#Lottie vs Laura thoughts

[cryingatwindermerepeaks]

Massive massive sympathy re your current pain situation: ive never experienced that (although ive definitely had astma flare ups where having to move even a tiny bit is just way too much) but it must be really hard. As per your doctors order: someone makes fun of Lottie for crying over the tv thing and the rest of the YJ swarm them and throw them out of the window as they deserve bc omg MEAN >:I

Other agere thoughts: -Tai generally being very non confrontational when shes little but then she's colouring in and Lottie makes her go over the lines and Tai just fully slams her to the ground -Also little tai refusing muddy outdoor play when she's feeling fragile bc dirt on her hands is triggering. Also seeing the others make mudpies and being encouraged to join in and getting upset bc the whole eating dirt while sleepwalking thing is RAW for her -Jackie and Lottie absolutely HOARDING anything that can be used as sylvanian family furniture or props. Like Laura Lee sees all the thread has been taken off a cotton reel bc Jackie wanted it to make a table/ bottle caps being taken off still-full bottles/cute buttons being 'accidently' ripped of Jackie's new shirt and very conveniently turning up in her dollshouse.... -Van calling sweets 'lollies' bc of Bluey and getting everyone confused bc of lollies in Australia meaning 'general sweets' vs meaning lollipops other places -Mari colouring in her fingernails with feltpens for nail polish and Shaina asking why she doesnt just use her own nail polish and Mari's like '.....its not the SAME' -Van complaining a LOT when its her turn to drive them all somewhere and then later playing a game with Mel involving pretending to drive a cardboard box car. And like the game isnt even exciting, she's literally just playing that shes getting groceries and getting petrol but she also whines about doing that irl XD

Feel better soon <3 ~yjdrabbles

eeeee ansnsns this made me giggle so much. yeah, defenestration deserved.

Anyway, anyway, i love all of these. Thank you so very much for this it cheered me up plenty! My thoughts:

- Tai is such a mellow kid until she doesn’t feel like she’s in control of a situation, so disturbing her colouring - especially having her make a mistake which she’s very hard in herself about - would set her off immediately. And Lottie, not really understanding what’s going on, just getting up and shoving right back. She isn’t really upset by it at all, and very unaware of the bruise that’s going to pop up tomorrow. Tai and Lottie shoving fights are so funny to me, like they are both so calm but also so violent.

- Tai would hate mud play. Not only is it icky because it’s messy, she also feels so embarrassed about other tai and the mud that she feels like everyone would judge her for playing with mud (even if they have no idea). It also just makes her feel so sick and uncomfortable.

- They would be absolutely insane with the hoarding (i mean, same). Anything small enough will go missing no matter how unconventional and everyone knows if they are looking for something it’s probably in one of the Sylvanian families houses. “And this is Mrs Rabbit and her babies.” “Jackie are her babies sleeping in the lid of my shampoo?” Yes, they are. And Lottie is the best at swiping things without being noticed so they always grab stuff without people realising and she’ll later just hold it up to Jackie super proudly.

- This one made me laugh so hard because i (an australian) had to read this twice before i understood it. People refer to lollipops as ‘lollies’ and everything else is candy? This makes little sense to me but I completely understand how confusing it would be for everyone - I bet she picks up a lot of words which confuse the others and often imitates their accents without realising.

- Mari definitely thinks sharpie nails are the coolest ever. Shauna just doesn’t understand fashion.

- This is so funny. Van having the time of her life playing ‘drive to the grocery store’ after whinging about having to actually do just that this morning. Everyone except Van would find it very amusing. And, when big Van complains about driving she definitely gets many comments about ‘would you prefer it if we bought a cardboard car instead?’ Which she doesn’t appreciate.

[elizabeth-mitchells]

the world needs to hear your thoughts on lottienatlee 🎤🎤

LOTTIENATLEE TRUTHERS LET'S GOOOOO

lottielee vs. lottienat debate OVER. we're all winners here

you don't have to choose between saint/worshiper and antler queen/antler queen. we can have it all

lottie matthews. in love with two blondes that are on opposite sides of the faith spectrum. her number one believer and her fiercest non-believer

two girls that think they're irredeemable in love with a girl that believes god made them perfect as they are

we literally don't talk enough about natlee. complete opposites. you'd think they'd hate everything about each other. but plot twist! they have such soft spots for each other <3

unfortunately there are zero self-preservation instincts in this house. my god why we are putting together three girls that show suicidal tendencies on screen

in the pilot, you see lottie and nat laughing at laura lee. me, an intellectual: it's an inside joke. they're in love with her. they're both fiercely protective of her

can you imagine them ruling the wilderness cult together? literally a holy trinity!!

they would balance each other perfectly! with lottie, nat keep her grounded, and laura lee always believes in her. with nat, lottie challenges her, and laura lee bring her comfort. with laura lee, lottie inspires her faith, and nat reminds her they're all human

they're this boygenius quote: Lottie: The difference between Nat and Laura Lee is Nat thought she was damned to hell from birth and Laura Lee was like, “Can’t wait to meet my BFF, God”. (God might also be Lottie btw)

[softantlers]

Here to yap about something and tell me if I’m totally wrong on this buttttt

I just rewatched s1 and I’m pretty sure we never see Laura Lee and Shauna interact outside of moments where LL is speaking to the group. They don’t even interact when LL is getting on the plane. If I’m right, this means that LL and Shauna would be the only pairing of the main YJ to never interact on screen

that's actually so fucking interesting. i've never really considered them alongside each other before, but they are kind of foils, huh?

grounded ethics vs moral ambivalence

(not to be weird but) chastity vs teen pregnancy

both have relationships with lottie that are interesting and feel polar, but i'm not sure how to articulate this

the drive to leave (laura lee in the plane) vs the drive to stay (shauna keeping everyone back)

idk there's something about laura lee assuming that she's at fault for the plane crash for literally the smallest fucking thing & shauna looking so deer in the headlights when jackie asks her "do you have any secrets big enough to crash a plane?" -- like the contrast between both and the openness of laura lee vs the concealment of shauna

HMMMMM... do you have more thoughts on this? something is here, i feel!! thanks for sharing!!

[captaindanvers89]

Just saying I need an afterlife AU where Jackie meets Callie cause we know Jackie’s the other bio parent.

Jackie and Callie would team up to annoy Shauna. Callie would call Jackie “Mom” and Shauna “Shauna” or “Mrs Sadecki” for kicks.

And Jackie would only refer to Shauna as “Sadecki”

Jackie and Callie would also wear matching outfits for a long time. And when Jackie and Shauna fight and need Callie to be the deciding factor, even if Jackie’s wrong, Callie would still side with her again for kicks.

Adding to the afterlife AU is Nat, Laura Lee, Lottie and Misty.

Having spent close to a lifetime with Jackie in the afterlife, Laura Lee is now a savage and thinks she’s in hell because Jackie showed up.

She’d be like “I prayed everyday and atoned for my sins but I called my piano teacher a cunt once and Lottie’s right, I am in hell” and Jackie would say, “Excuse me? I am the best thing to ever happen to you”

Then when Nat shows up, Jackie’s like “oh my god I am in hell”

Cue Laura Lee adding “told you”

Then Nat saying, “oh fuck you guys too”

Jackie and Nat would become friends cause I say so.

Also imagine Callie has a kid and Jackie finds out and is excited to meet her grandkid but the kid arrives and favors Shauna more. Jackie gets jealous.

Oh and I need Simone showing up and Tai who thought she escaped her panicking cause Van’s also in the afterlife. Jackie finds out and cause she needs entertainment, decides to host a mma fight.

Simone vs Van. Jackie as the announcer, Shauna gets roped in as the ref, Callie as the ring girl, Nat, Misty, Lottie and Laura Lee as the judges. Van’s scrappy but Simone’s all about the fury cause hell hath no fury like a woman scorned

[sandsoftide]

I know a lot of people are saying Nat should’ve lived so s4 would be a Shauna vs Nat showdown but honestly I think looking at the show as a whole and not just s3, Tai vs Shauna is the most logical conclusion.

The scenes involving Allie in the pilot set up the dynamic for our five leaders: Jackie knows nothing, Tai wants to freeze Allie out to secure victory, Nat says they should play as a team, Lottie knows Allie is a liability but would feel bad, and Shauna’s objection is “Jackie won’t like it”.

Compare to the wilderness. Jackie is dead before things start getting ugly — she doesn’t know anything. Lottie’s time as the prophet is marred by uncertainty and guilt and inaction until she abdicates. Nat tries to have everyone be united and happy but this only results in resentment festering between Shauna and Mari, and the team and Ben. And then Shauna becomes leader and Jackie isn’t there; she’s perfectly content with using a hunt to rally the girls and feel victorious, and Tai is hunting alongside her.

back in the pre-crash timeline, at the kegger, Shauna picks a fight with Tai, calling her a sociopath and saying she crippled Allie. Nat calls Shauna out for being a hypocrite. Adult timeline? Shauna is writing about how actually they all had so much fun, even though most of the girls are terrified. Shauna loves rewriting the narrative to suit her perspective, whether it be distancing her opinion from Tai’s or grouping all of the girls together to justify her thirst for the thrill of the hunt.

