one from the cold-open.
45. "You're his only hope" vs "betrayer of hope". I talked about this in one of my earlier posts I think, but the contrast still hits me hard.
Here we have Ishamael, blaming Lews Therin for his fall to the dark (and the stories say that it was LTT's 'fault' that Lanfear turned to), but it wasn't LTT's fault. It was Ishamael's choice. And it's Mat's choices that make him different from Ishamael.
But, yeah, this is another of those things that just gets extra weight to Mat and Rand's friendship vs Mat and Perrin's or Rand and Perrin's.
46. Dain and Perrin meet on the battlefield and get to fight back-to-back for a moment. I think everything with Perrin & the Whitecloaks & Hopper is well-done, but it's tough to talk about. Hopper does get a lovely send-off, as he see him leaping the way that he did when he told Perrin his name. Also, the tension between Dain and Perrin the next time they see each other (narratively, they have to see each other again, with all this set-up) is going to be fantastic.
Hopper's last sending to Perrin is so beautiful. And it's so easy to understand Perrin's rage here, just as it was easy to understand Egwene's need to kill Renna.
47. I like how Elayne (in agony!) is doing her best to help Nynaeve get to a place where she can help Elayne. She really takes charge of the situation and is able to bring a level of calm to it, even when she's under significant distress herself.
Nynaeve is trying so hard to channel here and she can't even embrace the Source. I do think that her 'block' probably got some reinforcement when her most recent use of the Power directly led to Ryma's capture.
(speaking of Ryma, since we don't see her in the tower or on the ships, it's entirely possible that, as a brand-new damane, she was still in the kennels and can get freed after the battle here is done; I would like that for her very much and - if they do decide to have the Wondergirls go back to the White Tower, Ryma could be the one to take them there, as she delivers the news about the Seanchan. That's one of the few reasons that I can see for the Wondergirls to think it will be safe for them to go back to Tar Valon, after they hear Moiraine's news, tbh)
But, yeah, I'm glad that Nynaeve can't just Bruce Banner "I'm always angry" at her problems. That her block is now something that is causing her distress in times when she desperately needs to be able to channel.
48. Mat blowing the Horn is such a beautiful moment. Time slowing and the music changing and the effects of how the Heroes appear. This is a moment of intense despair for everyone and Mat blowing the Horn here turns everything around. I think they did a really good job in making this the turning point of the episode. Mat blowing the Horn did bring back the hope of winning. It didn't win the battle, but it gave back hope. Instead of Mat being ~just like~ Ishamael, he is instead Ishamael's opposite. Instead of betraying hope, he creates it.
And it's such a joyous moment. Mat gets to have his self-worth affirmed by an outside source, gets to feel connected to something bigger than himself, after feeling alone for most of the season. It's really beautiful.
Just... gorgeous. And when Mat remembers and is able to get that validation that he is not destined to be a 'damn prick', just like his father, that he isn't rotten to his core... witnessing him going through that moment is so lovely. Cannot say enough good things about it, A+ television.
49. We also see that, after Mat says that he 'remembers', that he's handling his weapon differently, more familiarly, and he can now speak the Old Tongue. So we can see the impact that remembering his past lives has on him.
And, of course, we see here that Uno is one of the Heroes of the Horn! It's a nice hint to viewers who maybe weren't listening to Ingtar earlier that the Horn brings back the dead. Because we definitely all saw Uno die.
50. And, of course, being magically-fast ghost warriors, the Heroes absolutely can make sure that they only target active combatants and that no civilians get caught in the cross-fire.
Uno saving Perrin. <3 And then lending him a magic shield! Useful! I'm guessing it probably also fades away after the Heroes do.
And once the arrow is out of Elayne's leg, everyone is on their way to the tower.
51. Rand is able to push himself to his feet, despite the effects of the shield on him, and tell Ishamael, point-blank, "I will never serve him. In a thousand lives, I never have. I'm sure of it."
Ishamael knows that his main plan is a bust. It's only back-up plans and failsafes from here on out.
52. Mat's throw is a really good throw! Unfortunately, Ishamael is a trickster too, and it goes right through the illusion of him. This moment is incredibly traumatizing for Mat who only literally just now regained his sense of self-worth -- while we are going to end up with our heroes triumphing over Ishamael and the Seanchan and saving Falme... they all end up damaged and traumatized by it.
Mat just clutching onto Rand here in the wake of accidentally stabbing him. Oh, wow, it really gets to me. And Rand's anger is 100% (and very appropriately and accurately) focused on Ishamael.
And Ishamael is so distracted by this moment that he doesn't realize that Egwene has gotten up from where he threw her.
53. I love how delicate Elayne's healing weave is. And the wound left behind looks very nasty. And Rand getting healed by Elayne and then seeing the sun shining in her hair. What a way to be introduced to someone for the first time! They save your life like that and are literally wreathed in sunlight.
54. Moiraine and Lan getting on the same (ruthless) page when it comes to supporting Rand/the Dragon. And we get to really see Lan let loose with his fighting as Moiraine lets loose with her channeling.
55. I was honestly a little nervous about the idea of them actually doing a sky battle because I could not possibly picture how that would not be cheesy. I trusted the show's team but... I was nervous. What the show did was not at all cheesy. It was heartfelt and epic, but not cheesy.