Throughout the teen timeline in s1, Jackie and Tai are at odds while Shauna gets closer to Tai: the lake vote, sleeping in the attic, abortion scene. And they’re still close in the adult timeline when they talk about Shauna’s affair and the fact Tai doesn’t feel “it” with her family. Tai is the person Shauna shares her secrets with and vice versa.

this changes in s2. Tai is at Shauna’s side for all of it — she makes Shauna move past Jackie’s death, she is at Shauna’s side through pregnancy and labor. But this is no longer reciprocal. Shauna isn’t the one to help Tai with her sleepwalking, and she gets mad at Tai for getting therapy for it from Lottie.

Now here, I want to briefly talk about cannibalism as a metaphor for grief. Yellowjackets loves literal and metaphorical cannibalism. Literal? Shauna is the first to eat Jackie, Travis is the first to eat Javi, Tai eats Van’s heart. Metaphorical? Shauna crafts her adult life into a shadow of what Jackie’s might have been, marrying her boyfriend and having family dinner with her parents and never amounting to anything after high school the same way she accused Jackie of. Travis turns to drugs and by doing so, he’s “pretty sure some of [his] thoughts are Javi’s thoughts”. Misty almost exclusively listens to showtunes like Crystal loved, and later clings to Nat’s jacket and says explicitly that she’s trying to be more like her. Lottie clings to religion, the thing that connected her and Laura Lee to begin with. In Yellowjackets, love and grief is consumption: “I don’t know where you end and I begin.”

In the teen timeline, we are witnessing Shauna “become” her perception of Jackie, and Tai is her Shauna. She uses Tai for comfort, but when Tai “sides” with someone else over her, it’s a personal slight. Tai going to Lottie’s prayer circles is functionally the same as Shauna supporting Tai in going to the lake; it’s supporting the opposition. And in the adult timeline, Tai and Van allow Lottie’s hunt to happen, again choosing Lottie over Shauna.

Season 3 cements this dynamic. Shauna is the one pushing for the trial and the one to change the jury votes, but Tai is the prosecution. Shauna is the group’s butcher, but Tai is chosen to be Ben’s executor. In the adult timeline, Shauna is the one to attack Melissa, but Tai is the one to suffer for it (with Melissa killing Van).

At the beginning of their time in the wilderness, Jackie leaves Van to burn in the plane. At the beginning of winter, Shauna lets Jackie walk away to death. And now we are going to see that repeat with Tai and Shauna.

We’ve seen how everyone else involved with the Allie debate have handled leadership except for Tai. And we have also yet to see how Shauna will turn on Tai, just like she did at the kegger.

Tai and Shauna are parallel characters — high achieving academics (Shauna getting into Brown, Tai going to Howard and Columbia). They’re both ambitious and considered two of the better players on the team. They are the two survivors who have spouses and children, even though those relationships are in many ways performative. But Taissa wants to win for her team no matter the cost, she wants to bring about important political change. Shauna, meanwhile, is constantly stuck in Jackie’s shadow.

Nat may have been the moral opposition to Shauna, but this has never been a story about morality. It’s one of resentment and cannibalism and rivalry. Tai stepping up to the plate and taking the spotlight as she faces Shauna is the natural conclusion.

[rotating-hyperfixations]

Yellowjackets Rewatch Thoughts - 01x03

I am so sorry to all of you that are sick of me:

Theme song and intro debut, easily one of my all time favorites

If they ever get rid of Ella being cunty in the opening, I’m suing

Van and Laura Lee leading the little funeral makes them canon besties to me

Tai centric episode!

Honestly surprising that it apparently took this long for someone to suggest that Tai was a cannibal from the plane crash, given that theories had to be running rampant I’m sure

Love seeing Shauna and Jeff’s loveless marriage, Shauna there is still time for you to leave that man and live your lesbian dreams!

First time I watched the MistyNat road trip, I genuinely thought Nat might actually kill Misty before they reached New Hampshire or wherever they were going

Travis being an ass and also a good older brother is biblically accurate sibling relationship

Jackie’s optimism is devastating knowing what happens

Jackieshauna tension is commencing and the start of TaiShauna’s friendship

Sometimes I’m amazed Shauna got into Brown because she is so dumb sometimes

Nat and Shauna being the only two to “comment” on the dead bear foreshadowing their future roles as Hunter and Butcher

Jessica Robert’s mafia member?

Simone, I get that it’s probably concerning that your wife is more concerned about her political strategy then the angry outbursts; but she experienced unspeakable horrors in the woods, her priorities being a little skewed cannot be shocking

Man the juxtaposition of the context of Dreams vs Zombie is start to say the least

Mari and Nat finding Travis hot and Jackie being shocked that they’re desperate for men after only 3 days, just get back on the beach with Tai and stare longingly at your girlfriends you fuckass lesbians

Misty was excited to comply with law enforcement and go to prison lol

Shauna’s homeland security bit is so poorly executed, this bitch cannot lie to save her life

Tai paying for Nat’s rehab, they are all so fucked up but still care about each other.

Lottie looks supremely uncomfortable in every shot she’s on this episode

Jackie, baby girl, your breakdown is justified but shit is going to get so much worse

I get why Javi kept chewing that gum, but I know it had to be nasty at that point

I will never buy the Shauna was a bad friend to Jackie allegations because she tried her hardest to help Jackie acclimate and not exiled by their friends

Ben’s crash out is so valid

Man with no eyes introduction, hopefully we get some answers or any information on that bitch soon

Tai threatening that other senator was so god damn hot

Cryptic Lottie also begins this episode, so tame compared with what’s to come

I also didn’t realize they start placing the bricks for “other Tai” this episode

RIP Travis

[griddlebait]

i was backreading your page and saw you mention that you were once considering a tlt yellowjackets AU and assigned some characters to different roles. as a TLT and YJs fan i was wondering if you could maybe share what roles you assigned who?

oooh fun! thank you so much for asking this. i’ll put it below the read more because i will definitely get carried away and this is pretty niche lol. also spoilers for yellowjackets!!

i mostly assigned the roles based on necro/cav pairings so that’s how i’ll format this. also i’m basing this on the teen/wilderness versions of the characters.

taissa - necromancer / van - cavalier

i think that their dynamic in the show (especially as of s2) can easily lend itself to the necro/cav dynamic and i think it would be interesting to examine their relationship through that lens. also tangential but van palmer would love gideon nav as a character someone give her a copy of GtN

lottie - necromancer / nat - cavalier

i KNOW most people’s go-to here would be mistynat because of misty’s protectiveness over and devotion to natalie, however i just can’t see nat as a necromancer and i think there’s more room for juicy drama that could also play off their canon dynamic if nat is (begrudgingly) lottie’s cavalier. admittedly i am also a lottienatter so i might be biased here.

shauna - necromancer / jackie - cavalier

this one was a bit difficult for me because it can also be the other way around and still make sense, it really just depends on which parts of YJ canon you want to take into account. on all levels except for how their story canonically concludes, shauna should be the cavalier. i definitely see the merit of switching the roles, especially if you consider jackieshauna’s interpersonal conflict (particularly shauna’s feelings/resentment towards jackie) and the positioning of necromancers vs cavaliers in tlt - there’s plenty to work with there. but their storyline just kinda lends itself to this interpretation, at least in my opinion. and also when coming up with this (spoilers) i was thinking about shauna in the meat shed with jackie’s corpse and just the idea of reanimation/puppeting and the Seventh’s practices/expertise … it made sense to me for her to be the necromancer. (i did in fact think about placing them in the seventh house for that reason specifically lol)

misty - necromancer / crystal - cavalier

my thought process here is that i see misty as being the type of character to attain lyctorhood due to there being a convenient ‘whoopsie’ and being like well what else was i going to do? she was already dead! and with what happened to crystal … i mean. yeah. (although i did contemplate the idea of necro misty / cav nat and i think misty’s potential ascension/reaction to the cost of lyctorhood would change drastically if nat were to be her cavalier)

those are the only pairings i came up with but i definitely see laura lee as a Cristabel type of cavalier - if i moved nat to a different pairing or role i would have laura lee be lottie’s cav (potential for absolute devastation here).

thank you for asking this, it was really fun to think about again! i hope one day someone actually writes this au as i do not have the skill, talent, nor patience for such a thing. any other yellowjackers here please feel free to give me your thoughts

[storytellervan]

daily yellowjackets thoughts to the void… today is about laura lee and van being two sides of the same coin when it comes to faith and pure devotion

hm just thinking about LL going into the woods with unwaverable faith in an external higher power and dying as a result vs van being converted while in the woods to an internal organic spirit (or more honestly to the physical girl speaking for that spirit) and surviving … both of them being instruments of a greater plan… LL being the one who started lottie on the path to recognizing her visions as spiritual and giving her legitimacy by taking her seriously vs van giving her legitimacy by being a true believer… LL in some ways dying because she was trying to save van!! (van needs serious medical attention being one of the reasons she gave)! something something one of you is always drowning and one of you is always burning

[redshoes-blues]

I just finished the first Yellowjackets s3 episode and I loved it, so here are my thoughts before I start ep 2! Major spoilers ahead

Akilah taking care of a pen of rabbits is everything I love her. I'm also worried for her based on how sweet she is vs. Shauna and the wilderness' cruelty. Her death feels inevitable and I think it will be another death of innocence a la Javi, maybe to show the girls' cruelty.

Shauna's line to Melissa that "oh you do have a personality" was exactly the kind of fourth wall break I like to see lol.

Melissa is interesting so far because she seems in opposition with the craziness going on, but she's also very much keeping quiet to not cause any issues. I'm wondering who the blonde woman sending new YJ letters could be. My mind immediately thinks it's Melissa, but hard to say if she will be the final survivor or not. It would make sense though for her to be on the outs from the others post-rescue. She could also be a heartbreaking death for the season,

Speaking of Shauna, god damn does my girl ever have a lot of anger and emotion to work through. I love that we get to see a woman who is so mean but also complex and very sympathetic. And I'm going to need some sympathetic Mari backstory info because I already didn't stand her and as mean as Shauna is, this episode didn't make me feel for Mari at allllll. But that's a me thing. Also. Did Mari call Shauna "gaywad"?? lmao

I am SO GLAD Lottie's mental health is finally being acknowledged in the teen timeline. We know Shauna saw her take her pills in s1 and now we know that Shauna has explicitly commented on it to Lottie. The commentary on "you didn't see things at home, now you do" was interesting—especially because Lottie seems much more hesitant in her healer role in the wilderness. Also interesting Travis could hear the trees and she couldn't (because of shrooms?).

On the trees...absolutely love the screaming trees thing. And later on when everyone hears them, there are the sounds of Shauna's baby crying, etc. mixed in, so I feel like there is some symbolism there.

Lottie's little speech about each of the people who have died strikes me as important. Noting to myself that Javi will protect them; Jackie will guide them; and the Child will bring them to (?) deliverance. Jackie being the one to guide them is interesting given the necklace being passed around, and Javi being a child with a deeper connection to the wilderness.

Also. SHE DIDN'T MENTION CRYSTAL. Very odd. I know they don't have her body, but like, she also died, or vanished I suppose. They didn't mention Ben either, but Crystal happened way earlier than the Ben stuff and it seems to be a strange thing not to mention her.

Van makes a comment to Tai in the adult timeline about whether or not she wants to "burn the whole place down" and it makes me wonder if there is some truth to the other Tai setting the cabin on fire theories.

Adult Misty is obviously going through it and I found it interesting that when she donned Nat's jacket she took on parts of Nat's personality. Like how in Twin Peaks Donna wears Laura's glasses and becomes more similar to her, personality-wise. This is less extreme to that, because parts of Misty still slip through, but a fun nod.

Also let me talk about Callie for a second because I couldn't stand her in s1, but she has quickly become one of my favourites in the adult timeline. I love seeing her be fucked up and seeing how having Shauna as a mother—as well as all of the stuff she saw at the end of s2—has impacted her. I'm predicting her to have a very dark and/or violent storyline that mirrors teen Shauna, and I'm excited to see where she goes.

Ben finding a pit!! Is this going to become THE pit? And ohhh my god. Mari falling in the pit is crazy, they're definitely teasing us.

Two minor gripes: it does sort of drive me crazy that they keep introducing knew YJs into the wilderness who haven't been there all along. I wish they would've just stuck with the same extras and built on them. I'm sure the new characters will be great, but the lack of continuity bugs me. I also wish we saw at least some of how they got through winter without a cabin. Van implies in her speech that spring came immediately or very soon after? Hopefully we get more info or flashbacks later.

[lais-a-ramos]

ok, so, here are my two cents in the matter:

first of all, i tend to agree 100% with what @wildernessworship said on their post

bc there is a huge problem with the way that the show approaches lottie and uses her as more of a plot device for the "supernatural vs psychological" debate that makes the portrayal of lottie get dangerously close to the Magical Person of Color trope, a subset of the Magical Minority Person trope, especially the Magical Indigenous Person trope since both simone kessell and courtney eaton are Indigenous Maori .

the show also gets way too close to the Mystical Disability trope with the way that her schizophrenia is also utilized as a plot device for the same "supernatural vs psychological" debate.

and, of course, that impacts both on how lottie is treated in the narrative and also how she treats others.

however, i do tend to disagree with the idea that lottie deifies everyone as part of her religious system or that the relationships she has with the characters mentioned have the same approach, even if they all include her religious beliefs one way or another

bc, see, i don't think we can compare the way lottie treated both shauna's stillborn baby and callie with the way that she acted towards travis or akilah or even shauna herself, bc the way she treated her peers come more from a place of expecting them to see what she sees rather than just believing in some type of Chosen One level of prophecy like she did with stillborn baby and callie.

as i discussed in book club discord server earlier today, part of the tragedy of lottie is that she is so hurt by the idea of people seeing her as crazy that she got desperate for anyone who she thinks could feel like her and somehow being proof that lottie isn't crazy.

and that reflects a lot on how things escalated from her brief but very intense romantic friendship with laura lee, to her supporting shauna and standing on her side in the jackie corpse thing bc lottie spotted in shauna the same issues with psychosis as hers (which makes it even more tragic that, after the rescue, shauna acted as if she was "normal" and we constantly see adult shauna treating adult lottie as if she was the only "crazy" one), to how she startes to live vicariously through travis and akilah's supposed connection to the wilderness and making them Oracle of Delphi-type of propheta bc it was lottie's supposed connection to the wilderness that made her feel less "crazy".

i'm NOT saying that lottie didn't cross any boundaries in here, or that she wasn't forceful, or that it wasn't selfish of her, because all these things are true.

what i'm saying is that they are fundamentally different relationships, one of placing unrealistic expectations onto the next generation VS establishing a toxic and codependent bond with people she thought shared the same mentality as hers -- something she would also bring out for when she started her other cult in adult timeline, by the way.

actually, a lot of the conflicts between lottie and nat in teen timeline on season 2 were because lottie wanted nat to believe her and seemingly couldn't why nat seemed to think she was crazy when she was the one who said once that lottie "only talks shit when someone truly deserves it", all while nat couldn't understand why lottie was acting like that and started believing those things when she used to think lottie was one of the girls to make the most sense in the team

on the other hand, i don't think i even have to mention why this wanting to be believed is so crucial for lottie's bond with laura lee, because laura lee was probably the first person to ever listen to lottie and validate her worries and emotions in general.

and, of course, while laura lee accidentaly enabling lottie's religious delusions is the opposite of healthy, it's still rather telling of why it's so important for lottie when we consider her monologue on why she wanted to stay in the woods on episode 3x08: back home, all she ever got were people who treated her with condescendence and tried to control her with medication and people treated her more like a problem than as a person with specific medical needs, which is the historical problem of structural sanism/psychophobia and also of psychiatry as a field

sure, the one dynamic that might blur the lines between the "placing unrealistic expectations onto the next generation VS establishing a toxic and codependent bond with people she thought shared the same mentality as hers" is lottie's dynamic with callie

but, for that one, as even simone kessell herself mentioned in her interviews for the hollywood reporter and the wrap, it was less about grooming callie in a sexual or even cult leader way and more about her yet again seeing a bit of herself and the other girls in callie, which once again speaks to this motif in lottie's character arc of loneliness and desperation to be believed

i'm not saying this to try to excuse lottie's actions, but because i think that what makes the characters in this show so interesting and so compelling even when they commit morally gray actions and even atrocities is because of how their flaws represent very dark and extreme versions of flaws we see in ourselves and other people on our daily lives

and lottie's struggle with her loneliness and how isolated she feels from everyone because of her mental illness really drove her to extremes and to show some of the darkest parts of herself

i would say that this is lottie's fatal flaw, the way that this childhood wound caused by her parents (mostly her father, if both the 1x06 flashback and also the things old man malcolm told adult shauna when he mistook her for teen lottie in his neurodegenerative disorder-induced hallucination are any indication) and mental health professionals, when combined to the extreme trauma of the wilderness, drove her to some of her darkest places

and also influences a lot on her dynamic with travis and akilah, bc, as courtney eaton has said in her and kevin's interview for screen rant and also in the ensemble cast interview for rotten tomatoes, lottie became addicted to the wilderness, so, the idea that this thing could make her feel normal and validated is one of the things that drove her to try to live vicariously through travis and akilah, even though akilah's own relationship with the Wilderness deserves its own post bc lottie and shauna aren't the only ones who showed signs of psychosis in this series and therefore she had her reasons for wanting to believe the Wilderness is real for some time.