I love how everyone works together to make it work. The team did such a good job of playing out this theme of having the characters be isolated and showing how that made them vulnerable, and then rewarding us with this beautiful coming together. They can be there for each other and protect each other.
And I'm confused about anyone feeling like this takes away from Rand because... they all contribute so that Rand can strike the final blow -- because Rand is the only one who could have done that part. Moiraine freed Rand from his shield and Elayne healed him, Egwene and Perrin were able to block Ishamael's attacks, but Rand absorbed Ishamael's attacks into his own weave to strengthen it, and then he wove the One Power directly into his sword and we can see the results -- instead of getting back up again, Ishamael crumbled to dust.
Ishamael himself was aware that he had lost as soon as Rand was unshielded, imo. He makes another attack after that, but it's clear that he knows that he lost. There's a reason that Ishamael's first big move in the scene with Rand is to get him shielded by the damane. That's the only way he even has a chance in this fight and he knows it. Egwene isn't able to go on the offense against, Ishamael in any way and we can see what a toll it's taking on her to hold up her shield against him - holes develop in her shield before Perrin shows up.
Minor Cauthor note: I love how after Rand gets rocked by being unshielded and he realizes that Mat got pulled away from Mat, he grabs Mat's hand again. Cute, even in the middle of a pitched battle.
56. Our poor traumatized babies! Let's count up the trauma:
a. Rand felt shielded and helpless for much of the fight and now has a wound in his side that Elayne wasn't quite able to heal. He's also very aware that his lack of training is causing big problems. And he's got a heron brand on his hand now.
b. Egwene is deeply traumatized from her time as a slave.
c. Nynaeve spent this entire battle feeling helpless and her only contribution was bringing Elayne here so that Elayne could heal Rand. Nynaeve may even blame herself for the state Rand's wound has been left in, wondering if she could have healed him fully if she'd had access to the Power.
d. Perrin just lost his new wolf BFF in a traumatic way.
e. Mat stabbed his best friend with an evil dagger (after spending months being psychologically tortured).
f. Elayne has a pretty nasty leg injury. Also, she has to be the most confused person here, by a mile. She likely knows about the prophecies and the Dragon Reborn as general concepts but had absolutely no clue that she was accidentally stumbling into the middle of them. She's gonna have so many questions.
57. But this whole section really is beautiful. Just... I love the fire-illusion dragon so much. Moiraine is always So Extra, all the time.
58. This is the first time any of them have seen Rand channel! Even though they can't see the weaves, they can see Rand walking through Ishamael's attacks without flinching, they can see his sword glowing red, and Ishamael turning to dust. And they heard Ishamael call him "Lews", probably.
It's also another incredibly intimate stabbing, though in a different way than Mat 'stabbing' Rand was. He looks directly into Ishamael's eyes the entire time and, afterwards, he stays focused on Ishamael until he's turned to dust.
59. Yeah, Falme looks pretty all-in on the Dragon Reborn. He saved them from the Seanchan and (given what the dude in Atuan's Mill said) he also saved them from the Whitecloaks. At their greatest hour of need, the Dragon really did come to save them. We also get the confirmation here that these Aiel Maidens, at least, believe that Rand is the Car'a'carn that they've been searching for.
60. At this point in time, Lanfear is feeling pretty damn happy with herself. Step one of her plan was a complete success! Ishamael has been taken care of. Lews Therin Rand has been publicly proclaimed the Dragon! Her happy ending is within her grasp!
Then, as Lanfear is basking in her victory... she discovers that Ishamael took action when he realized she was betraying him. We meet "softly, softly from the shadows" Moghedien and see her stand toe-to-toe with Lanfear. All of the Forsaken are now loose.
Love the vibe they've given to Moghedien.
We can see here that those conflicts that Moiraine talked about between the Forsaken are clear and present. Lanfear and Moghedien are definitely not on the same page when it comes with how to deal with the Dragon.
Moghedien says that "him" and "all five of them" are now the other Forsaken's business and that Lanfear is to stay away from Rand in particular.
And she vanishes before Lanfear is set free and our last words of the season are Lanfear saying, "Light help you, Rand al'Thor."
Interesting in two ways! Acknowledgement of him as Rand, not Lews Therin, and calling upon the Light to aid him. I feel like it does a good job of setting up some very clear issues for the next season.
Hope we have a shorter wait this time!
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rosamundpkes · 7 months
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MOIRAINE channeling in "What Was Meant to Be"
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nervouspearl · 7 months
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"We all stand with you."
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state-of-being · 7 months
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Alanna: Why do you need to see the Amrylin?
Lan: ...
Me: DON'T TELL HER MOIRAINE AND SIUAN ARE IN LOVE DON'T TELL THEIR SPECIAL SECRET
Lan: We found the dragon reborn
Me: Oh. Right. That minor side plot.
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theuncannybookdragon · 8 months
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Actually loving the new Mat!
Episode 2 when he does the sassy lil hand gestures when Liandrin is locking the door???????
It clicked for me. Like-
That's it. That's him.
That is Mat Cauthon.
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