there is probably way more stuff i'm missing, bc this has been basically a blurb, and i spent the entire day writing this, and i don't even know if i'm making sense 😅

but i think that the biggest problem is how the show has actually inserted hints here and there that show lottie has more complexity, but these hints have never been fully developed because of the insistence in using her as a plot device for the "supernatural vs psychological" debate and, now in season 3, the way that it seems the creators rushed through the plot in an attempt to make the story more action-packed (something that seems corroborated by lauren ambrose's line in her the hollywood reporter interview about adult van's death and what she mentioned the showrunners told her: " It was like, 'Yeah, the strike, and show business is hard right now… and then we’re gonna kill Van. We want to raise the stakes.' ")

Lottie is pretty clearly not in a very good immediate postmortem situation at all, but once the fires of purgatory and/or Nega-Callie and/or the Ten Kings are done kicking her ass for being especially committed to cannibal woods Satanism or whatever, Laura Lee is going to welcome her home by blowing her back out harder than that one grimdark Batman storyline. In this essay I will

[misty-caligula]

Y’know it’s funny... Lottie’s correct about 50% of the time, which is pretty good but not exactly reliable. The rationalists have a similar success rate.

But is it possible that Laura Lee specifically is wrong 100% of the time on every single thing?

She believes wholeheartedly that she crashed the plane with her thoughts which is... probably wrong. She tells Lottie her hallucinations are God’s visions, with nothing to back that up at all. She just... thinks it. She tells Lottie that she thinks that past prophets “knew because they believed.” And she doesn’t seem to understand psychosis, so... she doesn’t get that Lottie can’t tell what’s real or not. She believes... everything. She just doesn’t know if she can trust what she believes. Or believe what she knows? She’s mixed up.

So Laura baptizes her, believing that God will guide her if she does. And Lottie has a vision of Laura exploding, and Laura misinterprets it as her seeing the holy ghost, because she’s not interested in LISTENING to Lottie, she’s just so excited to be guiding a saint. Her own confirmation bias is really guiding Lottie as well, it’s the blind leading the blind.

Then she believes that flying a plane is “easy.” and that you can literally just book learn your way through it.

(notably her grandpa didn’t learn to do it from a book - he couldn’t read.)

Then she believes that God will protect her and that she can fly a glorified scrap pile to their salvation and... well she’s VERY wrong about that.

This is WHY Laura Lee died, because she was so blinded by her own empty faith that she was willing to believe absolutely anything without question without any amount of proof or even suggestion. Her pure lack of skepticism meant that she couldn’t see the dangers right infront of her face, and she just walked off the cliff peacefully, absolutely confident that if she didn’t believe in gravity it couldn’t hurt her.

I think that’s why Lottie succeeds where she failed. Because Lott’s afraid, constantly, of everything. It makes her question what she sees, it makes her an unwilling and hesitant leader, and it’s only the faithful around her that really push her towards becoming more comfortable in trusting her intuition and letting go of that uncertainty. By the time she’s completely confident in her perception she’s going to have a powerful core of disciples around her who will manifest her reality and confirm everything she says, and the process to becoming a full on priestess/prophet/saint will be complete.

[galindatopland]

HI me again i had a paper to write but i'm back actually talking about the lottie point i was originally going to write about before getting possessed by the urge to write mari nolastname analysis. but basically i was thinking about how passive lottie was throughout old wounds, something that has been talked about quite a bit already. i was sort of thinking about that in relation to what we see in lottie's flashback episode as well as what we see in the s2 premiere of like... lottie is always spoken for, she is silently resigned to other people telling her what these visions mean and whether they're good or bad, something to hide or something to listen to and indulge in. like the scene of lottie at the top of the stairs listening to her parents argue about what to do with her vs lottie watching silently as the group argues about her in the cabin vs lottie catatonic and letting her dad decide what to do with her post rescue like... not only is she never a voice in the conversation but these are also SUCH polarized messages she's getting like. there is something wrong with her she's sick but then she's a prophet and a god in those woods and then it's right back to there is something wrong with lottie we need to fix her. and then something about adult lottie and all her guilt about everything. "we are the ones making ourselves sick". lottie takes all of the accountability and yet has none of the agency. like she Does make decisions for sure, she's not a passive character, but she lets other people decide what position to put her in and then acts from there. and like... how confusing and awful are all of these strong, loudly voiced, opposed opinions (that are honestly both dehumanizing in a way) for someone who is already scared and uncertain of their own experiences and what they mean? i love lottie matthews she makes me sooo. yeah. -cannibal laura lee anon

okay so. seems like the right time to discuss something i don't think i've seen discussed because i think people aren't sure how to talk about it. which... honestly i'm not sure either. everyone can judge for themselves whether they think how the show deals with mental health related issues is good or bad, there's for sure stuff to criticize or at least be aware of. but that's not really what i want to talk about. i want to talk about lottie in-universe and what are my thoughts and interpretations of her character and what she's going through. so! with that out of the way

lottie starts the show as a character who - i assume based on context clues with her childhood flashback and the meds we see her take in the days following their plane crash - has been on what i assume are antipsychotics for years (haven't researched how were psychiatrists prescribing those to minors in the 90s in usa but the show has lottie go through shock therapy after plane crash which is just. pretty damn unrealistic for the 90s so i think we can safely assume those meds are meant to be antipsychotics). my personal take on her character is that what happens to her is a mix of actual mental illness and something paranormal and regardless of that she's forced to quit her meds cold turkey after a traumatic event. even if her body and her mind dealt with it relatively well that's just horribly stressful for a 17yo who's been told for most of her life to fear her mind essentially and that she NEEDS those pills. she's so clearly anxious and then i think she's going through those rapid mood changes and then she's DRUGGED without her knowledge. like quite frankly that sounds horrifying especially in the context of what she's been through? and you're right it's this character we sort of see "in power" a lot in some ways but she doesn't actually have that much agency over herself and her life and i think she's trying to reframe it and change it in her adulthood through what she's... created and i think it's.. fascinating how she's trying to BE what people need her to be and who they think she is? at least so far in season 2. like jokes aside the fact that she's using things she's definitely learned in therapy before plane crash hurts me a little because to me that means she did find those techniques helpful and so she's trying to grasp at what might help her and others out there

[the-one-where-casey-watches-tv]

Yellowjackets episode 2.04 "Old Wounds"

Title sequences are so important. If it’s a good one, you shouldn’t have to look any further to get a sense of what the show is ‘about’, in the philosophical sense of the word. I’ve been so impressed with the Yellowjackets title sequence from the beginning, so when they played a different version of the theme song for this episode only, I knew there was a reason. The title sequence is off-putting, jarring, and jumping through time in every way possible from frame sizes to character ages- a fast paced dose of the overarching tone of the show. They really put a lot of work into it, so throwing in a new version of the theme song is certainly deliberate. And doing it for just one episode doesn’t mark the beginning of a new direction in the story, as I thought before watching the next episode; it means this one in particular is significant.

So what’s so special about this episode? I would argue that the confirmation of there being ‘something’ in those woods came and went in season one when pilot Laura Lee exploded moments after takeoff. Leonard the teddy bear ignited for no reason whatsoever, and that explosion is the first major event with no real logical explanation. While that was a blow, and things have certainly been pretty eerie since the shrooms doomcoming party, I think the events of this episode are the real turning point in the Yellowjackets’ time in the wilderness.

Liv Hewson and Jasmin Savoy Brown in "Old Wounds". Image courtesy of Showtime.

A few things happen, but most loaded is Natalie and Lottie’s duel to bring home the most food. The survivors have created such an emotional division into two camps of logic vs spirituality, with Lottie being the fearless leader of the latter, but I don’t think the situation- or Lottie- is that cut and dry. Natalie’s biggest gripe with Lottie is her perception that she and Travis are the only ones providing for the group, but I have to say that both Laura Lee and Lottie are very spiritual people who don’t overlook physical needs and their physical solutions. Laura Lee wasn’t waiting for divine intervention to rescue them; she read a technical manual and learned how to fly a plane. I don’t know yet what all Lottie is getting herself into (and I don’t think she does either), but she’s only ever tried to enable the group’s vital, practical chores. When Natalie scoffs at her pre-hunting ritual, she replies “you��ve come back alive every time, haven’t you?”.

But, like most cult leaders I suppose, teenage Lottie has found herself some followers more insistent than she is herself, and she agrees to this head-to-head between her and Natalie. The two part ways in the woods, Nat with the gun, Lottie with a little knife to perform a blood sacrifice. As they press on, they both make some pretty crazy discoveries. I’ll start with Lottie’s: the plane we all watched explode in midair, intact right where they found it. She gets inside and opens a hatch, revealing a ladder down into a well-lit, clean, cozy restaurant. She descends and joins her friends, including Laura Lee, at a table, but soon she’s shivering again, covered in snow, soaking wet, and seemingly in another world from her friends despite sitting right next to them. Finally, it’s Laura Lee who tells her she needs to go, or she’ll freeze to death. She pushes Lottie, who falls backwards into the snow, where there is no evidence of her experience in sight. Not even the plane. Whole thing was a hypothermia-induced hallucination from the start.

Courtney Eaton in "Old Wounds". Image courtesy of Showtime.

Nat, meanwhile, has been much more productive. She found a moose frozen into the surface of the lake- the same moose she saw for an instant while out hunting the other day, confirming that she is in her right mind, then and now. She rushes back to the cabin to enlist help breaking the ice and pulling it out. Some people (ahem, Misty) aren’t pleased with Nat getting help in what was supposed to be a one-on-one competition, but everyone else instantly puts the contest aside, as I’m confident Lottie would herself. The group is great at teamwork, honestly, and they’re a well-oiled machine working to break the ice, tie ropes to the moose’s antlers, and heave in unison. Yet despite a truly great effort, they lose their grip and the moose sinks down to the unreachable depths of the lake. Nat is devastated, contest or no contest, just sobbing “we need it” over and over.

This is a really emotional moment, and a huge blow for the group emotionally and physically. This was the first glimmer of hope they’ve had in so long, and now the question still remains: what are they going to eat? I don’t know exactly how things are going to progress, but we all know where this show is going, right? I really think this event is going to be the turning point that sends things in that direction. The thing that really puts into perspective that they are out of options. I wouldn’t be surprised if we hear Nat say at some point that none of the unspeakable things they did in those woods would have happened if they hadn’t dropped that moose.

After a demoralizing, empty handed return, the group returns to the cabin to find Lottie still isn’t back. Nat recovers in a warm bath while team Lottie goes looking for her. When they stumble back in, Lottie barely conscious, Nat jumps out and helps Lottie into the tub. The two hold hands, no hard feelings. The group has made them the symbols of two very different philosophies, but really, Nat and Lottie are both pro survival. They just have different skills.

The results of this competition seem to suggest that Nat, and everything she’s come to represent, are correct. The woods made a fool of Lottie, and even though they both came back empty handed I don’t think anyone can disagree that Nat came out on top. The pair’s present-day storyline also plays a big role in this episode, and I think the timelines really come together well to take us a solid step forward towards understanding what’s going on in the wilderness.

Present-day Natalie has found the cult of the purple people, and their leader Lottie. Clearly some bad blood has formed between the two of them since their good-natured competition because Nat is hell bent on exposing Lottie’s cult. But so far, Lottie seems bulletproof. Her followers know what they’re getting themselves into and honestly Lottie is so likable that I find myself rooting for her even though I’m sure the rest of the gang’s skepticism of her will be warranted in due time. A lot goes on within the cult in this episode, but the really significant part comes at the very end. Lottie is outside in the dark alone, slicing her hand open and dripping blood into an altar, just like she did in the woods, but this time she’s saying, “please let this be enough”.

Teenage Lottie has no idea what she’s praying to, and the events of their hunting competition suggest that the answer might be nothing. But this present-day development sheds a new light on those events: there is something in the woods, but it is not a friend.

But Van and Taissa already knew that. Taissa is staunchly team Natalie- I’d say because she doesn’t want to acknowledge what she already knows deep down- but she indulges Van by attending Lottie’s little spiritual groups. On a personal note, Van is the best character, and I am thrilled to see her join the present-day timeline- played by Six Feet Under’s Lauren Ambrose no less.

Lauren Ambrose in Yellowjackets. Image courtesy of Deadline.

I can’t ignore that major development, but while Taissa’s storyline is the most terrifying, it’s also maybe the least complex. The Leftovers comparisons abound with her character- the practical, good-natured bystander who’s been chosen by a force against their will and beyond their understanding. And the fallout gets worse the longer they ignore it.

So, after hiding from her nighttime escapades that have already left her son terrified of her, adult Taissa wakes up in her car with no gas and no cell phone battery. She deduces her alter ego’s destination and hitchhikes to Van’s place- something that will surely be reaching the press very soon. Whatever’s lying in the woods, Taissa will be the one really in the center of it. Her and Van’s discovery of Javi in the wilderness, in the exact spot that Van and Nighttime Taissa knew was significant, confirm that.

The really interesting thing about this show to me is that I really can’t figure out who to root for. Shauna, Natalie, and Taissa seem to be the heroes, but these ladies are all so nutty. Right now, we still have a lot to learn about what exactly goes down in these woods, but we have a pretty good idea and it’s safe to say that no one survived without getting their hands dirty.

But the best thing about this show is that literally anything goes! So what do you think is next for the Yellowjackets? Which characters are the kind of crazy you can get behind? What will become of poor coach Ben? And dare I even plant the seed that Shauna might eat her baby…

And I’ll end with a friendly reminder to support TV writers! The creators of Yellowjackets have closed the writer’s room for season 3 that had only just gotten started last week and are now picketing as I type. The Writer’s Guild strike means we might get an abridged season 3, as is the case for many current shows, but writers are getting shafted in this behemoth of an industry, and they’re fighting for the conditions that will let them both do their best work and live their best lives.

[spookyjudgement]

GBBO 2020 reactions Episode 3, don’t mind me

I get the concept of the opening skit but my Paul Patience has already worn out this season so.

Why? Do they also have to make a butter???? They’re making 2 breads already? Was having the bakers wait for their breads to prove and letting them have a break not exciting enough?

Prue saying that it would be interesting to get a “really different” butter as though she would actually like the taste of a “really different” butter *eyeroll*.

So this episode we get the explanation for Mark’s Ethiopian travels. It’s nice to see Irish and Welsh inspiration though!

I’m disappointed they’re not calling Marc Hamish. I will continue to call him Hamish. and URGH the thought of BUTTERMILK in his EAR!

Hermine’s evil laugh as she describes salmon and cheese is top quality. I love her. We also stan a knitter.

I’m rooting for Laura’s pizza stone!

Paul stop glaring at people’s bread you weirdo.

OF COURSE PETER STUDIES FINANCE I felt the VIBES! I FELT THE V I B E S! Also Paul really...loves him and it’s weird to see it. Glad to see the comment redirected to slamming Paul, though.

They’re making them...WHIP??? THE BUTTER???

LINDA <3 SHOWCASING MAK’S HONEY. MY HEART.

The apprentice kills the master lol if this ends in a Peter vs Paul death match I’d pay to watch it. Badminton finance boy, come through and kick his ass.

Rowan reinventing his story as he goes is Hilarious with the flatness.

Matt with the blueberry suggestion for Lottie. I agree with Lottie that Matt should be the one to mush blueberries in Paul’s face.

I’m glad Laura’s marzipan decision worked out!

It’s not fair that they seem to excuse underflavoring so much more than overflavoring. The Britishness really jumps out huh.

Hermine shaped her butter! So cute! Also...ew Paul’s sweaty hands. I’m glad he liked her breads.

Sura accepting her throne as flavor queen! QUEEN!

OMG NOEL THAT PAUL ROAST FOR PAUL’S NON-ADVICE COMMENT. Excellent moment.

Wait. Are they serious. Fucking rainbow bagels??? RANDOM INSTA/COOKING INFLUENCER FOOD IS APPARENTLY BAKE-OFF CONTENT NOW. Not to roast Rosanna Pansino or any of the other creators who made them but like. Why.

wha...”I think the rainbow represents the NHS” ??? More like you’ve decided the rainbow represents the NHS for you now I guess? Those look fucking neon?? guh.

Those colors...all their hands are a mess...fuckin wild...actually COMPLETELY colored with that neon mess.

I support Rowan for thinking in inches in the UK. It’s the chaotic choice. Matt’s look into the camera when Rowan said it was hilarious, like yes Matt, a contestant out-chaosed you.

I hope Hamish isn’t serious about the show making him start drinking...I would be really sad if it did :’(

Dave’s hands are still...blue. The water for many people’s bagels are...colored. Rowan’s water is straight up a witches’ brew.

I’m nervous for Dave? This doesn’t feel like his week...

It’s good to see Hamish seem like he’s in his element? It’s calming. Linda too!

Rowan and Dave at the bottom for the technical...predictable but unfortunate. But Hamish did well in the technical and was proud of himself! <3 wholesome.

ROWAN I love him, like...I didn’t do well but it was so much fun! His attitude is great, honestly. Not playing any of your anxiety games Paul.

Noel >:( Don’t make fun of Lottie. She is swan-like!

OK. Time to brace for their bullshit showstopper idea.

Bread plaque. Thing you’re most grateful for. Are you. Serious?????????

Rowan pointing out that it is traditionally inedible...bro why did they set this challenge.

“It’s probably curtain’s but I’m gonna have fun anyway” Rowan once again being iconic.

So Matt’s comment about Paul being gay got me looking because I didn’t think he was gay and...yeah he’s not AND in 2019 he broke up with a 24 year old WHY IS HE SO CONSISTENTLY HORRIBLE JESUS CHRIST SHE’S LESS THAN HALF HIS AGE alsdkjhfaskldfhj.

Sorry not over it yet. From wikipedia: “In August 2019 Hollywood split from 24-year-old girlfriend Summer Monteys-Fullam, ending a two-year relationship.” what a miserable creep ugh ugh ugh.

Dave’s having a BABY! I am excited for him.

Peter’s making a bagel dough...and he didn’t get first in bagels the day before...that makes me nervous for him.

“There is a plan. I know that’s surprising” Rowan, you are my icon.

I’m rooting for Hermine’s brioche. Stick it to the MAN Hermine!

Hamish coming in with actual Buddhist philosophy and not random fetishized shit? That’s good stuff. I’m pretty sure the production team prodded him into saying it because of his Tibetan bread though.

Prue coming in with more sense in judging Hermine’s bake than Paul. Screw you Paul, like you could have (or would have) done that quick-dash enriched dough.

Sura’s bread is good!!!! Also her asking if she could go at the end is really funny, she gives off such presenting to teachers vibes.

I’m glad Hamish did well!!!!! <3 So good!

I’m very worried for Dave...but also since when has bake-off judged based on the ideas???

Paul. Shut up about Hermine’s enriched dough. It worked well enough.

I support Matt in that comment on how much flavor bread needs anywy. Fight Paul on bread flavor, Matt. FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT!

HAMISH WON STAR BAKER I’M SO HAPPY FOR HIM.

bro. send rowan home. I love him but send him home.

Ok. Good. My hand has been stayed.

Family?? I thought they were isolated????

[bombshellsandbluebells]

I finally responding omg 

My theories around the dreams have completely changed in light of the finale now too.

Before the last two episodes of s2, I was fully leaning into the idea that there was something supernatural happening - both in the wilderness in the past and now in the future. And I thought the dreams tied very heavily into that. I had a sort of theory going that for some reason - where they were, or because of what was out there, or the symbols or something - dreams and reality were sort of blending together. Or the veil between them was thinner somehow??

The things that happened in the dreams directly impacted people’s lives - Jackie eating, the baby eating, vs. Lottie not eating (classic fairy realm rules, as people have already pointed out) and there was the additional idea of sleeping being relevant with Tai’s sleepwalking self.

Sleep and dreams seemed important. And it also seemed directly tied with death. I almost had a theory going too about the people in Jackie’s dream vs. Lottie’s. In Jackie’s dream, the people are almost sinister, welcoming her into death. In Lottie’s dream, all of the girls push her to eat EXCEPT Laura Lee. Who’s warns her against it. Laura Lee, who we know is actually dead. I almost started to wonder if somehow the Laura Lee in Lottie’s dream was the REAL Laura Lee, and that’s why she wasn’t beckoning Lottie to join them, she was trying to save her life.

And with Coach Ben, I was thinking it was a sign that things were blurring even more - the dreams slowly beckoning him into death in a supernatural sort of way with purpose, rather than just the sign that he was slowly wasting away and losing his mind.

Now, in light of the finale, I think all of that’s wrong. I’m pretty firmly in that camp of “actually nothing supernatural happened out there, it’s just what they told themselves to make sense of it and how they experienced it while it happened.” I think the exchange where Shauna says it was always them and Lottie just says, “Does it matter?” is so significant. Thesis statement, honestly.

Chances are s3 is going to lean back into the supernatural side of things again and I’ll change my mind AGAIN, but right now I’m sitting at “all of this can actually just be explained away as trauma.”

They tried to make sense of their situation as teenagers and 1) found hope in the idea of Lottie as a supernatural being and leaned HARD into that for their own sanity and 2) anything bad or scary happening could be explained away as both not their fault AND something that could be appeased with the right actions. The idea of it all being supernatural - of there being something out there - was a comfort in a way, because it meant there were rules. 

Then in s2, we see in the adult storyline that leaning into the idea that it was supernatural - that it was something Other - is a comfort because it means they can absolve themselves of their actions. Lottie doesn’t have to take on the guilt of how she might have influenced things (unintentionally) because there was Something Else out there. Natalia doesn’t have to feel the guilt over killing other people to survive or being the Antler Queen because there was Something Else out there and it’s followed them back and that’s why Travis died, that’s why all this happened. It wasn’t HER. Taissa and Van both seem sort of on the fence, in that as adults they deny the idea of Something Else, but they still seem to almost lean into the idea to comfort themselves in ways that noticeably Shauna and Misty never do.

The one detail that still sort of sticks out as weird and can’t be explained away - which you and I have already talked about - is the Bear. What was up with that if there wasn’t something supernatural going on? I’d say maybe also the way the plane caught fire was mysterious too - but it’s also something that COULD be natural and just shown to us in a way that feels supernatural. 

Anyways. So my theory on the dreams has gone from there is legitimately something happening with the Dream World here and the fact that Taissa has started sleepwalking again once all this started up again is very significant to the dreams are just a sign of them losing their grip on reality, the same way that Mari hearing the dripping, and Akilah seeing the mouse as alive was.

But who knows. Maybe s3 will change my mind on this again.

I want to talk Coach Ben dream theories with you bc even though I didn't respond I have been THINKING about your theory but I have to watch the next episode first bc I have no idea what more happened with that. I feel like I'd propose a theory and you'd be like WELLLLL lol. But oooooh the whole dream world thing is SO interesting

So this is obviously dated and before the finale, but I am still on this train!!

Sadly, I think we've left behind the world where Coach Ben is fully dissociating, though. Since dream!Paul kicked him out of the dream world and Misty talked him off the literal edge, Benny Boy's got his groove back. And that groove means attempted murder-by-fire of like, a dozen teenage girls (and Travis.) So I don't think anything about my theory of Ben eating in his dissociation dream world and permanently disconnecting from them is ever going to pan out.

But it's still very interesting to me that there were other similarities between Ben's dream world and the death dreams of the girls in the wilderness. In the death dreams, the girls are tempted by something they really want. Jackie drinks the hot cocoa and dies, and before that she dreams of her friends warmly accepting her and telling her they love her. Lottie's dream is a weird inverse, where her friends judge and belittle her, and Laura Lee pushes her out of the dream before she can eat food there and die in real life. Even Shauna's death dream, difficult as it is, involves her successfully feeding her baby and connecting with her child. So the pattern of not eating/eating and survival/death is pretty well established at this point.

Ben's dissociation dream world is so similar to these in some ways. He gets what he's dreaming of - he's with Paul, he never got stuck in the wilderness or lost his leg, he's not surrounded by cult-ish cannibalistic teenage girls (and Travis.) And at the end of it, Paul forces him back into the real world, just like Laura Lee did for Lottie. And Paul tells him he loves him, just like Shauna did in Jackie's death dream.

I don't know what these parallels mean, lmao. I'm not even sure they mean anything, anymore. And I don't know if they were ever going to get so literal as the "even if you're not dying, if you're dreaming and you eat, it's bad" route. That was probably too on the nose.

But I do think it's interesting that there are a lot of similarities to all these dreams. Maybe, since Coach also wasn't eating in real life, being the only one who hasn't given into cannibalism, the similarities between the dreams were only supposed to suggest that, if Ben hadn't woken up, he would've eventually succumbed to starvation and died anyway. And they just thought it'd be too obvious to have him be offered and refuse or nearly accept food in his dreams with Paul.

I thought it was clever, though, dammit!

Anyway, this is a long-winded way of saying that I think there's something there, I don't think it's exactly what I thought it was, and sadly, I think we've gotten all the answers we're gonna get. What a nuts story beat, though.

[helpersofindie-archive]

It’s 11:27 and the inbox is now open again! We closed the inbox on February 1st, and we’ve now had it closed for almost three weeks which has given us time to work through requests and get the inbox count down. We have gone from having 508 messages to 130 ( which is honestly amazing, that means we’ve managed to get through 378 asks). We now have 312 drafts instead of the original 370, and our current queue has 3 things in it. 

We’ve also accepted 11 new helpers into hoi, which is super exciting! They’re all super precious, so please give them a warm welcome! We’re all very happy to have them join the hoi team and I hope you all enjoy the resources they release on this blog!  While we have gotten the inbox count down to 130, we feel that we need a fresh start ( and a lot of the messages left now are old ones that no one has claimed ). Thus, we have decided to delete the inbox, so the inbox count is now at ZERO. A list with the deleted requests can be found below the cut. We ask that you do not resend the ones that weren’t aimed at a specific helper, BUT if you really want a request that you requested from someone you can resend it to someone else (or without a name).

We’d like to thank everyone for their patience during these 3 weeks, and also ask that you remain patient, since we still have a lot of requests in the drafts, and quite long to do lists. We hope everyone is having a good week and we’re excited that the inbox is now open once again.

remember, if you see your request in this list and would still like them to be done, then feel free to resend the request and hopefully one of the helpers will complete it for you! 

edit: only requests that were directed to specific helpers******

Hello! Could any of the helpers please make a gif hunt of Jonathan Hyde as Eldritch Palmer from the Strain? They can be normal and don't need any style. Thank you in advance!

Could someone familiar with wrestling do some rp icons of Randy Orton? More recent ones preferably. Thanks a million!

Can I request a manip of Ciara Baxendale and Grant Gustin? Thank you so much.

to anyone, I was wondering if someone could possibly make some 100x100 plain icons of tyler young in eyewitness? thanks if anyone can!

Hi! Could I request some icons of Ayase Haruka? If possible, from the movie "Umimachi Diary (Our Little Sister)". If not, any role would be perfect! Thanks!

Hi helpers, happy holidays<3 I was wondering if I could have a crackship of Tyson Houseman and Evan Peters please?

hello helpers! is there a helper who'd be willing to possibly help me out and make some base icons of Melanie Tran? ;w; And if not, could you please direct me to where I might be able to find some? Any help is appreciated! <3

Hi guys, I was wondering if I could request some icons of Tanc Sade in his role in Gilmore Girls pretty please?

Hey! Can i please a crackship of Finlay MacMillan and Freya Tingley? Thanks!

hey can i request an aesthetic of m/m interracial couples from lottie if she doesn't feel way too busy? thank you

Hi! Can I please get a manip of Jeremy Irvine and Xavier Dolan please? Thank you in advance!!

Could I please get a lovelt mannip of cory michael smith and eiza gonzalez? <3 <3 <3

Can I please request Rahart Adams icons from Every Witch Way, Liar Liar Vampire, and Nowhere Boys? Preferably border-less 100x100 HQ/HD? Forgot to add border-less in. x.x

Hey Gillan! Can you make some circular icons of Mune from Mune Guardian of The Moon?

Dear Jay and smutty-gif-hunt-anon, Thank you for helping out with what I'd be too embarrassed to request!! Rock on!

Hello if possible could I get gif icons of James paxton of eyewitness. any style works who ever seems inspired to do this works. thank you. I'm easy to please. Thank you again for all your hard work.

Will you make some Faith Wladyka icons?from Blue Valentine? Only if you're up for it :)

Hi Jay! Since you're the resident wrestling related helper I was wondering if you could help me with something. Could you make me a manip of Taylor Swift with the Raw women's title, please? Something similar to when Charlotte visited Today after wrestlemania? I didn't see manips on your WID, but I thought I'd seen you do a manip request before. Thanks in advance for your time!

I don't know if my request was received before or after the inbox was deleted so my apologies if this is a duplicate. Can I please get some roleplay icons of (Tristan Milligan) Lyle Lettau from season 13/14 of Degrassi? Thanks! <3

could i request some Darby Stanchfield rp icons as her role from abby whelan in scandal? preferably 70x70 white a light grey psd thank you so much in advance and god i love this blog - the indie community salutes you

Good evening HOI, could I request a man up of Shin Hye-Jeong and Jessica Parker Kennedy please?

Hi, Lottie! May I request some RP icons of Ryan McCartan as Brad Majors in the TV version of Rocky Horror Picture Show in style "scarlett," please? Thank you so much!

Hey guys! I was wondering if you could please do a manip of Kacey Musgraves and Derek Theler of them and some party or award show? Thanks, love ya bye!

Hey! I'd pretty please like to request plain static rp icons of Korean actor Jo Jung Suk if possible!

Hello! Could I please request an icon pack with Lily James in Downton Abbey using Blue's B6 style? Thank you so much! <3

This message is to anyone who has space on their todo. Culd i request some rp Icons of Keir O'Donnell on Wedding Crashers please ?

hey lovelies! I was wondering if someone was willing to do a manip of Emily Rudd and Matthew Daddario for me (sibling/friends vibes)? thank you in advance :)

hey there lovelies!! could i please request plain 100x100 rp icons made of christina masterson? thank you so much lovelies!

Hey there Samantha! Just wondering if you were up to making a gif icon hunt of recent Kat Mcnamara? Thank you! xxxxx

May I please request standard sized gif icons of Laura Vandervoort from the film Damage, please?? :333 Thank you, and Merry Christmas! <3

Thanks for being helpful and understand about my technical issues & letting me send my gif pack request here (Which admin would you like to complete the request? Anyone What is the url from the video? If it’s about a movie/tv show, tell me which the name of the movie/tv show+episode so we can find suitable download links.- skins 6x07 "alo" Who's the faceclaim?- holly earl as poppy champion Any specific PSD? Vibrant, Pale, Dark, or a link to one posted. " just 160x160 QUOTE text moodboard gifs

Hi Maxie! Could I request some icons of Taylor Dearden as Ophelia Mayer in Sweet/Vicious, in the mx17 style? Thank you!

Hello Ellen. Is it possible that I could het Dylan O'Brien gif icons in EL*013? Thank you in advance! :)

Hey Helpers! Is it possible I can get a twin Lin Miranda manip, one with short hair and one with long? Thanks!

May I request some Amy Nelson rp icons? [ underused face claim ] in any psd you want, I would appreciate it :D

Hello! Is it possible I could get roleplayable icons of Kalel Cullen? With a light psd and such?

Hello lovely helpers, can I please request for a manip picture of Elizabeth Olsen (brunette) with Evan Peters please? As a couple. Thank you so much. <3

Super random but can you pretty please make me some gifs of matthew daddario doing magic. Like instead of crackship gifs of him with another person , it would be of him and a faceless gif of magic aka gifs of wizard matthew daddario lol.

May I request a family template for Rachel Hilbert fc?

Hi, can i please request gif icons of Travis Fimmel in her role in Vikings (Ragnar)??? Thanks you very much. Oh, without border pls.

may i have a family template for sarah shahi? if you can, could her father be the one who's persian/iranian and her mother be the one who is spanish? but, if not, that's totally fine! thank you so much, helpers! xx

May I pretty please request a moodboard or aesthetic of Matthew Daddario and Cameron.Monaghan as Even x Isak from skam ?

Hello, there! First of all, I absolutely love your icons! I was just wondering if it was possible to ask for gifs/icons of Daniel Miller from Berlin Station? Thank you. Have a lovely day! :)

hey helpers! i'm currently working on creating a werewolf multimuse, and i want to have two packs represented- but for the life of me i can't think of pack names beyond the cliche "moonstone/bloodstone" kind of thing. so could you help me come up with names? if it helps, the packs are kind of opposites- good vs evil kind of thing. thanks so much!

Hello!! I was wondering if you guys could make me a manip of Tom Felton as Draco and Elle Fanning. As siblings.. Please and thank you! :3

Ayo! Can u make manip of Luke Hemmings and Dua Lipa, pls? Ty. ♡

Hi I was wondering if someone could make an Angelique Boyer gif hunt? I'm wanting to use her as a FC but realized there's hardly any gifs of her out there. I would appreciate it so much <33! Thank you to whoever decides to take it on.

Hi anyway! Can i request some Jun-ji hyun gif icons from The Legend of the Blue Sea please?

Would anyone be willing to make a gif hunt of Travis Fimmel in the the 2003 Tarzan, please?

You all are super talented and super awesome. i was wondering if any of you helpers could possibly do a manip or aesthetic of david gandy and helen owen as a power couple. Whichever would be easier. It's for a story i am currently writing.

Hello, can I please request icons of model and actress Nicole Fox? For whomever reads this I know her movies can be potentially triggering, so if you aren't comfortable with those, that's completely fine (frankly I'm just glad you're reading this). She was also in s13 of ANTM. If there's anything problematic about her, I am not aware, but please let me know. Thank you very much and have a great day x

Hi! I was wondering if any of you would be willing to do a family template for Romanian Actress Madalina Ghenea.

can i please request herman tømmeraas gif icons? thank you in advanced !

may i please request icons for maxence danet-fauvel?? Thank you!!!!

Could you please make some static rp icons of Ben Barns from By The Gun? Thank you!

Sorry, ignore my last message. Could I please request crackships of Britt Robertson and Jeff Goldblum from around Jurassic Park and The Lost World era? Thank you!

hey babes! i love all the manips you all do, so i was wondering if i could request a romantic-y manip of alec lightwood and max ehrich? preferably from under the dome for max, but really anything is fine for him! thank you so much

hello helpers! would someone be willing to make plain 100x100 icons of tom austen in his role as jasper frost from the royals?

I hope I'm not bothering any of you. I hope you all have a great holiday season. I was wondering if anyone would do a manip of Jessica Lowndes and David Labrava as a couple. You all do amazing work and should get more credit for all the hard work you guys put in. You are all talented.

Hey! I was hoping one of you would have the time to help me out with something. I've got all the human icons I need for my muse, but I'm seriously lacking in phoenix icons. I know there's Fawkes in Harry Potter, but I was hoping there would be manga/anime and/or other movies/shows with phoenixes in them that I could get icons from? Or if there are any icons/gifs out there already? Anything would help, please and thank you.

Hello is it possible to get Henrik Holm RP icons in G15 from his role as Even in SKAM?

do you guys make rp icons of animes and mangas? If yes can I ask for rp icons of Sarada Uchiha please? With a tiny white and grey border?

happy 2017 helpers ! hope you all are well c: i was wondering if i could possibly request a manip of seola from cosmic girls and hyungwon from monsta x ? please and thank you so much !

Hi there, can I please request a gif hunt of Jonas Nay from his role in Deutschland 83?

If possible could I get some Icons of the French Model Johan Akan the 3d scan for Nyx Ulric of Final Fantasy XV Kingsglaive? Please and thank you

Hello lovely helpers, can I please request for crackship gifs of Lily Collins with Evan Peters? They relationship is similar of Rosie and Alex's relationship in Love, Rosie. Thank you. <333

I lovely helpers! I was wondering if I could please request a manip of David Giuntoli as an X-Wing pilot from Star Wars? Thank you for your time <3

Hi :) Could you please do some Brent Antonello icons from the tv show Hit the Floor? I'd love that.

Hey helpers! Can I request a manip of Freddie Highmore as a Blue Lantern (or a green lantern if it's easier)?

Good morning helpers! Can I ask for a manip of Hunter Parrish and Robbie Amell please?

Can I have a manip of Kristine Froseth and Evan Peters? I'd like it if it was done mid-90's Polaroid style with using Evan's AHS Season 1 resources.

Hello helpers can someone make a manip of Zach Roerig and Matt lanter as best friend please?

hi, could i possibly get crackship gifs of america ferrera with long hair and chris (the guy) from the tv show skam? thank you in advance xx

Hey guys. I was wondering if any of you would do a manip of Rhiannon Fish and Scott Eastwood as a couple.

hello ! first of all, i'd like to thank all of u for putting in time to make resources for the indie community ! u guys are awesome ! secondly, i'd like to ask if any of you would be willing to make a manip of herman tømmeraas and ariana grande as friends ? thank u in advance !

Hello, can I please request a romantic "instagram-post like" manip of Zendaya and Cristiano Ronaldo? Thank you!

hi there! i hope you're all having a lovely day! could i please request gabi demartino gif icons?

Hey helpers! Can I request a (romantic) manip of Keahu Kahuanui (preferably with facial hair) and Nick Jonas? Thanks!

Hi, can I please request rp icons of Vika Bronova?

Hi guys, I was wondering if you could help me with a url for a Lord of the Rings elf original character, I'm using Emilia Clarke, primarily in her role and Daenarys Targaryen? thnx

Hi Helpers! I would like to know if any of you could do somes gif icons or icons of Trè Samuels, if is not a trouble. Thank you very much in advance <3

Hello! Could you guys suggest first and surname's for Naressa Valdez? ( I'm not sure if this counts as two asks? ) Thank you so much!

Hello, may I please request plain ( with pixel texture) gif icons of Jan Lisiecki ? Thanks in advance !

hello dearies! can i request some plain icons (bases, to be clear) of spencer macpherson in american gothic please?

could you please give me some ronan lynch urls? tysm, i love your blog!!

Could someone pretty please make a manip of Eva Green and Jeffrey Dean Morgan, by any chance? Thank you

hi love, can you do some gif icons of ryan gosling with beard and some from crazy stupid love? tysm <3

Hello can someone please make me some crackship gifs where it looks like Matthew Daddario has super powers.

hi i'd love some simple rp icons of alex steele in her role as tori santamaria in degrassi please <3

Oops! Sorry, I didn't realize there was a form! I recently changed my mind, though, and was wanting just plain RP icons (Robby Benson from The Chosen). Is that doable? Ahh sorry and thank you!

Can I pleeaaasseee get 100 x 100 black and white light textured rp icons of Amandaschronicles/Amanda Mckenna? It would mean so much to me! Thank you sm for all you guys do!

Could I please request some rp icons of Rodrigo Santoro? Thank you!

May I have an aesthetic (or a moodboard which ever you'd like to make) of Kristine Froseth and Evan Peters (AHS season one resources pls) as heads of a mafia known as the Gemini Mafia pls?

hello, could i request icons of Çağatay Ulusoy in a plain style, please? hope you guys have a great day and thanks for all that you do!! ♥

Can I please request some gif icons or a gif hunt, I'm not sure which is easier/preferred, of Raúl Esparza, please?

Hi! I was wondering if it was possible for someone to do a manip of Lady Marian (BBC Robin Hood) and Prince Arthur (BBC Merlin) ? Thank you. :)

Hello, yes! If you're still dong manila, can I have one of Katey Sagal (as Gemma Teller) and Norman Reedus. Preferably as a couple.

Is there any chance you could do a faceless gif hunt of a couple with a blonde female and a male who has dark skin? Thank you so much in advance!

can i request a manip of ryan potter and keiynan lonsdale?

can i please get a dominic sherwood x ashley moore manip? thank you

Hello helpers! I was hoping someone would be able to make regular, 100x100 RP icons of Morgan Lily! I would be much appreciated! Thank you for all of your help!

I'm not sure If you are still doing manipulations but if you are could I please request one of Matt Ryan and Marie Avgeropolous. Thank you. You guys are flawless.

hello! hope you're all doing well! i would like to request icons of Sophie Stuckey (from any and all ages, please). I did put in a request before, but i'm not sure if that's been done (and i haven't seen them) or rejected or forgotten about? so if anyone could make them or direct me to them or .. anything else? that'd be greatly appreciated. <3

Hi helpers! I was wondering if I could ask one of you lovelies to make a family template for Alex Brooke? Thank you so much!

could i ask for billy cranston from mighty morphin power rangers (David yost) icons? thank you thank you thank you :)

hey lizzie! thanks for opening your requests again. could i please request some icons of daniel sharman in the style L6? thanks so much!

hi lizzie!!! hope you're having a brilliant day! could i please ask you for some icons of jeremy irvine in the style L7? thanks so much!

hi hello lizzie! hope this isn't too much of a bother, but would it be possible for me to request some icons of Sean O'Pry in L7? thank you x10000 !!!!

lizzie could you pls make rp icons in L7 of chris wood as jake riley? :)

hey lizzie, could i please get rp icons of ivana baquero as eretria in L1?

could i please request gif icons of bellies during various stages of pregnancy? in short, gif icons of pregnant bellies? nothing fancy style-wise, but maybe a light texture, since i think those look best! thank you so much to whoever takes this up! (and another thank you to the rest of you, since you guys help the community so much!)

Hello! I have been unable to find any resources of Maeda Goki. He's a sadly underrated FC. If you know of some that already exist, could you link me please? And if not, could you please make some plain (no texture/border) icons of him from any role? Thanks for your help!

Hi Lia, could I possibly re-request the Toby Regbo as young Jaime Lannister aesthetic I asked for, if you'd like to do it?

can you make some icons of dean and renee kissing on total divas plkease??

I'm not sure if you've answered this but I I use Marie Avgeropolous as an fc and I know Olivia Steele-Falcone played young Octavia in The 100 but I don't know if she has enough films to create an icon pack.I know you have a gif pack form but I didn't see one for icons. Is it possible for anyone to do these for me, I would much appreciate it. Or if you have already done them can you link me? Many thanks in advance. You guys have been fabulous so far.

Is it possible for someone to make some PNGs? I need some supernatural creatures/scared/crying PNGs but I can't really find any. A mix of those would be great but just scared/crying PNGs are absolutely cool too.

hello! I was wondering if i could please request some icons of Tahlena Chikami? Possibly base icons? Or at least very little editing? I'd really like to use her as an fc, but she has almost no resources that i could find. thank you for your consideration and your time!!

would anyone be willing to make a manip (preferably a selfie) of cody saintgnue and ashley moore? :)

Could someone possibly make a manip of Jon Hamm and Michelle Forbes? They are married in my roleplay so possibly something of them cuddling or anything would be fine. Just a picture of them together would be amazing all together.

hey there lovely helpers!! i was hoping i could please request some 100x100 plain rp icons be made of ming na wen in joy luck club? thank you so much!!

Hello! If icon requests are open, may I please request plain 100x100 icons of Lulu Antariksa as Rowan in t@gged? It's on go90 :)